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      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

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zzarganas

Superfoiler test (video)

63 posts in this topic

30 knots are good news for tests.

 

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This thing is going to hurt when it crashes with 3 on the wire........ also noted very dark sails and no windows in the main or jib. I would have thought if you are ripping along at 40 knots, vision of what is under you may be important 😱

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This thing is going to hurt when it crashes with 3 on the wire........ also noted very dark sails and no windows in the main or jib. I would have thought if you are ripping along at 40 knots, vision of what is under you may be important 😱

 

nah, a 40kt demolition derby is what gets you the TV contracts.

 

Seems that their target date for the race series is November. Just a couple of months to go.

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Not much video of stable flight, November might be a bit ambitious.

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April May June July August Sept Oct Nov, that's more than "couple of months to go"

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But very little good sailing wind days between now and September in Sydney.

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Not much video of stable flight, November might be a bit ambitious.

If you look at their facebook feed, you'll see that they've been hyping the boat for months with a bunch of old 18 footer footage which consists entirely of people biting it and parts blowing up. I think they've rightly concluded that speed is a number and that mayhem is what primarily sells ad space. If the boat was incredibly well behaved and stable out of the box, they would have failed.

 

DRC

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If you look at their facebook feed, you'll see that they've been hyping the boat for months with a bunch of old 18 footer footage which consists entirely of people biting it and parts blowing up. I think they've rightly concluded that speed is a number and that mayhem is what primarily sells ad space. If the boat was incredibly well behaved and stable out of the box, they would have failed.

 

DRC

 

 

Bill Macartney is the guy who put the 18's on TV in the late 80's and 1990's, he had people bagging him back then as well.

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The guy who got one day cricket up and then after a few versions able to tailor Grand Prix 18s into a thing..

Now teamed up with his currently racing 18s son Jack & "some öld 18 guys" = maybe something bankable!

Remember it was after Bills time, when mumbles Brownie took over, that the circuit ran off the rails then into oblivion.

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I agree that the beastie looks stable and it really is just the sailors getting used to the tuning of the thing. Having had a play with a dev foiling cat, I can tell you this thing is stable! I look forward to seeing more of this sort of class coming to a beach near me soon.

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TV news piece today showing the Superfoiler & announcement of the first series of 6 International teams for December, to be screened on Seven.

It will be interesting if some cross promotion stirs up the canope & Audi stuff of the Sydney to Hobart brodcast an S2H race start.

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You got to be fucking joking if they are going to race on the harbour on the weekend in summer.  The eighteens are one thing but adding these to the mix will be a recipe for disaster, especially when the breeze kicks in.  

 

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18's are dieing. No coincidence that McCartney(s) will get 18 footer crews switching over to sail the first series.  Once John Winning leaves the 18's ........ All over.  This group will get a chance to become international, whereas 18's could only manage AUS, NZ, and the occassional UK boat. Grand Prix Sailing all over again with a new vehicle that hits the current flavours of the month

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Will these be available for normal people to buy and play? And If so how much? Would be a pitty to lock these boats to this event only.

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This boat is not an 18 replacement and the McCartney's have said they want to attract international teams. i heard there will be no more than 2 Australian teams, so they won't be switching people from the 18's to the Superfoiler. 

The boat will also not be made available to anybody else because it is for this series only and because of the difficulty of sailing. What some seem to miss is that this boat is unlike any weapon ever produced before. A crack team of 18 footer sailors have spend a significant amount of time trying to learn to sail it and still cannot manage it unless there is light winds. To date, there is no evidence to suggest it can be sailed above about 12 knost of wind. We have yet to see all 3 crew on the wire, which is what was intended and the guys are regularly being scared shitless. They are having to back off so much and c annot push at all despite sailing in light winds.

They have been trying to master the boat for a reasonable amount of time and i don't understand how they intend to get 5 other teams up to speed in the timeframe they have set. It's nearly July and they have 5 months to build 5 more boats and get a total of 6 teams up to the required level to race. Don't see it happening.

