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DtM

THE REAL 2018 Australian Multihull Championships

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We need a thread for the real 2018 Multihulls Australian Championship.

Was Wangi agreed at the meeting at the last Championships?

If so when?  If not where and when?

Race for the real trophies with the history.

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good questions ..

but a left field one for you all: Why are we using (and appear to have been doing it for a while) Northern Hemisphere delineation of the championships?

Every other class and association I have been involved with over the past 50 years nominate the Aus Titles as, for example, 2017/18.

It is only fixed regatta events (eg Hamo/Airlie/Syd-Hob, yada yada) that have a single year date name. Mobile regattas (ie different states/clubs) such as state and national titles all call themselves by the sailing season. This would get rid of the ludicrous situation of having champs 3 months apart, then an 11 month gap - but only if we all decide to play ball together nicely. 

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19 hours ago, DtM said:

We need a thread for the real 2018 Multihulls Australian Championship.

Was Wangi agreed at the meeting at the last Championships?

If so when?  If not where and when?

Race for the real trophies with the history.

How can it be the "real championships" when it is decided by the only sailors that turned up to the regatta that year.  Surely there needs to be a more represenaitive group making the decisions.  Why are the champs decided by this group only sailed in Cat 7 locations, because it suits them?

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24 minutes ago, trt131 said:

How can it be the "real championships" when it is decided by the only sailors that turned up to the regatta that year.  Surely there needs to be a more represenaitive group making the decisions.  Why are the champs decided by this group only sailed in Cat 7 locations, because it suits them?

They aren't. See Clause 2.1 NOR of the most recent Championships. Cat 5. We were required to submit an Audit form to enter and advised at briefing that safety was being taken seriously and checks would be done. 

http://www.mycq.org.au/documents/NOR/2017NORMultihullAusChampionshipsv4.pdf

 

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For the people that have not been and don't understand .You only have to nominate your club (after getting your club to agree ) and it will be put forward on vote day . In this day and age it can be advertised on the net as it has been in the past for the good of all .The existing system has been devised by the most interested and there are no hard and fast rule just fair and just for all .Or you can get a dictator to tell you what you want , The AYF.

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You are right Shane but what about my original questions as to the 2018 venue.

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On ‎11‎/‎9‎/‎2017 at 5:05 PM, DtM said:

You are right Shane but what about my original questions as to the 2018 venue.

If you want it or know anyone that does start planning or it will be up to the committee to ask for host clubs to pick it up . But it will happen .

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if you were referring to my comments (as I have been most vocal & seemingly one of the few concerned about our lack of formal organization like the majority of well functioning classes/associations) - some of us just don't live our lives here.

Shayne - I am already very familiar with the mechanism of  venue choice, and that is one of my concerns - it excludes those of us who are unable to attend for business reasons from even knowing what happened, let alone being part of the decision process.

Zero publicity/info for those of us who are not able to attend every Nationals.

Which is the root cause of DtM's original question - what happened? where is it? Just saying "... it will happen" is not exactly helpful for those of us who have to plan well ahead to hopefully make it! [eg - if it was going to put down for early Jan 2019, I'm out already due to teaching commitments I have been already asked to plan for] ..... and I REALLY want to sail regattas/Nationals!! they are such great events having multiple multis on the water together!

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15 hours ago, Chidz said:

if you were referring to my comments (as I have been most vocal & seemingly one of the few concerned about our lack of formal organization like the majority of well functioning classes/associations) - some of us just don't live our lives here.

Shayne - I am already very familiar with the mechanism of  venue choice, and that is one of my concerns - it excludes those of us who are unable to attend for business reasons from even knowing what happened, let alone being part of the decision process.

Zero publicity/info for those of us who are not able to attend every Nationals.

Which is the root cause of DtM's original question - what happened? where is it? Just saying "... it will happen" is not exactly helpful for those of us who have to plan well ahead to hopefully make it! [eg - if it was going to put down for early Jan 2019, I'm out already due to teaching commitments I have been already asked to plan for] ..... and I REALLY want to sail regattas/Nationals!! they are such great events having multiple multis on the water together!

Sorry but this sounds like me.me.me  not( us can I help )

A lot of people just complain why not just try and put forward what you would like for this next nationals .Its not hard to be positive .Put it forward and try to get What you would like 

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So where dose everyone Want the next nationals and whos club is going to step up ???. Do it, look into it or shut up !!.  Get active say it on the net and do something positive .Have a vote where do you want it ???. Put it forward .

