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3 hours ago, The_Alchemist said:

Come on.. NZ has been sailing the test boat all along to learn how to do the maneuvers.  Plus AM is handicapped with a small jib in lighter winds.  Soon you won’t be able to make all this crap up because we will have a lot of videos to watch.

AM has a test boat too.

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Interesting to see the difference in sailing, AM is stable and rock solid, TNZ is luffing, bearing away, up, down. Possibilities:

1) One boat/foil is more stable

2) The helms steer in different ways and style

3) One team uses the computer mode for training the other the racing one

4) One team favours manoeuvrability, the other speed.

5) One boat more unstable but faster foils (most common kiwi explanation read here)

6) Other ?

 

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5 hours ago, buckdouger said:

Can you elaborate on the first point? Are you talking about manoeuvres? Looked pretty good in @mikenz2 's last video. 

That was in place back in Florida pretty sure. 

Someone had posted about the difference between Ineos' battened foot vs ETNZs boom (articulating), suggesting Ineos' could only achieve a configuration of near matching camber down low vs flat windward skin. AM is certainly the most restricted for the shape of the main on the windward side down low (non articulating boom). Raises the question what shapes are actually desirable there. Ideally we hear from someone knowledgeable like @Basiliscus 

My point was based on the post with the videos of the 'first sails' of Te Aihe and Magic after their respective hiatus' - ETNZ looked to have much quicker/sharper manoeuvres but my point was trying to quantify the amount of training (either on the sim or a test boat) each team had during the time the big boats were off the water. From footage and info shared in the forums it seems like ETNZ have been a lot more active together whilst Te Aihe was doing it's world tour than Magic have been during thr past 5 months and because of this we shouldn't read too much into Magic's first day on the water in Auckland...

I was pretty sure the deck sweeper was a new feature? I don't remember seeing any sign of it in the P'Cola footage. If they've added the deck sweeper surely there could also be a new boom under there? 

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29 minutes ago, NZK said:

My point was based on the post with the videos of the 'first sails' of Te Aihe and Magic after their respective hiatus' - ETNZ looked to have much quicker/sharper manoeuvres but my point was trying to quantify the amount of training (either on the sim or a test boat) each team had during the time the big boats were off the water. From footage and info shared in the forums it seems like ETNZ have been a lot more active together whilst Te Aihe was doing it's world tour than Magic have been during thr past 5 months and because of this we shouldn't read too much into Magic's first day on the water in Auckland...

I was pretty sure the deck sweeper was a new feature? I don't remember seeing any sign of it in the P'Cola footage. If they've added the deck sweeper surely there could also be a new boom under there? 

The deck sweeper has been used while in Florida. There’s Instagram And YouTube stories and images of it from then.

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5 hours ago, The_Alchemist said:

Not too bad for a team that hasn’t sailed in 4-5 months.

Pretty bloody good, actually, Alchy. Can't wait for the motorway drags. ;-)

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3 hours ago, Rennmaus said:

The Journal of Medical Virology (...)

Sorry, sorry, sorry, I confused the threads! I'll delete the post here and re-post it "over there".

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More from Sail-World:

New York Yacht Club American Magic, U.S. Challenger for the 36th America's Cup, completed a milestone five-hour sailing session on Auckland's Waitemata Harbour on Monday. The team's AC75 racing yacht, DEFIANT, had been dormant since concluding its final training day at the team's winter base in Pensacola, Florida in early March.

"It's just nice to be back to doing what we're meant to be doing," said Terry Hutchinson, Skipper and Executive Director of American Magic. "[Today we had] perfect conditions to be out in the harbor, and out in the Hauraki Gulf. It wasn't too windy, perfectly flat water. Reminds you a lot of Pensacola."

https://www.sail-world.com/news/230397/Successful-first-sail-in-Auckland-for-DEFIANT

Pics: Ryan Pellett

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NZ Herald contribution: America's Cup: American Magic is first challenger to sail in New Zealand

"From the team perspective, it's great to see the team execute on a really hard plan," he added. "We're still constructing our base here, and all these little milestones are a measure of the team's progress. It's great to see the team on and off the water get things done. It's great to see the sailing operation up and running."

