leonacj3

Daysailer 22' to 30'

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Hello,
 
I'm looking for a daysailer in the 22' to 30' range with the following wishlist and want to make sure I haven't missed anything (the boats I'm considering are below the wishlist):
 
- Draft no more than 5 feet (open to a swing keel)
- Engine, preferably inboard (gas, diesel or electric - have to travel about 5 miles roundtrip to get to and from the ocean for open water to sail)
- Flushing marine head, because I will be sailing with my teenage daughter and don't want to have to return to the marina if she needs to use the restroom
- Boat that I could easily sail singlehanded for when my daughter is not with me; self-tacking jib ideal
- Along the lines of something that can be sailed singlehanded or with my daughter, prefer an asymmetrical spinnaker or code zero instead of a symmetrical spinnaker
- Prefer a current production boat or one that has been produced within the last 5-10 years
- Doesn't need to be trailer-able - it will be kept in the water
- Ideally the price would be under $75k-$85k but open to spending more for the right boat
- Room in cockpit for 5-6 people comfortably for the days I bring the whole family/friends onboard
- Would like something fast and fun to sail; this is why I'm considering a J/80 even though it doesn't meet some requirements above
- Ideally no teak to reduce maintenance - boat will be left out in the sun in Florida
 
Here are boats I am considering. Please let me know if I have missed anything that I should consider, and also please let me know any thoughts about these boats:
 
Catalina 275 Sport
Beneteau First 25
Beneteau First 22
Tartan Fantail
Morris M29X
Seascape 27
Saffier 23 SE
Alerion Express 28
J/80
 
Thank you!

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The Harbor 25 strikes me as the everyman's version of the Alerion 28.

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Seascape 27 probably the best fit all round.

Morris M29X  would be about 3 times your budget

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Your budget appears to support this package. And it's the only one that ticks all the boxes you have created. Plus you can afford the lift too, which is a good idea in FL. If you're in SW FL, the 4'6" draft is about the max I would want unless you're willing to be a regular with boat US.

 

image.png.1a538fa2195c29e4e85e0857d43cbbc5.png

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Why a flushing marine head?  A composting head would be much less maintenance

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41 minutes ago, SemiSalt said:

The Harbor 25 strikes me as the everyman's version of the Alerion 28.

Wow, that looks great. Wasn't even on my radar!

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22 minutes ago, lasal said:

Your budget appears to support this package. And it's the only one that ticks all the boxes you have created. Plus you can afford the lift too, which is a good idea in FL. If you're in SW FL, the 4'6" draft is about the max I would want unless you're willing to be a regular with boat US.

lasal, is that the Alerion Express 28?

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13 minutes ago, TwoLegged said:

Why a flushing marine head?  A composting head would be much less maintenance

Hadn't considered that - just noted that most of what I'm looking at either has a flushing head or a portable head, and I don't want to have to deal with the portable one. I've had boats before with a flushing head and it hasn't been a big deal, especially since there are multiple pumpout stations close to home port.

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Santana 22. I know it is older that most but boat for boat pretty good and tough as nails. Very hard to beat in PHRF racing too.

p1111189735-3.jpg

 

Draft is less than 4. Can be powered by a small outboard. Great boat to get started in.

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J100 is more of a day-sailor than a J80 and has an inboard. They list a shoal draft version but I am not sure how many they made. 

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On the small end, consider a Rhodes 22    I like mine.  Aside from a yearly trailer trip I daysail.   I’m alone 85% of the time.

Marine Head, hatch overhead allows a single handler to stand and keep watch if the wind is polite.   Unique door does expand to allow knee room if you need to sit.  I’m 5’11”

Stub keel & centerboard, floats in 20”and swims in 4’.   Forgiving if the board hits bottom.

Bimini and pop top can be raised under sail if the wind is moderate and the boom can be kept in the top ‘notch’.

8 foot cockpit.

Convenient to single hand.   Cross sheet the jib.   I do a lot of short tacking.

I can get it out of a slip in a crosswind up to 20 knots or more or without bumping my slip neighbor.   The advantage of small.

active class association.   

Newer boats have zero external wood, not even the tiller.   Also a rot free deck core and a fiberglass board instead of iron swing keel.   I looked hard at maintenance.   

