sailhmb

What's the most popular 2 person raced dinghy in US?

Recommended Posts

If a club wanted to start a club fleet of 2 person dinghies, which has lots of used boats available and no trapeze.  What would you choose? Thank you for your thoughts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Every region is different. You are in central California. Different answer than say, Maryland.

A number of classes have large numbers of used boats in California, that are not on the East.  There was a Catalina for instance, and the Flying Tern, and the Lido 14--a whole bunch of boats.  The Tasar is sailed at The San Francisco Yacht Club. Etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Snipes are usually popular if it's adults, high booms, no spins.  

If it's kids, 420s. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cali?

 

Kids is 420s for sure.

step up into 29er

adults? Don’t know if anything has real traction as far as “most popular”  

maybe look at regatta entries for ABYC turkey day & midwinters, Richmond YC midwinters and the Huntington regatta. Throw in the delta dinghy ditch as well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like Snipe, Mercury and FJ all had 7-10 boats on the line last week.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Popularity of a given boat and availability is very geo-centric.  You failed to mention economics in your original post.  If money is no issue you are free to purchase whatever you want and have at it.  If on a budget of sorts I would start by monitoring e-pay and craigslist and find good used boats near you to start a fleet with.  I am biased to the snipe based on my location( mid atlantic) and the plethora of used snipes available in all ranges of condition and price.  YMMV

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Last time I ran the numbers when requesting this data from YRA's from Michigan to Maine to Florida and over to Texas, it was the C420 for youth and the Snipe for adults/mixed.  I'm not a fan, at all.  But those numbers are from 2012; it is popular and you can get older boats in good condition easily.  Flying Scot was third.

I would recommend ignoring this thread and asking the dinghy one design chair in your regional YRA for what is popular for 2 handed adult.  Or grab C420's with spinnakers, if you decide that it was a bad idea you can easily sell them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Buy and sail whatever is popular and available locally  OR  you will spend your time on the road dragging a trailer.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've spent the last 15 years traveling around racing Buccaneer 18's

Having been to over 100 regattas up and down the east coast in that time I've only seen a snipe fleet at one regatta. 

 

I know the class has a sizeable following. ... but I never cross paths with them.  I've seen countless Flying Scots,  Thistles, Albacores, Jet 14s, Y-flyers, Hampton OD's,  Highlanders, Interlakes, I-20's. ....

So at your club you can sail anything you want and it won't matter. What does matter is where do you want to travel?  Who do you want to travel with?  What can you sell?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

So at your club you can sail anything you want and it won't matter. What does matter is where do you want to travel?  Who do you want to travel with?  What can you sell?

Great advice!

Rogerjolley was indexing One design turnouts at North Americans for several years...  (search for his posts on SA) That gives you another viewpoint on what adult dinghy you might want to look at.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/10/2018 at 11:57 AM, sailhmb said:

If a club wanted to start a club fleet of 2 person dinghies, which has lots of used boats available and no trapeze.  What would you choose? Thank you for your thoughts.

Folks are not reading the requirements.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Foredeck Shuffle said:

Folks are not reading the requirements.

Well, that's kind of true.
What 2 person non-trapeze dinghies have I crossed paths with that are raced in Long Island Sound for instance?
V15, JY15, C420, occasionally oddballs (MG14/NS14) . MC scow. Blue Jay. Some sort of one in the harbor types: international 14 (multiple vintages) Harpoon, snipe, comet, javelin, widgeon, Rhodes bantam. That's pretty much it. Really.
Spread down the coast, you'll find local strongholds of comets (yes actually) windmills and of course Snipes in Eastport MD. There used to be a Jet-14 class at West River MD. god only knows what came of that. Jimmy must be seeing vestiges of that fleet in his buccaneer pergrinations.
Gosh there used to be so many classes. All gone.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The club should ask their YRA what is popular in the area and pull from that list.  Local used boats, local knowledge about boats, local chandlers and lofts likely to carry parts and sails for said boats, local events on said boat, local market to dispense with same boats should they be deemed undesirable.