Hutchinson said the crew tested some new sails and some new systems, "all of which take time. Once we were able to do that, it was free sailing with no testing or anything except to go out and let it rip and get back into it. It was 10 to 13 knots, just really nice conditions. In that regard, it was really good."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12351451

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5 hours ago, The_Alchemist said:

How do they look getting up on the foils?  Were they stable in the light winds while still on the water, get up quicker, heel much, etc...  Just trying to get your gut feel about how they compare to NZ.

They got up on foils just in front of us, off North Head, and my impression was that they were shoveling an awful lot of water with that working foil arm (see photo). Not sure if that was a result of the stickiness of the hull shape, etc., or just the angle and amount of breeze (around 10 knots I believe).

Once up, they seem to fly higher and with slightly more nose-up attitude than what we are used to seeing with Te Aihe? Looked pretty stable in the light breeze.

I will try and get out to watch them today, now they've had a chance to get back up to speed.

DSC_0919a.jpg

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18 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

NZ Herald contribution: America's Cup: American Magic is first challenger to sail in New Zealand

That video looks very familiar, well done mikenz2

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1 minute ago, weta27 said:

That video looks very familiar, well done mikenz2

haha - and yes, they did ask permission :-)

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2 minutes ago, mikenz2 said:

haha - and yes, they did ask permission :-)

Have you asked for a ride out on an AM chase? 

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Sounds like AM have been quite accommodating with local media, might be worth a try

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4 minutes ago, weta27 said:

Sounds like AM have been quite accommodating with local media, might be worth a try

Now that you are an ‘accredited photographer’ (published in the NZ Herald, even) then sure, just ask ‘em. 
 

Dress warm, that AWS must be something to behold! 

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1 hour ago, Stingray~ said:

Now that you are an ‘accredited photographer’ (published in the NZ Herald, even) then sure, just ask ‘em. 
 

Dress warm, that AWS must be something to behold! 

Even worse than your typical Wellington southerly probably, Stinger. ;-)

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1 hour ago, weta27 said:

They got up on foils just in front of us, off North Head, and my impression was that they were shoveling an awful lot of water with that working foil arm (see photo). Not sure if that was a result of the stickiness of the hull shape, etc., or just the angle and amount of breeze (around 10 knots I believe).

Once up, they seem to fly higher and with slightly more nose-up attitude than what we are used to seeing with Te Aihe? Looked pretty stable in the light breeze.

I will try and get out to watch them today, now they've had a chance to get back up to speed.

DSC_0919a.jpg

Thanks, it nice to have a first hand observer that can keep us up to date on what is happening.

Weta27, just want to let you know how valuable your contributions are to all of us.

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Where the hell is the bustle???

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1 minute ago, Hawke said:

Great work.  Doesn't look that stable but I guess another week might be different....

Given the patchy wind conditions off the end of The Cloud I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and say they were more stable than I expected in there.

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7 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Where the hell is the bustle???

you get a quick glance before it's retracted into the hull :lol::lol::lol:

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Defaint headed straight for the same patch of water as Te Kahu was training in

 

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13 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Where the hell is the bustle???

:D 
 

The Aoteroean Seagull made off with it? 

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Nice!! Bean rock reads 17 gust 21 atm. And forecast is freshening over the next few days.

You're gonna have to hire a second camera when there's four boats out there Mike!!

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2 minutes ago, barfy said:

You're gonna have to hire a second camera when there's four boats out there Mike!!

I'll take a Nikon P1000 and two heavy fluid dampened video tripods if anyone has those lying around ;-)

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The bustle will be on the next boat. 
this ones a bit sticky. Healing a bit to help lift off. 