The shop is still in business, on a custom basis.   There are several used boats on the market and factory refits available.

 

negatives:   Unique solutions, if you are set in your ways it may not meet your expectations.   The centerboard shape is forgiving if you touch bottom, but doesn’t provide great lift.   It points ok but slips a bit.   It doesn’t like winds over 20 or 25, I reef early if storms threaten.   The in mast furling is convenient since I can be sailing 8 minutes after I lock the car,  but sail shape obviously suffers.  Since you have a long channel one with a traditional rig could be a better option.   It needs an outboard, or the factory torqueedo retrofit option.    My Tohatsu sailmaster 6 can get 25 n m per gallon at half throttle, if I can get ethanol free fuel and it doesn’t vapor lock.

 

 

 

 

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16 hours ago, steele said:

J100 is more of a day-sailor than a J80 and has an inboard. They list a shoal draft version but I am not sure how many they made. 

My thought as well, but may a bit outside the price range.

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2 hours ago, Remodel said:
18 hours ago, steele said:

J100 is more of a day-sailor than a J80 and has an inboard. They list a shoal draft version but I am not sure how many they made. 

My thought as well, but may a bit outside the price range.

J/95 (http://www.jboats.com/j95) has a similar recipe, but with a centreboard: 3'0" draft with board up.  Wheel steering (yuk) but otherwise similar to J/100.

The two listed on Yachtworld are v spendy: US$142k and $195k

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21 hours ago, SemiSalt said:

The Harbor 25 strikes me as the everyman's version of the Alerion 28.

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2008/Schock-Harbor-25-3084323/Lake-Lanier%2C-NE-of-Atlanta/GA/United-States?refSource=browse listing#.Wz-j8tVKjIU

Here you go.  Checks every block on your list.  Might need to by a new Aysm, but for the price, you've got plenty of room.  Not as nice as the Alerion, but comes with the retractable sprit for the aysm...

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That Harbor 25 looks near perfect for this brief

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On 7/5/2018 at 4:21 PM, leonacj3 said:

Wow, that looks great. Wasn't even on my radar!

Harbor 25

I looked at one of these about 4 years ago. I thought it was a little tubby looking and the interior a bit overdone ("bead board" and stone countertops?). I have heard that you need to be very careful about the build date, since the quality took a big dip at some point. Do some searching on SA and you should find the thread.

On the plus side, big cockpit and the traveler is aft of it.

Good luck in your search.

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Winner 8 would tick all boxes, I guess. Would need shipping and tariffs probably are a dealbreaker...

Winner-8-4.jpg

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Winner 8 would tick all boxes, I guess. Would need shipping and tariffs probably are a dealbreaker...

Winner-8-4.jpg

or, if a J/80 is the lower end in terms of comfort and motor, a JK 28 may also be an option. 

4_c493f4e9a3.jpeg

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10 hours ago, Matagi said:

Winner 8 would tick all boxes, I guess. Would need shipping and tariffs probably are a dealbreaker...

Winner 8 fails the OP's "Room in cockpit" criterion. It looks okay for 2 people, not the 5–6 which the OP wants

winner8-1170.jpg

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How does the Beneteau compare on cockpit room? And does anyone have a PHRF?

 

 

2018-07-07_2018.png

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21 hours ago, Matagi said:

or, if a J/80 is the lower end in terms of comfort and motor, a JK 28 may also be an option. 

 

Most everything I've found about the JK 28 is in German, and none I can find for sale in the U.S. Anyone have more information?

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I saw the Beneteau First 22 today. It's a big boat with sails that look too small (maybe because it's built to be a teaching boat they don't want it to get overpowered?). Here's is my refined list with data. Definitely appreciate the suggestions about the Harbor 25!

 

Capture.PNG

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Also sailed the J/80 today. I think that's going to be too much work to try to sail single-handed, and of course it also doesn't have a head, so that one probably will come off the list too.

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I see a lot to like about the Saffier.  Tasty lines, and high ballast ratio on a light hull.

However the self-tacking jib is one of those evil short track types.  Fine upwind in flat water, when a narrowly-sheeted blade is ideal ... but no use once the sheet is eased.  Even when daysailing or cruising, I like my sails to set properly, and that jib would offend me every time I was reaching.

