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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
Hillary

I know this about Trump

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  1. People always underestimate him. 
  2. He uses that weakness against them.
  3. Whatever obstacles life has thrown at him he has overcome them. The definition of success.
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We know this about Trump:

1. He trolls from Twitter

2. He delegitimizes the media by calling "Fake News" to anything he doesn't like.

3. When obstacles of life hits him he files bankruptcy and sues someone.

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4. he employs a large legal staff

 

 

 

i don't know (for certain) much more than that about the man

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4 minutes ago, aA said:

4. he employs a large legal staff

 

 

 

i don't know (for certain) much more than that about the man

He's fat, and rude.

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40 minutes ago, Hillary said:
  1. People always underestimate him. 
  2. He uses that weakness against them.
  3. Whatever obstacles life has thrown at him he has overcome them. The definition of success.

That’s just your opinion moron, nothing more than that. 

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1 hour ago, Ishmael said:

5. He has the morals of a remora.

Is that being at all fair to remoras?

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1 minute ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Is that being at all fair to remoras?

You can substitute lampreys if it makes you feel better.

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He's a salesman; as such, the truth doesn't matter, it's just part of the sales pitch.  

He's good at reading a crowd and telling them what they want to hear.  Unfortunately it's almost always a lie, unless he's talking to a crowd of 1%'ers.

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16 minutes ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:
1 hour ago, Ishmael said:

5. He has the morals of a remora.

Is that being at all fair to remoras?

Ethically and physically he's much closer to a Hagfish. Especially the bit about the slime coating.

 

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18 minutes ago, Ishmael said:
20 minutes ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Is that being at all fair to remoras?

You can substitute lampreys if it makes you feel better.

That works for me too.

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26 minutes ago, phillysailor said:

At this point in his term, he is the worst US president in history.

His entire presidency so far has been a failure, except for golfing.  He's winning there.  Bigly.

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12 minutes ago, Spatial Ed said:

His entire presidency so far has been a failure, except for golfing.  He's winning there.  Bigly.

Tougher to take Mulligans as President though. 

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Just now, Sean said:

Tougher to take Mulligans as President though. 

That's why he blocks the media from covering it.

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3 hours ago, phillysailor said:

At this point in his term, he is the worst US president in history.

He achieved that dubious distinction on inauguration day.

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21 hours ago, mad said:

That’s just your opinion moron, nothing more than that. 

That is obvious in the title Mad Man

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On 1/5/2018 at 11:41 AM, Hillary said:
  1. People always underestimate him. 
  2. He uses that weakness against them.
  3. Whatever obstacles life has thrown at him he has overcome them. The definition of success.

Cult-of-Trump-4.jpg

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5 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

RKQRbHc.jpg

I like it although it is a little insulting to rastafarians.  

 

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5 hours ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Very good, actually much better than that!

Trump is a woman?

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11 minutes ago, Hillary said:

Trump is a woman?

Yes. A girl to be more specific.  Have you seen his tweets after some hurts his widdle feelings? 

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10 minutes ago, benwynn said:

Yes. A girl to be more specific.  Have you seen his tweets after some hurts his widdle feelings? 

At least it's better than going out and killing kittens like he used to do.

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On 07/01/2018 at 8:48 AM, Hillary said:

I'm my own tree topper

You're sticking Christmas trees up your ass now Jack? 

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On 1/6/2018 at 6:31 AM, Sol Rosenberg said:

6. He is insecure about the size of his "button".  

Hillary will argue that there is nothing wrong with having a tiny cannon.

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6 minutes ago, LB 15 said:
On 1/6/2018 at 7:31 AM, Sol Rosenberg said:

6. He is insecure about the size of his "button".  

Hillary will argue that there is nothing wrong with having a tiny cannon.

On a related note, when 3beaner the newbie right-handed shitposter goes through his obligatory breakdown and starts lashing out, can we all please unify and ask Scot to "Flick the bean?"

