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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.
Norse Horse

2017 Race to Alaska

1,203 posts in this topic

Russell is on the move outside Hunter Island and currently has a lot more speed than those up ahead on the inside.....

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1 hour ago, Banjo5 said:

I can't get the Shearwater webcam to load this morning (http://shearwater.ca/site/live-webcam.html). So can't see whether 3.5 Aussies are in view or not. It's going to get busy up there today ... well if any wind shows up anyway. It's remarkable how weather windows come, go and shift during this race.

I'm guessing KMIYC aren't going to have the chance for much sleep if they want to hold off the WCWO's. The gap seems to be staying remarkably constant at just over 13nm.

3.5 Aussies just left the dock here at Shearwater 9:25 A.M.

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The chance of hitting a log; after 3 races - a statics could be made and the risk calculated. This year it took down a leader - but possible not the winner. Any way - not much to do about it... but retractable centerboard and rudders is possible on a tri...make the bows strong enough..

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Last year MAD Dog hit a log that did minor damage to one of the bows.

This year P&W hit a log that broke thier rudder fuse.

TPSR hit a log, damaged thier rudder. 

Broderna grounded. Bad Kitty grounded. Sistership grounded. 

This is just what i know of.

Tough race. 

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Posted (edited)

26 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

The chance of hitting a log; after 3 races - a statics could be made and the risk calculated. This year it took down a leader - but possible not the winner. Any way - not much to do about it... but retractable centerboard and rudders is possible on a tri...make the bows strong enough..

Plenty of racers have hit stuff (as Randy just said). The winners this year did and because they had a kick up rudder with a shear pin were able to fix it. I guess they also had a redundant rudder because of the twin rudder set up (so that could be a significant advantage).

The M23 rudder didn't look like it had any give/kick-up to it at all.

Nice Pair also hit something last year. Put a good dent in the bow bulb (which could be a good thing to have for this race :D ). I'm sure there are others. It's a calculated risk, I'd be wanting at least shear pins. Wasn't it rudder issues that put Bad Kitty out last year (not sure what caused them)?

In other news, KMIYC is now opening up the gap on WCWO. 18nm closer to Ketchikan and 20.3 ahead/away from WCWO.

Edit: PS. Thanks for the Shearwater update. Someday I'd like to have a beer on that patio ... it looks like a great spot.

Edited by Banjo5
Add PS.

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Logs is one thing - hard to avoid - but things can be done for the boat to survive it - but all the groundings: is the maps in these waters not up to date - or is it human error?  In our waters the maps are good - but there are groundings because one pushes the limits in the light stuff - and its not a long distant race.

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1 hour ago, SeaGul said:

Logs is one thing - hard to avoid - but things can be done for the boat to survive it - but all the groundings: is the maps in these waters not up to date - or is it human error?  In our waters the maps are good - but there are groundings because one pushes the limits in the light stuff - and its not a long distant race.

Human error, but that's what we are and why we do such silly things. ;)

Don't forget the awash sea containers!

Oh, and logs aren't sticks. These are the 2 -3 foot diameter ones that have been floating around forever so are full of water. They too are awash, or oscillating in a vertical cycle. S U R P R I S E ! ! -right in front of you, or up the centre of your hull...

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.

 

'heart of gold' progressing out of Johnston Strait,,, ~14th overall! :o

 

.

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3 hours ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

Your M32 cat with a hull flying and weather foils lifted would be no worse than a monohull? Apart from speed of course.

A tri can't escape 2 hulls in the water unless they are really sailing on the edge. But at least they would be closer together than a cats hulls and less likely to hit?

For your consideration- a 40' deadhead 1" under the h2o perpendicular to your course....

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And Ketch me takes the scenic route... but have no contenter for that 1000$....

 

 

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What is KMIYC up to? They look like they're going potentially around the east side of Porcher Island or are they stopping in at Kitkatla on Dolphin Island? This will help the wild ones catch up.

Heart of Gold is just phenomenal. 

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Posted (edited)

42 minutes ago, BarfBag said:

Human error, but that's what we are and why we do such silly things. ;)

Don't forget the awash sea containers!

Oh, and logs aren't sticks. These are the 2 -3 foot diameter ones that have been floating around forever so are full of water. They too are awash, or oscillating in a vertical cycle. S U R P R I S E ! ! -right in front of you, or up the centre of your hull...

We hit one N of Olympia that was sticking out of the mud.  The top end of it was 8' below the water level. We draw 8.5.  Nice dent on the port front of our bulb and a nice scrape down the side.

Deadheads are crafty buggers.  My favorites are when we're downwind in a frothy 3' chop doing 15k.  Sporty!

That and the edges of tidal flows.  We call them gunk zones.  Hiding under grass or kelp.  

I get nervous when we're doing over 8k....

there was a boat that was speared from below down at the Narrows- the story went that it made it through the bottom and the deck.

Edited by Amati
Stories that must be told!

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Sea grass and kelp are an issue as well as the floating dock pieces and such. A tip rudder is very useful. One of the biggest tide lines I have seen was in QCS.

That is generally a wind hole towards Prince Rupert, from the Lawyer Islands and in. The Skeena River effects the breeze where it enters the sea and boosts the ebb.

My record is 4 log impacts in one day, sailing the 4ksb in Howe Sound.

Imagine at speed. Even a prawn trap at speed could take out a rudder. They are set everywhere to 400 feet, many marked with anything they can find in the recycling that will float. They can be anywhere, any bay. Commercial ones are set way out off the Sunshine Coast, just out from the shipping channel. I have hit one of those in the dark and jumped 6 inches from the noise.

Go, WC wild ones.

Karl, what a machine.

 

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We dragged 2 crab pots God only knows how long on a moonless night.  Found them the next morning next to the boat at our berth floating next to the hull.

one was wrapped around the fin.  One didn't have a buoy.

rudder was ok

another haulout.....

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12 hours ago, SeaGul said:

Reading about Pear Shape in the link above : one can think that this boat is too small for this race - cant sleep good - and not as fast as an M32 - even BB and FB is faster - the weight of 3 and the gear will effect a small boat like this.

If you have little possibility to sleep you must be extremely fast. Extremely fast is a extreme boat - that need to really learn to sail - ref. multiple masts came down on the M32 before they learned to handle it, and it was races in very competative races a good time before the R2AK.

