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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

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On 2018-02-01 at 10:10 AM, slug zitski said:

Every afternoon i see two laser sailors, with coach boat, training off the harbour

these are aggressive, in your face behaviors 

Seriously?

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On 1/31/2018 at 8:30 AM, bdu98252 said:

A class is not bad because a small group of idiot parents lose sight of the important aspects of raising their child. The above story is a tale of ridiculous expectations, disposable cash and a lack of any sense of realism. Maybe you should have told your mate to get a grip and saved him some cash but deep down I am guessing that he was not such of a mate. If this family were not doing sailing then the kid would have been doing any number of other heavily coached activities.

We cant be shocked that winning in Optis has become a money game - I have been contrasting parts of Adult Competitive Sailing not the categories "Athletic" vs "Yachting" and  the second term I use synonymously with "Keel Boats."

But another way to think critically about the sport in the US - is "Fleets where you must buy a trophy" vs "Fleets where you can't"  The contrast is easy if i pick on the J70  - where having "Pros" on your team is mandatory to a top finish.  We took a "family friendly" keel (see initial brochure form J) boat and turned it into a money game.  The boat costs $70K and the trophy costs at least $500K - Ive done the analysis.   Contrast that to a 49er - no fancy Pro can get you around the course if you are not a great athletic sailor.  In the US, we (the majority of competitive sailors) like boats that are not physically challenging - where money is a key element to winning.

Optis can be great fleets to prepare kids for either avenue - in Australia you stay the boat as long as you have to - but the goal for an Aussie kid is to get to those cool skiffs and cats that the grown-up are sailing.  In the US the kids cant have that goal - no role models -  so the Opti game is played like the J70 game - as more of a money sport.  It's not the kids fault and sure isn't the boats fault - it just the nature of the sport in the US.

 

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On 2018-02-01 at 10:22 AM, slug zitski said:

At senior level , small keelboats, i know of no female owners

There are quite a few at my club. Some are really good sailors and competitive racers; some are the opposite. In other words, pretty much the same as the men.

i don’t know the exact figures, but from casual observation at the club I would estimate that the male-female split of all members (owners and crew) is approximately 60/40. That applies to all age groups.

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3 hours ago, slug zitski said:

Not to throw politics into this , but when talking about young people and  a decline in club sailing , you cant help but reflect on whats going on in society ...specifically the breakdown of the family unit.

I agree that society is changing, but “the breakdown of the family unit” is not all that widespread. Larger, more important changes are: (1) both parents now work in most families, and (2) people spend increasing amounts of time on solitary activities (e.g., watching television, surfing the Net, frequenting on-line chat rooms, etc.), rather than group activities (e.g., clubs, churches, sports teams).

Read the book Bowling Alone (2000), by Robert Putnam.

2 hours ago, slug zitski said:

Gee...you cant go sailing in an Opti or Laser with your family 

a kid cant just  show up at the club an go sailing ....

sailing starts young...first the swimming lessons, then summer sailing school.

What you describe is one model, not the only one.

Children can learn to sail with their parents on larger dinghies (e.g., Wayfarer, Flying Scot, Wanderer, Albacore), or keelboats.

People take up sailng at all ages; it isn’t like ballet, where you have no chance unless you begin at age 5.

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Dont know your club...

show me the entry list for a large  keel boat regatta in your region 

 

im looking at one now...big fleet....perhaps 5 percent female...perhaps less, 

i got tired of reading all the  entries 

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3 hours ago, Ajax said:

One of the allures of paddleboarding, is the convenience.  No storage, no maintenance, low skill level, low time commitments, low cost (comparatively.)

In my opinion, the fun factor is rather low.  I think it's a fad which will die off.  Yes, it's great exercise for your core but it's not fast and you're at constant risk of getting run over by everything faster than you, and wobbling your way through everyone else's wake cannot be anyone's idea of a relaxing time on the water.

I agree with Tom that I think a lot of people do it simply for "perception" purposes.  "Look at me, I'm outdoorsy and athletic."

Try it some time on a decent board...your perception of people doing it just for perception might change.

Your comments on it being cheap, accessible and a great workout....and I'll add outdoors and on the water... is why it is not a fad and has little chance of dying out anytime soon.