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5 minutes ago, mikenz2 said:

I'll take a Nikon P1000 and two heavy fluid dampened video tripods if anyone has those lying around ;-)

All you need is some Maui Magic while you film, then overlay some Jody ‘Bangin’ the Corners’ Shiels commentary 

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21 hours ago, weta27 said:

We heard the 'bang' as they went past, just as they got up on the foils.

DSC_0912.jpg

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Has anyone ever seen @weta27 and Richard Gladwell in the same room together ? I reckon they might be one in the same. Every time @weta27 posts his ripping photos RG does the same. :P

https://www.sail-world.com/news/230392/Americas-Cup-Rialto-July-27-Defiants-first-day

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34 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Where the hell is the bustle???

She ain't got one, which is why she's a bit sticky, Smack.

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11 minutes ago, Flippin Out said:

Has anyone ever seen @weta27 and Richard Gladwell in the same room together ? I reckon they might be one in the same. Every time @weta27 posts his ripping photos RG does the same. :P

https://www.sail-world.com/news/230392/Americas-Cup-Rialto-July-27-Defiants-first-day

They've been known to share the same rock on occasion, I believe. ;-)

In fact, this may well be said rock right here...

Screen Shot 2020-07-28 at 12.32.43 PM.png

Edited by Sailbydate
The rock?

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13 minutes ago, weta27 said:

Not exactly a New York skyline, but fortunately the weather improved quickly:

Great shots! They did wait for the grayist, most miserable moment to start sailing.

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1 hour ago, mikenz2 said:

Given the patchy wind conditions off the end of The Cloud I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and say they were more stable than I expected in there.

First sail after 5 months off the water, light if not marginal conditions, unfamiliar location, they deserve a little leeway.

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Gotta say it. Of all the AC36 boats, AM has the finest looking sails. 

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44 minutes ago, weta27 said:

DSC_0970.jpg

Area wise, AM foils easily look the biggest. Very modest taper upon their length. This might explain that scuffing wash Weta has noted before lift off. Also explains the relative ease in which they get up and their apparent stability. Whether they're fast compared to their rivals is another story.

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Just now, Horn Rock said:

Area wise, AM foils easily look the biggest. Very modest taper upon their length. This might explain that scuffing wash Weta has noted before lift off. Also explains the relative ease in which they get up and their apparent stability. Whether they're fast compared to their rivals is another story.

Let me break it down for you...

FAST:

DSC_1009.jpg

SLOW:

Screen_Shot_2020-07-14_at_10_01.51_AM.png

That's really all you need to know right now when it comes to B1.

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5 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

This might explain that scuffing wash Weta has noted before lift off.

Here's another lift-off, in a decent breeze.

DSC_1022.jpg

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1 minute ago, weta27 said:

Here's another lift-off, in a decent breeze.

Definitely a different look to Te Aihe pre lift off.

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12 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Let me break it down for you...

FAST:

DSC_1009.jpg

SLOW:

Screen_Shot_2020-07-14_at_10_01.51_AM.png

That's really all you need to know right now when it comes to B1.

I don't think I'm the only one awaiting the first of many nosedives from AM. If they aren't doing them ... they aren't finding the limits

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13 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Let me break it down for you...

maybe a bit of work still to do on cornering technique ....

DSC_1030.jpg

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3 minutes ago, weta27 said:

maybe a bit of work still to do on cornering technique ....

DSC_1030.jpg

You mean they should corner more like this?

yysw275973.jpg

Does look fast.

 

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:D :D :D 

I bet we see some mishaps for AM in the near future too, it’s howling out there on ‘HairWhacky Gulf’ most days now. 

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In all seriousness, Weta, thanks for the great imagery. You're good at this dude. Much respect.

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2 hours ago, mikenz2 said:

First flight this morning:

 

 

 

Whats going on at 0:40 seconds in?  Looks like they rotate the leeward foil up for a few seconds.  You can see the foil tip come out of the water.  Is that a mistake or maybe trying to create less side slippage?  Maybe something like trying to rotate the boat up over the foil instead of just getting enough lift from it?

 

Edit, or maybe they just heel to windward a bunch....