Crew: 3 seems ideal on a multi - the weight is essential.  So a boat that can be easy sailed by 2 - that makes for a rather big multi - but then the pedal out of harbor is the limiting factor. But a setup with all 3 pedaling - can be a rather big tri - given that the conditions not too bad (its a chance to take a too big boat  - it could fail to start).

Light wind conditions seems to be the factor; a boat that can sail fast in light conditions - and survive heavy - think Freeburd comes close to that concept - but could add more sail- bigger mast.

The boat isn't too small for the race, sleeping is an issue for everyone in certain conditions, it was no different for us. You are incorrect that BB and FB are faster,  they are in some conditions in others they are not as they will attest to. 

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At least a cat gives the opportunity to sleep in the windward hull, where you need a pretty big tri to do that.  I know it's kind of parcing design stuff, but still...

could the opposite be true for HP conditions in a cat? Get one of the hulls nearly or out of the water?  I'd have to model that 

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And you know of course what you call a log with birds sitting on it?

A Canadian aircraft carrier.

It's okay, I'm Canadian 'eh.

 

Pieces of floating dock, lol, I've seen that here too! Good thing it was sunny or I may not have seen it at 30 knots...

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The girls ( you too Ben! ) are catching up to the Nacra 20!!!

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39 minutes ago, 40Plus said:

The boat isn't too small for the race, sleeping is an issue for everyone in certain conditions, it was no different for us. You are incorrect that BB and FB are faster,  they are in some conditions in others they are not as they will attest to. 

Too small to be ideal that is...  I looked at the replay and it looked like FB was gaining a lot upwind before Pears got in trouble.

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12 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

Too small to be ideal that is...  I looked at the replay and it looked like FB was gaining a lot upwind before Pears got in trouble.

Yes they gained in those conditions as expected, however we were sailing very conservatively in the lumpy sea state. Upwind in Light/med air it's a different story. Downwind we are generally faster. 

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14 minutes ago, 40Plus said:

Yes they gained in those conditions as expected, however we were sailing very conservatively in the lumpy sea state. Upwind in Light/med air it's a different story. Downwind we are generally faster. 

But doesnt that small light boat feel heavy when it was loaded for this race? At 400kg - 3 men + gear+ supplies must be +300kg - and FB at maybe 1100kg+300kg - thats not much for a bigger boat...

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2 hours ago, Amati said:

For your consideration- a 40' deadhead 1" under the h2o perpendicular to your course....

In which case, what type of boat you have is academic, other than the fact that a multi could be going a lot faster.......

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57 minutes ago, BarfBag said:

And you know of course what you call a log with birds sitting on it?

A Canadian aircraft carrier.

It's okay, I'm Canadian 'eh.

 

Pieces of floating dock, lol, I've seen that here too! Good thing it was sunny or I may not have seen it at 30 knots...

:lol:

But if the flotation is styrofoam, they don't mark up the hull as much.  If the wood is waterlogged, much easier to see pale blue (or pink, or white) in dark green NW waters.

although hitting expanded polystyrene is messier than extruded.  And the beads stick to the hull.  Yuck!

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8 minutes ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

In which case, what type of boat you have is academic, other than the fact that a multi could be going a lot faster.......

A Hobie or Newick type hull might be ok, esp if the rudder kicks up-

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1 hour ago, Amati said:

:lol:

But if the flotation is styrofoam, they don't mark up the hull as much.  If the wood is waterlogged, much easier to see pale blue (or pink, or white) in dark green NW waters.

although hitting expanded polystyrene is messier than extruded.  And the beads stick to the hull.  Yuck!

There's often lots of foam but it's covered here either in concrete or 6 x 6 inch timbers, and awash.

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2 hours ago, SeaGul said:

But doesnt that small light boat feel heavy when it was loaded for this race? At 400kg - 3 men + gear+ supplies must be +300kg - and FB at maybe 1100kg+300kg - thats not much for a bigger boat...

We each weigh 165 lbs, there were two of us so 330lbs. Food+water+personal gear+safety gear +Repair Kits = 170lbs. So in total 500lbs. The boat felt just fine. 

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The siphon hose that is Johnstone Strait helps deposit enough dock foam floatsam in Queen Charlotte Sound to form mounds on the highest high tide line.

I was shocked to see it camped there last year on a little island. Most likely gets flushed to sea. Think about all that fetch south of Campbell River as a catchment for floatsam in winter storms, for days on end...

It will be interesting to see the results of the Kelp team microplastics water sampling.

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Anyone curious if Ketchme will break the Burd's [Arc22] time from 2015?

WC Wildones could beat the Hobie 33 time of 2015.

2015 (3rd) 8d 3h 49m, Team Por Favor - 33’ Mono - Hobie 33 (3 Crew)
2015 (4th) 9d 7h 24m, Team FreeBurd - 22’ Cat - ARC-22 (2 Crew
 
Nice vid from the ladies in Shearwater...

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Now there's a testament to having the right attitude!

I wonder if KMIYC will need to stop again before the finish. If they do, maybe WCWO will manage to pass? I don't get the impression that WCWO is going for the buyback anyway, but it'll be interested to see how they place. In a good place for first monohull at any rate.

And how about 3.5 Aussies? F31R vs Oday 27, but the Oday has a 120 mile lead, with 100 miles to go. Maybe we'll see a repeat of 2015's tortoise and hare battle between Por Favor and MOB.

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1 hour ago, Norse Horse said:

Anyone curious if Ketchme will break the Burd's [Arc22] time from 2015?

WC Wildones could beat the Hobie 33 time of 2015.

2015 (3rd) 8d 3h 49m, Team Por Favor - 33’ Mono - Hobie 33 (3 Crew)
2015 (4th) 9d 7h 24m, Team FreeBurd - 22’ Cat - ARC-22 (2 Crew
 
Nice vid from the ladies in Shearwater...

FWIW (which likely isn't very much), I have a spreadsheet that I record positions into now and then and calculate straight line distance to the finish, past 24 hour run, and a few other things.

So right now if you use the past 24 hour speeds for the remaining distance you get KMIYC finishing June 19th, 5:23am (7.72 days), and WCWO coming in a few hours later at 8:41am (7.86 days). So if this extrapolations hold anywhere close the two boats are in a good chance to beat the older times you mentioned.

And speaking of fun videos (like the one above) did you see this one of KMIYC going past Addenbroke Island? I really like the music on this one, and the little cat is hauling right along.

