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Luna Rossa Challenge. AC 36

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9 minutes ago, WakaNZ said:

m2200_crop169014_1024x576_proportional_1561125228364F.jpg

Where's Jimmy??

Edit: Ahh - is that him with the sunnies at the back?

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1 hour ago, WakaNZ said:

m2200_crop169014_1024x576_proportional_1561125228364F.jpg

Oh no! No one explained how to convert 75 feet into a metric length for the eyties?

 

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Hey Jimmy, “Too much weights. Not enough speed!” 

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57 minutes ago, Monkey said:

It sure looked bigger on the truck!!

Was a tiny truck!

TFE today, for AC scroll to around 17:00

 

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14 hours ago, 17mika said:

yep it looks so. I was hoping that Prada would bring some kind of a "new cool" with a bright color, like they did with the silver boats in Frisco...
We'll see tomorrow.

Paint =  weight that can be more usefully employed elsewhere. Ensuring the outer/epoxy/varnish/whatever is UV stabilised has been sufficient on other boats so likely more than enough for a molly–coddled AC hull. ;-)

It also ensures the boat builder makes the outer hull has fair as possible with no filling so more weight saved.

I think vinyl wrap for advertising is not included in the weight of the boat, so covering most of the hull in sponsor wrap is a pretty good alternative to paint.

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3 hours ago, RobG said:

I think vinyl wrap for advertising is not included in the weight of the boat, so covering most of the hull in sponsor wrap is a pretty good alternative to paint.

That doesn't make sense to me, surely you'd want the boat as light as possible?

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Isnt there a rule about the type of finish/paint required. Standard 2 pot? Basically so the teams dont spend mega bucks on surface coating technology (sharkskin texture etc etc)

Thought that's been the running in multiple cups .... oooooooo maybe thats how Oracle came back from 8-1 (dun dun duuuuuuuuuuuunnnnnnn)

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Almost time to welcome our Italian brothers to the party.

 

For you bro.jpg

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1 minute ago, minimumfuss said:

He'll look lovely sporting a prada handbag

Gratuitous shirt off photos are only gonna attract the homosexuals. Next thing they'll be playing loud music, snorting marching powder, dressing impeccably and being polite and stuff.

Oh wait. That's most Italians. 

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^^^ Hard to tell exactly what's going on, but there looks to be some interesting treatment in the bow area. Seems to have a dimple and a bulge around the foil arms as well. Looks like another intriguing AC75.

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4 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

^^^ Hard to tell exactly what's going on, but there looks to be some interesting treatment in the bow area. Seems to have a dimple and a bulge around the foil arms as well. Looks like another intriguing AC75.

Looking reasonably full in the bow, foil mounts look halfway between the very potruding AM and very recessed ETNZ, yup probably yet another different interpretation.  Can't wait for the full reveal so we can see what the underside looks like.

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Thank you for your remarks about us Italians. That's very kind of you.

 

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You're far too polite. I'm sure he's rubbing one out looking at Jimmy with his shirt off. His sheep has a headache

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Looks credible.  Good to see they haven’t been fucking spiders this whole time.

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Stealing the images direct from that link:

image.thumb.png.5a9c05bb7683f174079e50e09fb81013.png

image.thumb.png.463feba67b8aa163f0848cf3f857e3e1.png

So we have a Kiwi style "keel" to the hull and American Magic style bulbs on foils, (again for modification under the rules?)

Does the forestay seem rather far back anyone else?

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3 minutes ago, JonRowe said:

 

image.thumb.png.463feba67b8aa163f0848cf3f857e3e1.png

So we have a Kiwi style "keel" to the hull and American Magic style bulbs on foils, (again for modification under the rules?)

Does the forestay seem rather far back anyone else?

And the award for the craziest foil design yet goes to the italians, because why not.... 

 

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35 minutes ago, Woolfy said:

That doesn't make sense to me, surely you'd want the boat as light as possible?

Sure, but every kg of paint (and filler) is a kg that can't be used for something else.

