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1 minute ago, jaysper said:

Because snooker is way more popular. 

No sailing just isn't a TV friendly sport and all the attempts to make it so are ultimately in the long run going to fail.  It's a participation sport. 

To many weird confusing rules for normal people.  Not terribly exciting to watch either as a non-sailor.  With the wide angle shots despite the fact the boats are doing 30-40 knots they still look slow.  

That being said I'm glad it's being broadcast.  I just don't think it's a sustainable dream to bring sailing to TV

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24 minutes ago, Barnacle Bill said:

C'mon. SA is a legit sailing website. 

The forums section, I dunno. 

It's what he said on radio sport a few weeks back...he got declined originally.

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Just now, Sailbydate said:

That might just be the winning answer. 

I have to say this is much better racing, but oh, so much harder on the nerves!

Very difficult. I can't watch it properly, I'm too invested in wanting ETNZ to win. Later, in the calm of night I watch the races properly .... 

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13 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

He didn't answer it at all!

 

Outterridge gave a much better answer in the 10m interview that is uploading now.  Jimmy came up afterwards and punched me in the gut before giving me a hug and saying 'thanks for asking a real fucking question mate.' 

Very cool of JS. And yes, he answered it far more intelligently.

I do actually hope you bring some insight into this event for us, the attempt at explaining potential boatspeed improvements early today was an okay start but came after a too-long winded bunch of PR buffoonery. 

 

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1 hour ago, ~Stingray~ said:

...

IMG_1587.thumb.PNG.39204df996493e3335fece0b71ac0e39.PNG

Looking at those numbers, OtUSA are right back in this. 

What's the wind outlook for Monday, guys?

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4 minutes ago, LoopyGirdleSniffer said:

No sailing just isn't a TV friendly sport and all the attempts to make it so are ultimately in the long run going to fail.  It's a participation sport. 

To many weird confusing rules for normal people.  Not terribly exciting to watch either as a non-sailor.  With the wide angle shots despite the fact the boats are doing 30-40 knots they still look slow.  

That being said I'm glad it's being broadcast.  I just don't think it's a sustainable dream to bring sailing to TV

Totally agree

 

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9 minutes ago, NZL5 said:

Can you elaborate on the mod? Or are you hoping, like us, that there is one?

Sorry, I should have said modifications .... 

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10 minutes ago, ~Stingray~ said:

 

Problem since then has been the constant, endless, trashing of anything and everything AC

It only looks like AC if you're not paying attention - it has nothing to do with AC.   It is solely Russell Coutts management of ACEA that I have trashed, and there is a big and growing world full of sponsors, government ministers, TV networks, and teams that agrees with me.  Lots of stories will come out when this is over Stingray.  I won't expect any apologies, but you will find out just how much Russell fucked up the business side and 'sustainability' he pays so much lip service to...

 

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Just got finished watching both races.  OR-BDA truly made the most of their 5 day break.  

Still, they needed a sweep today to make things interesting, IMO.  Despite OR-BDA's gains they look to be at ETNZ-AUS's level, not surpassed it like back in AC34.

Down 4-1 it doesn't look like enough for OR-BDA to just be at ETNZ-AUS's level and come back to win.  Unless the wind picks up considerably.  

WetHog  :ph34r:

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11 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

It only looks like AC if you're not paying attention - it has nothing to do with AC.   It is solely Russell Coutts management of ACEA that I have trashed, and there is a big and growing world full of sponsors, government ministers, TV networks, and teams that agrees with me.  Lots of stories will come out when this is over Stingray.  I won't expect any apologies, but you will find out just how much Russell fucked up the business side and 'sustainability' he pays so much lip service to...

 

Very few of us care whether anyone else agrees with you about anything, including PR. It simply isn't about you, or whatever opportunities you are trying to curry favor for. You aren't the story anyone cares about.

Instead of spreading sleazy rumors about opinions from whoever: Please, please try to focus instead on the (c'mon, man) excellent technology and performances being delivered out there. THAT is where the dynamite is this time around. 

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8 minutes ago, ~Stingray~ said:

Actually, we shared good times in Valencia so I know he's big-ego'd but capable of also being decent. 

Problem since then has been the constant, endless, trashing of anything and everything AC - a direct insult to every one of the 500K interested posts in the AC forum. Mostly his problems seem to be with the PR side of it, which strikes me as dumb since he has zero professional cred in that area. 

After trashing it for so long, apparently to make egotistical claims that he is some kind of PR expert, his is now two-facedly attracted enough to go interject himself into an event he has been professing to hate? 

Sorry, I just think it's a bit filthy. He would have stuck to his 'morals' and stayed the f away if he'd actually had any.

Clear now. I've not read many articles on the front page of this site. I find the opinions of the folk in here better because they can be instantly criticized and refuted. Dribble by web only hacks is often biased by whoever took them out for a beer the night before. Not confirming Clean is a drunken hack not worth the steam off my piss, just saying that some are. Clean may be too. I'd need to make the effort to read some of his carefully scribed efforts to make my own opinion. 