 

 

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WCWO is currently 2 kn faster than Ketch Me. We might have a boat race!

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The ODay 27 has some history.

" It didn't take long for the O'Day 27 to become a success on the racing circuit, particularly in the MORC division. Jim Gleason, the former president of O'Day, reportedly never lost a race in a 27. Whether this true or not is hard to prove, but it does point to the fact that the 27 is a fast boat. The 27, like all of Gurney's boats, sails well in a wide range of conditions and that's why it has remained popular. Upwind, it's fairly stiff, as owners note they don't typically reef until the wind is consistently above 15 knots and the helm starts to load up. The rig is set up well inboard, allowing for fairly tight sheeting angles. "

http://sailingmagazine.net/article-726-oday-27.html

" O'Day Press Releases

For release October 14, 1975
Contact Robie Pierce 617-678-5291

O'Day 27 Race results
HOW FAST IS AN O'DAY 27?

1975 Summer Race results -- "American Pie"
A "Shoed" O'Day 27 -- "Personalized but not customized". All results in M.O.R.C. division

Buzzards Bay Tower Race (54 mile overnight) 1st
Block Island Race Week 5th out of 42 boats
Edgartown Regatta 1st 3rd 1st overall
Buzzards Regatta 1st 1st 1st 1st overall
Jewett Bowl 1st 1st 1st overall
M.O.R.C. International 5th Class 14th overall (48 boats 22 in class)
Stonington, Connecticut 1st Production Boat
Station 32 M.O.R.C. Lincoln Trophy
"

http://www.iheartodays.com/model_oday_27.html

 

From the 2016 Team Onism video, but the quote suits the O'Day.

Dale Goodwin-may the wild ones lead us to the mighty coasts of wonder through the winds of glory before our final days calm us forever

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9 hours ago, SeaGul said:

Logs is one thing - hard to avoid - but things can be done for the boat to survive it - but all the groundings: is the maps in these waters not up to date - or is it human error?  In our waters the maps are good - but there are groundings because one pushes the limits in the light stuff - and its not a long distant race.

The charts are updated periodically but not necessarily everything, especially soundings. The update may only be for aids to navigation which is usually the easy part. The rest of the chart, the shoreline and depths, are often updated in pieces. Some charts will have an inset chart that shows areas with dates of when that area was mapped, and in a few cases, some areas just have dashed lines with the approximate location of the shoreline and uncharted within. In the case of British Columbia, the charts I have of the western shore of the Queen Charlottes were uncharted as of just a few years ago. Umm.... make that few decades. With recent technological developments this may have changed but all my chars are older. Time flys when you're having fun!

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19 hours ago, SeaGul said:

About hitting a log - that can happen -as with Pear this year - foiling or not foiling... some luck is needed...

Luck? Yes! You can call it Russian Roulette.

Going around Chatham Point, where Seymour Narrows/Discovery Passage meets Johnston Strait, the strong currents cause lots of whirlpools that extend out from the point so it pays to give the point a wide berth because a lot of debris collects in them.

A few years ago while going around the point I tried to find a line between the whirlpools but I got a log (about 8 inches diameter, ~15 cm) get stuck between the spade rudder and the prop. Couldn't turn the helm because it was jammed against the rudder and couldn't motor because it was against the prop. Couldn't anchor because the depth there gets up to over 1,000 feet! and there is no shoal area anywhere where one can drop the anchor. The wind (~ 15 knots) was blowing strong in Discovery Passage and blowing me against the rock cliff of East Thurlow Island (shown as yellow land to the north) and I was sailing solo. This was Not a fun situation.

Edit: I've been gone all day so just getting caught up with the older posts.

Chatham Point.png

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2 hours ago, Sailor John said:

The charts are updated periodically but not necessarily everything, especially soundings. The update may only be for aids to navigation which is usually the easy part. The rest of the chart, the shoreline and depths, are often updated in pieces. Some charts will have an inset chart that shows areas with dates of when that area was mapped, and in a few cases, some areas just have dashed lines with the approximate location of the shoreline and uncharted within. In the case of British Columbia, the charts I have of the western shore of the Queen Charlottes were uncharted as of just a few years ago. Umm.... make that few decades. With recent technological developments this may have changed but all my chars are older. Time flys when you're having fun!

We wound up sliding our keel up 6" above waterline on a ledge opposite Shipwreck Rock on a falling tide -not on the charts - going into Sylva Bay.  Wasn't too bad until C-Tow, after hauling us off the ledge put us back on it at 5k or so.  The captain of the rescue Bertram uttered the immortal words "that wasn't supposed to be there". :lol:

Beautiful repair at Jespersen's.  Better than new, which is saying something...

Concensus was that a slab had moved from closer to the shore to our spot because of tremors.  

They could have named the ledge after us, but no....

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6 hours ago, 40Plus said:

We each weigh 165 lbs, there were two of us so 330lbs. Food+water+personal gear+safety gear +Repair Kits = 170lbs. So in total 500lbs. The boat felt just fine. 

Ok - but the sleeping part - was that intended on the trampoline? How much sail area du you have?

Logs - get it - its a big problem - but didnt MAD Dog use t-rudders? I saw a satelite foto - close up - it was millions of logs on the shores.  

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The singlehanded race is brute force and dogged determination against refined sophistication and calm confidence.  The french have a saying "Plus ça change, plus c'est pareil." - "The more things change the more they stay the same".  Every day has been Groundhog Day in this race -  Russell Brown must have "I've got you babe" as his six AM wake up alarm in the G32.

Roger Mann is the brute force and Russell Brown is the calm sophistication.  I watch Roger keep on the gas overnight, exhaustively build a lead and then watch Russell wake up, have breakfast and effortlessly regain his lead.  Even early in the day, Roger is betting on a risky shallow water shortcut, while Russell heads outside for better wind.   I'm finding the single hand race more exciting than the line honours.

 

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There is no single handed prize. I wonder if we can get 10 people chipping in $100 each to make a "side bet" $1000 prize before they finish. I'll put in $100.

Is anyone close to the race organizers who can make it official?

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2 minutes ago, Alex W said:

There is no single handed prize. I wonder if we can get 10 people chipping in $100 each to make a "side bet" $1000 prize before they finish. I'll put in $100.

Is anyone close to the race organizers who can make it official?