As an accessory for a larger cruising boat, it can easily run double duty as a toy and ship-to-shore utility craft. Anyone who says that a paddle board can't carry anything or will get tipped over at the first sight of a wake should probably get out there and give it a go. Might be surprised!

The first time I came across a whole bunch of recreational paddleboarders was about a decade ago in Santa Cruz. I thought WTF can the attraction be? Ten years later I see them everywhere being used by all types of people...beach or lake rentals of kayaks/canoes are now heavily augmented if not replaced by paddle boards.

An inflatable paddle board, which is not a flimsy beach toy...you'd hardly know the difference from a glass board for basic use...is a great addition to any cruising boat.

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I agree about the inflatables. A friend bought one and I was surprised at how rigid it was.

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5 minutes ago, Svanen said:

I agree that society is changing, but “the breakdown of the family unit” is not all that widespread. Larger, more important changes are: (1) both parents now work in most families, and (2) people spend increasing amounts of time on solitary activities (e.g., watching television, surfing the Net, frequenting on-line chat rooms, etc.), rather than group activities (e.g., clubs, churches, sports teams).

Read the book Bowling Alone (2000), by Robert Putnam.

What you describe is one model, not the only one.

Children can learn to sail with their parents on larger dinghies (e.g., Wayfarer, Flying Scot, Wanderer, Albacore), or keelboats.

People take up sailng at all ages; it isn’t like ballet, where you have no chance unless you begin at age 5.

Of course they can...im  talking about the club...sailing school, junior fleet... kids  just messing around....the progression to becoming a sailor 

when I was a kid there were armies...rival gangs of kids ....messing around the water, epic water  ballon battles, nightime raids on the club to sneak out in boats.  I dont see this now 

off course modern kids have more distractions and things to do these days, but I also think society  changes  , like family unit stuff, are also part of it 

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I don’t know your club, either! Why it is having trouble retaining women members, I have no idea.

I wasn’t implying that “mine is better than yours”; just making the point that women owners, and other club members, do exist and indeed are relatively plentiful: at least where I live.

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4 minutes ago, Svanen said:

I don’t know your club, either! Why it is having trouble retaining women members, I have no idea.

I wasn’t implying that “mine is better than yours”; just making the point that women owners, and other club members, do exist and indeed are relatively plentiful: at least where I live.

This is the big question...in a fleet like J 80 you would expect to have a more balanced ratio.

large  boats have always been a guys thing 

its possible that women  just dont like sailing 

not long ago a women described sailing to me as  masochistic  

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5 hours ago, Ajax said:

One of the allures of paddleboarding, is the convenience.  No storage, no maintenance, low skill level, low time commitments, low cost (comparatively.)

In my opinion, the fun factor is rather low.  I think it's a fad which will die off.  Yes, it's great exercise for your core but it's not fast and you're at constant risk of getting run over by everything faster than you, and wobbling your way through everyone else's wake cannot be anyone's idea of a relaxing time on the water.

I agree with Tom that I think a lot of people do it simply for "perception" purposes.  "Look at me, I'm outdoorsy and athletic."

I agree with you in areas of flatwater cruising, but here in Hawaii, I used to prone surf, and now all I do is Standup Paddle Surf (as well as windsurf).   You can catch 10x the waves than when prone surfing.  I dont think its going away in places that have surf.

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1 hour ago, slug zitski said:

This is the big question...in a fleet like J 80 you would expect to have a more balanced ratio.

large  boats have always been a guys thing 

its possible that women  just dont like sailing 

not long ago a women described sailing to me as  masochistic  

Well, that settles it then.  A single woman has spoken.  Big boats are a guy thing.  Women just don't like sailing.  It's masochistic.

Look at all the happy masochists!  Well, except for the main trimmer.