Clearly he's an old cunt. Sometimes old cunts have valid points, sometimes it's just mutterings of confused memories, facts and lies welded together. The product of which is repulsive.

For now I'll sit on the fence. As always Stinger, I value your considered opinion. 

 

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3 minutes ago, WetHog said:

Just got finished watching both races.  OR-BDA truly made the most of their 5 day break.  

Still, they needed a sweep today to make things interesting, IMO.  Despite OR-BDA's gains they look to be at ETNZ-AUS's level, not surpassed it like back in AC34.

Down 4-1 it doesn't look like enough for OR-BDA to just be at ETNZ-AUS's level and come back to win.  Unless the wind picks up considerably.  

WetHog  :ph34r:

I think it depends if they can squeeze a little more speed out of the boat and tighten up their handling to eliminate errors.  Right now it seems like errors by OR result in far bigger differentials so they'll want to fix that.  They'll know they got let off the hook in the second race and will gratefully accept the W, but they'll for sure be looking to wring more out of the boat tomorrow.  2-0 and it becomes very interesting again.

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14 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

Looking at those numbers, OtUSA are right back in this. 

What's the wind outlook for Monday, guys?

Yeah but we saw similar (higher) numbers with ART, missing VMG again here...

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Just now, rh2600 said:

Yeah but we saw similar (higher) numbers with ART, missing VMG again here...

I thought OTUSA's VMG numbers looked a lot stronger today.

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30 minutes ago, Paddywackery said:

No, I don't believe history will repeat itself at all. Different boats, different crews, different race schedule. 

PB looked remarkably relaxed. Part of ETNZ's strengths is the lack of fear and the calm determination. I believe the conditions and setup played a part today. Oracle did a great job in race 2 but they have a long way to go and need perfection. Watch for ETNZ to now get faster with the mod they've been saving for their first defeat. I believe they've sandbagged wisely. Correction: kept something in reserve. 

If it weren't for 2013 I today wouldn't have fazed me.

If Orifice step up again then we could be in trouble but right now I still think we've got this.

We still looked substantially faster down wind although it looks like Orifice have caught up or overtaken us on the upwind legs.

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10 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Nice of him to stop and talk for a bit. I think he's uncomfortable with swearing. 

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1 minute ago, Sailbydate said:

I thought OTUSA's VMG numbers looked a lot stronger today.

First race much lower (penalties have big impact), race 2 hard to say, we sailed further and only a handful of secs behind...

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8 minutes ago, ~Stingray~ said:

Very few of us care whether anyone else agrees with you about anything, including PR. It simply isn't about you, or whatever opportunities you are trying to curry favor for. You aren't the story anyone cares about.

Instead of spreading sleazy rumors about opinions from whoever: Please, please try to focus instead on the (c'mon, man) excellent technology and performances being delivered out there. THAT is where the dynamite is this time around. 

Bang on Stingers + 1

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1 minute ago, rh2600 said:

First race much lower (penalties have big impact), race 2 hard to say, we sailed further and only a handful of secs behind...

I thought the moments they were together, Oracle was pointing higher than they were last week. Seems like a good improvement. 

Last week they were pointing lower and still not matching the Kiwis on speed. 

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2 minutes ago, jaysper said:

If it weren't for 2013 I today wouldn't have fazed me.

If Orifice step up again then we could be in trouble but right now I still think we've got this.

We still looked substantially faster down wind although it looks like Orifice have caught up or overtaken us on the upwind legs.

Both teams caught game-changing favorable wind shifts today. 

Now that the boats are about equally fast, tactics (including luck, if things remain as shifty) will - like in many AC's past - be crucial. 

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24 minutes ago, LoopyGirdleSniffer said:

No sailing just isn't a TV friendly sport and all the attempts to make it so are ultimately in the long run going to fail.  It's a participation sport. 

To many weird confusing rules for normal people.  Not terribly exciting to watch either as a non-sailor.  With the wide angle shots despite the fact the boats are doing 30-40 knots they still look slow.  

That being said I'm glad it's being broadcast.  I just don't think it's a sustainable dream to bring sailing to TV

Yes but I believe the original point was that the coverage sucks for people who can actually understand what's going on.

Theyve tried and failed to make it appealing to the general public and in doing so have also failed to deliver suitable coverage for us.

Valencia coverage was much better.

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1 minute ago, jaysper said:

Yes but I believe the original point was that the coverage sucks for people who can actually understand what's going on.

Theyve tried and failed to make it appealing to the general public and in doing so have also failed to deliver suitable coverage for us.

Valencia coverage was much better.

Agreed minus the Valencia thing.  All I remember about Valencia was having to get up at 3am to watch

 

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2 minutes ago, jaysper said:

If it weren't for 2013 I today wouldn't have fazed me.

If Orifice step up again then we could be in trouble but right now I still think we've got this.