Otherwise they'll end up with a boat one of us has a prejudice for, likely some class that is on its last legs, or never really was.

Or they should just buy UFO's, VX/One's, VX/Evo's, M14's, RS Aero's, Open Bic's, Melges 17's, and Nacra 17's.  Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade.  That would be my unsolicited, highly biased, advice.  B)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Foredeck Shuffle said:

The club should ask their YRA what is popular in the area and pull from that list.  Local used boats, local knowledge about boats, local chandlers and lofts likely to carry parts and sails for said boats, local events on said boat, local market to dispense with same boats should they be deemed undesirable.

Otherwise they'll end up with a boat one of us has a prejudice for, likely some class that is on its last legs, or never really was.

Or they should just buy UFO's, VX/One's, VX/Evo's, M14's, RS Aero's, Open Bic's, Melges 17's, and Nacra 17's.  Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade.  That would be my unsolicited, highly biased, advice.  B)

That really really depends on the group that's starting up, and their goals/resources. If they are GenX'ers / yuppies then new boats would be great. At some point, which ever newer boat gains some critical mass will take off although it won't be like the glory days of the Laser etc etc. OTOH it seems more likely that you have a group of people without as much disposable income, in which case a boat that has a lot of boats on the shelf to be picked up for lo-$ is good to just build interest in the sport.

Personally I think the VX-1 is an awesome boat, most likely the best thing I've ever sailed. The economics are such that there will never be a local class here, so I am working at putting together some Buccaneers

 

On 2/10/2018 at 11:57 AM, sailhmb said:

If a club wanted to start a club fleet of 2 person dinghies, which has lots of used boats available and no trapeze.  What would you choose? Thank you for your thoughts.

The boat is less important than the people. It needs to be something that is available though, and you can only answer that by doing some homework/legwork in your area. I'd bet a lot that there are fleets of boats sitting unsailed at the clubs in your area. If you find one that has just faltered but still has some people interested -and- numbers of boats on the shelf, you're more than halfway to success with your own group.

FB- Doug

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Foredeck Shuffle said:

The club should ask their YRA what is popular in the area and pull from that list.  Local used boats, local knowledge about boats, local chandlers and lofts likely to carry parts and sails for said boats, local events on said boat, local market to dispense with same boats should they be deemed undesirable.

Otherwise they'll end up with a boat one of us has a prejudice for, likely some class that is on its last legs, or never really was.

Or they should just buy UFO's, VX/One's, VX/Evo's, M14's, RS Aero's, Open Bic's, Melges 17's, and Nacra 17's.  Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade.  That would be my unsolicited, highly biased, advice.  B)

You should add the new Seascape 14 to your list of 2 person dinghies - now completing sea trials. Easily converts from main only to main/jib or main/jib/gen to match crew size and skill.

Seascape 14 Flying.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, svein99 said:

You should add the new Seascape 14 to your list of 2 person dinghies - now completing sea trials. Easily converts from main only to main/jib or main/jib/gen to match crew size and skill.

Seascape 14 Flying.jpg

AFD - Another Fucking Dinghy

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you need to give more input to get an realistic idea. You could go from a Jet 14 to a Flying Scot per your initial post. Go to http://windmillclass.com/

Contact the "elders". They are a pretty helpful bunch and could give you a heads up on boats, (new and used) events, etc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, svein99 said:

You should add the new Seascape 14 to your list of 2 person dinghies - now completing sea trials. Easily converts from main only to main/jib or main/jib/gen to match crew size and skill.

The question was, "If a club wanted to start a club fleet of 2 person dinghies, which has lots of used boats available...."  

In what alternate universe are there lots of used Seascape 14s available?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Later said:

Sailhmb,

It appears you are in Half Moon Bay in California.  To find out about the local to the San Francisco Bay Area active fleets of 2 person dinghies you should attend Richmond Yacht Club's Sail-A-Small-Boat day on March 3rd:

http://richmondyc.org/Calendar/Event/13823~1207116~1

Later

Funny you should mention.  I will have my VX1 there for rides and will talk to the other dinghy sailors.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2018-02-10 at 11:57 AM, sailhmb said:

If a club wanted to start a club fleet of 2 person dinghies, which has lots of used boats available and no trapeze.

