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kent_island_sailor

The big swinging dick problem

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Franken, Moore, Clinton, Trump, Weinstein, Spacey, and thousands of unknown pervs and more being exposed every day.

Look at it this way. You own a company. The IT guy is an antisocial asshole who uses half your link for nonstop porn and no women want to come within 500 feet of him. He also does a superb job.

Your top sales guy is a big swinging dick that trying to screw everything that moves, some things that don't, and can't even walk across the room without harassing 5 women on the way. He also outsells the next 3 sales people combined on a slow day.

Your Congressman and Senator vote for all the things you like and against everything you don't. They are also screwing half their staff and grabbing ass in the elevator.

The producer that makes movies for you is a freaking horny octopus, but his movies make hundreds of millions of dollars.

Your kicker can score a field goal from his house, let alone anywhere on the field, but he beats his wife.

The old way was to ignore all these issues as long as your goals were being accomplished. The new way is............not sure yet where this ends, but I don't see the old way lasting much longer. Feminists back in the day couldn't have cared less what Bill Clinton did on his own time, they liked what he did for them as President. Now, I bet that woudn't go down that way again.

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Here's a twist on your point. Good read -

Washington Post - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2017/11/17/im-a-feminist-i-study-rape-culture-and-i-dont-want-al-franken-to-resign/

By Kate Harding November 17 at 6:00 AM Follow @kateharding

Kate Harding is co-editor of "Nasty Women: Feminism, Resistance, and Revolution in Trump's America," co-host of the podcast Feminasty, and author of "Asking for It: The Alarming Rise of Rape Culture—And What We Can Do About It."

I’m a feminist. I study rape culture. And I don’t want Al Franken to resign.

As a feminist and the author of a book on rape culture, I could reasonably be expected to lead the calls for Al Franken to step down, following allegations that he forced his tongue down a woman’s throat, accompanied by a photo of him grinning as he moves in to grope her breasts while she sleeps. It’s disgusting. He treated a sleeping woman as a comedy prop, no more human than the contents of Carrot Top’s trunk, and I firmly believe he should suffer social and professional consequences for it.

But I don’t believe resigning from his position is the only possible consequence, or the one that’s best for American women.

Cynics on both the right and left will presume I am passing by this particular steam tray on 2017’s smorgasbord of feminist outrage because Franken is a Democrat, and so am I. (I was even his proud constituent for two years.) In the most superficial sense, this is true. But it’s meaningless to say it’s because I am a Democrat without asking why I am a Democrat. If you understand what it means to be a Democrat today — that is, why it makes sense to vote blue over red in this highly polarized political environment — you can understand why it might not make the most sense to demand Franken’s resignation, effective immediately.

I am a Democrat because I am a feminist who lives under a two-party system, where one party consistently votes against the interests of women while the other sometimes does not. I am not a true believer in the party itself nor in any politician. I am a realist who recognizes that we get two viable choices, and Democrats are members of the only party positioned to pump the brakes on Republicans’ gleeful race toward Atwoodian dystopia. Meanwhile, I recognize that men’s harassment of and violence against women is a systemic issue, not a Democrat or Republican problem, a Hollywood problem, a sports problem, or a media problem. Its roots lie in a patriarchal culture that trains men to believe they are entitled to control women’s bodies —for sex, for sport, for childbearing, for comedy.

When you combine these things — an awareness that the Democratic Party is no more or less than best of two, and an understanding that men in power frequently exploit women — it becomes difficult to believe that Franken is the onlysitting Democrat with a history of harassment, abuse or assault. The recent #metoo campaign demonstrated how normalized unwanted kissing and groping are in our culture. Donald Trump was caught on tape crudely admitting to both of those transgressions, and we made him our president. According to the CDC’s National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence Survey, 1 in 3 women experiences some sort of contact sexual violence in her life. Sexual harassment and assault are simply too widespread for Democrats to respond to Franken’s offense with only Franken in mind: We need to respond in a way that helps us develop a protocol for meaningful change.

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Short version:

I am willing to throw the women that get grabbed by Democrats under the bus because they vote for things that benefit women in general. This is the EXACT SAME logic that got us Trump. All the turbo-Christians decided what's a little pussy grabbing among friends, Trump will screw over liberals so he is good to go :rolleyes:

 

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2 hours ago, silent bob said:

Jesse Jackson announces that he has Parkinson's.  Is that a preemptive excuse on why he grabbed those women's asses?  They just backed into his shaking hand?  Or, does he hgave a book coming out, and wants the pity sales?

 

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-jesse-jackson-parkinsons-20171117-story.html

Or maybe because he has Parkinson’s?

 

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3 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Franken, Moore, Clinton, Trump, Weinstein, Spacey, and thousands of unknown pervs and more being exposed every day.

Look at it this way. You own a company. The IT guy is an antisocial asshole who uses half your link for nonstop porn and no women want to come within 500 feet of him. He also does a superb job.

Your top sales guy is a big swinging dick that trying to screw everything that moves, some things that don't, and can't even walk across the room without harassing 5 women on the way. He also outsells the next 3 sales people combined on a slow day.

Your Congressman and Senator vote for all the things you like and against everything you don't. They are also screwing half their staff and grabbing ass in the elevator.

The producer that makes movies for you is a freaking horny octopus, but his movies make hundreds of millions of dollars.

Your kicker can score a field goal from his house, let alone anywhere on the field, but he beats his wife.

