Doug Lord

Steve and Dave Clarks Unidentified Foiling Object

Recommended Posts

I was out sailing in CT this week with the Fulcrum guys and got a good video of Dave showing how to get your UFO on to your car roof solo.  [Sorry for the vertical video].  

 

 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Gilles29 said:

The lower nylon rudder bushing is it glued ? How can we remove it ?

When it's worn out it will generally fall out of its own accord. They are friction fit and then superglued, if necessary, in the factory, but with wear and tear from foiling both the superglue and the friction fit wear out.

If it's not coming out then it's probably still pretty tight and doesn't need replacement yet. If you can see the bushing from above you can knock it out (this depends on how tight we were able to make the top hole with latter hull numbers being nicer). You can also get a wedge under the lip of the bushing and pull it out from the bottom. But like I said before, if it's not falling out on its own then it's probably not due for replacement, yet.

-Nick

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, burritoughs said:

When it's worn out it will generally fall out of its own accord. They are friction fit and then superglued, if necessary, in the factory, but with wear and tear from foiling both the superglue and the friction fit wear out.

If it's not coming out then it's probably still pretty tight and doesn't need replacement yet. If you can see the bushing from above you can knock it out (this depends on how tight we were able to make the top hole with latter hull numbers being nicer). You can also get a wedge under the lip of the bushing and pull it out from the bottom. But like I said before, if it's not falling out on its own then it's probably not due for replacement, yet.

-Nick

Nick

I noticed some slop at the bottom of my lower rudder gudgeon (around 1 mm) and I thought it was necessary to replace the lower nylon bushing.

So good news, in principle, this can still wait !

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Gilles29 said:

Nick

I noticed some slop at the bottom of my lower rudder gudgeon (around 1 mm) and I thought it was necessary to replace the lower nylon bushing.

So good news, in principle, this can still wait !

1 mm of slop is fine. If a big regatta were coming up, I might pull it out to replace it to get the boat perfect. But for recreational use or practice a little slop is fine.

-Nick

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"I was out sailing in CT this week with the Fulcrum guys and got a good video of Dave showing how to get your UFO on to your car roof solo"

I've seen Dave perform this at other UFO events.  Yes, its possible, but most UFO skippers are pretty friendly and I find it much easier to ask for a hand.   Even the unfriendly ones will usually help out in exchange for a beer!  I recommend enlisting the help of another person and minimizing the risk to your boat, your back, and your car.   Dave seems  to do this as a matter of principle, or perhaps it is just his favorite party trick!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/4/2019 at 12:16 PM, Champlain Sailor said:

Dave seems  to do this as a matter of principle, or perhaps it is just his favorite party trick!

Both. I'm guided by a firm principle to always be performing party tricks.

DRC

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/4/2019 at 9:16 AM, Champlain Sailor said:

"I was out sailing in CT this week with the Fulcrum guys and got a good video of Dave showing how to get your UFO on to your car roof solo"

I've seen Dave perform this at other UFO events.  Yes, its possible, but most UFO skippers are pretty friendly and I find it much easier to ask for a hand.   Even the unfriendly ones will usually help out in exchange for a beer!  I recommend enlisting the help of another person and minimizing the risk to your boat, your back, and your car.   Dave seems  to do this as a matter of principle, or perhaps it is just his favorite party trick!

The parking lot beer as a bribe--excellent suggestion.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/6/2019 at 1:16 PM, burritoughs said:

Got a great tip from a customer over the course of our most recent clinic on how to get stuck mast sections apart. Learning at the clinics doesn't just flow from student to teacher. You can learn from other clinic participants as well as the coaches, and the coaches are always picking up new things from owners that we can share with all of you. If you haven't been to a clinic yet, sign up for the next one we announce.

Anyway, here's the tip on getting a middle and top sections that have been stuck together with sand/silt in the joint apart. It is courtesy of James, UFO #127. First attempt to get it apart should be to douse the join with cold hose water and have two big guys try to pull it apart by hand. If that doesn't work, see below.

Hi Nick,

I highly recommend the wrench strap trick.  When I got a few grains of sand in my upper mast connection, the mast became fused together.  I tried yanking, pulling, and twisting.  I tried with my two brothers and we couldn't budge it.  I bought some wrench straps from amazon and it worked easily.  My wife and 12 year old son were pulling and I used the wrenches to apply torsion, occasionally changing rotation direction.  It came apart very quickly.

The wrenches are rubber straps.  My idea was to attach the handles so that the normal force was not near the sail track and the rubber strap provided a large tangential load via friction.  I agree that if not done correctly, the wrench handle will crush the sail track.

Below is a photo and a sketch.  Two wrenches are needed.  Set the wrenches to oppose each other so that the mast pieces can be twisted.  While one person twists, the other two people grab the mast and pull along the axis.