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5 hours ago, shane beyer said:

Sorry but this sounds like me.me.me  not( us can I help )

A lot of people just complain why not just try and put forward what you would like for this next nationals .Its not hard to be positive .Put it forward and try to get What you would like 

Sh*t - what can I say?

I am on record over the last 3 years offering to stand on forming structures/committees to get this up and going, and had varying response from ambivalence to derision to flat out rejection, so where is the 'not us can I help' in that?
Ahh - I see what's happening here, of course, we are are on SA where people can say what they fell like to deliberately insult. Ok, have fun with that.

While-ever Qld dishes Vic/SA & Vic/Sa dishes out back & NSW can't get a paperbag organized together (yes, I know it is not a wave of the magic wand), then YA and any other organized body can step in and organize an Australian title anywhere they feel like... and nothing is going to change anytime soon.

As far as next real nationals - are STILL asking the same question: who/where was it decided on?

Wangi would be great, & I would love to have one at my home club sailing off Cronulla beach (would be spectac!) but logistics and $$ put the handbrake on that.

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5 hours ago, Chidz said:

Sh*t - what can I say?

I am on record over the last 3 years offering to stand on forming structures/committees to get this up and going, and had varying response from ambivalence to derision to flat out rejection, so where is the 'not us can I help' in that?
Ahh - I see what's happening here, of course, we are are on SA where people can say what they fell like to deliberately insult. Ok, have fun with that.

While-ever Qld dishes Vic/SA & Vic/Sa dishes out back & NSW can't get a paperbag organized together (yes, I know it is not a wave of the magic wand), then YA and any other organized body can step in and organize an Australian title anywhere they feel like... and nothing is going to change anytime soon.

As far as next real nationals - are STILL asking the same question: who/where was it decided on?

Wangi would be great, & I would love to have one at my home club sailing off Cronulla beach (would be spectac!) but logistics and $$ put the handbrake on that.

Good you have just started it where dose every one else want it .Put it forward 

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 The Below post is from Goldfinger ,it was posted some time ago on the "other" 2018 Australian multihull championships thread. it appears the 2018 nats was on the cards for SA for 2018.

 

It was on the Cards for Jan/Feb 18 for a long time in SA. We decided to give it to Vic to coincide with the Aust Yachting Championship.  Championships pre Xmas in Southern states are as problematic as regattas post Xmas up North.  Other alternative is to miss a year which is even worse.

Sth Aus and Vic have travelled far and wide for years.  It's about time those from up North including NSW put on their dancing shoes and returned the favour.

We have wanted a National Body for years as well as the Vic's.  The hand break is Qld and NSW don't even have a State Body.

So who's  holding up the show.  

Pits 5 days to tow a boat from Adelaide to Airlie so a day trip from Sydney to Melb should be no problem or two days from Bris Vegas

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22 minutes ago, honestjohn said:

 The Below post is from Goldfinger ,it was posted some time ago on the "other" 2018 Australian multihull championships thread. it appears the 2018 nats was on the cards for SA for 2018.

 

It was on the Cards for Jan/Feb 18 for a long time in SA. We decided to give it to Vic to coincide with the Aust Yachting Championship.  Championships pre Xmas in Southern states are as problematic as regattas post Xmas up North.  Other alternative is to miss a year which is even worse.

Sth Aus and Vic have travelled far and wide for years.  It's about time those from up North including NSW put on their dancing shoes and returned the favour.

We have wanted a National Body for years as well as the Vic's.  The hand break is Qld and NSW don't even have a State Body.

So who's  holding up the show.  

Pits 5 days to tow a boat from Adelaide to Airlie so a day trip from Sydney to Melb should be no problem or two days from Bris Vegas

Who and when was "we decided" and how do you define "hand break (sic) is Qld". I recall in the last annual discussion here about an association a number of people from Qld including myself supporting the concept. We already have a State Association so feel free to talk to them about some form of national body. That doesn't sound like hand brake to me. 

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Correct me if I'm wrong ...

bu it appears from the discussion the only real handbrake is ourselves? [collective generalization]

fart.jpg

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3 hours ago, Chidz said:

Correct me if I'm wrong ...

bu it appears from the discussion the only real handbrake is ourselves? [collective generalization]

fart.jpg

You're perfectly right of course. Nobody seems willing or have the time to do it as has been demonstrated by the lack of action after this same debate each year both here and at various meetings. 

