AdmiralBangBang

Cheap, Fast Dinghy

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I am looking for a cheap, but REALLY fast dinghy. I am on a tight-strung budget, so the boat probably would have to be less than 1.5k, and I am looking for a second-hand boat. The boat needs to be able to carry two people, and it needs to be solid and with no leaks. I am fine with doing some repairs or TLC on the boat, but nothing like a major overhaul. Thanks in advance!

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39 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

I am looking for a cheap, but REALLY fast dinghy. I am on a tight-strung budget, so the boat probably would have to be less than 1.5k, and I am looking for a second-hand boat. The boat needs to be able to carry two people, and it needs to be solid and with no leaks. I am fine with doing some repairs or TLC on the boat, but nothing like a major overhaul. Thanks in advance!

Look out for a Laser-2 with good foils. Not a "fun"; they aren't. 

Cheers, 

              W.

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You are driving us ( and maybe yourself ) crazy! Is it a beach cat or a REALLY fast dinghy that you want? They are REALLY different. Make up your mind, then ask the FORUM for help.

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3 hours ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

I am looking for a cheap, but REALLY fast dinghy. I am on a tight-strung budget, so the boat probably would have to be less than 1.5k, and I am looking for a second-hand boat. The boat needs to be able to carry two people, and it needs to be solid and with no leaks. I am fine with doing some repairs or TLC on the boat, but nothing like a major overhaul. Thanks in advance!

$1500 ain't much of a final budget, it's hard to find decent stuff on Craigslist for that; and then you usually have to spend a bit to get the thing going properly (new line, some new hardware; not talking major rebuild). And of course SAILS are the engine and usually the sails on old cheap boats are shot to hell (to put it politiely).

Probably the fastest thing you're going to find would be a Highlander but they are not exciting. A Laser 2 is a good suggestion if you can find one, or a Windmill, or perhaps a 470 (a bit complex). A Buccaneer is fun but not really all that fast.

FB- Doug

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Okay, I've officially made up my mind. Unless I find a really good deal on a beach catamaran, I want a REALLY fast monohull dinghy. Also, Doug, I'm fine with replacing the sails on a boat. I need to spread the cost of a boat out, so I might buy a cheap boat with a good hull but trash sails, then buy new sails once I've saved up enough. 

Thanks guys! (And I'm sorry if I'm annoying you guys)

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18 minutes ago, msvphoto said:

Old 505.

He said cheap. I don't think a 5-0 is simple enough to be cheap and the fittings to make it work properly will nickle and dime you out of a low budget pdq.

 Tell me I'm wrong and I'll believe you but until you do, it wouldn't put it on my shortlist if I was short of cash...

 Fast, though, and a much better sea boat than the Laser-2,  if that matters. 

Cheers,

             W.

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21 minutes ago, WGWarburton said:
47 minutes ago, msvphoto said:

Old 505.

He said cheap. I don't think a 5-0 is simple enough to be cheap and the fittings to make it work properly will nickle and dime you out of a low budget pdq.

 Tell me I'm wrong and I'll believe you but until you do, it wouldn't put it on my shortlist if I was short of cash...

 Fast, though, and a much better sea boat than the Laser-2,  if that matters. 

Worth keeping an eye out for...... I'd definitely go 5-oh! if there was one close enough (remember, you can find all kinds of stuff on Craigslist as long as you're willing to drive across the continent) and cheap enough and not a 2tull wrekk. Refitting likely to be expensive, also, they are highly stressed rigs and likely to need some remedial fiberglassing.

Also, you can pick up good-condition 5O5 sails from class racers. I had 2 5O5s donated to a youth sailing program.... perfect cure for kids that are bored with FJs!!.... and had five sets of sails at one time.

FB- Doug

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You can find old One Design 14s for that price. 

But they are really slow upside down.

Sounds like you'd be upside down a lot.

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There are so many other factors you don't mention. For instance is your sailing experience and that of your crew. Then there is your size. The fact you don't know the speed of major fast dinghies is worrying, because if you are good enough to sail them, you probably would know about them. You don't want to be sailing a 505 if you and your crew are both 65kgs and you wouldn't want to sail a Laser 2 if you both weigh 100kgs. You also don't mention whether you want a no trapeze, single or even twin trapeze. All are factors

A cheap I14 is probably the fastest 2 man dinghy you will find for the money, but it is also the hardest to sail, needing skill, a bit of weight and the ability to twin trapeze. In the wrong hands there would be issues. At best, you would potentially be slower round the course than an easier to sail boat and will spend a lot of time upside down while at worse, it would be dangerous.