Here's the link from amazon. It ships with a large and small strap.  Two small wrenches work better (I bought two packages), but it will also work with a small and large wrench as shown in the photo.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00K92810A/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I hope this helps.  Feel free to forward this email or post to the forum.

James

Been made aware the diagram and pictures of the strap wrench mast separation method are only visible to me on the forum, not everyone. Fixed that below.

mdkicamlhmlemfmm.thumb.png.efba2cab88a251e1eed26b35742a358b.pngipnlidbnbgfhhcoh.thumb.png.6aad93a931f4619b145e54aef2589bd8.pngnhfakiaelfefifog.thumb.png.408a86f668cf5761dfbe047704baf8ef.png

-Nick

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, burritoughs said:

Been made aware the diagram and pictures of the strap wrench mast separation method are only visible to me on the forum, not everyone. Fixed that below.

mdkicamlhmlemfmm.thumb.png.efba2cab88a251e1eed26b35742a358b.pngipnlidbnbgfhhcoh.thumb.png.6aad93a931f4619b145e54aef2589bd8.pngnhfakiaelfefifog.thumb.png.408a86f668cf5761dfbe047704baf8ef.png

-Nick

Nick:  This should be part of the "UFO Repair Kit." 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A lightly edited version of this mast disassembly trick is now on the Unofficial UFO Flight Manual. Keep the good tips coming.

I expect I'll be using this technique later this week (when the straps arrive) :-}

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My mainfoil pushrod keeps getting bent here and there. Are there any good tricks to straighten it out without damaging it? Does heating it up help -- if so, how hot? Are there any field tricks of inserting it in something (ie: a metal profile) that'll straighten it up?

Video below, using a new mast lower -- figuring out rig tension and settings for this new mast base -- and foiling some. Wave conditions and not-quite-100% ride height control setup meant limited foiling time and height. Fun is fun though :-)

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, martin.langhoff said:

My mainfoil pushrod keeps getting bent here and there. Are there any good tricks to straighten it out without damaging it? Does heating it up help -- if so, how hot? Are there any field tricks of inserting it in something (ie: a metal profile) that'll straighten it up?

Video below, using a new mast lower -- figuring out rig tension and settings for this new mast base -- and foiling some. Wave conditions and not-quite-100% ride height control setup meant limited foiling time and height. Fun is fun though :-)

 

 

Where is your pushrod bending? -Also slick hiking form-

DRC

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Dave Clark said:

Where is your pushrod bending? -Also slick hiking form-

DRC

Thanks! Working those abs. Rod bends...

1 - At the top - small misalignments of the crane while sailing which happen with the rod pushed down end up in bends close to the head that are hard to cure. The g10 T piece has bent the aluminum a bit open. I have to hammer the foil vertical back to being tight.

2 - at the bottom, similar to a pic posted recently, with the tip of the rod being bent 20-30degrees.

3 - random spots in the middle due to handling. These only add friction to the system.

I think #1 happens first and leads to the rod length being 1-2mm short. This causes the bottom end to catch the edge of the dimple, leading to #2. With #1 and #2 the effect is a couple mm less action, with the resulting reduced fun percentage...

There's a trick for straightening wire using a drill and a block of wood. Might try it. https://youtu.be/ewuHD6RJFdE

Was also considering heating up the rod and inserting it - hot - in the foil vertical. I'd use the foil vertical upside-down to get all the way to the head of the wire. Needs more prep than the drill method, which is code for - I don't have a blowtorch.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heating a steel rod can make it a lot softer.  It depends on existing cold work or and/or heat treat. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey team, I have an outside the box concept for flight control I want to pitch you guys.

I work in the UAV industry and have custom built quad and tricopter drones.  Much of my experience is with sensors and digital flight controllers.  I have never loved the mechanical wand mechanism that we inherited from the Mothies.  I don't care for the drag, the part count, pushrods, and reliability issues.  That said, I get why Fulcrum went with something tried and true and well understood.  I just think it could be more awesome (while being removable to do One Design racing if desired).  

I am endeavoring to create a marinized, digital flight controller (DFC) for my UFO. My thought is to use a sonar sensor(s) to detect elevation above the water and have a servo controlling the front foil flap angle to maintain elevation.  Placement of sensor(s) could also allow the DFC to understand chop or wave shape and anticipate upcoming water 'terrain'.  We also gain the ability to control the flap in a continuous manner vs. the binary manner of the current system for more accurate elevation control.  

And as always, once you put a computer on something the 'good ideas' come out of the woodwork.  So I'm sure there are a million other things we could sense, record and/or manipulate.  Good ideas welcome.

