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Saorsa's wet dream. They're coming after people like me.

Problem is...you have to live somewhere. You can't not have a "residence" and participate in things like banking. Or voting - you have to be registered somewhere, and we've complied with all the laws.

Specifically Clay County is targetting one business which they may destroy if the Supervisor of Elections gets his way.

https://www.passagemaker.com/trawler-news/liveaboard-voting-rights-threatened-florida

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A state Board of Elections is calling for a change to make it difficult for you to vote, or even make sure you cannot do so.

And, you’re not even black. 

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Clay County.....firmly republican.

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1 hour ago, B.J. Porter said:

Saorsa's wet dream. They're coming after people like me.

Problem is...you have to live somewhere. You can't not have a "residence" and participate in things like banking. Or voting - you have to be registered somewhere, and we've complied with all the laws.

Specifically Clay County is targetting one business which they may destroy if the Supervisor of Elections gets his way.

https://www.passagemaker.com/trawler-news/liveaboard-voting-rights-threatened-florida

I can see them not wanting you to vote on local issues or taxes, but state and national elections are different and shouldn’t be changed. 

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I'm sure you can find another address of convenience in the USA where this won't happen.

Personally, I'd be embarrassed to call Florida my home.

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As a point of fact, you don't reside at that address and never have resided there. So what you're objecting to is them trying to apply reality rather than accept a fiction. I frankly don't think you've a legitimate complaint at all. Yes I understand how this complicates life and that you need a mailing address. If this still works for other stuff...?

I'm not sure how Australia handles such things for itinerants, but it'd be interesting to know. I *do* know because there have been a few recent cases on point that registering a bunch of people as living at an address where they don't actually live is classed as electoral fraud, can be prosecuted and will be prosecuted. As I have 3 properties in 2 different states, I tend to regard my address as somewhat 'flexible'. I can still only have one for issue of a driver's licence though it can be a PO Box.

FKT

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If you tell the electoral commission you're overseas indefinitely and do not intend to return, they'll take you off the roll.

If you tell them you intend to return within 5? years, you can still vote in federal elections.

you register at the address you had when you lived here.

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5 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

If you tell the electoral commission you're overseas indefinitely and do not intend to return, they'll take you off the roll.

If you tell them you intend to return within 5? years, you can still vote in federal elections.

you register at the address you had when you lived here.

If he registers at the address he actually lived at he would have to "gasp" pay taxes!!!!!

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3 minutes ago, warbird said:

If he registers at the address he actually lived at he would have to "gasp" pay taxes!!!!!

I think he has to do that regardless.

I've a friend and her husband..she's from Atlanta, he's originally german but with US cit.

They've spent the last 30 years working all over the world...but their perm address is in OZ.

The have to file a return in the USA, Australia and whatever country they are working in at the time, Sucks but they do it.

Downside of OS contracting.

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18 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

I think he has to do that regardless.

I've a friend and her husband..she's from Atlanta, he's originally german but with US cit.

They've spent the last 30 years working all over the world...but their perm address is in OZ.

The have to file a return in the USA, Australia and whatever country they are working in at the time, Sucks but they do it.

Downside of OS contracting.

BJ moved his mailing address to avoid taxes. The jurisdiction he moved to has a legitimate right (and obligation)to cleanse it's voter roles of nonresidents. 

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2 minutes ago, warbird said:

BJ moved his mailing address to avoid taxes. The jurisdiction he moved to has a legitimate right (and obligation)to cleanse it's voter roles of nonresidents. 

I agree. If you are not resident in a particular electorate you shouldn't be voting there on a local level..federally..should be registered at last residential address.

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2 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

I'm sure you can find another address of convenience in the USA where this won't happen.

Personally, I'd be embarrassed to call Florida my home.

Why?

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8 minutes ago, warbird said:

BJ moved his mailing address to avoid taxes. 

Where should his mailing address be?

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3 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Where should his mailing address be?

Last place he paid a property tax bill?  Last place he was domiciled?  SCOTUS just ruled on purging voter roles. That might give you someguidance.

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1 minute ago, warbird said:

Last place he paid a property tax bill?  Last place he was domiciled?  SCOTUS just ruled on purging voter roles. That might give you someguidance.

So he should use an address at which he no longer has any association?  How does that make sense?

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1 minute ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

So he should use an address at which he no longer has any association?  How does that make sense?

we talking about Tax or Voting?

Tax..pay direct to IRS.

Mailing adrress anywhere you chose..just don't link it with the other two.

Voting..the last place you lived for 5 years..or however many years it takes to become a US cit.

You should also have to come back once every ten years for jury duty.

