Tornado_ALIVE

Revitalising the East Coast Australian Tornado Fleet

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Revitalising the East Coast Australian Tornado Fleet.

 

Late January, this year I returned back to the Tornado class after about a 13 year absence, buying a Marstrom.  After many enquiries from people wanting to buy Tornados, I started a three month project locating boats for sale, convincing their owners to part with their boats and bringing these boats down to Melbourne.  Two months later, I have managed to sell these boats and get them into the hands of owners who will give the T’s a refresh and actively sail them.

 

I managed to find 2 x Marstrom’s and an Epoxy Reg White in Darwin, nearly 4,000 km away.  Co-ordinating with the owners, they packed the three Tornados onto a trailer whilst dealing with a direct hit form a cyclone :o I then arranged for them to be trucked down south to Melbourne on the back of a flat bed trailer.

 

On arrival, a mate of mine helped me to unpack the trailer and assemble the three boats.

 

This mate bought one of the Marstrom and is already on the water, keenly sailing through a Melbourne winter.  We will be racing against each other at our local club very soon.

 

A gentleman from South Australia travelled over to Melbourne to pick up the Reg White and will keenly race it against a very quick M20 and will hopefully build the SA fleet.

 

I was then contacted by a gentleman in Qld regarding his father looking for a boat, I pulled apart my Marstrom and loaded it onto the trailer, driving up to Sydney to meet the new buyer half way. The new owner is an old Tornado salt from way back and is very excited with his new boat.

 

The last remaining Marstrom,  I will be giving a make over, joining the other T racing out of Port Melbourne.

 

The last few months have been a little stressful owning four Tornados, looking to sell three coming into winter.  Fortunately, I managed to find three keen sailors and nearly broke even, coming away with few spare parts.

 

I will not be buying and selling multiple Tornados ever again, however if anyone is looking to buy or sell in Australia, I would like to assist with getting boats into active sailors hands.  I have already located a very good Windrush and Marstrom for sale.

 

With keen new Tornado sailors in Qld, Vic and SA, I expect interest and fleets to grow further.  Many are talking about the boats at the moment and we are yet to hit the water racing this coming season.

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Don't waste your time.

The "T" is dead.

If it wasn't for the bullshit Olympics selection process it would have died years ago.

Do yourself and sailing a favour and support a local class. 

 

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How about this, I like many of my mates have supported other classes, spent a lot of money racing them trying to stay at the front with the lates gear.  

Right now, with a young family I cannot afford to play like I use to and if I jump back into the F18 class, I would not be happy unless I get a new or very good boat and strive to be at the top.  

Buying a Tornado, I have paid nearly a third of the price for a boat that is 2 foot longer, 2 foot wider, 25kg lighter, better built, larger sail area, a lot more refined to sail and faster.

I only plan to enjoy club racing now with the odd regatta, possibly a Worlds here and there.

 

We have a lot of good T’s sitting in storage around Australia.  We are locating them and getting them into the hands of active sailors.

Other owners who have put sailing off for a while due to personal and work reasons, are dusting their boats off as we speak and are looking forward to hitting the water again.

The T is great bang for buck racing.  It is a more rewarding sailing experience than most other cats out there.  The T is making a comeback in Oz :D

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I hope that you succeed for the sake of the class and cat sailing in general.

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Good work finding owners for the boats . I owned  a J&J Jarvie ( i think ) built boat in the early 80s and always have fond memories of how nice a boat it was to sail . Did always think it needed the 2nd trap . Then in the mid 2000s a mate bought a Marlstrom decked out with a kite and got to have a sail in that configuration , still an absolute joy to sail . 

 

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Nice one. Similar resurgence seems to be happening in Whitstable, UK. For us weekend club racers, the Tornado packs significantly more bang for buck than F18s, and is a 'nicer' sail. Similar reason that the Dart 18 and Dart 15 are still going strong... Solid, well tested designs, relatively cheap, but still with a decent sized class and circuit.

When I bought our Tornado last year, I was very tempted to by another good example that was for sale at the same place, and now rather wish I had! Good on you for taking a risk and supporting a great class! 

As for the comment on "Support a local class", in my experience classes wax and wain. Currently the number of F18s is dropping, and Tornados are increasing at my club. But either way, we sail on handicap, so we can still have good racing between F18s, Hurricanes, A Class and Tornados. 

