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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

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bruce

will we see a move to retro ocean racing

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historic car racing form the 70s and 80s is becoming very popular

will we see the same thing in ocean racing 

IOR racing anyone ? 

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Nope,  tearing around Fastnet Rock in an open 40 .......... bit more water ballast please .......... beats plowing a furrow in the Irish Sea any day of the week.

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I've been racing on a 1983 SC50, that we still do quite well with. How retro do you want to go?

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I gotta be honest, while it would be great if a bunch more of the old IOR warhorses started showing up on start lines, I'd still rather be watching them start from the deck of something that can get out of its own way.

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If anyone is feeling nostalgic in Brisbane. My mate owns a 43' IOR boat & is looking for two more good crew for the 2018 season. Surf to City - Brisbane to Gladstone & local races. The boat has been updated with a new keel, triple spreader rig with single backstay. A new rudder & new standing rigging has just been completed. It is competitive with the modern boats. It has a good IRC rating & a good wardrobe. PM me. 

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See the revived Golden Globe race with 27" full keel boats. Looks like it's the real deal. In Vancouver there is a lot of 6 meter, Dragon and Star racing so vintage racing seems pretty well established. I'd suspect IOR boats aren't old enough to be interesting as vintage boats but are still expensive to run. 

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8 hours ago, Tom O'Keefe said:

I've been racing on a 1983 SC50, that we still do quite well with. How retro do you want to go?

ULDB > IOR

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8 hours ago, Tom O'Keefe said:

I've been racing on a 1983 SC50, that we still do quite well with. How retro do you want to go?

Totally agree with Tom, sailing on the Moore 24 designed in the 70’s is a ton of fun. It’s a great doublehanded west coast platform... but sailing on the 125 and the shock 40 also bring big smiles!!

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1 hour ago, LB 15 said:

So much has changed since those days.

 

tumblr_n0uwyue2mY1shyld4o1_500.jpg

Cunts on boats? Nothing has changed there mate.

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18 hours ago, rfullarton said:

historic car racing form the 70s and 80s is becoming very popular

will we see the same thing in ocean racing 

IOR racing anyone ? 

Retro ......Be nice to remove the electronic tracking ,  media, sponsorship curse......

 

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7 hours ago, DickDastardly said:

looks a great event !

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2 hours ago, Couta said:

Gorgeoous boat, used to lust after it when it was based in Sydney

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On 20/12/2017 at 4:33 AM, rfullarton said:

historic car racing form the 70s and 80s is becoming very popular

will we see the same thing in ocean racing 

IOR racing anyone ? 

rfullarton 

the old boats are still racing, just look at the 1/4 toners in Europe. They are running a world championship still. 

 

It has some big $$$$$ being spend on these old Boat and some big names are doing the circuit as well. 

 

Its he old thing of “if you build it, they will come”. The 50 year regatta proved that and many clubs would be more than happy to run a division for IOR handicaps if owners wanted it. It’s just a matter of getting 5 or so boats together with a valid IOR handicaps and away you go. The old IOR rule was a open rule so not like IRC today. You just need to find some one to manage the rule and away you go. 

 

Pulpit

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6 minutes ago, Couta said:

As a Dubois fan I get it.... but no way does Black Magic have the same cache as Mark Twain in the Retro stakes.

My ultimate retro would be the Dubois 42, Police Car, because it's the ocean racer that caught my attention the most when I was a teen. It's a shame Black Magic is not in it's original paint job as it is here with PC

Police+Car+&+Black+Magic+Dubois+40s+1981

Personally I consider IOR boats retro and earlier racers veteran or vintage... Maybe it's just because when I was young, yacht racing was to me 12m's challenging NYYC and IOR ocean racers.

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1 hour ago, hoppy said:

My ultimate retro would be the Dubois 42, Police Car, because it's the ocean racer that caught my attention the most when I was a teen. It's a shame Black Magic is not in it's original paint job as it is here with PC

Police+Car+&+Black+Magic+Dubois+40s+1981

Personally I consider IOR boats retro and earlier racers veteran or vintage... Maybe it's just because when I was young, yacht racing was to me 12m's challenging NYYC and IOR ocean racers.

If that's Seaquesta obscured by Police Car, then you've got the Dubois trifecta! Looks like Admirals Cup trials off Sandy...if so, then I'm there! SportsCar would know!

And Mark Twain was definitely an IOR rated boat!

 

 

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3 hours ago, pulpit said:

rfullarton 

the old boats are still racing, just look at the 1/4 toners in Europe. They are running a world championship still. 

 

It has some big $$$$$ being spend on these old Boat and some big names are doing the circuit as well. 

 

Its he old thing of “if you build it, they will come”. The 50 year regatta proved that and many clubs would be more than happy to run a division for IOR handicaps if owners wanted it. It’s just a matter of getting 5 or so boats together with a valid IOR handicaps and away you go. The old IOR rule was a open rule so not like IRC today. You just need to find some one to manage the rule and away you go. 

 

Pulpit

 No need to dig up IOR and dust it off.  Leave it to rest.  You can race old IOR boats just fine under IRC, which will rate them very fairly in fact.  The Quarter and Half Ton retro cups are raced under IRC.