I hope theyb do find a way of mastering the boat because they could be spectacular. The idea of them terrifies me.Travelling at 35+ knots ion a boat that can crash big time is probably the most dangerous sailing there has ever been. To "help" with the danger, they have lifted the windward board so that if they wipe out, you can crash into it with great velocity. I pray nobody gets seriously hurt.

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On ‎18‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 9:05 PM, xsailmakerSYD said:

18's are dieing. No coincidence that McCartney(s) will get 18 footer crews switching over to sail the first series.  Once John Winning leaves the 18's ........ All over.  This group will get a chance to become international, whereas 18's could only manage AUS, NZ, and the occassional UK boat. Grand Prix Sailing all over again with a new vehicle that hits the current flavours of the month

The one design 18 was supposed to save the class are you saying this is not the case, the same people who pushed the 18's into one design said Grand Prix Sailing would never work nobody would be interested in the 18's they could never be a professional class.

 

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2 hours ago, A Class Sailor said:

This boat is not an 18 replacement and the McCartney's have said they want to attract international teams.

A crack team of 18 footer sailors have spend a significant amount of time trying to learn to sail it and still cannot manage it unless there is light winds. To date, there is no evidence to suggest it can be sailed above about 12 knost of wind. We have yet to see all 3 crew on the wire, which is what was intended and the guys are regularly being scared shitless.

They have been trying to master the boat for a reasonable amount of time and i don't understand how they intend to get 5 other teams up to speed in the timeframe they have set. It's nearly July and they have 5 months to build 5 more boats and get a total of 6 teams up to the required level to race. Don't see it happening.

I hope theyb do find a way of mastering the boat because they could be spectacular. The idea of them terrifies me.Travelling at 35+ knots ion a boat that can crash big time is probably the most dangerous sailing there has ever been. To "help" with the danger, they have lifted the windward board so that if they wipe out, you can crash into it with great velocity. I pray nobody gets seriously hurt.

They have come a long way in the short time they have been sailing this boat, since there is nothing like it they probably had a few things to work out it looks like it's getting sorted to me.

Having seen one of the near crashes on video it looks like the crew swing well outside the windward foil before ending up in headsail if they are on trapeze, just like going around the old forward wingwire with the 18 in a nosedive.

I see it happening TV is already organised, I wonder if Bill will run it at twilight like he did with some 18 races when traffic is less of a concern.

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Might be a lot more user friendly for their short course racing if they swap out these boards for Z Foils.  

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Latest video shows they're getting the hang of sailing this thing.

http://www.facebook.com/SuperFoiler

 

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Euan and me (oops .... that should be you & me )    ;)   know what's going on ......

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I would love to see some video of tacks and gybed. Also 3 on the wire and more breeze.

i am sure they are getting their slowly. I still personally think the 4 point foiling would be better suited to short course racing.  This setup would. E good for long distance marathons.

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13 hours ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

They have come a long way in the short time they have been sailing this boat, since there is nothing like it they probably had a few things to work out it looks like it's getting sorted to me.

Having seen one of the near crashes on video it looks like the crew swing well outside the windward foil before ending up in headsail if they are on trapeze, just like going around the old forward wingwire with the 18 in a nosedive.

I see it happening TV is already organised, I wonder if Bill will run it at twilight like he did with some 18 races when traffic is less of a concern.

They have come a long way but they are a long way off where they need to be. They haven't yet shown they can sail it hard in the lighter stuff. No 3 man wiring, no proper tacks and gybes and only sailing in lighter winds. I also think that experienced foilers would watch the videos and suggest they still have a long way to go with their technique. On a lightweight, over powered foiler like this, it is very strange to see so little movement of the mainsheet. They are sailing it more like a GC32 than the lightweight foiler it is.

As for the crashes, on foiling boats, you do get those ones where the crew swing well out from the boat and forward but you also get ones where you would crash straight into where the board is. Ask me how I know;). I certainly have the injuries to prove it, but from the shrouds. These boats are going 10 knots faster than I go and that is a lot of extra inertia. Mitch Booth broke ribs on an F18 when he hit the raised windward board and that would be at far lower speeds. 