That would really make my day.

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46 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

On a related note, when 3beaner the newbie right-handed shitposter goes through his obligatory breakdown and starts lashing out, can we all please unify and ask Scot to "Flick the bean?"

That would really make my day.

You have my vote to flick the little prick any time.

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16 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

You have my vote to flick the little prick any time.

#FlickTheBean

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On 1/5/2018 at 12:41 PM, Hillary said:
  1. People always underestimate him. 
  2. He uses that weakness against them.
  3. Whatever obstacles life has thrown at him he has overcome them. The definition of success.

Partly.

He does seem to know the art of subterfuge. He obviously worked out a back door deal with North and South Korea to get them to their talks. I can't imagine what he used as incentive, maybe some big commercial development deal with Russia. And then he hid it under that brouhaha with the nuclear button shitfight. So yeah, I give him credit for the sneak and guile.

But I should hope that he knows how to at least do that right, he's been doing that kind of business for decades.

The problem is just what you wrote. Because yes, there is a flipside, but it's not a good thing that people underestimate him. He's The Freaking President of our country. I don't want anyone underestimating, estimating, or overestimating my President

I want my President to be such a steely-eyed bad ass that anyone who looks at him, knows exactly that he or she will point down the field and then run precisely to that spot because he or she is the patent global bad ass who doesn't need to trick anyone.

I want my President to be the political equivalent of Muhammad Ali or Tyson in the ring. He says he's going to knock you the fuck out with a left hook, and then anyone dumb enough to prance gets the fuck knocked out with a left hook telegraphed with the precision of Marconi. I don't want some slight-of-hand master. Fuck that shit. When the President of a small West African democracy can outstare the leader of the free world, then we need a testicle transplant somewhere up high.

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1 minute ago, mikewof said:

Partly.

He does seem to know the art of subterfuge. He obviously worked out a back door deal with North and South Korea to get them to their talks. I can't imagine what he used as incentive, maybe some big commercial development deal with Russia. And then he hid it under that brouhaha with the nuclear button shitfight. So yeah, I give him credit for the sneak and guile.

But I should hope that he knows how to at least do that right, he's been doing that kind of business for decades.

The problem is just what you wrote. Because yes, there is a flipside, but it's not a good thing that people underestimate him. He's The Freaking President of our country. I don't want anyone underestimating, estimating, or overestimating my President

I want my President to be such a steely-eyed bad ass that anyone who looks at him, knows exactly that he or she will point down the field and then run precisely to that spot because he or she is the patent global bad ass who doesn't need to trick anyone.

I want my President to be the political equivalent of Muhammad Ali or Tyson in the ring. He says he's going to knock you the fuck out with a left hook, and then anyone dumb enough to prance gets the fuck knocked out with a left hook telegraphed with the precision of Marconi. I don't want some slight-of-hand master. Fuck that shit. When the President of a small West African democracy can outstare the leader of the free world, then we need a testicle transplant somewhere up high.

You think Trump got the Koreas to talk? Really? He was too busy picking lint out of his foreskin to bother with that shit.

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18 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

You think Trump got the Koreas to talk? Really? He was too busy picking lint out of his foreskin to bother with that shit.

Yeah, I think he did it, I'm quite sure of it. He probably used some kind of carrot-on-stick with a Russian-DPRK infrastructure development. Russia wants to do that kind of work anyway, all the better if they can build a major industrial port/rail between the South and the North. Then the South can get the cheap manufacturing up North. 

But it's a risky game to play, if in fact that's what happened, because she North gets economic strength back, without specific guarantees of spooling back their defense export manufacturing.

He did something, South Korea came out and said that he did.  Hopefully it isn't frying pan to fire.

But then again, from his perspective, he's playing with house money, because if the whole mess explodes in our face, it will most likely happen during a Blue administration.

