Shootist Jeff

Tattoo 26- WTF???

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I saw this ad for a Tattoo 26 for sale in my area. I clicked on the link out of curiosity and it looked just like a .......

 

GASP

 

Mac26

 

Fuck!

 

(A turd by any other name.....)

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The daughter's Turd. Daddy sold the 26 foot design, the daughter and her husband played around with a 22 foot little sister as well. I think they failed before they could pollute the gene pool further.

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

Step away from the keyboard, slowly, do not pass go and say 10 hail SA's....

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

I continue to defend the classic Macs (22, 25, 26 classic AKA 26D and 26S) They are Chevrolets, but two of three on my water see more use then most any other sailboat (myself excepted, my boat is in use nearly every time I check). By my definition any sailboat in use is better then one collecting spiders. The 26X and 26M motorcruisers are too pricey for my neighborhood, so I see few and withhold comment aside from the simple observation that any noisy motor is bad for my zen, and makes the boat it attaches to bad by association. The cure is to turn the motor off and use the sails. If that is done, and the Mac or Tattoo is in use, it becomes good. Simple.

 

I admit the motor cruisers have excess windage and sail slowly. They trailer much faster, have good accommodations for their size, Zeno's Arrow was modified for extensive slow cruising, and they successfully keep people off jetskis. We collectively admire many motor trawlers with auxiliary sail. We reject these because they are entry level boats pretending to be yachts, and they can pass us up under motor which hurts our feelings.

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I wonder is 4th mode optional?

 

Tatoo 26 being the Mac 26x isn't anything new.

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

Theires northing to udenstand, istt what we do.

 

:)

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

I continue to defend the classic Macs (22, 25, 26 classic AKA 26D and 26S) They are Chevrolets, but two of three on my water see more use then most any other sailboat (myself excepted, my boat is in use nearly every time I check). By my definition any sailboat in use is better then one collecting spiders. The 26X and 26M motorcruisers are too pricey for my neighborhood, so I see few and withhold comment aside from the simple observation that any noisy motor is bad for my zen, and makes the boat it attaches to bad by association. The cure is to turn the motor off and use the sails. If that is done, and the Mac or Tattoo is in use, it becomes good. Simple.

 

I admit the motor cruisers have excess windage and sail slowly. They trailer much faster, have good accommodations for their size, Zeno's Arrow was modified for extensive slow cruising, and they successfully keep people off jetskis. We collectively admire many motor trawlers with auxiliary sail. We reject these because they are entry level boats pretending to be yachts, and they can pass us up under motor which hurts our feelings.

 

Gotta agree with you. I started out with a Mac V 22 then went to a Cal 20 which I still OD race and I have also acquired a Newport 33 for cruising. The Mac was a great starter boat it gave me the bug and sent me on the road to bigger and better things.

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This is from the For Sale ad and says it all:

 

Purchased last year and is barely used. Sails have never been used and are in original packing.

 

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

fu k off

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This is from the For Sale ad and says it all:

 

 

Purchased last year and is barely used. Sails have never been used and are in original packing.

 

yep. +1

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This is from the For Sale ad and says it all:

 

Purchased last year and is barely used. Sails have never been used and are in original packing.

 

 

 

It says "swing and a miss" to me.

 

There are a few types of people who buy Mac powersailers. One type is people who are powerboaters and think they might want to sail, but they're not ready to give up the ability to power fast. There's really only one boat that lets them put a toe in the water to see if they like it. Some do like it and pretty much 100% of those people move on to a normal sailboat within a year or so.

 

Others don't like sailing or don't want to live their dream badly enough to unpack the sails and try it. The latter is my guess as to how this boat ended up for sale. They're moving back to a normal powerboat. Some do. Sailing isn't for everyone.

 

But that boat represents to me someone who sorta had a sailing dream and it wound up going nowhere, for whatever reason. Swing and a miss. We could have had another sailor in the world, but we don't. If we did, it would be because of the existence of the powersailers.

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

I continue to defend the classic Macs (22, 25, 26 classic AKA 26D and 26S) They are Chevrolets, but two of three on my water see more use then most any other sailboat (myself excepted, my boat is in use nearly every time I check). By my definition any sailboat in use is better then one collecting spiders. The 26X and 26M motorcruisers are too pricey for my neighborhood, so I see few and withhold comment aside from the simple observation that any noisy motor is bad for my zen, and makes the boat it attaches to bad by association. The cure is to turn the motor off and use the sails. If that is done, and the Mac or Tattoo is in use, it becomes good. Simple.

 

I admit the motor cruisers have excess windage and sail slowly. They trailer much faster, have good accommodations for their size, Zeno's Arrow was modified for extensive slow cruising, and they successfully keep people off jetskis. We collectively admire many motor trawlers with auxiliary sail. We reject these because they are entry level boats pretending to be yachts, and they can pass us up under motor which hurts our feelings.

