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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

99 posts in this topic

Now there are three trimarans using a lifting foil on the daggerboard: Fire Arrow, Maserati and  the 105' Gitana 17! This is the first full size trimaran designed from scratch with a lifting foil on the daggerboard. The design, by Guillaume Verdier is a breakthru maxi tri .

More info on the boat: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/gitana-17-100-trimaran-foiler-launch-7-17-17.58231/

Gitana's daggerboard with lifting foil-the new standard in fast trimarans:

Gitana 17-daggerboard foil.jpg

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Cant wait to see this thing sailing. Should break some serious records. In someway she comes at a time when the big multi's are ready to take the next step. Everything Guillaume Verdier is involved with is turning to Gold. Comanche is breaking records in the mono world and I suspect this thing will do the same if it can hang together. Breaking the lifting foil on the daggerboard in todays oceans will be the challenge.

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6 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Now there are three trimarans using a lifting foil on the daggerboard: Fire Arrow, Maserati and  the 105' Gitana 17! This is the first full size trimaran designed from scratch with a lifting foil on the daggerboard. The design, by Guillaume Verdier is a breakthru maxi tri .

More info on the boat: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/gitana-17-100-trimaran-foiler-launch-7-17-17.58231/

Gitana's daggerboard with lifting foil-the new standard in fast trimarans:

Gitana 17-daggerboard foil.jpg

Oh my god - you are a total fucking joke.................

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Fucking dusty mantlepiece Fire Arrow toy? Just spewed my beer over the screen. Have you no shame LoRd of foiols? No need to answer that.

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One of the most significant elements of the Fire Arrow Foil System in addition to the daggerboard foil and rudder T-foil are the UptiP ama foils based on the discovery of a self-stabilizing foil by TNZ in 2010 or 11. In this video Guillaume Verdier discusses the ama foils for G17 and mentions that they are also based on the technology discovered by TNZ: https://www.facebook.com/yachtingworldmagazine/videos/vb.111913865558561/1425355727547695/?type=2&theater

Fire Arrow UptiP ama foil based on the self-stabilizing foil discovered by TNZ:

MPX ama + ama = cat --foil comparison 011.JPG

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I have a $500.00 challenge for you Doug my marblehead 50 R/c boat against the FA in an 50 yard W/L 

coarse any wind strength any time

PL. 

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Doug

Thanks for posting. Interesting.

You keep getting very excited about these foiling tris but you won't tackle the questions being asked. Maserati failed, yet again, to deliver the goods and was beaten by 2 non foilers. The broken rudder didn't make much difference because it was the starboard one and they were on starboard tack much of the time, and they were behind when it happened. I am sure they might win one day, but they aren't looking like a good all round boat and it seems like they need ideal conditions which appear to be hard to find.

I was concerned for your health because you disappeared from both the AC foil discussions and the Maserati thread. I hope there wasn't anything wrong and that the only reason you stopped posting is because you had been so wrong on both subjects.

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I am not sure that with these bigocean crushing trimarans moving to full foiling makes much sense honestly. They are already so fast I have doubts about the gains, and if they start going to much faster they are going to need super-cavitating foils or start blowing the foils apart. 

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Great clip. thank you.

I think one of the most important things he mentions is, getting a higher average speed, rather then getting the highest speed..

It will be very cool to watch this tri develop over the next few years...

 

awesome..

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The central dagger T foil appears to be proportionately quite small and elongated "fish plate" shape in plan form, like stingray (aquatic not limitless poster here), nothing like the ugly and extremist contraptions on the LoRd's thing. Interesting that in early art rendering illustrations Gitana's main dagger was very high aspect ratio and conventional. Presumably the draft will be less on the new dagger design because of end plate effect. Rudder T foil also seems to follow same main dagger philosophy.596ee882d32c7_gitanamaindaggercopy.jpg.5bb02fa8b73e588d9abc78d7fcd710fb.jpg

Gitanarudderfoilcopy.jpg

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I'll add another $500 to the above 50 yard w/l FA challenge.  Winner take all?  

And Dougie, you still haven't answered the simple question I posed a while back--In the last 24 months, how many hours have YOU spent successfully foiling either full size or r/c? 

Or how about this even simpler question--name any regional, national or international race won by any boat at any time designed by you? How about a part designed by you? 

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DoUg will be bankrupted with the giant fail? So cruel?

 

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9 minutes ago, Tom Corbett said:

And Dougie, you still haven't answered the simple question I posed a while back--In the last 24 months, how many hours have YOU spent successfully foiling either full size or r/c? 

Please don't ask that because he is a proven liar when it comes to his sailing. Last year, he made a claim of the number of hours he had done in a Rave. The funny thing is, that 2 years previously, he had made another such claim, so it was easy to see how much he had sailed a Rave over the intervening 2 years. It worked out at something like 16 hours per week, every week for 2 years. He didn't even own a Rave over that period. Strangely, he never got back to us with an explanation of that one. No doubt he will now post his standard "you are a liar and don't know what you are talking about" response. :D

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Guys, admit it, without the Lord, you would not be discussing the merits of foiling or non foiling on Gitana 17. Take a lot of what he says with a pinch of caution, but he does bring discussion to the table which is more than I can say for a lot of the anti Lord postings you see.

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For gosh sakes its talked about in multiple other threads so no his endless cut and paste and reposting of videos does not add anything except for clutter, but yea, just put him on ignore so you don't have to read his idiocy and hopefully can stop commenting on him.  Geeze, its a cool boat and instead the thread becomes about the nutjob.

Like Keith I find it interesting that in the YachtWorld video they claim to be almost 100% focused not on increasing the top speed, but rather on making the boat have higher average speeds over longer periods and be self-sustaining (foiling) for single-handing.  Really interesting that he said the faster platform would be a catmaran - not a tri - but they can't make the cat self sustaining for single handed sailing (but that seems to suggest for a RTW fully crewed attempt he thinks a cat would have higher top end and higher averages than the tri.

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7 hours ago, Wess said:

For gosh sakes its talked about in multiple other threads so no his endless cut and paste and reposting of videos does not add anything except for clutter, but yea, just put him on ignore so you don't have to read his idiocy and hopefully can stop commenting on him.  Geeze, its a cool boat and instead the thread becomes about the nutjob.

