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Great Red Shark

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Enjoyed getting a good look at the Fareast 28 and 23 in Annapolis the day before the show - the Seascape 27 and 24 too - as well as the J/88 and WraceGP26 - lots to see in this size range, for once.

 

Sadly, Catalina couldn't be bothered to have the 275 at the biggest show of the year - I mean, it's probably not relevant, but it would have been nice to compare.

 

Folks at the Fareast and Seascape stands were some of the nicest, most informed people I spoke to - very nice boats. My pal liked the Fareast28 more, I think I'd rather the Seascape27 - sure would be nice to race the two of them ( Heck, toss the J-88 and GP26 in there just for fun ) .

 

Hot ticket that the C&C 30 is, it's just a bit too race-focused for me, personally.

 

As for the Annapolis show - Thursday was very nice, but I can't believe that there was a Navy football game on that Saturday - Good Grief that must have made for some epic congestion. Glad I got in early.

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The J 88 that I saw at $130k did not impress me for a number of reasons and more so after I saw the Far East 28 at half the price.

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The J and Seascape 27 have fairly nice interiors for a weekend or even more. What's down below on the GP26 and the Far East? Are they strictly daysail/race or are they overnighters sans with fluffy cushions?

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In descending order of interior fitment: J-88, Seascape, FarEast,......GP26 - very little below deck space or accommodation. The Fareast had a basic, but functional interior.

 

The J has a lot more room and systems - can't really say that it's wildly over-priced as it IS a lot more boat - backstays cost money, afterall...( seriously, it seems as if there is a lot more vessel there ) - but for ME the trailer-ability of the Fareast and SeaScape make them the preference - I'm just tired of dealing with the boatyard here - ever again, if possible.

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I liked the Seascape 27 for cruising and got to sail the 24. That's a sweet boat on all points of sail - stable and fast - and a bit spartan for cruising. The FarEast boats look similar but not for cruising. They seem like a great value.

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The J 88 that I saw at $130k did not impress me for a number of reasons and more so after I saw the Far East 28 at half the price.

Of course, given the almost 1000kg difference in displacement, and as both are largely conventional builds, there is "less" boat to the FE 28, so it ought to cost less. Plus, what will resale of the J/88 be vs. the FE 28. Room for both boats in the market, so not knocking either one. Just saying there might be a reason the J cost's more....plus the J is built in the US, and the FE is built in Shanghai. So there there is the difference in labor costs as well...

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The J 88 that I saw at $130k did not impress me for a number of reasons and more so after I saw the Far East 28 at half the price.

Of course, given the almost 1000kg difference in displacement, and as both are largely conventional builds, there is "less" boat to the FE 28, so it ought to cost less. Plus, what will resale of the J/88 be vs. the FE 28. Room for both boats in the market, so not knocking either one. Just saying there might be a reason the J cost's more....plus the J is built in the US, and the FE is built in Shanghai. So there there is the difference in labor costs as well...

 

I think the boats are very equivalent except for the fact that the Far East does not have the cabin or interior of the J 88 which I believe is what makes up the difference in displacement. With the larger cockpit and lighter displacement the 28R seems more day/sport boat oriented. Otherwise the boats seems very similar to me.

 

Does an interior cost $65,000? Maybe if it's done very well, but the 88 did not seem to have an interior that was any better than a truly budget interior, so it's not there. I think most of the difference in pricing can be attributed to the difference in labor and probably environmental compliance costs as well.

 

Go on Yachtworld and see what else you can get for $130,000..

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Parma,

I don't disagree that J/Boats tend to be priced higher than their competition...But as you've said, the Far East has no cabin, so is more day/sport boat boat oriented. You could very reasonable weekend cruise the J/88, it has a head for female crew to use with some degree of privacy, and you can not unreasonably sleep a crew of 4 at an overnight weekend regatta. All of those things are worth something to some people. Additionally, you have to consider the power of J/Boats in marketing their boats - near 100 J/88's have been sold. How many Far East 28's? If you want to race OD, the number of J/88s makes a convincing argument. Finally there is resale value, Js tend to hold theirs as well as any in the industry. Far East? We don't know yet.

 

Again, nothing at all against the FE 28...

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I think there is also a difference motors for the J and 28r which would account for increased cost and weight.