 

 

I don't hate them because they can pass me. I dislike the way they leave a huge wake when going faster than a crawl. And because this is never mentioned in the advertising, it never occurs to the clueless dolts driving them to not wake everybody.

 

It may be that they keep people off jetskis, I think most Mac26X'ers have a jetski mentality, and I know of a few who also have jetskis... to be fair I also know a few who have real sailboats.

 

If you look at them as a self-propelled on-water camper trailer, they are great. But they are rather disappointing to actually sail, they're not much fun.

 

FB- Doug

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The 26 x and m are his power sailors. The rest of his boats were true sailboats and are really not that bad of boats. The x and m well that's another story.

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Yeah. Roger had the M26 tooling trucked from Costa Mesa, CA to Laura in Florida. Brand name changed for legal reasons.

 

The M26 was Roger simply designing and building what people wanted to buy.

M26 are very popular with first-time boat owners. They are:

  • Cheap.
  • Have lots of beds.

My M26 story goes like this:

Some retired Navy procurement officer bought one of the last M26s built in Costa Mesa. It was his dream boat. His retirement masterpiece.

He made life miserable for the seller (Inman) and nit-picked every single pinhole in the gelcoat, every screw with a slot that didn't line up with all the others... all stuff that if you bought a custom-built boat for millions you wouldn't even complain about. He maxed-out all options, had extensive custom covers made, even had a new asym made. He had the most expensive cheap-ass boat ever.

 

When it came time to launch it, he could not get down the launch ramp. He would back down 3 feet (1 meter), freak out that it was veering off to the side an inch or so (2 cm), then straighten it out by pulling forward 6 feet. He did this for about two hours, getting gradually further and further away from the water. Finally the sailmaker showed up and backed the truck up and launched the boat in 3 minutes.

 

Eventually we got underway, hoisted sails, and crawled along in light air. The new owner could not find an upwind groove or, really, keep the boat pointed in any direction for more than a few seconds at a time. I blame his senile lack of skill and the Cholo Vato 12" (30 cm) diameter steering wheel.

 

A few more months after that first sail, the owner finally "accepted delivery" of the boat after everyone told him, "We're not doing any more work on your boat." He towed it to his cheap dry-storage on the Naval Base somewhere to the south. He kept asking the salesman and the sailmaker to come sailing with him because he couldn't handle launching and sailing the boat. After one time each, they both said, simply, "No." The boat sat in the dry-storage for a few more months, then went up for sale. Probably still for sale for all I know. He was asking the new price plus all the little extras he added. Ad read: "Best M26 ever built!"

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There is also a Tatou, but it is more of a dinghy

 

saw one at a boat show a while back

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I have no problem with those who buy and use them.

 

It is the ones who make preposterous claims about the boat that will rile up most of us on this site.....

 

Click HERE at your own risk.

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We cane leveriage thisse sittes spotlite and promisse hime SA swag foura holiday spessialle oncore? Oune weeke enguagemente, oune man showe, "Franke Live!" Niew topice everey day, we haft to try to gette thisse rolleng!

 

:)

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Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

I continue to defend the classic Macs (22, 25, 26 classic AKA 26D and 26S) They are Chevrolets, but two of three on my water see more use then most any other sailboat (myself excepted, my boat is in use nearly every time I check). By my definition any sailboat in use is better then one collecting spiders. The 26X and 26M motorcruisers are too pricey for my neighborhood, so I see few and withhold comment aside from the simple observation that any noisy motor is bad for my zen, and makes the boat it attaches to bad by association. The cure is to turn the motor off and use the sails. If that is done, and the Mac or Tattoo is in use, it becomes good. Simple.

 

I admit the motor cruisers have excess windage and sail slowly. They trailer much faster, have good accommodations for their size, Zeno's Arrow was modified for extensive slow cruising, and they successfully keep people off jetskis. We collectively admire many motor trawlers with auxiliary sail. We reject these because they are entry level boats pretending to be yachts, and they can pass us up under motor which hurts our feelings.

Gotta agree with you. I started out with a Mac V 22 then went to a Cal 20 which I still OD race and I have also acquired a Newport 33 for cruising. The Mac was a great starter boat it gave me the bug and sent me on the road to bigger and better things.

Has another forum just had a clear out again?

 

Either that or there's a fishing trip going on.

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This might fan the flames.

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Wouldn't that be fun Snags? Unfortunately, the only place to confront Frank nowadays is on Facebook, and he won't accept my Friend Request. Wonder why.

 

And to think, he sent me one.

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Tim Kernan. Has he had any commercially successful designs?

What constitutes a "commercially successful" design?

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This might fan the flames.

 

I like it. Storm staysail for planing in 60mph winds, and the wind generator can charge the battery while trailering down the highway

 

FB- Doug

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Also reinforced rudders that don't fatigue from sustained ocean waves, modified centerboard to allow pointing, and barely visible hull brackets allowed outriggers, used for anchoring and shallow rivers.

