Doug Lord

Steve and Dave Clarks Unidentified Foiling Object

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11 minutes ago, Charlie P Mayer said:

Dave, I will not be able to get to Miami this year for TFW.  Too many irons in the fire here.

Will there be any UFOs there?

We will be there with a rib and three company boats as part of our demo tour. However, we're already booked pretty solidly with demos for all the days there, so our capacity to be involved in any racing or provide any support/training is pretty much shot. That's basically why I haven't made much noise. Two guys and a rib get tapped out on how much they can provide pretty fast. I'm very slowly learning the art of underpromising and overdelivering. That said, there is a regatta going on, and I know Page is looking to come down with her UFO and take part in that. Room for a bunch of boats on the line.

DRC

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Digging around in pics and found several from my trip to RI in November 2016.  Decent shots of the first prototype, the green Probe, may be found on this FB page: UFO Foiling in Texas.  Needless to say, the boat design has come a long way from its rather humble beginnings as a mash up of Laser spars, spare parts, and one incomplete Moth hull....  The boat we sail is many iterations removed from Probe, and many of those iterations may be seen in the pics.

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Dave and Clean, thanks for being so kind to us Texans in the SA interview on Feb 1 (Leadership Conference as shown on FB).

Don't forget about the manufacturers of the foiling cats: DNA, Whisper, and Petrucci Designs(S9) among others.

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43 minutes ago, duwke said:

Thursday is looking good.. 75 and 15 knots steady

I hate you.  In a friendly sort of way.  In the 30s and dead calm here.  What's the boat in your pic?

 

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I thought I was kinda rubbing everyone's nose in it.. sorry bout that.  kinda :)

Weta, with larger spin and main.  She is on the block to be sold because of the light wind performance.. wait..

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I just order a UFO last week!

Now I'm killing the time working out the details how to cartop it on the Volvo.

To be able to make some progress; could somebody give me the width of the hulls and/or the width between the hulls (the tunnel)?

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16 hours ago, Jedel said:

I just order a UFO last week!

Now I'm killing the time working out the details how to cartop it on the Volvo.

To be able to make some progress; could somebody give me the width of the hulls and/or the width between the hulls (the tunnel)?

Congratz! and welcome.

Approximately, width of the hulls 5'-8" (173mm) and  the width between the hulls (the tunnel) 3'-8" (112mm) - center of balance approximately 3' (91mm) forward of transom.

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My UFO Hull# 95 will be infused next week. Does someone knows the next steps in the build process after infusing?

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UFO 0054 received on Tuesday in Brittany, France. Drive to Spain yesterday (kids sailing at the international optimist trophy in Palamós). UFO first time in the water today, 4-6 knots wind.

it is difficult fit some pins or struts at the beginning but I am confident after a few sails everything will go smoothly. Weighing 92kg, I had no doubt I would not fly on my first day with this light wind. Good thing though, even without foiling, I was faster as optimists!

one thing is sure, you’ll stop dozens of people looking at this funny little boat, half of them asking questions. Dave, I could have sold several boats today!

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Gilles this is from an email I got about the steps left on my boat from Dave.

"Your hull was built at the start of the month. It has not yet got into the finishing touch-up station. From there it needs to get through hardware and move on to getting it's small parts. I'd say we're looking at a March delivery."

I don't know my hull number. 

 

 

 

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On 13/02/2018 at 9:16 PM, Jedel said:

I just order a UFO last week!

Now I'm killing the time working out the details how to cartop it on the Volvo.

To be able to make some progress; could somebody give me the width of the hulls and/or the width between the hulls (the tunnel)?

 I purchased a pair of Thule pro bar this week. At 175 cm, they are perfect for the ufo. You just need someone else to put the boat on or off the bars. 

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10 hours ago, Nervouster said:

 I purchased a pair of Thule pro bar this week. At 175 cm, they are perfect for the ufo. You just need someone else to put the boat on or off the bars. 

20 hours ago, Bill's Sock Puppet said:

Congratz! and welcome.

Approximately, width of the hulls 5'-8" (173mm) and  the width between the hulls (the tunnel) 3'-8" (112mm) - center of balance approximately 3' (91mm) forward of transom.

thank for the info, very useful. Small comment: the SI dimension should be cm. 

 

10 hours ago, Nervouster said:

 I purchased a pair of Thule pro bar this week. At 175 cm, they are perfect for the ufo. You just need someone else to put the boat on or off the bars. 