Heres one thing I know about Trump, he knows how to gamble. It doesn't mean that we won't pay for all the chips he loses, we will. But in a sufficiently short time scale, any losing gambler can appear to be a genius.

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14 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

On a related note, when 3beaner the newbie right-handed shitposter goes through his obligatory breakdown and starts lashing out, can we all please unify and ask Scot to "Flick the bean?"

That would really make my day.

Gotta maintain that echo chamber

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21 hours ago, mikewof said:

He did something, South Korea came out and said that he did.

Got a link?  I remember seeing the headline, but didn't read the article.

I'd assumed they just meant, he came off like such a psycho that it made NK want to talk to someone, and made SK look pretty damn approachable in comparison.

But like I said, I didn't read the actual article, so don't know what they actually said. 

 

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On 1/5/2018 at 12:41 PM, Hillary said:
  1. People always underestimate him. 
  2. He uses that weakness against them.
  3. Whatever obstacles life has thrown at him he has overcome them. The definition of success.

Mia Love says he’s a racist.  How does that set with your Mormon values?

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On 1/11/2018 at 3:57 PM, Ishmael said:

You have my vote to flick the little prick any time.

Bean bean bean..Sounds like Cat from Red Dwarf counting beans :D

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On 1/10/2018 at 9:16 PM, mikewof said:

Partly.

He does seem to know the art of subterfuge. He obviously worked out a back door deal with North and South Korea to get them to their talks. I can't imagine what he used as incentive, maybe some big commercial development deal with Russia. And then he hid it under that brouhaha with the nuclear button shitfight. So yeah, I give him credit for the sneak and guile.

But I should hope that he knows how to at least do that right, he's been doing that kind of business for decades.

The problem is just what you wrote. Because yes, there is a flipside, but it's not a good thing that people underestimate him. He's The Freaking President of our country. I don't want anyone underestimating, estimating, or overestimating my President

I want my President to be such a steely-eyed bad ass that anyone who looks at him, knows exactly that he or she will point down the field and then run precisely to that spot because he or she is the patent global bad ass who doesn't need to trick anyone.

I want my President to be the political equivalent of Muhammad Ali or Tyson in the ring. He says he's going to knock you the fuck out with a left hook, and then anyone dumb enough to prance gets the fuck knocked out with a left hook telegraphed with the precision of Marconi. I don't want some slight-of-hand master. Fuck that shit. When the President of a small West African democracy can outstare the leader of the free world, then we need a testicle transplant somewhere up high.

Nah, Putin had it right.

Lil Kim played the game. His daddy built the bomb. He built the delivery method.  He's now secure in his little castle in Pyongyang. In his security, he can reach out to talk to South Korea with a damn good card hand.  He beat Trump. Like a pro beats a mark.

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3 hours ago, Spatial Ed said:

Mia Love says he’s a racist.  How does that set with your Mormon values?

Nailing Happy Hillary is old-school Mormon. Curse of Ham and all that.  

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1 minute ago, SloopJonB said:

Does that mean he wears magic undies?

the itchy wool ones, which explains a bit of the crankiness, no?

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15 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

the itchy wool ones, which explains a bit of the crankiness, no?

That, and realizing that he's here posting like some 18th century woman in a flimsy masquerade ball mask pretending we don't know exactly who he is or how many times he's stepped on his own dick and been humiliated.

 

68e47fd57ff66414175727e56d0d42dd--the-ma

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4 hours ago, Spatial Ed said:

Mia Love says he’s a racist.  How does that set with your Mormon values?

Yeah.... racism and Mormonism kind of go hand in hand. You do know they only started ordaining black people to their senior priesthood after the IRS started making noise about their tax-exempt status right? And before that convenient "revelation", only white people could spend eternity with God (black people weren't good enough).

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7 hours ago, Bent Sailor said:

Yeah.... racism and Mormonism kind of go hand in hand. You do know they only started ordaining black people to their senior priesthood after the IRS started making noise about their tax-exempt status right? And before that convenient "revelation", only white people could spend eternity with God (black people weren't good enough).