There used to be Side Bets, last year.

There are only notations in the official results to honour solo accomplishments.

You can certainly email the sponsors link to enquire with the Race Boss.

People can support the race and other great programs by joining the NorthWest Marine Center.

Sistership is raising money for womens programs. They raised 8k last year and appear to be closing on it this year. They are thoughtfully posting individual thanks on FB

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There are two side bets listed this year. One from Small Craft Advisor for first sub-20 foot boat to finish and one from Fisheries Supply for first DNF due to time. 

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16 minutes ago, Alex W said:

There is no single handed prize. I wonder if we can get 10 people chipping in $100 each to make a "side bet" $1000 prize before they finish. I'll put in $100.

Is anyone close to the race organizers who can make it official?

I'd put in $100 as well - I've gotten at least that much entertainment from the show.

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25 minutes ago, Alex W said:

There are two side bets listed this year. One from Small Craft Advisor for first sub-20 foot boat to finish and one from Fisheries Supply for first DNF due to time. 

Last year individual bets were allowed.

Might be some fun in the Stoke paddle boarders getting a Seagull o/b....

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So WCWO just posted a live video on Facebook  (just how good is that). They're rowing in pretty much a flat calm, so we can only presume that KMIYC are doing the same thing 12 miles ahead of them. Dedication to the cause.

Right now it's looking like Sistership is the fastest boat on the course.

And given the weather forecast, if Russell is well rested enough he could/should head further out to get more of the wind that's coming.

It's the race that just keeps on giving.

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Screenshot of the wind forecast at 11 AM. It is currently 10:55 AM.

Edit: guess I should have used more bytes.

Wind Forecast 11 AM PDT.PNG

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Posted (edited)

Screenshot for 5 PM PDT later today. Looks good for going north on the outside.

Wind Forecast 5 PM PDT.PNG 

Edit: Catch Me if You Can and WCWP are facing about a 1.5 knot ebb out of Revillagigedo Channel and Dixon Entrance at 11:30 PM Not sure why WCWP have a heading toward Dundas Island because the forecast wind shows it is lighter there but maybe more local wind and currents favor that.

Edited by Sailor John
Info on Catch Me If You Can and WCWP

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12 hours ago, SeaGul said:

Ok - but the sleeping part - was that intended on the trampoline? How much sail area du you have?

Logs - get it - its a big problem - but didnt MAD Dog use t-rudders? I saw a satelite foto - close up - it was millions of logs on the shores.  

We had sleeping options, down below in light air, trampolines or cockpit floor in breezier conditions. All 3 options are in gore-tex bivvy bags. 

As for sail area we have a slightly bigger than standard main and jib, our A2 is 600 Sq feet so downwind sail area is almost 1000 Sq feet. 

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Stoked teams are having it rough with sickness. Pushing all that way on a paddleboard, cold water and fatigue make a cold turn to something worse.

Call yer mom. Well, Daniel did. Asking about those wild ones. The audio blog with the Film Boss is a hit, with some good rapport. Reminds me of some Johnny Carson humour, from way back. https://r2ak.com/2017-daily-updates/2017-stage-2-day-6-your-mama/

Go Ryan!! Big day, over 7 knots speed...

This video is for Rod Price, for finding the floating Molson Canadian beer in the Great White North.

 

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15 miles of separation between KMIYK and WCWO.  It is interesting that KMIYK split rather than cover.  They may be looking for flat water, since they are going in close to shore.  I did the same on a Hobie 18 in leg 1 and found it really helps comparatively to the larger boats in light winds. Not sure why they are going west of Duke's Island though.

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1 hour ago, tama_manu said:

15 miles of separation between KMIYK and WCWO.  It is interesting that KMIYK split rather than cover.  They may be looking for flat water, since they are going in close to shore.  I did the same on a Hobie 18 in leg 1 and found it really helps comparatively to the larger boats in light winds. Not sure why they are going west of Duke's Island though.

Did you mean east of Duke Island ( not Duke's Island, unless that's the one they did go west of, if so, where is it? )

Perhaps better current and winds there for a Nacra 20.

Wild Ones are doing so well!  Down to almost 12 miles apart now...

Go Wild West girls ( you too Ben!! ).

So cool to "overlay" Navionics and the Tracker, set to satellite, by toggling back and forth between partitions on my laptop!!

The cat is moving more than twice a fast as the girls, and Ben.

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Can't speak for what it was like an hour ago but at the moment, looking ahead on the east side of Annette Island has a reasonable flood speed. Unfortunately, at the moment, if they go over the top of Annette Island it's a small ebb. Don't know where we are in the tide/current phase. The wind forecast is for very light on both the east and west side of Annette but the forecast SW direction favors the east side so a bot can be on a broad reach instead of a run but then by 8 PM it changes to a SE direction at 4 > 6 mph which would put the north side of Annette on a run while the west side would be more of a broad reach. By 11 PM the wind becomes more of an easterly in the Narrows. Don't have any current predictions available.

At 4:30 PM, KMIYC is doing 6 knots while WCWO was doing 3.9 to 4.2 knots.

Screen Shot 2017-06-18 at 16.39.30.png

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11 minutes ago, BarfBag said:

Did you mean east of Duke Island ( not Duke's Island, unless that's the one they did go west of, if so, where is it? )

Perhaps better current and winds there for a Nacra 20.

Yes, you're right, east of Duke Island.

The split seems to be paying for the Nacra,  sticking close to shore seems fast.

It is amazing that the Wild Ones are doing so well, still having fun too.  They have really put their big sail inventory to good use.

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Wind forecast for 7 PM in the Ketchikan/Annette Island area. 

Don't know why KMIYC went east of Mary Island (the small island to the east of Annette Island). The flood current shown between Mary Island and Annette Island looks good. The winds are confused in this area so maybe it is a calm area that doesn't show up on the map.

WCWO has good winds and good current but have further distance to go.

Note: Just discovered I goofed up and posted the wrong wind file in the post above. Hey, it sorta looked like it was supposed to look and didn't raise a flag. This time I wrote some names on the map to tell them apart better.

Wind Forecast June 18 7 PM.png

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There's a wind reporting station close to KMIYK that is showing 20 mph, so I think that's likely why they are taking the longer route

IMG_0709.PNG

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Interesting situation: North to Alaska @ 0.4 knots and Discovery @ 0.1 knots are both in the middle of Higgins Passage! This at 17:33.

