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southerncross

VOR Leg 2 Lisbon to Cape Town

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3 hours ago, Chasm said:

Liz also called for help right away. That shortens reaction time. OTOH if someone is not calling they might need help even more.

Good point. Watching it, and the short video off the boat, again, I realized that it wasn't just them being slow getting in the J1 that cost them in the rounding. When Liz went down Dee stopped the turn and kept them pointed downwind, which I think was an important factor in getting Liz untangled without more harm being done to her. But it meant that they ended up sailing past the leeward mark by a boat length or more, which gave Vestas room to round inside them.

Her upset face that Sam zoomed in on once she was back on the rail; I've been thinking about that, and about her interaction with the medical person who met them in the RIB on the way back in. I think she was worrying about what the injury means going forward. They're leaving for leg 2 tomorrow, and if she's not 100% it's going to be a tough call.

I hope she's good to go. Her not being on the boat would be a huge blow to the team; you can see from the leg 1 videos what an important role she plays.

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1 hour ago, Alinghi4ever said:

jbc,

Check out this cute Video from Carolijn Brower and her son

 

The think I really like about this VOR is that these women are hard as it goes in their 30's and 40s. Pure sexy.

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I like to think of myself as a fairly competent nav and have a Transpac navigators trophy to back it up.  But, I'm glad to be only armchair navving for this race. 

This next leg is going to be a navigator's brain buster.  They are all going to be working hard for their money. 

Removing the Fernando Wp, really does put the emphasis on getting the lane right, to get through the doldrums.  Then, the South Atlantic High could well be a huge pot hole in the course!

West is not Best....................today!

 

VOR leg2comps.JPG

VORLeg2sum.JPG

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Thanks HH. East is least, west best, but west Magenta says  . . .  22D10hrs?

5 of the 7 skippers' comments compiled a few hours ago by VOR's Will Carson: 

Quote

“It’s a very interesting one, maybe more interesting than in the past,” said Charlie Enright, the skipper of Leg 1 winner, Vestas 11th Hour Racing. “You usually have to go nearly all the way to Brazil… ‘West is best’ as they say…”

“I think (taking out the waypoint) changes things a lot,” said Sun Hun Kai/Scallywag skipper David Witt. “I think this will be an interesting leg and I think you might see the biggest split you’ve seen for a long time in the Volvo Ocean Race. But we’ll see what happens.”

“For sure you can go more east,” agreed Dongfeng Race Team skipper Charles Caudrelier. “The difference is huge, but it’s a danger (tactically). It’s always a balance and it’s always difficult to know where to go. It will be a nightmare for the navigators.”

“Let’s see. Hopefully the others will go the short way and we’ll keep going west,” said Xabi Fernández. “It’s hard to know. It will be busy for (navigator) Juan Vila. But we trust his instincts and his work and hopefully we have a good crossing of the equator.”

“It’s a leg of 21 or 22 days with technical decisions to make every day,” said Simeon Tienpont, the skipper of team AkzoNobel, who has added the experience of Chris Nicholson, Jules Salter and Peter Van Niekerk to his crew for this leg.

http://www.volvooceanrace.com/en/news/10233_-We-re-in-this-for-something-bigger-.html

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Thanks for the routing Hitch.  It's certainly not normal to go left of the St. Hell high.  I wonder if the high pressure that far south creates risk of being stopped by the ice zone.  Happened in last Vendee IIRC.

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6 minutes ago, Alinghi4ever said:

 

As you said picking the right lane through the doldrums and getting around the South Atlantic High will be the Key.

Are you competing in the ""stating the bleeding obvious" olympics?

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14 minutes ago, stief said:

Thanks HH. East is least, west best, but west Magenta says  . . .  22D10hrs?

5 of the 7 skippers' comments compiled a few hours ago by VOR's Will Carson: 

http://www.volvooceanrace.com/en/news/10233_-We-re-in-this-for-something-bigger-.html

Steif, the Magenta routing is from yesterday, so that window has closed! I left it in as a reference.  Clearly it does not work now since it ends up going through the South Atlantic High!

Also, these forecasts are only really good for maybe five days out, even though I'm running 14 days out. There after everything is an outright lie!

Edit: Stief, those quotes are great.

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2 minutes ago, Alinghi4ever said:

I know that's obvious. Just wanted to reinforce what Hitch said.

Don't.

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Remember the VOR edition when newby Groupama went Africa coast hugging. Didn’t end well for Camas. West will be best as always and the non way point for FdN just means more options where to cross the doldrums?

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21 minutes ago, NORBowGirl said:

Are you competing in the ""stating the bleeding obvious" olympics?

Not competing really, he’s already won gold. 