Most religions are built on racism.

The reality of contemporary Mormans is that the vast majority of them are devoted to family and service, and aside from their incessant proselytizing, they reach out to people of all colors and ethnicities around the world.

I've no doubt that it was a racist religion back when most religions were racist too, but Mormonism today is no more racist than any other mainstream religion, and probably less racist than many.

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8 hours ago, Raz'r said:

Nah, Putin had it right.

Lil Kim played the game. His daddy built the bomb. He built the delivery method.  He's now secure in his little castle in Pyongyang. In his security, he can reach out to talk to South Korea with a damn good card hand.  He beat Trump. Like a pro beats a mark.

Woah, that's a compelling way to look at it. That would also explain why South Korea credits Trump, because they don't dare acknowledge Kim.

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12 hours ago, frenchie said:

Got a link?  I remember seeing the headline, but didn't read the article.

I'd assumed they just meant, he came off like such a psycho that it made NK want to talk to someone, and made SK look pretty damn approachable in comparison.

But like I said, I didn't read the actual article, so don't know what they actually said. 

Their President seemed genuine;

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/10/world/asia/moon-jae-in-trump-north-korea.html

But I like Raz'r's analysis better.

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6 hours ago, mikewof said:

Most religions are built on racism.

The reality of contemporary Mormans is that the vast majority of them are devoted to family and service, and aside from their incessant proselytizing, they reach out to people of all colors and ethnicities around the world.

I've no doubt that it was a racist religion back when most religions were racist too, but Mormonism today is no more racist than any other mainstream religion, and probably less racist than many.

Yeah... Church publications from 2003 still recommended that people marry within their own racial ethnicities. Just because they are no longer allowed to outright forbid the act doesn't stop that being racist.

The Mormon belief regarding black skin is that those born with it were less virtuous spirits in the pre-existence. In other words, white people have purer souls than black people. Again, like it or not, whether they have an admirable devotion to family and service - that is racist.

I grew up in the Church. My family are still very devout members of the Church. My mother still discusses her doubts about the Church with me occasionally, where this issue still comes up. I have no doubts that there are many, many good and virtuous people in the Church. However, their doctrine is racist and that leads to racism in the congregation. Just because they are not burning crosses and beating black people with sticks doesn't change that.

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Lamanites are described as having received a "skin of blackness" to distinguish them from the Nephites. The Lamanites began as wicked rivals to the more righteous Nephites, but when the Nephite civilization became decadent, it lost divine favor and was destroyed by the Lamanites.

"Because of their unbelief, the Lamanites are cursed, receive a skin of blackness, and become a scourge unto the Nephites. The Lamanites shall be a dark, filthy, and loathsome people."  Second Nephi 5.

 

So sayeth the Golden Tablets.

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4 minutes ago, Spatial Ed said:

Lamanites are described as having received a "skin of blackness" to distinguish them from the Nephites. The Lamanites began as wicked rivals to the more righteous Nephites, but when the Nephite civilization became decadent, it lost divine favor and was destroyed by the Lamanites.

"Because of their unbelief, the Lamanites are cursed, receive a skin of blackness, and become a scourge unto the Nephites. The Lamanites shall be a dark, filthy, and loathsome people."  Second Nephi 5.

 

So sayeth the Golden Tablets.

If I'd known that I would have stayed away from laminite counters.

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10 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

If I'd known that I would have stayed away from laminite counters.

stay weary of carbon fiber spinnaker poles too.

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2 hours ago, Bent Sailor said:

Yeah... Church publications from 2003 still recommended that people marry within their own racial ethnicities. Just because they are no longer allowed to outright forbid the act doesn't stop that being racist.

The Mormon belief regarding black skin is that those born with it were less virtuous spirits in the pre-existence. In other words, white people have purer souls than black people. Again, like it or not, whether they have an admirable devotion to family and service - that is racist.