 

On 2018-02-11 at 8:44 AM, burnt chef said:

You failed to mention economics in your original post.  If money is no issue you are free to purchase whatever you want and have at it. 

See the original post, quoted above for convenient reference. The economic situation seems clear enough to me.

On 2018-02-12 at 7:21 AM, Foredeck Shuffle said:

[J]ust buy UFO's, VX/One's, VX/Evo's, M14's, RS Aero's, Open Bic's, Melges 17's, and Nacra 17's.  Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade.  That would be my unsolicited, highly biased, advice.  B)

Wow. Just ... wow. :huh:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Economic situation seems clear???

Used snipe in nap town 300.00 to 6k how's that for economics?  I am sure the rest of the geo centric used boats mentioned have a spread that great or better.  since I am bored and this is dingy  anarchy, how bout a picture of your girls tits?

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On February 12, 2018 at 7:21 AM, Foredeck Shuffle said:

Or they should just buy UFO's, VX/One's, VX/Evo's, M14's, RS Aero's, Open Bic's, Melges 17's, and Nacra 17's.  Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade.  That would be my unsolicited, highly biased, advice.  B)

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Eddie_E said:

I suggest the Beneteau 45. Being close to San Francisco, there should be a few for sale used around there.

What??  Might have a little trouble going up and down the launch ramp.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you feel that the Beneteau 45 might be a little too cramped for a couple of people, then I suggest a fleet of 90ft rigid wing trimarans. 

I understand there is one near you in Redwood City, CA. Why not make an offer?

550px-USA-17-flying-cropped.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I were starting a new class, I would start by looking on craigslist to see what has the biggest over-stock in your area. Sometimes bigger boats are cheaper than small boats, but be realistic about launch area. Inland I would never go over 20'. With ocean access you have options. In my part of New England, it's the O'day Daysailor.  Cheap as dirt and they sail well. A quick look at CL in your area shows Catalina 22's are cheaper than old Lasers. We are still out of season, so I would look around in April to see what's out there. How old and athletic are your friends who you plan to drag into this class. Last year at my club we had many different boats out there. The Daysailors beat the 29er every race. Not only in Portsmouth handicap, but also in actual finish order. This is on a lake with a tree covered island in the middle and frequent wind shifts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/13/2018 at 2:25 AM, svein99 said:

You should add the new Seascape 14 to your list of 2 person dinghies - now completing sea trials. Easily converts from main only to main/jib or main/jib/gen to match crew size and skill.

Seascape 14 Flying.jpg

Damn. I was 30 years too early. I designed a boat with those same features. And a wishbone boom, too!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All about the Lido 14. Basically an adults CFJ/420. One design with nice tight racing, and lots of used boats!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, Ross said:

All about the Lido 14. Basically an adults CFJ/420. One design with nice tight racing, and lots of used boats!

Any idea how many are raced in SF bay area?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

59 minutes ago, Ross said:

All about the Lido 14. Basically an adults CFJ/420. One design with nice tight racing, and lots of used boats!

 

20 minutes ago, sailhmb said:

Any idea how many are raced in SF bay area?

 

boats002.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, sailhmb said:

Any idea how many are raced in SF bay area?

See Lido 14 fleet historical list below, only 11 fleets are active out of 81 (no surprise - state of sailing in the US).

Not much in SF Bay Area, active fleets appear to be in protected waters. Half Moon Bay, sure would hate to flip a Lido in the open ocean.

http://www.lido14.org/Fleets/FleetListing.htm

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, sazx said:

See Lido 14 fleet historical list below, only 11 fleets are active out of 81 (no surprise - state of sailing in the US).

Not much in SF Bay Area, active fleets appear to be in protected waters. Half Moon Bay, sure would hate to flip a Lido in the open ocean

 

 

But there is one Lido 14 in Japan.  There is even a blog about it!

http://sweet-bluesette.blogspot.com

bluesette151004.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, sazx said:

See Lido 14 fleet historical list below, only 11 fleets are active out of 81 (no surprise - state of sailing in the US).

