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By the lee

525's - "The Original Sport Boat"

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Used to have one, moved up to a Holder 20, now on to a Tripp 26, getting closer to a sporty with each jump

525 was great to learn and not too slow, but not really a sportboat

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I believe the first sport boat would be my 1985 Hot Foot 20. Everything but the prod and asymetric.

Disp 1000lb  SA 224 sq ft. SA / Disp 36.07 so powered up

Draft 5 ft with 400 lb bulb on lifting keel   Bal/Disp 40%

Dis/Length 76.55  Planes like a Mother Farker in breeze. First owner of my boat claims 19 knots. I have seen 14-15 in 25 ish breeze flat water.

Designed by Doug Hemphill. Doug should have followed through on this design and built a 25 footer along the same thinking except with a prod and asymetric. He could have beat Melges to market.

 

 

 

VooDoo.jpg

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Na the S20 is the "Original Sport Boat", so says the brochure.  :D:P  525 used all the lessons learned but had to put it into an IOR package.  

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Na the S20 is not known as the Tuna 20 for nothing. I have owned one of those too. Fun boat but not in the same league. Lots of broaches on my Tuna. Hot Foot gets more solid the faster it goes. 14 knots and it feels like it is on rails.

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Don't forget the Venture 21 (Pre-1970).  1200 lbs., 5.5 draft.  And they plane rather easily at around 12 mph wind.  Just ask Dennis Connor.  He got beat by Venture 21 rather handily in an Ocean Race in the late 60's.  Roger MacGregor was driving.  Dennis was in a 60 footer.

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3 hours ago, JimB said:

Na the S20 is not known as the Tuna 20 for nothing. I have owned one of those too. Fun boat but not in the same league. Lots of broaches on my Tuna. Hot Foot gets more solid the faster it goes. 14 knots and it feels like it is on rails.

No argument here, but the hotfoot was first built in the 80's, predecessor to the ultimate 20.  First Santana was 1975, so there you go.  :P

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Yes the Hot Foot was the inspiration for the Ultimate 20. I like the Ultimate and would consider one for my next adventure. Problem is I am not sure it would be a good move from a performance perspective. It has been a few years, I have only raced my Hot Foot against one Ultimate 20  but pretty much axe murdered it boat on boat every time on w/l courses. Never raced a distance race with lots of reaching against one. I expect the results would be different in reaching conditions. Anyone else out there with experience or have seen a Hot Foot racing against against an Ultimate?

When you look at he additional sail area the Ultimate carries you would think the Ultimate would be faster all way round as per the diff in PHRF rating. Maybe the Ultimate I have encountered was not in good hands. I never really watched the guy as I was always ahead of him and focusing on beating J24s etc.

 

 

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Not this again... Please define 'original' and 'sportboat', then let's talk.

Flying 15 was 1947, probably good candidate as the 2nd.

1st sailed 1939. 

One ten going to weather.png
An International 110 racing to weather.
Development
Design one-design
Boat
Draft 3 ft (0.91 m)
Hull
Type Monohull
Hull weight 910 lb (410 kg) (min)
LOA 24 ft (7.3 m)
LWL 18 ft (5.5 m)
Beam 4 ft (1.2 m)
Hull Appendages
Keel/Board Type Fixed
Rig
Mast Length 23 ft (7.0 m)
Sails
Spinnaker area 100 sq ft (9.3 m2)
Upwind Sail Area 157 sq ft (14.6 m2)

2 Photo by Onne van der Wal

 

19800799_10154775881023997_6179414619945949841_o.jpg

20023833_10154775826098997_7252981755979257485_o.jpg

vineyard1976.jpg

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23 hours ago, pasta514 said:

Not this again... Please define 'original' and 'sportboat', then let's talk.

Flying 15 was 1947, probably good candidate as the 2nd.

1st sailed 1939. 

One ten going to weather.png
An International 110 racing to weather.
Development
Design one-design
Boat
Draft 3 ft (0.91 m)
Hull
Type Monohull
Hull weight 910 lb (410 kg) (min)
LOA 24 ft (7.3 m)
LWL 18 ft (5.5 m)
Beam 4 ft (1.2 m)
Hull Appendages
Keel/Board Type Fixed
Rig
Mast Length 23 ft (7.0 m)
Sails
Spinnaker area 100 sq ft (9.3 m2)
Upwind Sail Area 157 sq ft (14.6 m2)

2 Photo by Onne van der Wal

 

19800799_10154775881023997_6179414619945949841_o.jpg

20023833_10154775826098997_7252981755979257485_o.jpg

vineyard1976.jpg

I think that you both have it wrong. 

