Meat Wad

Waterline Systems

Recommended Posts

Are they a functioning business?
I know their website is not working properly.
I have ordered items over the phone and Gordon says they are in stock and will be shipped out.
I have called twice in the last month and am assured I am at the top of the list.
No items ever arrive.

Anyone know anything?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

About six weeks ago I left a message with Waterline for parts info / pricing inquiry for j24 Parts  that weren’t  showing on the website.

Got a voicemail from Gordon and never was able to contact him. I did reach Randy Borges and he told me they do still offer the kit I was looking for and to send him an email and he’d get the info and pricing for me. Emailed Randy with no response. Tried the website email link and still nothing. Left a final voicemail politely explaining that I wasn’t having much luck with getting ordering info and asking they contact me but nothing.

It’s a bummer because I’d really like to get their parts but left wondering like you.

It’s confusing because they do answer the phone and seem to be open for business but something is not connecting.

I’m guessing it’s related to recent business changes.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  I finally was able to obtain some needed parts as well as another fallow J-22 owner, by going to their web site. Make a note of the parts you need ei: part numbers, posted cost and quantity. Then send an e-mail to Randy Borges at rhb@waterlinesystems.com, and also calling as a fallow up to the e-mail.

  I am guessing he just doesn't have the stock sorted out after a forced to clear out move from there old location and is still a little overwhelmed. 

   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Waterline used to be the Water Craft Business???

I just wanted the J105 Stanchion bases and posts. Everything I read said these guys had it.

I' gotta call Waterline Systems and tell them to shred my CC info.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

US Watercraft and Waterline Systems are different.  Waterline Systems is supposedly still operating as the parts dealer and to build and support the Alerion Yacht brand.  They moved to North Kingstown, RI last year.  I have had bad luck trying to get someone to return phone calls and emails.  I emailed Randy Borges: rhb@waterlinesystems.com a few months ago about a new J24 mast but crickets.  I sourced it elsewhere in the meantime.  I called about two weeks ago to get some parts and the nice girl that answered said I needed to talk to Randy and that he was on the shop floor.  She forwarded me to his voicemail and after leaving message I haven't heard back.  I have since ordered from another reputable company that stocks some of these parts and calls or emails back.

Good luck hopefully you can find the parts elsewhere or get better service than I did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/9/2018 at 2:39 PM, Imsission said:

US Watercraft and Waterline Systems are different.  Waterline Systems is supposedly still operating as the parts dealer and to build and support the Alerion Yacht brand.  They moved to North Kingstown, RI last year.  I have had bad luck trying to get someone to return phone calls and emails.  I emailed Randy Borges: rhb@waterlinesystems.com a few months ago about a new J24 mast but crickets.  I sourced it elsewhere in the meantime.  I called about two weeks ago to get some parts and the nice girl that answered said I needed to talk to Randy and that he was on the shop floor.  She forwarded me to his voicemail and after leaving message I haven't heard back.  I have since ordered from another reputable company that stocks some of these parts and calls or emails back.

Good luck hopefully you can find the parts elsewhere or get better service than I did.

Found them. http://www.whitewatermarineinc.com

it seems the guys made the parts for the 3rd party.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

US Watercraft and Waterline Systems were/are different, but the presidents of both were/are the same slimy prick. Amazing how a shit always floats back to the surface.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Meat Wad said:

Found them. http://www.whitewatermarineinc.com

it seems the guys made the parts for the 3rd party.

Have you talked to Garhauer Marine?  I’m not a big fan of their blocks, but their stanchion gear is excellent, and he’ll do custom work.  Prices are very good, and he’s in SoCal!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/11/2018 at 11:28 AM, silent bob said:

Have you talked to Garhauer Marine?  I’m not a big fan of their blocks, but their stanchion gear is excellent, and he’ll do custom work.  Prices are very good, and he’s in SoCal!

I saw their link in one of the J class sites under resources.
I like the J 105 bases because it has a bigger footing and a center bolt too. Crew is so big these days I want safety and the base is most of the strength.
I gotta replace the old ones as I have already repaired one and 4 out of 6 do not have smooth eyes because the grommet is gone so I have plastic tubing helping with chafe.
The old designs have such small bases too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Meat Wad said:

I saw their link in one of the J class sites under resources.
I like the J 105 bases because it has a bigger footing and a center bolt too. Crew is so big these days I want safety and the base is most of the strength.
I gotta replace the old ones as I have already repaired one and 4 out of 6 do not have smooth eyes because the grommet is gone so I have plastic tubing helping with chafe.
The old designs have such small bases too.

As I said, he does custom work!  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So trying again to source the j24 vermiculite sump / floor kit through Waterline.

Would really like to get the verm out of the old girl after all these years.