We still looked substantially faster down wind although it looks like Orifice have caught up or overtaken us on the upwind legs.

Completely agree jaysper. Remove 2013 from the equation and we'd all be more relaxed. Ironically enough, PB and the boys don't seem at all burdened by that episode and that bodes well. And stepping up works both ways so it's all to play for which should make for great racing. 

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Just now, LoopyGirdleSniffer said:

Agreed minus the Valencia thing.  All I remember about Valencia was having to get up at 3am to watch

 

Despite Ernie being a total cunt, Valencia was a really good AC. Great venue, good coverage and a decent number of challengers.

For all the effort Wussell has put into "making the AC great again" he has failed in the most spectacular fashion. Dick!

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4 minutes ago, jaysper said:

Yes but I believe the original point was that the coverage sucks for people who can actually understand what's going on.

Theyve tried and failed to make it appealing to the general public and in doing so have also failed to deliver suitable coverage for us.

Valencia coverage was much better.

Yes, lowest common denominator misses the mark!

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NO's comment about Jimmy not giving up a few kilos for the grinders was interesting if OR have spent some time last week giving the boat a Jenny Craig.

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Just now, jack_sparrow said:

NO's comment about Jimmy not giving up a few kilos for the grinders was interesting if OR have spent some time last week giving the boat a Jenny Craig.

Yeah bit awkward that eh... 

Plus the bike has proved to be a bit of an albatross...

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20 minutes ago, LoopyGirdleSniffer said:

No sailing just isn't a TV friendly sport and all the attempts to make it so are ultimately in the long run going to fail.  It's a participation sport. 

To many weird confusing rules for normal people.  Not terribly exciting to watch either as a non-sailor.  With the wide angle shots despite the fact the boats are doing 30-40 knots they still look slow.  

That being said I'm glad it's being broadcast.  I just don't think it's a sustainable dream to bring sailing to TV

Good topic. 

Sailing is made interesting on TV by the commentators, graphics and insights from the boat. 

Take away the commentator,  or have an ill informed fuckwit who tries to 'teach' the viewers about the sport while a race is underway, and it just fucks it for me. 

Peter Montgomery made the cup every kiwis sport in Team New Zealand's early days. He added excitement with what he delivered and the inflection in his voice. His part in making the Americas Cup, New Zealand's cup is important and I thank him for those times, those memories. 

Now through Peter Montgomery is a tired old cunt and totally worthless to me. I won't listen to him now, it's embarrassing. 

Good commentary can make anything exciting. Well, except for the sport of curling. 

The point being that it matters not if the next cup is on foils, hover skirts or on traditional mono hulls. What matters is drama, close racing and fair sport. 

The management of this iteration of the cup have come well short of my expectations. What's making it so exciting for me this time is more than 'my' team winning. It's the prospect of things changing from this fuck up that really matters to me. 

#notmycup 

 

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11 minutes ago, Miffy said:

I thought the moments they were together, Oracle was pointing higher than they were last week. Seems like a good improvement. 

Last week they were pointing lower and still not matching the Kiwis on speed. 

Oracle definitely faster than last week

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In Race 1 the wind direction and avg speeds were relatively even for both boats with OR having better avg VMG upwind but the Kiwis having better max VMG.  Downwind it looks like OR had a fraction more breeze but worse VMG numbers by a reasonable margin.  Race 2 looked to have slightly more variation in the wind direction but the avg wind speeds were similar and OR looked to generally have better VMG numbers.

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2 hours ago, nav said:

Too much of a dial down and should have covered once they established the 100m lead.

And did they need to duck at the top gate? Looked like they could have tacked for the protection of the circle?

Oh well heads up - and congrats to OTUSA

+2

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2 hours ago, nroose said:

I am watching today's first race now, which I missed. Seems like the NZers around here have it backwards. Now to win, Kiwis need to get multiple penalties in their favor and count on OR to make mistakes.

Actually, have just heard that ACEA have offered ETNZ $10,000,000 to win just 1 race a day for the next 3 days to stretch it out a bit for their TV obligations:lol:

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Just now, snaerk said:

+2

Perhaps they felt that they'd lose to much speed to pull it off properly. 

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32 minutes ago, ~Stingray~ said:

 It simply isn't about you

You aren't the story anyone cares about.

Instead of spreading sleazy rumors about opinions from whoever:

:lol::lol:

You cannot be serious.........