Personally I think you should pay tax in the country you are resident in..and non of this "leave the country for XX days BS."

 

Rights come with responsibilities..or so I think.

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22 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

So he should use an address at which he no longer has any association?  How does that make sense?

If he has no " association " why should he vote?  Vote does imply "skin in the game".

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14 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

we talking about Tax or Voting?

Tax..pay direct to IRS.

Mailing adrress anywhere you chose..just don't link it with the other two.

Voting..the last place you lived for 5 years..or however many years it takes to become a US cit.

You should also have to come back once every ten years for jury duty.

Personally I think you should pay tax in the country you are resident in..and non of this "leave the country for XX days BS."

 

Rights come with responsibilities..or so I think.

You are entitled to your opinion. Florida law may not comport with that. See link below. 

I doubt that the purchaser of BJ’s House took title subject in fee simple subject to the sellers’ right to receive mail at the address. I myself thought about trying to secure easement rights to the front porch, because it was among the finest drinking spots on the east coast of the US, but thought better of it. 

You’ll notice that the only people saying that BJ isn’t paying taxes are morons and bullshitters, not BJ. 

Heres the SOE guide to FL election residence requirement. 

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf

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15 minutes ago, warbird said:

If he has no " association " why should he vote?  Vote does imply "skin in the game".

He isn’t trying to vote at the last place he paid a property tax bill. Why would you suggest that?

Who says he has no association?  How do you know?

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1 hour ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

I can still only have one for issue of a driver's licence though it can be a PO Box.

US states, in my experience, require a physical address for a driver's license. It cannot be a PO Box. The mailing address can be, but your physical address cannot. A distinct problem for "legal" existence if you don't have a physical address (hence legal fictions like BJs). As a corroborative example I believe in some liveaboard thread here there's someone stating they used the street address of the town dock in Maine as their "physical address" when they were moored offshore for a year or two.

If you aren't a US resident you may not know that many states welcome the convenient fiction of residency for certain classes. Military service members get to effectively pick and choose the state they "live" in. Many choose a low-state/registration-fee state like Alaska as a state of convenience if they pass through it long enough to gain residency and then maintain such "residency" for years. Some states effectively discourage university students living in their state from becoming residents though they are actual residents. 

states also maintain different classes of "resident". in a number of states you may be eligible to vote and register your car in the state, but purchasing a hunting or fishing license at the "resident" price requires a different standard - often a physical year in the state.

It's a problem people don't want to really answer because life doesn't fit in the boxes we used to assign for it, their's no clear constituency, and the arena is rife for abuse. There's already a number of people dodging state taxation through bullshit residency scams or corporate registration scams.

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5 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

You are entitled to your opinion. Florida law may not comport with that. See link below. 

I doubt that the purchaser of BJ’s House took title subject in fee simple subject to the sellers’ right to receive mail at the address. I myself thought about trying to secure easement rights to the front porch, because it was among the finest drinking spots on the east coast of the US, but thought better of it. 

You’ll notice that the only people saying that BJ isn’t paying taxes are morons and bullshitters, not BJ. 

Heres the SOE guide to FL election residence requirement. 

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf

 

2 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

He isn’t trying to vote at the last place he paid a property tax bill. Why would you suggest that?

Who says he has no association?  How do you know?

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf The guideline is 7 years old. Much has changed and municipalities have an obligation to purge their voter roles.

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5 minutes ago, warbird said:

 

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf The guideline is 7 years old. Much has changed and municipalities have an obligation to purge their voter roles.

Quote

Legal residence-Mobile. For a person with a nontraditional abode (e.g., boat, motor home, etc.) who intends and has presence in the county and intends for county to be residence county, acceptable addresses include: 1) the place where messages regularly received, 2) the general delivery address at a specific post office, or 3) the address for the campground or docking site (if mail is received there).

What do you get out of being a stupid fuck warbird? 

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19 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

You are entitled to your opinion. Florida law may not comport with that. See link below. 

I doubt that the purchaser of BJ’s House took title subject in fee simple subject to the sellers’ right to receive mail at the address. I myself thought about trying to secure easement rights to the front porch, because it was among the finest drinking spots on the east coast of the US, but thought better of it. 

You’ll notice that the only people saying that BJ isn’t paying taxes are morons and bullshitters, not BJ. 

Heres the SOE guide to FL election residence requirement. 

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf

Yeah it was just a general observation..What BJ does about his tax is non of my business.

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2 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

Yeah it was just a general observation..What BJ does about his tax is non of my business.

Nor is it mine, though his legal residence is the next county over. 