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Though flamed here, this boat was well used for over a decade. MaddMike doesn't seem to spend much of his life online. The storm passed, I'm out of excuses myself.

 

 

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=25645

 

http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/neil-armstrong-and-sir-edmund-hillarys-trip-to-the-north-pole

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20041204034316/http://www.planetwave.com/captain.html

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A MAC 26 sailed Hammo this year. Australian acceptance at such as prestigious regatta implies endorsement of its capabilities at the highest level. Only one there but also only one Pogo. Just saying.

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Cats and Dogs sleeping together!

 

 

End times are nigh.

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A MAC 26 sailed Hammo this year. Australian acceptance at such as prestigious regatta implies endorsement of its capabilities at the highest level. Only one there but also only one Pogo. Just saying.

 

Has it finished yet? Couldn't resist.

 

Hobot, I'm still hoping for some reaction, I assume everybody in the north is getting a last sail in. There can't be thunder everywhere, can there? At least a rainy day means I've nearly got the old dinghy ready for fall sailing. Better it rains this week then next, when I test the advantages of the trailer cruiser concept with a less maligned boat (but achieve far less).

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Depending on the level of personal discomfort you can stand, sailing is a 365 day sport Pacific Northwest.

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A MAC 26 sailed Hammo this year. Australian acceptance at such as prestigious regatta implies endorsement of its capabilities at the highest level. Only one there but also only one Pogo. Just saying.

There were 2 in fact.

 

They had handicaps that would have let them anchor for lunch and still win but unfortunately they came 2nd and 3rd last; the last boat actually never showing up to race.

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The Mac has an older cousin with the mobo style, wrap around window, that was designed in '78.

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/eden-hills/sail-boats/farr-6000-trailer-sailer-sailing-boat/1124124873

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=4877 farr

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=4090 mac

$_20.JPG

 

 

 

 

 

 

I made a bad in the post I deleted, so here it is corrected. Jungle Kitty is the r2ak boat. https://www.facebook.com/teamjunglekitty/about

Tim Kernan redesigned the Fox 44 Ocelot, among other designs, like the Columbia 30. http://kernanyd.com/sailboats/

http://kernanyd.com/project/fox-44/

Fox44_01.jpg

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$_20.JPG

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That Farr was a good little boat and would outsail the bigger Macoo, Tattmac or whatever it is.

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Depending on the level of personal discomfort you can stand, sailing is a 365 day sport Pacific Northwest.

Aside from Seattle traffic, tempting. A fellow Rhodie posted pictures of his weeks expliring desolation sound etc. georgious.

 

I make do with a wetsuit in the fall but haven't ordered the icebreaker attachment yet.

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This might fan the flames.

 

What's it rate?

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Eventually we got underway, hoisted sails, and crawled along in light air. The new owner could not find an upwind groove or, really, keep the boat pointed in any direction for more than a few seconds at a time. I blame his senile lack of skill and the Cholo Vato 12" (30 cm) diameter steering wheel.

 

Yuk. Was it made of welded chain?

 

I always thought if I ever won the Powerball, that a good practical joke would be to get a Mac 26, then hollow it out, throw out anything with density, hide some performance stuff under the waterline like a canting keel, get rid of the water ballast, subtly change the stick to a 40 feet rotating carbon fiber, upgrade the rigging to stuff that won't break under the weight of a pack of gum, and spoof some better sailcloth to look like the cheap stuff. Basically make a decent boat that looks like a Mac, then put the fugger in a beer can race. Instead of coming in last place, it might pull a second-to-last, and all the drunks would say "hmm, never seen a Mac not come in last before."

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Practical joke or reality. Inman took a MacGregor Venture Newport 23 (1981) and hacked the hell out of the rig to turn it into a light-air flier. It has to reef in 10 knots true, but under 8 and she's off to the podium.

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Practical joke or reality. Inman took a MacGregor Venture Newport 23 (1981) and hacked the hell out of the rig to turn it into a light-air flier. It has to reef in 10 knots true, but under 8 and she's off to the podium.

Juste what Mikewofe wase sayeng! Fithe mode! :)

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Practical joke or reality. Inman took a MacGregor Venture Newport 23 (1981) and hacked the hell out of the rig to turn it into a light-air flier. It has to reef in 10 knots true, but under 8 and she's off to the podium.

I've heard of Mike Inmon, I didn't know he modified those Ventures. Do you know what he did to the rig?

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I've never read such racer talk about the 26x before... :o

 

"All Mac26x owners are at least indirectly interested in racing owing to the related resale value of the power sailer. MacGregor Yachts established itself as a race boat company with the MacGregor 65. The MacGregor 65 Joss in 1985 established a record that went unbroken 22 years - one of the oldest records in ocean racing history.

In 1985 Richard and Camille Daniels' MacGregor 65, Joss, boosted by following breezes of 15 to 25 knots most of the way, raced the 1,125 nautical miles from Marina del Rey to Puerto Vallarta in 4 days 23 hours 0 minutes 4 seconds. Average speed: 9 1/2 knots."