Thanks for the tip!; I already have the volvo standard transverse bars (which are very short) so I probably first try transporting it upside down. 

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20 hours ago, Randy said:

Gilles this is from an email I got about the steps left on my boat from Dave.

"Your hull was built at the start of the month. It has not yet got into the finishing touch-up station. From there it needs to get through hardware and move on to getting it's small parts. I'd say we're looking at a March delivery."

I don't know my hull number. 

Randy

When did you order your UFO ?

 

 

 

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On 2/15/2018 at 1:33 AM, Jedel said:

thank for the info, very useful. Small comment: the SI dimension should be cm. 

 

Thanks for the tip!; I already have the volvo standard transverse bars (which are very short) so I probably first try transporting it upside down. 

I would definitely not try this myself. It is clearly designed to sit on the flat portions of the hull. That’s just my opinion but why risk messing up the hull? The boat is not close to flat inverted. 

We bought the Yakima rack with the wide bars and it works fine. Does take us 2 people to load and unload. We will probably go to a trailer at some point to make this easier. 

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Fantastic!   That sure looked familiar!

From my experience:  to halt the heel to windward, sheet in like crazy!  Even if your butt hits the water, don't bail and keep sheeting.

I'm told that if you set the wand deeper to fly higher you have more time to do this, but I have not yet tried it.

 

So you guys can sail during the week?  May I come over with mine and join you?  Water temp?

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Come on down!

Water is nice, 62 degrees.   It was low though.. hard to get the boat out to the deeper parts, so we stayed in the channel the whole time.  I will definitely need to put some more holes in the foils so I can sail out without sticking in the mud.  I've been hesitant to do so, because.. holes.

I'll keep a lookout for nice weather and text you.  We can take the boats out to Texas City Dike.  Sandy beach and consistent air.

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48 minutes ago, duwke said:

As mentioned.. water was low, and I hit mud at about 4 knots.  Any suggestions for re-attaching this?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/vJHSdEDBWDXVzJuW2

 

West system g-flex resin. Serious abrasion with 80 grit paper beforehand. Clamping with a bunch of pvc pipe slashed rings or a bunch of spring clamps or a vacuum bag would be ideal. The piece is vac bagged in place the first time round. We actually just jacked up the abrasion spec from 150 to 80 just to be even safer. I've been flying on 150 sanded hinges for a year, but when it comes to building them every time I always get more neurotic and paranoid with my specifications over time.

 

DRC

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On 2/15/2018 at 3:33 AM, Jedel said:

thank for the info, very useful. Small comment: the SI dimension should be cm. 

 

Thanks for the tip!; I already have the volvo standard transverse bars (which are very short) so I probably first try transporting it upside down. 

Um yea, the SI dimensions should be cm and the GC is actually further aft without the rigging.

There is quite a bit of deck camber on the UFO, so transporting it upside down might be a bit wobbly. 

Quote

Approximately, width of the hulls 5'-8" (173cm) and  the width between the hulls (the tunnel) 3'-8" (112cm)
 
- center of balance approximately 2' (60cm) forward of transom.

 

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Hi!!  New to the forum as a member, been following since last March.   Here is #58 ready to leave the Mothership for a 6 hour trip back to upstate NY on 1/8/18.  Only had snow from Springfield MA on, but the UFO didn't melt.  It will be a while before the ice and snow melt, so I have to be content getting my kicks reading your tips and comments, your pics, and especially watching the videos!  Please keep them coming.  Hope to catch up with some of you for real once the sailing begins-Thanks!!!

IMG_1139 (1).JPG

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On 16-2-2018 at 9:39 PM, Bill's Sock Puppet said:

 

There is quite a bit of deck camber on the UFO, so transporting it upside down might be a bit wobbly. 

 

Everybody, thanks for the transport advice.

I wised up and order 175cm long thule probars.

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Hi everybody!  

Seems Dave is getting calls about my mods.  I didn't expect him to catch flak for my hacks.

Just a note so everyone understands:  

My mods are made for my convenience only, they are not endorsed by Fulcrum Speedworks, and they may not conform to UFO Class Rules.

Please don't contact Dave about my boat mods.  He's got more important work to do.  

(and no, Dave did not ask me to post this)

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I got out for a bit yesterday after work.  Was fun in the puffs.  Twice she kept going up, well past when the wand was lifted out, till she went down hard.  Any pointers to stop that?  I'm assuming it has something to do with the foil adjustments.  I have both at center.