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19 minutes ago, Alinghi4ever said:

Bottom Line:

We all here on SA are Amateurs compared to the Teams who have Pro-Navigators onboard the Boats so we will probably all be wrong which route to pick.

Speak for yourself fuckface.

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Summary of the route options by the skippers for those who prefer to watch and hear rather than read:

 

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^^^Nothing new learned here. Except this whole earth spinning thing.  Who Knew?

 Holding their cards very close to the chest.

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41 minutes ago, Hitchhiker said:

^^^Nothing new learned here. Except this whole earth spinning thing.  Who Knew?

 Holding their cards very close to the chest.

Agree. Was hoping Charlie might troll about his Vestas computer modelling advantage. Xabi clearly means to go west; Simeon's "21 or 22 days" matches your "west route" from yesterday. Whole piece seems to try and drum up more interest in the route than the skippers shown.

Simeon's "technical decisions" reference was a bit confusing. Not sure if he means "tactical/strategic" as in routing choices, or referred to sailing "technique" as in sail setting/trim and other such "technical" aspects more to do with 'getting there fast" rather than 'where to go'. 

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I have Alinghi on ignore. But you, Sparrow, keep quoting Alinghi, which renders my ignore useless!

Please desist from this course action.  It doesn't have to be like this.

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The routing strategy for this leg is usually peppered with the phrases "West is Best", First in First Out" etc.

They still apply however I think with it now being a Sans Fernando Mark leg, a fresh synonym comes into play. I call it the the Verdes Dash. How teams shine or otherwise in doing well at that may well determine the winners and the also rans more than any other factor in this leg.

The reason being that those at the front will have a greater selection of doorways through the convergence zone to choose from. Conversely the backmarkers with no WP to drag them in their wake are going to be under a lot of pressure to take the first doorway offering that comes up to get to the other side.

However this will increase the risk of them going too early and being stranded. That then will stretch the rubberband between them and the leaders to possibly breaking point, and from which there is no return. However that said it may be a doorway that can take a backmarker to the front, albeit unlikely.

So I think the objective for teams to today is crossing the start line and from the very first metre going as fast as possible for every metre between there and the Verdes without taking the peddle off. Once there it may be possible to take a break as the breeze softens and clocks while looking for the best doorway. 

The secret is going to have still enough gas in the tank to keep going at close to optimum pace after doing the Verdes Dash. To me having optimum crew numbers and gender in this first part of Leg 2 is arguably more important than  Sth Ocean legs.  Once they get through to the other side weather and when to pull the trigger to go left, not will-power, strength and boat speed will have a greater impact on determining gaps, gains and losses.

Interestingly in the briefing most of the skippers talked around east versus west with no Fernando mark. The only one I think that implied the Verdes Dash might be on was Teapot. 

Maybe the others were just foxing?

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2 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

..keep quoting Alinghi, which renders my ignore useless!

Shit hitch that's a new one...no where to hide, Aliguist complaints have no end...maybe a Perpetual Motion Generator is responsible for his posts??

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Would you plan to pass west of Funchal while true wind is strong enough for deep run without sacrificing too much or steer for Canary and make west when angles get better?

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1 hour ago, Hitchhiker said:

Oh I hope this is an anomaly

Mate you should have binned not posted that ugly might get kissed scenario.. damages your reputation  ;-) Hint select a few arbitary but conventional dolly doorways as WP's, changes the outcome enormously.

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15 hours ago, jbc said:

I hope she's good to go. Her not being on the boat would be a huge blow to the team; you can see from the leg 1 videos what an important role she plays.

Yes, definitely one of the key players. However if she is not ok I hope that she sits out the leg instead of toughing it out. The race is long and the southern legs are coming. Not a good place to have a lingering injury and having to step off the boat at that point is worse for the team.
Same for Neti.

Very good reaction of everyone on board. Lets not test that scenario again.

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2 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

So I think the objective for teams to today is crossing the start line and from the very first metre going as fast as possible for every metre between there and the Verdes without taking the peddle off.

I hope they read this. They might not have thought about crossing the line and sail fast. :ph34r::rolleyes:

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9 minutes ago, ModernViking said:

I hope they read this. They might not have thought about crossing the line and sail fast. :ph34r::rolleyes:

Eric ever seen a 1,500 metre runner treat it as just a 15 X 100m sprints?? If so you would know they don't tend to waste a lot of printers ink.

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1 minute ago, jack_sparrow said:

Eric ever seen a 1500 metre runner treat it as just 15 X 100m sprint ?? If so you would know they don't tend to waste a lot of printers ink.