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Ultimately, even though a lot of people won't/ don't want to admit it, Grant Dalton was spot-on with his comment about sailing being an internet sport, not a tv sport. What ACEA/ Russell Coutts should've realised was instead of pandering to the fans he potentially may have gotten (the non-sailing audience) he should've catered to the fans they were guaranteed to get, that being the sailing audience. I mean, really, the Americas Cup, foiling AC50's with cyclors, hydraulic powered systems and wings does undoubtedly make for fantastic tv coverage, but if you're a non-sailor, and you go down to your local yacht club, and you say "ok, I saw these things on tv flying around in Bermuda, now where do i sign up for that"? You are really going to be disappointed in the outcome. The sailing audience, well, they can watch these things, be amazed, and then go back to sailing their keel boats on a Wednesday night no worries at all. Yes the AC should be broadcast on TV, but TV should in no way, dictate the way the Americas Cup is broadcast. The AC should be aired live on You Tube and other internet sites, with indepth commentary and analysis from people who know what they're talking about when it comes to what is being shown on the coverage. 

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5 minutes ago, Paddywackery said:

Perhaps they felt that they'd lose to much speed to pull it off properly. 

Agreed. They were burned by that maneuver against Oracle in the RR match.

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4 minutes ago, sclarke said:

Agreed. They were burned by that maneuver against Oracle in the RR match.

But nayld it in an erly AC rayss, no?

Or woz it vs Artemis in Finalz?

Going into RH top mark, accel from 11kn to 22kn in 3 bote lengthz ending with a bow between there transomz

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5 minutes ago, snaerk said:

But nayld it in an erly AC rayss, no?

Or woz it vs Artemis in Finalz?

Going into RH top mark, accel from 11kn to 22kn in 3 bote lengthz ending with a bow between there transomz

Correct Snaerk, against Oracle who then messed up the gybe and lost 200m almost immediately. 

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1 hour ago, Sailbydate said:

I thought OTUSA's VMG numbers looked a lot stronger today.

That was my gut feeling - waiting for the VS data to come up on the historical stuff - best way to get a feel for WTF is going on.

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35 minutes ago, sclarke said:

Ultimately, even though a lot of people won't/ don't want to admit it, Grant Dalton was spot-on with his comment about sailing being an internet sport, not a tv sport. What ACEA/ Russell Coutts should've realised was instead of pandering to the fans he potentially may have gotten (the non-sailing audience) he should've catered to the fans they were guaranteed to get, that being the sailing audience. I mean, really, the Americas Cup, foiling AC50's with cyclors, hydraulic powered systems and wings does undoubtedly make for fantastic tv coverage, but if you're a non-sailor, and you go down to your local yacht club, and you say "ok, I saw these things on tv flying around in Bermuda, now where do i sign up for that"? You are really going to be disappointed in the outcome. The sailing audience, well, they can watch these things, be amazed, and then go back to sailing their keel boats on a Wednesday night no worries at all. Yes the AC should be broadcast on TV, but TV should in no way, dictate the way the Americas Cup is broadcast. The AC should be aired live on You Tube and other internet sites, with indepth commentary and analysis from people who know what they're talking about when it comes to what is being shown on the coverage. 

Yup. 

Why not have duel coverage with one being for hard-core, informed sailors with telemetry, 360 live cameras and audio switching on demand? Why can we not choose what camera we want to view from, audio we want to hear. I want to wear VR goggles and look around the boat, hear the calls and immerse myself totally in this thing. I can do it with porn, why can't I do it with the AC FFS! 

Then another footage stream for dim Americans who have never seen the water, let alone sail on it. Like the current shit we're forced to accept. Dumbed down coverage for the I'll prepared, lazy buckets of shit that just tuned in while they're waiting for Nascar to start pisses me off. 

The best way to learn,  when you find yourself overwhelmed with something new,  is to apply some self directed learning, not rely on some nice person to get the puppets out and politely explain how to tie your shoe laces. 

I have a work colleague who has not long arrived in NZ, had never watched or been involved in sailing, is right into the AC now and he's complaining that there's not enough in depth technical info or selectable on demand coverage to satisfy his thirst for his new interest. I dare not introduce him to SAAC. He'll leave after the first request for tits. 

The coverage could easily be so much more. We live in a media age where if you can dream it, you can do it. 

I detest being left wanting. I expected more from a technology company that is well capable of offering what I want and had the resources and rights to do so. 

Stuff you OTUSA and ACEA. 

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1 hour ago, jaysper said:

 it looks like Orifice have caught up or overtaken us on the upwind legs.

Agreed, watched both races again, OR look a bit faster upwind. After their near-death reappraisal imo they'll have more items on the ideas list to do and will be busy again in the shed. More importantly they probably still have development potential left in their new realizations going in their favour.

ETNZ need to have something substantial to be working in the shed tonight or this is going to swing the other way, imo. If the boat has plateaued they're in trouble imo.

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, HP2 said:

Agreed, watched both races again, OR look a bit faster upwind. After their near-death reappraisal imo they'll have more items on the ideas list to do and will be busy again in the shed. More importantly they probably still have development potential left in their new realizations going in their favour.

ETNZ need to have something substantial to be working in the shed on tonight or this is going to swing the other way, imo. If the boat has plateaued they're in trouble imo.

 

 

 

Nope. Standby. 

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Just now, Barnacle Bill said:

Nope. Standby. 

Nope to which part?

