• Announcements

    • Zapata

      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
Halpthejalp

Musto LPX for offshore racing

34 posts in this topic

I'm doing Newport- Bermuda next year and was wondering if the Musto LPX GTX Jacket would be enough to get me there dry. I was thinking of doing an LPX Jacket with the MPX Trousers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What sways you toward the LPX jacket, and not a full MPX set? I have MPX here in Texas, and its a gem. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Price- the LPX jacket is a lot cheaper 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Durability, breathability, affordability - you can only pick 2...

LPX gives up durability.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Halpthejalp said:

I'm doing Newport- Bermuda next year and was wondering if the Musto LPX GTX Jacket would be enough to get me there dry. I was thinking of doing an LPX Jacket with the MPX Trousers.

most people would say it's not ideal...

it's not designed to keep the water out in the conditions that _might_ be encountered on an ocean race. The bermuda race in particular tends to have upwind sailing, so you are probably somewhat more likely to encounter conditions for which the jacket is really unsuitable, than on a race that is mostly downwind.

if you were to encounter those conditions.., it might mean that you are less than comfortable on your watch.., and maybe even not able to function at the level expected by the rest of the crew. 

on the other hand.., it might turn out to be an easy race, where the jacket will be fine.

certainly, people have sailed to bermuda with worse jackets than that one, and lived to tell about it...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What would you recommend for a Bermuda race?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, since i work for Zhik, I would have to recommend the Zhik Isotak 2 range.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not Zhik

Get MPX, and for the next 5 years pride yourself for amortizing the extra 100-200$ difference every time you're warm and dry on a cold and wet night.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isotak gear is nice and light. The v2 is supposed to be a lot more durable and has been developed with some top ocean racers (Dongfeng team are wearing it in the Volvo Ocean Race). That being said, Musto MPX and HPX are the gold standard in foulies. I regret not buying this back in 2012 when I did my first Bermuda race, as my gear at the time made it just in time to cross the finish line and leak the next time out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fiscal side of this question is always kind of funny to me. As how much do you spend on a good suit, by the time you have it tailored & pressed.  Then have bought 2-3 shirts to go with it, ditto ties, & had all of them pressed.  Yet that suit with rare exceptions isn't something which affects your physical & mental comfort, let alone your ability to perform complex tasks, etc. Nor, other than helping to earn a paycheck, does it aid in keeping you alive. And keep in mind that unlike a business suit, you'll likely be living in the stuff for several days at a stretch sometimes. Including for 20hrs a day. More if you're sleeping on the weather rail.

I explained it this way to my dad once, when I was saiing 6 days a week, & own 2-3 sets of foulies at any given time. And suddenly the lightbulb went on above his head. :)

Or to put it another way, when compared to everything else you'll spend money on in connection with the race, even if you're not the boat owner, how expensive is a set of foulies really? You know, food, drinks, outfits, travel expenses, air fare, vehicle rentals, hotel rooms, tips... And yes, even that new PFD that you got for the race.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gill makes offshore jackets that you can get for quite a lot less than the MPX, that will work fine for the bermuda race

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would not buy Gill. Even the top of the line OS1 stays waterproof for only 18 months and it's expensive!. Their warranty is for "the life of the garment" whatever that means. They may replace it once or twice; the stuff has a very short life in my experience.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have zhik isotak 2 gear and after about 4-5000 miles offshore and inshore racing it's as good as it was day one- it's great gear- I'm completely happy with it and everything else Zhik makes- great gear and impeccable customer service- very best alternative to musto there is- 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, tomtriad said:

I would not buy Gill. Even the top of the line OS1 stays waterproof for only 18 months and it's expensive!. Their warranty is for "the life of the garment" whatever that means. They may replace it once or twice; the stuff has a very short life in my experience.

You need gills to wear gill gear- it's the worst kit out there- absolute crap

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I have lot's of musto gear

the last musto jacket i bought - last summer - leaks on me... 

Musto is good, but not as good as everyone here thinks - i think in general people on SA over state the differences - "Musto is awesome..., Gill is crap"

it's not true.

if i was buying new offshore gear today i would probably get the new Mustang stuff. It costs more than Musto, I think, but i am ready to try something other than Musto.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, us7070 said:

 

I have lot's of musto gear

the last musto jacket i bought - last summer - leaks on me... 