The Hoyt jib boom as used on the Alerion and the Harbor 25 is a much better all-rounder. Both those boats are heavy, but at least their rigs are not crippled. 

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Does it also concern you that there seem to be very few examples of that boat in the US? Seems like it might be more difficult to resell it down the road since less people would know about them. 

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Hey Leon, looks like you're making some good progress and actually getting out on the water, the most important thing.

The Harbor 25 is pretty nice. Note that those have a gas saildrive, Yamaha 9.9, not a diesel. I'd be happy with that powerplant, the main thing being that running narrow passes and channels under power where the waves can get steep, an outboard is far more likely to cavitate than an inboard.

Just a note on draft, as combined I have sailed, fished from a variety of center consoles, and kayaked the entire SW FL coast from Boca Grande to Shark River, almost every pass and bay/sound, and also all around Marathon Key. I don't know what river and pass you'll be transiting to go sailing, but five feet is deep draft for a lot of cool spots. If you wanted to sail Pine Island Sound on a regular basis, for example, a nice cat boat might be something to think about. One with an inboard.

Charlotte Harbor, or Tampa Bay, five feet draft would be ok, until you wanted to anchor in a nice little spot that won't allow five feet. Plus, on a small boat carrying a dingy to get to shore is not easy. A shoal draft boat can often get you close enough to nice little lunch spots where you can walk, swim off the boat right up to a sandy spot a few yards away. You are in Florida after all.

 

image.png.cc25e6b5ba31adaae06ec5b166d80bfd.png

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I'm enjoying my C275 and pm'd you some additional information.  As I said, it checks off most of the boxes.  It is a displacement boat, so it will be certainly slower than the Seascape 27.  And I'm not too wild about the Seascape's OB configuration.  It is designed to sail, not motor.

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Your table for the C275 needs to have the standard draft of 5.0.

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If you can stand another six inches of draft (5 1/2'), you might look for a CF 27. Price should fit your budget and they aren't bad boats for IOR vintage.

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Wylie 30?  

Depending on your docking setup one of the smaller Corsairs (Dash/Sprint I think?) with the longer cockpit might work. Still an outboard but really fast and fun, and beachable, which I think would be a huge advantage where you are. 

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34 minutes ago, socalrider said:

Wylie 30?  

Depending on your docking setup one of the smaller Corsairs (Dash/Sprint I think?) with the longer cockpit might work. Still an outboard but really fast and fun, and beachable, which I think would be a huge advantage where you are. 

Sprint is the one I'm thinking of with the small cabin and larger cockpit:

http://windcraftmultihulls.com/2014-corsair-sprint-750-mk-ii-69500

The Dash is the one with more cabin and less cockpit:

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2010/Corsair-Dash-750-%23382-3187659/Stuart/FL/United-States?refSource=standard listing#.W1ZfXS2ZNKM

 

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Westsail 32. Ooops. Wrong thread.

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Here is an updated chart. As we have looked at boats, it has become apparent that my wife wants a "sit in", not a "sit on", boat, so that has eliminated a couple from the initial list. 

The 5'0" draft is really a limitation of where the boat slip is - I am in southeast Florida and in the canal where the boat slip is, any more than that is going to have the keel stuck at low tide.

The more I look at these, the more I like the Tartan Fantail although I haven't seen one in person yet. The electric outboard (Torqeedo) that is elegantly stowed away up and out of the water makes a lot of sense to me. I also have a Duffy electric boat which has been fantastic - no real maintenance other than filling the batteries 2 or 3 times a year, and it's nice not to deal with smelly fuel or a loud engine. And I had a cruising boat previously where the rubber boot failed prematurely so am gun-shy about having a saildrive.

Apparently there were only 20-something of the Fantails made, so there's not a lot of information on the web except for reviews from 2012-2013 when they premiered. If anyone here has experience with one, I would love to hear about it.

Capture.PNG

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Rubber boot or did you mean the seal?  Knock on wood, I haven't had any problems with my saildrive, but did charter a new cat this last spring that did have a seal leak on one side.  Someone's comments about saildrives.

