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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
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Peanut Butter

Ridiculously Overpriced Boats

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12 hours ago, Forestdawg said:

Ha, I crewed on Bagatelle in the summer of 1983 (-ish). It was the "learning boat" and I learned a lot. Don (the owner) was very patient with newbies like me. One of my cherished memories is blasting back to Kingston from the US side after the Freeman Cup race, sun shining, the Stones blaring from the tape deck and eating pancakes whipped up by Don. Good times.

Don's a great guy (when I knew him long ago) and the boat has been a "learning boat" since the mid 70s.  I can't recall her ever being particularly competitive but she is a grand old dame nonetheless!

 

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4 hours ago, CriticalPath said:

Don's a great guy (when I knew him long ago) and the boat has been a "learning boat" since the mid 70s.  I can't recall her ever being particularly competitive but she is a grand old dame nonetheless!

 

Don's an absolute legend! I hear he's still kicking around KYC but sails alot less these days due to his age.

Thanks for the history - its a cool story of an iconic boat 

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I sailed with John Odenbach Sr. With and against John, Fritzy and Gardy. Have never sailed with a finer family. Great corinthians. Of course Lou kept them all in line.

Lioness, i think we travelled the same road. Remember George Sibley?

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On 12/8/2017 at 8:59 PM, slap said:

Only off by a factor of 2 or 3.

Somewhere in there. Ran across an Irwin 42 of similar vintage for sale by the original owner yesterday. Looks nice. Half the price of that one.

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On 11/28/2017 at 4:48 PM, 12 metre said:

True, but my comments were with regard to the C&C 43 in question

The  boat you are referring to would be the Redline 41 "Red Jacket" which won 1967 SORC and is allegedly the first cored boat built.  She was designed by C&C, but predates C&C Yachts.

Red Jacket may be able to sell for a premium because of her historical significance, but the same could not be said for other Redline 41s.  There is a very nice one advertised in West Van right with an asking price of about $80k

Some IOR boats that IMO might sell for a substantial premium because of their historical significance (provided they are in excellent condition) include: Ganbare, Magic Bus, and Imp.

I might even include Terrorist in that group because of her revolutionary design -which was quickly banned.  Okay, not banned, but heavily penalized.  She was laying falling apart in a yard in Port Townsend a few years ago until someone in Texas bought her and did a wonderful restoration job on her.  I think they even kept her infamous bilge boards.

terr7 best.JPG

Terrorist.jpg

Terrorist_Aug 14_2.jpg

Aug 13_2.jpg

Why the fuck anyone would waste money on an ugly POS like that is beyond me. Recently our council spent a kings ransom restoring a substation built in 1956 because it was a 'historically significant building'. The Architect (my father) said no it wasn't  - it was a industrial brick box built to house electrical equipment. He suggested they bulldoze it and built an attractive building. That boat is ugly as fuck, would be a shit of a thing to steer and the deck layout is just plain awful. Still its his money and he can piss it up against any wall he wishes. Pity he didn't at least get someone with half a clue to choose the paintwork and the sign writing. 

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On 11/28/2017 at 10:49 PM, Steam Flyer said:

That is awesome. Looks like a beautiful restoration along with suitable updates/upgrades thrown in.

Any chance you could get me an ounce of what you are smoking?

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LB - you realize that Terrorist was designed by Bruce King don't you?

Calling one of his boats ugly is hubris of the first magnitude.

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I could understand the cockpit layout if it had a traveler, I can’t stand split cockpits...but I can appreciate the tumblehome...

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9 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

LB - you realize that Terrorist was designed by Bruce King don't you?

Calling one of his boats ugly is hubris of the first magnitude.

Even Charlize Theron takes an occasional dump

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11 hours ago, LB 15 said:

That boat is ugly as fuck, would be a shit of a thing to steer and the deck layout is just plain awful. Still its his money and he can piss it up against any wall he wishes. Pity he didn't at least get someone with half a clue to choose the paintwork and the sign writing. 

The paint scheme and lettering is matched how it was originally painted in the 70's, it is a restoration after all. Might not be fashionable today, but i think it looks great.

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2 hours ago, Looper said:

This.

Don't see it. Given that laser have a monopoly product and captive customer base their prices don't seem ridiculous to me... High, arguably, but not ridiculously so.

 Anyway, your post misses the point of the class. You are not paying for the boat. 

Cheers, 

               W.

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5 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

I could understand the cockpit layout if it had a traveler, I can’t stand split cockpits...but I can appreciate the tumblehome...