Mostly just want the fiberglass floor stringers from Waterline, Could live without their teak & holly but their stringers are supposed to be sweet.  I’ve seen so many pics of j24s with plywood floor stringers just run into the sump resin. It seems like a lot of pics of rotted plywood. Not what I want. 

Gordon at Waterline told me they’d have to make up the floor stringers and it’d need to be an order for like 3 boats or he’d need to have a few lined up at one time to be worth his time. Kind of a pain. Not feeling the love that’s for sure.

Anyone have an old Waterline vermiculite replacement kit consider selling?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Randy's poor accessibility is a perfect example of why the guy who's the greatest on the shop floor isn't necessarily also the best in the board room or vice-versa.

Please see the Barry Carroll vs. Eric Goetz disparity as well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don’t know what’s going on over there.

It was frustrating having Randy say they offer the kit, directing me to Gordon and then have Gordon send me away.

The fiberglass floors just seem to be the proper method of repair following vermiculite removal. I’m considering going with marine plywood epoxied instead but only because can’t get the kit. 

It appears plywood is okay in lieu of sold glass 

http://j24forum.org/usa/faqs/verm_repair.htm

Question for those who have done these, If Waterline continues to be a no go, would it be reasonable going with G9 or G10 glass epoxy sheet for the floors instead of plywood? 

*Edit that-never mind, I just checked pricing on glass epoxy sheets and seems it gets pricey.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why not make your own glass epoxy sheets?  You don’t need expensive vac bagging equipment.  Google “fiberglass hand lay up”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was thinking yeah why not just layup some floors and tab them in. There’s not much to them.

Just the thought of cutting some to fit out of some sheet or board sounded clean and solid.

Funny thing Waterline sent out an email today advertising Fall savings and to contact them for parts and service needs.

also something about hard to find parts etc...

I snipped back in a reply email that I still need the vermiculite kit and if any chance, ever?

What do you know, I got a response from Henry Pendleton.

Henry now heads up the parts department at Waterline and he says they can indeed provide me with the kit for

$1063.00- and if I had any questions and / or would I like to place an order.

I’ve got an email back to him asking what that price includes.

I’m guessing the glass stringers and teak and holly flooring. Doubt resin etc..

Ive heard others mention that they’ll break it up and sell you what you need.

I don’t know. An old j24 that gets raced only probably doesnt need teak and holly but 

it sure does look nice. 

Ill see what the $1000 bucks includes but I’m really feeling like it might just be worth it to me.

Anyways, thankful that Waterline seems to be getting things sorted now.

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re Waterline: not to highjack the thread but thought it would be useful to chime in with my 2 cents.  I just ordered some small parts for our 109.  While the web site was absolutely awful, and parts were typical boat industry overpriced, and I had several concerns about service given other post here on SA - Waterlined delivered.  Website while clunky worked and parts showed up on time.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah It seems they are trying.

Got a email from Henry at Waterline first thing this morning with the vermiculite kit instruction sheet that includes a list of recommended materials and tools. In addition it lists everything included in the kit.  Waterline supply: 9 sq. ft. Of Pensky foam, 1708biaxial fiberglass cloth, Cabin Sole, floor supports / stringers.

Another email after asking if the  verm is just rear section of or entirely through sump.

i don’t know, maybe they got to a point where they were only filling part of the sump with the vermiculite? Mine is full to the brim and I’m thinking itheres going to be a bunch under the floors.

sorry, anyways I’m really feeling optimistic after communicating with Henry. Super responsive so far. 

His contact is henry@waterlinesystems.com

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎4‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 8:18 AM, butternutz said:

US Watercraft and Waterline Systems were/are different, but the presidents of both were/are the same slimy prick. Amazing how a shit always floats back to the surface.....

And here I thought I was the only one who felt this way!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was at the foreclosure auction last year.  All inventory was sold, so there was no working stock remaining for Waterline Systems to sell.  J/Boats had the J/109 Class remove Waterline Systems as the "Authorized J/Boats Repair and Service Center" from the class website.  Previously Waterline Systems retained most of the J/Boat build files and prints in the old TPI building.  These were restricted from sale in the auction and did not move when Waterline Systems opened to North Kingstown.  Unless some subsequent agreement was reached with J/Boats, I do not believe that Waterline Systems has the J/Boats drawings.  Any parts ordered through Waterline from what used to be inventory would need to be purchased by them from a 3rd party at the time of sale, since they probably wouldn't have invested to build a new inventory of parts to have on hand.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/4/2018 at 10:07 AM, jackolantern said:

Randy's poor accessibility is a perfect example of why the guy who's the greatest on the shop floor isn't necessarily also the best in the board room or vice-versa.

Please see the Barry Carroll vs. Eric Goetz disparity as well. 

Too funny...I have first hand experience of this. Exactly right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/5/2018 at 10:27 AM, Herreshoff said:

I don’t know what’s going on over there.