I agree with Tornado Alive. It does seem strange that they are using that type of foil when Z foils would seem the perfect choice for the type of sailing and for safety reasons.

 

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The latest Superfoiler video is here: http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?/topic/180878-trimaran-foiling-systems/#comment-5807990

The Superfoiler was designed by Morrelli and Melvin who invented(along with TNZ) the  UptiP foils used on this boat. Additionally, they have done extensive testing of UptiP foils ,Z foils and "C" foils as shown in this paper for the N17-see page 26: https://www.dropbox.com/s/x44cb22wlw5zfvb/Meeting Presentation.pdf?dl=0

All foil design is a compromise and the "Z" foil compromise is reduced roll stability*, reduced RM and a reduced crew workload. UptiP foils are faster with more RM but require more effort. The latest video shows the Superfoiler performing well......

* interview with Bora Gulari on the N17: http://www.catsailingnews.com/2017/04/performance-sailing-nacra-17-foiling.html

"The coordination between the helm and crew is going to be next level stuff, gone is the inherent stability of a cat. The boat is now sitting ontop of a teeter toter in the roll axis and there is a lot of inertia, feels much more like a big skiff than a catamaran in that axis to me."

 

 

 

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Foiling tacks and gybes will be fundamental to the success of this venture. A few high speed crashes will be good tv, but floundering around in the water wont be.

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5 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

The latest Superfoiler video is here: http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?/topic/180878-trimaran-foiling-systems/#comment-5807990

The Superfoiler was designed by Morrelli and Melvin who invented(along with TNZ) the  UptiP foils used on this boat. Additionally, they have done extensive testing of UptiP foils ,Z foils and "C" foils as shown in this paper for the N17-see page 26: https://www.dropbox.com/s/x44cb22wlw5zfvb/Meeting Presentation.pdf?dl=0

All foil design is a compromise and the "Z" foil compromise is reduced roll stability*, reduced RM and a reduced crew workload. UptiP foils are faster with more RM but require more effort. The latest video shows the Superfoiler performing well......

* interview with Bora Gulari on the N17: http://www.catsailingnews.com/2017/04/performance-sailing-nacra-17-foiling.html

"The coordination between the helm and crew is going to be next level stuff, gone is the inherent stability of a cat. The boat is now sitting ontop of a teeter toter in the roll axis and there is a lot of inertia, feels much more like a big skiff than a catamaran in that axis to me."

Here we go again. Stop posting shit based on old reports and that do not tell the whole story. The M&M report compares foils tried on the N17 and only applies to them. It does noty follow that because the V foils they tried on the N17 were faster than the Z foils they tried on the N17 that V foils are faster than Z foils. As has been pointed outy to you many times, in other tests Z foils have been shown to be faster than V foils.

In the same way, you quote Bora as if toi suggest there is a problem with Z foils. The truth is that any cat with either Z or V foils loses the inherent stability of cats and needs a higher amount of coordination between helm and crew. The Z foiled N17 is one of the easiest foiling boats to sail. Teams who have never sailed a foiler before are pulling off foilingb gybes and are certainly getting to grips with the boat far quicker compared with boats like the Flying Phantom. One friend who has sailed both told me that the N17 is so much easier to sail.

As for the Superfoiler, I am not sure how you can judge it is going well based on a video taken in light winds and which doesn't show any tacks or gybes. The best youi can say is it goes along in a straight line in light winds pretty fast but with some big scary moments, such as at 1:26 and 1:38. If you are going to race it in Sydney in November, it needs to be sailed in up to 20 knots or maybe more and in bumpy water. To date, it looks as if it hasn't sailed in over 10 knots and the water is always smooth. It will be interesting to see how much progress they make in the coming months.

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Very much like this approach; well it is similar to my lightweight single handed 8.5 x 8 metre Sid - but Superfoiler looks really flighty and verging/is close to uncontrollable.