Think so?

An IB diesel vs a 15kg (min) OB?

BTW one of the two is included with the boat. Guess which

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I'm not saying the Far East is a great boat. As with most things that come out of China the quality and durability of the item is immediately in question and absolutely subject to doubt. The Chinese really need to work on that.

 

That said, I'm going to stick to my position that for $130,000 the J 88 was lacking. We just rolled our eyes looked at each other and said "are you flocking kidding me?" but to be fair most new boats these days do seem to be costly.

 

Finally, value has nothing to do with displacement. A heavier boat that might last longer does not mean it is a good buy. (and neither does a cheaper boat)

 

Between the two? I would take that at FE28R

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I think there is also a difference motors for the J and 28r which would account for increased cost and weight.

Think so?

An IB diesel vs a 15kg (min) OB?

BTW one of the two is included with the boat. Guess which

 

The J?

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I'm not saying the Far East is a great boat. As with most things that come out of China the quality and durability of the item is immediately in question and absolutely subject to doubt. The Chinese really need to work on that.

 

That said, I'm going to stick to my position that for $130,000 the J 88 was lacking. We just rolled our eyes looked at each other and said "are you flocking kidding me?" but to be fair most new boats these days do seem to be costly.

 

Finally, value has nothing to do with displacement. A heavier boat that might last longer does not mean it is a good buy. (and neither does a cheaper boat)

 

Between the two? I would take that at FE28R

Wasn't trying to say that displacement means a boat is a better value. Was trying to say more materials (more displacement means there is more material used to build - interior fit out, IB diesel, etc) equals higher cost assuming equal level of tech in the build...

 

I was also trying to say for some people there is value in capability to overnight/weekend/sleep the crew. Therefore they might be willing to pay additional to get that capability.

 

Completely understand why you would take the FE...wasn't trying to say its not the better boat for you...

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The extra cabin space of the 88 does give one the opportunity to sit down with your friends and drink the kool aid. meanwhile, on the FE you have a lotta dosch left over for hookers n'blow, as has been noted.

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if you're into hookers n' blow, then I guess that's a good thing... :D

 

If you're into teaching your kids to sail, maybe drinking kool aid is the right answer :rolleyes:

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Go on Yachtworld and see what else you can get for $130,000..

 

 

.......a whole lotta hookers'n blowwww :)

I don't see that option under sailboats. Must be somewhere under powerboats, right?

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If you guys are done pissing in the thread, I'm going to ask anyone that HAS sailed either of the Seascapes or Fareast boats to give us their impressions, opinions, thoughts on them - particularly in comparison to other boats around the same size.

 

The threads in Sportboat Anarchy are pretty thin on objective impressions - each brand has it's own cheerleader thread, it seems.

 

Thanx

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I've only sailed the Seascape 24 after the Annapolis boat show. I arranged for the sail at the show. It's a fun boat because it sails well on all points of sail. We only had about 8 knots of breeze but the boat showed 6 knots SOG upwind and downwind. It comes with laminate jib and main and an asymmetric spinnaker. It likes to ride on its chine but feels stable doing so at a heel angle of 20 degrees or so. The asymmetric spinnaker did get slightly wet on our sail. Not sure if this was operator error. Don't know what happens in a bigger breeze. There is plenty of sail area but it always felt in control. It is nicely set up and easy to do maneuvers short-handed. It's nominally a cruiser but pretty spartan in the cabin. Sleeping is OK but not much room for much else. Definitely fun, fast, and sweet sailing.

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GRS: Price is about $70 K as we sailed it which is all you really need. It had a cooler and porta-potty but no cooker or any instruments. You could stow the Torqeedo in a lazarette after you got away from the dock.

 

The 27 had the single burner cooker and a marine head in an enclosure. They had a neat stowable outboard in a well that swings up after you got going. More space inside for eating including a table, sleeping, and stowage. Clever use of panels for multiple uses. Both boats put the emphasis on sailing performance. It's not beachable. I haven't yet sailed the 27.

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Yes. The 24's keel folds completely into the hull. The 27's keel folds but doesn't go into the hull. Another difference: the 27 has a traveler while the 24 has a bridle.