 

https://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p09.htm

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Oh God...what's next, a search for all the Clipper Marine 21's out there and what a PHRF machine they are??

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The Mac has an older cousin with the mobo style, wrap around window, that was designed in '78.

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/eden-hills/sail-boats/farr-6000-trailer-sailer-sailing-boat/1124124873

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=4877 farr

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=4090 mac

$_20.JPG

 

 

 

 

 

 

I made a bad in the post I deleted, so here it is corrected. Jungle Kitty is the r2ak boat. https://www.facebook.com/teamjunglekitty/about

Tim Kernan redesigned the Fox 44 Ocelot, among other designs, like the Columbia 30. http://kernanyd.com/sailboats/

http://kernanyd.com/project/fox-44/

Fox44_01.jpg

 

Kernan did not 'design' the Fox 44. That is a Wylie design, built by Schooner creek as their first infusion hull. It had a lot of voids and Schooner creek & the original owner spent much time in court. Schooner took back the hull and had Kernan design a conventional rig and the necessary internal structure to support it.

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Jesus Christ don't ever quote him directly... Have we learned nothing?? Those who do not pay attention to history are doomed to repeat it..... :ph34r:

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Jesus Christ don't ever quote him directly... Have we learned nothing?? Those who do not pay attention to history are doomed to repeat it..... :ph34r:

I dointe see anney poeste frome or qoutting Jeseus Chrste, musttove beene delleeted, :)

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animated-police-light-image-0008.gif

Post Police! Multiple officers, and one feline with broken engleesh.

Guilty as charged.PUI and destroying evidence :(

 

Kernan Yacht Design was approached by Steve Rander of Schooner Creek to modify a Wylie hull with an unstayed cat rig to carry a conventional sloop rig with a carbon spar. The hull was modified structurally to accommodate a new sail plan. Next the deck layout was reconfigured for the new rig and spinnaker gear.Features:

  • Mainsheet runs below decks to secondary winches
  • Traveler runs through cascade below decks to exit through cockpit sole
  • Carbon spinnaker poles, boom, and deck-mounted struts
  • Rod rigging, PBO backstay, hydraulic mast jack
  • Harken deck gear

 

giphy.gif

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On 28/09/2016 at 6:20 PM, Rasputin22 said:

Tim Kernan did the new Tattoo 22 and 26 designs I think. He should know better, maybe Rogers daughter had her way with him...

A snob is one born and raised in privilege, who resents having to share those privileges with people who earned privilege. Your contempt for MacGregor/Tattoo powercruisers is exactly that; Little Richie Rich snob, whose mummy & daddy owned yachts, bought him dinghies to learn to sail and paid his expensive yacht club membership, HATING having to share the water with nasty blue collar self-mades, in cheap trailer sailers. Well here’s a tip, Ferdinand Maggelan; Try sailing around Tristan de Cunha Island until you die; Don’t see many Macs sailing there!

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10 minutes ago, Reason said:

A snob is one born and raised in privilege, who resents having to share those privileges with people who earned privilege. Your contempt for MacGregor/Tattoo powercruisers is exactly that; Little Richie Rich snob, whose mummy & daddy owned yachts, bought him dinghies to learn to sail and paid his expensive yacht club membership, HATING having to share the water with nasty blue collar self-mades, in cheap trailer sailers. Well here’s a tip, Ferdinand Maggelan; Try sailing around Tristan de Cunha Island until you die; Don’t see many Macs sailing there!

You signed up to post that?

Frank?

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1 hour ago, Reason said:

A snob is one born and raised in privilege, who resents having to share those privileges with people who earned privilege. Your contempt for MacGregor/Tattoo powercruisers is exactly that; Little Richie Rich snob, whose mummy & daddy owned yachts, bought him dinghies to learn to sail and paid his expensive yacht club membership, HATING having to share the water with nasty blue collar self-mades, in cheap trailer sailers. Well here’s a tip, Ferdinand Maggelan; Try sailing around Tristan de Cunha Island until you die; Don’t see many Macs sailing there!

Don't see many Macs sailing period...drifting with sails flapping ineffectually maybe, motoring around making wake in the marina, sure...but sailing? Nah.

 

 

 

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I was under the impression that the Venture line of sailboats we're for the blue collar Hoi-polloi.

 

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On 9/28/2016 at 1:52 PM, J28 said:

Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. Her lines are reminiscent of some modern luxury superyachts, inboard tracks for both jib and genny, bridgedeck mounted traveler, small offshore size, self-draining cockpit and provision for sufficient OB power for those light wind days. Maybe you need a brody knob when you have that high a HP/weight ratio.

Frank is that you ?

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On 7/12/2017 at 8:05 AM, Reason said:

A snob is one born and raised in privilege, who resents having to share those privileges with people who earned privilege. Your contempt for MacGregor/Tattoo powercruisers is exactly that; Little Richie Rich snob, whose mummy & daddy owned yachts, bought him dinghies to learn to sail and paid his expensive yacht club membership, HATING having to share the water with nasty blue collar self-mades, in cheap trailer sailers. Well here’s a tip, Ferdinand Maggelan; Try sailing around Tristan de Cunha Island until you die; Don’t see many Macs sailing there!