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3 minutes ago, HP2 said:

Agreed, watched both races again, OR look a bit faster upwind. After their near-death reappraisal imo they'll have more items on the ideas list to do and will be busy again in the shed. More importantly they probably still have development potential left in their new realizations going in their favour.

ETNZ need to have something substantial to be working in the shed on tonight or this is going to swing the other way, imo. If the boat has plateaued they're in trouble imo.

Bit premature to say all this I think. One race win (that could've gone the other way) in a boat that looked like a dog to sail in race one is hardly now going to canter away with 6 straight victories - JS has still only won a single start which has very little to do with performance and ETNZ are still yet to lose a race where they've lead at mark one.

But I do think we'll see the races won by the team that makes the fewest mistakes now, and everything else being equal, it'll be the team that leads at mark one (or the one that gets really lucky with a windshift).

It will be interesting to see what performance improvements the teams do make, but right now I'd say the performance is too close to call and the better sailing will win each race from here. Game on.

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1 hour ago, jaysper said:

If it weren't for 2013 I today wouldn't have fazed me.

If Orifice step up again then we could be in trouble but right now I still think we've got this.

We still looked substantially faster down wind although it looks like Orifice have caught up or overtaken us on the upwind legs.

Thanks Jaysper. I like the positivity! "For myself" I'm struggling. I thought today would give us answers but I now think tomorrow will. Who wins and how they win will make it clear whether it's going to be a battle, a 2013 repeat or that ETNZ has it. 

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Not shore Orickel can bank this win, tho I hope so - 1 kn less ave wind & az configgered today wd hav been in trubbel - JS sed az mutsh before going out

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3 minutes ago, KoW said:

Bit premature to say all this I think. One race win (that could've gone the other way) in a boat that looked like a dog to sail in race one is hardly now going to canter away with 6 straight victories - JS has still only won a single start which has very little to do with performance and ETNZ are still yet to lose a race where they've lead at mark one.

But I do think we'll see the races won by the team that makes the fewest mistakes now, and everything else being equal, it'll be the team that leads at mark one (or the one that gets really lucky with a windshift).

It will be interesting to see what performance improvements the teams do make, but right now I'd say the performance is too close to call and the better sailing will win each race from here. Game on.

Not really premature, I've been talking about this for awhile. Yes, I totally agree, it's unlikely that they'll sweep but imo it looks like it might come down to the bonus point or something like that. 

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2 minutes ago, HP2 said:

Not really premature, I've been talking about this for awhile. Yes, I totally agree, it's unlikely that they'll sweep but imo it looks like it might come down to the bonus point or something like that. 

If Xerox win it thanks entirely to the 5 lay day copying week and their "bonus" point from sailing in a regatta where most of their opponents were actually their stooges, it will leave an even more bitter taste in my mouth than 2013.

However I don't share your belief that today showed Oracle have overtaken ETNZ (yet).

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2 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

You really know when to hit the butt hurt switch

No butt hurt here. If Jimmy takes two off PB tomorrow, then you'll see butt hurt. 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not an Oracle fanboy. I'd like to see ETNZ win, but the ETNZ fanboys make it hard to root for the team. Just give me some close racing and I'll be happy, regardless of who wins in the end. 

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3 minutes ago, HP2 said:

Nope to which part?

I don't think they'll have a whole lot left in the shed. They've had five days to give it everything. Nothing will have been held back.  The gains to be made now for OTUSA are in moding the boat more effectively. They'll be doing that and taking a close look at today's coverage. 

The speeds look fairly even to me. VMG matters still,  and I did not see VMG advantage consistently to OTUSA today.

ETNZ sailed poorly in the second race. Missing the wind shift lost them the race, amongst other errors. 

This'll come down to sailing the boat. I maintain ETNZ has the better tasking for the sailors and therefore an advantage to sail the boat more effectively than OTUSA ultimately winning more races. 

Dialing on pt/stb is not effective unless at or near a mark rounding or at the start. We'll see changes on that should it option tomorrow. 

I'm picking 2-0 to ETNZ tomorrow unless there's three races. 

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Just now, KoW said:

If Xerox win it thanks entirely to the 5 lay day copying week and their "bonus" point from sailing in a regatta where most of their opponents were actually their stooges, it will leave an even more bitter taste in my mouth than 2013.

However I don't share your belief that today showed Oracle have overtaken ETNZ (yet).

Yeh, I'm not even a kiwi and I'll be disgusted if this goes sideways. More than 2013, like you. 

 

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15 minutes ago, 1eyedkiwi said:

Thanks Jaysper. I like the positivity! "For myself" I'm struggling. I thought today would give us answers but I now think tomorrow will. Who wins and how they win will make it clear whether it's going to be a battle, a 2013 repeat or that ETNZ has it. 

Daltons Dandies need 3 wins and Oriface require 6 from the 7 remaining races correct?.

A betting man would say Auckland City had better start borrowing bucket loads of dosh quickly.