Like Keith I find it interesting that in the YachtWorld video they claim to be almost 100% focused not on increasing the top speed, but rather on making the boat have higher average speeds over longer periods and be self-sustaining (foiling) for single-handing.  Really interesting that he said the faster platform would be a catmaran - not a tri - but they can't make the cat self sustaining for single handed sailing (but that seems to suggest for a RTW fully crewed attempt he thinks a cat would have higher top end and higher averages than the tri.

They way I heard it the cat would be faster unless you had to have the hulls in the water due to seastate if the tri has to come off the foils in the same conditions it would be faster, at least that's the way I heard it

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9 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Guys, admit it, without the Lord, you would not be discussing the merits of foiling or non foiling on Gitana 17. Take a lot of what he says with a pinch of caution, but he does bring discussion to the table which is more than I can say for a lot of the anti Lord postings you see.

I disagree.  Besides people bringing his name up the whole time he was gone, I feel the thread was better off.  If his absence was given a few more weeks, his name would have likely been vented out completely as it has been with other unmentionables in the past.  He's the biggest distraction from any real discussion or exchange of ideas I've ever seen on SA.  It's already chaos in here without him.  Just my opinion.

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16 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Guys, admit it, without the Lord, you would not be discussing the merits of foiling or non foiling on Gitana 17. 

I disagree. Doug sometimes beats people to be first to post because he is obsessed, but without him, it does get discussed. Waiting a few more hours before the subject comes up seems like a small price to pay for him not posting his rubbish. I readily acknowledged his was an interesting post, but why did he need to pollute the thread with his lawn ornament? I have no problem with Doug posting as such. I have a problem with 2 things, such as his constant posting of his models, as if they have any relevance at all. Even then, post once and that is fine but the 2 most posted photos on Sailing anarchy his because he posts them time and again. The other thing is that if you disagree with him he abuses you, saying you are a fool or idiot and that you don't understand. He has proven to be so wrong with both the AC foils and Maserati that it isn't surprising people are fighting back. 

I follow what you and others discuss about foiling beach cats like the A's and S9. Since Doug has stopped posting on those threads, the discussions have become a lot better and I have learnt so much more. That in itself tells us that without Doug, it would be better.

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I've been dealing with Doug for over twenty years now from his days when he was getting banned from r/c sailng forums.   Fact is he derives his entire self worth from his internet postings and the underlying reasons for all his posts is to try and validate what from all indications is a very small life,. Notice how he claims that his ideas, designs or boats are at the heart of a technological revolution.  Notice how he is incapable of dealing rationally with anyone who suggests that his theories are unworkable or wrong.  Notice how he tries to drag others into his fantasy designs or plans that never reach fruition in the real world.  It is all part of the same, sad pattern of a man desperately trying to validate himself.

Unfirtunately for the rest of us this means he is also incapable of engaging in rational, reasonable reasoned discussions.  Further, it means he will never go away for his posting is his being.   I have found after all these years there are only a few ways to deal with Doug.  First, is to not engage. This is the first rule you are given when dealing with a disturbed personality.  Ignore them. If no one responds to Doug's posts, he will eventually move on to another website.  Second, if you really want to say something, respond only with humor or even ridicule.  For example, make fun of his stupid names and graphics.  Suggest that he needs to move out of his basement room,  Put up a clock showing how many days since one of his boats sailed.  He has no sense of humor whatsoever and his responses will usually be so hate filled that he is likely to be banned.  Third, and finally, challenge him to put his money where his mouth is.  For twenty years I've offered to race his creations at stakes as high as $10,000.  I've offered to pay his airfare to attend races and demonstrate his work.  Doug Lord has never agreed and has never appeared.

I'll end by following my own advice--Hey Dougie, Pizza Boy, there is a $1000 on the table to get you to race your lawn ornament.  Wanna bet you stay in the basement?  Yes, it's a revolution, and you are not a part of it....

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Good analysis, Tom ... however everyone here has worked out the twisted mentality of the Lord of Fooling    so I guess we are perverse in responding to his wacko defecation. Does that make us bonkers too? However you are dreaming if you think ignoring the turkey well induce him to swing to something else. This has been suggested before with zero success. And yet we keep trying, sigh.

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17 sails-but with only one ama foil:

 

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On 8/13/2017 at 9:58 AM, Doug Lord said:

An interesting interview .. thanks Doug .. It seems that they have a lot of work ahead to develop foils for ocean racing ..

"We have tools for that; We must develop them. This is the biggest technological difficulty. That's what we did with Team New Zealand but we were 80 people! We have to get the quintessence of what we have been able to do with Team New Zealand and transpose it here.

Voilesetvoiliers.com: What is Team New Zealand in this boat? 
GV: The knowledge we have acquired: profiles, how a foiler works.

Voilesetvoiliers.com: And, as on Emirates Team New Zealand's ClassAC, the aerodynamics were very careful ... 
GV: And it's far from over! It still lacks many fairings, especially on the rear beams.
"

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Gitana Foils:

Gitana 17 is the third trimaran to make use of the foil configuration similar to the basic Fire Arrow Foil system. Both Maserati and Gitana's foil systems were designed by Guillaume Verdier, with the Fire Arrow Test Model the first tri of any size to use the basic System.

---Gitana has 3 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, a daggerboard foil with adjustable flap(probably capable of downforce) and two UptiP ama foils(one used at a time). This boat is the first fullsize trimaran to be designed from scratch to use this foil configuration.

---Maserati, a modified MOD 70, has 2 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, an all-moving daggerboard foil(no flap) capable of downforce, and two ama "L" foils installed at an angle so that when they go thru the water they work like an UptiP foil(one used at a time),

---Fire Arrow Test Model and WOLF- Uses one rudder T-foil with no flap and a wand controlled daggerboard foil, with two UptiP ama foils used one at a time.Designed to fly at an angle of heel so the UptiP foils don't have to be retracted/deployed with each tack or gybe as with the other two boats using the basic system.   More here: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-173

==========================

Looking forward to flying pictures of Gitana 17 soon...

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Have Gitana or Maserati ever confirmed that they use the daggerboard foils for down force and not just lift?

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22 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Gitana Foils:

Gitana 17 is the third trimaran to make use of the foil configuration similar to the basic Fire Arrow Foil system. Both Maserati and Gitana's foil systems were designed by Guillaume Verdier, with the Fire Arrow Test Model the first tri of any size to use the basic System.

---Gitana has 3 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, a daggerboard foil with adjustable flap(probably capable of downforce) and two UptiP ama foils(one used at a time). This boat is the first fullsize trimaran to be designed from scratch to use this foil configuration.