5a74b3d1bdb09_RTC2017.thumb.JPG.7de13a7b382315121378aaa42b295045.JPG

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Anyone can go for a ride....i can show you a million pictures of boats with girls on them

very very very few with girls owning and operating them

sailors, thats whats this is about.

as I pointed out...look at a  small keelboat regatta entry list 

count the women...then get back to me 

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I like sailing, and I know some other people (including my now adult children) who enjoy it too. Most of us started in Opti's, and have done a little racing. I have owned a sailing yacht (not necessarily an indication of great intelligence) for most of the past forty-five years, and have spent untold dollars, hours, gallons of sweat, skinned knuckles, etc. keeping the damn things in decent sailing and cosmetic shape. I've rationalized the tradeoff as completely worthwhile because of the deep seated emotional satisfaction I've derived over the years... playing with the wind, new harbors entered, the sunsets, the mistakes overcome, fears faced, placid anchorages, hauling down and passing other boats, yadda, yadda. I might have taken up flying, gotten deeper into sports cars and motorcycles, chased more women, drank more/better wine & liquor, invested more, etc., but I chose sailing and sailboats. It's worked for me... haven't gone bankrupt, sent to jail or rehab, or contracted an STD. 

But... it seems to me the pace of life has increased dramatically over the past dozen years, and is forcing leisure activities into smaller and smaller bite size chunks for most people. This (only half joking) may be the future of sailing for most folks?

 

VR Sailing.jpg

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1 hour ago, Left Shift said:

Well, that settles it then.  A single woman has spoken.  Big boats are a guy thing.  Women just don't like sailing.  It's masochistic.

Look at all the happy masochists!  Well, except for the main trimmer.

5a74b3d1bdb09_RTC2017.thumb.JPG.7de13a7b382315121378aaa42b295045.JPG

He has a great traveller there and he is playing the main?

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5 minutes ago, sugarbird said:

I like sailing, and I know some other people (including my now adult children) who enjoy it too. Most of us started in Opti's, and have done a little racing. I have owned a sailing yacht (not necessarily an indication of great intelligence) for most of the past forty-five years, and have spent untold dollars, hours, gallons of sweat, skinned knuckles, etc. keeping the damn things in decent sailing and cosmetic shape. I've rationalized the tradeoff as completely worthwhile because of the deep seated emotional satisfaction I've derived over the years... playing with the wind, new harbors entered, the sunsets, the mistakes overcome, fears faced, placid anchorages, hauling down and passing other boats, yadda, yadda. I might have taken up flying, gotten deeper into sports cars and motorcycles, chased more women, drank more/better wine & liquor, invested more, etc., but I chose sailing and sailboats. It's worked for me... haven't gone bankrupt, sent to jail or rehab, or contracted an STD. 

But... it seems to me the pace of life has increased dramatically over the past dozen years, and is forcing leisure activities into smaller and smaller bite size chunks for most people. This (only half joking) may be the future of sailing for most folks?

 

VR Sailing.jpg

Also getting a bit expensive..when i was a kid access to the waterfront was free,....not anymore

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5 hours ago, cbulger said:

Interesting to see where the conversation has turned.  For the record - recreational sailing is great, kids in Optis are great.... and keel boat racing is great - all are alive and well.

Again my observation is that Adult Athletic Competitive sailing has been on a declining trend in the US for 20 years.  And that the governing forces US Sailing, Yacht Clubs and for profits players (North and the few others) are all focused on keel boat sailing.  No more clubs, no more Olympic medals.... yada, yada

For those of us who are passionate about Adult Athletic Competitive Sailing - time to take a page out of the Australian/European playbooks and get our own act together.

Or just find some warmer water.

i tried to get my kids in dinghies in Hobart, they still remember the cold water.

moved to Sydney, no issues.

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8 hours ago, slug zitski said:

Not to throw politics into this , but when talking about young people and  a decline in club sailing , you cant help but reflect on whats going on in society ...specifically the breakdown of the family unit.

  For young folks to play basketball ,  they only need a pair of shoes and a walk down to the court.   No moms or dads needed. 