Have the (courageous) crew sailed it 2 up and with main reduced? If not I think they might be surprised. Full rig looks to me to be terrifyingly overpowered. Yes, yes, I know it is meant to be super macho boat but I think you blokes are sitting in a gum tree and chainsawing off the branch you're sitting on.

sidrepair4.jpg

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4 hours ago, A Class Sailor said:

If you are going to race it in Sydney in November, it needs to be sailed in up to 20 knots or maybe more and in bumpy water. To date, it looks as if it hasn't sailed in over 10 knots and the water is always smooth. It will be interesting to see how much progress they make in the coming months.

+1 .  Not only the wind waves, but plenty of powerboat wash. Nobody in Sydney seems to know what a trim tab is for.

It will also need to be able to turn quickly to avoid the traffic, power and sail.  Going to be a lot of deer in headlights moments.

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17 minutes ago, ColinG said:

It will also need to be able to turn quickly to avoid the traffic, power and sail.  Going to be a lot of deer in headlights moments.

Another very important point..... with shore lines, islands and harbour traffic, you don't want to waste time putting boards down before you tack / gybe..... particularly if you need to manoeuvre in a hurry.

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7 hours ago, A Class Sailor said:

Here we go again. Stop posting shit based on old reports and that do not tell the whole story. The M&M report compares foils tried on the N17 and only applies to them. It does noty follow that because the V foils they tried on the N17 were faster than the Z foils they tried on the N17 that V foils are faster than Z foils. As has been pointed outy to you many times, in other tests Z foils have been shown to be faster than V foils.

In the same way, you quote Bora as if toi suggest there is a problem with Z foils. The truth is that any cat with either Z or V foils loses the inherent stability of cats and needs a higher amount of coordination between helm and crew. The Z foiled N17 is one of the easiest foiling boats to sail. Teams who have never sailed a foiler before are pulling off foilingb gybes and are certainly getting to grips with the boat far quicker compared with boats like the Flying Phantom. One friend who has sailed both told me that the N17 is so much easier to sail.

As for the Superfoiler, I am not sure how you can judge it is going well based on a video taken in light winds and which doesn't show any tacks or gybes. The best youi can say is it goes along in a straight line in light winds pretty fast but with some big scary moments, such as at 1:26 and 1:38. If you are going to race it in Sydney in November, it needs to be sailed in up to 20 knots or maybe more and in bumpy water. To date, it looks as if it hasn't sailed in over 10 knots and the water is always smooth. It will be interesting to see how much progress they make in the coming months.

What do you mean by "V" foils? Superfoiler uses uptip foils. Gulari was referring to the loss of roll stability with "Z" foils-something that does NOT happen with uptip foils.

The boat is brand new-a whole different concept-of course it will take time to get it right!

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Just don't get it, do you?!

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9 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

What do you mean by "V" foils? Superfoiler uses uptip foils. Gulari was referring to the loss of roll stability with "Z" foils-something that does NOT happen with uptip foils.

The boat is brand new-a whole different concept-of course it will take time to get it right!

Stop being  complete arse. You are the only person who calls them uptip foils on a regular basis.The foil designers I have been speaking to stopped using that term (if they ever did) years ago. You can use whatever name you want for foils, but the rest of us will continue using the terms that are in common use today (V, L, Z etc).

Quote

Just don't get it, do you?!

I think T-A has just joined the exclusive club of those who DL sayd doesn't get it. That exclusive list includes at least 2 foiling world champions, AC sailors and people who sail foilers every day. Congrats to T-A! I am also pleased to see that DL sticks with his well laid out arguments (you don't get it!). I think T-A gets it far more than DL ever will, because as his words suggest, all of this is pointless unless you go out and sail.

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Your rationale for inventing multiple names* for uptip foils is complete bullshit. Calling them any name other than what the designers named them is the essence of asininity!!! Ignoring what Gulari said about the loss of roll stability with "Z" foils would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic---you and your little buddy really, really don't get it."Z" foils have less RM and much less resistance to roll than do uptip foils-that's just a fact and a point that Bora felt had a big bearing on how a cat using them would have to be sailed.  