From a hardware perspective I believe this to be mainly an integration and packaging effort.  There are lots of highly integrated, cheap RC aircraft flight control boards out there with good support.  Most of the sweat will be figuring out the software interfaces, control algorithms, control loop gains, and sensor array interpretation. 

So, does this sound exciting to anyone else?  Does anyone else have a skill set and time who would want to help on the project?  If so, PM me and we can get our own thread together for development.  We can report back here periodically on progress and ask for UFO test pilot volunteers =)

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Embedded motion sensor can determine pitch as well. 

Ride height is one possible function. Automatic or electronic control of foil rake might be dumb but more useful in practice. Superfoiler had this.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Derek, I completely agree that this is a viable project.  About four years ago, my son was looking for a senior project in high school.  At the same time, I was learning to foil with a local sailor that owns a moth.   We found that the settings that we wanted for upwind sailing and downwind sailing were very different, and the owner was experimenting with mechanical ways to transition between the right setpoints (ride height, wand responsiveness, baseline AOA etc) quickly when bearing away or heading up.  We realized that an electronic ride height mechanism may do the trick, recognizing that it would not be legal for use while racing the moth due to class rules.  If nothing else, it might make finding the optimal settings much faster, and we could then back into a mechanical way to replicate what we learned with an electronic system.

One of the impetuses for this was a local business here in Vermont name Senix that makes commercial liquid level measurement systems.  They are used mostly for water and chemical treatment systems, but I found a case study on their website that showed that Oracle had used them to measure hull height on their Americas Cup catamaran.  Looking at their website now, it appears that this has grown to be a normal part of their business.  https://www.senix.com/applications/hydrofoil-and-nautical/    At the time, the AC work was a fun, one-off application for them.  My son approached them and asked for a sample for his high school project, and they were happy to give him one that did not meet the linearity specs that they guarantee (it was off by tenths of an inch-no problem for us).

Over the winter my son bought a waterproof project box for batteries and an Arduino, machined a bracket to mount the sensor to an arm that would replace the wand pivot, and found a servo that could drive the wand pushrod.   He programmed the Arduino with a proportional control algorithm and allowed the user to adjust the offset (higher or lower) and the time constant (faster response or longer time averaged response) using four waterproof push buttons mounted in the case.  I encouraged him to implement a full PID control algorithm, but he didn't think it necessary (and didn't want to listen to dad).   He got it up and running and demonstrated that the controller would drive the servo to correct for height, while holding the sensor in the house.   We planned to add a toggle switch as well, so you could have two setting 'stored' in the controller, upwind and downwind.  That way, when you bear away, you flip a switch and the controller will adopt your 'downwind' settings,  a lower ride height and shorter time constant (you want to follow the waves as you sail down then).  Upwind you want to be up to allow lots of windward heal and a longer time constant so you can punch through the waves without the flap responding to each one.

Unfortunately, in early spring the Moth's owner was transferred to the Southern US, and took our test platform with him.   That summer my son found an alternate use for the Arduino, and by the time I bought my UFO last year, there was very little left of the control system to try to apply to the UFO.  But I haven't given up and I'm urging him to re-assemble it and mount it on the UFO while he is home on college from breaks.   Your post has me re-motivated to try to get this up and running this winter, with or without my son!

Doug

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Martin - For straightening I have used my bench vise with smooth jaws to clamp it, rotate, clamp, rotate, clamp.  It's not as fast as the drill method I suppose but it works pretty well.  I have noticed the rod is susceptible to easy handling damage as well.  I would avoid the heating method due to the potential to anneal it.  I'm not sure what grade/temper of stainless Fulcrum is using.  If you were to heat it to straighten it I would probably reheat it, after it's straight, and then quench it to put some hardness back into it.  I would also watch for any cracks in the strut if you're moving the aluminum both ways - i.e. bending it out and then back in.  You likely already are watching but unless the bulging is creating issues with it fitting in the slot I might be tempted to shim the G10 for a snug fit in the opened up hole rather than trying to squeeze it back.

 

Derek - I like the simplicity of mechanical systems and not having electrical needs on the small boat.  However, if you've got a way to make it fly easier and better, I'm game.  Electrons and I don't always get along so I can't help on the control side.  But I've got ready access to a bit of composites, a CNC, and decent manual mill if that helps the cause any.

 

BTW - Martin, I'm incredibly jealous of your weather.  The last time I tried to get out, a week ago, it was 45 degrees out at best, kinda rain/snowy, and we had an inch of snow on the surrounding mountains...  Keep posting up the videos, keeps me jazzed and willing to go wetsuit up and be cold and wet to play :).

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A small marine safe electronic module with simple ultrasonic for height along with attitude and motion sensors has been discussed in many forums for improving foiling.  It is obvious that it can work and can be cost effective. 

The UFO would be a pretty good test platform. 