 

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Lido’s aplenty around here.  Not that fast but plenty of racing with “fast” folks.  

Good one on a decent trailer @ $1000.

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Okay, to help you guys, I'm going to provide a bit of sailing background and physical information. I am eleven, going on twelve, and I weigh 78.4 pounds, (35 kilograms). My sailing experience started in Opti bathtubs, then went to Club 420s. That is what I am sailing right now. I am inexperienced in trapezing, but have done it a couple times. I frequently sail during the summer and infrequently other times. I am looking for a fast, fun boat that I can sail on weekends and during the summer that will not rip my budget to pieces, so it should be less than 2, hopefully 1.5K. I am fine with doing repairs and TLC, but no complete overhauls like replacing all the fittings or something. Thanks.

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Alright, I have read through the threads including your request for help with buying a new boat. I am 17 and live in Minnesota and have been sailing for most of my life. I consider myself a skilled crew in dinghies, cats, keel boats and even bigger offshore boats. I sail c420 and have been racing them for a number of years as well as racing f18 infusions (cats) at a highly competitive level. I see your ambition and drive to purchase a boat but I’d suggest you step back and look over your situation. You live in New York which has plenty of resources when it comes to producing high quality sailors. What concerns me is your lack of experience when talking about using trapeze and wanting an i14. I only have good things to say about the 420 (minus how boring it gets once you’re fast in it) and how it builds good sailors. I’d say your best bet is to continue on in opti and move into 420 once you are better. Boats like the i14 are insanely hard to sail in the beginning and will only hurt you. I speak from experience after having sailed the.

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Where will you keep the boat? Rigged next to water or on disassembled on trailer far from water? Do you have willing help for trailer launching a heavier boat on a trailer? Will the boat be at a club that has a hoist?How shallow is your sailing area? A daggerboard boat can be a nuisance if there is lots of thin water and sandbars (Great South Bay?) How windy is it in your area?

The Hobie 14 idea from the other thread would be the boat I would choose for a pair of 75 pounders with a need for speed, but only if it could stay rigged next to the water.

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Admiral. You’ve got a couple interesting choices. Forget the 14 till you weigh 150-175 pounds, as does your crew.

old laser. 2 little guys can sail it fast.

29er if you have a 150 pound crew. Hard to find that cheap.

But see if you can find an old 470 or laser II

 

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You guys haven't figured out this is a troll? On the 'should I build a cat or buy one' thread he started I suggest a Prindle 15 and then he tells us he is 11 years old and weighs 75 lbs. Someone on that thread offers him a dirt cheap Moth and then he asks if he can buy just the hull now and the rig and sails later! Now this thread...

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2 minutes ago, Rasputin22 said:

You guys haven't figured out this is a troll? On the 'should I build a cat or buy one' thread he started I suggest a Prindle 15 and then he tells us he is 11 years old and weighs 75 lbs. Someone on that thread offers him a dirt cheap Moth and then he asks if he can buy just the hull now and the rig and sails later! Now this thread...

Idk I just see an overly ambitious “11 but nearly 12” year old kid. 

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Rasputin, I'm really sorry if I seem like a troll to you. I assure you that I really want to buy a dinghy. I really didn't have 7K to spend on a Moth, and I was just asking. Sorry.

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I see from your profile that you are a fan of fiction. Your behavior here is indicative of that. Go find a Prindle 15 like I suggested earlier and put a 6HP OB on it until you grow into your weight in a couple of years. Oh, you want a sailing dinghy? You can get a Laser for cheap. 

Image result for smelly socks

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This is the end of your pathetic "End Game" Bang Bang. You really snuck one in here, wait til the local bad boys sniff your virgin ass out. READ CAREFULLY you little shit.

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There are lots of boats that might suit, from Flying 11 (you might grow out of that pretty quickly though) to 29er and 13' skiff. Even a 125 or i420 might be a lot of fun with the spinnaker and single trapeze. It really depends on what you can find and who you have to help you learn to sail it.

So firstly, just go looking for smaller double handed skiffs in your price range. Keep an open mind about what you want and that the resale value won't be much.

Almost by definition, fast boats are difficult to sail. Don't let that put you off, it just means it's much better if you can find someone to help you learn to sail it that isn't your dad or a teacher (but they'll do as a last resort). Speed is relative anyway, I had great fun in a Vagabond one day (bathtub with sail) in 25+kn. Getting it to plane (and listening to the boat complain bitterly about it!) was great. 

Just get out there and have fun in whatever you end up sailing. ;-)

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My dream boat right now is either a VX Evo or a 29er. The problem is that there are no cheap secondhand VX Evo's and 29er's are a tad expensive.