---Maserati, a modified MOD 70, has 2 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, an all-moving daggerboard foil(no flap) capable of downforce, and two ama "L" foils installed at an angle so that when they go thru the water they work like an UptiP foil(one used at a time),

---Fire Arrow Test Model and WOLF- Uses one rudder T-foil with no flap and a wand controlled daggerboard foil, with two UptiP ama foils used one at a time.Designed to fly at an angle of heel so the UptiP foils don't have to be retracted/deployed with each tack or gybe as with the other two boats using the basic system.   More here: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-173

==========================

Looking forward to flying pictures of Gitana 17 soon...

Doug making up his own press releases!!

 

YCMTSU!:lol:

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Great interview with Guillaume verdier-in english:     (click for sound)

 

 

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On 8/19/2017 at 4:41 AM, swangtang said:

Have Gitana or Maserati ever confirmed that they use the daggerboard foils for down force and not just lift?

No. I believe Maserati said it's possible (obviously), but they would not be trying it anytime soon.

On 8/19/2017 at 9:52 PM, mad said:

Doug making up his own press releases!!

YCMTSU!:lol:

It's his modus operandi: things get quite so he posts more regurgitated crap as if it mattered. His comparison of his thought bubble to fully operational offshore racing trimarans backed by multi-million Euro campaigns pretty much sums him up. I think his boat will be a hoot to foil jibe as it rolls through 20° when the main comes over. Let him fix that with downforce on the main foil.

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Good to see he named it with the performance expectation in mind.

opps, I read it as WOOF only ever skim read his senseless crap

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On 8/18/2017 at 2:41 PM, swangtang said:

Have Gitana or Maserati ever confirmed that they use the daggerboard foils for down force and not just lift?

Guillaume Verdier has to me about Maserati but said words to the effect that you have to be real careful when using it.

Maserati's daggerboard foil is an "all-moving foil" while Gitana's main foil has a flap that also allows downforce.

Fire Arrow/ WOLF uses a dual wand controlled main foil and can develop tremendous downforce( a high percentage of total mainfoil lift).

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Great shot,remenich-thanks! Interesting that they have the tip of the port UptiP ama foil blurred out. First 100+ foot sailing foiler-incredible!

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Gitana Foiling!      picture by Yann Riou----see port foil in the circle-blurred. Stb foil tip is just at the surface-really big foil!

Gitana Foiling! - Copy.jpg

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You know Dougie, if I post a still picture of my cat jumping off the sofa, that really isn't proof that he can fly.  Or is it on your planet? 

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FFS DoUg, please start on your 18 foot or whatever length it is version of your pond toy; it may reduce your continual flood of wacko postings here?

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More great stuff on Gitana 17 here:    http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?/topic/185953-gitana-maxi-17/#comment-5900040

What an incredible breakthru foiling tri!!!!!! Nothing like it anywhere in the world outside of France......and Florida!

 

picture by Yann Riou:

Gitana 17---photo-yann-riou-gitana-s-a_3574663_771x434p.jpg

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Dougie here is your chance to prove us all wrong. Since you claim you have a foiling tri in Florida, please post a video, taken anytime in the last six months showing your boat foiling for one minute or more.  No stills, no video from two years ago, no crayon drawings (I assume you aren't allowed pointy objects where you currently reside).  A simple recent video of your boat showing sustained foiling and I will start the ball rolling and proclaim you a visionary here and anywhere else you like. 

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Pigs can fly like angels ... in wacko fantasy-land?

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2 hours ago, Tom Corbett said:

Dougie here is your chance to prove us all wrong. Since you claim you have a foiling tri in Florida, please post a video, taken anytime in the last six months showing your boat foiling for one minute or more.  No stills, no video from two years ago, no crayon drawings (I assume you aren't allowed pointy objects where you currently reside).  A simple recent video of your boat showing sustained foiling and I will start the ball rolling and proclaim you a visionary here and anywhere else you like. 

That's grossly unfair! Be reasonable. Doug should be allowed to post any video of any of his foiling boats from the last 10 years that show the boat foiling for a minute or 250 yards if that is under 1 minute. Really, any video evidence of reasonably recent sustained flight will do. I will predict you will see nothing because in all the time he has been posting on this forum, he has never achieved that.

What amuses me about Dougs little lawn ornament is that he deliberately heals it to leeward when almost everybody else in the foiling world does everything they can not to heal because the resultant loads from the rig significantly hurt foiling (watch him now post irrelevant pictures of completely different foilers that doesn't apply to ;) )

 

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You need to catch up, DoUg; Technique Avances and l'Hydroptere .... from around the turn of this Century; in fact TA would be in the 1990s. But don't let historical reality bother your weird mentality?

techniques advance copy.jpg

Hydroptere.jpg

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8 hours ago, Groucho Marx said:

You need to catch up, DoUg; Technique Avances and l'Hydroptere .... from around the turn of this Century; in fact TA would be in the 1990s. But don't let historical reality bother your weird mentality?

 

 

Mr. Frog, I 'm surprised you would even bring them up since their foil systems are absolutely NOTHING like the Gitana foil system and NOTHING like the boat from Florida!!

And the foil system on the Fire Arrow(the boat from Florida) and on Gitana 17 are basically the same-the most revolutionary foil system ever used on trimarans designed for it from scratch! Speaking of catching up!?

Both Gitana 17 and Fire Arrow use UptiP ama foils, an adjustable lifting foil on the daggerboard and one or more rudder t-foils; They are the ONLY trimarans in the world designed from scratch for this basic foil configuration.

 

Gitana picture by Yann Riou, Fire Arrow picture by Doug Lord/Dan Burke:

Gitana Foiling!.jpg

MPX_Fire_Arrow-First_Full_Flying_Foiling_on_video-7-24-14_011.JPG

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And when and for how long did your lawn ornament last sail?   Last I checked, you can't call it a boat if it isn't in the water.  

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The Lord of Fools; who gives a rat's flatulence about your uptip/downtip nonsense; the major point is these large foiling boats (with downtip foils) were flying before your lawn toy fantasies had entered your copyist brain.

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Doug

Please can you shut up all the non believers by posting video of one of your boats foiling continuously for at least 1 minute. It shouldn't be hard to do. Either you have achieved that or you haven't. If you haven't, your boat is nothing like Maserati and Gitana. We know their boats work because we have seen the videos. A photo doesn't prove a single thing. To date, the longest flight we have seen from yours is 15 seconds, which proves nothing at all. Has it ever foiled over any meaningful distance?