The old way was to ignore all these issues as long as your goals were being accomplished. The new way is............not sure yet where this ends, but I don't see the old way lasting much longer. Feminists back in the day couldn't have cared less what Bill Clinton did on his own time, they liked what he did for them as President. Now, I bet that woudn't go down that way again.

Interesting how in your hypo it's the sportsman who is a wife beater- not the white collar guys...you see..until the stereotyping stops it will always be some other demographics problem.

and the new way is simple..get more women in senior management roles, more movie producer roles and definitely in more political roles.

 

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19 minutes ago, Sean said:

Or maybe because he has Parkinson’s?

 

 

When the gal asked if Jesse wanted a blow job, he said "Sure, but what's in it for ME?"

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24 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

Interesting how in your hypo it's the sportsman who is a wife beater- not the white collar guys...you see..until the stereotyping stops it will always be some other demographics problem.

and the new way is simple..get more women in senior management roles, more movie producer roles and definitely in more political roles.

 

They are ALL stereotypes. The horny crude salesman, the antisocial geek, grab-ass movie producer, etc ;)

BTW, if you live near Baltimore, wife-beating (or was it fiancée ??) footballers is not just a stereotype.'

How about it - vote for the local council guy that loves funding libraries but likes to wave his dick at the schoolbus or vote for the brogan that can't spell library, won't fund anything but beer, but obeys all laws and customs.

 

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1 hour ago, kent_island_sailor said:

They are ALL stereotypes. The horny crude salesman, the antisocial geek, grab-ass movie producer, etc ;)

BTW, if you live near Baltimore, wife-beating (or was it fiancée ??) footballers is not just a stereotype.'

How about it - vote for the local council guy that loves funding libraries but likes to wave his dick at the schoolbus or vote for the brogan that can't spell library, won't fund anything but beer, but obeys all laws and customs.

 

or vote for the local council WOMAN who neither waves her dick at the schoolbus nor has any objection to beer.

You just can't help yourself :D

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8 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

or vote for the local council WOMAN who neither waves her dick at the schoolbus nor has any objection to beer.

You just can't help yourself :D

That isn't the choice.

OK - Vote for the women who has a history of sexual harassment claims against her but loves library funding or the other women who is illiterate and hates libraries but otherwise law abiding?

The POINT is do you vote for the PERSON or what they can DO FOR YOU. X is bad but helps libraries. Y is good but hates libraries. Hillary Clinton supports feminist causes in general but is not shy about slut shaming and vicitm blaming her husband's girfriends/victims/accusers. What is your pick?

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Wasn’t it Mike Tyson who was described in court as a “serial buttocks fondler”?  

There is no truth to the rumor that his response was “thath’s ludicwith, I justh love to gwab assth.” 

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14 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

That isn't the choice.

OK - Vote for the women who has a history of sexual harassment claims against her but loves library funding or the other women who is illiterate and hates libraries but otherwise law abiding?

The POINT is do you vote for the PERSON or what they can DO FOR YOU. X is bad but helps libraries. Y is good but hates libraries. Hillary Clinton supports feminist causes in general but is not shy about slut shaming and vicitm blaming her husband's girfriends/victims/accusers. What is your pick?

why isn't it the choice..the Choice YOU are giving ME?

OK ..if I can find a woman that has sexual harassment claims against her V an ignorant woman ect..I'd vote for neither and try make dam sure woman A gets a fair hearing...and B gets an education.

No.. to answer your question..I would not vote for someone with spotty morals no matter how well  their policies match my ideal..It's likely to mean that they are well accustomed to lying and cheating and would be unlikely to fulfill their election commitments..DUH.

as for the OP..all those sexually suspect superstars actually are as dispensable as any other person ..when was the last time a high profile job came up where one candidate so outstripped the rest that profits would suffer?..it's a bullshit argument made to excuse the boys club.

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now I'll ask you a question pertinent to the OP..when you went for interviews, were you ever asked a specific question and asked for an expansive answer on your attitude to sexual harassment  and how many on the panel were women?

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No, I can't say I have ever had to give an extensive dissertation on what I think about sexual harassment. It would be a poor filter anyway, only the very worst would actually say anything but that they were totally against it. Can you imagine hiring someone that bragged about pussy grabbing........:rolleyes:

I did have to fire someone for being a sexual harasser+stalker, which was not my most fun day at work, but I could not have that kind of thing going on in my shop.

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It's essentially fairly simple. Some actions are against the law; rape, groping, etc can be several things, but always assault, which is unlawful.

(Attitudes and social acceptance do change over time. 30 years ago drink-driving was often accepted, much less so now. 150 years ago, other things, such as dueling were common and accepted by some. Not now.)

One shouldn't employ, applaud or otherwise encourage people who break the law. End of sermon.

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

 

No.. to answer your question..I would not vote for someone with spotty morals no matter how well  their policies match my ideal..It's likely to mean that they are well accustomed to lying and cheating and would be unlikely to fulfill their election commitments..DUH.

 

I would vote for the one with the biggest tits.

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1 minute ago, LB 15 said:

I would vote for the one with the biggest tits.

pauline H?

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19 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

No, I can't say I have ever had to give an extensive dissertation on what I think about sexual harassment. It would be a poor filter anyway, only the very worst would actually say anything but that they were totally against it. Can you imagine hiring someone that bragged about pussy grabbing........:rolleyes:

I did have to fire someone for being a sexual harasser+stalker, which was not my most fun day at work, but I could not have that kind of thing going on in my shop.