Still I can't shake that Jaws theme,dah dum dah dum........

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a lot about wind shifts I I think.

race 1 O had pretty munched finished their goofing by mark 3 and etnz put 90 secs on them (albeit O saved one last horrific bungle until toward the end)

race 2 all on fir young and old. Can O sail that well 6 more times ?

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5 lay dayz givs advantaje to hwitshever teem iz off payss.

Orickel did not expeckt to be off payss.

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9 minutes ago, Barnacle Bill said:

I don't think they'll have a whole lot left in the shed. They've had five days to give it everything. Nothing will have been held back.  The gains to be made now for OTUSA are in moding the boat more effectively. They'll be doing that and taking a close look at today's coverage. 

The speeds look fairly even to me. VMG matters still,  and I did not see VMG advantage consistently to OTUSA today.

ETNZ sailed poorly in the second race. Missing the wind shift lost them the race, amongst other errors. 

This'll come down to sailing the boat. I maintain ETNZ has the better tasking for the sailors and therefore an advantage to sail the boat more effectively than OTUSA ultimately winning more races. 

Dialing on pt/stb is not effective unless at or near a mark rounding or at the start. We'll see changes on that should it option tomorrow. 

I'm picking 2-0 to ETNZ tomorrow unless there's three races. 

Yup, well said, and I hope you're right on all of that. Because of my (flexible) convictions the most I'm hoping for tomorrow is one race each, which'll be fantastic enough.

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I think Oracle are definitely faster than they were last weekend, but I also think the Kiwi's made a few mistakes that let them in, especially in that second race. I also think that Oracle sailed a great second race, near perfect. However its a tough ask to sail perfectly every day from now on. Kiwi's need only 3 more wins, Oracle need twice as many. To pull that feat off IMO they need to be substantially quicker than ETNZ, and right now they aren't. ETNZ has the luxury of only having to win one race a day till the end, where Oracle have the added pressure of having to win pretty much everything from now on. 

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27 minutes ago, Priscilla said:

Daltons Dandies need 3 wins and Oriface require 6 from the 7 remaining races correct?.

A betting man would say Auckland City had better start borrowing bucket loads of dosh quickly.

Still I can't shake that Jaws theme,dah dum dah dum........

We've still got some blue buckets from last time. Handy that.

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Like I said before: All you kiwis don´t have any reason to be worried, it still is 4:1. START WORRYING AT 6:1:ph34r::ph34r:

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I am a non sailer.. the only water sport I watch is the americas cup.

I am desperate to see more information on the screen. a lot of stuff can be put up and it will help everyone. the more I understand, the more I know when to panic

The commentators can help a lot too, i grew up with kiwi commentators on NZ tv.

this sky feed from the US is rubbish

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The OR tack in this clip seems to have a much quicker turn rate than we've seen from them before -

 

 

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2 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

NO's comment about Jimmy not giving up a few kilos for the grinders was interesting if OR have spent some time last week giving the boat a Jenny Craig.

I find this interesting..

There were other comments as well.

"During the pre-race chat with America's Cup TV Spithill was a little bit more descriptive, saying they have taken a "whole heap" of stuff off the Oracle boat to make it lighter."

 

and on the live stream, one of the commentators noted ( before the first race) that OR "looked significantly lighter".

 

WTF?

 

Are they trying to say that a team with the resources and skills of OR have been sailing a heavy boat all this time???

That they couldn't produce a boat that weighed in at minimum before the first race? At this level why would you do anything else?

 

Besides the obvious bike, I would be keen to know what the "whole heap" of unnecessary gear OR had on board actually was.

 

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The comments about maybe two feeds to watch the racing are hopefully soon to be a thing of the past. I've got a mate working for Sky NZ and they are planning to broadcast all their cameras punters at once and then let the viewer select what to watch.  Using the rugby analogy, you could choose to follow the ball, a player, a team etc, using multiple screens if they wish.

Moving to the quality of the commentary, the problem as I see it is that we all watch the same feed expecting something different from it.  Surely, if you want a sailor's commentary, you go to a specialist sailing website? How about that Clean; provide the serious commentary that sailors want while we watch our various feeds, sans sound. I moved on fromPJM ages ago.

 

on a more serious note, what the hell was that last ETNZ dial down about?

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Fig 11 said:

The comments about maybe two feeds to watch the racing are hopefully soon to be a thing of the past. I've got a mate working for Sky NZ and they are planning to broadcast all their cameras punters at once and then let the viewer select what to watch.  Using the rugby analogy, you could choose to follow the ball, a player, a team etc, using multiple screens if they wish.

Moving to the quality of the commentary, the problem as I see it is that we all watch the same feed expecting something different from it.  Surely, if you want a sailor's commentary, you go to a specialist sailing website? How about that Clean; provide the serious commentary that sailors want while we watch our various feeds, sans sound. I moved on fromPJM ages ago.