 

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1 hour ago, Couta said:

If that's Seaquesta obscured by Police Car, then you've got the Dubois trifecta! Looks like Admirals Cup trials off Sandy...if so, then I'm there! SportsCar would know!

And Mark Twain was definitely an IOR rated boat!

I think the photo came off a site which credited SportsCar for the photo and it was from the trials.

Ok, The underwater shape of MT doesn't look like what I am used to in an IOR design. I guess that's an age thing.

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3 hours ago, DtM said:

Police Car is sitting in a paddock on the north coast of NSW.

Seen the photos of it there and the discussions about it in other threads.

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On 12/20/2017 at 3:40 PM, LB 15 said:

So much has changed since those days.

 

tumblr_n0uwyue2mY1shyld4o1_500.jpg

Tasmania has suffered through modern cartography.

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5 hours ago, hoppy said:

If I wanted to go retro "Black Magic" is probably more the way I would go

https://yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/dubois-40/186537

Hey hoppy,

 

i own the sister ship ship of black magic, SeaULater that was a old sandy Boat. It still carries the sail number SM69. She will be back in the water I hope before gladstone next year. 

 

It will fit into your $80k budget with change to spare. I’m even hoping to get the old crocodile back on the side of her as well.

 

pulpit 

8638BD93-F3A6-4395-8318-FA3DCFB74696.jpeg

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How period correct does it need to be? Are we talking period correct clothing ala Goodwood Revival Meeting? 'Cause I've just found the old man's 81-82 RTW wets and you can count me out on that front. 

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On 20/12/2017 at 11:16 PM, slug zitski said:

Retro ......Be nice to remove the electronic tracking ,  media, sponsorship curse......

 

And bring back the racer chasers. Wait....most would be in their Mid 50's by now. Like the boats many by now will have had many owners, an extensive refit and a few modern touches added.  

 

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On 12/19/2017 at 10:46 AM, Tom O'Keefe said:

I've been racing on a 1983 SC50, that we still do quite well with. How retro do you want to go?

That boat is more restomod than retro.  Not that there's anything wrong with that!

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On 12/21/2017 at 5:26 AM, DickDastardly said:

 No need to dig up IOR and dust it off.  Leave it to rest.  You can race old IOR boats just fine under IRC, which will rate them very fairly in fact.  The Quarter and Half Ton retro cups are raced under IRC.

 

They have to change keels to heavier ones to be competitive in IRC. Unlike IOR IRC doesn't penalise stiffness.

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On 12/20/2017 at 3:40 AM, LB 15 said:

So much has changed since those days.

 

tumblr_n0uwyue2mY1shyld4o1_500.jpg

For a similar effect you can still gather a group of modern hippies.

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1 hour ago, LB 15 said:

And bring back the racer chasers. Wait....most would be in their Mid 50's by now. Like the boats many by now will have had many owners, an extensive refit and a few modern touches added.  

 

I hope they've taught their daughters well

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1 hour ago, LB 15 said:

And bring back the racer chasers. Wait....most would be in their Mid 50's by now. Like the boats many by now will have had many owners, an extensive refit and a few modern touches added.  

 

Nothing with  the return of racer chasers  ..bit of after hours action in the keel pit ....even bring back the racer chasers beer oclock tribal chant ... "feed me, fuck me , get me high, pay the bills and dont ask why " 

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On 12/20/2017 at 9:30 PM, Couta said:

mark twain looks a great buy ... 

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I borrowed this picture from an old friend, but this is what retro racing should look like - (and yes, I think that may even include the short shorts...)

Note - that's a cold-molded Peterson 42 named Challenger. It was owned and raced by Fred Hazard back in the day. I got the pleasure of drooling over this boat, and then racing on it once. ***sigh***

That is one sexy boat.

challenger.jpg

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***Note - if anybody knows where Challenger is these days - I would be in the market to purchase her. Last I saw, she was in Vancouver, B.C.

Damn that's a sexy boat.

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Doing up and downs in meter yachts or skerry cruisers may be fun but riding an IOR racehog over the open ocean is an entirely different thing. Me, I'd jump right from the wooden classics to modern fat bottom planing designs, thank you very much! 

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On 12/23/2017 at 10:46 AM, JasonSeibert said:

I borrowed this picture from an old friend, but this is what retro racing should look like - (and yes, I think that may even include the short shorts...)

Note - that's a cold-molded Peterson 42 named Challenger. It was owned and raced by Fred Hazard back in the day. I got the pleasure of drooling over this boat, and then racing on it once. ***sigh***

That is one sexy boat.

challenger.jpg

The guy trying to flick the lazy runner back around the boom may give you an idea as to why many of us are happy those days are in our wake. There are many things in the world that are nice to look at but boring to ride.

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There are lots of old IOR boats lying around in marinas, but the problem is that the all the safety regulations have moved on. Its not worthwhile to bring these boats up to scratch compared to taking on a late design performance racer/cruiser. The cost is not a big as you would think for the improvement in performance, especially in light/down wind conditions.