I said an expansive answer ...hmmm..which way do I Go?Image result for interview panel

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1 hour ago, kent_island_sailor said:

No, I can't say I have ever had to give an extensive dissertation on what I think about sexual harassment. It would be a poor filter anyway, only the very worst would actually say anything but that they were totally against it. Can you imagine hiring someone that bragged about pussy grabbing........:rolleyes:

I did have to fire someone for being a sexual harasser+stalker, which was not my most fun day at work, but I could not have that kind of thing going on in my shop.

I had a woman I had to fire for theft, misappropriation, of funds, lying to me, etc. in my company of half a dozen employees. I only found out after the fact that she was harassing the crap out of one of the guys in the office. Making him REALLY uncomfortable with aggressive invites and comments about coming over to her house for a 3-way with her husband, calls for such outside the office, etc. She was quite an attractive woman, fun to be around, a bit flirty but with a good sense of humor.

Of course, the guy never said a thing to me until after I'd fired her for other reasons.

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8 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Short version:

I am willing to throw the women that get grabbed by Democrats under the bus because they vote for things that benefit women in general. This is the EXACT SAME logic that got us Trump. All the turbo-Christians decided what's a little pussy grabbing among friends, Trump will screw over liberals so he is good to go :rolleyes:

 

It is exactly the same, which makes me wonder if she thinks Trump unfit to serve due to his creepiness.

I was thinking about our first thread here in which "grab them by the pussy" came out. For a brief moment in time, NGS was done with Trump. I was surprised by his reaction and basically asked him, "You didn't know this?"

It soon became apparent that everyone (aside from NGS) was unsurprised, unperturbed, and "locker room talk" became the standard excuse.

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2 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

I had a woman I had to fire for theft, misappropriation, of funds, lying to me, etc. in my company of half a dozen employees. I only found out after the fact that she was harassing the crap out of one of the guys in the office. Making him REALLY uncomfortable with aggressive invites and comments about coming over to her house for a 3-way with her husband, calls for such outside the office, etc. She was quite an attractive woman, fun to be around, a bit flirty but with a good sense of humor.

Of course, the guy never said a thing to me until after I'd fired her for other reasons.

So how do you know it was true?

Though 30 years ago women could be just as guilty of what today would be called harassment.

years ago we had a young man working with us, up from a small country town.

he was about my age, maybe a bit younger.

He was a amature tri athelete ..used to go jogging at lunchtime ..shorts and bare torso  would come through the office hot, sweaty and delicious :D

Oh boy did the older women give him a hard time..oh boy did he blush.

We thought it was all in good fun.

Only later I realised he didn't enjoy it one bit.. :(

 

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50 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

So how do you know it was true?

Though 30 years ago women could be just as guilty of what today would be called harassment.

years ago we had a young man working with us, up from a small country town.

he was about my age, maybe a bit younger.

He was a amature tri athelete ..used to go jogging at lunchtime ..shorts and bare torso  would come through the office hot, sweaty and delicious :D

Oh boy did the older women give him a hard time..oh boy did he blush.

We thought it was all in good fun.

Only later I realised he didn't enjoy it one bit.. :(

 

Given that she was fired for cause, there was no reason for this other fellow to invent the story. What could it possibly serve? It didn't come from him the day after she was gone, it only came weeks later.

Also, what he said about her behavior was not inconsistent with other things observed; e.g. it was an extension and magnification of the more public "joking" that was going on with her and others.

 

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2 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

So how do you know it was true?

Though 30 years ago women could be just as guilty of what today would be called harassment.

years ago we had a young man working with us, up from a small country town.

he was about my age, maybe a bit younger.

He was a amature tri athelete ..used to go jogging at lunchtime ..shorts and bare torso  would come through the office hot, sweaty and delicious :D

Oh boy did the older women give him a hard time..oh boy did he blush.

We thought it was all in good fun.

Only later I realised he didn't enjoy it one bit.. :(

 

Yes he did.

Trust me on that.

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2 hours ago, SloopJonB said:
4 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

So how do you know it was true?

Though 30 years ago women could be just as guilty of what today would be called harassment.

years ago we had a young man working with us, up from a small country town.

he was about my age, maybe a bit younger.

He was a amature tri athelete ..used to go jogging at lunchtime ..shorts and bare torso  would come through the office hot, sweaty and delicious :D

Oh boy did the older women give him a hard time..oh boy did he blush.

We thought it was all in good fun.

Only later I realised he didn't enjoy it one bit.. :(

 

Yes he did.

Trust me on that.

Yeah...if he didn't like the attention he would have made sure the shirt got on before he walked back inside.

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6 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

Yeah...if he didn't like the attention he would have made sure the shirt got on before he walked back inside.

But he walked out of the office with it off!! :D

Nah seriously, I think he was about the most naive country boy I've ever met and possibly gay. It was the older women used to cat call and whistle..not us younger ones. 

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It's a contraction of.."if you drink and drive, you're a bloody idiot" a highly successful government campaign.

 

we do tend to contract everything jeffie.

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I guess some have swinging dick and knee problems.

 

 

x ray.jpg

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4 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

Yeah...if he didn't like the attention he would have made sure the shirt got on before he walked back inside.