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What is the minimum crew weight for the Tornado versus the F18?

Is there an ideal weight to be be competitive for both classes?

 

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No min for the Tornado class. Ideal is about 140kg but upto 165 is still very competitive.

 

F18 min is 150kg without additional corrector weights.  Ideal I would say is 150 to 160kg.

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49 minutes ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

No min for the Tornado class. Ideal is about 140kg but upto 165 is still very competitive.

 

F18 min is 150kg without additional corrector weights.  Ideal I would say is 150 to 160kg.

That isn't what I was thinking it would be

Which class would be better for "Team Fat Bastards"?

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Both about the same, The T doesn’t need as much weight as the F18 due to its beam and probably has a bit wider range.  

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Just out of interest is a ply Tornado still competitive with the later Tornado designs if it ran a modern rig?  I'm not saying front of fleet performance but how far would one be off the pace?

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Not even close.  The only competitive platforms at the top leave would be a carbon rigged Marstrom, Windrush or Graham Eeles.  That said, if you are the average club racer, even an alloy stick Reg White or the like would be great fun and competitive in a local fleet.

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Will Marstrom build masts if they get orders?
How about a new T?

The T is a long lasting love affair..

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_Alive   You said your objective was to rebuild the T fleet at the club level ... I am curious about the balance of club racing versus the travel circuit in Oz.   It sounds like you expect your T 's to sail handicap at the club level and the fun factor per buck is a winner.  No pretense of building a travel circuit of T's in Oz (pay no mind to all of the tilt trailer pics).....    (Same story in England) So, do the F18s have strong local clubs and a handful of members travel.... Or do the F18 sailors just do the travel circuit and essentially rent a club for the weekend.  what about the A class and Hobie 16 classes?  If you live in a major Oz city... are there clubs that you can join, keep your boat rigged and go racing every other weekend or so?

In the US Yacht clubs (back in the popular days of cat racing)  very very few clubs were home to one design cat fleets (Detroit YC had Tornados,   Roten Point YC  for Hobie 21s and C class of all things.).  circa 2K or so.... there was a move to join  Y clubs with mast up storage and club events.   Today, I can't think of a yacht club that you would point to as a Highlight for  classic cat CLUB racing on the east coast.  I can think of Sandy Hook BCC ( a beach cat club North New Jersey with a handful of H16  travel racers  among their 100 boats with 4 to 12 sailors in three club events this year and Lake Hopatcong (A class with a handful of travel sailors) and a Sunday weekly series for 3 months come to mind.    Some clubs like West River SC (MD)  with a couple of A cat and F18  travel sailors have a tuesday night steeplechase type club race while Syracuse NY also have a weeknight club race for H16s. Weeknight racing  is limited to racers geographically close to the club tho....  

It would seem that Yacht club multihull fleets peaked a few years ago and several are just a shell of themselves.  Most of the keen racers are travel racers who belong to paper yacht clubs and essentially borrow water access with their race circuit.

Is the Oz culture notably different then the US in 2018 so that you see a good future for Tcat club racing?

 

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On 6/22/2018 at 1:29 AM, Rushman said:

That isn't what I was thinking it would be

Which class would be better for "Team Fat Bastards"?

As a member of one of those teams(!), we switched from an F18 to a Tornado. If you can find the right F18 (make and model with the right Hull shapes and buoyancy for bigger crew, lake or sea sailing, etc), and get the sails cut for heavy weight, you can probably be more competitive on an F18. However, the Tornado seems more accommodating and fun to race for a heavier crew. 

So again, bang for buck wise, IMHO get a Tornado, but if your priority is winning the circuit, get an F18, but prepare to spend a lot more, and spend a lot more time researching for the right boat. 

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Tcatman, still early days. At our club we will have 2 x T’s.  There are a few more around the bay and we are hoping to convince one of them to come join us.  Our club also has about 6 x F18s and a couple of Vipers along with Hobies.

We will handicap race however the good F18s will keep you honest.  We will also travel to regattas.  Many people are starting to talk about the boats and hopefully once our season starts and we are racing, interest grows enough to convert more boats into active racers.