Without going into detail(s) I know a little bit about FL legal residence and the best evidence of it is where you say it is. That’s not just verbal, because as we see on this board, there are people who can tell you that the sun rises in the West. It means recording a Declaration of Domicile, or having a driver’s license, vehicle registration or other factors in the statutes. 

As far as taxes go, BJ is paying his share of property taxes by paying St. Brendans, pursuant to whatever agreement they have.  Those costs are baked in. That’s Capitalism at its finest. 

We all have our ideas about how it should be. Mine are certainly less popular than the present system, but that’s not what is driving this. I’d bet dollars to donuts that the absentee ballot count in Clay County is showing too many democRAT votes for any Good American’s liking. 

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4 hours ago, warbird said:

If he registers at the address he actually lived at he would have to "gasp" pay taxes!!!!!

What address would that be? I haven't set foot in the US since 2015.

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4 hours ago, warbird said:

Last place he paid a property tax bill?  Last place he was domiciled?  SCOTUS just ruled on purging voter roles. That might give you someguidance.

Last place I was "domiciled" legally was Florida, according to their laws.

I have as much connection to FL in 2018 as I do to RI.

You won't believe it, but my decision to use SBI mail was made before I knew the tax implications. There is no company with service like that in RI, I looked. States without income taxes are where mailing services tend to congregate.

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4 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

we talking about Tax or Voting?

Tax..pay direct to IRS.

Mailing adrress anywhere you chose..just don't link it with the other two.

Voting..the last place you lived for 5 years..or however many years it takes to become a US cit.

You should also have to come back once every ten years for jury duty.

Personally I think you should pay tax in the country you are resident in..and non of this "leave the country for XX days BS."

 

Rights come with responsibilities..or so I think.

They're talking about State income tax, not Federal. Each of the 50 states has individual income tax laws on top of federal.

The claim that I don't pay taxes is a lie. I pay Federal taxes, but Florida (like a handful of other states) does not collect income tax.

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3 hours ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

You are entitled to your opinion. Florida law may not comport with that. See link below. 

I doubt that the purchaser of BJ’s House took title subject in fee simple subject to the sellers’ right to receive mail at the address. I myself thought about trying to secure easement rights to the front porch, because it was among the finest drinking spots on the east coast of the US, but thought better of it. 

You’ll notice that the only people saying that BJ isn’t paying taxes are morons and bullshitters, not BJ. 

Heres the SOE guide to FL election residence requirement. 

https://soe.dos.state.fl.us/pdf/GuidelinesVoterResidencyUpdated.pdf

Hey, can I come live with you?

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3 hours ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Nor is it mine, though his legal residence is the next county over. 

Without going into detail(s) I know a little bit about FL legal residence and the best evidence of it is where you say it is. That’s not just verbal, because as we see on this board, there are people who can tell you that the sun rises in the West. It means recording a Declaration of Domicile, or having a driver’s license, vehicle registration or other factors in the statutes. 

As far as taxes go, BJ is paying his share of property taxes by paying St. Brendans, pursuant to whatever agreement they have.  Those costs are baked in. That’s Capitalism at its finest. 

We all have our ideas about how it should be. Mine are certainly less popular than the present system, but that’s not what is driving this. I’d bet dollars to donuts that the absentee ballot count in Clay County is showing too many democRAT votes for any Good American’s liking. 

I think it's this. I'm going to be in the area in a few weeks. I'm considering popping in to say hi to Mr. Chembliss.

My biggest concern is my daughter who turned 18 this year. She will probably have to register in Pennsylvania, unless the republicans there are trying to fuck the kids out of voting where they spent 2/3 of their lives and $50K+ a year like they always try to.

P.S. every Florida school that she applied to accepted her, and offered in-state tuition and money. Because you know, we meet the residency requirements and all.

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I have to confess I don't have much sympathy for your voting plight.

There's millions of potential voters disenfranchised across the USA.

Florida permanently disenfranchises convicted felons even after they've served all their sentence.

Many states intentionally retract the franchise from convicted felons, but differ as to when or if the franchise can be restored. In those states, felons are also prohibited from voting in federal elections, even if their convictions were for state crimes.