 

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I kept thinking of your and Claire's advice.  It was really puffy though, so after the puff, I need to pull and come down.. which was more successful later in the day.

Yeah, from the park near my house.  I finally drilled a hole in the rudder and added the topping line to make getting out easier.  Never touched mud today!  It gets better each time I go out.

Thanks for the help Dave on foil cover.  It held, but it isn't as smooth as I'd like.  I am probably going to take it down to my fiberglass guy to see if he can work his magic.

I do have an issue with my front foil adjustment thingy.  In the slop and waves, the foil moves around a bunch, which jars against the holes.  It has completely destroyed the center hole, which allows it to move to the second hole given enough force.  I don't think there was enough carbon between the holes.  Matter of fact, on mine, it was so slim that I cut my finger on it the first day.  Picture coming...

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My thoughts watching the vid (bear in mind I have sailed mine a total of FIVE times!).  I think you're too close to the wind trying to get foiling.  I have my best results when starting on a super broad reach.  You're on a close reach, and that doesn't give you enough wiggle room.  You did a GREAT job of bailing when the weather hull was the first out of the water.  The boat won't foil when the weather hull is out first, or rather, I can't get the boat to foil when the weather hull is the first out of the water.  If you can try starting out on a broader reach, I predict you will be flying all the time!  Once the boat is foiling and stable, you can then start experimenting with trying to get to weather.

Love the video!

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8 hours ago, duwke said:

I got out for a bit yesterday after work.  Was fun in the puffs.  Twice she kept going up, well past when the wand was lifted out, till she went down hard.  Any pointers to stop that?  I'm assuming it has something to do with the foil adjustments.  I have both at center.

 

Cool! More rudder! The "stairway to hell" is basically an upward stall where the rudder never catches up.

 

Also, can send out the same part made out of G10. The top loader is a lot more civilized than the side loader but it went out the door a bit fast.

 

DRC

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Can someone translate the upward stall line for a neophyte sailor please?

48 minutes ago, Dave Clark said:

The "stairway to hell" is basically an upward stall where the rudder never catches up

 

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17 hours ago, duwke said:

I got out for a bit yesterday after work.  Was fun in the puffs.  Twice she kept going up, well past when the wand was lifted out, till she went down hard.  Any pointers to stop that?  I'm assuming it has something to do with the foil adjustments.  I have both at center.

[…]

Those dumps to windward… lake sailing! Try to find some steady breeze.

It seems to me that the UFO is narrower than a Moth (considering the extra wing width), so a bit harder to sail in some respects. Foiling in a Moth sitting in is much harder than sitting fully out on the wing bar, especially in shifty breeze. 

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Great stuff.

Dave basically told us not to worry about the front pin position much. We have the old style. 

The rudder he just wanted in the middle. Looked pretty neutral visually if I remember? 

Check your butt placement. Like the one on your body. I’m far from an expert but maybe move it back a bit? Dave kept telling us to scoot back and that seemed to help me settle the boat down a lot. 

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19 hours ago, Randy said:

Can someone translate the upward stall line for a neophyte sailor please?

 

If the rudder lacks sufficient angle of attack, it can't catch up to the Mainfoil and level the boat after the wand wants to stop climbing. The whole boat will continue to fly bow up because the rudder needs more lift and just can't climb fast enough as the speed increases. The wand breaks free from the surface, indicating that the Mainfoil is generating as little flap driven lift as possible. But that doesn't help. Since the rudder is still struggling to gain lift, the boat operates at an overall angle of attack in pitch which keeps the whole boat climbing. This is what I call the "stairway to hell". The next thing that happens is the mainfoil reaches the surface and ventilates. The foil creates no lift when wrapped in a bubble of air, so the bow falls at the speed of gravity. Flow usually is still attached on the rudder, so the boat goes nose down and into the water like a lawn-dart. Splash. Either dropping AoA on the mainfoil(foil head forward), increasing the AoA on the rudder (foil head aft), or moving your bodyweight forward will fix this. Or a blend of the three! If the boat feels disturbingly binary, where it takes off level and then feels either flat or VERY bow down, you have overcorrected.

 

DRC

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Thank you for the fuller explanation. I need to remember the rudder isn't just a rudder on the UFO but also a source of lift. Since I fly R/C planes stalls are something I am very familiar with. And AOA, angle of attack. 