You bought one of the ugly things, didn't ya? 

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I just use my Jet boat and spray them all on the way by.

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On 7/12/2017 at 5:05 AM, Reason said:

A snob is one born and raised in privilege, who resents having to share those privileges with people who earned privilege. Your contempt for MacGregor/Tattoo powercruisers is exactly that; Little Richie Rich snob, whose mummy & daddy owned yachts, bought him dinghies to learn to sail and paid his expensive yacht club membership, HATING having to share the water with nasty blue collar self-mades, in cheap trailer sailers. Well here’s a tip, Ferdinand Maggelan; Try sailing around Tristan de Cunha Island until you die; Don’t see many Macs sailing there!

Don't forget people who have had to fix the fucking things. Those people hate them too.  I remeber the hardest part about glassing one that bumped a dock was not cutting through the hull during the grind for a bevel  We literally ended up sanding it to try and get a decent bond width.   Never seen a boat with less glass than a shower stall and made of nothing but badly wet out chopped strand.   They are expensive for how well they aren't built.   A half rotten ferrocement boat is cheaper and stronger and doubtful it sails worse.  

 

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On 9/29/2016 at 4:26 PM, HypnoToad said:

I have no problem with those who buy and use them.

 

It is the ones who make preposterous claims about the boat that will rile up most of us on this site.....

 

Click HERE at your own risk.

 "but the substantial modification for the circumnavigation is the CDI furling headsail"

 

eesh...

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On 10/1/2016 at 1:22 PM, Trickypig said:

 

That Farr was a good little boat and would outsail the bigger Macoo, Tattmac or whatever it is.

Farr 740 Sport. My Dad had one of those.  I loved that little boat.  The wraparound window definitely took some getting used to. I don't think I really got used to it.  I just tried not to look. Our first sail once he got it home was in a strong southerly.  We sailed upwind a while, past the Carlsbad power plant and then turned around and set the spinnaker.  We kept practicing gybes, which took some getting used to.  On such a little boat, the helmsman had to gybe the main and handle the running backs, while steering the boat under the spinnaker.  The boat had no problems at all, no hairy white knuckle ride, no hint of wanting to broach.  It all felt so relaxed until we looked at the speedo, showing 11 knots and often pegged (I think 11 was pegged).  Before we knew it we were at the San Onofre power plant, and it was time to turn back, astonished at the miles we covered.  

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On 9/29/2016 at 4:52 AM, J28 said:

Don't understand the hate for the Mac 26. 

As you own a J28 I am not surprised.

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I googled Tattoo 26 and all I got was this...

image.jpeg.121fac2e2d305596898da6540233f13f.jpeg

And this...

Image result for hot girl with tattoos

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On 11/19/2018 at 2:21 AM, jgbrown said:

Don't forget people who have had to fix the fucking things. Those people hate them too.  I remeber the hardest part about glassing one that bumped a dock was not cutting through the hull during the grind for a bevel  We literally ended up sanding it to try and get a decent bond width.   Never seen a boat with less glass than a shower stall and made of nothing but badly wet out chopped strand.   They are expensive for how well they aren't built.   A half rotten ferrocement boat is cheaper and stronger and doubtful it sails worse.  

 

I was pretty alarmed the first time I was inside one and someone walked by outside. I could tell exactly who it was through the fiberglass hull. That ain't right!

To get to that point, I had to get past the rigging, which seemed to me appropriate for sailboats about 16' and under.

OTOH, that was in the mid 2000's. At that time, I could and did sell ten year olds very quickly and easily. Those same boats are now 20+ and still sell quickly and easily for about the same money they brought a decade ago. And I still see people use them.

I'm getting less alarmed by their imminent failures. Yeah, they're ridiculously thin and light. That's the result of trying to be a powerboat with such a tiny engine. And yes, 50 hp is tiny for a 26' powerboat that hopes to plane.

Sailors bitch about the sailing performance, which never struck me as all that different from other trailer boats of that size. At least, not compared to the difference between those powersailers and a real powerboat. They're not bad sailboats. They're bad powerboats. Because powerboats just shouldn't have masts.

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I love my m26. The boat is just a modern day sharpie. Lots of other boats were built, that weren't suited for deep ocean sailing, and they never got the hate the Mac power sailors do. There is other sailing besides deep ocean sailing, did you know that? Shallow bay sailing, where you beach the boat and let the dogs off, while you beach comb. Sneaking through dragovers where the depth is in inches not feet. My boat has taken me places my previous heavy keelboats could not. Miles of shimmering white shoals, where even I had to move on the tides. Find a deeper hole tinged with just enough blue so the boat wont  be on the hard bottom at low water. This is my domain. Part of a cosmic painting of sunsets, low mangrove islands, egrets and brilliant blue skies. 