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On 8/28/2017 at 8:34 AM, Doug Lord said:

Mr. Frog, I 'm surprised you would even bring them up since their foil systems are absolutely NOTHING like the Gitana foil system and NOTHING like the boat from Florida!!

And the foil system on the Fire Arrow(the boat from Florida) and on Gitana 17 are basically the same-the most revolutionary foil system ever used on trimarans designed for it from scratch! Speaking of catching up!?

Both Gitana 17 and Fire Arrow use UptiP ama foils, an adjustable lifting foil on the daggerboard and one or more rudder t-foils; They are the ONLY trimarans in the world designed from scratch for this basic foil configuration.

 

Gitana picture by Yann Riou, Fire Arrow picture by Doug Lord/Dan Burke:

Gitana Foiling!.jpg

MPX_Fire_Arrow-First_Full_Flying_Foiling_on_video-7-24-14_011.JPG

Unfortunately, there is no video of Gitana foiling ,that I know of, so a few of the anonymous "lack-a-brain's" around here will probably say she's not really foiling.

However, I think the poor bastards that say that would be wrong.............

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Sympathy for Guillaume Verdier with this demented lunatic (yes, it is a revolution, Wolf, daughter of Fire Arrow, ffs) associating his erratic nose diving pond toys with Verdier's brilliant work. 

The comparison is such that there is no comparison?

Hopefully next month the crazed loon will have discovered another designer to fixate upon?

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15 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Unfortunately, there is no video of Gitana foiling ,that I know of, so a few of the anonymous "lack-a-brain's" around here will probably say she's not really foiling.

However, I think the poor bastards that say that would be wrong.............

Videos of Gitana sailing in 2017 - 1

Videos of Doug Lord sailing in 2017 - 0, 2016 - 0, 2015 - 0, 2014 - 0, 2013 - 0, 2012 - 0, 2011 - 0, 2010 - 0, 2009 - 0, 2008 - 0, 2007 - 0, 2006 - 0, 2005 - 0, 2004 - 0, 2003 - 0, 2002 - 0, 2001 - 0, 2000 - 0, 1999 - 0, 1998 - 0, 1997 - 0, 1996 - 0, 1995 - 0, 1994 - 0, 1993 - 0, 1992 - 0, 1991 - 0...

Most recent photo of Gitana foiling - 27.08.2017

Most recent photo of Doug Lord foiling - xx.xx.xxxx (photo does not exist)

Posts on SA by GV - 0

Posts on SA by DL - 10,957

DL, Why can't you be more like Guillaume Verdier?

Sailors respect for Guillaume Verdier is very high.

Sailors respect for Doug Lord is non-existent.

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A foil system designed from scratch like no other full size tri-an extraordinary ocean going configuration:

picture by Yann Riou

Gitana foiling 3 yann riou.jpg

 

---Gitana 17 is the third trimaran to make use of the foil configuration similar to the basic Fire Arrow Foil system. Both Maserati and Gitana's foil systems were designed by Guillaume Verdier, with the Fire Arrow Test Model the first tri of any size to use the basic System.

---Gitana 17 has 3 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, a daggerboard foil with adjustable flap(probably capable of downforce) and two UptiP ama foils(one used at a time). This boat is the first fullsize trimaran to be designed from scratch to use this foil configuration.

---Maserati, a modified MOD 70, has 2 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, an all-moving daggerboard foil(no flap) capable of downforce, and two ama "L" foils installed at an angle so that when they go thru the water they work like an UptiP foil(one used at a time),

---Fire Arrow Test Model and WOLF- Use one rudder T-foil with no flap and a wand controlled daggerboard foil, with two UptiP ama foils used one at a time.Designed to fly at an angle of heel so the UptiP foils don't have to be retracted/deployed with each tack or gybe as with the other two boats using the basic system.   More here: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-173

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4 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

---Gitana 17 is the third trimaran to make use of the foil configuration similar to the basic Fire Arrow Foil system. Both Maserati and Gitana's foil systems were designed by Guillaume Verdier, with the Fire Arrow Test Model the first tri of any size to use the basic System.

---Gitana 17 has 3 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, a daggerboard foil with adjustable flap(probably capable of downforce) and two UptiP ama foils(one used at a time). This boat is the first fullsize trimaran to be designed from scratch to use this foil configuration.

---Maserati, a modified MOD 70, has 2 rudder t-foils with adjustable flaps, an all-moving daggerboard foil(no flap) capable of downforce, and two ama "L" foils installed at an angle so that when they go thru the water they work like an UptiP foil(one used at a time),

---Fire Arrow Test Model and WOLF- Use one rudder T-foil with no flap and a wand controlled daggerboard foil, with two UptiP ama foils used one at a time.Designed to fly at an angle of heel so the UptiP foils don't have to be retracted/deployed with each tack or gybe as with the other two boats using the basic system.   More here: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-173

Let's see if I have this right

Gitana 17 - proven foiling system that works. The boat has been seen foiling for extended periods of more than 17 seconds

Maserati - proven foiling system that works. The boat has been seen foiling for extended periods of more than 17 seconds

Fire Arrow Lawn Ornament - unproven foiling system. The boat has never foiled for more than 16 seconds and video shows as many crashes as it does brief periods of unstable foiling.

 

Doug - Until you can show your model actually foiling for a decent length of time in variable conditions, you cannot make the claims you do for your design without looking stupid. You claim your system is substantially the same as the Gitana and Maserati, but the biggest fail of your boat is that unlike the other 2, it does not foil properly. Until you can show us that it does, you will be considered a fraud. Photos don't cut it. Short videos don't cut it. The thing most obvious to everybody is that you don't even make claims of extended flight. Even more noticeable is that in all the years you have made claims of design and building foilers, you have never provided any evidence at all of them working.

People are tired of your incessant lies and attempts at claiming credibility through the work of others. Claims are really easy to back up but you never do that. Instead, you tell lies and use the work of others in an attempt to make claims for your own work. So put up or shut up.

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Hoping for change from LordofFools is like farting against continuous brain numbing thunder, GBR?

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remenich, you've come up with some great stuff and this is the best yet-great video of this remarkably innovative trimaran!! Thanks...

Haven't yet seen a good, clear picture from front or back of the UptiP ama foils....