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35 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Rasputin, that was not necessary

Yes you are right Bang Bang but your posts are growing weary. Does your Mom let you stay up this late? Wait til the really assholes here get wind of your posing. I'll leave you to them.

Sorry if I offended young soul.

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2 hours ago, Rasputin22 said:

You guys haven't figured out this is a troll? On the 'should I build a cat or buy one' thread he started I suggest a Prindle 15 and then he tells us he is 11 years old and weighs 75 lbs. Someone on that thread offers him a dirt cheap Moth and then he asks if he can buy just the hull now and the rig and sails later! Now this thread...

He sound like that really old guy from Texas with a drawer full of socks.

Pathetic 

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You seem a bit light for anything fast...

The best thing I can say is to get good in slow boats- I mean good. Then you don’t have to worry about having crap tactics when you go faster.

When I was 11, I had a laser with a full rig that I couldn’t hold down in four knots. I would take the boat out when it was windy and do long reaching legs as fast as I could. Really fun at the time, but the wrong rig gave me muscle memory of bad hiking technique. 

The best thing is to be patient...

It'll come 

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Keep sailing the Opti, race it hard, and in the meantime jump into anyone else's faster boat you can!!!  Every 420 ride that comes up, grab it. If someone has a laser going out, ask for a go .... at 35kg the bigger faster boats will be a bit of a leap. Oh, and the best fast thing for your budget, if it really is burning a hole in your pocket and you must spend it ... a sailboard. Probably a Bic Techno 293 with a couple of sails ... easy to store too, and it will teach you heaps about sailing, apparent wind sailing and the sheer joy of blasting around!! Good luck!!

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1 hour ago, Connor.kainalu said:

You seem a bit light for anything fast...

The best thing I can say is to get good in slow boats- I mean good. Then you don’t have to worry about having crap tactics when you go faster.

When I was 11, I had a laser with a full rig that I couldn’t hold down in four knots. I would take the boat out when it was windy and do long reaching legs as fast as I could. Really fun at the time, but the wrong rig gave me muscle memory of bad hiking technique. 

The best thing is to be patient...

It'll come 

Hi again,

                   What you need is an RS Feva race programme. The Feva works for people your size and is much faster than an Oppy. It's a good stepping stone to a 29er when you have the weight to keep one down. 

 The Feva hull would benefit from being lighter - you need a fair bit of wind to make it go properly - but it's tough and forgiving. In lighter winds you can work on the subtle skills you would develop in an Oppy or c420 but when the wind picks up you can have a blast.

 Is there anything like this in your area? Here in the UK there's a national race circuit,  regional and national training squads etc. I'm almost certain the same sort of thing exists in NZ, as I know a top coach who took a job there.. I'd be surprised if Aus didn't have a similar setup but the USA doesn't seem to do youth dinghies quite so much... Having said that,  they show up to international regattas,  so somebody's sailing them!  I see three US boats at last year's Feva Worlds- from Portchester, Hugenot and Pequot... and this year's Worlds are at Clearwater, Florida next month....

Cheers,

              W.

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12 hours ago, Midwestmike said:

Idk I just see an overly ambitious “11 but nearly 12” year old kid. 

as someone who has grown up on the internet, more or less, an overly ambitious 11-12 year old is a perfect candidate for an internet troll. but to answer the question he asked, have you heard about the mothquito?

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You know I thought about it a lot. I changed my mind. I’d look into a Tf10 superfoiler, quick multihull and perfect for your weight. My friend is selling his for $1,000. 

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I'm sorry, but the TF10 is HUGE!! How would I cartop or trailer that? Launching would be hard enough.

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14 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

I'm sorry, but the TF10 is HUGE!! How would I cartop or trailer that? Launching would be hard enough.

I didn’t mean to say tf10

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12 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

What did you mean to say?

He meant to say 11 year olds don’t talk about cartopping or ramp launching.

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18 foot skiff, my buddy In Connecticut is selling his for $1,000. Fits perfect on any car and easy to launch

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31 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Mike, can you show me a picture? And where can I find it?

thurlow-fisher-airborne.jpg

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Just now, AdmiralBangBang said:

Wait a sec, how am is my weight perfect for that boat?

you sit on the bow sprit to hold the bow down

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I just thought of this. Wouldn't a Tasar or Laser 2 be perfect? There are cheap used ones, they are pretty fast, and they aren't that hard to sail.

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7 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

I just thought of this. Wouldn't a Tasar or Laser 2 be perfect? There are cheap used ones, they are pretty fast, and they aren't that hard to sail.