Due to Australia’s large size, we unfortunately have pockets of fleets (as do the F18s) that are fairly spread apart.  In some cases up to 3,700km or 2,200 miles apart. When the numbers build again, we will reserrect the Nationals.  We are also talking to other T sailors about kicking off a series of regattas (including Long distance) where we invite other 20 footers to race in one division.  These will include Nacra 20, Marstrom 20 and a local custom carbon 20. Might also like to include the F18’s and Taipan 5.7s.

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Another Marstrom coming together.  The owner is dusting her off and assembling after a few years tucked away.  There are actually quite a few good boats tucked away in storage waiting to be pulled out and get wet again.

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A fellow Anarchist was requesting pictures of how the Marstrom rudders lock down...... so I took a video for him. Thought I might share here as well.

 

 

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On 6/23/2018 at 8:33 PM, Tornado_ALIVE said:

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That can't possibly be Melbourne, too many palm trees! :lol:

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Darn nice example.

Certainly one of the finest boats ever built. Still a little underpowered for the heavy guys, I think the Nacra 20 is a better match for teams weighing north of 180kg. The Nacra F20Carbon is too but at the current going rate pretty much any boat is better bang/dollar (especially a Martstrom T, top of the line example for well under 1/3rd, nearly 1/4th of what a F20c is and under 1/2 what a brand new F18 is in USD).

@MultiMani,

Marstrom is long since out of the Tornado or boat building business, so the only spares around are those from the Olympic days. They might build a run of masts for the class if asked? There is a gentleman stateside setup with Autoclave that is building parts and Windrush will build parts. No idea what folks are doing otherwise.

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On 6/23/2018 at 6:23 AM, Tornado_ALIVE said:

Australia’s large size, we unfortunately have pockets of fleets (as do the F18s) that are fairly spread apart

_Alive     Thanks,  trying to get a sense of what club racing is all about in Oz and how that supports or is undermined by the more competitive racing in the travel circuit. 

IMO, a perfect CLUB racing scene would be about 20 similar boats on the beach  (in your case high performance spin boats) who get 10 boats out on the water for the weekly,  4 hour race period on Saturday or Sunday,  A second fleet of classic Hobies would also race on the course.    It sounds like you  are half way there at your club.... (assuming everyone is up for the club race).  More the point... you see a path to get some of the rec sailors at the club to come out and give racing a try.

Is my ideal scenario representative of  a good number of clubs in Oz?

The US has never had a wide spread catamaran clubs with a big club racing tradition.  The handful of traditional clubs are Roten Point  in Conn with  Hobies, C class, Open Class,  Lake Hopatcong, NJ with A class,  Detroit YC (torandos once upon a time) and Miami YC (Tornado's and others).   those are about it from my memory...

Given the isolated pockets and large size of Oz... what's a typical travel circuit look like for an F18 racer or a H16 racer who is serious about competing?

In the states, The enormous Hobie Fleets in  days of old were so large they would by pass Yacht clubs and take over public parks and they ran their own show for years and years.   So... not much Yacht club tradition here in any active racing classes  The rec sailors would point their vehicle to the regatta site and play in C fleets.... really no different then pointing to the state park launch.   Mast up storage was found on undeveloped beach front... never at yacht clubs with small boat parks.   For the last 20 years or so... most racing has been about the travel circuit of 2 day regattas on the weekends.   What survives today (East Coast USA)  is.   The Hobies have an active circuit that requires a 4 hour drive for Mid atlantic racing.  The A cats have an Atlantic coast circuit of 3 events  that requires an 8 hour drive or so and a winter racing Florida circuit.  The F18s have a New England travel circuit that requires about a 4 hour drive or so ... Florida has a travel circuit as do the southern states.   CRAM and CRAW have an active travel circuit around Lake Michigan.   Basically... if you want to go racing... its the same as it was 40 years ago...  you keep the boat in your back yard and rent a yacht club who is hosting a regatta.

 

So... finding new cat racers to join fleets is rarer then hens teeth.... Perhaps a club racing circuit where you could start out and get your feet wet racing could get some rec sailors into the dark side. as you are planning would work ..... Sadly, I can think of one club that has a weekly, one day a week end  Club race where you get 10 boats or so...(Lake Hopatcong for A class).  Several other clubs have a local weeknight series for an hour or so race.  (West River SC and Syracuse). The core problem is that you don't see ANY rec sailors joining in with the travel fleet to go racing because that is a huge jump and not much fun for them.