Realistically there are four States involved. Three purportedly have local bodies so that's a really good platform. If NSW could form one or even a loose group of people willing to help then a combined sub group from the four States could do a bit of administration. Doesn't have to be too formal and just agree to get a Club to run each event and privide the necessary infrastructure and insurances etc. 

Back on the topic of this thread, regardless of legitimate or quasi nationals run by the AS dickheads, my understanding was Wangi happens every two years. HJ mentioned earlier that he was going to find out any info on 2018. 

So any progress for a 2018 non nationals at Wangi in Sept/Oct school holidays when some people suggested was a good time?

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20 hours ago, honestjohn said:

 The Below post is from Goldfinger ,it was posted some time ago on the "other" 2018 Australian multihull championships thread. it appears the 2018 nats was on the cards for SA for 2018.

 

It was on the Cards for Jan/Feb 18 for a long time in SA. We decided to give it to Vic to coincide with the Aust Yachting Championship.  Championships pre Xmas in Southern states are as problematic as regattas post Xmas up North.  Other alternative is to miss a year which is even worse.

Sth Aus and Vic have travelled far and wide for years.  It's about time those from up North including NSW put on their dancing shoes and returned the favour.

We have wanted a National Body for years as well as the Vic's.  The hand break is Qld and NSW don't even have a State Body.

So who's  holding up the show.  

Pits 5 days to tow a boat from Adelaide to Airlie so a day trip from Sydney to Melb should be no problem or two days from Bris Vegas

He only had to put it forward to the  vote as they did in South Australia a couple of year ago and they got it .Does anyone remember that .So why are we crying poorly hard done by . Why not do it again if he would like it . Take it to the vote .Not get in bed will the dictators 

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It is up to you .It always was .Don't stand back just do it .Come forward or stop complaining .I'm even shore that if a lot of people could not make the vote it would still be looked at if that was the case  .This is the good for all nationals have a say .

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Plenty of time to go before a real championship, some questions have been asked to the right people in clubs, and things will work out eventually as usual. If any clubs (and their members)  are keen, they know who to contact. The AS thing will flicker for one 3 day 2018 event and then go subliminally for 2 years (of Tas and WA) while the real program continues. :D

 

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12 hours ago, WetnWild said:

You're perfectly right of course. Nobody seems willing or have the time to do it as has been demonstrated by the lack of action after this same debate each year both here and at various meetings. 

Realistically there are four States involved. Three purportedly have local bodies so that's a really good platform. If NSW could form one or even a loose group of people willing to help then a combined sub group from the four States could do a bit of administration. Doesn't have to be too formal and just agree to get a Club to run each event and privide the necessary infrastructure and insurances etc. 

Back on the topic of this thread, regardless of legitimate or quasi nationals run by the AS dickheads, my understanding was Wangi happens every two years. HJ mentioned earlier that he was going to find out any info on 2018. 

So any progress for a 2018 non nationals at Wangi in Sept/Oct school holidays when some people suggested was a good time?

I didn't get a chance to speak with the relevant people on the weekend, i'll chase it up in the next week or so.

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16 minutes ago, honestjohn said:

I didn't get a chance to speak with the relevant people on the weekend, i'll chase it up in the next week or so.

Would be a great outcome hj, nice end of the world!

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10 hours ago, plywoodboy said:

Plenty of time to go before a real championship, some questions have been asked to the right people in clubs, and things will work out eventually as usual. If any clubs (and their members)  are keen, they know who to contact. The AS thing will flicker for one 3 day 2018 event and then go subliminally for 2 years (of Tas and WA) while the real program continues. :D

 

 

8 hours ago, honestjohn said:

centre of the universe actually.

 

Mr P. Hakeeet - love your work ... just my issue (and I'm sure others too) is that I get booked with 'stuff' sometimes 12 months + in advance  (which is what has happened with both real 2107 nats & pretend 2018 Aussies) .. just leaving it to a month or 2 before before getting the word out there eliminates many of us non-retireees from the game.

HJ - i'm sure I read 'centre of my anus' when I first read your post ... but then I stand (or sit) corrected [bhahahaha]

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17 minutes ago, plywoodboy said:

Well you need to get a real job and form a national association !

can imagine the pay is real good for that one!

(says him posting photos of 'his day  in the office' out at Moreton .... :-P)

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12 hours ago, honestjohn said:

I didn't get a chance to speak with the relevant people on the weekend, i'll chase it up in the next week or so.