Although the existing main foil should work OK for a start, there would be advantages to having the main foil flap being actuated more freely and probably being bigger.   With a main foil set up for more control, there are probably other features that would make the boat more fun and easier to learn.  For example, with a smart take off program, the foil would stay low lift until the right speed is reached and then quickly pop the boat up out of the water.   

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For folks interested in the Digital Flight Control, I have started an SA blog.  Check it out, and feel free to comment.  I will try to post at each major milestone.  

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/15/2019 at 11:15 AM, Skid said:

Martin - For straightening

good stuff, thanks!

On 10/15/2019 at 11:15 AM, Skid said:

I'm incredibly jealous of your weather.

(-: -- Let it be on the record than helpful and friendly UFO sailors are welcome to drop by Miami and borrow mine. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Finally a YouTube ad shows up that actually appeals to me!

 

 

2D842BE0-4923-45D9-B78D-D48DB53519CE.png

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey dgmckim, I noted you hail from North Carolina. 

I am a UFO newby in Wilmington.  Where are you located.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

large.IMG_20191018_174228.jpg.c3f5d5952725620523df854a927cbb59.jpglarge.IMG_20191018_174222.jpg.128147e2a0e69892a6ce12b205853693.jpglarge.IMG_20191018_190618.jpg.a95a5edd02ffdac875f755ca453e2609.jpglarge.IMG_20191018_190224.jpg.50cfae724cf3ee094a1d0419f63ba556.jpglarge.IMG_20191018_174237.jpg.82f6f34ad4b6a188387d5a2061ba239c.jpg

Sandwich press, pressed into pushrod straightening duty...

Drill method made things worse. I am risking anneeling the metal, but hey, might get sailing tomorrow.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sandwich press + drilled wood block works! 

- Drill multiple holes, as holes are worn out, enlarged, switch to an unused one. 

- If you have soft wood and hard wood, use soft wood first, then hard wood block

- Locking pliers and gloves

- You'll make multiple passes - work in both directions of the rod, and work almost always pulling . Or pull-rotate. Where you have a kink it'll have a hard time going through the wood. Grab the rod from both ends (careful! hot!) and run the kink through the wood block many times, alternating which side you pull from. In a few cases you cannot avoid pushing - careful and gentle, the warm metal bends really easy!

- You can only warm about 15cm at a time (5inch) so work in that 15cm section, and then leave the next section to warm up. I give it  about 5 minutes to warm up

- It works really well to do this near the foil vertical, and to insert the rod in the vertical while it's still warm.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, john.p said:

Some Sydney harbour foiling from last weekend.

100 out of 10 for waving to somebody while flying by. This video makes me grin from ear to ear.

DRC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/19/2019 at 7:14 PM, martin.langhoff said:

 

Martin:  If you had dumped the sail quicker, could you have saved yourself?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/17/2019 at 10:51 PM, P Flados said:

Hey dgmckim, I noted you hail from North Carolina. 

I am a UFO newby in Wilmington.  Where are you located.  

hey! Sorry, I didn't see your message until today - i'm in Raleigh but I spend a lot of time sailing in Wrightsville. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Andyufo said:

Martin:  If you had dumped the sail quicker, could you have saved yourself?

Probably yes, and generally yes. I was bearing away and easing trying to save it, and maybe easing faster would have helped.

In this particular instance, some equipment failure was at play, and I think made it harder to save than usual. Once I was back I found that the mainfoil flap hinge was peeling off, from the front. So as soon as I picked up speed, parts of the rubbery flap hinge would lift up and act as a break. I suspect this odd dynamic made things more... interesting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, martin.langhoff said:

Probably yes, and generally yes. I was bearing away and easing trying to save it, and maybe easing faster would have helped.

In this particular instance, some equipment failure was at play, and I think made it harder to save than usual. Once I was back I found that the mainfoil flap hinge was peeling off, from the front. So as soon as I picked up speed, parts of the rubbery flap hinge would lift up and act as a break. I suspect this odd dynamic made things more... interesting.

Do we have guidance on how to repair main foil flap? I vaguely remember seeing it here, but there's nothing in the Unofficial Manual.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Andyufo said:

Do we have guidance on how to repair main foil flap? I vaguely remember seeing it here, but there's nothing in the Unofficial Manual.

I think Fulcrum has changed how the hinge is bonded and is no longer recommending the diy fix as a good repair. Short term fix Is Tyvek tape (you can see it on my videos). Long term fix involves a trip to Fulcrum.

Mine has gone flakey after 2-3 years in Texas and Miami sun. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, martin.langhoff said:

I think Fulcrum has changed how the hinge is bonded and is no longer recommending the diy fix as a good repair. Short term fix Is Tyvek tape (you can see it on my videos). Long term fix involves a trip to Fulcrum.