I grew up in the Church. My family are still very devout members of the Church. My mother still discusses her doubts about the Church with me occasionally, where this issue still comes up. I have no doubts that there are many, many good and virtuous people in the Church. However, their doctrine is racist and that leads to racism in the congregation. Just because they are not burning crosses and beating black people with sticks doesn't change that.

Lessee ... I have three Morman cousins, two of them married African American spouses, they have mixed-ethnicity children, and they seem to have little issue with the LDS church nor the church with them.

I'm not denying the racism that you find in doctrines, because every religion seems to have its share of racist wackadoos who know how to publish. But my actual experience with actual Mormans doesn't reflect the wackadoo position.

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39 minutes ago, mikewof said:

Lessee ... I have three Morman cousins, two of them married African American spouses, they have mixed-ethnicity children, and they seem to have little issue with the LDS church nor the church with them.

I'm not denying the racism that you find in doctrines, because every religion seems to have its share of racist wackadoos who know how to publish. But my actual experience with actual Mormans doesn't reflect the wackadoo position.

The LDS church has learned to adapt to the cultural changes and acceptance of the dark skins in society.  Thus why you cousins are allowed to maintain their priesthood status.

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1 hour ago, mikewof said:

Lessee ... I have three Morman cousins, two of them married African American spouses, they have mixed-ethnicity children, and they seem to have little issue with the LDS church nor the church with them.

I'm not denying the racism that you find in doctrines, because every religion seems to have its share of racist wackadoos who know how to publish. But my actual experience with actual Mormans doesn't reflect the wackadoo position.

You can't even spell it right, and you are arguing from authority with 3rd party anecdotes with someone that was raised in Mormonism and de-converted....

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1 hour ago, B.J. Porter said:

You can't even spell it right, and you are arguing from authority with 3rd party anecdotes with someone that was raised in Mormonism and de-converted....

I know my cousins, and my aunt, they're Mormons and they're some of the best people I know. And two of them married black guys. Their LDS church had a lot more Black folks than the Lutheran church or the nondenominational in the same neighborhood.

Colorado is next to Utah, there are a lot of Mormons here. And I love eleven lot of them. Suck my balls. 

Apologies on the spelling, my Swype wasn't recognizing it.

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2 hours ago, Spatial Ed said:

The LDS church has learned to adapt to the cultural changes and acceptance of the dark skins in society.  Thus why you cousins are allowed to maintain their priesthood status.

I can tell you, they don't give a rat's ass about their status.

They go to church when it suits them, my auntie sends me Facebook messages at inopportune times, and my cousins talk about basketball, cool music and potluck. Lots and lots of potluck.

I'm convinced that whatever religious dogma they used to have has now been completely supplanted by family game night, sparkling apple juice and potluck. So much potluck.

My wife and kids and I never go to church, I'm not even a Christian. But my Mormon cousins all spend a lot of time with each other and seem happier than we are.

I don't care if this makes Jack Happy, but my Mormon family is happy and healthy.

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17 minutes ago, mikewof said:

I know my cousins, and my aunt, they're Mormons and they're some of the best people I know. And two of them married black guys. Their LDS church had a lot more Black folks than the Lutheran church or the nondenominational in the same neighborhood.

Colorado is next to Utah, there are a lot of Mormons here. And I love eleven lot of them. Suck my balls. (No offense BJ.)

Apologies on the spelling, my Swype wasn't recognizing it.

Again...you know your cousins.

You were not raised in the religion. How many Mormon services for Mormons only did you attend? I'm guessing NON. How many Mormon religious education classes did you go to as a kid?

When you are explaining Mormonism to someone who was raised in the religion based up the anecdotes you have from your 3rd party experience, you come off like  a bit of a dink, that's all.

I'll take the word of the guy raised in the religion, whose immediate family still follows the religion, over someone that "knows a couple of nice Mormons."