7 minutes ago, Lickindip said:

Isnt there a rule about the type of finish/paint required. Standard 2 pot? Basically so the teams dont spend mega bucks on surface coating technology (sharkskin texture etc etc)

 

9.1 Except as permitted in Rules 9.5 and 9.6, the outermost layer of the hull, foils and rudder must be a commercial product approved by the Rules Committee according to Rule 8, who shall only approve paints that are comparable to those on the list provided in Rule 8.6.

 

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2 minutes ago, RobG said:

Sure, but every kg of paint (and filler) is a kg that can't be used for something else.

 

9.1 Except as permitted in Rules 9.5 and 9.6, the outermost layer of the hull, foils and rudder must be a commercial product approved by the Rules Committee according to Rule 8, who shall only approve paints that are comparable to those on the list provided in Rule 8.6.

 

I'm pretty sure the black is just plain carbon that's been given a matte finish, no need to paint it black if it's already black.

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Very pretty boat.  

The Foils well.....I’m trying to like....but just can’t.  

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Each foil has to weigh close to 1,000 kg. Presumably LR has put most of that into the bulb, leaving them a lot more leeway on materials and design of the wings. It may also mean they can easily swap wings rather than the whole foil.

There may also be benefits for cavitation, and at least one very knowledgeable and successful hydrofoil builder swears that bulbs are faster than T joints, all else being equal.

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15 minutes ago, Raptorsailor said:

I'm pretty sure the black is just plain carbon that's been given a matte finish, no need to paint it black if it's already black.

Yes. But if you want something other than black (or "carbon grey")…

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15 min left to start of live, 2h45 according to announcement. Don't quite get their timing but stay tune.

Edited by Lakrass
Timing correction

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Launch is at 2 so assume 30 minutes of waffle before the christening, then speech with a bottle of fizz on the bow, then move waffle?

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57 minutes ago, JonRowe said:

image.thumb.png.5a9c05bb7683f174079e50e09fb81013.png

yysw264457.jpg

Italian is more like a daggerboard in the middle of rather flat bottom and Kiwi's boat has a "rounder" belly. Looks like 3 boats and 3 different designs to me. Waiting for more pics from the Italian.

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12 minutes ago, Lakrass said:

yysw264457.jpg

Italian is more like a daggerboard in the middle of rather flat bottom and Kiwi's boat has a "rounder" belly. Looks like 3 boats and 3 different designs to me. Waiting for more pics from the Italian.

The aggressive anhedral of the foils helps to open up the superposition region where cavitation may be an issue. The tips seem to compensate for this and maybe return some roll stability. 

The keel continues to just in front of the rudder. Doesn't look maneuverable in displacement mode.. wonder what the advantage is. 

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18 minutes ago, JonRowe said:

Launch is at 2 so assume 30 minutes of waffle before the christening, then speech with a bottle of fizz on the bow, then move waffle?

This is italia... we maka you waita..relax..

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The one thing you can count on from the Italians is their boats will look fantastic.  Even with yellow foil arms and rudder.

WetHog  :ph34r:

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1 minute ago, Purple Headed Warrior said:

I take it back... she nailed it!

She nailed the microphone pretty good a moment before, christ.  

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image.png.a892019e5c7544450ea13b4e9c100c8b.png

No fellow anarchist on a boat in the background? In the crowd? Anywhere to get other angles than the one from live coverage?

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From Farevela's fb page

71172853_3029548473726143_4103527362233106432_n.jpg

71224103_3029548453726145_4379340223427903488_n.jpg

71313878_3029548700392787_7594846044530147328_n.jpg

71347872_3029548610392796_5988808110125350912_n.jpg

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Minor remark: apparently, Italy doesn’t share the US requirement that a painted flag should have the staff side toward the bow. So, on starboard the staff (green) segment is aft - had noticed that on a previous LR boat

 

OTT, I see absolutely nothing that would jusify Max Sirena’s claim they delayed launching by one full month so that the competition wouldn’t copy them ...

 

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I see they have the torpedo foils.  Could have delayed the launch after seeing the AM foils!  They can only splash 6 foils and may have realized the NZ type foil was inferior?

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Three super-high quality boats launched - amazing effort from these teams interpreting a new rule.

ETNZ are an outlier in respect of their foil design.