So... just looking for a light in the tunnel based on your experience of the Oz scene! 

TIA

 

 

 

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T_Catman, you're forgetting Mission Bay Yacht Club in San Diego who have exactly what you describe. There are a few others on the West Coast as well, and about a dozen high performance multihulls (F18's, F20c's, Nacra 17 Mk. 1's and 2's, M32, etc.) at Sail Newport in RI.

The New England Circuit is an 8-10 hr drive from Annapolis with a trailer and mandatory pit stops, excluding the 2 events out of Sandy Hook. Time any of it wrong and its even longer. Time it really right and maybe its a 7 hour drive. Its why no one bothers from my club-too much time away from family. Maybe if Southwest would check a F18...

We are holding steady at West River, always open to more boats/rec sailors, and we do have 2-3 weekend events a month that are 4-6 hours long, all out of the club. Lots of options for those who have time.

My take on the whole scene is really the following, and the travel scene has nothing to do with it:

1) Most of the fleet management is getting older so less in touch with the average person, some exceptions apply (A-Cat and F18 do have management teams in their 30's, not sure about the Hobie guys). This means that attracting sailors is harder due to the disconnect.

2) Time, time and time. No one has it period. Most families now are dual income no kids, some of those might own boats (myself, my sailing partner). Others are dual income with kids, some of those own boats from before kids. Others are single income based and the price of any newer boat keeps them hunting, crewing maybe, or forced out. Not many N20's or T's around and most are older and in less than ideal shape, not garage kept queens like the Marstrom shown here, so then you ask yourself what needs replacing and it could be a long, scary list. One of the club N20's might need a new front beam, fitted with self tacker that's nearly half the value of the boat!!

3) Hobie 16's aren't competitive with post 2000's board boats in any wind. I'm not saying on handicap, I'm saying on line honors. That means we don't get a lot of cross pollination out of the fleets as the H16's don't want to sail with the fast boats and don't need to because they have the numbers, but in our area don't really.

4) 90% of youth sailors are never exposed to cats..there are pockets of N15's/F16's around the country but certainly not at every club.

5) All of this means lower turnout. How do we fix? No idea really. Putting your best foot forward like T_A has done, to the extent of dipping heavily into the savings account to grow the fleet is one way, but probably not sustainable.

Anyway all of this is, IMO, pretty major thread drift and we should focus on the results between custom carbon badass 20 footers and high end production bad ass 20' classics.

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Good luck TA I think you will nail it. There are a lot of people now looking for a more laid back sailing experience than the cutting edge classes provide.

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SamC.... I am not forgetting the west coast...  It's the other side of the continent and I have no history with the local scene..... Given that it was the center of Hobie world back in the day (read huge travel circuit with no Yacht club participation)   that leaves US Sailing which used to have a West coast OCR.... I think at Mission bay..as one of the few clubs in the country with mast up storage and a good club racing scene out west....

You are missing my point...   A strong club racing scene that operates independently  of and is not cannibalized by the travel fleet  taking off or taking a  pass on putting the boat together because they  travel in two weeks is proposed as a Solution going forward...

Unfortunately... its not something that cat sailors have really enjoyed over the last 40 years given our non yacht club origins.  Back in the day...   leaving Friday evening and returning late sunday night for a two day event was the regatta life...  in 2018 even the big boats with bunks for 6 plan on one day races because of the time commitments.  For boats with motors in Annapolis you can draw fleets from several clubs and marinas to the race area .... so its basically club racing.... with out a common bar scene.  THAT is what we need for cats....   Beer cans on weeknights are extremely popular but the geographic reach is limited to locals near the club.     So... my answer to the TIME TIME TIME  problem is a local club scene that gives you 3 to 4 hours of 10 boats on the line... no matter what  every sunday...  

The regatta circuit for racers hasn't really changed in 40 years...  just sayin...  there are other models.

RE Hobie 16s and like boats... Yup... not really interesting to go race the spin boats... much less the fast sloops.... AND its the likely entry for a rec sailor into a racing scene.   So... you need clubs that give the H16s and the like that same experience... 10 boats on the start line... week in and week out for decent racing.