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7 hours ago, mikewof said:

Lessee ... I have three Morman cousins, two of them married African American spouses, they have mixed-ethnicity children, and they seem to have little issue with the LDS church nor the church with them.

I'm not denying the racism that you find in doctrines, because every religion seems to have its share of racist wackadoos who know how to publish. But my actual experience with actual Mormans doesn't reflect the wackadoo position.

I'm not denying that you've heard nice things second-hand through discussions with your cousins who would want to give the best impression of their religious faith possible. 

I am simply pointing out that my first-hand experience of being raised in the church, with siblings & parents still actively devout members runs counter to what you have heard. It also coincides with the actual doctrine, which is somewhat more definitive in regards to what a church believes than what an outsider is told. 

Lying for the lord, milk before meat, sacred but not secret oaths, etc are somewhat problematic when it come's to truly determining what a church/cult believes. Let us know when you've done work in the temple, been ordained into the priesthood,  and/or actually just been a Mormon for enough time you are trusted with "non-faith promoting" discussion. Careful not to fuck with your cousins' temple recommend by pushing for details though. They can get in trouble for that if they have the wrong bishopric called for their ward. 

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7 hours ago, Bent Sailor said:

I'm not denying that you've heard nice things second-hand through discussions with your cousins who would want to give the best impression of their religious faith possible. 

I am simply pointing out that my first-hand experience of being raised in the church, with siblings & parents still actively devout members runs counter to what you have heard. It also coincides with the actual doctrine, which is somewhat more definitive in regards to what a church believes than what an outsider is told. 

Lying for the lord, milk before meat, sacred but not secret oaths, etc are somewhat problematic when it come's to truly determining what a church/cult believes. Let us know when you've done work in the temple, been ordained into the priesthood,  and/or actually just been a Mormon for enough time you are trusted with "non-faith promoting" discussion. Careful not to fuck with your cousins' temple recommend by pushing for details though. They can get in trouble for that if they have the wrong bishopric called for their ward. 

I have no idea what it's like for you where you are, I didn't claim to know.

My life has been full of Mormons for as long as I can remember. The ones in my family don't seem to care about the deeper meanings, most of them didn't even do mission. (Some of my Mormon friends did mission.)

Did you do mission?

I'm sure that whatever you went through With that cult did suck. But really, how different is LDS from any other Christian cult? They all proselytize, they will lie to "save a soul" and Christianity in general seems to attempt to have no compunction in breaking apart a family if Christ isn't accepted by one of the key members.

You're giving me these warnings as if LDS is somehow more screwey than Baptists, Lutherans, and Pentecostals. Those folks have to reject science in a way that makes magic underwear seem kind of quaint. Ironically, it's now Catholics who are showing some of the most progress, at least they don't risk burning in hell believing in Origin of the Species, or for refusing to proselytize to their Jew relatives who have now been cleared for the burn in hell thing by the Pope. My fiend had to lie to his J Witness mom for years about his military service, lest she die of a broken heart.

And whatever milk before meat lifestyle LDS dogma offends you is absolute lightweight compared to Judaism or even Seventh Day Adventists. Right now there are millions on top of millions of observant Jews and Adventists who won't touch anything electrical, or carry their house keys because of Sabbath, to say nothing of only eating a piece of bologna that comes from meat scraps only from the front of a steer that was butchered only in the perfect ritualistic way. And ultra-orthodox Jews can make Muslims look often downright irreligious in comparison.

Heck, as long as the can of worms is open, what about the world of peace-loving Buddhists who suddenly become murdering mobs in places like Burma? Where is Buddha when that Buddhist monk is hacking apart a Muslim immigrant with a machete?

Religions can be screwed up, child raping monstrosities. You came through one of the more modem Christian cults. Your experiences sucked. I get it. My cousins' experiences didn't seem to suck as much. Some left LDS, some didn't.