 

Both  the international 110 and flying fifteen are both fixed keel boats and a sports boat has a dagger board keel. 

 

So it’s got to be the international tempest. 

22 feet long, 6’4”  wide, 3’7” draft and only 480 kgs designed back in 1965

 

the other boats are quick, but not designed to be trailable like the tempest.

 

pulpit

 

 

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Another vote for the Flying fifteen - fixed keel or not it was the original Grin machine - a boat with enough ballast to keep you out of trouble most of the time,  and slippery and powered-up enough to outright plane off.   Fun,  fun FUN boats.

 

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51 minutes ago, eerie sailor said:

I always thought the mid 90s was cool for sport yachts. Mumm 30, Melges 30 and Henderson 30.

And Melges 24!

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On 10/28/2017 at 11:47 PM, pasta514 said:

Not this again... Please define 'original' and 'sportboat', then let's talk.

Flying 15 was 1947, probably good candidate as the 2nd.

1st sailed 1939. 

One ten going to weather.png
An International 110 racing to weather.
Development
Design one-design
Boat
Draft 3 ft (0.91 m)
Hull
Type Monohull
Hull weight 910 lb (410 kg) (min)
LOA 24 ft (7.3 m)
LWL 18 ft (5.5 m)
Beam 4 ft (1.2 m)
Hull Appendages
Keel/Board Type Fixed
Rig
Mast Length 23 ft (7.0 m)
Sails
Spinnaker area 100 sq ft (9.3 m2)
Upwind Sail Area 157 sq ft (14.6 m2)

2 Photo by Onne van der Wal

 

19800799_10154775881023997_6179414619945949841_o.jpg

20023833_10154775826098997_7252981755979257485_o.jpg

vineyard1976.jpg

Agree, the ORIGINAL sport boat. Keelboat with ability to plane, great boats by C. Raymond Hunt

 

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On 11/17/2017 at 8:40 PM, Varan said:

And Melges 24!

 Take a look at the lines of a Henderson 30 which came out a few years before the melges 24. I think RP stole the lines and shrunk them.  It was my first thought the first time I saw the underbelly of a Melges 24.

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15 hours ago, dolphinmaster said:

 Take a look at the lines of a Henderson 30 which came out a few years before the melges 24. I think RP stole the lines and shrunk them.  It was my first thought the first time I saw the underbelly of a Melges 24.

Melges 24 = 1993ish

Henderson 30 = 1997ish

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Look at the hull lines and rig of a Thistle 1952 Sandy Scott design I think. Plumb bow, wide flat stern, plaining machine with a huge main and small fore triangle. My vote for Original sport boat...

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On ‎10‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 11:56 AM, shaggy said:

Na the S20 is the "Original Sport Boat", so says the brochure.  :D:P  525 used all the lessons learned but had to put it into an IOR package.  

The 525 was not "an IOR package".  It was Shad's response to the J24.  Like the J24 it rated close to Half Ton under IOR, with a sailing speed closer to Quarter Ton.  Being a bit lighter than the J some thought it should be faster.  But with the flexy construction and craptacular rig they weren't.

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On 12/8/2017 at 12:21 PM, Movable Ballast said:

Look at the hull lines and rig of a Thistle 1952 Sandy Scott design I think. Plumb bow, wide flat stern, plaining machine with a huge main and small fore triangle. My vote for Original sport boat...

The Thistle has a centerboard... so not a sportboat.

 

110 is the original sportboat.  Flying Fifteen is an admirable second.  Both kick ass designs that are still faster than loads of modern shapes to this day.  Planing on a blast reach doing 15+ kts on a 110 is truly one of my favorite experiences in life so far.  

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First boat was the 525, second 5.5 (Columbia Saber), third 505 and now the Tempest, THE original sport boat from Ian Proctor.

The Tempest still kicks on the newer designs, we beat the factory crewed U20 on the longest inshore race on the west coast, a 70 mile downwind drag race. Ended the race with my mast inverted and still beat the U20 by a minute and a half after 8 hours racing. In one race with big air (30+) hitting over 16 knots in a wind blown crossing of San Pablo Bay in SF.

Loves heavy air and is a great boat for SF Bay. Races competitive with the SC27, U20, and Moore 24's which I would call the second "original" sport boat after the Tempest. Wabbits are very fast as well and just about untouchable under PHRF downwind.

Been thinking about doing over the Tempest with an open transom and a reworked keel.

09-29-06_1252.jpg

Nelson, Chris-079 8x12.jpg

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