Maine and Vermont allow prison inmates as well as probationers and parolees to vote.[8]

Twenty states (Alaska, Arkansas, Georgia, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Texas, Washington, West Virginia, and Wisconsin) do not allow persons convicted of a felony to vote while serving a sentence, but automatically restore the franchise to the person upon completion of a sentence.[9] In Iowa, in July 2005, Governor Tom Vilsack issued an executive order restoring the right to vote for all persons who have completed supervision, which the Iowa Supreme Court upheld on October 31, 2005.[10]

Thirteen states (Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, New Hampshire, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Utah) plus the District of Columbia allow probationers and parolees to vote, but not inmates.[11]

Five states (California, Colorado, Connecticut, New York, and South Dakota) allow probationers to vote, but not inmates or parolees.[12]

Eight states (Alabama, Arizona, Delaware, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, Tennessee, and Wyoming) allow some, but not all, persons with felony convictions to vote after having completed their sentences.[13] Some have qualifications of this: for example, Delaware does not restore the franchise until five years after release of a person.[14] Similarly, Kentucky requires that the person take action to gain restoration of the franchise.[10]

Two states (Florida and Virginia) permanently disfranchise persons with felony convictions.[15]

About 6 million people could not vote in the last election.

that sucks

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5 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

I think he has to do that regardless.

They have State taxes on top of Federal - we don't (yet). My life would get more complex if we did unless it was apportioned by time in each State.

As a matter of observation from another forum the US State tax system is Byzantine and pretty much impossible to deal with honestly unless you have a *very* good accountant, I'm told. If your corporation does business in other States, there's sales tax but the kicker is, if you send an employee to another State to install equipment, consult, whatever, you owe *that* State a pro-rata income tax *and* some pro-rata corp tax.

Anyone who can avoid getting caught in this is doing the sensible thing IMO.

FKT

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5 hours ago, warbird said:

If he registers at the address he actually lived at he would have to "gasp" pay taxes!!!!!

Trump brags about not paying taxes: 'That makes me smart'

Donald Trump said he's "smart" by not paying income taxes — and argued that if he did, the money would be "squandered."

Trump's jaw-dropping statements came after Hillary Clinton launched a fiery attack on the Republican presidential nominee for breaking a four-decade tradition of White House aspirants releasing their federal income tax returns.

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3 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

They have State taxes on top of Federal - we don't (yet). My life would get more complex if we did unless it was apportioned by time in each State.

As a matter of observation from another forum the US State tax system is Byzantine and pretty much impossible to deal with honestly unless you have a *very* good accountant, I'm told. If your corporation does business in other States, there's sales tax but the kicker is, if you send an employee to another State to install equipment, consult, whatever, you owe *that* State a pro-rata income tax *and* some pro-rata corp tax.

Anyone who can avoid getting caught in this is doing the sensible thing IMO.

FKT

well we kind of do..stamp duty etc

Pisses me off that when a house is sold because of a court order..when you buy a smaller one you still have to pay stamp duty.

 

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1 minute ago, random said:

Trump brags about not paying taxes: 'That makes me smart'

Donald Trump said he's "smart" by not paying income taxes — and argued that if he did, the money would be "squandered."

Trump's jaw-dropping statements came after Hillary Clinton launched a fiery attack on the Republican presidential nominee for breaking a four-decade tradition of White House aspirants releasing their federal income tax returns.

Shhh..that little issue seems to have quietly died.

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5 hours ago, warbird said:

BJ moved his mailing address to avoid STATE taxes. The jurisdiction he moved to has a legitimate right (and obligation)to cleanse it's voter roles of nonresidents. 

FIFY.  Every US citizen who lives overseas is on the hook for Federal taxes, although at a reduced amount as the first $100K is exempt.

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11 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

well we kind of do..stamp duty etc

Pisses me off that when a house is sold because of a court order..when you buy a smaller one you still have to pay stamp duty.

 

And land tax for properties other than your permanent place of residence in at least some States.

Stamp duty is an outrage & was supposed to be abolished as part of the GST. Of course they quietly forgot about that.....

We *really* don't want USA style taxes here though - the concept of a personal property tax is enough to make my blood pressure elevate. And paying property tax on the guesstimated improved value/market value.

Back more or less on point the concept of a fixed address really needs to be re-examined. It's a bit of an antiquity for a lot of people nowadays. I could nominate any one of 3 places as mine and that doesn't include the boat. I'm really not sure what the proper thing to do about voting would be - possibly to assign everyone without a fixed address to the ACT or some other Federal enclave?

FKT

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7 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

And land tax for properties other than your permanent place of residence in at least some States.

Stamp duty is an outrage & was supposed to be abolished as part of the GST. Of course they quietly forgot about that.....

We *really* don't want USA style taxes here though - the concept of a personal property tax is enough to make my blood pressure elevate. And paying property tax on the guesstimated improved value/market value.

Back more or less on point the concept of a fixed address really needs to be re-examined. It's a bit of an antiquity for a lot of people nowadays. I could nominate any one of 3 places as mine and that doesn't include the boat. I'm really not sure what the proper thing to do about voting would be - possibly to assign everyone without a fixed address to the ACT or some other Federal enclave?