Mine has gone flakey after 2-3 years in Texas and Miami sun. 

Our recommendation for repairing the mainfoil hinge in-field is to splice in new pieces of hinge material under vacuum. You can also use Tyvek tape to hold it down in a pinch. Or try splicing in a new piece and securing it with many, many clamps, but that doesn't work nearly as well. The repair with clamps will definitely not be as fair and will not hold up as long as a repair done under vacuum.

As most folks aren't set up to vacuum bag, our real recommendation is to send your foil back to the factory for maintenance. Here at the factory we can replace the entire hinge, which you can't do in the field, because you don't have a mold to register everything in place. If you are vacuum bag capable, and want instructions for this repair email me. We can put a guide together and send it your way.

-Nick 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

was watching some AC races on youtube and got an ad for UFO 

the first sailing ad i've ever gotten i think

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, burritoughs said:

Our recommendation for repairing the mainfoil hinge in-field is to splice in new pieces of hinge material under vacuum. You can also use Tyvek tape to hold it down in a pinch. Or try splicing in a new piece and securing it with many, many clamps, but that doesn't work nearly as well. The repair with clamps will definitely not be as fair and will not hold up as long as a repair done under vacuum.

As most folks aren't set up to vacuum bag, our real recommendation is to send your foil back to the factory for maintenance. Here at the factory we can replace the entire hinge, which you can't do in the field, because you don't have a mold to register everything in place. If you are vacuum bag capable, and want instructions for this repair email me. We can put a guide together and send it your way.

-Nick 

Nick:  Do some owners have a backup rudder and/or main foil? How much $'s are these? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Andyufo said:

Nick:  Do some owners have a backup rudder and/or main foil? How much $'s are these? 

have a spare rudder, safely stored in the bottom of biscayne bay somewhere... 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, martin.langhoff said:

have a spare rudder, safely stored in the bottom of biscayne bay somewhere... 

Thanks to our exhaustive prototyping on the Kickemuit River I have a spare rudder somewhere 100 feet off our dock and a really sweet baby blue mainfoil a mile further down the river. Archeologist will someday find them and realize that our civilization was rad.

DRC

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Dave Clark said:

Thanks to our exhaustive prototyping on the Kickemuit River I have a spare rudder somewhere 100 feet off our dock and a really sweet baby blue mainfoil a mile further down the river. Archeologist will someday find them and realize that our civilization was rad.

DRC

Lolol. I have the utmost admiration for DRC, the inventor, and for Martin, the relentless user, and no guess why there is that large washer at the top of the strut. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Andyufo said:

Nick:  Do some owners have a backup rudder and/or main foil? How much $'s are these? 

Some owners do have spare mainfoils. (Price is $748.57 plus tax.) Martin is one them as he bought a new mainfoil to keep foiling, while his old mainfoil is coming back to the Mothershop for hinge replacement. Mainfoils can suffer catastrophic damage when grounded or running into submerged objects (usually trash, sometimes creatures of the deep), and the hinge will eventually need maintenance. 

Rudder foils are much more durable. With the exception of folks who've stored spare rudder struts and foils at the bottom of the harbor, which can happen when you don't hook up the halyard or use the washer on the top of the strut or when you strike a submerged object at speed and rip the rudder off the boat, no one has a spare rudder foil as far as I know. All damage to rudder foils we've seen so far has been repairable.

The majority of repairs to rudder foils have been of the filling and fairing variety, which is fairly easy for an amateur doing their first boat repair to pull off. Mainfoil repairs tend to require basic lamination skills as the foil is the more delicate of the two. Additionally, in some cases like hinge repair/replacement, the repair requires tools you probably don't have at home.

If you're going to buy a spare foil, we recommend purchasing the mainfoil first. If you want a spare rudder foil, we're happy to sell you one, but it's less likely to be useful than a spare mainfoil.

-Nick

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

$750 includes the vertical member? Seems like a bargain compared to dumbfoil prices either way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

Thought you guys would enjoy some Thursday afternoon comedy.  Dave, when are we getting traps on our UFO's?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, DerekF said:

 

 

Thought you guys would enjoy some Thursday afternoon comedy.  Dave, when are we getting traps on our UFO's?

This is precisely what I always rant about when people suggest traps on foilers. I've tried it. A lot. The sensation is best described as "Spacewalk gone wrong". This is legitimately gut-laugh funny. However it's also worth noting that it's great news nobody's hurt. Heavy short-crewed foilers run on surface piercing foils are a truly olympic challenge to keep tame. They can bite hard.