AM do not have the bustle - a more aero hull.

It will be really interesting to se the next iteration of these boats.

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6 minutes ago, theParadoxOfThrift said:

Three super-high quality boats launched - amazing effort from these teams interpreting a new rule.

ETNZ are an outlier in respect of their foil design.

AM do not have the bustle - a more aero hull.

It will be really interesting to se the next iteration of these boats.

I would find it even more interesting to see them sail against each others.

 

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24 minutes ago, Herfy said:

I see they have the torpedo foils.  Could have delayed the launch after seeing the AM foils!  They can only splash 6 foils and may have realized the NZ type foil was inferior?

Torpedo not a foil. Can't see the point unless to add some lead ballast or as structural support for the foils.

Do the Italian foils have less area than TNZ and AM. Seems to look like it.

As for hull shape if the aim is to sail the majority or all the race flying, then the Italian hull looks like more drag.

Also surprised that they are not using two different foil designs on either side. With the limit on the total number allowed seems a sensible  choice by TNZ

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*ahem* I'll just leave this here

*hack splutter*

I thought it might be more subtle but didn't pick a sharp ridge like that :blink:

 

I feel that the idea of the central bulge must have been a concept that was shared one way or the other between TNZ & LR.

Maybe from personnel changes or as part of exploring the shapes possible within proposed rules?

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from https://www.sail-world.com/news/222696/Americas-Cup-Luna-Rossa-launch-first-AC75

The Challenger of Record for the 36th America's Cup, Luna Rossa Prada Pirelli has launched their first AC75 in Cagliari, Sardinia.

The hull is a different design treatment than the first two launched by Emirates Team New Zealand and NYYC American Magic. The bow is reminiscent almost of an IACC yacht, with a very soft treatment, however about a third of the way back a crease starts in the hull which appears, from the video to develop into a bustle coming into a skeg-like structure in the centre of the transom, ending just ahead of the rudder.

(contd)

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This will be a very interesting cycle.

Like the first cycle of the IACC when we saw, "short skiffs" (TNZ), "heavy/long/narrow" (USA) and the "aircraft carrier" (ITA).....  

Capture5.PNG.7d232f1f0d69c6af770fa3613850584b.PNGCapture4.PNG.95ddc8c8010cb60bc20a3607b3b3d908.PNG

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1 hour ago, Herfy said:

I see they have the torpedo foils.

The work on the Italian bulbs seems much cleaner than that of Defiant's which looked rather rough. May be the Italians have greater skill here? Hard to see any sign of a movable flap on their foils. Are they permitted to rotate the entire wing?

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27 minutes ago, Rennmaus said:

What's her name?

Luna Rossa apparently. 

From a Gtran of https://www.gazzetta.it/vela/02-10-2019/coppa-america-varo-luna-rossa-tronchetti-tecnologia-tutta-italiana-3402972766132.shtml?refresh_ce-cp

Punta Ala, Auckland, Cagliari: Luna Rossa number 8, in the fifth America's Cup of the Prada series goes into the water in the early afternoon of Cagliari in the presence of an impetuous Mistral. 

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3 minutes ago, Stingray~ said:

Luna Rossa apparently. 

From a Gtran of https://www.gazzetta.it/vela/02-10-2019/coppa-america-varo-luna-rossa-tronchetti-tecnologia-tutta-italiana-3402972766132.shtml?refresh_ce-cp

Punta Ala, Auckland, Cagliari: Luna Rossa number 8, in the fifth America's Cup of the Prada series goes into the water in the early afternoon of Cagliari in the presence of an impetuous Mistral. 

Ah, o.k., thanks.
LR8. Good for tradition :wub:

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8 minutes ago, Stingray~ said:

we focused more on hydro-dynamism than on aspect of air performance ".

Hydrodynamics - the motion of fluids and the forces acting on solid bodies immersed in fluids.

Does this mean the Italians think the hull will be in the water more than the other teams?

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4 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

we focused more on hydro-dynamism than on aspect of air performance ".

Hydrodynamics - the motion of fluids and the forces acting on solid bodies immersed in fluids.

Does this mean the Italians think the hull will be in the water more than the other teams?