Musto is good, but not as good as everyone here thinks - i think in general people on SA over state the differences - "Musto is awesome..., Gill is crap"

it's not true.

if i was buying new offshore gear today i would probably get the new Mustang stuff. It costs more than Musto, I think, but i am ready to try something other than Musto.

 

Look at zhiks isotak2 kit- I was a die hard musto fan until I tried this stuff and I cannot be happier- 

pricepoint is there right below musto and dollar for dollar it's better gear, well thought out ergonomics, adjustable wherevit needs to be, truly good stuff/ 

plus impeccable customer service/ like surprisingly good-

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, USA190520 said:

Look at zhiks isotak2 kit- I was a die hard musto fan until I tried this stuff and I cannot be happier- 

pricepoint is there right below musto and dollar for dollar it's better gear, well thought out ergonomics, adjustable wherevit needs to be, truly good stuff/ 

plus impeccable customer service/ like surprisingly good-

 

 

how's the fit?

i consider myself to have "normal" body proportions.., but by today's standards.., i'm "thin"

some of the musto stuff is a bit big if i get the right length

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm tall and thin- so I suffer the same baggy issues-

my lg gear fits like it was tailored- the salopettes have adjustable shoulders- a godsend to anyone over 6'- all in all I'd say the zhik fits on the athletic side, not slim but normal- and on me like a glove- sallopettes that don't ride up when you bend over are worth it- plus a breat pocket- two huge thigh pockets and a pocket for a tool- they're some of the best thought out pieces of kit I've owned- I'd buy them again and again/ 

 

I've got almost 5k miles and a couple hundred days on them and they're still perfect-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess it's also worth asking what kind of boat you're going to be on.  Someone in the back of a Swan 60 has very different needs than someone on the bow of something racier.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Zhik gear is comfortable and the right fit. Customer service is the best in the business. I won't attest to the long term durability of the Isotak 2 line. I will say the Isotak gear is very light and that weight matters when doing long hard jobs on a boat.

I have a pair of Gill OS1 Salopettes purchased on sail for much less than the equivalent Musto or Zhik gear. Downside is they are big on me, right height but baggy. The survived last years Bermuda race just fine and I'm sure have at least one more, hopefully two in them. I will say the only gear on the transatlantic that didn't leak were a Gill drysuit and some of the Musto MPX and HPX gear that wasn't past its expiration date.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/8/2017 at 9:05 AM, lamorak said:

Durability, breathability, affordability - you can only pick 2...

LPX gives up durability.

big +1.  Any brand "inshore" light duty foulies are going to give up durability.  You'll poke a hole in them pretty quick or tear a pocket out of them.  Great for inshore, but not designed for offshore. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Merit 25 said:

big +1.  Any brand "inshore" light duty foulies are going to give up durability.  You'll poke a hole in them pretty quick or tear a pocket out of them.  Great for inshore, but not designed for offshore. 

but the difference is more than just durability...

inshore foulies typically don't have all the same features to stop water ingress that offshore foulies have.., and that is the main reason that they are unsuitable offshore.

things like covered zippers.., flaps across the neck.., good wrist seals...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agreed, sorry my last post wasn't very informative.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about the Helly Hansen Foil smock? It has inner cuffs and a neck seal, and it's a 3 layer laminat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Depends on the boat and what your position is on said boat.  The bermuda race outside the first 24-36 hours is very warm and you will find yourself wanting a lighter jacket.  If you are on some bigger drier boat and stay mostly in the cockpit you will be fine with the LPX, this is coming from some one who owns LPX, MPX and HPX.  If you are a front of the boat guy I would recommend a smock like the mpx or spray top.  I ran a boat where all our jackets were LPX for a season and then gave them out to the guys, no one has had an issue.  I would however recommend you buy a size up so you can layer for the colder nights.  For bottoms spend the most money there and if possible buy HPX along with solid boots to stay dry. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/9/2017 at 10:03 AM, USA190520 said:

I'm tall and thin- so I suffer the same baggy issues-

I've bought several musto items over the years and I agree - they were designed for Mr. Potatohead

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/11/2017 at 9:15 AM, sailthebay26 said:

Depends on the boat and what your position is on said boat.  The bermuda race outside the first 24-36 hours is very warm and you will find yourself wanting a lighter jacket.  If you are on some bigger drier boat and stay mostly in the cockpit you will be fine with the LPX, this is coming from some one who owns LPX, MPX and HPX.  If you are a front of the boat guy I would recommend a smock like the mpx or spray top.  I ran a boat where all our jackets were LPX for a season and then gave them out to the guys, no one has had an issue.  I would however recommend you buy a size up so you can layer for the colder nights.  For bottoms spend the most money there and if possible buy HPX along with solid boots to stay dry. 

 

My rule of thumb is for every $100 spend on bottoms you get one season- so a $500 pr of mpx salopettes should give you 5 yrs of dryness- on average- 

one hint of outside moisture invades my safe space and I retire the kit-  

 

fully agree on position vs location vs boat type-  it sucks for me as I cover the entire boat lots of times as such I wear a smock and end up sweaty... I

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/9/2017 at 8:53 AM, us7070 said:

 

I have lot's of musto gear

the last musto jacket i bought - last summer - leaks on me... 

Musto is good, but not as good as everyone here thinks - i think in general people on SA over state the differences - "Musto is awesome..., Gill is crap"

it's not true.

if i was buying new offshore gear today i would probably get the new Mustang stuff. It costs more than Musto, I think, but i am ready to try something other than Musto.

 

 

On 8/9/2017 at 9:49 AM, USA190520 said:

Look at zhiks isotak2 kit- I was a die hard musto fan until I tried this stuff and I cannot be happier- 

pricepoint is there right below musto and dollar for dollar it's better gear, well thought out ergonomics, adjustable wherevit needs to be, truly good stuff/ 

plus impeccable customer service/ like surprisingly good-

 

Should I get the MPX trousers or salopettes? I do inshore racing on 42's and Farr 400's, distance racing, a lot of cruising and I'm doing Newport -Bermuda.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Halpthejalp said:

 

Should I get the MPX trousers or salopettes? I do inshore racing on 42's and Farr 400's, distance racing, a lot of cruising and I'm doing Bermuda.

 

i like the salopettes - but you can't adjust the length, so make sure they ft.

also - i think the salopettes fit a bit slimmer than the trousers, which is good for me.

note that with the length, you want them to be a bit long when you are standing, so that when sitting on the rail. or kneeling on deck, they still come down to your ankles, or near to them. at least, that's the way i like them to fit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you get the zhik salopettes you can adjust the shoulder straps, save a hundred bucks and have a better fitting better performing set of pants.... but that's just me- 

 

im a fan of salopettes- I'm a trimmer usually and they are a good cross over keeping my core dry and staying cool- 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/11/2017 at 9:15 AM, sailthebay26 said:

Depends on the boat and what your position is on said boat.  The bermuda race outside the first 24-36 hours is very warm and you will find yourself wanting a lighter jacket.  If you are on some bigger drier boat and stay mostly in the cockpit you will be fine with the LPX, this is coming from some one who owns LPX, MPX and HPX.  If you are a front of the boat guy I would recommend a smock like the mpx or spray top.  I ran a boat where all our jackets were LPX for a season and then gave them out to the guys, no one has had an issue.  I would however recommend you buy a size up so you can layer for the colder nights.  For bottoms spend the most money there and if possible buy HPX along with solid boots to stay dry. 

 

Went with the MPX- is there any specific way to fold the jacket and trousers without damaging the Gore-Tex?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anything but balled up.  I usually fold in half and roll my gear before putting it in a bag for racing, then hang it when at home.  My work MPX bibs stay rolled up in a backpack and seem to be fine 7 years later.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, sailthebay26 said:

Anything but balled up.  I usually fold in half and roll my gear before putting it in a bag for racing, then hang it when at home.  My work MPX bibs stay rolled up in a backpack and seem to be fine 7 years later.

What about the method where you fold the arms and roll it into the hood?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Halpthejalp said:

Went with the MPX- is there any specific way to fold the jacket and trousers without damaging the Gore-Tex?

I fold my foulies like I would any sweater and trousers while travelling. But if not in used they are hung on a hanger.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now