A fantail looks a little cramped below and one review stated a porta-potty and another shows a flush.  The toilet is opposite of the cooler.  Definitely should go and look at one if this is your top choice.

 

 

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A friend has a Catalina 270. 

6283975_20170628092922299_1_XLARGE.jpg

It's heavier than the 275 and the rig is pretty conservative, but it's a nice little boat.  Per PHRF ratings, it's 10-15 sec/mile slower than the 275.  Double spreader, masthead rig, and you can see in the picture than the stays are set well inboard so it should point pretty well (at least with the deep keel version). Based on a tiny bit of experience and observation, I'd say it's pretty stiff and may do better in a windy area than some other designs. 

(Pic is not my friend's boat.)

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On 7/7/2018 at 7:19 PM, SemiSalt said:

How does the Beneteau compare on cockpit room? And does anyone have a PHRF?

 

 

2018-07-07_2018.png

 

I have a First 260, the older version of the 25s with a traditional spar. A 1996 built in France, It’s a real hoot. We race it well, and cruise it well. Sticky in the light, but with a little breeze (like yesterday) she gets around just fine. 

 

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Carbon fiber mast and boom are options on the Tartan Fantail. The dealer recommends them. The mast adds $4k to the price and the boom adds $2k.

Is it worth $6k to have carbon fiber instead of aluminum?

What maintenance is required for these?

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As daysailers go, the Alerion 28 is pretty sweet.  I don't think there's a plumbed-in head and holding tank in most of them, but  there' just enough headroom down below to sit up on a porta-potti.   A curtain  provides privacy.   You can overnight, or long-weekend  'em too.

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1 hour ago, leonacj3 said:

Carbon fiber mast and boom are options on the Tartan Fantail. The dealer recommends them. The mast adds $4k to the price and the boom adds $2k.

Is it worth $6k to have carbon fiber instead of aluminum?

 

 

If you don't know, the answer is NO.

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10 minutes ago, Jackdaw said:

 

If you don't know, the answer is NO.

I would like to learn. That is why I’m here. 

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I have to say, you can find a really nice 25-28 foot daysailer for a hell of a lot less than $75,000.

 

I mean, if you WANT to spend $75,000 then go for it.   How about a Rustler 24?  Old Skool. Slow. But pretty.


https://www.sailingworld.com/sailboats/rustler-24

http://www.rustleryachts.com/rustler24/

 

no potty for the daughter, though.

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41 minutes ago, leonacj3 said:

I would like to learn. That is why I’m here. 

Fair enough. Its a costly tweak on a daysailor. While it will lighten the boat and strengthen the rig, the performance advantage will be small and will likely be lost on you. And yes carbon spars need to be maintained and protected from UV.

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The rustler 24 has no cabin. I think that’s a real drawback. 

Tartan, Alerion, what’s not like? Leon, what boats on your list can be found in your area?

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Bull, he could buy an H Boat. I know one in Southern California that I'll sell  for $65,000!  It's a bargain!

 

Actually in a more serious vein....Left Coast Dart, if you can find a used one. There's one for sale for $45K in Hawaii.

 

Esse 8.5 L.  The regular 8.5 draws 6+ feet, the "L" model has a slightly shorter rig, and a shallower, heavier keel with a bigger chord.   Should still be pretty quick, though. I have no idea if there are any in North America, but there's enough of a cabin to put a potty for the daughter down below.

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Ever consider a new Bente 24 ?  30k plus and you have a custom boat of your own preference. You could sail it in Europe before you brought it home or just order it to be delivered. The testing would be fun.  Otherwise a refitted j27 set up for single handed would be a trailerable hoot.

 

 

 

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On 7/6/2018 at 12:41 AM, Lark said:

 

On the small end, consider a Rhodes 22    I like mine.  Aside from a yearly trailer trip I daysail.   I’m alone 85% of the time.

Marine Head, hatch overhead allows a single handler to stand and keep watch if the wind is polite.   Unique door does expand to allow knee room if you need to sit.  I’m 5’11”

Stub keel & centerboard, floats in 20”and swims in 4’.   Forgiving if the board hits bottom.

Bimini and pop top can be raised under sail if the wind is moderate and the boom can be kept in the top ‘notch’.