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It was my impression too that Te Kahu was much faster. The size difference seems to accentuate the speed and maneuverability though.

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1 hour ago, Flippin Out said:

Has anyone ever seen @weta27 and Richard Gladwell in the same room together ?

Yes it has happened, but I warn you, it's not a pretty sight!

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55 minutes ago, weta27 said:

Actually, at times Te Kahu made Defiant look like she was standing still ... :D

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She would do the same to NZ's big brother too. She's nimble, She's lighter, hell she could be faster? Makes you wonder why don't they just go with 38 footers so everyone can enter the Cup? :D

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There is another video on the Emirates Team New Zealand AC36 fanpage on fb too if anyone is interested 

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1 hour ago, weta27 said:

Yes it has happened, but I warn you, it's not a pretty sight!

Are you a love child then perhaps ?? :wub:

Keep up the amazing work with the photos mate. I'm not sure that everyone on here appreciates just how privileged we are that you share them all with us. I most certainly am. Can't wait until the other two boats arrive too.

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^^ that was a special moment. Neck and neck, no one knows who is sandbagging but I've waited a long time for that shot. Congrats !!!

Wonder if we'll see te aihe out there..probably toobusy shining her up for the sale :lol:

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5 hours ago, mikenz2 said:

First flight this morning:

 

It pushes a lot of water prior to lift off. Certainly we haven’t seen anything similar on Te Ahie. 

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3 hours ago, Stingray~ said:

Great photos, thank you so much you guys. 
 

A66AE258-D15F-46B5-9730-F4CF47D8B347.thumb.jpeg.62e4c542f4aa8211960db1517742ff36.jpeg

That can happen?! #LifeGoals

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Please don't tell the KiWhingersTM that Deano and DEFIANT utterly humiliated Bungling and Te Buhu  in a head-to-head...

95446251_ScreenShot2020-07-28at12_41_16AM.png.d1a92058ad81596b491482fe08900e9f.png

There will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth. Heh.

Welcome to the real world boys.

PS - If you zoom in, you can see Deano give a little wave to Bungling as he passes.

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4 hours ago, Sailbydate said:

Gotta say it. Of all the AC36 boats, AM has the finest looking sails. 

I was thinking the jib looks a little tired... then I scrolled and read your post

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“Deck sweeper” and associated crew positioning is clearly an afterthought.

Try running around the mast as the jib moves through the fore triangle through a foiling tack.

I see a lot of flapping of sails through the tacks too. It’s something I hadn’t noticed on ETNZ’s boat, but it must happen without job tracks. 

6DC327AC-C856-4D21-9B16-A87F5133A306.png

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2 hours ago, Horn Rock said:

 

let the mindfucking begin...

Looked almost par for speed, TK seemed to sandbag start and finish.  AM made no effort to avoid them.  That must give ETNZ some useful data vs nothing useful for the Covid refugees. Must be annoying LOL

 

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^^^^^^ The shaping of the main is quite different on Defiant. Whereas Te Aihe has the top 3rd open, Defiant has about half her main open - different twist setups. Defiant looks to be turning a bigger circle through the manoeuvers as well. Seems to be going around more gently.

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1 hour ago, smackdaddy said:

Please don't tell the KiWhingersTM that Deano and DEFIANT utterly humiliated Bungling and Te Buhu  in a head-to-head...

95446251_ScreenShot2020-07-28at12_41_16AM.png.d1a92058ad81596b491482fe08900e9f.png

There will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth. Heh.

Welcome to the real world boys.

PS - If you zoom in, you can see Deano give a little wave to Bungling as he passes.

Oh my, you're right. We should just hand The Americas Cup over right now and save us the humiliation and burden of holding the regatta.

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19 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

^^^^^^ The shaping of the main is quite different on Defiant. Whereas Te Aihe has the top 3rd open, Defiant has about half her main open - different twist setups. Defiant looks to be turning a bigger circle through the manoeuvers as well. Seems to be going around more gently.

Negative/neutral camber at the head?