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Have you no shame Doug?  Putting yourself in the same class as real world yacht designers?  Come on.  You can not show a minute of your Fire Arrow in sustained foiling mode.  You won't show up to race any of your innovations even when you are offered $1000 and more to do so. You haven't even sailed one of your boats for at least two years.  Living in your own head isn't living.   Posting on the internet isn't the real world.   Move out of the basement, prove yourself in the real world and then post something.  Until then STFU.

Oh, and the photos of the full size boats you say you designed over 30 years ago that you posted on the toy boat forum, those boats are ugly as shit...

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Found that great video on youtube

 

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We've heard Guilliame Verdier explain politely and eloquently about his latest work Gitana 17  ... but with this girlish teenager-like LoFooils gushing endlessly and without embarrassment, plus self-importantly aligning himself beside (maybe even a little ahead?) of the real-world designer, Verdier must be wondering, where did I go wrong, how do I deserve this? LoFool's infatuation is like the kiss of death?

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I have a question and a request...

I have DouG on ignore (it's fantastic) but unfortunately some of you here quoting him which I can see... so

Request: Please all ignore him and stop quoting him and then he ceases to exist.... problem solved.

Question: Can I start a thread and exclude certain people from my thread (DouG)...?

Thanks

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Groucho, put doug on ignore. It really cleans up threads and makes them readable, it surprised me how much of a difference it makes. save for those threads that are really more about complaining about him.

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13 hours ago, PIL007 said:

I have a question and a request...

I have DouG on ignore (it's fantastic) but unfortunately some of you here quoting him which I can see... so

Request: Please all ignore him and stop quoting him and then he ceases to exist.... problem solved.

Question: Can I start a thread and exclude certain people from my thread (DouG)...?

Thanks

 

1 hour ago, sail(plane) said:

Groucho, put doug on ignore. It really cleans up threads and makes them readable, it surprised me how much of a difference it makes. save for those threads that are really more about complaining about him.

Yes.  Plus 1.

Otherwise every thread become about the iDiOcY his self aggrandizement.

He is a proven fool but he ain't going away (SA must love the endless copy and paste upping the post count). Just ignore him so he doesn't wreck otherwise good threads..

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The rudder t-foils and main foil have adjustable flaps-the UptiP foils probably don't but the lee ama foil would have rake adjustment.

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From Foilers!(Fred Monsonnec) first pictures of Gitana ama foil. Look at the tip very closely in both pictures !

https://foils.wordpress.com/

gitana-17-foil-babord-f-monsonnec-04-04-17.jpg

 

 


 

gitana-17-vue-arric3a8re-photo-2-f-monsonnec-04-04-17.jpg

  •  
  •  
Fire Arrow UptiP ama foil 2013

MPX ama + ama = cat --foil comparison 011.JPG

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5 minutes ago, Doug Lord said:

From Foilers!(Fred Monsonnec) first pictures of Gitana ama foil. Look at the tip very closely in both pictures !

https://foils.wordpress.com/

gitana-17-foil-babord-f-monsonnec-04-04-17.jpg

 

 


 

gitana-17-vue-arric3a8re-photo-2-f-monsonnec-04-04-17.jpg

  •  
  •  
Fire Arrow UptiP ama foil 2013

MPX ama + ama = cat --foil comparison 011.JPG

DownTiP foils:D

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Something to consider:

gitana-17-vue-arric3a8re-photo-2-f-monsonnec-04-04-17 - Copy.jpg

MPX_Foiling--_Foil_Assist-Flying_Main_hull_Over_Powered_009.JPG

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7 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Something to consider:

gitana-17-vue-arric3a8re-photo-2-f-monsonnec-04-04-17 - Copy.jpg

MPX_Foiling--_Foil_Assist-Flying_Main_hull_Over_Powered_009.JPG

Consider?

What the fuck is there to consider mate?

YOU COPIED ETNZs AC72 foil when you made those foils.

Yours look nothing like gitana foils, yours look everything like the ones you copied ETNZ's AC72 boards.

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=imgres&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiUjPuIso_WAhUFpJQKHY7KAMsQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pointwise.com%2Ftheconnector%2FJuly-2013%2FEmirates-Team-New-Zealand.shtml&psig=AFQjCNFEk5XNCsMpZpuWL2JCckOYcemnWA&ust=1504747142607189

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I considered typing into google your name and TNZ foil DL, and instead I ended up with a literal drawing, by you, stating where you took your foil design from. Ironically a bloke hired by them to design foils was the bloke who designed the foils for Gitana.

Fucking hilarious.

Thank you for literally showing where you stole your design from. I mean literally writing on one of your drawings where you copied the design from.

Apologies to everyone else, he's on block, just getting a little tired of this shit.

Tantra 2014 UptiP foils 002.JPG

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Me, Martin Fischer and a half dozen others have designed their own version of the fantastic TNZ foil. But I was one of the first to use a droop tip(NOT ON THE TNZ FOIL*) and was, without a doubt the first to incorporate the basic TNZ UptiP foil on a trimaran ama. 

The "bloke who designed the foils for Gitana" didn't just do that-Guillaume Verdier designed the whole boat- incorporating, for the first time, a three point foil system utilizing a variable lift daggerboard main foil capable of downforce, UptiP ama foils(with a droop tip) used one at a time and rudder T foils. A system that is basically identical to the Fire Arrow System designed years ago but the FIRST application of that basic system to a fullsize trimaran designed from SCRATCH to use it.

The innovation incorporated by Verdier in Gitana places him among the greatest trimaran designers ever. He is already one of the greatest foil designers ever!

*the design of my version of the TNZ foil was complete before that article was ever published!

TNZ foil Richard Gladwell photo:

 

 

AC 72 TNZ ploughing the field.jpg

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15 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

Me, Martin Fischer and a half dozen others have designed their own version of the fantastic TNZ foil. But I was one of the first to use a droop tip(NOT ON THE TNZ FOIL*) and was, without a doubt the first to incorporate the basic TNZ UptiP foil on a trimaran ama. Wrong you IDIOT- SEE BELOW.

The "bloke who designed the foils for Gitana" didn't just do that-Guillaume Verdier designed the whole boat (I don't actually care, he still designed the foils, meaning I'm still right)- incorporating, for the first time, a three point foil, well wrong Again, this is where your stupidity prevails, Gitana sails on 2 rudder foils, one amas foil and the daggerboard, a 4 point foiling boat. Yours is 3. Already very different, and more similar to other peoples designs that to yours.