FKT

I actually don't mind paying tax in Oz..generally speaking it gets well spent.

What I do have bones with is other revenue raising exercises..like fines and stamp duty on  the property sale of your place of residence

This one size fits all system sucks..I get pinged for a parking infringement ..it costs me half a weeks wages.. The bloke down the road commits the same offence and its his or her equivalent to missing taking his kids to the footy.

The woman down the road..it's the food out of her and kids mouth for a week or two.

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

I actually don't mind paying tax in Oz..generally speaking it gets well spent.

What I do have bones with is other revenue raising exercises..like fines and stamp duty on  the property sale of your place of residence

This one size fits all system sucks..I get pinged for a parking infringement ..it costs me half a weeks wages.. The bloke down the road commits the same offence and its his or her equivalent to missing taking his kids to the footy.

Move to Hobart. After Sydney, the first time I got a parking fine, I looked at it & thought 'Is this some type of joke? $8??? I pay more than that an hour in Sydney'.

Alas, the fines have increased - but so have Sydney's. As I have a Gold Opal card because I'm ancient <smirk> I travel everywhere by public transport for $2.50 for the entire day.

And yeah, I don't go to any extent to max out my tax deductions. I earn reasonable money when I do some consulting, I just pay the tax and claim the big items back.

FKT

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1 minute ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Move to Hobart. After Sydney, the first time I got a parking fine, I looked at it & thought 'Is this some type of joke? $8??? I pay more than that an hour in Sydney'.

Alas, the fines have increased - but so have Sydney's. As I have a Gold Opal card because I'm ancient <smirk> I travel everywhere by public transport for $2.50 for the entire day.

And yeah, I don't go to any extent to max out my tax deductions. I earn reasonable money when I do some consulting, I just pay the tax and claim the big items back.

FKT

cost me $800 to get my car back..parked it outside my own house..took dog for walk..GONE. Clearway from 4.30 PM :(

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16 minutes ago, Shootist Jeff said:

FIFY.  Every US citizen who lives overseas is on the hook for Federal taxes, although at a reduced amount as the first $100K is exempt.

Aaaaand you should know JB.  Land of the free doesn't pay well does it.

How are things going working for the Arabs?  The guys who did 9/11?

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6 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

you register at the address you had when you lived here.

That makes as much sense as anything when it comes to deciding where in the US someone like BJ lives. He doesn't.

 

27 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

We *really* don't want USA style taxes here though - the concept of a personal property tax is enough to make my blood pressure elevate. And paying property tax on the guesstimated improved value/market value.

Really? Doesn't bother me a bit. We own land in lots of FL counties and the appraisers are generally close but a bit low on value.

It seems to me that many govt services revolve around protecting my property rights. That's a good thing. Who should pay for those services? How about: property owners!

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13 minutes ago, random said:
31 minutes ago, Shootist Jeff said:

FIFY.  Every US citizen who lives overseas is on the hook for Federal taxes, although at a reduced amount as the first $100K is exempt.

Aaaaand you should know JB.  Land of the free doesn't pay well does it.

How are things going working for the Arabs?  The guys who did 9/11?

Its actually going great.  Thanks for asking.  I've never done so much sailing and racing in my life.  Whooda thunk I would have to come to the middle east to get back into regular racing at a high level?

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1 minute ago, Shootist Jeff said:

Its actually going great.  Thanks for asking.  I've never done so much sailing and racing in my life.  Whooda thunk I would have to come to the middle east to get back into regular racing at a high level?

Some people change sides for a $.  The rest of us have morals.

But even IBM made systems for the Nazis to track Jews.  You are continuing a great American tradition,  You should be proud.

BTW not sure about the "high-level" part.

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2 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

Hey, can I come live with you?

Yup. I have a guest house. Putnam County is even more fun than Clay. 

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2 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

I have to confess I don't have much sympathy for your voting plight.

There's millions of potential voters disenfranchised across the USA.

Florida permanently disenfranchises convicted felons even after they've served all their sentence.

Many states intentionally retract the franchise from convicted felons, but differ as to when or if the franchise can be restored. In those states, felons are also prohibited from voting in federal elections, even if their convictions were for state crimes.

