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Piginwater

Moving up from a Hobie 16

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I started out on an old Chrysler Man O' War, then went to a Hobie 16. I'm by no means an expert, but I'm having fun.

What should I be looking for to upgrade?

I'm looking for something for me and my fiance that will last us for years to come, basically our "permanent toy". We won't be racing it, so we don't care about a fleet nearby.

  • Traps would be nice. 
  • Doublehanded.
  • Big sensation of speed and fun. A Hobie 16 might be faster, but I'd like the sensation of speed a monohull will give. Or should I stick with multihulls?
  • Enough difficulty that we won't get bored of it and will constantly be learning, but not so high strung that we'll be exhausted and constantly breaking expensive things.
  • Under $5,000 used.
  • Can be found in the western USA.

I've heard maybe an Osprey, RS500? 

I'm thinking of this the way I think of cars. I don't really need a fast car when I have a fast motorcycle. We're looking for a bigger cruiser at somepoint, but we want the dinghy version of the "feels fast" bike.

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RS800 - feels very fast upwind and downhill. It's manageable, but it's challenging enough to keep you interested for years. Also, if you can sail it, you'll happily sail pretty much everything else. Multihulls will feel like they have training wheels on after a few years in a skiff!

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I moved up from a Hobie 16 to a Prindle 19 many years ago. That was a big step up and a great boat. One design racing isn't going to happen with that boat any more but you said that was not a priority. It will keep your interest if you can find one that has not been beaten and easily fall in your price range. 

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The problem I see with an RS800 or full fledged race boat is that there's not really any room for taking a breather.

I know the girl would like to be able to stuff a cooler under the bow. Even though the hobie doesn't have a bow with storage, there's still room to strap a cooler down on the tramp from time to time.

Would a boat with an open transom be able to float around relaxed if the wind dies down? Where we go the wind can be extremely uncertain. One hour to the next might be a great time, to just drifting in total calm.

A newer Osprey looks interesting, but are there even any in the USA?

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2 hours ago, SailMoore1 said:

I moved up from a Hobie 16 to a Prindle 19 many years ago. That was a big step up and a great boat. One design racing isn't going to happen with that boat any more but you said that was not a priority. It will keep your interest if you can find one that has not been beaten and easily fall in your price range. 

I've been considering something about that size in a cat. ARC17, Nacra Infusion F18, they all look like a blast. But is the sensation of speed and fun bigger on a fast monohull?

How does the Prindle 19 compare to other cats?

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IMHO, your price point of less than $5k is limiting your options. Not a bad thing just reality.

The Prindle 19 will steer and act much like the cats you listed at half to 2/3rds the cost. That puts it in your price point. It is also a huge jump from a Hobie 16. I am not putting down the 16, I have owned several and they are the true beach cat, way more fun in the surf than just about anything. 

When comparing the 19 to the boats you listed, it is several generations behind in development. 

 

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You're right, I got my boats and prices mixed up. I did find an Infusion for $7500, I'd rather not go up that high if it's really not worth it though.

And I'm reading that the monohulls feel a lot faster than the cats. I'm really just after the fun factor, and the learning experience that comes from a dinghy. I'm not ruling out a cat though.

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Exactly where are you? 

 

There's a Buccaneer18 fleet in Phoenix that's super laid back, fun and supportive.   I know they have some awesome boats available in your price range.  They are sporty monohulls that easily meet your comfort requirements.  The kite is symmetric which isn't the coolest kid at the dance these days. ... but with the bow launcher and some simple rigging its super easy and fun for sailors of a wide skill range. 

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I'm out in the Pacific Northwest. My stomping grounds are the Seattle to Portland area. 

I'll read up on the Buccaneer, thanks. I'm definitely looking for the sporty side of the dinghy world, I'd just like to be able to relax too when the weather dies down without warning.

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I have owned many boats including a hobie 16 and a hobie 17.  I currently own a Hobie Getaway and love it.  Much more durable than a hobie 16, so it will last you for years, and you can use a trap wire if you want but you can also take others out with you also.  I also own a megabyte and I owned a raider Ii before.  The raider was fast but I have to say the multihulls feel faster than the monohulls.

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" the sensation of speed a monohull will give "   ???    I must be missing something here. Stick with a multihull. Happy Sailing

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On September 30, 2017 at 4:34 PM, Piginwater said:

I started out on an old Chrysler Man O' War, then went to a Hobie 16. I'm by no means an expert, but I'm having fun.

What should I be looking for to upgrade?

I'm looking for something for me and my fiance that will last us for years to come, basically our "permanent toy". We won't be racing it, so we don't care about a fleet nearby.

  • Traps would be nice. 
  • Doublehanded.
  • Big sensation of speed and fun. A Hobie 16 might be faster, but I'd like the sensation of speed a monohull will give. Or should I stick with multihulls?
  • Enough difficulty that we won't get bored of it and will constantly be learning, but not so high strung that we'll be exhausted and constantly breaking expensive things.
  • Under $5,000 used.
  • Can be found in the western USA.

I've heard maybe an Osprey, RS500? 

I'm thinking of this the way I think of cars. I don't really need a fast car when I have a fast motorcycle. We're looking for a bigger cruiser at somepoint, but we want the dinghy version of the "feels fast" bike.