The innovation incorporated by Verdier in Gitana places him among the greatest trimaran designers ever. Again, I do not care. No disrespect to GV, he's a champ and successful, but there is absolutely no reason to sit here sucking his dick. If someones a great designer/builder let their boat do the talking, if someones a great sailor let their sailing do the talking.

*the design of my version of the TNZ foil was complete before that article was ever published! - Well, see this is where you actually become a real piece of shit, because the article is based on a foil TNZ were testing on boat 1 back in 2012. Which is exactly what you copied, you even spoke of this back then, because, and I'm sure everyone agree's you do not shut the fuck up about it. Unlike you, I'm in my 20's and have a great memory (oh and I actually sail). 

TNZ foil Richard Gladwell photo:

 

 

AC 72 TNZ ploughing the field.jpg

SA should ban you you piece of shit, you exactly copied their daggerboard design.

See the cad image of their version 2 daggerboard, which tnz were testing at the time you made your foils.

How about see this screenshot of a video. This video pre-dates the launch of your stupid model which hasn't even sailed in years. Which shows them sailing on it 6 months before that article, meaning they had already tested the board prior to the video, as the only ever leaked "old" information, meaning that the board was launched in 2012, and back then when it took 6 months to manufacture and design, meaning the board may have been designed in 2011 or at the latest early 2012. WAY BEFORE YOU. You lying P.o.S. The photo you shared is of early 2012 boat 1, not end of 2012 boat one, or boat 2 (shown in the screenshot).

Dear Sailing Anarchy Admins, I think this would be a good time to put this P.o.S. in time out? (Permanently pls). Seems fair for stealing other peoples work and passing it off as his own.

Emirates-Fig2-Daggerfoil-400x209.png

downtip.jpg

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+1 to the request to ban DL - for design theft and then worse still, passing it off as his own IP. 

Now watch how nothing gets done (in the chase for click traffic..........) by Clean, Scott or the administrators.

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8 hours ago, darth reapius said:

SA should ban you you piece of shit, you exactly copied their daggerboard design.

See the cad image of their version 2 daggerboard, which tnz were testing at the time you made your foils.

How about see this screenshot of a video. This video pre-dates the launch of your stupid model which hasn't even sailed in years. Which shows them sailing on it 6 months before that article, meaning they had already tested the board prior to the video, as the only ever leaked "old" information, meaning that the board was launched in 2012, and back then when it took 6 months to manufacture and design, meaning the board may have been designed in 2011 or at the latest early 2012. WAY BEFORE YOU. You lying P.o.S. The photo you shared is of early 2012 boat 1, not end of 2012 boat one, or boat 2 (shown in the screenshot).

Dear Sailing Anarchy Admins, I think this would be a good time to put this P.o.S. in time out? (Permanently pls). Seems fair for stealing other peoples work and passing it off as his own.

 

 

You have no clue-just more poorly thought out punk kid bullshit!. I did my absolute best to copy the best elements of the TNZ UptiP foil with other components  I introduced like washin, iFLAP , a unique planform, and horizontal foil droop*. The fact that my foil works so well on Fire Arrow is testament to the brilliant invention by TNZ as well as to the specific elements of the design I incorporated on the Fire Arrow-which in your punk-kid-idness you have no clue about.

Many other designers copied the basic elements of the TNZ UptiP foil which was in the public domain-I introduced many changes to the basic TNZ-type foil that help it to work exceedingly well.

* compare the pictures-much more droop on my foil.

My UptiP ama foil design was the FIRST such foil ever used on a foiling trimaran ama in the history of mankind!!!!

 

MPX i-flap off port foil 001.JPG

MPX ama + ama = cat --foil comparison 011.JPG

MPX i-flap-frnt view port foil --Twist (1).jpg

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1 hour ago, Boink said:

+1 to the request to ban DL - for design theft and then worse still, passing it off as his own IP. 

Now watch how nothing gets done (in the chase for click traffic..........) by Clean, Scott or the administrators.

Oh yes, the value of those foiling anarchy clicks...a few more and I'm buying a ferrari!  

 

You, boink, clearly know exactly how the internet works.  Bravo!

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Doug, you have the perfect chance to have the fastest tri in the history of all mankind

put it outside when IRMA hits

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2 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

My UptiP ama foil design was the FIRST such foil ever used on a foiling trimaran ama in the history of mankind!!!!

 Come on Doug give it a rest

 

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7 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

The fact that my foil works so well on Fire Arrow ..........

 

Doug

You are full of shit and liar. How can you expect anybody to take you seriously. How can you claim your foil works "so well" when all it has ever done is get your model to fly for a maximum of about 8 seconds. Proof that a foil works well can only come from a range of conditions and if it achieves the most important thing in foiling, extended flight. Not only do you refuse to provide any evidence of extended flight, it's also true that you have never made claims of extended flight. Without extended flight, you cannot claim the foils work well.

Which brings us to your latest lie, one of a string you have told over the years. You seem to forget that what you post in the past can usually be found again, so we can go back in time to see if your revisionist history stacks up. In this case, you claim on another thread that the video you take your pictures from was the culmination of a month and a half of testing and development. But here is the funny thing. In some places, that video is titled first flight. In other places, your refer to it as the second time out. You also made the excuse that you couldn't sail without somebody to help both launch and video, telling us you wouldn't sail without video.You have a great track record of posting every little thing you do and every little change, yet there is a whole chunk that you are now suggesting you didn't record, didn't photograph and didn't post about. You cannot expect anybody to believe that.

It's no different from the time you claimed 2000 hours of Rave sailing. It was strange that in a post a few years earlier, you had claimed 20 hours+, meaning that in the intervening period, you had sailed about as much as an olympic sailor would train. I am still waiting to learn who lent you a boat for so many years, how you fitted in all the hours and why you never told anybody on any forums even though every other aspect of your foil "play" is covered in such fine detail.

With proven lies like that, how do you expect anybody to believe you when you say you didn't steal other people's work and pass it off as your own. 

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15 hours ago, Doug Lord said:

You have no clue-just more poorly thought out punk kid bullshit!. I did my absolute best to copy the best elements of the TNZ UptiP foil with other components  I introduced like washin, iFLAP (actually the stupidest shit I have ever seen, it shows how poor your knowledge of hydrodynamics is) , a unique planform, and horizontal foil droop* (no, this was on the foil you copied, you even said you did). The fact that my foil fails so badly on Fire Arrow is testament to my stupidity. (I fixed that for you)

Many other designers copied the basic elements of the TNZ UptiP foil which was in the public domain-I introduced many changes to the basic TNZ-type foil that help it to work exceedingly well. I do not actually care what other people do, that is up to them, your just the only one to copy other people and claim it as their own, that makes you scum.