DRC

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This boat sure merits the TGIF moniker. Had a rocking outing today in 15.22kt with a messy chop, took me quite a bit of trying to find the right settings so I wouldn't faceplant every 30s. So there's two videos for y'all

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/25/2019 at 10:18 PM, martin.langhoff said:

This boat sure merits the TGIF moniker. Had a rocking outing today in 15.22kt with a messy chop, took me quite a bit of trying to find the right settings so I wouldn't faceplant every 30s. So there's two videos for y'all

 

Re: settings. These will vary a bit on sailor dimensions and frankly style, so a good way to save you a few steps of iterative learning is to hashmark your foil settings once you've found a setup you like for those conditions. Memory is more fickle than writing.

DRC

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys, a few more updates on the Digital Flight Control System.  I have all the sensors now working with the controller and the servo sized.  I am trying to decide linear actuator vs. servo to reduce power consumption.  Packing, integration, and PID loop tuning are my remaining challenges.  Link to the blog below if you are interested in the details.  Happy Halloween--let's hope for lots of UFO sightings.  

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/24/2019 at 5:13 PM, Dave Clark said:

This is precisely what I always rant about when people suggest traps on foilers. I've tried it. A lot. The sensation is best described as "Spacewalk gone wrong". This is legitimately gut-laugh funny. However it's also worth noting that it's great news nobody's hurt. Heavy short-crewed foilers run on surface piercing foils are a truly olympic challenge to keep tame. They can bite hard.

DRC

We could put this one into that thread about changing direction too. This was an unintentional "zone of death" move. Darn it--that helmsman surely didn't want to do that, but there was nothing else to hold onto!

I just though of a brilliant plan. Put the tiller facing aft so that when you have to pull on it in that sort of situation, it luffs you up haha.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The unofficial UFO guide has some updates, all sourced from this very forum discussion. Mainly straightening pushrods and advanced foiling technique (crab mode, downwind S patterns, etc). Edits, suggestions welcome. 

Also ... I've noticed we've messed with Youtube's algorithms:

  • Open Youtube.com (in an incognito tab if you want to remove any "personalization" variables)
  • Search for 'foiler'
  • Use the filter widget to narrow it down to 1 week
  • Scroll down the results. It won't take long before you see "UFO Sightings" videos listed. And I don't mean Fulcrum's UFOs, but "actual UFO" videos.

YT has associated that UFOs are foilers, and so... searches for foilers turn up UFO videos. 

Don't think we have to worry about AI taking over.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jealous of Martin's warm water and perfect foiling breeze? Impending snow storms messing up your foiling plans? Then it's time to start getting ready for the 2019-2020 UFO Winter Circuit. Dates for all 5 events are announced. NORs and sites for registration should be up for the first four events this week. We'll post all the latest info on the UFO Event Calendar. Check it out!

Here's the rundown on the UFO Winter Circuit:

Dec 7-8          Flying-V                                                  Charleston, SC

Jan 15-20      East Coast Foiling Midwinters           Key Largo, FL

Mar 11-16      East Coast Foiling Midwinters #2     Key Largo, FL

Apr 1-6           East Coast Foiling Midwinters #3     Key Largo, FL

Apr 17-19      Fort 2 Battery                                        Charleston, SC

 

-Nick

P.S. If you're interested in attending Flying-V and haven't told me yet, let me know. We have an email chain about event details that I'm happy to add folks to.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The recent post with Dave putting a UFO up on his car convinced me that my trailer is way better for getting my boat from my house to one of the local boat ramps.

However, part of my retirement includes going places with a 19' pull behind camper trailer.  Since some campgrounds have good water, I will want to take the UFO with me.  

Again, Dave's video (with his little car) confirmed that typical solo boat loading for a UFO would not have a chance when your boat rack is 6' off of the ground.   Not willing to give up, I have been considering my options for a while.  The plan came together today.  The "extra equipment" is two loading rails made from 8' 2x2s.  

The boat can be put on its side on the ground, slid into position, leaned up against the rails and then the boat is pushed up and over onto the racks pretty easy.  It was probably less struggle for me than what I saw Dave go through since "controlling the boat" is so easy as it is positioned on the ground and then lifted/pushed up and over.

After get the boat up on top, I went through a bunch of different choices for securing it in place.  I finally came up with something that is simple, secure in all directions and can be done from the ground without a ladder.  The tricks to this are that the ropes up from are put on the boat while it is on the ground and I had to add an extra "tie down" to my trailer hitch to keep the boat from lifting up in the back.

IMG_20191107_170630091.jpg

IMG_20191107_170713708.jpg

IMG_20191107_170703360.jpg

IMG_20191107_165630148.jpg

IMG_20191107_165618641.jpg

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My boom needed TLC.

Oneof the g10 spreader forks was splitting open, and I hear it can lead to bad breakage so fix asap. Reglued with g10, and added fillets in prep for a carbon sleeve later.