Nice work HJ. Wangi and LM are great sailing venues. I'll be there in early January sailing an event and will be found for coffee and brekky in the bakery every morning! I should have moved there forty years ago before the Grim City residents discovered the cheap water view real estate. Only problem with Wangi is they have no idea about which football team to support. 

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4 hours ago, Chidz said:

 

Mr P. Hakeeet - love your work ... just my issue (and I'm sure others too) is that I get booked with 'stuff' sometimes 12 months + in advance  (which is what has happened with both real 2107 nats & pretend 2018 Aussies) .. just leaving it to a month or 2 before before getting the word out there eliminates many of us non-retireees from the game.

HJ - i'm sure I read 'centre of my anus' when I first read your post ... but then I stand (or sit) corrected [bhahahaha]

Cry me a river Chidz. You have no idea what busy is until you retire. It's a 24/7 job with no public holidays and no weekends. This morning I have to check the weather for WAGS tomorrow, make two sets of rigging, order a couple of rolls of rope, research the best terminal ends for some diamond wires, organise some crew for the Surf to City, get my documentation in order to act as event equipment inspector for a couple on National Titles later in January, then of course go and have coffee. You working people probably just check a few bullshit emails then go to a couple of boring meetings where there is endless discussion and no outcomes. Get a real job - retirement. 

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7 hours ago, WetnWild said:

Cry me a river Chidz. You have no idea what busy is until you retire. It's a 24/7 job with no public holidays and no weekends. This morning I have to check the weather for WAGS tomorrow, make two sets of rigging, order a couple of rolls of rope, research the best terminal ends for some diamond wires, organise some crew for the Surf to City, get my documentation in order to act as event equipment inspector for a couple on National Titles later in January, then of course go and have coffee. You working people probably just check a few bullshit emails then go to a couple of boring meetings where there is endless discussion and no outcomes. Get a real job - retirement. 

I think I just heard a volunteer for new National Pres! Vote #1 Wet-boy

Poor baby just needs to get some direction and something to actually do during his day --- Oooo, the pain of checking the weather AND coffee - Oooo I don't know how you can cope

:lol:

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1 hour ago, Chidz said:

I think I just heard a volunteer for new National Pres! Vote #1 Wet-boy

Poor baby just needs to get some direction and something to actually do during his day --- Oooo, the pain of checking the weather AND coffee - Oooo I don't know how you can cope

:lol:

Yep happy to do it after I finish my part in organising a World Title in late 2018. Or maybe we could talk Plywood out of playing with his Wit as and spend his time productively!:)

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On 11/13/2017 at 9:38 AM, WetnWild said:

You're perfectly right of course. Nobody seems willing or have the time to do it as has been demonstrated by the lack of action after this same debate each year both here and at various meetings. 

Realistically there are four States involved. Three purportedly have local bodies so that's a really good platform. If NSW could form one or even a loose group of people willing to help then a combined sub group from the four States could do a bit of administration. Doesn't have to be too formal and just agree to get a Club to run each event and privide the necessary infrastructure and insurances etc. 

Back on the topic of this thread, regardless of legitimate or quasi nationals run by the AS dickheads, my understanding was Wangi happens every two years. HJ mentioned earlier that he was going to find out any info on 2018. 

So any progress for a 2018 non nationals at Wangi in Sept/Oct school holidays when some people suggested was a good time?

Why states? States are irrelevant. We have internet. Communication is instant.

 

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On 11/14/2017 at 10:52 AM, WetnWild said:

Nice work HJ. Wangi and LM are great sailing venues. I'll be there in early January sailing an event and will be found for coffee and brekky in the bakery every morning! I should have moved there forty years ago before the Grim City residents discovered the cheap water view real estate. Only problem with Wangi is they have no idea about which football team to support. 

I moved here 10 years ago. Our place would sell for about what we paid in 2007. Football - what's that?

 

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4 minutes ago, paulnudd said:

Why states? States are irrelevant. We have internet. Communication is instant.

 

Yes I understand your point. I only suggested the existing bodies co-operate to form a national position. I have no objection to everyone joining MYCQ if the others are useless. We know from SoO that Qld extends to Kempsey anyway. 

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1 minute ago, WetnWild said:

Yes I understand your point. I only suggested the existing bodies co-operate to form a national position. I have no objection to everyone joining MYCQ if the others are useless. We know from SoO that Qld extends to Kempsey anyway. 

As a member of MYCQ I'd vote for a name change to MYCA. "Country Membership" (outside of Bris') is very cheap.