So he deserved harassment because of how he dressed?  That's a pretty quick slippery slope.

 

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1 hour ago, cmilliken said:

So he deserved harassment because of how he dressed?  That's a pretty quick slippery slope.

 

Dressed like that - he was asking for it!

There is the common perception that since men are pigs in general, they also don't mind being on the receiving end of what would be a firing offense for a man.

Company I used to work for had a sexual harassment training day we all had to go to. The presenter was an incredibly hot - movie star hot - young blond female  lawyer. She picked me as the sample victim up on stage and was doing all the "wrong" things to me. All my male friends were pissed they didn't get picked, but I kept thinking the company would have sued out of existence before lunch had a male lawyer dragged a female employee up there and talked about her hot looking ass. Everyone knew no guy was going to complain :rolleyes:

Best part though was when an old lady from accounting spoke up about masturbating at work being one of the things companies get sued over. "Well now you take away the one fun thing we have do around here" :lol::lol:

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8 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Dressed like that - he was asking for it!

There is the common perception that since men are pigs in general, they also don't mind being on the receiving end of what would be a firing offense for a man.

Company I used to work for had a sexual harassment training day we all had to go to. The presenter was an incredibly hot - movie star hot - young blond female  lawyer. She picked me as the sample victim up on stage and was doing all the "wrong" things to me. All my male friends were pissed they didn't get picked, but I kept thinking the company would have sued out of existence before lunch had a male lawyer dragged a female employee up there and talked about her hot looking ass. Everyone knew no guy was going to complain :rolleyes:

Best part though was when an old lady from accounting spoke up about masturbating at work being one of the things companies get sued over. "Well now you take away the one fun thing we have do around here" :lol::lol:

It’s not so funny when you’ve been on the receiving end of it! <_<

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22 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Short version:

I am willing to throw the women that get grabbed by Democrats under the bus because they vote for things that benefit women in general. This is the EXACT SAME logic that got us Trump. All the turbo-Christians decided what's a little pussy grabbing among friends, Trump will screw over liberals so he is good to go :rolleyes:

 

can't fight against terrorists using old tatics

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6 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:

 Or is it just another antipodean distortion of the English Language?   

you're just picking up on this?

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39 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

you're just picking up on this?

Which is pretty funny, coming from an American. :)

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8 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

But he walked out of the office with it off!! :D

Nah seriously, I think he was about the most naive country boy I've ever met and possibly gay. It was the older women used to cat call and whistle..not us younger ones. 

If it happened more than once he liked the attention.

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2 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Dressed like that - he was asking for it!

There is the common perception that since men are pigs in general, they also enjoy being on the receiving end of what would be a firing offense for a man.

FIFY

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2 hours ago, mad said:

It’s not so funny when you’ve been on the receiving end of it! <_<

You got sued for masturbating at work?

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On 11/17/2017 at 11:53 AM, kent_island_sailor said:

Franken, Moore, Clinton, Trump, Weinstein, Spacey, and thousands of unknown pervs and more being exposed every day.

Look at it this way. You own a company. The IT guy is an antisocial asshole who uses half your link for nonstop porn and no women want to come within 500 feet of him. He also does a superb job.

Your top sales guy is a big swinging dick that trying to screw everything that moves, some things that don't, and can't even walk across the room without harassing 5 women on the way. He also outsells the next 3 sales people combined on a slow day.

Your Congressman and Senator vote for all the things you like and against everything you don't. They are also screwing half their staff and grabbing ass in the elevator.

The producer that makes movies for you is a freaking horny octopus, but his movies make hundreds of millions of dollars.

Your kicker can score a field goal from his house, let alone anywhere on the field, but he beats his wife.

The old way was to ignore all these issues as long as your goals were being accomplished. The new way is............not sure yet where this ends, but I don't see the old way lasting much longer. Feminists back in the day couldn't have cared less what Bill Clinton did on his own time, they liked what he did for them as President. Now, I bet that woudn't go down that way again.

Ignoring until someone puts it will continue.  

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9 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:
19 hours ago, Fleetwood said:

(Attitudes and social acceptance do change over time. 30 years ago drink-driving was often accepted, much less so now. 150 years ago, other things, such as dueling were common and accepted by some. Not now.)

Sorry for the hijack, but this has always bugged the shit out of me and I see it more and more.  Its not "drink driving".  Its "drunk driving".  Now you could say "drinking and driving", that's acceptable.  But is drink driving just the lazy way of saying drinking & driving.  Or is it just another antipodean distortion of the English Language? 

It's an Australian thing. You get used to it.

Aussies say a lot of things in a shortened fashion. Now I've got to go off and fix myself some brekkie.

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6 hours ago, cmilliken said:
11 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

Yeah...if he didn't like the attention he would have made sure the shirt got on before he walked back inside.

So he deserved harassment because of how he dressed?  That's a pretty quick slippery slope.

It is indeed a slippery slope.

Except that wearing shorts and no shirt in the office is not acceptable office attire. It would be like showing up for work in a bikini - it's hard to understand how doing something like that wouldn't be done to attract attention. There's no reason for it, and the clothing is not appropriate for the situation unless you work for a landscaper.

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12 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

It's an Australian thing. You get used to it.

Aussies say a lot of things in a shortened fashion. Now I've got to go off and fix myself some brekkie.

3/5

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7 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:
20 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

It's an Australian thing. You get used to it.