Unlike some mac purchasers,  I have been a life long sailor. I knew exactly what I was getting. Coukd I have built a better boat? Of course. For more money and a lot of work and no resale value. Would it have performed better? Well, I thought it might have, till I learned how to sail the M26. In sheltered conditions, she actually sails well. I get 5 to 6 knots easily, and with a lot of living space. I could have bought a contessa 26 if I wanted to go deep ocean sailing. But I didnt. I wanted to do exactly what I'm doing with the mac. And the majority of owners use the boat for it's intended purpose. Lakes and bays. I probably sail mine more than many. I have upgraded the sailing parts as needed to focus on sailing, which is important to me. The rigging is light and cheap, and theres not much of it. The mast is easy to raise and lower. 

Are the boats light? Yea. Not offshore boats. If I want to go off shore, I'll get a contessa 26. 

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An old buddy of mine towed his Mac 26 to Pr Barrow and launched and went around the point West to East I think to get to the MacKenzie River and went upstream (South) until he got to the irrigation ditches in Saskatchewen or someplace and then towed it with his man overboard harness like a mule across what passes for a North/South continental divide. When the water started flowing the other way (that area brings new meaning to the term 'flat') he tooled along down stream into the Red, Rouge, and whatever combination of rivers got him to the Mississippi River and made his way to the Gulf. He bopped along the Gulf ICW to Key West and then eventually island hopped down to St John where he took a break. His mission was to continue after some R@R down to to the Orinoco and go up it to where he could do a short traverse to the Amazon and then do a 'reverse Tritan Jones' by crossing the Andes to the Pacific. He wanted to do the Chile "Inside Passage" down to Patagonia and complete his "Trans America North/South Passage". Apparently the three hour happy hours at Woody's Bar in Cruz Bay was his downfall and he never did the second leg of the trip. He gets enough credit just for the first half though!

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11 hours ago, Ixneigh said:

Unlike some mac purchasers,  I have been a life long sailor. I knew exactly what I was getting.

That's not all that uncommon. When I was selling them, buyers came in three basic flavors:

1. Never owned a boat, don't know much, want the options of power and sail.

2. Powerboaters wanting to try sailing without giving up planing (sort of.)

3. Sailors with a list of past boats much, much longer and more distinguished than mine.

So I'd guess you're a "3."

11 hours ago, Ixneigh said:

In sheltered conditions, she actually sails well. I get 5 to 6 knots easily,

I'd say not quite as well as, for example, the Catalina 250 and annoyingly tender, but the performance is close.

Wanna know what really doesn't sail very well? A Com-Pac Sun Cat. I made up a whole sorta fake regatta to emphasize the point. I loved our Sun Cat and intend to own the newer Sunday Cat model one day. But all those complaints about the Mac powersailer sailing performance apply abundantly to the Sun Cat. But it looks cute and boaty and no one but me will say that it sails worse than a Mac 26. But it does. Yes, even if you put a big, silly bowsprit on it.

wilyconch-frisky-lg.jpg

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12 hours ago, Ixneigh said:

I love my m26. The boat is just a modern day sharpie. Lots of other boats were built, that weren't suited for deep ocean sailing, and they never got the hate the Mac power sailors do. There is other sailing besides deep ocean sailing, did you know that? Shallow bay sailing, where you beach the boat and let the dogs off, while you beach comb. Sneaking through dragovers where the depth is in inches not feet. My boat has taken me places my previous heavy keelboats could not. Miles of shimmering white shoals, where even I had to move on the tides. Find a deeper hole tinged with just enough blue so the boat wont  be on the hard bottom at low water. This is my domain. Part of a cosmic painting of sunsets, low mangrove islands, egrets and brilliant blue skies. 

Unlike some mac purchasers,  I have been a life long sailor. I knew exactly what I was getting. Coukd I have built a better boat? Of course. For more money and a lot of work and no resale value. Would it have performed better? Well, I thought it might have, till I learned how to sail the M26. In sheltered conditions, she actually sails well. I get 5 to 6 knots easily, and with a lot of living space. I could have bought a contessa 26 if I wanted to go deep ocean sailing. But I didnt. I wanted to do exactly what I'm doing with the mac. And the majority of owners use the boat for it's intended purpose. Lakes and bays. I probably sail mine more than many. I have upgraded the sailing parts as needed to focus on sailing, which is important to me. The rigging is light and cheap, and theres not much of it. The mast is easy to raise and lower. 

Are the boats light? Yea. Not offshore boats. If I want to go off shore, I'll get a contessa 26. 

 

I've had a number of friends that owned Mac 26X (or M, the later "improved" model) Pow-R-Sail-Rs and if you want a floating camper, they're great. They don't sail worth crap and a number of people whose opinions I respect say they're crummy motorboats too. But they're comfy, and if you are dead set on buying new, you can't get anything near that big and roomy for the same buck$.