Maine and Vermont allow prison inmates as well as probationers and parolees to vote.[8]

Twenty states (Alaska, Arkansas, Georgia, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Texas, Washington, West Virginia, and Wisconsin) do not allow persons convicted of a felony to vote while serving a sentence, but automatically restore the franchise to the person upon completion of a sentence.[9] In Iowa, in July 2005, Governor Tom Vilsack issued an executive order restoring the right to vote for all persons who have completed supervision, which the Iowa Supreme Court upheld on October 31, 2005.[10]

Thirteen states (Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, New Hampshire, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Utah) plus the District of Columbia allow probationers and parolees to vote, but not inmates.[11]

Five states (California, Colorado, Connecticut, New York, and South Dakota) allow probationers to vote, but not inmates or parolees.[12]

Eight states (Alabama, Arizona, Delaware, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, Tennessee, and Wyoming) allow some, but not all, persons with felony convictions to vote after having completed their sentences.[13] Some have qualifications of this: for example, Delaware does not restore the franchise until five years after release of a person.[14] Similarly, Kentucky requires that the person take action to gain restoration of the franchise.[10]

Two states (Florida and Virginia) permanently disfranchise persons with felony convictions.[15]

About 6 million people could not vote in the last election.

that sucks

Read about caging lists. The GOP in Florida is great at making sure the wrong people face great difficulty exercising their right to vote. 

And don’t get me started about the disenfranchisement of corporations, our Best Citizens. 

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1 hour ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

That makes as much sense as anything when it comes to deciding where in the US someone like BJ lives. He doesn't.

 

Really? Doesn't bother me a bit. We own land in lots of FL counties and the appraisers are generally close but a bit low on value.

It seems to me that many govt services revolve around protecting my property rights. That's a good thing. Who should pay for those services? How about: property owners!

We pay local government taxes (rates) on the assessed *unimproved* capital value of the land, and this is re-assessed periodically. This stops the (IMO) ridiculous situation that Tom Colvin once explained to me about his workshop, where if he put in a concrete floor that would trigger a tax reassessment upwards but a gravel floor didn't. That's as bad/idiotic as the window taxes that used to apply, maybe they still do.

I don't mind paying local govt taxes as they generally provide reasonable services, though in some cases I do regard paying as 'stay away from me' money.

FKT

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1 hour ago, random said:

Some people change sides for a $.  The rest of us have morals.

But even IBM made systems for the Nazis to track Jews.  You are continuing a great American tradition,  You should be proud.

BTW not sure about the "high-level" part.

Changed sides???  I haven't changed sides.  I still ultimately work for the same master as I did before I arrived over here.  I'm just getting paid a bit better and not having to go live in shitholes for months at a time.  

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12 hours ago, B.J. Porter said:

Saorsa's wet dream. They're coming after people like me.

Problem is...you have to live somewhere. You can't not have a "residence" and participate in things like banking. Or voting - you have to be registered somewhere, and we've complied with all the laws.

Specifically Clay County is targetting one business which they may destroy if the Supervisor of Elections gets his way.

https://www.passagemaker.com/trawler-news/liveaboard-voting-rights-threatened-florida

So what. Hillary would have lost anyway. Get over it.

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2 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

I have to confess I don't have much sympathy for your voting plight.

There's millions of potential voters disenfranchised across the USA.

Florida permanently disenfranchises convicted felons even after they've served all their sentence.

Many states intentionally retract the franchise from convicted felons, but differ as to when or if the franchise can be restored. In those states, felons are also prohibited from voting in federal elections, even if their convictions were for state crimes.

Maine and Vermont allow prison inmates as well as probationers and parolees to vote.[8]

Twenty states (Alaska, Arkansas, Georgia, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Texas, Washington, West Virginia, and Wisconsin) do not allow persons convicted of a felony to vote while serving a sentence, but automatically restore the franchise to the person upon completion of a sentence.[9] In Iowa, in July 2005, Governor Tom Vilsack issued an executive order restoring the right to vote for all persons who have completed supervision, which the Iowa Supreme Court upheld on October 31, 2005.[10]

Thirteen states (Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, New Hampshire, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Utah) plus the District of Columbia allow probationers and parolees to vote, but not inmates.[11]

Five states (California, Colorado, Connecticut, New York, and South Dakota) allow probationers to vote, but not inmates or parolees.[12]

Eight states (Alabama, Arizona, Delaware, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, Tennessee, and Wyoming) allow some, but not all, persons with felony convictions to vote after having completed their sentences.[13] Some have qualifications of this: for example, Delaware does not restore the franchise until five years after release of a person.[14] Similarly, Kentucky requires that the person take action to gain restoration of the franchise.[10]

Two states (Florida and Virginia) permanently disfranchise persons with felony convictions.[15]

About 6 million people could not vote in the last election.

that sucks

What felony did I commit again?

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5 minutes ago, Mickey Rat said:

So what. Hillary would have lost anyway. Get over it.