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While not beachable, I THINK ( not entirely sure, haven't sailed it) that the 27 remains somewhat navigable with the keel retracted though - whereas a lot of the slick new flatter designs become rather in-commanded when the keel is brought up - just not enough lateral surface for tracking properly.

 

Anyway, thanks again - I was hoping you went and hunted down the Fareast guys so we could get a comparo. Did they Seascape guys let on as to if they've written some orders for them here in the US ?

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Makes sense. The retracted keel on the 27 resembles a full, shallow keel. The Fareast was interesting and similar in style to the Seascape but it wasn't a cruiser which the admiral prefers. The heel angle on the Seascape 24 will probably kill that idea.

 

There are a few Seascapes 27s in the US. There is one further south on the Chesapeake which I hope to get a ride on to compare heel angles (-:

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Yeah, they probably aren't going to ask to use that pic for their marketing brochures !

 

In comparison, I sailed another modern 27-footer this past weekend in a 3-race buoy series, doublehanded in 15-25. We reefed down but even still, that boat just fell over and wouldn't carry speed through the gusts well at all - definitely intended for inshore, or perhaps even indoor use.

 

I had a friend with me at the show that (for some reason) greatly preferred the Fareast to the Seascape - while I feel just the opposite. Yeah, that outboard arrangement on the bigger Seascape might seem convoluted, but I like it.

 

Keep us posted if you think of anything else - heck, have any contacts you might have stop in on the thread.

aloha

DW

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I bought a FE28R with the aim to sail with the family and maybe use as rental for 2017 season with the first Worlds. I was already doing a few races on my friend's FE28R and liked the boat.

My family, with twins at 9 YO, really liked the boat as a day sailer, not letting me do much. I had a plan to install a light portable bunk in the bow and 2 aluminum pipe berths but no time this season. The boat feels quite safe, but is fully powered up in 10kn. Get a reefable Jib or a 2nd hand M24 jib in windier conditions. We only have the original assy that is smaller and flatter AP design, which feels perfect for family sailing.

For me to able to do some active Sailing myself, I entered the boat and a friend to a short handed race, said he Nordic Yacht's Open with a 100 participant and a reversed handicap start. Light winds that increased to 12kn was a perfect test and learning experience. I took some time to find good vmg upwind in the higher Range. We passed all but 8 slower boats, including Seascapes 24 and 27. We were quite happy with our top 10 total.

I must say that I am really happy with the boat and the less is more concept is a real strength from a performance perspective using a full racing crew, all smiling when going 18+ kn downwind, but still trucking nicely on the beat.

With some bunks for cruising and keel lift, me and the family can join our motorboat friends in to shallows lagoons in our archipelago next summer. And the rental plans is now scrapped, as I am taking the boat to the worlds to win another FE28R as 1st price 😏 http://fareast28r.com/news-posts/world-match-racing-tour-finals-today-2/

 

For short handed and family use I do like the winches and main fine-trim that enables even my small kids to do the trimming of sails

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Just from a purely aesthetic POV, of the two being discussed - the FE28R is a far better looking boat. I don't like the look of the Seascape 27. Too chunky looking and I don't like the double rudder. I know that's no way to judge a boat. But the SS27 IMHO is kinda ugly.

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Just from a purely aesthetic POV, of the two being discussed - the FE28R is a far better looking boat. I don't like the look of the Seascape 27. Too chunky looking and I don't like the double rudder. I know that's no way to judge a boat. But the SS27 IMHO is kinda ugly.

I think you would be very happy with the twin rudders of the 27 when surfing down wind (and getting into shallow areas) - they are there for a reason. As for looks it for sure is an individual opinion, but I frequently get positive comments when traveling with my 27. One female gas station attendant asked if that was my boat and then smiled and said "good job my husband is not here or he would have left me (for the boat)"

 

To answer some of the other comments:

 

1. Although not a current option, the 27 cooking system could be easily adapted to the 24.

 

2. The 27 draws about 3' keel up so steering is no issue, but you loose a little max speed compared to keel down. For the 24 you would just drop the keel a little for motoring in shallow areas.

 

3. Spi riding low on the 24 - it is true that it the foot comes close to water as the wind picks up if you are short handed, but you can easily adjust it from fractional to mast head as shown below.

post-74169-0-34319800-1487553653_thumb.jpg

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