 Ignoring and/or trying to redefine the conclusions reached by M&M in the actual testing of three different types of foil and discarding their conclusion that uptips were faster is nothing short of utter nonsense-why in hell do you think they used uptip foils on a boat specifically designed to be a no holds barred speed machine?

*Especially "V" foils which have been around for decades and are not uptip foils!!!!

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1 minute ago, Doug Lord said:

Ignoring and/or trying to redefine the conclusions reached by M&M in the actual testing of three different types of foil and discarding their conclusion that uptips were faster is nothing short of utter nonsense-why in hell do you think they used uptip foils on a boat specifically designed to be a no holds barred speed machine?

The utter nonsense is you using the M&M report as evidence of more than what they state. It is clear to anybody being objective that M&M are comparing foils for the N17 and not all V foils verses all Z foils. You repeatedly ignore the fact that in the A Class, it has been shown that Z foils are actually faster than the well designed V foils that have been tried to date. Your great mate Dario looked a complete idiot on that score, selling poor unsuspecting people his V foils with claims that they were easier to sail and faster when it was quickly found that the latest Z foils were both quicker and no harder to sail. In the case of the N17, if they had made the Z foils smaller, the boat would have been significantly quicker but it would have been harder to sail. As it is, it is considered by most to be easier to sail than it needs to be, as seen by people who have never sailed foilers pulling off the first foiling gybe. People who have sailed a wide range of foiling cats say that the N17 is by far the easiest to foil of all.

As for why M&M have used v foils on the Superfoiler, there are many reasons that might have nothing to do with speed. You have no idea what the design brief was.Maybe they wanted the foils to reflect what goes on in the AC, maybe they see the raising and lowering of boards as adding a level of complexity to the boat handling that would be good for TV. Maybe it is a reflection on M&M and their knowledge, because they clearly have a great track record in designing v foil but far less of one designing fast Z foils. Maybe they felt they could get the v foils right first time but not Z's. the design of v foils is pretty well developed but Z foils are still in their infancy by comparison. The one thing you cannot say is that M&M chose v foils because they are faster.

It's my belief that even if v foils were faster in a straight line (which I do not), because of the extreme nature of the boat, they would be quicker around the course if they were Z foils, but until we see these boats tacking and gybing, I cannot be sure. I also agree with Mr Marx that the rig is way too big and that is causing many of their issues. The rest of the problems seem to come from the guys learning to foil on what might b the most difficult foiler ever. It is clear watching the videos that they are not yet sailing the boat like a foiler. They would be far better off getting some time a boat like an A, so they can learn how the boat reacts and how to sail it. If the AC guys use A's for that purpose, these guys should try it as well. I think they would make far quicker progress if they did.

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10 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Just don't get it, do you?!

Sadly, you truly don't get it.... I said go sail a boat because by doing so you may start to understand what is involved in manoeuvring a boat in short course around the bouy races with traffic.  I certainly don't want to have to worry about dropping a foil before going into a rush tack to avoid a collision.

As with A Class sailor...... I have never said Z foils are quicker than a V foil boat in a straight line (it could be possible though).  I would put money on it though that it would be quicker and easier to handle around a short course, fleet race.

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They aren't "V" foils-keeping on with that, despite the facts, is the essence of ignorance. 

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1 hour ago, Doug Lord said:

They aren't "V" foils-keeping on with that, despite the facts, is the essence of ignorance. 

Doug, You long ago proved to everyone here that you are the essence of ignorance and repetitive cut and paste posting of the same drivel.  Are you married?

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It really eats at you doesn't it Doug. :lol:

Perhaps worry less about what it is called and go sail a boat.

V Foil 

IMG_9755.PNG

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And then there is this-its just a matter of calling one of the most significant foil designs ever by the name the inventors gave it as a small sign of respect for their effort:
 

Link to Part 1 and Part 2--Pete Melvin and Gino Morrelli: http://www.cupinfo.com/en/featuresindex.php

Quote from the article,Part 1:

When we were working on the rule, we knew you wanted to get as much lift as possible when you were going fast downwind,” Melvin says. "For instance, in the 2010 America’s Cup, sailed on giant multihulls, the maximum amount of lift we thought we could get was about 50% of the weight of the boat. At that time, we were still relying on the hull to provide pitch control, so what’s come out of this is the boats all now have elevators (the horizontal foils on the rudders).