8 foot cockpit.

Convenient to single hand.   Cross sheet the jib.   I do a lot of short tacking.

I can get it out of a slip in a crosswind up to 20 knots or more or without bumping my slip neighbor.   The advantage of small.

active class association.   

Newer boats have zero external wood, not even the tiller.   Also a rot free deck core and a fiberglass board instead of iron swing keel.   I looked hard at maintenance.   

The shop is still in business, on a custom basis.   There are several used boats on the market and factory refits available.

 

negatives:   Unique solutions, if you are set in your ways it may not meet your expectations.   The centerboard shape is forgiving if you touch bottom, but doesn’t provide great lift.   It points ok but slips a bit.   It doesn’t like winds over 20 or 25, I reef early if storms threaten.   The in mast furling is convenient since I can be sailing 8 minutes after I lock the car,  but sail shape obviously suffers.  Since you have a long channel one with a traditional rig could be a better option.   It needs an outboard, or the factory torqueedo retrofit option.    My Tohatsu sailmaster 6 can get 25 n m per gallon at half throttle, if I can get ethanol free fuel and it doesn’t vapor lock.

 

 

 

 

this one may be sold for cheap ....it took on water yesterday and capsized at my YC in a storm...I have geard that this is NOT unusual for the Rhodes

 

rhodes22.jpg.33d7d4033360590f5649ac31f08a7a22.jpg

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On 7/7/2018 at 11:16 AM, TwoLegged said:

Winner 8 fails the OP's "Room in cockpit" criterion. It looks okay for 2 people, not the 5–6 which the OP wants

winner8-1170.jpg

In boats of that size it's more comfortable for the crowd to be out on the trampolines.

Oops, wrong forum.

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I won’t mention the Ensign because it has an outboard

D31A5672-9773-471E-B8CA-3344A637231C.jpeg

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But it has an 8’ cockpit, cabin and a small head. Great for gunkholing and cruising. No stone counter tops or standing hreadroom either

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And do you have to motor the 5 miles to the ocean or can you sail as well?

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2 hours ago, dacapo said:

this one may be sold for cheap ....it took on water yesterday and capsized at my YC in a storm...I have geard that this is NOT unusual for the Rhodes

 

rhodes22.jpg.33d7d4033360590f5649ac31f08a7a22.jpg

That’s not a R-22.   My design has odd flaired sides, but is dry in chop.   It also has enough built in flotation to be unsinkable unless crushed by collision.  Class lore says only one has capsized.   It was caught by a following quarter wave on the Chesapeake while powering through a storm, and flipped,    The mast stuck in the mud.   It was salvaged and the family kept using it.   I can’t speak to the many other designs associated with the talented pen of Philip Rhodes.   

Everybody loves their own boat of course, or they bought the wrong one.   I plugged mine because an 8 foot cockpit and marine head are uncommon in a sailboat that can float of a grounding by lifting the boards and floating in 20 inches of water.    I recently had opportunity to learn the manufacturer stands by his work, even if the broken tiller is out of the refit’s two year warranty.   “It shouldn’t have broken, send it back and I’ll mail you a new one”.   Meanwhile another Rhodie currently in the mediteranian (he shipped his boat there) suggested that his emergency spare is made out of a wheel barrow handle.   

I apologize for the uneven fender.   This was a late season vacation last year. I was at South Haven on Michigan at the time,   The pop top is down since we were leaving the boat to explore the town.   

210E8B22-4F97-4F69-A834-D5EBBCEAFA18.jpeg

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2 hours ago, dacapo said:

this one may be sold for cheap ....it took on water yesterday and capsized at my YC in a storm...I have geard that this is NOT unusual for the Rhodes

 

rhodes22.jpg.33d7d4033360590f5649ac31f08a7a22.jpg

Edit.   I don’t think it is.   The R 22 has a stub keel and flat semiplaning hull behind it.    Unless the flotation under the cockpit was compromised and the lazarette full of water, I don’t think it would float like that.    My bow looks more bluff in the rear view mirror.   

3540129C-497C-4966-9092-D4A4ADEF99C4.jpeg

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How about the Catalina 22 Capri? Tall rig rates 200. Only drawback is the 4 hp outboard.