Aussies say a lot of things in a shortened fashion. Now I've got to go off and fix myself some brekkie.

3/5

Some of them don't make a ton of sense to me though.

"Brekkie" is one of them. It has the same number of syllables as "breakfast", and it doesn't save you anything except pronouncing the "F" which sort of slows the word down.

"Macca's" at least makes some sense it saves you a syllable.

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11 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

It is indeed a slippery slope.

Except that wearing shorts and no shirt in the office is not acceptable office attire. It would be like showing up for work in a bikini - it's hard to understand how doing something like that wouldn't be done to attract attention. There's no reason for it, and the clothing is not appropriate for the situation unless you work for a landscaper.

excuse me..Australia in the 80's was a very different place to where you are at now.

A woman customer was never addressed as Ma'am or Madam except in plonker establishments

wearing shorts and no shirt all day would have been frowned upon in the city but ducking through the office in your running gear after a lunchtime run? though admitedly the boss usually wore a singlet with HIS running shorts..nah..this kid was just naive..wouldn't occur to him unless the boss told him to put his singlet on.

We has a newsreader, famous for reading the news in shirt, tie, jacket..and boxers and thongs(flip flops) under the newsdesk.

Going to the Pub at lunchtime? impromptue work barbie in the park at lunchtime (with frisbees)

You 'murricans have tamed our colonial freedoms and gaucherie so much in the last 30 years, no one wears their blunnies, stubbies and bonds to work anymore :(

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13 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

Some of them don't make a ton of sense to me though.

"Brekkie" is one of them. It has the same number of syllables as "breakfast", and it doesn't save you anything except pronouncing the "F" which sort of slows the word down.

"Macca's" at least makes some sense it saves you a syllable.

Bicky, Johnno, smoke -oh .cossie (bit obsolite, costume) .susso..melsie.. barbie ,they aren't contractions.

Dunno where we picked it up you'd have to ask someone with better aus cred than i ..but we dont "Fix ourselves brekkie" we make ourself or ourselves some brekkie ..fixing a snack is an americanism that's slipped in 

like "gotten" 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

excuse me..Australia in the 80's was a very different place to where you are at now.

A woman customer was never addressed as Ma'am or Madam except in plonker establishments

wearing shorts and no shirt all day would have been frowned upon in the city but ducking through the office in your running gear after a lunchtime run? though admitedly the boss usually wore a singlet with HIS running shorts..nah..this kid was just naive..wouldn't occur to him unless the boss told him to put his singlet on.

We has a newsreader, famous for reading the news in shirt, tie, jacket..and boxers and thongs(flip flops) under the newsdesk.

Going to the Pub at lunchtime? impromptue work barbie in the park at lunchtime (with frisbees)

You 'murricans have tamed our colonial freedoms and gaucherie so much in the last 30 years, no one wears their blunnies, stubbies and bonds to work anymore :(

I've never worked anyplace where a lunchtime run would be practical. Shower facilities aren't often provided in work settings in the states. The closest I could have come to that was when I worked in the McGraw-Hill building in Manhattan, and our bank offered a membership deal with a health club in the basement. But going there at lunch would be madness due to the crowds. Of course, you didn't generally take an hour lunch in the US anyway unless you have a business meeting planned for it.

It wouldn't even occur to most American businesses to put a shower facility in for employees. That's one of the challenges for people trying to bike to work. I knew some guys that would, and they'd join a nearby YMCA or health club and shower and change there for work.

Working in New York I wore a suit, white shirt, and tie to work every single day unless there was a designated dress down day. In my own company our in-office dress code was very lax, but everyone kept a suit in the office in case a client came by or we had to visit one on short notice. "To the batpoles, Robin!" was a running joke...

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Just now, Shortforbob said:

Bicky, Johnno, smoke -oh .cossie (bit obsolite, costume) .susso..melsie.. barbie ,they aren't contractions dunno where we picked it up you'd have to ask  ..but we dont "Fix ourselves brekkie" we make ourself or ourselves some brekkie ..fixing a snack is an americanism that's slipped in 

like "gotten" 

 

It's not like I'm going to go to Macca's to pick up some brekkie from here.

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3 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

I've never worked anyplace where a lunchtime run would be practical. Shower facilities aren't often provided in work settings in the states. The closest I could have come to that was when I worked in the McGraw-Hill building in Manhattan, and our bank offered a membership deal with a health club in the basement. But going there at lunch would be madness due to the crowds. Of course, you didn't generally take an hour lunch in the US anyway unless you have a business meeting planned for it.

It wouldn't even occur to most American businesses to put a shower facility in for employees. That's one of the challenges for people trying to bike to work. I knew some guys that would, and they'd join a nearby YMCA or health club and shower and change there for work.

Working in New York I wore a suit, white shirt, and tie to work every single day unless there was a designated dress down day. In my own company our in-office dress code was very lax, but everyone kept a suit in the office in case a client came by or we had to visit one on short notice. "To the batpoles, Robin!" was a running joke...

Shower facilities are almost universal in ozzie workplaces, either in factories for OHS considerations (saftey showers) or just because they were installed as a matter of course in anything built post 1970 or possibly even earlier.  Aussies wash a lot..my pommy landlady used to complain about our daily showers :D

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23 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

wearing shorts and no shirt all day would have been frowned upon in the city but ducking through the office in your running gear after a lunchtime run? though admitedly the boss usually wore a singlet wife beater with HIS running shorts..nah..this kid was just naive..wouldn't occur to him unless the boss told him to put his singlet  wife beater on.