Welax :-) It was just too much of a temptation, not to quoute that (out of context) 

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16 hours ago, Alinghi4ever said:

jbc,

Check out this cute Video from Carolijn Brower and her son

 

Thanks! I did indeed really love that. You know me well. :)

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51 minutes ago, Chasm said:

Yes, definitely one of the key players. However if she is not ok I hope that she sits out the leg instead of toughing it out. The race is long and the southern legs are coming. Not a good place to have a lingering injury and having to step off the boat at that point is worse for the team.
Same for Neti.

Very good reaction of everyone on board. Lets not test that scenario again.

Agreed on all points. Watching the cockpit footage yet again, Dee actually had started turning to port for the mark rounding when the incident happened, but immediately *turned back to starboard* to go DDW and help blanket the J1.

Had a whole discussion with my partner in crime tonight about the incident after we watched it again (both videos), frame by frame. I was saying how impressed I was with the quick reactions and decision-making of everyone involved. The PiC was like, yeah, but Liz made a mistake, right? To which I was like yeah, but:

  • the pointy end is the realm of chaos
  • esp. on these boats with these short-handed crews (and especially on this boat in particular, given the relative inexperience of many of the crew) maneuvers tend toward rapid evolutions and having to improvise/extemporize
  • the in-ports' short courses and the tight one-design roundings make all this worse
  • it was breezy/gusty/squally. again: worse.

All that makes it understandable for me that she got into that mess, losing track of the slack in the sheet and sticking her feet in the bight when she shifted her position while her eyes were aloft. And then I think her automatic first reaction when she started getting dragged by the left foot was to shift her weight to her right foot to try to raise the left foot and free herself. But what her reptilian hindbrain didn't realize was that her right foot was *also* in the bight, and by the time she even knew what was happening she'd been dragged across the deck and pinned against the lifeline.

It's revealing, I think, that pretty much the exact same type of accident happened to Ñeti in the same race, where a lazy sheet on the foredeck whipped across and took his feet out from under him.

Y'all go on sometimes about how the 65s are nerfed compared to the 70s, and that's obviously true. But they're still big, powerful boats that can fuck you up in an hurry. Liz (and Henry and Sam and Dee) were all impressive as hell.

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7 hours ago, Miffy said:

Would you plan to pass west of Funchal while true wind is strong enough for deep run without sacrificing too much or steer for Canary and make west when angles get better?

Miff first my apologies for missing your post. I just dialled back in after 3 hours or so and expected it to be a frenzy here now in advance of start time. Seems not other than Aliguist doing a colour check of wet weather gear. I haven't checked the news but has Rocket Man pulled the trigger and killed southern and his early rising US buddies?

Anyway in answer to your question as it seems the room is empty I will do my best to respond. Having regard for my PC with routing programmes being converscated in 1995, (I was jailed then for saying the V60 resembled a floating block of flats and Volvo engines resembled a BarMix) but the guards here letting me poke my finger out the cell window just now, my sumation is  this after doing some quick Coriolis effect corrections as I'm in the southern hemisphere.

The Funchal and Canary split is always a tough one. However history shows being a buffalo girl on the outside or a pig on the inside rarely pays a dividend. 

So go middle I reakon, then again my finger might have been turned around the wrong way or I was taking the opportunity of giving Alinguist the finger. Who knows.

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31 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Seems not other than Aliguist doing a colour check of wet weather gear. I haven't checked the news but has Rocket Man pulled the trigger and killed southern and his early rising US buddies?

Rest of us are practicing being silent...... oops that's blown it!

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21 hours ago, Alinghi4ever said:

jbc,

Check out this cute Video from Carolijn Brower and her son

 

That's really sweet. Let the start begin!

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 Good. Other than some updates to the ice zone, nothing new on the Noticeboard. So, no new protests.

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41 minutes ago, Alinghi4ever said:

The last time we have had this kind of big breeze the first Night was in 2011/2012 out of the NE.

The wind whipped around the hedge surrounding the pool and on account of it being a really hot day heated up the paving pool surrounds so the breeze had this crazy criss cross effect happening. 

I remember it clearly now being stuck between the current from the filtration pump return and the umpires big deckchair on the west side causing the breeze to clock left not right as we all expected. 

How we got a great start to that Leg of the 11/12 RC Round the Pool Coping Race  I don't know.

I remember seeing a video of that.

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20 minutes ago, stief said:

 So, no new protests.

Stief...no protests yes ..Bindi tells me  there was a bit of Lisbon pool time yesterday to get certs in order. She said she wore her best thong which finishes behind her ears to distract supervisors to guarantee a good result for Team Paintwagon. All good.

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1 hour ago, rogerfal said:

I haven't checked the news but has Rocket Man pulled the trigger and killed southern and his early rising US buddies?