 

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45 minutes ago, tama_manu said:

There's a wind reporting station close to KMIYK that is showing 20 mph, so I think that's likely why they are taking the longer route

That's a huge difference from the forecast map. It's a full time job to check everything: weather forecast, wind forecast, weather station & buoy data, currents, ..... that's enough to wear a person out. Do these guys have flight following? Someone doing all this for them?

I've been looking mostly at this leader group an just looked at what everybody else is doing. Wow! Global is on the outside with some high winds in the forecast.Hard to tell exactly how much but at least they're out of the south southeast which should really help them out.

Edit: Where Global is at the moment the current there ebbs south but will be diminishing as they go further north so the wind against current will become less and eventually be wind with the current. By tomorrow morning the winds are forecasted to be in the low teens there.

Edit: Added Global's position.

Weather June 18 @ 11 PM.png

Screen Shot 2017-06-18 at 18.37.37.png

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North to Alaska and Discover have made it past the worst of Higgins Passage and both are going at around 2.7 knots (rowing or pedal speed?). At that rate they should be clear of the passage shortly. In fact, just doing another look at their positions and North to Alaska is just now exiting and out into open water.

Screen Shot 2017-06-18 at 18.35.25.png

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I can concur that there seems to be a lot to look at, and a lot of information that doesn't seem to particularly line up with what's actually happening on the ground. The windy.com wind map seemed to indicate that WCWO had made the right choice (at least to me), but it certainly seems like it's panned out better for KMIYC. I haven't (yet) figured out where to get tide information from.

Further back, it seemed like the forecast indicated that going "outside" was a good move. It will be interesting to see how things play out for Global over the next 12-24 hours.

And yup, this seems hard enough to do at home sitting on the couch with high speed internet, let alone sailing on a small open boat in the wilds of Northern BC/Alaska with (perhaps at best) a handheld VHF (and a weeks worth of sketchy sleep)!

Lots to learn and figure out before I'd even consider doing the race itself (which I'd love to do).

Appreciate everyone's insight. Cheers, Andrew.

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It appears that Katch Me If You Can will be the next finisher and WCWO shortly thereafter. Currently 9 knots SE in Ketchikan.

Discovery and North2Alaska are moving along at (almost) night as it's 10 PM now but there's still some light left. 

Global is still sailing on the outside but the wind where they are doesn't seem to be that strong. If they would be more further out the wind gets stronger, 20 knots SSE measured currently. 

Speaking of night, one thing that I noticed was how many entries are holding up for the night. with their Lat & Long one could see if there are any interesting anchorages.

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Ketch me  is in....  and when a Nacra 20 can do it - the next would be a foiling beach cat....

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6 hours ago, Sailor John said:

It appears that Katch Me If You Can will be the next finisher and WCWO shortly thereafter. Currently 9 knots SE in Ketchikan.

Discovery and North2Alaska are moving along at (almost) night as it's 10 PM now but there's still some light left. 

Global is still sailing on the outside but the wind where they are doesn't seem to be that strong. If they would be more further out the wind gets stronger, 20 knots SSE measured currently. 

Speaking of night, one thing that I noticed was how many entries are holding up for the night. with their Lat & Long one could see if there are any interesting anchorages.

It's fun to switch the tracker to satellite view and then zoom in when boats are stopped. Some great little coves and anchorages often appear.

In case you didn't know, if you click on the boat, you can get their lat and long. 

WTG to KMIYC, 4th overall. And who would have called WCWO's to finish 5th. Both boats showed what determination, consistency, and insight/taking a chance/good fortune on a weather window can do.

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1 hour ago, Banjo5 said:

It's fun to switch the tracker to satellite view and then zoom in when boats are stopped. Some great little coves and anchorages often appear............

WTG to KMIYC, 4th overall. And who would have called WCWO's to finish 5th. Both boats showed what determination, consistency, and insight/taking a chance/good fortune on a weather window can do.

+1...... I use Google Earth as much as charts for passage planning.

Well done to both boats.

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20 hours ago, multihuler said:

Sistership are smarter than people think, word on the street is they stuck over $25,000 in their pocket before they donated the $8,000.

yes, I am Jealous 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps you should reword that unless you intended it as the accusation it sounds like?

 

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1 hour ago, Banjo5 said:



WTG to KMIYC, 4th overall. And who would have called WCWO's to finish 5th. Both boats showed what determination, consistency, and insight/taking a chance/good fortune on a weather window can do.

+1

Incredible performance.

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Russell parked in an interesting place overnight.... Is he planning to go up Grenville Channel????

just as far that way as back to outside......

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Definitely not....... He is heading the wrong way if he is..... Or maybe he changed his mind.

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1 hour ago, LMI said:

Perhaps you should reword that unless you intended it as the accusation it sounds like?

 

Unless he can back that accusation up, he a real douchebag. 

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A HUGE Congrads to Ketch me, the Nacra 20 team for a finish that smashes the Burd's time in 2015.

 

A HUGE Congrads to locals WC Wild Ones, in an ODay 27, for a finish that smashes the Hobie 33 time in 2015.

 

All in a year with light air, worse than last time in 2016. If it was phrf, wow...

 

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15 minutes ago, RKoch said:

Unless he can back that accusation up, he a real douchebag. 

 one of the crew members told me this and it isn't wrong to get sponsors . so they have a gimmick, why would that make me a douchebag?

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Seems like there can be a F-27 against a F-31-R race to the finish - but the  31 should thake that easy - but they havent impressed so far - Aussies are not at their best it seems..

 

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Hats off to all the finishers but especially to WCWO, a 4ktsb that became the first monohull to finish! Great job to Ben and the crew for pushing the entire way. 

Nobody will ever look at an O'Day 27 the same again.

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13 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

Seems like there can be a F-27 against a F-31-R race to the finish - but the  31 should thake that easy - but they havent impressed so far - Aussies are not at their best it seems..

Any crewed boat that parks overnight can't be taking it too seriously. Don't forget these guys are sailing though some of the most beautiful and spectacular waterways and coast the world has to offer. Enjoy.....

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I'm super impressed by both WCWO and KMIYC.  I don't think KMIYC has slept at all for the last 3 nights to stay ahead of WCWO.  

It's buried in the WCWO video, but KMIYC did do the buyback.  I think this gives them the top possible cash prizes, $1000 for first sub-20 boat and $10,000 for the buyback.  Of course they don't have a boat anymore.