“At Team New Zealand, we developed a new type of foil that allows you to keep your height above the water more or less steady. No one had been able to do that before, at least not on a course-racing boat that was not going downwind. We developed that mostly on our SL33 test boats -- they came with the stock constant curvature “C” foils and with those kinds of foils, you can generate 50% boat weight lift before they get unstable. But we noticed that when we could get one boat up fully foiling for a few seconds it would really accelerate away from the other boat – and that got the wheels turning. How, with such a huge potential benefit, can we achieve stable flight downwind? So our design team came up with the “up-tip” type of boards. We refined those on the 33s and our 72 is designed to do that and fortunately it worked right of the box.”

__________________

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If I get Gino to write something that says they now call them v-foils or something else, will you stop using that word?

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Well then could you tell us why nobody will marry you, hire you, or build actual boats from your toy ideas?

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FFSake Lord of Fools, who gives a rat's flatulence what the differently designed lifting foils are called; they're all outmoded now with ETNZ's introduction of the bat wing designs - which by the way are nothing like your asinine upTiPs.. And even your beloved and unhealthily worshiped  OR-Zerox copyists have come round to a watered  down version of the NZ foils.

Go away with your endlessly nauseous and repetitive horse shit. Try gardening - or something -  kayaking? - anything to stop your pollution on these sites.

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23 hours ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

IMG_9755.PNG

 

21 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

If I get Gino to write something that says they now call them v-foils or something else, will you stop using that word?

 

21 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Probably not.......

This tells us everything we need to know about DL and why he is irrelevant to any serious conversation on foils. And he accuses us of not understanding. He was made to look stupid on the AC threads with his obsessive ill informed comments and this only continues. It is a shame we cannot have a proper and informed discussion with DL.

Doug

You need to learn to be open minded and to stop being obsessed by one theory. You ended up looking stupid on the AC threads both with the term "uptip" and with the ridiculous idea that teams would only use one design of foil. You would both gain and offer so much more on this forum with flexibility and a willingness to challenge your own thinking, rather than defending it at all costs. I guess it is unlikely to ever happen because people have been saying this to you ever since you appeared on forums, but we can live in hope because if you did, this would become a richer place and I suspect you would get more enjoyment out of it, rather than, I suspect, a sense of frustration.

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40 minutes ago, A Class Sailor said:

 

 

This tells us everything we need to know about DL and why he is irrelevant to any serious conversation on foils. And he accuses us of not understanding. He was made to look stupid on the AC threads with his obsessive ill informed comments and this only continues. It is a shame we cannot have a proper and informed discussion with DL.

Doug

You need to learn to be open minded and to stop being obsessed by one theory. You ended up looking stupid on the AC threads both with the term "uptip" and with the ridiculous idea that teams would only use one design of foil. You would both gain and offer so much more on this forum with flexibility and a willingness to challenge your own thinking, rather than defending it at all costs. I guess it is unlikely to ever happen because people have been saying this to you ever since you appeared on forums, but we can live in hope because if you did, this would become a richer place and I suspect you would get more enjoyment out of it, rather than, I suspect, a sense of frustration.

When someone claims that a ladder foil is a "V" foil that is incredibly uninformed and then when the same person- under cover of some association with an AC team- claims an UptiP foil is a "V" foil- that borders on profound ignorance. I have proved beyond a shadow of a doubt what the inventors call their foil and a little research would show you what an actual "V" foil is. It's not new, like an UptiP foil- a "V" foil has been around for years. To say you ,and several others, don't know what you are talking about is an unfortunate understatement.