The outhaul end is a bit of a mess, twisting unevenly, the U bolt is bent, but I'm told it shouldn't be a big deal. Still, I added a ss monel rivet to the bottom plate trying to align it with the top plate, and redid the fillets (original fillets with plexus, chipped them away with a wood chisel, new ones with g/flex).

Used small ziplock bag (cut the corner off) and little bamboo or wood spoon-forks which work great to mix g/flex, spoon it into the baggie, and do fillets.

large.IMG_20191109_102732.jpg.f2b74fa1274c27a1463cccedf02cf7b4.jpglarge.IMG_20191109_102738.jpg.7bcbc94249426d2400cf9673a4770943.jpglarge.IMG_20191109_102839.jpg.7027b857fbde7847db27628707463b26.jpglarge.IMG_20191109_102846.jpg.ce1f1179cd213db18186c416dab43e3e.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Martin, thanks for sharing your tips for keeping your rig in good shape.   Looks like you are putting plenty of wear and tear on the boat....that's a good thing!   It just dropped below freezing here yesterday, UFO sailing is likely done up here until spring.   I need to make plans to get down South over the winter!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

UFO #4 Squirt Of Theseus has been around for... 2 1/2 years I think. I've owned it for about 1 year and 1/2. It's always lived outside, mast rigged, in the harsh Texas and Florida conditions. Monday and today key dyneema strops failed -- mast hounds strop yesterday, outhaul strop today.

In coming days I'll try replace other dyneema lines around the boat, in particular those that are not protected by the cover.

So it's just one data point, but... replace your dyneema strops and rigging every ~2 years :-)

I spliced the replacement mast hounds strop with 4mm Amsteel Blue, triple-brummeled, extra long bury. Target is to end up with the loops 42cm apart. It stretched a bit too long once I had it installed and tensioned up, so I made a 2 figure-8 knots to shorten it a bit and get sailing. I'll probably assemble a slightly shorter strop now that I know how much it stretches once in use.

Even though it's Amsteel "Blue", it's actually green. It'll still stretch/creep some. I'll try a prestretched heat-set strop next time.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Went out with 20kt, quickly dropping to 10kt. Lots of stops to get the right settings for 20kt, and then to readjust for lighter air.

Soon after got to the lighter air settings, which involve lots of outhaul tension, the outhaul strop snapped. I had some 2mm dyneema in hand, so I jury rigged a replacement, and got back home. 

There's a shot of the strop failing on me. Very last shot is foiling with a jury rigged outhaul :-)

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Red cars go faster. Boats with carbon-black shrouds too.

Random pics of replacing the original shrouds with 2.5mm black Marlow D12 Max -- note! the recommended spec is 3mm. To make things easier to set and remove, the shackle ends have a splice, and the ring ends have a trucker's hitch made into a soft shackle. I also sanded the spreader ends to reduce chafe.

large.IMG_20191118_091820.jpg.6802099900c6ab571e16597a6c7a0601.jpglarge.IMG_20191118_092719.jpg.6e169d7fbebafe932761cce818062b21.jpglarge.IMG_20191118_092724.jpg.5f77fb3917c111431a2437f4450a2b84.jpglarge.IMG_20191118_125441.jpg.8b0f82ea38266af58c2993eea1567017.jpglarge.IMG_20191118_125500.jpg.f1b4ebb8ae648eef1bf9bf4a9758261b.jpg

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Martin, any recommended part numbers or line diameters?  Seeing your outhaul failure makes me think I should have some spare line onboard...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, DerekF said:

Hey Martin, any recommended part numbers or line diameters?  Seeing your outhaul failure makes me think I should have some spare line onboard...

(-: -- the outhaul is 3mm or 4mm dyneema, Amsteel Blue works and is easy to find. I used Marlow D12 Max 3mm (from Landfall) but that's overachieving -- the only benefit is that it stretches less. Now that I look closer, I think the U-bolt is pretty aggressive on the dyneema, so planning to keep an eye on that strop.

My water bottle and knife are tied with spyderline dyneema, which is ridiculously over-spec'd but serves as spare line.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for the information and videos Martin.  It's greatly appreciated.  I'm planning on making it through the winter watching videos and thinking of warm weather.  It's currently 41 degrees out, though sunny and windy, but the water is around 45...  I think it might be a bit much at this point for me to be out learning.

So yes, thank you again for the info and I'm loving the videos!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, Skid said:

Thank you for the information and videos Martin.  It's greatly appreciated.  I'm planning on making it through the winter watching videos and thinking of warm weather.  It's currently 41 degrees out, though sunny and windy, but the water is around 45...  I think it might be a bit much at this point for me to be out learning.

So yes, thank you again for the info and I'm loving the videos!