Not much in SF Bay Area, active fleets appear to be in protected waters. Half Moon Bay, sure would hate to flip a Lido in the open ocean.

http://www.lido14.org/Fleets/FleetListing.htm

 

 

The YC boats are sailed in the harbor where there is more wind and no waves.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, sailhmb said:

The YC boats are sailed in the harbor where there is more wind and no waves.

Aha, I see, HMB harbor is about a mile across. 

Back to Lidos, there are two flavors, the original and the 6000 series. 
Original has 3 separate buoyancy tanks (bow and side compartments)
6000 series is all one space. The problem is it can fully flood when (not if) cracks deep inside the centerboard trunk go undetected.

In any case, if you buy a fleet of used Lidos, then you are in the Lido repair business.
Parts for the original series are scavenged,  some parts for 6000 series differ.

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, sazx said:

See Lido 14 fleet historical list below, only 11 fleets are active out of 81 (no surprise - state of sailing in the US).

Not much in SF Bay Area, active fleets appear to be in protected waters. Half Moon Bay, sure would hate to flip a Lido in the open ocean.

http://www.lido14.org/Fleets/FleetListing.htm

 

 

 

I beg to differ that Fleet 40- Clear Lake, Tx is active. Been here for 2 years and the only Shock boats I've seen are a Santana 20 and 525!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/12/2018 at 6:08 AM, Steam Flyer said:
On 2/12/2018 at 6:08 AM, Steam Flyer said:

Or make it simple and only buy boats that have been designed in this decade. 

That really really depends on the group that's starting up, and their goals/resources. If they are GenX'ers / yuppies then new boats would be great. At some point, which ever newer boat gains some critical mass will take off although it won't be like the glory days of the Laser etc etc. OTOH it seems more likely that you have a group of people without as much disposable income, in which case a boat that has a lot of boats on the shelf to be picked up for lo-$ is good to just build interest in the sport.

Personally I think the VX-1 is an awesome boat, most likely the best thing I've ever sailed. The economics are such that there will never be a local class here, so I am working at putting together some Buccaneers

 

The boat is less important than the people. It needs to be something that is available though, and you can only answer that by doing some homework/legwork in your area. I'd bet a lot that there are fleets of boats sitting unsailed at the clubs in your area. If you find one that has just faltered but still has some people interested -and- numbers of boats on the shelf, you're more than halfway to success with your own group.

FB- Doug

Designed in this decade is good.... fleets at Cal Sailing in Berkeley and UCSB

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Ross said:

 

I beg to differ that Fleet 40- Clear Lake, Tx is active. Been here for 2 years and the only Shock boats I've seen are a Santana 20 and 525!

There was one guy, Dick Hoover, who was the center of that fleet for decades.  I heard he died about a year ago.  He helped teach generations of people how to sail.  My father sailed with him in the 70s.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My Holder

On 2/15/2018 at 2:26 PM, sailhmb said:

Any idea how many are raced in SF bay area?

If your goal is a 14' Lido, you could group a few other boats with the same specs. The Holder 14/ Hobie One and the Capri 14.2 are the same boat for all practical purposes.

  You don't want to get stuck racing PY handicap against longer boats in light air, as the short waterline has the profile of a giant bowling ball. In less than 13 kts they settle down in the water and slow to a crawl. Once planing in 17~21 kts they are good fun and faster than a DS.

  I raced a Holder 14 last year against the DS1/DS2 fleet and by mid-summer my wife refused to crew for me because she always got tangled in the jib sheets and bruised by the dagger board. I finished the season racing it single handed. She has no problem crewing for me in a DS2 though, because of the extra room in the cockpit area. My suggestion if going 14' is to choose a boat with a rolling furler on the jib and a swing up CB. Capri 14.2 being this way, the late Holder 14/Hobie One had this and the older Holder(1984~1988) had a vertical dagger board and clip on jib. Not sure on the Lido , other than the other two are 1 kt faster on average.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now