People have been saying laser 2 the whole time you troll. I’m serious though about sailing 420 and opti

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44 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

What about the Laser Pico? Or the RS Quba?

I think you really need the Unobtainium 5000

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Wasn't there a young English child, "little bit", who designed and built his own dinghy? A few years ago. His father helped but, I think he did most of the work. Maybe get your mom onboard. She could always crew for you? Maybe, where you plan to sail?

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9 minutes ago, hobie17li said:

Wasn't there a young English child, "little bit", who designed and built his own dinghy? A few years ago. His father helped but, I think he did most of the work. Maybe get your mom onboard. She could always crew for you? Maybe, where you plan to sail?

One of his many socks already claimed he could build the Laser cheeper and better.

He could get with Doug and make it a foiler!!!!!!!

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I think I saw an ac50 on the market for a good price

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My only real question is where is an 11 year old gonna come up with $1500

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19 hours ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Also, does anyone know where I can get used boats in my area? I live on Long Island.

Check the CT Craigslist in the Spring, like sometime in May.  On a super cheap budget there should be a few options for a young sailor. Force 5's  show up in your area for $800 all the time. Laser 2's around $1K that will both take a friend.  If you plan to sail alone a lot with a few club races, I still think the  plain old Sunfish with an Intensity race sail is the most fun per dollar that has ever been invented. You should be able to do the Sunfish with a brand new sail for $600 or less. 

If the cat is still in your mind, there will be dirt cheap Hobie 16's around in the Spring too. A Hobie Wave is a more durable boat over time. They also cost double on the used market.

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1 hour ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

What about the Laser Pico? Or the RS Quba?

Now I know you're trolling.

You got me but now I'm out.

Cheers, 

                W.

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Thank you Eddie and Tillerman with providing some real, helpful answers instead of just calling me an annoying troll and hating. 

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15 minutes ago, Midwestmike said:

My only real question is where is an 11 78 year old gonna come up with $1500

FIFY

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7 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Thank you Eddie and Tillerman with providing some real, helpful answers instead of just calling me an annoying troll and hating. 


That's OK. I am hoping to be 11 some day soon myself.

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Good news, guys! I finally, FINALLY decided on a boat. A Waszp! With the smallist rig, my weight is enough to sail it, it's fast, can "sort of" carry a second person, and it FOILS! I just wanted to ask where I can find a good, cheap Waszp.
 

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29 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Good news, guys! I finally, FINALLY decided on a boat. A Waszp! With the smallist rig, my weight is enough to sail it, it's fast, can "sort of" carry a second person, and it FOILS! I just wanted to ask where I can find a good, cheap Waszp.
 

I think that the best place to find a Waszp in good condition for under $1500 is probably 2058.

Do you have a time machine?

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Tillerman, I think I'm just going to try and raise enough money to get the cheapest one I can. How much would a really cheap one be?

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I too want a fast boat that can: be had for less than $1k, be rigged in 5minutes, planes in 7kts, stands upright at the dock, doesn't have training wheels, can be singlehanded or double handed, traps, cheap replacement parts, and feeds me cake and/or beer while i'm trapping. 

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33 minutes ago, AdmiralBangBang said:

Tillerman, I think I'm just going to try and raise enough money to get the cheapest one I can. How much would a really cheap one be?


The list price for a new Waszp on the Colie Sails website is $10,500

There was a second-hand one for sale in Newport RI last summer for $11,000 (including a SpeedPuck.)

Go figure.

 

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39 minutes ago, mustang__1 said:

I too want a fast boat that can: be had for less than $1k, be rigged in 5minutes, planes in 7kts, stands upright at the dock, doesn't have training wheels, can be singlehanded or double handed, traps, cheap replacement parts, and feeds me cake and/or beer while i'm trapping. 

You should buy an old Sunfish. Apart from not being fast, no traps, no cake, no beer, and not planing in 7kts (or ever really) it ticks all the boxes.

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25 minutes ago, tillerman said:

You should buy an old Sunfish. Apart from not being fast, no traps, no cake, no beer, and not planing in 7kts (or ever really) it ticks all the boxes.

thank's, a coworker in the warehouse just heard a bang and came running asking what happened. IT was my desk hitting my head - in case you were curious. :rolleyes:

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2 hours ago, mustang__1 said:

I too want a fast boat that can: be had for less than $1k, be rigged in 5minutes, planes in 7kts, stands upright at the dock, doesn't have training wheels, can be singlehanded or double handed, traps, cheap replacement parts, and feeds me cake and/or beer while i'm trapping. 