It also looks like Roger on Discovery might have slept from midnight to 5am.  

 

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Go N2AK!

Some serious pluck to get an aluminum sharpie that far, that fast. Racing alongside Roger Mann and doing the secret shortcut together, the teens will have a great story to tell.

What about the Oaracle? A love story, the longest date in the world, getting run over together, car dies on the way...there are some movie rights available. Great Big Story?

Then there is Team Grace B anchoring with the Sisters for an over 55 party. I see the girls left first.

Just why did the Kelp girls spend a whole day with the Frenchmen?:wub: Why is there no news on Phoceona?  Do the ladies in Shearwater have a local that can parlez voo?

The rowing on Sat. must have been hell for that many teams to park. Or the tapwater in Campbell River.

Watch the slideshow from Team Onism from 2016 to see some serious blisters and swelling, ouch.Imagine what the Ketchme team looks like at the finish.

The pics and vid give a family insight into the prep, the race and the long trip back home. I met them briefly in the bay in Prince Rupert, on the way home. Some really great shots by the photographer. The race start is around half way in. R2AK 2016 Coyote & Team Onism - YouTube

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11 minutes ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

Any crewed boat that parks overnight can't be taking it too seriously. Don't forget these guys are sailing though some of the most beautiful and spectacular waterways and coast the world has to offer. Enjoy.....

I agree with you.  R2AK is more of a challenge than a race - most of the entrants know they will not be at the front of the fleet.  Although R2AK is a run what you bring "race" it is pretty well established by now that a first place line honours victory means 24 hour sailing and requires a serious multihull campaign with at least three crew.

To me the interesting thing about the R2AK isn't the front runners, it is the wide array of boats arriving between the frontrunners and the sweep boat.  I can relate more to them.

 

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The race appeals on all it's levels (to me), whether it's crushing performances at the front, mid-pack battles, just making it, the adventure, and more. 

As they talked about in the podcast the other day, the Race provides the focus. And it's brought out countless amazing and inspiring performances. I mean where do you start between Elsie Piddock doing the what seemed impossible in the first race and then the MAD Dogs double trumping that last year. And so many boat on boat duels (it's always been close for the Steak Knives). And then where do you begin with following so many "everyday" type teams, whether it's Kohara, Mau, Onism, Fly, WCWO, and more. And then there's Roger Mann and Karl Kruger who completely defy any characterization and can only described (as an old colleague of mine once said) as "indescribable". (And you could probably add something from every team).

It's also a very interesting "thought experiment" for any of us who like the idea of doing the race sometime (even though we live 3000 miles away). So much to learn and enjoy.

And yup, add me to the list of folks who will never look/think about an Oday 27 the same way again. Although I've been a "multi huller" since we first saw a little Piver tri sailing on the Thames Estuary 50 years ago (I was ~7, Mum & Dad and 3 kids in a 16' Yachting Monthly Senior) I can say that buying a boat like that already on the left coast seems like a very practical way of becoming part of a future R2AK.

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54 minutes ago, bistros said:

I agree with you.  R2AK is more of a challenge than a race - most of the entrants know they will not be at the front of the fleet.  Although R2AK is a run what you bring "race" it is pretty well established by now that a first place line honours victory means 24 hour sailing and requires a serious multihull campaign with at least three crew.

To me the interesting thing about the R2AK isn't the front runners, it is the wide array of boats arriving between the frontrunners and the sweep boat.  I can relate more to them.

 

Both, for me. The leaders pushing on, through often adverse conditions (light and heavy), in small boats, is admirable. And even the middle of pack group, often solo, or forced to stop for repairs and having to catch up, is to be respected. Anyone who makes it to Ketchikan and finishes gets props from me.

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1 hour ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

Any crewed boat that parks overnight can't be taking it too seriously. Don't forget these guys are sailing though some of the most beautiful and spectacular waterways and coast the world has to offer. Enjoy.....

There's not that much night time up there right  now.....

just sayin'

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1 hour ago, Norse Horse said:

Go N2AK!

Some serious pluck to get an aluminum sharpie that far, that fast. Racing alongside Roger Mann and doing the secret shortcut together, the teens will have a great story to tell.

What about the Oaracle? A love story, the longest date in the world, getting run over together, car dies on the way...there are some movie rights available. Great Big Story?

Then there is Team Grace B anchoring with the Sisters for an over 55 party. I see the girls left first.

Just why did the Kelp girls spend a whole day with the Frenchmen?:wub: Why is there no news on Phoceona?  Do the ladies in Shearwater have a local that can parlez voo?

The rowing on Sat. must have been hell for that many teams to park. Or the tapwater in Campbell River.

Watch the slideshow from Team Onism from 2016 to see some serious blisters and swelling, ouch.Imagine what the Ketchme team looks like at the finish.

The pics and vid give a family insight into the prep, the race and the long trip back home. I met them briefly in the bay in Prince Rupert, on the way home. Some really great shots by the photographer. The race start is around half way in. R2AK 2016 Coyote & Team Onism - YouTube

:lol:

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1 hour ago, Banjo5 said:

The race appeals on all it's levels (to me), whether it's crushing performances at the front, mid-pack battles, just making it, the adventure, and more. 

As they talked about in the podcast the other day, the Race provides the focus. And it's brought out countless amazing and inspiring performances. I mean where do you start between Elsie Piddock doing the what seemed impossible in the first race and then the MAD Dogs double trumping that last year. And so many boat on boat duels (it's always been close for the Steak Knives). And then where do you begin with following so many "everyday" type teams, whether it's Kohara, Mau, Onism, Fly, WCWO, and more. And then there's Roger Mann and Karl Kruger who completely defy any characterization and can only described (as an old colleague of mine once said) as "indescribable". (And you could probably add something from every team).

It's also a very interesting "thought experiment" for any of us who like the idea of doing the race sometime (even though we live 3000 miles away). So much to learn and enjoy.

And yup, add me to the list of folks who will never look/think about an Oday 27 the same way again. Although I've been a "multi huller" since we first saw a little Piver tri sailing on the Thames Estuary 50 years ago (I was ~7, Mum & Dad and 3 kids in a 16' Yachting Monthly Senior) I can say that buying a boat like that already on the left coast seems like a very practical way of becoming part of a future R2AK.