I sat in a nondenominational service where the minister spent a surprisingly large part of his sermon talking about how we want to rape women, and "sleep with children" ... but we don't because Christ lives inside of us and prevents that of we believe. Excuse me? Christ isn't in me, and I've no desire to rape women and children. Nor does that thought even need to enter my mind, and didn't enter my mind until that handsome maniac told the church that's what we all want to do.

 

Some people unfortunately have fucked up lives and those people often seek religion as an emotional refuge. Sometimes their lives are further fucked up because they seeked religion as an emotional refuge. At the same time, I know some fairly fucked up people who look for emotional refuge in atheism too, one person even in B'hai, whom I knew. The Unitarians I know seem pretty stable, but I don't know too many Unitarians. One distant family member in California is in Scientology, she seems stable. 

Anyway, I reject that idea that Mormonism is any better or worse than any other religion. I think that religion is what you make it. Like a palette of bricks, you launch the bricks one by one at your perceived enemies and crack some skulls. Or you can build a brick shithouse instead, and have something that lasts a while.

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Leave the Lutherans out of it Mike.  Many are good people.  Some of them, Missouri Synod, are bad hombres though.

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11 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

Again...you know your cousins.

You were not raised in the religion. How many Mormon services for Mormons only did you attend? I'm guessing NON. How many Mormon religious education classes did you go to as a kid?

When you are explaining Mormonism to someone who was raised in the religion based up the anecdotes you have from your 3rd party experience, you come off like  a bit of a dink, that's all.

I'll take the word of the guy raised in the religion, whose immediate family still follows the religion, over someone that "knows a couple of nice Mormons."

Why do I give a rat's ass what happens inside an LDS place? Ever been in Pentecostal service? You might see things that make LDS look rational.

I have eyes, ears, and I have a memory. Mormons whom I have known all my life seem no more screwed up than ones I have known from other religions. I have seen children and spouses get the living tar beat out of them by an adult who rejects all religions.

Yeah, I get that Bent Sailor and you have now presumably shared a beer and you now respect his expertise in this. I don't reject his expertise in it, because I didn't grow up in Mormonism. 

But you have a mountain of convincing to try to sell me on.the idea that Mormonism is somehow uniquely more screwed up than any other religion. My relatives who came through it, came through it intact.

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12 minutes ago, Spatial Ed said:

Leave the Lutherans out of it Mike.  Many are good people.  Some of them, Missouri Synod, are bad hombres though.

Lutherans are terrific people. Some of them apparently even allow themselves to believe in evolution without worrying about eternal damnation. I love that.

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I went to a Benadictine Catholic church years ago for a wedding.  Holy shit.  It was Catholicism on steroids.  When they started walking around the place swinging the smoking flail around while chanting and waving other shit over our heads, it felt like I was somewhere in the deep Amazon.  

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1 hour ago, benwynn said:

I went to a Benadictine Catholic church years ago

Are they the ones who make Benadryl?

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3 hours ago, benwynn said:

I went to a Benadictine Catholic church years ago for a wedding.  Holy shit.  It was Catholicism on steroids.  When they started walking around the place swinging the smoking flail around while chanting and waving other shit over our heads, it felt like I was somewhere in the deep Amazon.  

If you want your mind blown, try to make a friend with a Zoroastrian, if you can find one. Their religion was once proportionately bigger than Christianity, and by the time it was nearing extinction was about the same time Christianity was invented.

It's like looking into the birth of every major contemporary religion. Including the Catholic smoke pots. They have a temple in Rockland County, NY. Gorgeous graphic design and architecture, it looks oddly contemporary, almost corporate.

I've noticed a thread connecting.Zoroatrianism, Jainism and Samaritanism, and then the paleo-American faiths. I don't think that they made it across the land bridge before the reliions developed, but rather that what we have now on all of them is the remnants of something that came before. You can practically do archeology on religions just by looking at the still-active remnants.