Sail? I've seen them spend hours tacking back and forth across a lake in a nice afternoon breeze, close-hauled but not making any progress to windward due to the windage of the boxy hull and the poor foils. I've seen them sloshing along in the chop of the afternoon sea breeze along the coast, beautiful day for sailing and the Mac skipper is spinning the wheel stop-to-stop trying to get it to hold a course. I've also seen them break their steering gear a few times but that may have been earlier, unimproved models. When I say "I've seen them" that means I was sailing right alongside, keeping company with friends and trying to not offer unwanted help because it was clearly a case of unheeded distress, not watching from a mile away.

If you enjoy the Mac 26x or M, great! Everybody should have a boat they enjoy. But there are lots of other shallow draft options for coastal or river cruising, and you could probably pick up a cheap tri-hull weekender and make a better sailboat out of it.

A remote river & flatlands expedition might be the prefect mission for these boats. I've done a fair bit of inland cruising and that has some appeal.

FB- Doug

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Macs offend the snobs and racers.   Sure they tack back and forth all afternoon on a nice breeze without covering much ground, but isn’t that kind of the goal?  If they want to go fast, they have a motor.   If I want to cover distance, I leave my boat on it’s wheels.   Sailing is big enough for anybody that agrees to turn off the engine and use the wind.    I’d argue those with hydraulic keels that require an engine to beat are less a real sailboat then a MacX with it’s motor raised.

It’s not about the boat, it’s what you do with it.  A 36 foot beauty used to daysail is no more then a dinghy with training wheels.  

168D48CB-0C8E-4084-BCED-1A3EE609023A.jpeg

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20 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

 

I've had a number of friends that owned Mac 26X (or M, the later "improved" model) Pow-R-Sail-Rs and if you want a floating camper, they're great. They don't sail worth crap and a number of people whose opinions I respect say they're crummy motorboats too. But they're comfy, and if you are dead set on buying new, you can't get anything near that big and roomy for the same buck$.

Sail? I've seen them spend hours tacking back and forth across a lake in a nice afternoon breeze, close-hauled but not making any progress to windward due to the windage of the boxy hull and the poor foils. I've seen them sloshing along in the chop of the afternoon sea breeze along the coast, beautiful day for sailing and the Mac skipper is spinning the wheel stop-to-stop trying to get it to hold a course. I've also seen them break their steering gear a few times but that may have been earlier, unimproved models. When I say "I've seen them" that means I was sailing right alongside, keeping company with friends and trying to not offer unwanted help because it was clearly a case of unheeded distress, not watching from a mile away.

If you enjoy the Mac 26x or M, great! Everybody should have a boat they enjoy. But there are lots of other shallow draft options for coastal or river cruising, and you could probably pick up a cheap tri-hull weekender and make a better sailboat out of it.

A remote river & flatlands expedition might be the prefect mission for these boats. I've done a fair bit of inland cruising and that has some appeal.

FB- Doug

I think your friends just needed some tips on technique. It's possible to sail them upwind. I know because even I can do it!

The M will do it better than the X because of the daggerboard vs centerboard and the rotating mast. But in either case,

6 hours ago, Lark said:

If they want to go fast, they have a motor.

Or if they want to get upwind.

So making those modifications just to improve upwind performance seemed kinda silly to me. I don't think that was the only reason. Although a daggerboard won't kick up, it's easier to maintain. I can't think of a good reason for the rotating mast.

But I think the main reason for the new model was that it was getting really hard to sell a new X with so many used ones on the market. The new M's sold like hotcakes when they came out.

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The beta version, bottom, was even worse upwind and also lacked a trailer.   

I can imagine a lightly built heavily burdened Mac ripping the daggerboard or even the well open on a grounding.   Not very forgiving for a boat that often introduced families to the water.   He switched the Mac D to the centerboard S version for this reason.  I didn’t get the logic on reverting back.   MacGregor must have been a bit desperate to improve sailing performance without affecting the RV’s interior.   He retired before perfecting the slideout.  

 

8F977C83-3139-4CFA-8DBC-841541A5A58B.jpeg

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1 hour ago, Lark said:

The beta version, bottom, was even worse upwind and also lacked a trailer.   

I can imagine a lightly built heavily burdened Mac ripping the daggerboard or even the well open on a grounding.   Not very forgiving for a boat that often introduced families to the water.   He switched the Mac D to the centerboard S version for this reason.  I didn’t get the logic on reverting back.   MacGregor must have been a bit desperate to improve sailing performance without affecting the RV’s interior.   He retired before perfecting the slideout.  

 

 

Dobbertin pretty much won that competition with his "Surface Orbiter" milk trailer conversion.

image.png.cae82408852a393e4b68d478c6c9af3b.pngimage.png.525194846b30ee3548050f76bb20cd79.png

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3 hours ago, Lark said:

I can imagine a lightly built heavily burdened Mac ripping the daggerboard or even the well open on a grounding.   Not very forgiving for a boat that often introduced families to the water.