Sailing is different , heavy parental involvement .

its really obvious on Opti weekends...the place is overflowing with moms and dads. 

if you have fewer moms and dads, you will have fewer youth sailors 

 

 

IMG_8036.PNG

I think you are completely 100% wrong on this:

 

Sailing for kids WITHOUT their parents is far preferable in developing a love for the sport

Opti- moms and dads is exactly what is WRONG with junior sailing

 

Your last sentence makes no sense

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34 minutes ago, Christian said:

I think you are completely 100% wrong on this:

 

Sailing for kids WITHOUT their parents is far preferable in developing a love for the sport

Opti- moms and dads is exactly what is WRONG with junior sailing

 

Your last sentence makes no sense

i think he's saying they need parents to locate a program.., buy a boat.., schelp them back and forth every day....

but he's still wrong..., because the statistics he is citing are for the country as a whole.

in the sailing demographic - i.e. people with money, there are not nearly as many single parent households - that's one of the big differences between the poor and the rich in the usa

 

 

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Just now, us7070 said:

i think he's saying they need parents to locate a program.., buy a boat.., schelp them back and forth every day....

but he's still wrong..., because the statistics he is citing are for the country as a whole.

in the sailing demographic - i.e. people with money, there are not nearly as many single parent households - that's one of the big differences between the poor and the rich in the usa

 

 

Well that depends.......................I would venture that if parents do those things it may feel like the kid gets sailing stuffed down his/her throat and the "love for sailing" may get a foul taste.  The kids that can be enticed to do this on their own has a much higher chance of becoming life-long sailors.  And they do not need to buy a boat - there are plenty of opportunities to sail in club-owned boats and/or crew on OPB

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If you go down to the club on weekends , the place smells like polyester body filler.  

Dads are fixing bangs, screwdrivering, messing with rigging,,stretching out sails,  inflating flat dolly tires.....

i suppose that a 7 year old can  simply sail  j his dingy to the shipyard , have it hauled, present a work list to be done.

then pick it up next week, flash a visa card  , and  go sailing 

 

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5 minutes ago, slug zitski said:

If you go down to the club on weekends , the place smells like polyester body filler.  

Dads are fixing bangs, screwdrivering, messing with rigging,,stretching out sails,  inflating flat dolly tires.....

i suppose that a 7 year old can  simply sail  j his dingy to the shipyard , have it hauled, present a work list to be done.

then pick it up next week, flash a visa card  , and  go sailing 

 

Proving to me that you do NOT get it at all

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8 minutes ago, Christian said:

Proving to me that you do NOT get it at all

No..i dont get it at all

perhaps you should explain it to me one more time 

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So, we are out on Pittwater, there is a flock of boats up ahead.

a couple of dozen Optis racing in a tight course, around four RIBs from the club running around like sheepdogs.

around this is a circle of benehuntalinas, mums and dads drinking wine and telling Quentin to bear up, or Zoe to ease the sheet.

were is the self reliance, where is the fun, where is the peer group interaction?

Things sure have changed from the times the start boat would head out after the race to find all the lost kids in their sabots and VJ’s and tow them home.

 

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They do carefully shepard optis locally.    Normally 5 optis per Rib .

Commercial shipping uses the harbour..the racing area, sailing area is about one mile away...open  sea. 

The port authority requires shepards . 

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41 minutes ago, slug zitski said:

No..i dont get it at all

perhaps you should explain it to me one more time 

At least you have some self awareness.  No you don't get it at all.  I show you a pic of a 50/50 male/female crew on a winter race all kitted out in raingear, harnesses and warm clothes and smiling like crazy and you say:  "Well, anyone can go for a ride."   The women happen to be the tactician, trimmer, bow and backstay on that crew on a 50' raceboat.  That nobody "goes for a ride" on.  

What a fuckin' misogynist you are.  No.  You don't get it at all.

So, stop posting your bitter, whiny, negative and very unhelpful bullshit.  Or how about just delete your account.

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Just now, Left Shift said:

At least you have some self awareness.  No you don't get it at all.  I show you a pic of a 50/50 male/female crew on a winter race all kitted out in raingear, harnesses and warm clothes and smiling like crazy and you say:  "Well, anyone can go for a ride."   The women happen to be the tactician, trimmer, bow and backstay on that crew on a 50' raceboat.  That nobody "goes for a ride" on.  

What a fuckin' misogynist you are.  No.  You don't get it at all.

So, stop posting your bitter, whiny, negative and very unhelpful bullshit.  Or how about just delete your account.