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To add to (or confirm) what Dave said above, this past summer I went out with not enough rudder on (not enough AOA) and experienced the "stairway to hell". It is pretty disconcerting to go up and up and up and see the wand break free-you know exactly what is gong to happen next! I dialed some rudder on and the change was amazing-really level flight after that. At the Bristol regatta, where it wasn't as breezy, I was probably at the same setting, but at Steve an Dave's suggestion, slid aft to get the boat up foiling, and then trimmed forward for level flight.

Another thing I learned in Bristol was that on the first reach, which was a pretty high angle , the boat would load up and I would start to fly the windward hull. By doing an aggressive waggle-steering down and then back up, I could unload the rig enough on the down turn that the leeward hull would pop up, and then by steering back up I would power back up and take off foiling. Give it a try-it almost feels like you are pumping the boat up onto the foils with the steering. I think you can initiate foiling earlier by doing this in marginal conditions-you get the power of sailing a hotter angle but then are able to unload the rig to release the leeward hull.

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On 3/12/2018 at 2:09 PM, Bill's Sock Puppet said:

On March 31 we have a short distance race open to Lasers and UFO's.  There is no entry fee, but you have to pay for dinner at the club if you stay.

Link to the Race info and stuff.

We have an extra UFO on the dock - ready to sail, if anyone want to come down and sail, but can't be bothered to bring a boat.
Also Dave said he's going to be there, so it will be a mini-clinic fro the rest of us. (as long as he's still in sight.)

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Hi All - Dave Clark would like to escape winter and come down to Texas for another UFO seminar - he mentioned second weekend in April.

Should we have a stand-alone event, or should we encourage him to attend one of these:

http://www.texascenterboard.org/schedule/

 

I know Dave watches these forums (fora?) so he'll see your responses.

Thanks,

Charlie

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Stand alone event IMO.  I want the improvement coaching brings.  A regatta would cut down too much on coaching.  And we SHOULD have some WIND!

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5 minutes ago, True North said:

Stand alone event IMO.  I want the improvement coaching brings.  A regatta would cut down too much on coaching.  And we SHOULD have some WIND!

Agree. You can either do a clinic or participate in a regatta. A regatta/clinic only works if you're the only game in town and can start up and stop racing at will.

 

DRC

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So, does April 14-15 work for anybody?  Kemah?  Texas City Dike?  Clear Lake?  Lake Waco?

TN:  how about your lake?  Any wind in early April? 

Canyon Lake and Lake Travis are a bit unpredictable, but available.  

Kemah and TCD should have the best wind, eh?

 

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User locations:

Charlie: Canyon Lake, New Braunfels 
Brig: Lake Ray Hubbard, Dallas
Claire/theo: Waco Lake, Waco
Darin: Galveston Bay?, Kemah
Andre: Glaveston Bay, Galveston
Terry: Chandeleur Sound, Gulfport MS

By the numbers, it looks like Houston is a windy nexus point. 

I'm going down to coach and rockstar at the Fort To Battery in SC the week after, but I am free the weekend of the 14th-15th (must check with the SO).

DRC

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I am up for anywhere, but I prefer a lake where the mast doesn’t get stuck in the mud. 

Ray Hubbard is a really good venue as it’s built north/South and the prevailing wind is southerly; however, when fronts come through, it generally goes northerly.  Less chop when it’s from the south, and a lot when from north.

Again, up for anywhere that weekend.

 

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Finally the boy got to unwrap his UFO down here in Sydney .... its been a long, long wait!!! Can't wait to now get the thing rigged and on the water!

UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_2f0f4.jpg

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I will offer a Place to stay for Dave C. and one other couple/ single at my place walking distance to RCYC. Also have GOPRO and Polaris support to film and pick up pieces. And of course free beer. 

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Finally the boy got to unwrap his UFO down here in Sydney .... its been a long, long wait!!! Can't wait to now get the thing rigged and on the water!

UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_2f0f4.jpg

Great pic, Stanno.   What a great parcel to have delivered.  We too cannot wait for you to get the thing on the water!

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I sent my registration in for Wickford today.  The entry fee is $60.00 until the 31st, goes up to $75.00 on April 1, so it pays to register early.  You do NOT need insurance or an US Sailing number or insurance to register.  I am still frozen in up here in Pulaski, but will do both clinics in Bristol, and hopefully a little more time before Wickford, just hoping NOT to embarrass myself when I get there.  Hoping others will register soon.  #58

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On 3/22/2018 at 3:12 PM, Lifesave said:

I will offer a Place to stay for Dave C. and one other couple/ single at my place walking distance to RCYC. Also have GOPRO and Polaris support to film and pick up pieces. And of course free beer. 