The daggerboard breaks without any noticeable damage to the trunk. And if you do it again, it will happen again.

Sincerely,

A guy who sold two daggerboards to an adventurous but slow-learning 26M owner.

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On 12/8/2018 at 4:43 AM, dogballs Tom said:

I think your friends just needed some tips on technique. It's possible to sail them upwind. I know because even I can do it!

...   ...

I didn't say it was impossible, I just said they didn't make much progress. VMG somewhere between a stumble and a crawl. As you said, they can motor upwind.

They heel, so perhaps some people think it "feels like" sailing. Which is fine, if it's a boat that people like and take sailing and enjoy, that's great.

Do you have any knowledge of how many folks go from a Mac 26X or M to higher performance sailboats?

FB- Doug

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9 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Do you have any knowledge of how many folks go from a Mac 26X or M to higher performance sailboats?

In my experience, only "type 3's" mentioned above, so it would be more accurate to say they went back Or were fellow PN sufferers and had both at the same time.

Type 1's might do anything.

Type 2's would either buy a BeneHuntalina or go back to powerboats, depending on how the experiment went. They weren't interested in performance sailing in the first place, just dipping a toe into pleasure sailing.

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Here's the deal with 1st-timers buying boats that don't sail well: that is their experience: boat don't sail well. How can anyone expect to develop the "feel" for sailing a boat well if the boat itself presents such a formidable obstacle?

"We'll get a better boat if we like it." Well, they're not going to like sailing a crap boat so that's the end of the line for them.

Same thing with poorly-rigged boats. "We don't need big winches; we're not racing." Incorrect! That is precisely why you need large winches. Your frail niece will never get the headsail in tighter than a loose close reach. The boat won't point, or balance right, and all the other boats will be sailing right past you. "Well, we're not racing so we don't care that we're the slowest boat out there." It simply doesn't work that way. Every time there's a newbie on board and you get passed, what do they always say? "Why is that boat faster?" Part of the appeal of sailing is the tactile, visceral sensation of a well-tuned boat. If that's missing... boring!

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On 9/29/2016 at 4:26 PM, HypnoToad said:

I have no problem with those who buy and use them.

 

It is the ones who make preposterous claims about the boat that will rile up most of us on this site.....

 

Click HERE at your own risk.

 

That site has been dead for over a decade, try this one....

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/

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On 12/9/2018 at 8:32 PM, Somebody Else said:

Here's the deal with 1st-timers buying boats that don't sail well: that is their experience: boat don't sail well. How can anyone expect to develop the "feel" for sailing a boat well if the boat itself presents such a formidable obstacle?

"We'll get a better boat if we like it." Well, they're not going to like sailing a crap boat so that's the end of the line for them.

Two assumptions that are mistaken here.

1. That they would know whether it's sailing well.

2. That they would care, at least at first.

What I've seen: glee when the engine shuts down and the wind takes the boat. The same glee that comes from that feeling in a race boat or in a Sun Cat.

This works because the boats really do sail. Not well, but well enough to produce that feeling, which we all know is addictive. And that's what leads Type 1's to get a better sailboat (and often, list their Mac with the lucky broker who sold them the new boat, guaranteeing him a quick and easy check.)

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8 hours ago, dogballs Tom said:

Two assumptions that are mistaken here.

1. That they would know whether it's sailing well.

2. That they would care, at least at first.

What I've seen: glee when the engine shuts down and the wind takes the boat. The same glee that comes from that feeling in a race boat or in a Sun Cat.

This works because the boats really do sail. Not well, but well enough to produce that feeling, which we all know is addictive. And that's what leads Type 1's to get a better sailboat (and often, list their Mac with the lucky broker who sold them the new boat, guaranteeing him a quick and easy check.)

I don't agree. I have been on too many boats with too many newbies to ignore the user experience on a good-sailing boat versus a shitter. Even on a good boat in bad trim, the newbie will struggle at the helm, being forced to turn it into an intellectual exercise as they struggle to keep on the wind. Get everything in tune and they can finally stop staring at the compass and tell-tales and feel the boat come to life under their touch. You leave the newbie with the frustration and stress of a poor-feeling boat, they might never come back. You get someone in the zone in a well trimmed decent boat, they can't wait until the next sail!

Of course there's always the pirate wanna-be's who are so swept up in the romance that they don't care which direction the boat is going.

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Newbie or merely inexperienced?   I took a real newbie out this summer.  He did a week class in Florida and bought an Ericson.    Ethanol left him stranded at the dock.   It reminded me of a first driving lesson.   He looks to the left, the boat goes left.    He starts to luff, so he hardens up.   Great guy.   He was having fun trying.   Give him a few hours in 7-10 and he'll start to develop some intuition but he's like the kid who has to stop and think:   'gas, brake, clutch, parking brake, high beams' before he knows where to move his foot.    At his level would it really make any difference what boat he is holding the stick on?

See the source image

 

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