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1 hour ago, RedFlag said:

A cheap copy of a Beneteau First Class 7.5 ?

Anyway, it cant be worst than the original ...

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I agree, poor ripoff of the Melges 20. You can tell by the fact that a 20 foot sailboat inexplicably has an outboard on it. I guess this boat is also meant for pros who cant' sail on and off the dock. 

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6 minutes ago, sshow bob said:

Two winch handle pockets for a boat with no winches?

Sharp!

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Ha

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19 minutes ago, sshow bob said:

Two winch handle pockets for a boat with no winches?

tallboy holders.

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Just now, Dibley said:

Ha

I thought it was a Dibley.

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2 hours ago, sshow bob said:

Two winch handle pockets for a boat with no winches?

Shhh!

Those are for the beers.

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Not quite a 100% Dibley from what I can see. A few embellishments here and there, but nothing a big tidy up can’t fix. Mainly Fin/Bulb/Rudder re-fairing, put the Carbon rig on that was originally designed, and she’d be away at the right price. New owners have some great plans to get people back into sailing and that alone is a great thing!

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The Torqueedo knock off electric motor looks interesting on the boat in back. Direct drive- they claim 2x running time vs Torqueedo. But $2600?

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Is it is or is it aint a Dibley?

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15 hours ago, jackolantern said:

I agree, poor ripoff of the Melges 20. You can tell by the fact that a 20 foot sailboat inexplicably has an outboard on it. I guess this boat is also meant for pros who cant' sail on and off the dock. 

Actually, pro's have protectors towing them out to race courses. That motor is for the weekend dude.

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11 hours ago, gjbike said:

The Torqueedo knock off electric motor looks interesting on the boat in back. Direct drive- they claim 2x running time vs Torqueedo. But $2600?

I think it's interesting that one has the Torq and the other has the knockoff.

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13 hours ago, Dibley said:

Not quite a 100% Dibley from what I can see. A few embellishments here and there, but nothing a big tidy up can’t fix. Mainly Fin/Bulb/Rudder re-fairing, put the Carbon rig on that was originally designed, and she’d be away at the right price. New owners have some great plans to get people back into sailing and that alone is a great thing!

Please tell me this is at least a licensed "variant," and not design theft.

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Sharp eyes on the motors -- the Torqueedo 1003 and the ePropulsion Spirit 1.0 were purchased at the same price. Comparing them to decide future preference. These were rigged to get the boats from the launch yard to their new home on Lake Union in Seattle. 

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39 minutes ago, hobomack said:

Sharp eyes on the motors -- the Torqueedo 1003 and the ePropulsion Spirit 1.0 were purchased at the same price. Comparing them to decide future preference. These were rigged to get the boats from the launch yard to their new home on Lake Union in Seattle. 

Keep us posted! I've got a 1003 and it's fine, but if i can get increased range from the spirit then I might switch. I was thinking of getting a spare battery for the 1003 but they're hella spendy so if the epropulsion tech is better then I might change horses.

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1 hour ago, Peanut Butter said:

Synonym for ‘junk’ 

They used to say that about Japanese cars and electronics a few decades ago! Don't underestimate the Chinese.

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14 minutes ago, svein99 said:

They used to say that about Japanese cars and electronics a few decades ago! Don't underestimate the Chinese.

I’ve lived over there. 

The difference is in the mindset and the inputs. Japanese have always had a craftsmans’ pride and integrity based on flawless execution. It’s deep in their bones. 

The Chinese not so much. For them it’s about lowest cost, high volume, low value on human life, brute force method and fake-it-till-you-make it. 

It’s like the difference between Russians and Germans. Just a few miles apart geographically - light years apart in core values and how that impacts delivery.

That said, any country pumping out a million-plus new engineers, designers, etc every year is bound to eventually change their approach and expectations...

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4 minutes ago, Peanut Butter said:

I’ve lived over there. 

The difference is in the mindset and the inputs. Japanese have always had a craftsmans’ pride and integrity based on flawless execution. It’s deep in their bones. 

The Chinese not so much. For them it’s about lowest cost, high volume, low value on human life, brute force and fake-it-till-you-make it. 

That said, any country pumping out a million-plus new engineers, designers, etc every year is bound to eventually change their approach and expectations...

Well said!

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Aren't the iphones Chinese made?  Seems like under the right circumstances very high production standards can be had there.  Even if you concede some degree of quality, there are many products made well enough to be more than up to the task often selling for a fraction of what American or European products go for. Even American icons like  Yamaha and Fender  guitars have Chinese produced guitars with their brand name on them and are very good quality for less than half of what their US made guitars sell for. No doubt many cheap and poorly made products are made in China, as they are here, but the days when " Chinese made" automatically meant poor quality are fast becoming a thing of the past

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On 2/21/2018 at 4:54 AM, ryley said:

 

 

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On 2/21/2018 at 7:19 PM, gjbike said:

Aren't the iphones Chinese made?  Seems like under the right circumstances very high production standards can be had there.  Even if you concede some degree of quality, there are many products made well enough to be more than up to the task often selling for a fraction of what American or European products go for. Even American icons like  Yamaha and Fender  guitars have Chinese produced guitars with their brand name on them and are very good quality for less than half of what their US made guitars sell for. No doubt many cheap and poorly made products are made in China, as they are here, but the days when " Chinese made" automatically meant poor quality are fast becoming a thing of the past

I'm more concerned about the Chinese playing fast and loose with patent and copyright law, not to mention skirting international law with government owned subsidiaries. A chinese API supplier ended up killing 88 kids in Haiti because their 'medical grade glycerin' was actually diethylene glycol. By the time the FDA had tracked them down, the government had quietly folded the company with no trace. They are notorious for 'liberating' intellectual property through their mandatory data center black boxes - a pharma I know nixed plans for a lab in china because they were attacked on a daily basis. 

I'm sure the manufacturing standards over there run the gamut like they do here, but look at the Red Dragon D5.8 Thistle ripoff or the X80 J80 ripoff. It's one thing to follow a trend, it's another to lift a design wholesale.

p.s. you can buy a nice chinese iphone X knockoff for around $150 ;)

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18 hours ago, ryley said:

I'm more concerned about the Chinese playing fast and loose with patent and copyright law, not to mention skirting international law with government owned subsidiaries. A chinese API supplier ended up killing 88 kids in Haiti because their 'medical grade glycerin' was actually diethylene glycol. By the time the FDA had tracked them down, the government had quietly folded the company with no trace. They are notorious for 'liberating' intellectual property through their mandatory data center black boxes - a pharma I know nixed plans for a lab in china because they were attacked on a daily basis. 

I'm sure the manufacturing standards over there run the gamut like they do here, but look at the Red Dragon D5.8 Thistle ripoff or the X80 J80 ripoff. It's one thing to follow a trend, it's another to lift a design wholesale.

p.s. you can buy a nice chinese iphone X knockoff for around $150 ;)

There are just too many cases of this kind of thing. It’s insane.

Just an amusing anecdote: when I lived over there, fresh water was vended from dubious looking gasoline style pumps on the street. It Was a national corp that managed them.

They later found out that the company had been repurposing used gasoline pumps, full of heavy metals. People were arrested.

It’s no wonder my hair was falling out...

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