FIFY

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6 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

Shower facilities are almost universal in ozzie workplaces, either in factories for OHS considerations (saftey showers) or just because they were installed as a matter of course in anything built post 1970 or possibly even earlier.  Aussies wash a lot..my pommy landlady used to complain about our daily showers :D

I think the UK was the last bastion of the Saturday Night Bath.

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1 hour ago, B.J. Porter said:

It is indeed a slippery slope.

Except that wearing shorts and no shirt in the office is not acceptable office attire. It would be like showing up for work in a bikini - it's hard to understand how doing something like that wouldn't be done to attract attention. There's no reason for it, and the clothing is not appropriate for the situation unless you work for a landscaper.

OMG.

You weren't trolling?  You were ACTUALLY going for the 'he deserved it by how he was dressed' argument with a straight face? :)

Safe sailing.

 

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Just now, cmilliken said:
1 hour ago, B.J. Porter said:

It is indeed a slippery slope.

Except that wearing shorts and no shirt in the office is not acceptable office attire. It would be like showing up for work in a bikini - it's hard to understand how doing something like that wouldn't be done to attract attention. There's no reason for it, and the clothing is not appropriate for the situation unless you work for a landscaper.

OMG.

You weren't trolling?  You were ACTUALLY going for the 'he deserved it by how he was dressed' argument with a straight face?

No, I'm was going for the "if you repeatedly dress inappropriately in the office you might not be hating the reaction" argument.

The ladies were no question out of line.

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23 hours ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Wasn’t it Mike Tyson who was described in court as a “serial buttocks fondler”?  

There is no truth to the rumor that his response was “thath’s ludicwith, I justh love to gwab assth.” 

Sthounds more like Leon Sthpinkths......

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well It's not ever quite as simple as that is it?

It depends a lot on the camaraderie in the workplace.

The women would whistle at some of the blokes in their running gear, and get a bow in return.

The blokes might whistle at a female drinking companion ..a female "mate" who comes to work unusually well turned out..and get given a cheerful finger salute..that is all in good fun and nothing actually sexual in it..well..thats in aussie workplaces.It's all about nuance .dunno how it works in the USA.

Sadly, we've thrown the baby out with the bathwater with all this workplace harassment scrutiny.  

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15 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

well It's not ever quite as simple as that is it?

It depends a lot on the camaraderie in the workplace.

The women would whistle at some of the blokes in their running gear, and get a bow in return.

The blokes might whistle at a female drinking companion ..a female "mate" who comes to work unusually well turned out..and get given a cheerful finger salute..that is all in good fun and nothing actually sexual in it..well..thats in aussie workplaces.It's all about nuance .dunno how it works in the USA.

Sadly, we've thrown the baby out with the bathwater with all this workplace harassment scrutiny.  

That is part of the problem - th enature of the workplace.

When I had my small consulting company - we reached ten employees, max - we had a small, tight-knit group. More men than women working there, but that's not uncommon in tech. But given the size of the group, we were pretty casual and friendly, and there was a fair amount of ribald humor. But that doesn't translate to a company with 1,000 people. And it doesn't translate the first time you hire someone that doesn't fit into that particular work environment. That being said we still had a couple of employees (women) that I found out made a couple of my male employees uncomfortable. Again, none of the men spoke up - it was only later whne they were gone that I found out about it

My biggest client was a million times worse than us; we were tame and demure by contrast.  This is a place that watched "Naked News" during a project meeting (anyone remember that?) because the CEO thought it was hysterical, where the same CEO was alleged to have handed out boob jobs as bonuses, and Friday was referred to as "no panty day." Now, I don't know if the CEO was very careful in who he hired and how he vetted them or how he avoided lawsuits. But this was at a company in the midwest and a conservative place. And maybe that's how he got away with it, because in New York he would have gotten a slapdown in no time for that sort of thing. The women (and men) at this company that weren't comfortable either stayed quiet or didn't stay, I suppose. I know of one quite religious person who worked there right up until the company went tits-up; she just shook her head and rolled her eyes at the nonsense.

But it comes down to culture. If you want to see a vivid example, go visit some of the Sailing and Cruising groups out on Facebook where you are dealing with a broad spectrum of people instead of the bent nitwits like us that congregate at SA. Tell someone in those groups to "Fuck off" or "Show us your tits" or call them a moron, see what happens. Those Facebook sailing groups are much closer to the reality of corporate or government employee life in the US.

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Meli,

We do have fun at work and be quite risque, but only among people we KNOW and KNOW FOR SURE are up for it. For others, not so much. When woman A commented to me that woman B had the hugest tits and the tightest shirt ever seen at the office, since I barely knew A I decided the safest thing to do was say "I didn't notice" and exit the area ASAP.

BTW, if I walked around work shirtless the abuse would be horrendous :o

( not lusting for my body, more like screams for eye bleach)

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14 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Meli,

We do have fun at work and be quite risque, but only among people we KNOW and KNOW FOR SURE are up for it. For others, not so much. When woman A commented to me that woman B had the hugest tits and the tightest shirt ever seen at the office, since I barely knew A I decided the safest thing to do was say "I didn't notice" and exit the area ASAP.