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OK in that video AM is faster than Te Aihe which shouldn't be a surprise. Hard to tell how much faster but the Kiwis will know the answer. Great to see 2 boats having a play. Deano is back in his homeland and may have some tricks up his sleeve? One things for sure AM have done well getting to NZ and now sailing way ahead of the Italians and the British in terms of time. Makes sense they launched earlier too. Who knows how B2's will look like? Can't wait.............:o

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4 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

OK in that video AM is faster than Te Aihe which shouldn't be a surprise. Hard to tell how much faster but the Kiwis will know the answer. Great to see 2 boats having a play. Deano is back in his homeland and may have some tricks up his sleeve? One things for sure AM have done well getting to NZ and now sailing way ahead of the Italians and the British in terms of time. Makes sense they launched earlier too. Who knows how B2's will look like? Can't wait.............:o

Shouldn't be a surprise? Don't tell that to the KiWhingersTM - you'll break their delusional little hearts.

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17 minutes ago, smackdaddy said:

Shouldn't be a surprise? Don't tell that to the KiWhingersTM - you'll break their delusional little hearts.

A straight line is irrelevant if you get your ass kicked around the course. Oracle proved that. AM wont make it to the match.

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28 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

OK in that video AM is faster than Te Aihe which shouldn't be a surprise

Should have gone to Specsavers bro Te Kahu is a scale model by some 50% so in your case when she says size doesn’t matter she is just being polite.

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TH - "As always, you can't say enough good things about how the New Zealand Government has treated us, and helped us through this"

Reality continues to be far cry from the trolls' prediction the corrupt NZ govt was in kahoots with GD and would screw AM over... :P

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Clearing the sdcard at the end of the day.... here's a couple more clips of the two boats in the same bit of water

 

 

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On 7/27/2020 at 2:51 PM, Stingray~ said:

Just stop, nobody needs your shitty attacks. You too, think about it. 

ah, i had to scroll back a bit to find this once i had a laptop up.

you sir, are an apologist POS that has been called out hundreds of times as you slip into your innuendo attacks with a passive aggressive flavour for the 15 years i've been here. Then you slip into your passive mode for a bit, giving lollys to all.

I can call you out for: spam posting to reach your 10k, cut and paste BS, stupid questions about shit that you are obviously able to research; as your cup feed is pretty large.

moreover, you live on a lake, have never helmed a boat, and are the worst kind of keyboard warrior, based on your admission of being a redmond IT boy.

There have been many here call you out, but ..i'm a poisoned personal attacker. (my fav being RO!)

you had the spinbot handle before i came on here, and for all your mild manner shit slinging you are just that to me, a POS with no fucking idea what makes a boat move using the power of the wind.

cheers.  

ps. you, TC, and your buddy hawke are trolls of a feather...hope you enjoy being tarred with that and some seagull feathers

 

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2 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

Love your videos Mike, but I wish you had my Miller DS5 fluid head.

shipping costs for a givealittle?

 

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7 hours ago, Sailbydate said:

Gotta say it. Of all the AC36 boats, AM has the finest looking sails. 

Did you forget the Purple Font SBD?

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2 minutes ago, barfy said:

shipping costs for a givealittle?

It's quite heavy for shipping....I only paid $400 for it second hand...Quality tripods are worth buying second hand, as there's not much to go wrong with them, yet you usually get them for a big discount on new.

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6 minutes ago, Horn Rock said:

Love your videos Mike, but I wish you had my Miller DS5 fluid head.

Walking up Queen Street and picking up a fluid head is pretty high on my todo list. Also interesting when at full zoom, with the tripod locked off, I can see the OIS compensating for the sway of my apartment building :-)

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4 minutes ago, Boink said:

Did you forget the Purple Font SBD?

I agree - they're the only ones not using Norths, and they don't look great - to me.

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1 minute ago, mikenz2 said:

with the tripod locked off, I can see the OIS compensating for the sway of my apartment building :-)

Switch off OIS when mounted. Manual focus would probably be better as well.

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