772B24C9-0B69-4B34-9B41-DC79E965F26E.jpeg

52E2C117-1D46-4C1B-9EE6-F9DCCAA4D806.jpeg

38195A89-432D-47B6-B32E-B0E9EDD8B148.jpeg

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I re-read the op and 2 1/2 miles each way is nothing for a 5 hp 4stroke Yamaha of Honda Long Shaft outboard motor. A new Ensign Classic is about $45,000 ready to go with trailer, sails and LED lighting. 

Fiberglass coamings, benches and cockpit sole for ease of maintenance if you ask nicely. Otherwise you get nice mahogany and teak like I have!

Thanks Ensign Spars for a great boat!!

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10 hours ago, Lark said:

Edit.   I don’t think it is.   The R 22 has a stub keel and flat semiplaning hull behind it.    Unless the flotation under the cockpit was compromised and the lazarette full of water, I don’t think it would float like that.    My bow looks more bluff in the rear view mirror.   

3540129C-497C-4966-9092-D4A4ADEF99C4.jpeg

it is most definitely an R22...I've done work on it for the owner...lazy owner, STILL hasn;t come to the YC to take a look or see if he can right the boat...it's only in 4 ft of water at low tide

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8 minutes ago, dacapo said:

it is most definitely an R22...I've done work on it for the owner...lazy owner, STILL hasn;t come to the YC to take a look or see if he can right the boat...it's only in 4 ft of water at low tide

Sorry to see it.   Do you know the build year?   The owner hasn’t bothered to check it out?!?    What happened (or didn’t happen) before the storm?    If the rail was held under there is a space under the open cockpit seats that would let water slowly fill the lazarette and cabin.   Like the Titanic the bulkheads only go above swamp height.   It’s not a blue water boat, just a coastal pocket cruiser and day sailor.  The foam will keep it above water, but no boat is stable full of water.   The hard part is getting it under to that point.   It shouldn’t have happened unless the cockpit drains were plugged and the foam flotation had been slowly soaked as well, or a through hull had failed.     

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39 minutes ago, dacapo said:

it is most definitely an R22...I've done work on it for the owner...lazy owner, STILL hasn;t come to the YC to take a look or see if he can right the boat...it's only in 4 ft of water at low tide

With all respect, the hull shape has no resemblance to the Rhodes 22.

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33 minutes ago, Bull City said:

With all respect, the hull shape has no resemblance to the Rhodes 22.

ok...it's still a Rhodes 22....with the flared sides, pop top , the silly mast stepping device, and the outboard motor attached to the steering.......

maybe it's the perspective...we're gonna try to raise it tomorrow morning 

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Silly mast stepping device?    I like that bit,  I can rig solo in 20 knot winds, even if sweat gets in my eye.   

 

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11 minutes ago, Black Jack said:

Perfect for its natural habitat: the Italian lakes.

For other uses, less so.

And for the OP's use with a 5-foot draft limit, it's a no-go.

But since we are all busy spending someone else's money, maybe Black Jack would buy one for me, along with a lakeside villa where I could moor it?

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5 hours ago, Lark said:

Silly mast stepping device?    I like that bit,  I can rig solo in 20 knot winds, even if sweat gets in my eye.   

 

Why would anyone sweat while rigging a trailer sailor?

Sincerely,

Sun Cat owners

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7 hours ago, Lark said:

Silly mast stepping device?    I like that bit,  I can rig solo in 20 knot winds, even if sweat gets in my eye.   

 

I didn’t mean silly like “stoopid” I meant silly like I’ve never seen one like that before 

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5 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

Why would anyone sweat while rigging a trailer sailor?

Sincerely,

Sun Cat owners

I saw one east of Lorain.    After passing from a distance I tacked back to take a second look.    I think he told me it was the Horizon cat.   Nice boat, nice guy.    I went to the website, but couldn’t find the head, stove or much storage in the schematic.   A pocket cruiser has to have his standards.   

Sincerely:

Rhodies.   :D

The Horizon daycat would fit the mission of the original poster, if he wanted to settle for a chamber pot.

http://sailingmagazine.net/article-permalink-217.html.   The overnighter’s review by Robert Perry.