Banjo5 - great post! I’ve told my wife I’d like to do this “race.” Double-handed (in our boat of course). In no way would we ever come in at the top of the leader board but it would be fun. At least I think it would be.

On another note, if one likes following these racers and challengers, the vagaries of the rugged venue with all it has to offer, there is a really good read with the title North to Alaska by Oar “Bijaboji”. This is a story about a young 22-years old woman who solo rowed from Anacortes to Ketchikan back in 1937. 

As we watch this R2AK from our comfortable home on our computers, clicking on the URLs for weather, navigation charts, videos, race reports, and all in pretty much real time, going back to 1937 it was much different. Back then there was no GPS, chart plotters, VHF and cell communication, or even much in the way of nautical charts. If one can appreciate what life was like back then and the R2AK race is of interest, then this book would be a recommended read.

Edit: Very frustrated .... the picture kept coming out in landscape! Original, Preview, and everything else was in portrait. I give up so here it is.

Edit #2: Got the back cover "to work."

Bijaboji cover.JPG

BijabojiB.jpg

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31 minutes ago, Sailor John said:

Banjo5 - great post! I’ve told my wife I’d like to do this “race.” Double-handed (in our boat of course). In no way would we ever come in at the top of the leader board but it would be fun. At least I think it would be.

On another note, if one likes following these racers and challengers, the vagaries of the rugged venue with all it has to offer, there is a really good read with the title North to Alaska by Oar “Bijaboji”. This is a story about a young 22-years old woman who solo rowed from Anacortes to Ketchikan back in 1937. 

As we watch this R2AK from our comfortable home on our computers, clicking on the URLs for weather, navigation charts, videos, race reports, and all in pretty much real time, going back to 1937 it was much different. Back then there was no GPS, chart plotters, VHF and cell communication, or even much in the way of nautical charts. If one can appreciate what life was like back then and the R2AK race is of interest, then this book would be a recommended read.

Edit: Very frustrated .... the picture kept coming out in landscape! Original, Preview, and everything else was in portrait. I give up so here it is.

Edit #2: Got the back cover "to work."

Bijaboji cover.JPG

BijabojiB.jpg

I think I saw a reference to that book somewhere a while back. Rowing up there is an amazing accomplishment.

It is totally amazing how technology has changed things. In all the "Round the World" sailing books I read (usually of boats in the 60's/70's) there were instances where they were in danger because they didn't know where they were (usually overcast in a gale). When I was planning to go to the Bahamas in the early 80's the debate was whether to get/afford LoranC! GPS has changed so much. And that you can fit all the charts onto a cell phone, and get real-time weather updates.

One story I always remember was from "World to the West" (IIRC) where I guess there's a reef in the mid Pacific 1000 miles from anywhere. There's a gap you need to pass through. They'd had no fix for 3 days in a storm. Gives me the shivers every time I think about it.

What kind of boat do you have John?

And I'd meant to comment on Onism ... they really were a joy last year. And a little home designed/build trimaran lined up close to experiences I've been close to. This year is proving a big challenge for them it seems.

cheers, Andrew

 

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Look out, Shearwater girls, here comes the Aussies. That bar will b rockin' more than the laundromat there.:lol:

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6 minutes ago, Foiling Optimist said:

Heart of Gold at Bella Bella. That's about two and a half days from Alert Bay, which is 215km.

Pretty impressive for a SUP.

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Doing a quick bit of guesstimation, PTWatercraft has about 180km to get to Ketchikan and at present speed it would take about eleven/twelve hours give or take.  It will be interesting to see if Russell Brown decides to do it in one go until 1AM.  Team Discovery is about 35km behind him give or take but I do not doubt that Roger Mann will not stop before he gets to ring the bell.  

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4 hours ago, bistros said:

I agree with you.  R2AK is more of a challenge than a race - most of the entrants know they will not be at the front of the fleet.  Although R2AK is a run what you bring "race" it is pretty well established by now that a first place line honours victory means 24 hour sailing and requires a serious multihull campaign with at least three crew........

+1. ..... And if you are a soloist, the discipline is that you have to take your rests in the middle 4 hours or so of a foul tide, regardless of what time of day..... And you must NEVER miss a fair tide. The slower the ride, the more important it is.

And Heart of Gold is just amazing .....

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10 minutes ago, bistros said:

Doing a quick bit of guesstimation, PTWatercraft has about 180km to get to Ketchikan and at present speed it would take about eleven/twelve hours give or take.  It will be interesting to see if Russell Brown decides to do it in one go until 1AM.  Team Discovery is about 35km behind him give or take but I do not doubt that Roger Mann will not stop before he gets to ring the bell.  

I am pretty sure that Russell will step on the gas as necessary to be first soloist to Ketchikan.

He will also hold the record for soloist in the largest boat so far in R2AK?????

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1 hour ago, Banjo5 said:

It is totally amazing how technology has changed things. In all the "Round the World" sailing books I read (usually of boats in the 60's/70's) there were instances where they were in danger because they didn't know where they were (usually overcast in a gale). When I was planning to go to the Bahamas in the early 80's the debate was whether to get/afford LoranC! GPS has changed so much. And that you can fit all the charts onto a cell phone, and get real-time weather updates.
......
What kind of boat do you have John?

That's for sure! I've got several hundred paper charts covering up to Nome Alaska, southern Greenland, much of Europe and some coverage of the Pacific. A few years ago I got a laptop loaded with digital charts and now, of course, have Navionics charts on our cell phone, iPad, and computer. Technology has helped to make cruising easier and less dangerous (really like radar and weather forecasting) but since the days when one could cruise the world on their sailboat (Hal Roth et al) and the major problems were “officialdom”, now it seems the problem is more with hijackers and kidnapers. That’s why I like the cruising area where we live. If I were younger I’d entertain the Northwest Passage. 

Haven't found much written about the Russian explorations in Alaska but Sitka was a very thriving city several hundred years ago. There were some Russian replica boats that came down into Puget Sound, guessing around 40 feet long, double enders with three masts, and the decks typically leaked a lot. Hey, it rains 280 inches a year in the southeast! And Behring (sp?) was what we'd call a hired gun in those days. Always wondered why they never got into the Charlottes but there must have been a deal with the Haida. They also had a base at Fort Ross just north of San Francisco. That's a coastal area that is really nasty.