You sound angry, frustrated

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11 hours ago, Svanen said:

There are quite a few at my club. Some are really good sailors and competitive racers; some are the opposite. In other words, pretty much the same as the men.

i don’t know the exact figures, but from casual observation at the club I would estimate that the male-female split of all members (owners and crew) is approximately 60/40. That applies to all age groups.

Why bother responding to slug- he is a fucking clown. He couldn't find his own ass with a mirror on a stick.

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5 hours ago, olaf hart said:

benehuntalinas

You'll hear a LOT of derision for the
'BeneHuntalina' boats - that's Beneteau, Hunter and Catalina - they are the major 'production' boat builders, and the main beef
against them is that 'you wouldn't want to sail out of sight of land in one of them'.

learnt me a new word did i :blink:

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5 hours ago, slug zitski said:

 

Dads are fixing bangs, 

 

Maybe they can fix a bang up for you. Your anger might indicate that it has been some time since you last 'pumped the bilges'. 

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Bullshit. Slugs been putting an effort into contributing and sharing some knowledge.

I'm sorry. I'm new to Internet sailing. Only about 4 years. Actual sailing 40 plus.

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On 1/30/2018 at 7:45 PM, LB 15 said:

Yada yada, Optis are child abuse yada yada, everyone should do what we do at our fabulous club yada yada children should put there phones down Yada yada...

For fucks sake, is there anything that hasn't been said 1000's of times already about this shit in the previous 25 000 threads on this topic?

+1. Every word of this and more has been said a thousand times for twenty years, and nothing has changed. Sailboat sales, sail participation and yacht club membership are still a fraction of what they were in the 80’s, despite the occasional localized blip up. The old guard continues to kill sailing as a pastime, and when they fade away, the next generation already doesn't care in large numbers. ...95% of youth sailors quit sailing by age 22.” Today’s kids/young adults aren’t interested in sailing given the costs-logistics-time and other alternatives, dragging them on to adult boats isn’t going to change that. Sailing continues to slide into a niche sport for the wealthy, most of the middle class left a generation ago or more.

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15 hours ago, MauiPunter said:
20 hours ago, Ajax said:

One of the allures of paddleboarding, is the convenience.  No storage, no maintenance, low skill level, low time commitments, low cost (comparatively.)

In my opinion, the fun factor is rather low.  I think it's a fad which will die off.  Yes, it's great exercise for your core but it's not fast and you're at constant risk of getting run over by everything faster than you, and wobbling your way through everyone else's wake cannot be anyone's idea of a relaxing time on the water.

I agree with Tom that I think a lot of people do it simply for "perception" purposes.  "Look at me, I'm outdoorsy and athletic."

I agree with you in areas of flatwater cruising, but here in Hawaii, I used to prone surf, and now all I do is Standup Paddle Surf (as well as windsurf).   You can catch 10x the waves than when prone surfing.  I dont think its going away in places that have surf.

The first time I tried one was at one of our passes between harbor and Gulf. No surf.

I was just going out to look at the baitfish on the shoal, contemplating how I might catch them later. I could have used my kayak and it would have been a lot easier to get back in against wind and tide.

I'm glad I tried out the paddleboard instead. The view of the bait was much better from a standing position than it is with my butt at water level.

I'm seeing more of them on the flats (and fewer kayaks) for this reason. They put a cooler with rod holders on it and go fishing.

Though I still suspect some of them are just doing it to meet chicks.

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10 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Why bother responding to slug- he is a fucking clown. He couldn't find his own ass with a mirror on a stick.

??

Is this how one looks for one's ass down under? Personally, I don't need to look for mine, but others often try with both hands in a bath tub.

FB- Doug

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4 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

The first time I tried one was at one of our passes between harbor and Gulf. No surf.

I was just going out to look at the baitfish on the shoal, contemplating how I might catch them later. I could have used my kayak and it would have been a lot easier to get back in against wind and tide.

I'm glad I tried out the paddleboard instead. The view of the bait was much better from a standing position than it is with my butt at water level.

I'm seeing more of them on the flats (and fewer kayaks) for this reason. They put a cooler with rod holders on it and go fishing.