Sounds great! Who can do Rush Creek on the weekend of the 14th? I'm down to coach and I've been told the wind machine is on full blast this time of year.

DRC

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Unpacking boat 1/4 down here. Can anyone ID this cog-looking wheel. It fell out of the box and looks like it belongs in this cavity with a pin. Or am I crazy?

Thanks

20180331_175645.jpg

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5 minutes ago, TheActualDave said:

Unpacking boat 1/4 down here. Can anyone ID this cog-looking wheel. It fell out of the box and looks like it belongs in this cavity with a pin. Or am I crazy?

Thanks

 

You are correct,  you need to find a steel rod with threads on one end and a hole on the other.  The threads go into this wheel, the hole is the upper gudgeon for the rudder.  It is used to adjust the rake of the rudder foil.

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47 minutes ago, TheActualDave said:

Thanks! Got it now. I'll start hunting for that rod. 

If that's not in there, let me know and I'll mail one down. 

DRC

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Hi Folks! I was lucky enough to spend some time with Ben Rosenberg of Red Aerial Photography this weekend and get some drone footage from this Sunday! This is just a film made from it. I have nearly an hour of the stuff that with a couple voiceovers can yield some good learning tools. So amped!

 

Technique notes:
1. Have a look at the priority on 'velocity first-heading second'. Upwinds and downwinds are founded on good speed-builds followed by progressive gains on heading and thus VMG. Out of tacks and gybes, revert to a reach until you have your speed back; then start to chip away towards the mark. So basically tack and gybe as little as possible.
2. Much sheeting, little steering. Keep your eyes on the puffs and your heel angle. The last minute or so of this video showcases that pretty clearly. While hiking is critical to going fast, it's more static than dynamic. You need to be prepared to decisively dump sheet and re-sheet to bleed heeling moment and maintain a healthy level of weather heel. Essentially, if you're dead level, you have no heel in the bank and the next puff will take you off the foils. 
3. Sail a lot. I've been sitting behind a desk, pounding cheeseburgers, coffee and beer and not working out for seven months with one brief escape down to FLA for a week. BOY am I feeling it in the corners. Not so much on the straightaways, but I am definitely taking full advantage of the beamy hull on my gybes.

More to come!

DRC

 

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On 3/26/2018 at 10:27 PM, koolkat505 said:

I sent my registration in for Wickford today.  The entry fee is $60.00 until the 31st, goes up to $75.00 on April 1, so it pays to register early.  You do NOT need insurance or an US Sailing number or insurance to register.  I am still frozen in up here in Pulaski, but will do both clinics in Bristol, and hopefully a little more time before Wickford, just hoping NOT to embarrass myself when I get there.  Hoping others will register soon.  #58

What/ when is Wickford? Picking up #105 tomorrow.

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New UFO sighting in San Diego, CA! 

Dumb question from the noob--where do you find the hull number on the boat? 

Also wondering, is there any tribal knowledge regarding center and rudder foil Angle of Attack?  Light air, light sailor aim for max AoA on both foils?  Heavier air, heavier sailor more neutral positions on both foils?  Is there ever a situation where you would want one or both foils set at minimum AoA?

Last, if you aren't into transporting via car top or trailering behind the car.....bike trailer (pic below).  Give me a shout if you want info on the build.  It's basically an off-the-shelf bike trailer from Amazon ($90), some bubble wrap and zip ties, and a few sections of 1" PVC.

 

 

Resized_20180405_160541_8834.jpeg

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14 hours ago, DerekF said:

Dumb question from the noob--where do you find the hull number on the boat? 

 

It should be stamped into the stern on stbd side. It's part of the serial number - from memory the hull number is in the middle of that longer number. 

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Advice from back in my days as a newbie (now that I've sailed it like 5 times)...

Set the rudder and foil trim neutral and don't worry too much about it. I was doing way too many other things wrong that affected me far more than those settings. If the boat is porpoising (is that a word) a ton, adjust the rudder foil. Once Dave got me to quit worrying about them so much, and worry about sheeting and hiking, I did WAY better. 

I think I made comments about this on the google doc. Let me know if they are confusing or you want a picture. I think front foil is 3rd hole on the bottom and rudder foil is an inch or so from the front. You shouldn't need to really adjust these until you are way better. Moving my bootie affected way more than moving these. 

 

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