As I posted earlier, I believe it does have a traveller - their looks to be a mounting surface for a curved track on the front face of the partition maybe 8" below the top of the coaming.  I  can't imagine any top level 1T not having one.

Topsides_stern.jpg.4d6a8af6ca0d6d474d777f75650b71c8.jpg

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14 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Why the fuck anyone would waste money on an ugly POS like that is beyond me. Recently our council spent a kings ransom restoring a substation built in 1956 because it was a 'historically significant building'. The Architect (my father) said no it wasn't  - it was a industrial brick box built to house electrical equipment. He suggested they bulldoze it and built an attractive building. That boat is ugly as fuck, would be a shit of a thing to steer and the deck layout is just plain awful. Still its his money and he can piss it up against any wall he wishes. Pity he didn't at least get someone with half a clue to choose the paintwork and the sign writing. 

As one of your famous compatriots once said "the fastest boat is the most beautiful".

That Terrorist was acknowledged as the fastest boat at the '74 OTC (only a dismasting prevented her from winning) gives lie to the statement that she is an "ugly POS"

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I can understand why someone would spend a fortune restoring a truly beautiful classic like Dorade or Stormy weather - even a swan from that era. Those boats are timeless. Put one of them next to that fugly Pos and see what I mean. That boat represents the worst of the terrible design features of that era - cheese cutter stern, transom hung rudder, 45 degree stem rake and a truly awful deck layout. It's like restoring an Leyland P76 (australias equivalent to the Edsel). Still it's his coin so his to spend on what ever he wants.  Fast? It's all relative of course but didn't someone say it was banned?  And it would have won some series if it hadn't dropped its rig? Well if my Aunt had Balls she would be my uncle. 

BTW it Looks a lot like Ceil III and Rampage - Bob millers Hobart winners (from 73 and 75 IIRC) they are still butt ugly as well. 

Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

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28 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Sorry to say it LB but your taste is all in your mouth.

Each to their own mate. Regardless of what I think I am sure the boat brings the owner great pleasure and that after all, are what boats are for. 

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4 hours ago, 12 metre said:

As I posted earlier, I believe it does have a traveller - their looks to be a mounting surface for a curved track on the front face of the partition maybe 8" below the top of the coaming.  I  can't imagine any top level 1T not having one.

Topsides_stern.jpg.4d6a8af6ca0d6d474d777f75650b71c8.jpg

I’ll say you’re both right and wrong. Take a look at the photo of Terrorist in the photo of her sailing. There’s a track visible that isn’t shown in the photo at the dock. Not recessed though, but up top. I’m guessing that dock photo was part way through the restoration, with a temporary padeye. 

Edit: I’m dumb. Just realized the boat’s still white when it has a visible traveler. Maybe the new owner is big on Vang sheeting. 

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18 minutes ago, Monkey said:

I’ll say you’re both right and wrong. Take a look at the photo of Terrorist in the photo of her sailing. There’s a track visible that isn’t shown in the photo at the dock. Not recessed though, but up top. I’m guessing that dock photo was part way through the restoration, with a temporary padeye. 

Edit: I’m dumb. Just realized the boat’s still white when it has a visible traveler. Maybe the new owner is big on Vang sheeting. 

Looks like it has a traveler in this pick.

5a1d0b3c46e6a_Terrorist_Aug14_2.jpg.7dcf7115ef64ec356e709bf3cc4784fe (2).jpg

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2 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

Looks like it has a traveler in this pick.

5a1d0b3c46e6a_Terrorist_Aug14_2.jpg.7dcf7115ef64ec356e709bf3cc4784fe (2).jpg

Yes, if you zoom in enough you can see the track bolts and kind of make out a car. The main trimmers back leg is angled forward a bit, resting on the angled structure I though might house the traveller (although it would have been a very awkward spot for one)

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Actually looks like the traveller was removed and the aft winches moved back closer to the cockpit bulkhead if you look closely at the racing and berthed images. The paint job might be different too

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That little fitting on top of the cockpit divider must be a temp thing, I can't imagine sheeting to it in anything over 5 knots. 

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I have to side with Life Boat on this one: Terrorist is and was an ugly boat. The fact that it was semi-functional is not enough to make it pretty.

Al Cassel built it (for himself) in his Sparcraft mfg facility in Costa Mesa.

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2 hours ago, Somebody Else said:

I have to side with Life Boat on this one: Terrorist is and was an ugly boat. The fact that it was semi-functional is not enough to make it pretty.

Sounds like a candidate for Admiration.

If there really is a traveler.

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