RE WRSC....   umm  well... I waited and waited for the club to offer what I needed... that strong club race scene once a week. They insisted on strict one design and the class culture was... an email chain..that usually went out on Friday.. HEY... guess what... its a club race this sunday... who is going...   3 boats might pipe up.. ... but two have to leave early....   um... OK...     but No thanks... not what I am talking about.

It may be one of those... welp... you can't get there... from here situations in the states..    Nobody wants to kill off a weekend regattta circuit and getting agreement on a single club  to get a critical mass of boats and a core race schedule with real commitments is not trivial.    Its tough.

 

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On 6/20/2018 at 8:16 AM, Tornado_ALIVE said:

Buying a Tornado, I have paid nearly a third of the price for a boat that is 2 foot longer, 2 foot wider, 25kg lighter, better built, larger sail area, a lot more refined to sail and faster.

The T is great bang for buck racing.  It is a more rewarding sailing experience than most other cats out there.  The T is making a comeback in Oz :D

This, this, this, this!

I've tried to explain that point to multiple F-18 sailors; and until they spend time with a T and/or sail one, they don't get it. The build quality is on a totally different level and the handling of a well tuned boat is like a Cadillac!

I had a beautiful Marstrom that I sold last year only because of the time to rig/derig from a breakdown trailer and the lack of crew here in Texas.  I still have a beautiful set of Zuccoli's that look like new that I need to sell.

Great boat that is deserving of the work you are putting into the class!!

On a related/unrelated note, one of the skippers I sail F-18s with just bought an F-28R. We've already taken two monhull sailors out and think we've converted them to multihulls. As much as I'd love to convert people with a beach cat, I'm starting to think that the tris are "more approachable" for all but the most adventurous noobies.

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Tcatman.... we are fortunate in Australia to have quite a few clubs in each state that get reasonable numbers (and quality) of cat sailors that race every weekend for 7 to 8 months of the year, excluding winter series where ran.

 

Sam.... Marstrom may not build hulls any more, who knows if a run of hulls was requested.  They may do a run of masts.  Most other parts can be bought here.

https://catsailing.net/index.php?

The problem with the T class for manufacturers is that Marstrom build such a brilliant boat with a very long shelf life.  There are also a LOT of good boats tucked away all around the world.  A little research and negotiating may get owners to sell.

Furthermore, Windrush in Australia are also Tornadoes, some have said better than Marstrom which is a big call.  Brett has an Autoclave and has also pumped the bows out to the max, wider than Marstrom.  His boats will also be a lot cheaper than when Marstrom was building them.  I would love to see him get the moulds for the mast as well. 

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Wlrottge..... This difference with myself and the other gentleman who bought a Marstrom from our club is that we both came off Tornados to join the F18 class, so we already knew the T was on another level than the F18 :D

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9 hours ago, Rawhide said:

Good luck TA I think you will nail it. There are a lot of people now looking for a more laid back sailing experience than the cutting edge classes provide.

Cheers mate, I believe unless you are training to be at the top of the fleet, or you have too much coin, you are better off with very good older boats such as the T, even a Capricorn or old C2.  Single handed, there are some cheap straight and curved board A’s floating about which are awesome bang for buck. Post Worlds I would imagine a lot of cheap converted foilers if you want to toy with foiling.

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Second what rawhide said..   Good luck.... I think you have the right approach with the club scene focus.

Hopefully, the US Sailors will see the value of building a club racing scene... even if it might cost some opportunities on the travel OD circuit to build this.

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My club (TYPBC) at Tauranga, New Zealand has moved from a mixture of Hobie 16's, F18's and other small cats to a fleet of 10 Tornados. Tauranga Harbour has narrow channels and lots of sandbanks and shallow water, so for us, the Tornado with it's centreboards is the perfect boat.

Most of our racing is Wednesday nights with the keelers and a mixture of short coastal and harbour races.

The New Zealand fleet has re-built itself with imports from Australia and Europe. 

Finally the 2019 Tornado World Champs will be at Takapuna Beach, Auckland (site of the 2008 Worlds) from the 4th January to the 10th Jan 2019. We have got sponsorship giving us free shipping of boats from different locations around the world (mainly Europe, Australia) (port charges still need to be paid). If interested email multihullers@gmail.com

 

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Have the Tornado Worlds changed from  Whangaporoa?

