Jiame

470 Main and Jib Halyards Question

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I have a Vanguard 470 that I found and am trying to rig the Main and Jib Halyards. The halyard are all rope and run internally in the mast to pulleys at the bottom of the mast and then out. Where they go from there I don't know., I put the line in the jam cleats on the thwarts that are marked jib and main even though I know that won't work. I also have a highfield lever on the mast but it looks to me that it would only pull from the top down. In all honesty I replaced the jam cleats with cam cleats on the thwarts just to try it out and it held but I would like to find a more secure or proper way of securing the jib halyard to get tension. I attached some photos and any help appreciate. I also found out the wooden rudder handle that jams into the rudder will pull out into your hand as it did while I way tacking. Really gets interesting trying to put the handle back in while the boat is spinning in circles in the wind, I bought a bolt for the handle.

 

Thank you

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Lever is probably for the jib halyard (rig tension) so the wire part loops up connects to the lever and tighten to set tension. Was replaced with a Magic box in the 80s and tackle in the 90s. 

Main should be swage ball on the mast. Most exited up or down to a swage ball. We had one with the hook above the exit and one below. I have also seen a few with hooks on the mast for the wire loop.

Now if you only have rope (Cannot tell from the pictures) use the lever for jib, won't get proper tension but probably sailable. I would mount a clam cleat to the mast higher up in the side and then a block for the rope. Run the halyard out of the mast up through the clam and then the block pull up or side and it will automatically clear. Pull out of the cleat to drop.

 

 

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Doesn't the lever look like it would not pull up from the bottom to tighten only from the top. The rest I will do as you mentioned and add some some blocks and cleats. I really appreciate you response. 

 

Thank you

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It does kind of look that way?? 

What are the blocks on the port side of the mast? Could those be the jib tension setup? Is the yellow line the spin halyard?

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The lever looks upside down for jib halyard -- could it be for cunningham?

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I suppose its possible but you would have to have the hoist exactly right. Cunningham generally needs quite a lot of travel (full off hoisting to full on 20+ knots) I don't think a lever would be able to accomplish that.

Could also consider the mast is not for a 470? Other boats of that time frame (look late 60's early 70's ) use that mast and are rigged different?

What is the hull #

If you  zoom in on the below you can see the jib halyard exiting right in front of the CB, I think the purchase for that is the green line on starboard side of the CB trunk. Main appears to exit on starboard side of mast and to a pin rail for adjustment. Its the slack wire right below the partners. 

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Looking at the photos, it looks like you could slide the highfield lever out of the top of the track & put it back the other way up.

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The original jib halyard would have been wire, set up with a long (4 or 6 inches most like) soft wire loop at the mast end, and then a rope tail. You pull on the rope tail through the block on the bottom to haul the jib up, and then the wire ends up adjacent to the hook of the highfield, and is just pulled out from the mast, hooked on the end of the highfield and then tensioned. That way the jib halyard loads don't go on the block at the bottom of the mast. You could replicate the same setup using a high tech rope instead of the wire. The tail has no significant load and can be anything. I usually use 3 strand because its easiest to splice!

 

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I think until I could set something up with a wire to hook one the lever I will run the line to some cam cleats I installed on the thwart. The cam cleats are solid with fender washers on the bottom so they won't pull out. I have one on each side for the Jib Halyard and the Main Halyard. I can have someone pull on the forestay to create tension and lock the jib Halyard off with the cam cleat on the thwart. Might be a Micky Mouse way of doing it but I think it is pretty solid. I have attached some photos and really appreciate your reply's. I had a Taser before which I regret selling but have not sailed that much so your help is appreciated. I like the 470 and think I will buy another if I can find one for a backup boat and something to work on.

Thank you

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That's a lot of load to somewhere that wasn't really designed for it, and on a rather old boat. Its not an option I would ever take. It should be a quick enough job to rerig the jib halyard to the highfield in the way I indicated. Might have to watch chafe if you use rope though. All the main halyard really needs is a cleat on the side of the mast. 

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I guess I can't picture hooking onto the highfield as you mentioned since the lever can only pull from above and not the pulley below. I don't picture the wire or rope being able to exit the mast from above the highfield and having it lock down with the lever. I do believe what you are saying but hard to picture and will secure to the mast by installing cleats on the mast. I believe a 420 is set up that way with cleats and a pulley for the jib, I appreciate your answers and will re-rig it. Any idea the best way to install extra cleats. i believe "rivnut" may work but never used them. I have the two lines already in the mast so I don't want to catch on them. 

 

Thank you

Peter

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My old mid-70's 5o5 has a similar setup and now after reading Locus and others above I think I understand it better. The main halyard is rope until the last 6 inches or so which is wire when the main is hoisted, and the wire has a few a few swage balls on it. It looks like there's a tang with a notch on the mast which I suppose takes one of the swage balls. There's a highfield lever with its hook on the downward side which must be for the jib halyard/rig tension but it gets in the way of the vang.  There's no obvious point in the jib halyard for an eye or loop that would seem to correspond with the highfield lever position. How is this accomplished?

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I took the highfield lever out and turned it so it will pull from the bottom and made a loop in the jib halyard line then hooked it on ran the lever up tight in its track and closed the lever. It is now tight and solid. Thank s again for your help.

 

Peter

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What does the top of the mast look like? Is there a halyard lock for the main? 

As for the jib, on a modern 470 the setup is typically something like: 2:1 jib/forestay halyard (block attaches to jib hayard/forestay), up to the jib halyard sheave, then where it exits it is connected to a 3 or 4:1 which is then connected to a (guessing at this next purchase) 8:1 for finger tip control of the forestay tension. Point is, the thing is designed to take some load. That knot you have there might become difficult to to untie after a hard day of sailing. I recommend learning how to splice :D (don't worry its really not that hard once you learn how to taper the tails prior to burying). 

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