Inshore/Bay racing is a completely different story and there is huge potential to get all these grand old girls out with some class rules to prevent pimping.

3R

  

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If the boat has been loved safety costs aren't a big problem. Of course you don't want to spend 50k on your 50k IOR boat to race CAT1 when you could buy a turn key FARR40 for that money. 

I think it's largely about crew, runners, gybing the pole & weight on the rail & finding people who are happy to finish much later. Everyone is time poor these days. On an IOR boat everything loads up but you don't really go much faster, especially the bigger 1 tonners etc. 

If there are similar boats to race or the crew like the boat you might be ok. But generally most people would prefer the newer faster designs. 

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52 minutes ago, SCANAS said:

If the boat has been loved safety costs aren't a big problem. Of course you don't want to spend 50k on your 50k IOR boat to race CAT1 when you could buy a turn key FARR40 for that money. 

I think it's largely about crew, runners, gybing the pole & weight on the rail & finding people who are happy to finish much later. Everyone is time poor these days. On an IOR boat everything loads up but you don't really go much faster, especially the bigger 1 tonners etc. 

If there are similar boats to race or the crew like the boat you might be ok. But generally most people would prefer the newer faster designs. 

And their are plenty of others things that were glams in the '70's that you can ride on when you get to Gladstone.

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14 hours ago, SCANAS said:

If the boat has been loved safety costs aren't a big problem. Of course you don't want to spend 50k on your 50k IOR boat to race CAT1 when you could buy a turn key FARR40 for that money. 

I think it's largely about crew, runners, gybing the pole & weight on the rail & finding people who are happy to finish much later. Everyone is time poor these days. On an IOR boat everything loads up but you don't really go much faster, especially the bigger 1 tonners etc. 

If there are similar boats to race or the crew like the boat you might be ok. But generally most people would prefer the newer faster designs. 

I guess 70's IOR boats are like 70's supercars. They were fast and difficult to drive fast. Now days they are slow but still difficult to drive fast and now days a 70's supercar will be thrashed on a race track by a family SUV, a hot hatch and even a salesmans company car.

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23 minutes ago, hoppy said:

I guess 70's IOR boats are like 70's supercars. They were fast and difficult to drive fast. Now days they are slow but still difficult to drive fast and now days a 70's supercar will be thrashed on a race track by a family SUV, a hot hatch and even a salesmans company car.

Yeah, but while your Accord may be faster than an early Countach, it doesn't look or sound like one...

Countach_Autostadt.jpg

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36 minutes ago, sshow bob said:

Yeah, but while your Accord may be faster than an early Countach, it doesn't look or sound like one...

Countach_Autostadt.jpg

I was more fond on the 80's Countach. Might have been something to do with the poster on my bedroom wall :)

lp500qv9.jpg

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I had this poster on my wall as a teenager. Didn't make we want to own a tennis racket though.

 

lgPP32602.jpg

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If luck goes my way, we’ll be looking for an ocean “racer” soon and I don’t see why an Olsen 40 wouldn’t work.  Maybe an early IMS 40’er.

going to be sailing with teens and old guys

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2 hours ago, LB 15 said:

I had this poster on my wall as a teenager. Didn't make we want to own a tennis racket though.

 

lgPP32602.jpg

I didn't have it but I certainly studied it closely for it's artistic composition and lighting as part of my interest in photography :D 

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2 hours ago, LB 15 said:

And these as well.

ab7618e94bcef8cf4e6a65b81134145a--feathered-hair-farrah-fawcett.jpg

004-mp-cuttie.jpg

 

The second is Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz dude..

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Now this is a 70's classic I'd like to get into

 

Henrik-Purienne-1024x619.jpg

 

 

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Who wants a return to going 7.2 knots in almost every wind angle, with the occasional 10 knots when falling of a wave and broaching downwind?

IOR was just about ploughing a hole in the ocean. 

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Just now, mad said:

Who wants a return to going 7.2 knots in almost every wind angle, with the occasional 10 knots when falling of a wave and broaching downwind?

Not every classic is that sort of design. 

Olson 40 will lift her skirts a bit.  Might even be comfy enough for the off watch to get some sleep. 

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32 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

Not every classic is that sort of design. 

Olson 40 will lift her skirts a bit.  Might even be comfy enough for the off watch to get some sleep. 

Fair point, I’m basing this on the joys of IOR boats. 

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4 hours ago, mad said:

Who wants a return to going 7.2 knots in almost every wind angle, with the occasional 10 knots when falling of a wave and broaching downwind?

IOR was just about ploughing a hole in the ocean. 

Indeed it is but racing anotehr bunch of boats with similar performance profiles is fun as it ends up very tight on handicap, unlike modern IRC/ORCi/PHRF racing where boat performance curves differ so much across the fleet that the weather becomes the main determinant in who wins.

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16 minutes ago, DickDastardly said:

Indeed it is but racing anotehr bunch of boats with similar performance profiles is fun as it ends up very tight on handicap, unlike modern IRC/ORCi/PHRF racing where boat performance curves differ so much across the fleet that the weather becomes the main determinant in who wins.

Ok, another good point. :P

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