It was frustrating having Randy say they offer the kit, directing me to Gordon and then have Gordon send me away.

The fiberglass floors just seem to be the proper method of repair following vermiculite removal. I’m considering going with marine plywood epoxied instead but only because can’t get the kit. 

It appears plywood is okay in lieu of sold glass 

http://j24forum.org/usa/faqs/verm_repair.htm

Question for those who have done these, If Waterline continues to be a no go, would it be reasonable going with G9 or G10 glass epoxy sheet for the floors instead of plywood? 

*Edit that-never mind, I just checked pricing on glass epoxy sheets and seems it gets pricey.

 

 

 

Go with the G10 plates.  They're expensive but it's doable at http://mcmaster.com  You do it once with G10 and you'll never have to do it again.

It can't be Gordon Borges that's working there...it must be a different Gordon right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

let me know if you would like to go the G 10 route .  We supply Mc master and many others .   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/30/2018 at 8:08 PM, WCB said:

Go with the G10 plates.  They're expensive but it's doable at http://mcmaster.com  You do it once with G10 and you'll never have to do it again.

It can't be Gordon Borges that's working there...it must be a different Gordon right?

I assumed it was a Gordon Borges. I can’t find the old emails to verify. He was cool on the phone but wasn’t really willing to help. He didn’t seemed concerned with throwing away business. Just a measly sump kit I guess.

When I most recently reached out thinking I was trying Gordon again instead I got the response from Henry and he now heads up the parts department. 

I have ordered the sump kit through Henry a couple weeks ago but still have not seen the charge or heard back. He said it would be a week out or so. Previously, when speaking with Gordon he said he would need a few orders at one time to make it worth his time as they needed to makeup the kit. I wasn’t super happy with that and persisted. I am assuming Henry needs to build the kit as well but is willing to do just one. Perhaps that’s why he’s the new parts dept. lead.

For others, the kit was a bit over $1400.00- for full sump and floors kit. It includes Waterline built solid glass floor stringers. Penske foam, fiberglass cloth. Teak & Holly floor.

Still waiting and will update if and when it arrives.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/3/2018 at 10:31 AM, SPECTRE said:

let me know if you would like to go the G 10 route .  We supply Mc master and many others .   

Thanks SPECTRE, may be in touch if the Waterline kit doesn’t work out. Feeling optimistic that they will come through but will see.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Herreshoff said:

I assumed it was a Gordon Borges. I can’t find the old emails to verify. He was cool on the phone but wasn’t really willing to help. He didn’t seemed concerned with throwing away business. Just a measly sump kit I guess.

When I most recently reached out thinking I was trying Gordon again instead I got the response from Henry and he now heads up the parts department. 

I have ordered the sump kit through Henry a couple weeks ago but still have not seen the charge or heard back. He said it would be a week out or so. Previously, when speaking with Gordon he said he would need a few orders at one time to make it worth his time as they needed to makeup the kit. I wasn’t super happy with that and persisted. I am assuming Henry needs to build the kit as well but is willing to do just one. Perhaps that’s why he’s the new parts dept. lead.

For others, the kit was a bit over $1400.00- for full sump and floors kit. It includes Waterline built solid glass floor stringers. Penske foam, fiberglass cloth. Teak & Holly floor.

Still waiting and will update if and when it arrives.

Gordon Borges left before the year 2000.  It wasn't under the best of circumstances so I can't imagine he's back but I've been wrong once or twice in my life.

Parts are often slow out of there.  They once hired a parts person to manage all of that but I would guess with the recovery from the bankruptcy sale that they'll be slow to rebuild.  Hang in there with them though.  At the end of the day, Randy is an entrepreneur and I'm impressed that when faced with the opportunity to walk away, he came back for more. I hope everybody does their best to support his efforts to support our sailing community.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, WCB said:

Gordon Borges left before the year 2000.  It wasn't under the best of circumstances so I can't imagine he's back but I've been wrong once or twice in my life.

Parts are often slow out of there.  They once hired a parts person to manage all of that but I would guess with the recovery from the bankruptcy sale that they'll be slow to rebuild.  Hang in there with them though.  At the end of the day, Randy is an entrepreneur and I'm impressed that when faced with the opportunity to walk away, he came back for more. I hope everybody does their best to support his efforts to support our sailing community.  

Randy has been helpful and responsive. I am absolutely patiently awaiting the parts.

It seems the boat business can be as difficult as it can be lucrative. I’m not sure any of these guys are getting rich. Actually, doubting it. At the end of the day it’s a living. I’m thankful someone’s trying to provide support To J boat owners.

I agree, hopefully many will be supportive and give them a chance to gain new traction.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/5/2018 at 8:20 PM, Herreshoff said:

 

It seems the boat business can be as difficult as it can be lucrative.

Then it sounds pretty easy!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now