Yes, that caught my eye too, interesting.

Another pic 

luna-rossa-AC75-2019-cagliari_05.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

we focused more on hydro-dynamism than on aspect of air performance ".

Hydrodynamics - the motion of fluids and the forces acting on solid bodies immersed in fluids.

Does this mean the Italians think the hull will be in the water more than the other teams?

The way I read his comment in italian is that it is about minimizing drag at takeoff, but not sure.

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Just now, 17mika said:

The way I read his comment in italian is that it is about minimizing drag at takeoff, but not sure.

Thanks, would make sense.

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9 minutes ago, Tropical Madness said:

Has to be fast...

BFXYWT.jpg

That's more of a Flipper belly than the sharp Luna Rossa crease

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4 minutes ago, 17mika said:

The way I read his comment in italian is that it is about minimizing drag at takeoff, but not sure.

That would seem logical.

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1 hour ago, DHFiend said:

This will be a very interesting cycle.

Like the first cycle of the IACC when we saw, "short skiffs" (TNZ), "heavy/long/narrow" (USA) and the "aircraft carrier" (ITA).....  

Capture5.PNG.7d232f1f0d69c6af770fa3613850584b.PNGCapture4.PNG.95ddc8c8010cb60bc20a3607b3b3d908.PNG

Looks more like the shape of a tuna than a sardine. 

 

Flipper - Orca - Tuna - TBD*

*(I still like Oil Spill, regardless of shape, for the frackers)

 

 

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14 minutes ago, 2Newts said:

Flipper - Orca - Tuna - TBD*

*(I still like Oil Spill, regardless of shape, for the frackers)

Slick?

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Is it just me, or the bottom of the boat seems far from being smooth? It looks sort of unfinished. 

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1 hour ago, Stingray~ said:

Luna Rossa apparently. 

Its not Luna Rossa Pirelli?  ;)

WetHog  :ph34r:

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Interesting curvature of the deck from bow to stern.

But it passed its first test, it floats!

WetHog  :ph34r:

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1 hour ago, Horn Rock said:

The work on the Italian bulbs seems much cleaner than that of Defiant's which looked rather rough. May be the Italians have greater skill here? Hard to see any sign of a movable flap on their foils. Are they permitted to rotate the entire wing?

Are you sure about that?  The LR foil looks more like a couple of fins stuck onto a symmetrical bulb.  The AM foils look to have a very intentional design that looks more like a bird in flight with flaps.

 

lr foil a.jpg

am foil.jpg

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What difference does it make what the foils look like now?  These are just testing foils and the foils that matter won't be advertised, right?

WetHog  :ph34r:

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3 minutes ago, Stingray~ said:

771A5BC1-700B-491D-A36C-64F8EAEBC090.thumb.jpeg.8da83dfc9b4f0066907b8e67d9d5e3de.jpeg

 

 

Is the boat tipping towards the camera, or is that just an optical illusion?

 

It is interesting how the decks of the three boats are very similar, with the AM being just a bit more rounded on the edges.

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3 hours ago, theParadoxOfThrift said:

Three super-high quality boats launched - amazing effort from these teams interpreting a new rule.

ETNZ are an outlier in respect of their foil design.

AM do not have the bustle - a more aero hull.

It will be really interesting to se the next iteration of these boats.

AM are the outlier in terms of things that matter.  They're starting to look like they've missed a trick with their hull design.

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1 minute ago, WetHog said:

What difference does it make what the foils look like now?  These are just testing foils and the foils that matter won't be advertised, right?

WetHog  :ph34r:

they can only make 6 foils!

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2 minutes ago, Ex-yachtie said:

AM are the outlier in terms of things that matter.  They're starting to look like they've missed a trick with their hull design.

Or they plan on it being out of the water more than the other teams.  They could be the ones that figured out the trick.

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17 minutes ago, Herfy said:

they can only make 6 foils!

Which makes it interesting that LR launched with 2 identical foils, apparently and assuming they are real.

Perhaps, since they like AM have torpedos, they can do a lot with fins because of how much weight is concentrated in them and could remain unmodified? edit: I see that was pointed out above already

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