 

2019 Tornado worlds -NZL

Although we are before the 2018 Tornado World championship, next year’s venue is decided.

Let’s arrange our New Year’s Eve to New Zealand!

The NZITA are working very hard to get the 2019 World Championships organised and ensure that it will be an event not to be missed.

Prior to the NoR, we have an update for the 3 events below:

2019 New Zealand National Championship
30 Dec 2018 – 3 Jan 2019  (Racing 1-3 Jan – 3 races per day.)
Stanmore Bay, Whangaporoa, Auckland.

2019 International World, Global Mixed, and Youth Championship
4 January 2019 – 10 January 2019 (2 – races per day + layday)
Stanmore Bay, Whangaporoa, Auckland

2019 Bay of Islands Sailing Week
22-25 January
Waitangi, Bay of Islands.

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6 hours ago, pacice said:

Finally the 2019 Tornado World Champs will be at Takapuna Beach, Auckland (site of the 2008 Worlds)

Terrible venue, we sailed the Hobie 16s out of there for Auckland Anniversary day regatta, I hated every minute of it!

10 minutes ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

Have the Tornado Worlds changed from  Whangaporoa?

Manly sailing club in Whangaparoa would be among my top choices of a venue for a Tornado worlds in Auckland. I'm happy to put another few venues your way, but Manly is the best off the beach sailing launch site (with a club on it) around. Torbay and Waikatere (Narrow Neck beach) are also not bad venues either. Trust me, if you have an off the beach catamaran worlds at Takapuna, you'll regret it!

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Also, Tornado_Alive, I wish you nothing but the best of luck with revitalizing the fleet. It's an amazing mission which you're undertaking and I'm happy to see others out there. Our local Hobie 16 fleet in NZ is trying to band together with the Wetas, A-class, and Tornados to have joint events to collectively increase all of our numbers long term. It's going to take a long time to get it off the ground though. 

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Interesting your view on Takapuna, I sailed the 2008 Tornado Worlds there and really enjoyed the venue.  The breeze was very good as well which made it even more pleasant.  That said, I have already raced there and would personally prefer to go to another venue.

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Takapuna will have a lot of nice looking babes around, and the bars are just up the hill. However, accessibility wise it's terrible due to several reasons: 

1) Very difficult access for cars with trailers. Only one access point if they remove the chain between the bollards, even then, you have to go, turn around, and jump through hoops and ladders to do the maneuvers to get through it in a car with a trailer. This is only possible in the early morning before the rest of the city wakes up and starts parking their cars right outside the access point, or just driving their cars past it. The access point is barely wide enough to get your catamaran trailer through without hitting the bollards on either side. 

2) The sailing club doesn't own much land outside of it's extent, rather it's council park land. Someone will quickly ask you to move your car and boat back onto the roadway after you access the club grounds via the access point. 

3) Once you're past the access point and on the parklands/sailing club side, if it's wet in any way, shape, or form (dew, rain, etc.), it is difficult to get your car back up the steep hill to the access point and back onto the road. 

4) Getting through the access point onto the road is a pain in the ass, as there are heaps of people everywhere, and other drivers just trying to get places who don't expect a boat (AND TRAILER!) to come flying out of the park since you needed momentum to get up the damn hill without going backwards. 

5) The hill continues down to the boat ramp and beach. If you manage to rig your boat on the parklands, when you try to beach trolley the boat down the ramp, it's very steep and it's very difficult to prevent the boat from rolling uncontrollably down the ramp towards the beach. 

6) At the bottom of the boat ramp, where it connects to the beach, the interface level is off. The sand is about 50cm below the end of the ramp's stone, and this big bump causes the hard stone to hit the bottom of your boat after the beach wheels go over it. 

7) You have to deal with problems 5 and 6 in reverse when you come back after the races. This time, it's an uphill battle. 

8) The beach is not wide at high tide. If you go out or come back at high tide, then you have no beach to land on. Instead, you've got a rock seawall. 

9) THERE'S PEOPLE EVERYWHERE! And we all know people are stupid. When you come back from racing, they have no clue your boat is about to run them (or their kids) over while they are enjoying a leisurely swim. 

10) There's no car+trailer parking, without walking 1km away, and that car+trailer parking is not affiliated with the sailing club, so it's quite possible it gets filled up with day-to-day recreational traffic. 