Dosvedana, comrade. Der fuhrer had a bit of help, you treasonous twat.

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2 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

What felony did I commit again?

Well, you are a democRAT, and you haven’t taken a vow of poverty, for one. 

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1 minute ago, B.J. Porter said:

What felony did I commit again?

 

2 minutes ago, B.J. Porter said:

What felony did I commit again?

 

Non,,but as I understand it you can register to vote elsewhere unlike the 6 millions I mentioned above...or maybe they can move state too?

Dunno.

maybe you could offer to swap their home for yours?

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1 minute ago, B.J. Porter said:

Dosvedana, comrade. Der fuhrer had a bit of help, you treasonous twat.

Did you just call Hillary a treasonous twat? <_<

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21 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

This stops the (IMO) ridiculous situation that Tom Colvin once explained to me about his workshop, where if he put in a concrete floor that would trigger a tax reassessment upwards but a gravel floor didn't.

This is funny to me because my 40 x 30 Boatport will be installed this week.

In this part of the county, I can put a "pole barn" anywhere without permission. And "pole barn" can be defined pretty broadly.

But I want to push my boats around on concrete. Even out here in the woods, any concrete pad larger than 3 x 3 feet requires a permit. And, you guessed it, triggers an assessment.

It's not all that ridiculous. The assessment is because the property is more valuable if I put concrete. And since I was willing to wait months and pay lots for that concrete, that's pretty Eva Dently true.

BoatportPad.jpg

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NRA paying for that shed?

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24 minutes ago, Mickey Rat said:

Did you just call Hillary a treasonous twat? <_<

MickeyRattrump.jpg.738673ff474ed84ee529aa8554f79c73.jpg

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50 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

 

 

Non,,but as I understand it you can register to vote elsewhere unlike the 6 millions I mentioned above...or maybe they can move state too?

Dunno.

maybe you could offer to swap their home for yours?

WTF is wrong with you? You think any voter suppression is fine because felons can't vote?

Republicans: We will make this new requirement to vote that requires going to an office that is at the far corner of the state with no public transportation and is only open on Thursday.

Poor people: This sucks, we can't vote.

Meli: STFU, felons can't vote either, quit whinging or move to the other end of the state.

 

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um..i was talking about felons..and it's not me whinging..i'm confused now.

I though we were talking about this

https://www.passagemaker.com/trawler-news/liveaboard-voting-rights-threatened-florida

BJ doesn't live in st Brendans..never did AFAIK..so why should he be able to vote there?

It's distorting the electoral process.

BJ's not actually having his vote suppressed, he's being told to register where he lives..or wherever he legally can..I's kind of offensive to lump him in with the homeless. 

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9 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

As a point of fact, you don't reside at that address and never have resided there. So what you're objecting to is them trying to apply reality rather than accept a fiction. I frankly don't think you've a legitimate complaint at all. Yes I understand how this complicates life and that you need a mailing address. If this still works for other stuff...?

I'm not sure how Australia handles such things for itinerants, but it'd be interesting to know. I *do* know because there have been a few recent cases on point that registering a bunch of people as living at an address where they don't actually live is classed as electoral fraud, can be prosecuted and will be prosecuted. As I have 3 properties in 2 different states, I tend to regard my address as somewhat 'flexible'. I can still only have one for issue of a driver's licence though it can be a PO Box.

FKT

FKT puts it better.

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Meli - you have to "live" SOMEPLACE in the USA. You can't vote if you have no state registration. There is no "federal" voter registration. You really have no clue how this works and should STFU.

 

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4 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

Meli - you have to "live" SOMEPLACE in the USA. You can't vote if you have no state registration. There is no "federal" voter registration.

 

For voting purposes, your state of legal residence is generally the state where you resided immediately before leaving the United States, even if you no longer own or rent property or intend to return in the future

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/international-travel/while-abroad/voting.html

 

Most U.S. citizens 18 years or older who reside outside the United States are eligible to vote absentee for federal office candidates in U.S. primary and general elections. In addition, some states allow overseas citizens to vote for state and local office candidates and referendums. For information about your specific state, visit the FVAP Voting Assistance Guide or the Overseas Vote Foundation website. The Overseas Vote Foundation is a non-partisan voter advocacy organization.

For voting purposes, your state of legal residence is generally the state where you resided immediately before leaving the United States, even if you no longer own or rent property or intend to return in the future. Twenty-four states and the District of Columbia specifically allow U.S. citizens who have never resided in the United States to register where a parent would be eligible to vote. Direct your questions about eligibility to local election officials.