* compare the pictures-much more droop on my foil. I'm sure there is a LOT of droop in your foil, I bet it doesn't even uptip

 

" But I was one of the first to use a droop tip" - DL

" *compare the pictures-much more droop on my foil." - DL

Get your fucking story straight mate, first your the inventor, then inspired, then straight up copied, then "mines a little different". Stop changing your story, we know you copied it, stop being a fuck-wit. 

Get your stupid little toys out of your lounge room and into the fucking water. (Quick take Pro Looper's advice)

You know who sounds like a kid now right? (Hint he's lying about the toys he has)

Ps. Thank you for pointing out that I'm a punk kid, I can't rebut that, I may sometimes talk a bit rough, I may even have a baby face, I may have a full head of hair (but not enough to grow a beard), but to tell the truth, someday's I feel like I'm getting old because this winter I've spent so much time either in my office or in my workshop (I'm building a 20' boat), and it's nice to be reminded that I have my whole life ahead of me to continue sailing, designing and building.

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In January 2013, it seems Doug was still tinkering with T foils. Inspiration seems to have first come from Salvador Dali.

srt-mpx-ama-foil-002-jpg.78093

Source: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-16#post-610108

In Feb 2013 he moved to remove one side of the T, probably as a result of not being able to work out how to do a curved hinge (now that would have been a useful invention).

srt-mpx-curved-l-foil-001-jpg.78924

Source: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-19#post-615081

In April 2013 he acknowledged ETNZ's prior art: "the new shape, inspired by TNZ's AC 72 main foils…" which is just as well, since they'd been sailing with them since sometime the year before.

Source: https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/high-performance-mpx-foil-self-righting-trimaran-the-test-model.36058/page-23#post-623382

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On 9/7/2017 at 10:43 PM, MR.CLEAN said:

Oh yes, the value of those foiling anarchy clicks...a few more and I'm buying a ferrari!  

 

You, boink, clearly know exactly how the internet works.  Bravo!

Don't buy a Ferrari - you'll never fit that tubby physique - let alone that fat head

Besides, it will only be more confirmation that you are compensating for all things lacking......

Now toddle off, and deepthroat some industry insider, you paragon of sailing journalism

 

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AYRS, Amateur Yacht Research Society, started publishing in the late 1950s and there are numbers of issues related to foil design ... and every foil imaginable is published there including V,inverted T, L, angled out, angled in, up tip and down varieties and many others from the inventive types posting in those times. Repeat: that was late 1950s and early '60s. And now we have this Lord of Fools (not Foils), a latter day copyist and imposter trumpeting (endlessly and repeatedly) his insufferable self proclaimed inventor successes? (delusions).  One should have sympathy .... ?

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BREAKING NEWS DL's rc toys survived IRMA.

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On 9/7/2017 at 5:29 PM, Team_GBR said:

Doug

You are full of shit and liar. How can you expect anybody to take you seriously. How can you claim your foil works "so well" when all it has ever done is get your model to fly for a maximum of about 8 seconds. Proof that a foil works well can only come from a range of conditions and if it achieves the most important thing in foiling, extended flight. Not only do you refuse to provide any evidence of extended flight, it's also true that you have never made claims of extended flight. Without extended flight, you cannot claim the foils work well.

Which brings us to your latest lie, one of a string you have told over the years. You seem to forget that what you post in the past can usually be found again, so we can go back in time to see if your revisionist history stacks up. In this case, you claim on another thread that the video you take your pictures from was the culmination of a month and a half of testing and development. But here is the funny thing. In some places, that video is titled first flight. In other places, your refer to it as the second time out. You also made the excuse that you couldn't sail without somebody to help both launch and video, telling us you wouldn't sail without video.You have a great track record of posting every little thing you do and every little change, yet there is a whole chunk that you are now suggesting you didn't record, didn't photograph and didn't post about. You cannot expect anybody to believe that.

It's no different from the time you claimed 2000 hours of Rave sailing. It was strange that in a post a few years earlier, you had claimed 20 hours+, meaning that in the intervening period, you had sailed about as much as an olympic sailor would train. I am still waiting to learn who lent you a boat for so many years, how you fitted in all the hours and why you never told anybody on any forums even though every other aspect of your foil "play" is covered in such fine detail.

With proven lies like that, how do you expect anybody to believe you when you say you didn't steal other people's work and pass it off as your own. 

You calling me a liar with such a profound compendium of made-up bullshit is hilarious and sad. You are full of shit.

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7 minutes ago, Doug Lord said:

You calling me a liar with such a profound compendium of made-up bullshit is hilarious and sad. You are full of shit.

There's no made up bullshit. There is only what you post. They don't lie. For instance, the vast exaggeration of your Rave sailing experience. By coincidence, a week ago i was looking for a picture of a foiler from a few years ago and what popped up but a post by you that stated you had 20+ hours experience in the Rave. Strange, I thought. Doug claimed far more than that. Maybe he bought one without telling anybody and has been sailing it almost full time since. Or maybe is account has been hacked and somebody has gone back and edited his posts to make him look like a liar. 

Then there is the lawn ornament. You posted every single little bit you could about that. You posted when you rigged it on the lawn, you posted when you first got it wet. You posted when you sailed it. Then you posted loads of excuses why you hadn't sailed it again. They are still up on the server. hen your claims about the foils working "perfectly" were challenged on the basis of not enough testing, you argued that the short time you had sailed it proved it worked. People said you hadn't sailed it enough, you argued that the outings you had reported were enough to prove the bot worked. Now you claim 1.5 moths of testing. Why had you never mentioned that before? You say you tried different foil combinations, yet you never once mentioned those on the forum when you have mentioned everything else you have done in the finest detail, usually complete with photos. Why had you never mentioned that testing before? It's particularly strange seeing how so many have attacked you for the lack of testing, yet you never mentioned it. Instead, you made exuses as to why you hadn't tested.

You live in a fantasy world where reality seems to be blurred. I call it lying. Some might be generous and call it exaggerating. What do you call it?

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On 9/8/2017 at 1:48 AM, darth reapius said:

" But I was one of the first to use a droop tip" - DL

" *compare the pictures-much more droop on my foil." - DL

Get your fucking story straight mate, first your the inventor, then inspired, then straight up copied, then "mines a little different". Stop changing your story, we know you copied it, stop being a fuck-wit. 