Wow, I didn't expect my list to reach 10 reasons. 

Despite being a terrible venue, I will have to give credit to the Takapuna sailing club's staff. They understood this and did everything they could to make it easier for us, even providing a tractor to help tow our boats/trailers up the hill after the races. They're very nice and helpful people. 

Please, do NOT host your worlds at Takapuna beach, it's a huge mistake. Stanmore bay and Manly Sailing club (just down the road from Stanmore bay) are far superior venues accessibility wise. Only downside is the girls aren't as plentiful, and the bars/restaurants are a little farther away. If you want the bars/restaurants, Orewa beach is pretty nice and you can sail there if you like from Stanmore. It's just a skip and a hop away. Otherwise, driving to places is good too. 

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I don't recall any of these complaints coming out of the A-Cat worlds at Takapuna. I suspect they shut the beach down for non-sailors during that event however.

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18 hours ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

Have the Tornado Worlds changed from  Whangaporoa?

 

 

 

18 hours ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

Yes, Takapuna Boating Club has stepped up as the Organising club, so we have moved it to Takapuna.

It is more central, closer to the bars, and and will create more public interest.

Video of the Worlds 2008 at Takapuna showing what we hope will be the sailing conditions we want.

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, BboySlug said:

Terrible venue, we sailed the Hobie 16s out of there for Auckland Anniversary day regatta, I hated every minute of it!

Manly sailing club in Whangaparoa would be among my top choices of a venue for a Tornado worlds in Auckland. I'm happy to put another few venues your way, but Manly is the best off the beach sailing launch site (with a club on it) around. Torbay and Waikatere (Narrow Neck beach) are also not bad venues either. Trust me, if you have an off the beach catamaran worlds at Takapuna, you'll regret it!

Many is busy doing the BIC Worlds, so weren't available.

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On ‎6‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 9:52 PM, overlay said:

Don't waste your time.

The "T" is dead.

If it wasn't for the bullshit Olympics selection process it would have died years ago.

Do yourself and sailing a favour and support a local class. 

 

Seriously overlay you were so butt hurt over having your post downrated you stalked me around SA downrating all my posts? You must have a very small penis.  Whatever gets you off, you have mistaken me for someone who gives a fuck. 

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1 hour ago, Rawhide said:

Seriously overlay you were so butt hurt over having your post downrated you stalked me around SA downrating all my posts? You must have a very small penis.  Whatever gets you off, you have mistaken me for someone who gives a fuck. 

He has been downrating my posts as well the pathetic sad troll.  Perhaps we should pull together and get him some couciling. 

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2 hours ago, Tornado_ALIVE said:

He has been downrating my posts as well the pathetic sad troll.  Perhaps we should pull together and get him some couciling. 

Got quite a chuckle out of it actually. 

But onto something of meaning. are the T style snuffers class legal for a F18?

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Are you talking about the full aero, jib endplate snuffer (not that I know the answer)?

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No just the solid aero one like TA just had refurbed

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1 hour ago, Rawhide said:

No just the solid aero one like TA just had refurbed

You can have a solid snuffer as long as its glass but you cant have the spinnaker pole starting at the end of the snuffer like the tornado ones.  It has to fasten to the front beam

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Good luck at Takapuna, I'm just warning, it was one of the most stressful regattas I'd ever had due to the format of the venue. Takapuna sailing club staff are great and very accomodating, but the facility accessibility is horrendous. 

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Understand it might not be ideal for locals bringing their boats in by car however International sailors had containers delivered and will not experience most of the issues you raised.

in 08 we raced there and found the venue great.  We utilised the large park alongside the club and had plenty of room.  The public were not an issue, were respectful and kept their distance whilst still coming up and having a look.

The boat ramp was manageable with 2 crew.  I have raced events where it is a lot worse.  The video above shows some launching.  

We had plenty of beach, even when coming in on high.  Perhaps the tides were favourable for us.

I am confident this will be a great venue as it is not the first time we have been there.

9B783C3B-1C47-4CE6-BF2A-B595E7C330EB.jpeg

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Assuming you don't have to dick around with cars/trailers, yes, it'll be fine I think. 

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FYI....My Marstrom modern rig, carbon mast T is for sale. Located in BC Canada. My AD was posted in SA Classified but just expired. Might be able to provide delivery...

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