Though I still suspect some of them are just doing it to meet chicks.

Before the SUP became a "thing" I used my windsurfer without the sail, to paddle into the marsh with the kids. It was the perfect tool because you could stand up to look over the grass.  Of course I was aware at the time that in Hawaii, people had been paddling boards for centuries. But even there, it had faded a lot. In 2006 when I was there, I didn't see many of them even in Waikiki. I'm sure they must be swarming there now.

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19 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Well, that settles it then.  A single woman has spoken.  Big boats are a guy thing.  Women just don't like sailing.  It's masochistic.

Look at all the happy masochists!  Well, except for the main trimmer.

5a74b3d1bdb09_RTC2017.thumb.JPG.7de13a7b382315121378aaa42b295045.JPG

The guy on the transom appears to be prepping the crew for an unannounced MOB drill! 

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On 1/30/2018 at 7:46 AM, cbulger said:

He was.... and is ... saying there are no facilities on Narragansett Bay dedicated to Athletic sailing.  There are a bunch who tolerate it and Sail Newport does as much as it can, and should,  within its charter.  Try to campaign a 49er, Nacra 17, F18 or the like in New England.   The boat will live in your driveway and you will travel.   Not so in Australia or all over Europe - where dingy and skiff clubs flourish under different charters and leadership.  I'd encourage you to read the Manly Skiff Club charter - you will get a sense of the kind of focus takes to keep adult athletic sailing thriving.

 The issue isn't that we don't win Olympic medals - the issue is that this part of the adult sport has been dying in the US for 20 years.  Medals are just a symptom.

There are a few Laser racers around 3rd beach in the evenings. No special facilities, just a boat ramp and a bay to sail in.

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5 hours ago, fastyacht said:

Before the SUP became a "thing" I used my windsurfer without the sail, to paddle into the marsh with the kids. It was the perfect tool because you could stand up to look over the grass.  Of course I was aware at the time that in Hawaii, people had been paddling boards for centuries. But even there, it had faded a lot. In 2006 when I was there, I didn't see many of them even in Waikiki. I'm sure they must be swarming there now.

they out number the prone surfers on most breaks.  

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16 hours ago, fufkin said:

Bullshit. Slugs been putting an effort into contributing and sharing some knowledge.

I'm sorry. I'm new to Internet sailing. Only about 4 years. Actual sailing 40 plus.

Mate surly after four years on sailing forums and 40 years sailing you could work out in 5 mins that If you gave Slug an enama you could fit him in a shitbox. 

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1 hour ago, LB 15 said:

Mate surly after four years on sailing forums and 40 years sailing you could work out in 5 mins that If you gave Slug an enama you could fit him in a shitbox. 

Gotta admit that registers on the chucklemeter.

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I did some interviews at this week's US Sailing Leadership forum about this subject and got some interesting discussions out of it.  All on SA Facebook under 'video'

 

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4 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

I did some interviews at this week's US Sailing Leadership forum about this subject and got some interesting discussions out of it.  All on SA Facebook under 'video'

 

https://www.facebook.com/SailingAnarchy/videos/10159996030120375/

More people will see it if you make it easy for 'em

FB- Doug

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On 2/2/2018 at 10:39 AM, cbulger said:

Interesting to see where the conversation has turned.  For the record - recreational sailing is great, kids in Optis are great.... and keel boat racing is great - all are alive and well.

Again my observation is that Adult Athletic Competitive sailing has been on a declining trend in the US for 20 years.  And that the governing forces US Sailing, Yacht Clubs and for profits players (North and the few others) are all focused on keel boat sailing.  No more clubs, no more Olympic medals.... yada, yada

For those of us who are passionate about Adult Athletic Competitive Sailing - time to take a page out of the Australian/European playbooks and get our own act together.

For  god sake you STILL don't get what I'm saying.

FOR ADULT ATHLETIC COMPETITIVE SAILING TO BE A THING IN THE US AGAIN IT NEEDS TO HAPPEN FROM THE YOUTH STANDPOINT FIRST.  YOU WILL NOT GET JOHN DOE DOING MAIN ON A J111 TO JUST COME OUT AND START SAILING AN A-CAT. THE ONLY WAY TO CHANGE THE TREND IS TO GET THE YOUNGER CROWD INTERESTED. THAT INVOLVES GETTING KIDS INTERESTED. AND KEEPING THEM INTERESTED. 