 

on a more serious note, what the hell was that last ETNZ dial down about?

 

 

We don't watch the same feed.  Us in the US have the stick and ball douche from AC34 with unpolished NO and Draper and the International crowd get the rugby guy and KR.  

Lord knows why us in the US lost KR after the LVC but, no offense to NO and Draper, the commentary sucks.  Sucks bad. 

WetHog  :ph34r:

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Quote

Are they trying to say that a team with the resources and skills of OR have been sailing a heavy boat all this time???

Lots of small contributing factors to "heaviness" 

Well there was the obvious difference in foil design...

There was the strap-on bmx...

There's the bulkier crew...

There's the old-fashioned winches for the trim...

There's the single design hulls which NZ paid Oracle for the mould for and built their own lighter version while everyone else used Oracle's hull builders...

There's all those extra batteries needed to power crappy Oracle software (that JS himself can't stop bagging as the reason for his losses)...

There's the grinding pedestals (don't know if these are heavier than the cyclor stations though)...

Then there's the fact that a boat is "heavier" if it generates less hydrodynamic lift, or its weight is distributed less intelligently.

ETNZ paid immense attention to detail, money doesn't buy attention to detail.

 

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^^ There's only 100kg margin in the class rules so it's not like they were sailing around with an extra tonne dragging them down

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1 hour ago, KoW said:

If Xerox win it thanks entirely to the 5 lay day copying week and their "bonus" point from sailing in a regatta where most of their opponents were actually their stooges, it will leave an even more bitter taste in my mouth than 2013.

However I don't share your belief that today showed Oracle have overtaken ETNZ (yet).

So, based on your incredibly clever Xerox reference, I'll just assume you understand how copying works. A perfect copy would make both boats equal.  So you think Spithill is the better helmsman?  Interesting. I'd keep that opinion quiet around your parts, but I get it. 

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6 minutes ago, Monkey said:

So, based on your incredibly clever Xerox reference, I'll just assume you understand how copying works. A perfect copy would make both boats equal.  So you think Spithill is the better helmsman?  Interesting. I'd keep that opinion quiet around your parts, but I get it. 

+1

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2 races tomorrow?

there was talk of 3 races and that if that happened, the teams would have to be informed by 8pm

 

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3 hours ago, Barnacle Bill said:

Good topic. 

Sailing is made interesting on TV by the commentators, graphics and insights from the boat. 

Take away the commentator,  or have an ill informed fuckwit who tries to 'teach' the viewers about the sport while a race is underway, and it just fucks it for me. 

Peter Montgomery made the cup every kiwis sport in Team New Zealand's early days. He added excitement with what he delivered and the inflection in his voice. His part in making the Americas Cup, New Zealand's cup is important and I thank him for those times, those memories. 

Now through Peter Montgomery is a tired old cunt and totally worthless to me. I won't listen to him now, it's embarrassing. 

Good commentary can make anything exciting. Well, except for the sport of curling. 

The point being that it matters not if the next cup is on foils, hover skirts or on traditional mono hulls. What matters is drama, close racing and fair sport. 

The management of this iteration of the cup have come well short of my expectations. What's making it so exciting for me this time is more than 'my' team winning. It's the prospect of things changing from this fuck up that really matters to me. 

#notmycup 

 

This is a great analysis.   

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59 minutes ago, starlyte said:

I am a non sailer.. the only water sport I watch is the americas cup.

I am desperate to see more information on the screen. a lot of stuff can be put up and it will help everyone. the more I understand, the more I know when to panic

The commentators can help a lot too, i grew up with kiwi commentators on NZ tv.

this sky feed from the US is rubbish

+10

TV shood at min hav VMG for both, at ORL tymz

The klownz hav even stript VMG from Virtual Eye, hwitsh haz had it since forever

Wot givz?

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44 minutes ago, WetHog said:

We don't watch the same feed.  Us in the US have the stick and ball douche from AC34 with unpolished NO and Draper and the International crowd get the rugby guy and KR.  

Lord knows why us in the US lost KR after the LVC but, no offense to NO and Draper, the commentary sucks.  Sucks bad. 

WetHog  :ph34r:

God I would love to have NO and Draper cf Read. 

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you may think I'm full of shit, but if they put me and freddy carr in the booth and steph roble or genny tulloch on the water, we'd rock the fucking world.

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The Cup's a media failure. I'm ok with paying to view TV and the app. What I'm not ok with is the commentary we get in NZ through sky TV. I'm forced to turn the volume down and instead constantly refresh SAAC and glance over to the app as attention allows. I DON'T want to hear an English and American with OTUSA bias tell me what's going on, nor do I need a lesson on hydraulic fluid pumping differences during every race. 

I believe the future of coverage in this event lies in a central online streaming solution where you can choose a variety of commentators, camera angles and positions, listen to what ever boat you want or go for the full VR experience. 

I believe we should have the power to overlay data on the screen as we see fit and be able to analyze data post race with full access to all recorded data that the teams get as part of the deal. 