Get your stupid little toys out of your lounge room and into the fucking water. (Quick take Pro Looper's advice)

You know who sounds like a kid now right? (Hint he's lying about the toys he has)

Ps. Thank you for pointing out that I'm a punk kid, I can't rebut that, I may sometimes talk a bit rough, I may even have a baby face, I may have a full head of hair (but not enough to grow a beard), but to tell the truth, someday's I feel like I'm getting old because this winter I've spent so much time either in my office or in my workshop (I'm building a 20' boat), and it's nice to be reminded that I have my whole life ahead of me to continue sailing, designing and building.

Way to go, punk. You locked yourself in the crazy room for all to see.

-------------------

My thread* on boat design is about 7 years old and is not the first thread where I proposed what is now the basic Fire Arrow Foil System used by Fire Arrow, Maserati and in its finest conception yet by Guillaume Verdiers Gitana 17-one of the coolest fullsize trimarans ever designed. And all three of these boats use a basic foil configuration with details never before seen on any trimaran anywhere at any time. Not in the 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's 90's -NOT EVER!

They are examples of a revolution in trimaran foiler design with features on all three never before used together on any size foiling tri. Again, a fucking Revolution-that the punks and old men have no clue about whatsoever!!!

* My thread is one of the longest and most detailed to be found anywhere but the real thing on boatdesign is that there is no attempt to claim any intellectual property at all-it is an attempt to present new ideas that anyone is free to, and encouraged to copy. Further, I already had four letters patents when I started that thread and instead of publishing every detail of the Fire Arrow concept I sure as hell could have patented the concept-but I didn't want to-I wanted to give back to the design community and inspire others to think outside the box that trimaran design has long been wedged into. And I did it while developing one of the most significant foiling trimaran concepts ever- PUBLICLY. And a couple of the top foiler designers in the world have seen the thread and the resulting Fire Arrow Foil Concept Test Model and told me that it was just great. So the half-ass comments by the punks and old men are simply meaningless drivel as far as I'm concerned.

Gitana 17 picture by Yann Riou, Maserati picture by Gulain Grenier, Fire Arrow pictureby Doug Lord/ Dan Burke:

Gitana Foiling!.jpg

Maserati with fire arrow foil system.jpg

MPX Fire Arrow-First Full Flying Foiling on video-7-24-14 009 (2).JPG

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Wow, Doug, thanks for posting those photos and your comments. I had never seen them before............:lol::ph34r:

Seems to me you keep getting caught out by your own words. Got to love the way you hang on to your one hope of coupling your name with the successful work of others. It's particularly interesting after the way you were so completely discredited on the AC Anarchy forum where you were shown to be wrong with everything you were saying. If foiling was a person, you would have been locked up for stalking by now.

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It has now gone beyond sad with Lord of Fools.

We're dealing with a deranged, deluded and extreme fantasist mind here.

His raison d'etre are his silly toys ... so we should keep that in mind. Remove his dreamy fantasies by attempting logic ...  he might implode. This bloke is a special kind of bonkers.

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4 hours ago, A Class Sailor said:

Wow, Doug, thanks for posting those photos and your comments. I had never seen them before............:lol::ph34r:

Seems to me you keep getting caught out by your own words. Got to love the way you hang on to your one hope of coupling your name with the successful work of others. It's particularly interesting after the way you were so completely discredited on the AC Anarchy forum where you were shown to be wrong with everything you were saying. If foiling was a person, you would have been locked up for stalking by now.

Probably sexual assault as well. ;)

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"So the half-ass comments by the punks and old men are simply meaningless drivel as far as I'm concerned." -DL

Doug, you do realise your the only one who doesn't actually sail here? This is SAILING Anarchy. When was the last time, you actually sailed in a race which would have your name in the results? Honestly, because it must be before the internet (what 20 years at least?) Because if you google it, it doesn't exist. Also, you seem to not be aware of it, but you yourself are so old and overweight you can't sail (so I really can't work out who you are talking to when you mean "old men"). I may be a punk, but I at least have a few championships under my belt (something I'm pretty sure you don't have)... But actual sailing experience doesn't matter to you does it? I mean we all saw you bicker with Bora over foiling/moth related things...

Let me break that down for you. YOU, an overweight old man who hasn't sailed in decades, bickered about sailing/foiling/moth related items, with a multiple times world moth sailing champion, member of the Luna Rossa AC team and US Olympic sailing team representative (in the only foiling class).

You are literally meaningless drivel to sailors around the world. Concept is nothing without proof, and proof is evidence sufficient to establish a thing as true.

You claim you have proof of your models working, but you have insufficient evidence, you have 8 seconds of something you say is working from 3 or 4 years ago, even if you had 10 minutes straight of that thing airborne it still wouldn't be "proof", proof would be hours of footage of it sailing around a course against other boats.  As the point of a racing boat is to compete against others, not sit on the lawn all day every day.

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Please STOP feeding DOUG. I can't read in every post about him. This site is turned to LORD ANARCHY. 

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I seriously had to scroll up to the top to check the subject of this thread. 

So, back to Gitana 17. How friggin amazing is it! And get all those blokes off the boat at it will be a tonne lighter. 

But my two questions are: 1) will the amazing feats of the crewed Idec and the solo Thomas Coville be beaten (by any significant amount) if one can't leap forward to the next low pressure cell and so will these new generation boats be able to do that?

and 2) how the fuck are you meant to be able to sleep (and not crash into shit!) on these things while sailing (foiling!!!) at 30/40/50 knots for days and weeks on end on your own? 

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12 hours ago, LionIsland said:

I seriously had to scroll up to the top to check the subject of this thread. 

So, back to Gitana 17. How friggin amazing is it! And get all those blokes off the boat at it will be a tonne lighter. 

But my two questions are: 1) will the amazing feats of the crewed Idec and the solo Thomas Coville be beaten (by any significant amount) if one can't leap forward to the next low pressure cell and so will these new generation boats be able to do that?

and 2) how the fuck are you meant to be able to sleep (and not crash into shit!) on these things while sailing (foiling!!!) at 30/40/50 knots for days and weeks on end on your own? 

1) So long as they keep up with the pressure systems it should be a step ahead, but I wonder how it'll perform in very little breeze compared to them also.

2) Like sex with Max Power, you strap yourself in and feel the G's

L2t7D3l.gif

 

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