 

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So where are we at? Who's going to Sandringham?

I need to make a decision this week?

I'm not keen to do the necessary work on the trailer and then do the tow to melbourne again if there is not a fleet to race with.

As for Wangi, if it is here it will be in November - no other month.

Shane has had enough and won't run it. Neither will I though I will help out with it if someone else takes it on.

I have agreed to participate in a meeting.

 

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On 11/12/2017 at 6:07 AM, Chidz said:

 

Wangi would be great, & I would love to have one at my home club sailing off Cronulla beach (would be spectac!) but logistics and $$ put the handbrake on that.

I tried Cronulla many times in the 90's -2000's as i to live there.. We got a good little offshore group going (Nuddy will remember) ....It can only work for bigger boats as there is no rigging area for trailer multis.

Kurnell can work but no marina so anchor only..... very few options in NSW other than the obvious ones..

I have no dog in the fight but I'm still sitting on the side lines waiting for the group to get their shit together and if that ever happens I would buy another boat... 

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8 hours ago, PIL007 said:

I tried Cronulla many times in the 90's -2000's as i to live there.. We got a good little offshore group going (Nuddy will remember) ....It can only work for bigger boats as there is no rigging area for trailer multis.

Kurnell can work but no marina so anchor only..... very few options in NSW other than the obvious ones..

I have no dog in the fight but I'm still sitting on the side lines waiting for the group to get their shit together and if that ever happens I would buy another boat... 

You need a Diam Pil.

Botany Bay needs a Marina.

 

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On 11/1/2017 at 8:53 AM, Chidz said:

good questions ..

but a left field one for you all: Why are we using (and appear to have been doing it for a while) Northern Hemisphere delineation of the championships?

Every other class and association I have been involved with over the past 50 years nominate the Aus Titles as, for example, 2017/18.

It is only fixed regatta events (eg Hamo/Airlie/Syd-Hob, yada yada) that have a single year date name. Mobile regattas (ie different states/clubs) such as state and national titles all call themselves by the sailing season. This would get rid of the ludicrous situation of having champs 3 months apart, then an 11 month gap - but only if we all decide to play ball together nicely. 

I totally agree Keith. I made the same suggestion at Geelong in January 2015 and was howled down.

It has been as short as 2 months between nationals.

 

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Australian Sailing is recognised by the International Sailing Federation as the governing body for the sport of sailing in Australia.

From Australian Sailing:

"The Australian Yachting Championships will also incorporate the 2018 Australian Multihull National Championships."

Many years ago Multihull sailing was not governed by what was then called the "Australian Yachting Federation" (AYF est' 1956) which later became "Yachting Australia" and recently "Australian Sailing".

In the early days the AYF was 'anti-multihull' and multihull sailors had to form their own clubs, establish their own rules and organise their own races.

This was the case when I joined the ranks of 'Multihull Sailors'.

Then some time in the early 1990s someone suggested that multihull sailors should "join the mainstream". Meaning we should submit to control by the AYF.

I was a QMYC member at the time and got to vote on the proposal. I voted NO but there were too many in favour so we 'affiliated' and submitted to their control.

Now we sail by their rules, whether they suit multihulls or not.

And now if Australian Sailing says this is the multihull nationals it is the Multihull Nationals.

I guess it is too late now, after all these years, to form a breakaway group outside of Australian Sailing but if someone wants to do that they can count me in.

It has happened with motorsport. Used to be that CAMS was it. CAMS logo proclaims "we are motorsport". Yet we have AMSAG and AASA both running successfully outside of CAMS control. Competitors are free to participate in any or all. CAMS tried to stop it - unsuccessfully.

So is it time for 'Multihull Sailing Australia' - outside of Australian Sailing? And a member driven Multihull Sailing Australia Nationals?

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Hi Paul. Who wrote the quote above? Is it in Australian Sailing magazine, on tne AS website or what? Cheers Charles

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AS Website amendment to NoR

 

Australian Yachting Championships 2018
Notice of Race
Amendment No.1 The Australian Yachting Championships will also incorporate the 2018 Australian Multihull National Championships. The following clauses are amended to read: 5.4 The regatta shall comprise of up to eight (8) races for each keelboat division and six (6) races for the Multihull division. 10.2 The Multihull series will consist of up to 6 races. One (1) race is required to be completed to constitute a series.
Posted 23 August, 2017
Kevin Wilson - PRO


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