Finally.  The morning routine: feed the animals, feed the kids, make the coffee before I can bloody sit down.   

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8 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

Maybe the others were just foxing?

A lot of that going on I reckon.

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Hehe. Bindi losing credibility with Sailing Illustrated?

Quote

We will never reveal our sources, and if you have a hot tip please don't hesitate to send it to us at sailingillustrated@gmail.com.

On the other hand we are also keen to debunk rampant rumors when we are reasonably certain that they are not true. To wit, this afternoon your Ed. heard from a few friends in Lisbon saying we should watch the Jury Notice Board, suggesting that a number of the other six VOR teams would be lodging protests against AkzoNobel – alleging that one or two of their latest crew additions had not taken and passed the requisite "RYA Yachtmaster" requirement for all VOR racers. 

We have checked this out, and are satisfied that idea of such protests are more in the way of wishful thinking on the parts of people close to other teams, or not happy about Team AkzoNobel for other reasons.

https://www.sailingillustrated.com/single-post/2017/11/03/VOR-AkzoNobel-announces-that-Jules-Salter-GBR-is-re-joining-the-team-Chris-Nicholson-AUS-and-Peter-van-Niekerk-NED-are-new-additions-will-Akzo-be-protested

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Gabart due west of Lisbon last update.

TJV starting in an hour. I wonder if we'll see some passes by the Multi 50's, Maxi Tri's or IMOCA's?

A pass filmed from one of the the boats by Gitana and Josse would be something.

 

Screen Shot 2017-11-05 at 1.38.07 PM.png

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Two things for this new page:

 

1) VOR dock walk/dockout show for Lisbon start:

 

2) TJV Is live with some incredible coverage:

 

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4 minutes ago, stief said:

Hehe. Bindi losing credibility with Sailing Illustrated?

Come on stief where do you think SI Little Larry got that from... we dribble some bits out for $ so the girls aren't on the street. Can you see that guy doing tequila shooters at Tasca do Chico in Bairo Alto last Friday night with most team crews, and then doing the strip game. His heart would fail. 

Today's Sunday mate and he has just caught up. Give him his due though we got suckered  on the team annoucenent thing. Won't happen again. The man is sitting in a rocking chair in California begging for contacts. We are on the ground and  don't sell our soul unless Fox, Disney or CBS call.

Oops back to the start

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Bice instead of Conrad commenting? 

That hole in VS11's sail didn't seem to hurt them short-term  . . .  good to see them change it out.

(thinks there's a 2hr minimum penalty to dock and substitute it?)

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1 minute ago, stief said:

Bice instead of Conrad commenting? 

That hole in VS11's sail. didn't seem to hurt them short-term  . . .  good to see them change it out.

(thinks there's a 2hr minimum penalty to dock and substitute it?)

Looks like something that could be patched up underway, if they have at least some equipment for that. Do they?

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I take it with the Dong assured of hitting the mark first then Aliguist's penis has exploded in his own mouth? Surely there is no chance of a recovery from that? Help me God.

 

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6 minutes ago, ModernViking said:

Looks like something that could be patched up underway, if they have at least some equipment for that. Do they?

During the last editions they had a sewing machine with them. No reason it should be different this time

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22 minutes ago, ModernViking said:

Looks like something that could be patched up underway, if they have at least some equipment for that. Do they?

yep, they will glue it together. 

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4 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

An adhesive gun is not like the old days of a sewing machine. 

"The old days" being the last edition or the one before

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Just now, Rennmaus said:

"The old days" being the last edition or the one before

I think I remember it being a call for some boats wether to take one or not to save weight. 

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Some domestic impressions from the days of yore (2011/12)
by Amory Ross/PUMA Ocean Racing/Volvo Ocean Race:

Ryan Godfrey (Puma) repairing a ripped sail with the onboard sewing machinevor030312_ross_0102.jpg.f5319fb544ee011a6206eba28e902a1e.jpg 

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2 minutes ago, owe.jessen said:

The teams are dropping their guests rather brutally, letting them jump of board at - 15-20kn. #thatmusthurt

Given the chance, who wouldn't? What a ride.

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24 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

I take it with the Dong assured of hitting the mark first then Aliguist's penis has exploded in his own mouth? Surely there is no chance of a recovery from that? Help me God.

 

I don't think he is old enough to have that experience

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Gonna be game on for the next several days.  Looks like the splits will start to happen around Wednesday/Thursday.

Btw.  happy Guy Fawkes day!

VORLeg2sum2.JPG

VORroute1.JPG

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2 minutes ago, Tropical Madness said:

Comeone Akzo throw in a reef, youre killing me

furled away allready

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