Hobie 18. Although primarily a mono sailor, I've fooled around a bit on the 16 and 18. The 18 is a nice handling cat. 

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There's been a Hobie 18 resurgence here in Aus, cheap as chips and huge fun.  Only problem is probably the weight, a bit beefy to lug around but may do.  There's also the H17 which people here seem to like (particularly based on the price).

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18 hours ago, knobblyoldjimbo said:

There's been a Hobie 18 resurgence here in Aus, cheap as chips and huge fun.  Only problem is probably the weight, a bit beefy to lug around but may do.  There's also the H17 which people here seem to like (particularly based on the price).

H17 Doesnt do that well with too much weight though does it? Otherwise for a solo cat it looks a lot of fun

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They seem to like tweaking them here.  The H18's they leave as standard but the H17's have square top mains and chute's.  If you're not going to compete as OD it doesn't matter.  I guesss crew weight is an issue, the local 17's here are father and daughter.

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Ospreys do exist just over the border in Canada with a few coming  up for sale every year and a fleet at the surrey sailing club.

https://www.surreysailingclub.bc.ca 

No boat is going to be perfect but a hobie 18 would be a great upgrade

 

https://spokane.craigslist.org/boa/d/hobie-18-magnum-with-wings/63795655

How about a FD?  Fast, stable, roomy and maybe one of the most beautiful boats ever ;-)

This one is nicely rigged with good sails.

https://wenatchee.craigslist.org/boa/d/flying-dutchman/6358144575.html

The blue buccaneer behind the FD is also for sale by the sailing club and a is well sorted boat.

 

 

 

 

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My advice is to find a good used Hobie Tiger or Nacra Infusion. This isn't a knock on the monohull crowd, but in the price and size range you are talking, its either balls to the walls performance or a slower boat like the bucc's and to some extent FD. Used Tigers, Infusions and Cap 's are out there-saw a nicely sorted Cap 1 sell for less than $6k this past year in the Northeast. F18's are a HUGE speed upgrade compared with the Hobie 16 (and significantly faster than most any monohull in the price range, comparable in speed to International 14 foot skiffs FYI), nice size OD fleet in the U.S (Worlds in Sarasota, FL in 2018), including a fleet in the Seattle area, you still have the tramp with space for a cooler for lazier sailing. There is a local Infusion at my club regularly sails 3 up, father and 2 daughters, just don't hoist the kite if you're looking for a lazy run down wind. In terms of forgiveness and durability, these are also generally higher than most high performance dinghys imo, which aren't very stable in roll and gybing in breeze is a hairy affair. Most readily damaged bits would be the main sail if you plow through or the boom if again you plow through in a capsize. It's possible to snap a rig in really breezy conditions downwind with the kite up with high sea state and stuffs-leave the main cleated down pretty hard and its a non issue. Parts are readily available as the F18 is open manufacturing so spares from Hobie, Nacra, Goodall, Falcon tend to work. PM me if you have any additional questions.

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On 11/21/2017 at 10:49 AM, samc99us said:

My advice is to find a good used Hobie Tiger or Nacra Infusion. This isn't a knock on the monohull crowd, but in the price and size range you are talking, its either balls to the walls performance or a slower boat like the bucc's and to some extent FD. Used Tigers, Infusions and Cap 's are out there-saw a nicely sorted Cap 1 sell for less than $6k this past year in the Northeast. F18's are a HUGE speed upgrade compared with the Hobie 16 (and significantly faster than most any monohull in the price range, comparable in speed to International 14 foot skiffs FYI), nice size OD fleet in the U.S (Worlds in Sarasota, FL in 2018), including a fleet in the Seattle area, you still have the tramp with space for a cooler for lazier sailing. There is a local Infusion at my club regularly sails 3 up, father and 2 daughters, just don't hoist the kite if you're looking for a lazy run down wind. In terms of forgiveness and durability, these are also generally higher than most high performance dinghys imo, which aren't very stable in roll and gybing in breeze is a hairy affair. Most readily damaged bits would be the main sail if you plow through or the boom if again you plow through in a capsize. It's possible to snap a rig in really breezy conditions downwind with the kite up with high sea state and stuffs-leave the main cleated down pretty hard and its a non issue. Parts are readily available as the F18 is open manufacturing so spares from Hobie, Nacra, Goodall, Falcon tend to work. PM me if you have any additional questions.

that was kind of my thought as well for an older F18 like the Tiger. Away from the narrow hulls of the classic hobies, still a cat but reasonably fast, and you can take a breather. 

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Given you description I'd second staying with a cat and finding one with an asymmetrical kite.  I got my Nacra inter 20 within your budget but got lucky.  If you want a monohull my suggestion would be a 505.

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I recently sold a getaway, recognizing that the best dinghy / sportboat in the solar system is the Raider 16 Turbo.  So versatile - single hand or carry 2, 3 sails with spinnaker all doable with 1 person.  Super fun and well designed. Great looking and sailing. Nothing in my view at this moment in time holds a candle to it..

https://m.facebook.com/raidersailboat/

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Sailed my new Raider for the first time today. No screecher or asymetrical. Light air. Beat Hobie 16s and Weta boat for boat. And was comfortable. Is that allowed? Dave Ellis

 

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