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On 2/5/2018 at 2:10 PM, celphtaught said:

For  god sake you STILL don't get what I'm saying.

FOR ADULT ATHLETIC COMPETITIVE SAILING TO BE A THING IN THE US AGAIN IT NEEDS TO HAPPEN FROM THE YOUTH STANDPOINT FIRST.  YOU WILL NOT GET JOHN DOE DOING MAIN ON A J111 TO JUST COME OUT AND START SAILING AN A-CAT. THE ONLY WAY TO CHANGE THE TREND IS TO GET THE YOUNGER CROWD INTERESTED. THAT INVOLVES GETTING KIDS INTERESTED. AND KEEPING THEM INTERESTED. 

This may be true.

HOWEVER,

The UFO says otherwise.

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This is from an old O'Day brochure ("What's  a Fleet?")

Quote

Many's the man who's come to learn of the life that overtakes you when you're part of a group — everyone in an identical boat. It's something you never get over.

You don't forget a dash through the morning sparkle — off in a bunch bound for a picnic and a swim in a corner of the lake or in a bay where you've never been before.

You don't forget the races, either. How your hands grip so tight your knuckles whiten as the sails pop and the booms swing to port and you're in the thick of it charging for the line — seconds to go to the gun.

And there's the great talk, too. Standing around a dock crowded with hulls of many colors — each man propounding on the adjustment of a stay or the leads of his spinnaker.

It's the world's greatest life, some say. For you. And for your kids. Kids who learn to sail in a fleet learn to sail right. They learn how to compete, how to comply and how to discover, grow with, and master the skill, sport and thrill of the great time-honored experience — called sailing.

A fleet can be exactly what you want it to be. We'd dearly like to tell you that your choice of boat is vital to your fun. But it isn't. As long as everyone is sailing in the same design you're in for all the excitement and drama of the 12 meter cup defenders, and all the gab and chatter of dockside at the Yacht Club in Honolulu.

What boat your fleet decides to buy depends on how much you want to spend, where you want to sail, how you want to sail, whether or not you want to race, how many children will be sailing now and in the next couple of years, prevailing wind and tide conditions, and a consensus of aesthetic opinion.

 

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Svanen,

                  I notice you're from Whitby... are you familiar with a yacht called Qantro, by any chance? Half-tonner that changed hands recently... not sure if she's still there.

Would like to keep track of her, as she's one of the few surviving sisters of my own boat...

Cheers,

              W.

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On 2/4/2018 at 9:57 AM, MR.CLEAN said:

I did some interviews at this week's US Sailing Leadership forum about this subject and got some interesting discussions out of it.  All on SA Facebook under 'video'

 

Ignoring Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat and Twitter is one of the simple pleasures of my life.

You have a fucking website. You want clicks.  Use it.

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On 2/6/2018 at 6:39 PM, fastyacht said:
On 2/5/2018 at 2:10 PM, celphtaught said:

For  god sake you STILL don't get what I'm saying.

FOR ADULT ATHLETIC COMPETITIVE SAILING TO BE A THING IN THE US AGAIN IT NEEDS TO HAPPEN FROM THE YOUTH STANDPOINT FIRST.  YOU WILL NOT GET JOHN DOE DOING MAIN ON A J111 TO JUST COME OUT AND START SAILING AN A-CAT. THE ONLY WAY TO CHANGE THE TREND IS TO GET THE YOUNGER CROWD INTERESTED. THAT INVOLVES GETTING KIDS INTERESTED. AND KEEPING THEM INTERESTED. 

This may be true.

HOWEVER,

The UFO says otherwise.

We've had tremendous fleets of Optis charging around for about 25 years now. Where do all these youth sailors go?

FB- Doug

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5 hours ago, Svanen said:

Orange hull, sail number 5260?

That's her, Eliminator 32 half tonner, Julian Everitt design, built in Scotland. Was at Whitby for years but I heard she was to be heading for Portugal.

Cheers,

                W.

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