It’d be really fun to try one of the AC boats in this race but then the main would need several reef points for the higher winds. Love this video: Whoo hoo! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld5lvJKhi04

Our boat is (has become) a vintage ’88 Hunter 35 and in cruise mode it’s decked out with solar panels and a wind generator. Picture below is in an inlet south of Sitka. Many of the tree tops have been stripped of their needles testing to the fact the area gets some high winds. As we get older it would be nice to have a somewhat larger boat but I don’t think that’s going to happen. Sailed solo from Otter Cove near Chatham Point to Port Hardy in one day with her.

P0006587.JPG

Tracy Arm ice bergs.jpg

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One of the interesting things about this race is that there are several “pods” of competitors where the individuals are within sight of each other. Not necessarily from one end to the other but between boats. Well, with a good set of binoculars at least. 

Northern pod: 3.5 Aussies, Triceratops, and Willpower a bit further back.

Banks group: PT Watercraft, Discovery, Away Team, North2Alaska, and Global. Yesterday I had high hopes for Global because they were on the outside and thought that was a good position for wind.

Shearwater: Heart of Gold and Adventurists. Are they sightseeing in the big city??? (couldn't resist the comment)

Calvert Island group: Nomadic, Sistership, Freya, and Grace B. Looks like there’d be better wind on the outside until tomorrow.

Johnstone Strait group: Really spread out down there. VIZ Reporter and Rod Price Adventure riding the ebb tide past Alert Bay (a lot better than the other option, i.e., flood)

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3 minutes ago, Sailor John said:

One of the interesting things about this race is that there are several “pods” of competitors where the individuals are within sight of each other. Not necessarily from one end to the other but between boats. Well, with a good set of binoculars at least.....l

Nice to have company. It is a big empty place.... Safer too.

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An emerging topic of desk-bound speculation today: How did WCWO a 1972 O'Day 27 with four crew and 8 head sails handily beat Willpower, a SeaScape 27 with two crew? You have to think the extra crew on the heavier boats where mass delta is proportionately smaller, makes a big positive difference in the ability to keep moving both in rowing and more watches.

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It is the extra crew member. By rights, the Seascape should be much faster. But two up means that the off watch person doesn't get much time off watch in HP conditions and when it blows. And there is a hell of a lot of navigating to be done. So eventually, they have to stop. A disciplined 3 crew boat ensures that offwatch is exactly that for at least one crew, possibly the second/standby one as well, as and when conditions are suitable and there is nothing to do.

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29 minutes ago, Foiling Optimist said:

An emerging topic of desk-bound speculation today: How did WCWO a 1972 O'Day 27 with four crew and 8 head sails handily beat Willpower, a SeaScape 27 with two crew? You have to think the extra crew on the heavier boats where mass delta is proportionately smaller, makes a big positive difference in the ability to keep moving both in rowing and more watches.

The O'Day is good in light airs and upwind.  

I wonder what the difference is between the Seawind and the O'Day as far as wetted surface goes.  Would make a difference for HP too.

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19 minutes ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

It is the extra crew member. By rights, the Seascape should be much faster. But two up means that the off watch person doesn't get much time off watch in HP conditions and when it blows. And there is a hell of a lot of navigating to be done. So eventually, they have to stop. A disciplined 3 crew boat ensures that offwatch is exactly that for at least one crew, possibly the second/standby one as well, as and when conditions are suitable and there is nothing to do.

I would think you get into more an more trouble if the overall race is longer as well. It's one thing for Randy and crew to sleep badly over three days on an M32. Any longer than that if under-crewed or on an open boat you'd just have to stop and sleep properly. Didn't Ocelot have a decent number of crew, like four or more last year?

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27 minutes ago, Amati said:

The O'Day is good in light airs and upwind.  

I wonder what the difference is between the Seawind and the O'Day as far as wetted surface goes.  Would make a difference for HP too.

Using Sailboatdata.com stats, the O'Day has an SA/Displ of around 16 and a Displ/L of 199. The Seascape is 43 and 63 respectively.

No way in gods earth should the O'Day be faster, especially when you see that the Seascape seems to have one of the best sorted HP systems in the cockpit and not hanging off the back of the boat. I haven't seen any video of the Seascape crew, but there is no doubt that the O'Day crew come across as sorted, confident and rested, with enough time and energy to send out lots of fun videos. And so young!

Well done them.....

Edited by Rob Zabukovec

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19 minutes ago, Foiling Optimist said:

I would think you get into more an more trouble if the overall race is longer as well. It's one thing for Randy and crew to sleep badly over three days on an M32. Any longer than that if under-crewed or on an open boat you'd just have to stop and sleep properly. Didn't Ocelot have a decent number of crew, like four or more last year?

+1...... 

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2 hours ago, bistros said:

Doing a quick bit of guesstimation, PTWatercraft has about 180km to get to Ketchikan and at present speed it would take about eleven/twelve hours give or take.  It will be interesting to see if Russell Brown decides to do it in one go until 1AM.  Team Discovery is about 35km behind him give or take but I do not doubt that Roger Mann will not stop before he gets to ring the bell.  

As of 4:00 pm, I get 202 km between Russell and Ketchikan, or 109 NM - great circle distance.  He's doing 5 knots now, so that's ~20 hours, more or less.  Very unlikely he will push through without another stop.  This has been just another long distance solo cruise for him.

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2 hours ago, Rob Zabukovec said:

I am pretty sure that Russell will step on the gas as necessary to be first soloist to Ketchikan.

He will also hold the record for soloist in the largest boat so far in R2AK?????

I'm not so sure of that, he's run his R2AK completely to the beat of his own drum - it seems like he's immune to worrying about what other people think.  I almost get the impression he's drawing out the passage from the sheer pleasure of the journey.   My take is that he has done so much, for so many years actively avoiding the spotlight that he just doesn't care about a schedule.  I highly doubt records mean anything to him.

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7 minutes ago, bistros said:

I'm not so sure of that, he's run his R2AK completely to the beat of his own drum - it seems like he's immune to worrying about what other people think.  I almost get the impression he's drawing out the passage from the sheer pleasure of the journey.   My take is that he has done so much, for so many years actively avoiding the spotlight that he just doesn't care about a schedule.  I highly doubt records mean anything to him.

I wouldn't argue with that. It also occurred to me that he is biding his time so that he can keep an eye on some of the smaller boats. He is that kind of guy.....

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