Doug Halsey's foiler with "V" foils-picture by Terry Curtis:

Broomstick_4 Terry Curtis photograph.jpg

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Yet again Doug, you are being a complete arse. Are you telling us that BAR don't know what they are talking about when they use the term V foil for the foils you refer to as "uptips". It seems that the only person who gets confused and hung up on this is you. If the vast majority of people, including AC teams call them V foils and we all understand what is meant, why can't you?

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23 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

 

And then there is this-its just a matter of calling one of the most significant foil designs ever by the name the inventors gave it as a small sign of respect for their effort:
[...]
"So our design team came up with the “up-tip” type of boards.
__________________

If you're such a champion of defending the originator's IP, why do you insist on mangling the spelling and capitalisation? Why do you not call them "up-tip" type boards?

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UptiP is spelled the exact same way with subtle differences to enhance the recognition of the term-which it has done --and then some. Check the spelling and capitalization on page 26 of the paper by M&M above( post 43) -the only difference is the capital "P" at the end of UptiP..........

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6 minutes ago, Doug Lord said:

UptiP is spelled the exact same way with subtle differences to enhance the recognition of the term-which it has done --and then some. Check the spelling and capitalization on page 26 of the paper by M&M above( post 43) -the only difference is the capital "P" at the end of UptiP..........

No, No, No! Why do you think you should be the one to "enhance the recognition" by  changing how it is written. Your arrogance astounds. You are the only person who capitalises the U in mid sentence. If you want to use page 26 of the M&M paper as precedence, then why don't you also capitalise the first letter of Foil every time? The styling of the word "uptip" to appear "UptiP' is solely your invention and not used by anybody else. 

Does it make you feel important? The only reason for enhanced recognition is because of ridicule and you don't even realise it. People shy away from the term to avoid any chance of being associated with you. 

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4 minutes ago, A Class Sailor said:

No, No, No! Why do you think you should be the one to "enhance the recognition" by  changing how it is written. Your arrogance astounds. You are the only person who capitalises the U in mid sentence. If you want to use page 26 of the M&M paper as precedence, then why don't you also capitalise the first letter of Foil every time? The styling of the word "uptip" to appear "UptiP' is solely your invention and not used by anybody else. 

Does it make you feel important? The only reason for enhanced recognition is because of ridicule and you don't even realise it. People shy away from the term to avoid any chance of being associated with you. 

Thank you!

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1 minute ago, Doug Lord said:

Thank you!

Tells us everything. You think that is a complement! Idiot!

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Now that's funny!!

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Superfoilers ARE prototypes for the next AC Cup.

they have super funding, design team of M&M and

the circuit is not only being used to test and display the boats, but in search of feedback from spectators and sponsors.

Enjoy the show! 

Cheers, Stephen 

 

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On ‎21‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 6:39 AM, A Class Sailor said:

They have come a long way but they are a long way off where they need to be. They haven't yet shown they can sail it hard in the lighter stuff. No 3 man wiring, no proper tacks and gybes and only sailing in lighter winds. I also think that experienced foilers would watch the videos and suggest they still have a long way to go with their technique. On a lightweight, over powered foiler like this, it is very strange to see so little movement of the mainsheet. They are sailing it more like a GC32 than the lightweight foiler it is.

As for the crashes, on foiling boats, you do get those ones where the crew swing well out from the boat and forward but you also get ones where you would crash straight into where the board is.

 

If we could all ignore Mr Lords wet dreams for a moment we can get back on topic.

The last video I saw only had 2 trap wires rigged so might be difficult to put 3 on the wire considering I didn't see a 3rd trap wire, I don't know if this will be a permanent change.

I think they have come a long way considering they only have one boat sailing, it would be easier with 2 or more boats testing, I agree with experienced foilers probably being essential to get the best from these boats with trim and sailhandling.I don't think the 18's would be a logical stepping stone.

As for mainsheet movement the breeze did look steady which might explain that, the footage also shows crew on the wire would have no problems clearing boards in capsize.

Since Bill has stated several teams from several countries I would suspect he has sponsorship and sailors already lined up considering TV coverage is confirmed, I wonder what some of the AC guys have planned for summer down under. I reckon there might be a few pro sailors with experience in 49ers/Moths and AC competing.

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