Fuck yeah! I want one of those too.

If you can figure out a way to put tits on it, I'll buy a dealership

FB- Doug

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18 hours ago, mustang__1 said:

I too want a fast boat that can: be had for less than $1k, be rigged in 5minutes, planes in 7kts, stands upright at the dock, doesn't have training wheels, can be singlehanded or double handed, traps, cheap replacement parts, and feeds me cake and/or beer while i'm trapping. 

That is the dumbest thing I ever read

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Cake and beer, Stupid

Cheetos and beer,  yay

 

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I have seen several great looking (for pleasure sailing) five-ohs in California in the OP's price range in recent times. Many are in rather amazing condition, just sat for a long time. Not fleet competitive anymore, but make excellent sailing pleasure boats and if you get lucky really don't need much.

The Ballenger in MD for $1500 looks like a nice example. http://www.usa505.org/classifieds

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Wasn't there a young English child, "little bit", who designed and built his own dinghy? A few years ago. His father helped but, I think he did most of the work. Maybe get your mom onboard. She could always crew for you? Maybe, where you plan to sail? Our club sometimes gets rid of Sunfish, I have a friend selling a minifish smaller sunfish probably less than $500 maybe good for your size now. I am out in Westport let me know if you're interested

 

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On 3/7/2018 at 12:07 PM, Rasputin22 said:

Get your Mom one of these

Image result for opti mom

 

 

...and if mom looks anything like this, get her to drop by the blue van in the corner,, I have something for her.   :)

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I have a One Design 14 I have been trying to sell. Would love to sell it to you for $1500. I have the Standard and Grand Prix rigs for it. 

DSC_3128.jpg

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On 4/15/2018 at 4:48 PM, Gouvernail said:

I want a gorgeous low maintenance nymphomaniac who has a Jerry Garcia fetish . 

For less than $1500 of course.

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Assuming the Admirals not a troll and returns to this thread one day, what about a small catamaran you could build yourself? 

About 10 years ago there was a fair bit of hype around the F12 class, I don’t think it ever really got going but I’m sure if you asked enough people someone would have the plans. They still look cool and I’m sure you’d get one around the track heaps quicker than you’d be able to sail a 14 at your weight. 

Dudley Dix also has something similar on his website.http://dixdesign.com/oppikat.htm

Youll learn valuable skills that will save you money on your bigger boats as you get older and you’ll have the confidence to tackle bigger projects. I wish I’d done something like that at your age! 

Did I mention Cats are fast? 

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I think the OD 14 options are really the best for you.  Some context, I started sailing them back when they were actually a thing when I was just a little bit older than you... though not by much.  I likely had a lot more experience than you did, and I certainly knew what a 505, I14, Cherub, Flying 15 etc etc etc was before I ever sailed a 14.  That said, these boats are selling for short money!  $900 for a One Design 14 (which measures in as an I14...though woefully slow these days compared to modern designs) is some very good value.  If you think a C420 seems like it's fast, than you will have brown stains in your wetsuit after sailing an OD 14 in some breeze.  These boats go fast, and they have a Asymmetric spinnaker that is easy to handle.  Coach Gents 14, which comes with both Standard and GP rigs is a great deal for $1500.   At 74 lbs, you'll appreciate the standard rig, which is still plenty fast over the full sized GP rig. 

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i was never impressed with the old 14's, but maybe i just never got out in enough wind? They just always seemed like they were glued to the water to me. Like a really hard hump to get over to get them to break free and plane. Even the newer B4(?ithink? been a while) i sailed seemed a bit stuck but it definitely broke free fairly easily. 

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On 3/6/2018 at 7:21 PM, AdmiralBangBang said:

 And are I14's fast?

OMG....if you have to ask.

Oh no.....did I just catch a fishhook in my lip?

The OP is an 11 year old who is concerned about whether his new toy can go on the car top? :wub:

If there really is an 11 year old who wants to accelerate onto fast boats, the best advice came from Midwest Mike. Get all the time that you can in your local club's 420 program, graduate to the Laser radial and look for rides in the 29er.

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Admiral - good on ya for showing such interest! I certainly recall being 12 and salivating over fast boats. My advice to you is to go to the nearest sailing club and post the following on the notice board, or stick it on the fast looking boats:

"LOOKING TO CREW ON A FAST BOAT! I HAVE SOME EXPERIENCE AND AM SUPER-KEEN TO LEARN. PLEASE CALL ME AT XXX-XXX-XXXX."

Make sure you meet the skipper with your mom or dad. Good luck!

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