Martin:  Thanks from me, too, a newbie shut down for the season on Cape Cod. Perhaps, frostbiting next winter, when I'm spending more time on the boat than under it. Please keep the videos coming, so we can get vicarious pleasure from your travails, for which I have a few questions:

1. When you lost the outhaul, did you still have any steerage left, or did the jury rig have to be performed at sea?

2. For 10 knot winds, I thought we need a "looser" outhaul, than it cranked down hard, as you describe.

Best,

Andy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Andyufo said:

Martin:  Thanks from me, too, a newbie shut down for the season on Cape Cod. Perhaps, frostbiting next winter, when I'm spending more time on the boat than under it. Please keep the videos coming, so we can get vicarious pleasure from your travails, for which I have a few questions:

1. When you lost the outhaul, did you still have any steerage left, or did the jury rig have to be performed at sea?

2. For 10 knot winds, I thought we need a "looser" outhaul, than it cranked down hard, as you describe.

Best,

Andy

My pleasure :-) -- I'll see what I can do to keep you all happy. If anyone drops by sunny FL, do send me a PM. In fact, I highly recommend coming down to the Key Largo races.

#1 - I fixed it at sea (actually, in the bay, much less dramatic). Pulled the outhaul line, tied a little knot to hold it against the cleat as you do when rigging, then worked tie the replacement strop -- 1.8mm spyderline. The only complication is that working at the far back of the boat, there isn't enough buoyancy there and I was at risk of pitchpoling over the stern. I need longer arms. There's 10 minutes of very boring video of me trying to tie a stupid knot in a lull. There was a sandbar nearby, I could have gotten myself there for a more comfy repair.

May have been able to steer a broad reach, but return was upwind. 

#2 - as the wind was dropping, I was adding rig tension and outhaul, trying to get to the high camber light wind config; this gets you a very deep luff all the way to the head of the sail, but everything is cranked out hard. you can pluck the shrouds like a guitar. (there's a description of this setup in the unofficial guide).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My location (Southern NC coast) does not prevent some wintertime sailing.

However, like the sailors up North I will also just be watching this winter.  

I am out of any action for a while recuperating from repair of a torn rotator cuff.  I had been having shoulder issues for over a year before they got around to doing the MRI that showed the damage.   

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, martin.langhoff said:

My pleasure :-) -- I'll see what I can do to keep you all happy. If anyone drops by sunny FL, do send me a PM. In fact, I highly recommend coming down to the Key Largo races.

#1 - I fixed it at sea (actually, in the bay, much less dramatic). Pulled the outhaul line, tied a little knot to hold it against the cleat as you do when rigging, then worked tie the replacement strop -- 1.8mm spyderline. The only complication is that working at the far back of the boat, there isn't enough buoyancy there and I was at risk of pitchpoling over the stern. I need longer arms. There's 10 minutes of very boring video of me trying to tie a stupid knot in a lull. There was a sandbar nearby, I could have gotten myself there for a more comfy repair.

May have been able to steer a broad reach, but return was upwind. 

#2 - as the wind was dropping, I was adding rig tension and outhaul, trying to get to the high camber light wind config; this gets you a very deep luff all the way to the head of the sail, but everything is cranked out hard. you can pluck the shrouds like a guitar. (there's a description of this setup in the unofficial guide).

Thanks Martin. Before my short season ended (received the boat Labor Day weekend), my recollection is that with the proper batten tuning, I was able to get that light wind camber with tight shrouds, but not significant outhaul. Look forward to checking this out in the Spring. Of course, the only way to get the shrouds to play like a guitar lies with the outhaul. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, P Flados said:

My location (Southern NC coast) does not prevent some wintertime sailing.

However, like the sailors up North I will also just be watching this winter.  

I am out of any action for a while recuperating from repair of a torn rotator cuff.  I had been having shoulder issues for over a year before they got around to doing the MRI that showed the damage.   

Feel better, heal well.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Holiday Gift Ideas...

They're asking me what I want for the Holidays. I want a new Personal Flotation Device, aka Life Vest, for my UFO. I would appreciate recommendations from the Forum. What works well that doesn't interfere with tacking? Thanks in advance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, P Flados said:

I am out of any action for a while recuperating from repair of a torn rotator cuff

Ouch! Hope you get better soon! 

 

1 hour ago, Andyufo said:

a new Personal Flotation Device

Zhik PFD2 Black is my personal pick. Zhik's "classic" PDF is also very good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agreed, take your time and get feeling better.  Shoulders suck to have to work on twice...

I don't have a Zhik but I've really enjoyed my whitewater kayaking vest - it's a Wilderness Systems.  Kind of silly to state, but, I'd see if you can try a few on before you get it purchased to make sure it fits your build well.  I know that's tough when you're asking for a gift.  Having been in many different kayaking PFD's, they don't all fit the same...

FWIW, I'm asking for a GoPro Hero 5 so I can have documentation of the adventures out.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now