 

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10 hours ago, TwoLegged said:

Perfect for its natural habitat: the Italian lakes.

For other uses, less so.

And for the OP's use with a 5-foot draft limit, it's a no-go.

But since we are all busy spending someone else's money, maybe Black Jack would buy one for me, along with a lakeside villa where I could moor it?

Last month I did sail one on lake Como. It was sweet despite the light winds and some rain. I have a friend who has a nice comfortable villa there - how about we take the boat out again in September. Certainly an idealized boat. Hard to argue it does not fit the wish list.42808920945_e38aafba73_c.jpg

29842592568_ab22076a70_c.jpg

I am doing my own inquiry for a great day sailor with the same parameters and with the ability to tow with a decent SUV. As for amenities - I do like a boat that is easy to nap on both in the cockpit and inside the cabin.  If i do get transferred to Phoenix from the Bay Area in the next months, I will want a boat that can be easily trailered from the lakes to San Diego to make up for my big loss of being close to great water sailing.

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2 hours ago, Lark said:

I saw one east of Lorain.    After passing from a distance I tacked back to take a second look.    I think he told me it was the Horizon cat.   Nice boat, nice guy.    I went to the website, but couldn’t find the head, stove or much storage in the schematic.   A pocket cruiser has to have his standards.   

Sincerely:

Rhodies.   :D

The Horizon daycat would fit the mission of the original poster, if he wanted to settle for a chamber pot.

http://sailingmagazine.net/article-permalink-217.html.   The overnighter’s review by Robert Perry.

 

The entire bow of a Horizon cat is the head, with porta potti under bench and sink. The "galley" is basically a plank that spans the boat aft of the bulkhead and a pull-out single burner propane stove. And another little sink. There's no oven. There's storage fwd and under the berths, which are generous singles by boat standards, and in lazarettes. It's an adaptation of a Herreschoff America Cat but with Com-Pac's folding rig.

If you're relatively long and strong and young, you can raise the mast in under a minute like a Sun Cat. If you're not, there's a gin pole thing.

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6 hours ago, Black Jack said:

 

Last month I did sail one on lake Como. It was sweet despite the light winds and some rain. I have a friend who has a nice comfortable villa there - how about we take the boat out again in September. Certainly an idealized boat. Hard to argue it does not fit the wish list.42808920945_e38aafba73_c.jpg

29842592568_ab22076a70_c.jpg

I am doing my own inquiry for a great day sailor with the same parameters and with the ability to tow with a decent SUV. As for amenities - I do like a boat that is easy to nap on both in the cockpit and inside the cabin.  If i do get transferred to Phoenix from the Bay Area in the next months, I will want a boat that can be easily trailered from the lakes to San Diego to make up for my big loss of being close to great water sailing.

I don't think you're putting a flushable head & holding tank in one of those.

Purty boats though.

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On 7/28/2018 at 9:03 PM, Lark said:

Sorry to see it.   Do you know the build year?   The owner hasn’t bothered to check it out?!?    What happened (or didn’t happen) before the storm?    If the rail was held under there is a space under the open cockpit seats that would let water slowly fill the lazarette and cabin.   Like the Titanic the bulkheads only go above swamp height.   It’s not a blue water boat, just a coastal pocket cruiser and day sailor.  The foam will keep it above water, but no boat is stable full of water.   The hard part is getting it under to that point.   It shouldn’t have happened unless the cockpit drains were plugged and the foam flotation had been slowly soaked as well, or a through hull had failed.     

Can’t read entire HIN but last theee digits are 899. I’ll have pics later

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F0221CF4-6C1B-41E5-83A5-57BA9EC51AFC.thumb.jpeg.983512e670ba6213b93c8fc8e2927148.jpeg

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8 hours ago, dacapo said:

Can’t read entire HIN but last theee digits are 899. I’ll have pics later

The owner has shared his loss with the owner's forum.    He's given me advice in the past.   I'll let him share more if he chooses.    He is unsure exactly what happened, but the mast was somehow caught under a mooring chain preventing the boat from righting.   

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I enjoy my Catalina22 for a day sail. Hoping to step into something bigger in future though. Definitely couldn't fit 6 though. Its be a little tight...

20180730_165453.jpg

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