This way the experience can  be as simple or complex as the user wants. None of this requires technology advances, just the courage to do it. 

I'll be letting the winning team know this view and will let a know what reply I get, if any. 

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10 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

you may think I'm full of shit, but if they put me and freddy carr in the booth and steph roble or genny tulloch on the water, we'd rock the fucking world.

What kind of shit? A Jimmy? 

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44 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

you may think I'm full of shit, but if they put me and freddy carr in the booth and steph roble or genny tulloch on the water, we'd rock the fucking world.

In your dreams, Buddy. ;)

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5 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

18 minutes after posting my 'banned' story i got a friendly email.  Funny how that works.

great news , you won the protest

 

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51 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

you may think I'm full of shit, but if they put me and freddy carr in the booth and steph roble or genny tulloch on the water, we'd rock the fucking world.

you're full of shit!

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So much shit and hot air in NZ , the sheep need safety equipment

Kiwi sheep.jpg

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9 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Just confirmed that TWO RACES TOMORROW ONLY.

Nice reports mister.

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10 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Just confirmed that TWO RACES TOMORROW ONLY.

So I guess the desire to have the Cup on the front page of Monday's NY Times is only relevant if it's Oracle winning.  So much for marketing the event.  I know that NBC wants this over as soon as possible, so I wonder who decided against giving IM the discretion to run a third race if the Kiwis get to match point?

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No idea, but it's one in a litany of misteps on the organizer side.  On the other hand, the race village is really well done and the crowds were excellent today, albeit it in a fairly small area that accentuates the size of the throng.  My swag estimate (based on other events that actually released numbers) with a little support from a local event staffer is somewhere between 6 and 8k on the day.  I do know there were something like 2000 spec boat flags issued, and am trying to get the event media folks to get a high helicopter shot of the spectator fleet. Remember the 2009 VOR when they shot the fleet off Stockholm, eventually counting like 5000 boats or something?  That would be good for them to do.

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1 hour ago, MR.CLEAN said:

you may think I'm full of shit, but if they put me and freddy carr in the booth and steph roble or genny tulloch on the water, we'd rock the fucking world.

I actually like your live commentary as much as any in all of sailing and have for a number of years. The volvo start you did and especially the M32.  And your facebook dock out thing this morning was great.

Just to balance it all out thought....your a punk.

 

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Just re-watched the races and on the post SR put up on speeds, vmg, etc. there we a number of times the Kiwi boat was consistently faster than OR. Also the Kiwis hit a top speed of 38.5 and that was noted on the NBC commentary. At times the Kiwis just angled the boat downwind especially the first run in race 1 while maintaining most of the top speed but eliminating a gybe.

OR may be faster than before but I am not convinced that they are equal or better than the Kiwis. They are probably like AR, if they get a lead they have enough to fend them off tactically by covering. There were quite a few places where you could see the wind speed helping or hurting.

I think the Kiwis still have the edge but may have to work a little harder on it.

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35 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

No idea, but it's one in a litany of misteps on the organizer side.  On the other hand, the race village is really well done and the crowds were excellent today, albeit it in a fairly small area that accentuates the size of the throng.  My swag estimate (based on other events that actually released numbers) with a little support from a local event staffer is somewhere between 6 and 8k on the day.  I do know there were something like 2000 spec boat flags issued, and am trying to get the event media folks to get a high helicopter shot of the spectator fleet. Remember the 2009 VOR when they shot the fleet off Stockholm, eventually counting like 5000 boats or something?  That would be good for them to do.

If they had held the cup somewhere other than a tiny island in the middle of nowhere with overpriced hotels, food and beer then perhaps more people would have shown up. Stadium racing with 8k people turning up is hardly a measure of success. In NZ, 8k people show up to watch a provincial rugby game with no grandstand. Just people standing around the rugby paddock yelling at the blind referee. All I see in BDA is rich white folk waving event-purchased flags and sipping champers from a bottle with a shewee poking out the top. 

I'd love to see the ACEA balance sheet at the end of this. I bet my left nutbag that there's no money in this. 

The only reason we're watching, talking and paying any attention to this event is the prestigious TROPHY that awaits the billionaire rat claws to fondle it at the end. Without the mug, this is just a medium level yacht regatta akin to second tier events, such as the international curling championships being held in Japan right now. 

Spectacular spectator boats. I counted 109 last weekend from a high helicopter shot. 

In 2000, 120,000 people and over 2000 spectator boats surrounded the lads on the final day of the AC. 

BDA is wanting IMO. 

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2 hours ago, jaysper said:

God I would love to have NO and Draper cf Read. 

With more experience NO and Draper would be as good, or better, than KR, but the stick and ball douche has to go.  His claim to fame is doing play by play for that pinnacle of sport the Worlds Strongest Man competition on ESPN 15-20 years ago.  That says it all.  Magnús Ver Magnússon and his crew ar