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As expected, @mikewof, when faced with a fuck up you couldn't fix by pretending a better source of superior knowledge - you instead went with the long screed of irrelevant bullshit that has little to do with the original point. 

I did not say, nor have I ever argued, that Mormons are worse than other Christian sects or even other non-Christian religions. I did not say, nor have I ever argued, that Mormons have weirder beliefs than other Christian sects or even other non-Christian religions. I said Mormons have racist beliefs. You tried saying that was just in the past and that they are no more racist than most mainstream religions. You are wrong. Your attempt to prove that you knew what you were talking about rested on you knowing some black people in the Church and that they were happy. There were happy black people in the Church whilst they were explicitly denied the full priesthood due to the colour of their skin. Their happiness doesn't change the fact that belief is racist as was the policy. 

I'm not going to follow you down your new little rabbit hole, mikey. You want to argue that there are other weirder or worse religions, you find someone that thinks you're wrong and go to town. I'm not that person. It's trivial to find weirder and worse religions. It's trivial to find weirder and worse sects of Mormonism than mainstream LDS. That was never my point. My point was that Mormonism has racist beliefs. My point is that those racists beliefs are still evident in the Mormon culture. That's a fact I can prove, despite whatever it is you think your Mormon friends and cousins "being happy" proves about something else.

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18 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

As expected, @mikewof, when faced with a fuck up you couldn't fix by pretending a better source of superior knowledge - you instead went with the long screed of irrelevant bullshit that has little to do with the original point. 

I did not say, nor have I ever argued, that Mormons are worse than other Christian sects or even other non-Christian religions. I did not say, nor have I ever argued, that Mormons have weirder beliefs than other Christian sects or even other non-Christian religions. I said Mormons have racist beliefs. You tried saying that was just in the past and that they are no more racist than most mainstream religions. You are wrong. Your attempt to prove that you knew what you were talking about rested on you knowing some black people in the Church and that they were happy. There were happy black people in the Church whilst they were explicitly denied the full priesthood due to the colour of their skin. Their happiness doesn't change the fact that belief is racist as was the policy. 

I'm not going to follow you down your new little rabbit hole, mikey. You want to argue that there are other weirder or worse religions, you find someone that thinks you're wrong and go to town. I'm not that person. It's trivial to find weirder and worse religions. It's trivial to find weirder and worse sects of Mormonism than mainstream LDS. That was never my point. My point was that Mormonism has racist beliefs. My point is that those racists beliefs are still evident in the Mormon culture. That's a fact I can prove, despite whatever it is you think your Mormon friends and cousins "being happy" proves about something else.

And once again you demonstrate your inability to read. In my original post I actually wrote that I didn't deny the racism that was claimed against Mormons, just that my personal experience with the Mormons whom I know doesn't reflect that. Two of them married Black men, and they have mixed-ethnicity children!

And complete argumentative guy that you are, you start yet another pointless shitfight about your experiences in LDS! YOU'RE THE ONE MAKING RABBIT HOLES! YOU'RE DIGGING FUCKING RABBIT HOLES WITH A STEAM SHOVEL!

Once again, for this fourth time now ... I don't deny your nightmare experience with LDS. It's the apex of the Bent Sailor asshole matrix though for you to deny my own experiences with my own cousins, whom I have known all my life.

So for the fourth time, I don't deny that some Mormons have racist beliefs, or even that they're woven into the fabric of the LDS. The Mormons whom I know are NOT racist! They married Black men! They have mixed-race children! They hug these mixed race children inside of the LDS church! They attend funerals and cook each other potlucks in the LDS church. Whatever racism you describe is not part of any LDS churge activity that I've seen in my town. And once again, I have no idea where you live or what it's like over there. If memory serves, you live in Australia. My time in Australia about twenty years ago was punctuated some incredibly blatant racism of the kind I've never seen here, overt. So say what you will about your life there, but you need to accept that it might not sufficiently describe my life here.

What did Gary say in South Park? Was it "suck my balls"?

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