BTW, if I walked around work shirtless the abuse would be horrendous :o

( not lusting for my body, more like screams for eye bleach)

 

Key point there...you have to know. But even if you know, sometimes you don't know. And even if you DO know, it's generally better not to go there.

Back when I worked in a bank I hired a female programmer to work for me. A very attractive woman, late 20's, blonde, had a bit of the sexy librarian vibe when she put her glasses on. Slim, trim, cute as hell..and a good programmer and smart, which is why I hired her. Numerous thumbs and up and thank-yous from the young men on the staff for hiring her, though that's not the point of the story.

At some point, we were talking casually and the topic of a class she was taking at her health club came up. I forget the context (it was a while ago, I think it was making her sore the next day at work or something) but she mentioned the name of the course was "Build a Better Butt." This left me momentarily lost for comment, because well, from where anyone around her sat there was very little room for improvement. The immediate thought in my head, of course, was "how is this even possible?" but I couldn't say that. After a beat, I muttered something lame like "sounds tough" or "don't hurt yourself" and changed the subject.

You just can't go there.

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I really like the standard adopted by most women I know:

It isn't harassment the FIRST time, but if we tell you to cut the shit, you had better leave the shit cut.

For your example, a couple of women I work with would love getting the compliment and a couple more would not. Gotta know your audience or STFU. If you are in charge of them, really STFU.

I also have a canned response to all female "how is my hair I just got it done" queries: It looks great and it was great before too

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It's not hard to embarrass someone completely innocently as well.

I walked into the office one day and a woman I knew pretty well had a new angora sweater on - it was gorgeous and I said "nice sweater" as I passed her desk. She turned beet red and then I realized the "usual" meaning of what I said. I had to quickly assure her that I meant it literally, not suggestively.

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2 hours ago, kent_island_sailor said:

If you are in charge of them, really STFU.

That is really much of the core fo the problem. 

Workplace romances come and go, and peers jump in the sack and break up. So long as they are discreet and it doesn't affect their work no one cares too much.

But as soon as you start skating up and down lines in the org chart, there is a big problem. You have power over someone's job or career, you need to handle them like they are radioactive and take no chances that they will feel inappropriate pressure.

That's the really bad issue with the Weinstein's of the world. They have so much power over the young aspiring people's careers. A guy like Weinstein could make you famous overnight. Or he could make you a pariah, or at least keep you out of any project he or his circle of influence had a tentacle in. And he let women know how to make him happy and helpful. Same with a guy like Kevin Spacey - the big start on the set could get anyone fired, and a positive recommendation from him could help you out.

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5 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

Image result for hot australian tradie

yeah..better off :D

What’s he doin outside with that little finish hammer?

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3 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

It's not hard to embarrass someone completely innocently as well.

I walked into the office one day and a woman I knew pretty well had a new angora sweater on - it was gorgeous and I said "nice sweater" as I passed her desk. She turned beet red and then I realized the "usual" meaning of what I said. I had to quickly assure her that I meant it literally, not suggestively.

You can’t tell someone in the workplace they are wearing a nice sweater these days.  

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3 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:

Sorry, It's both Homo AND Ghey.

I do find the infantilizing od the language annoying.

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2 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

I do find the infantilizing od the language annoying.

The US isn't immune - cookies?

And in the current discussion - guys (for all genders) and dolls. Dolls? Good way of objectifying women (I know its now a bit archaic but then so are many of the current crop of perpetrators.)

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On 11/18/2017 at 10:04 PM, Shootist Jeff said:

Sorry for the hijack, but this has always bugged the shit out of me and I see it more and more.  Its not "drink driving".  Its "drunk driving".  Now you could say "drinking and driving", that's acceptable.  But is drink driving just the lazy way of saying drinking & driving.  Or is it just another antipodean distortion of the English Language?   

the blood alcohol  limit in australia is 0.05. Not even nearly drunk.

well, maybe for airforce.

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1 hour ago, Fleetwood said:

The US isn't immune - cookies?

And in the current discussion - guys (for all genders) and dolls. Dolls? Good way of objectifying women (I know its now a bit archaic but then so are many of the current crop of perpetrators.)

What are cookies infantilizing?

They say "biscuits" in Oz and the UK.

rego = registration
arvo = afternoon
macca's = McDonald's
avo = avocado
biccy = biscuit
tradie = tradesman
veg (with a "j" sound) = vegetables

Those are the ones I actually remember hearing or seeing on signs. 

We seppos don't really do that sort of thing with the language in the same way.

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1 hour ago, Fleetwood said:

And in the current discussion - guys (for all genders) and dolls. Dolls? Good way of objectifying women (I know its now a bit archaic but then so are many of the current crop of perpetrators.)

I thought it was Blokes and Sheilas?

 

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1 hour ago, B.J. Porter said:


 

I thought it was Blokes and Sheilas?

 

blokes yees, Sheilas a bit archaic 

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

blokes yees, Sheilas a bit archaic 

I've not actually heard sheila in use, but I had to take a bit of the piss on it.

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3 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

What are cookies infantilizing?

They say "biscuits" in Oz and the UK.

rego = registration
arvo = afternoon
macca's = McDonald's
avo = avocado
biccy = biscuit
tradie = tradesman
veg (with a "j" sound) = vegetables

Those are the ones I actually remember hearing or seeing on signs. 

We seppos don't really do that sort of thing with the language in the same way.

You're only just scratching the surface: ambo, servo, the list goes on......

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51 minutes ago, Fleetwood said:
3 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

What are cookies infantilizing?

They say "biscuits" in Oz and the UK.

rego = registration
arvo = afternoon
macca's = McDonald's
avo = avocado
biccy = biscuit
tradie = tradesman
veg (with a "j" sound) = vegetables

Those are the ones I actually remember hearing or seeing on signs. 

We seppos don't really do that sort of thing with the language in the same way.

You're only just scratching the surface: ambo, servo, the list goes on...

Oh yeah, I'm sure. There definitely have been some signs and billboards that were completely incomprehensible to me.

 

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1 hour ago, Fleetwood said:

You're only just scratching the surface: ambo, servo, the list goes on......

more than 5000 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminutives_in_Australian_English

American Cookies I assume comes from the dutch koekje which in it'self is a diminutive of Koek or cake..je is added to a lot of dutch nouns to indicate smallness..hence Koekje..little cake.

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3 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

more than 5000 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminutives_in_Australian_English

American Cookies I assume comes from the dutch koekje

I'm sorry but saying "chocky bikkie" just makes you sound like a two year old.

 

Though "the Gabba" makes the most sense of any of them because that actually saves you about eight syllables.

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10 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

I'm sorry but saying "chocky bikkie" just makes you sound like a two year old.

nah.that's called a TIMTAM :D

BTW..if you should purchase said TIMTAM..please buy the original milk chocky ones..the multi flavoured abominations were introduced after fucking Campbells took them over..:(  nothing is safe or sacred.

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24 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

I'm sorry but saying "chocky bikkie" just makes you sound like a two year old.

 

Though "the Gabba" makes the most sense of any of them because that actually saves you about eight syllables.

The Gabba is called the Gabba because it's at Woolangabba..

You have to be careful using Australian Dialect..the diminutives are now often used in comic sense..many on that list are archaic..some are local.

Be extra wary of using Australian metaphors ..things like "splashing the boots" "Pointing percy at the porcelain" "technicolor yawn" etc, were invented by the Character Barry McKenzie as overblown satire..you'll sound like a bit of a Dill if you use them :) 

The chocky bicky thing ..it's meant to sound like a two year old..begging for a..well..chocky bicky.

Furreners venturing into the minefield of any local slang are likely to sound odd. example..french supposedly use an expression that translates as "push the mushoom" meaning step on the gas..or guele de bois (animal mask (as in foxes or badgers mask) of wood =hangover...I wouldn't attempt my own translations :D

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Yeah, I lived in France for a while (long time ago!) and did my best to learn the local slang (there is/was a great book "Merde et Merde Encore"  which was very helpful) but I rarely used it - had a hard enough time mastering the official language.....

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

nah.that's called a TIMTAM :D

BTW..if you should purchase said TIMTAM..please buy the original milk chocky ones..the multi flavoured abominations were introduced after fucking Campbells took them over..:(  nothing is safe or sacred.

We've been all over Timtams for years, even since we hit NZ. Agreed on the multi flavors, though the women on board have taken a preference for the dark chocolate ones.

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54 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

The Gabba is called the Gabba because it's at Woolangabba..

You have to be careful using Australian Dialect..the diminutives are now often used in comic sense..many on that list are archaic..some are local.

Be extra wary of using Australian metaphors ..things like "splashing the boots" "Pointing percy at the porcelain" "technicolor yawn" etc, were invented by the Character Barry McKenzie as overblown satire..you'll sound like a bit of a Dill if you use them :) 

The chocky bicky thing ..it's meant to sound like a two year old..begging for a..well..chocky bicky.

Furreners venturing into the minefield of any local slang are likely to sound odd. example..french supposedly use an expression that translates as "push the mushoom" meaning step on the gas..or guele de bois (animal mask (as in foxes or badgers mask) of wood =hangover...I wouldn't attempt my own translations :D

I know what the Gabba is, I've walked by it many times. There's a Whitworth's in Wooolangabba not too far from there, its the easiest to get to from the moorings over by the botanical gardens. Also there's a BBQ Galore there, where we filled our propane. There's a few restaurants around there, and a Coles too. So we'd often make an afternoon of it getting the propane or something from Whitworth's.

The first tests of the Ashes are being played in the Gabba this week.

Mostly I talk like an American...most diminutives I use are with my wife, used ironically.

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Just now, B.J. Porter said:

We've been all over Timtams for years, even since we hit NZ. Agreed on the multi flavors, though the women on board have taken a preference for the dark chocolate ones.

(and I have guilty liking for the caramel ones out of the fridge (and we are allowed to call a fridge a fridge because we invented it)..but that's not the point..I just read that wagon wheels now come in multiple flavours ...Bloody yanks!

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4 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

I know what the Gabba is, I've walked by it many times. There's a Whitworth's in Wooolangabba not too far from there, its the easiest to get to from the moorings over by the botanical gardens. Also there's a BBQ Galore there, where we filled our propane. There's a few restaurants around there, and a Coles too. So we'd often make an afternoon of it getting the propane or something from Whitworth's.

The first tests of the Ashes are being played in the Gabba this week.

Mostly I talk like an American...most diminutives I use are with my wife, used ironically.

So..have you been to a test yet? there are no first tests at the gabba..there is ONE test match at  the Gabba..5 days..is one test match.

get a ticket for the second day.

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