Start by submitting a Federal Post Card Application (FPCA) on the Federal Voting Assistance Program (FVAP) website, FVAP.gov, or the Overseas Vote Foundation website overseasvotefoundation.org. Use the online assistant and carefully follow the instructions for your state to receive a ballot. Include accurate contact details in case there is a problem.

IMPORTANT: U.S. citizens abroad must submit a new Federal Post Card Application (FPCA) each year to vote in U.S. elections. Submit your FPCA at the beginning of the calendar year, or at least 45 days before an election, to allow ample time to process your request and resolve any problems. Once approved, your name will be put on a list of voters to receive absentee ballots.

For more information see:

  • Absentee Voting Basics
  • Registration/Absentee Ballot Request
  • Receiving Your Blank Absentee Ballot
  • Voting and Returning Your Ballot
  • 0.gifUsing an Emergency Write-In Ballot
  • Verifying Your Registration
  • Role of Local Election Officials
  • Be an Educated Voter
  • Voting and Taxes

You are incorrect..even homeless people can vote.

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We fucking KNOW THAT

It does not help one bit. There might not be a residence/forwarding service in that state, which BJ hasn't lived in for years anyway. Their voter registration officials can decide the exact same thing the Florida ones did - why let this guy register, he isn't even here.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

We fucking KNOW THAT

It does not help one bit. There might not be a residence/forwarding service in that state, which BJ hasn't lived in for years anyway. Their voter registration officials can decide the exact same thing the Florida ones did - why let this guy register, he isn't even here.

 

 

and quite rightly so. Why should a person registering for convenience be allowed to vote where he has no engagement or interest and actually cancel our anothers vote? 

You guys have a really warped idea of voting convention and integrity 

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2 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

and quite rightly so. Why should a person registering for convenience be allowed to vote where he has no engagement or interest and actually cancel our anothers vote? 

You guys have a really warped idea of voting convention and integrity 

 


THERE IS NO OTHER WAY

It would make a ton of sense for there to be an overseas federal only ballot system - but there is no such thing. Are you really this dense?

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5 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

God you are stupid.
THERE IS NO OTHER WAY

then dont fucking vote!!

as a player in my own community, i'd be rightly pissed off if some itinerent on a boat, 3 or 15,000 km away had the means to cancel my vote.

And don't call ME stupid because you arrange yourselves a lifestyle that jeopardizes your voting rights.:rolleyes:

Fix your system if it doesn't suite. 

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USA citizens have to pay income tax no matter where they live in the world. We do not get to just "opt out" of the system.

All voting is done through states. There is no federal voting system.

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Just now, kent_island_sailor said:

This is the exact Republican line. Arrange your lifestyle to vote. Sure we closed the MVA office in the hood, but you all can drive somewhere else, right?

OH puleeze..you're equating your situation with those that have been genuinely disenfranchised for political skulduggery?

People like you and BJ choose to a sail away from your electoral zone, you ain;t stuck half way to no where and had your poling booth closed.

The entitled class never fail to disgust..that's why trump won 

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Just now, Shortforbob said:

OH puleeze..you're equating your situation with those that have been genuinely disenfranchised for political skulduggery?

People like you and BJ choose to a sail away from your electoral zone, you ain;t stuck half way to no where and had your poling booth closed.

The entitled class never fail to disgust..that's why trump won 

I live on an island and my polling place is a 10 minute walk. WTF are you talking about?

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6 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

USA citizens have to pay income tax no matter where they live in the world. We do not get to just "opt out" of the system.

All voting is done through states. There is no federal voting system.

Really? Go away , your making me cry.

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2 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

I live on an island and my polling place is a 10 minute walk. WTF are you talking about?

I'd stop digging If I were you.

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15 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

and quite rightly so. Why should a person registering for convenience be allowed to vote where he has no engagement or interest and actually cancel our anothers vote? 

You guys have a really warped idea of voting convention and integrity 

Not really

Same kind of thing happened here back in the 1980s (Senator Jesse Helms) and again in the aughts .......  thousands and thousands of young people using address of convenience and registered to vote....... originally the vote suppressors weren't concerned because they assumed the military would vote overwhelmingly Republican.

Party-affiliated voting officials caught red-handed throwing military absentee ballots in the dumpster, oh my

-DSK

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2 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

i'm confused now.

FIFY

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6 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Not really

Same kind of thing happened here back in the 1980s (Senator Jesse Helms) and again in the aughts .......  thousands and thousands of young people using address of convenience and registered to vote....... originally the vote suppressors weren't concerned because they assumed the military would vote overwhelmingly Republican.

Party-affiliated voting officials caught red-handed throwing military absentee ballots in the dumpster, oh my

-DSK

I'm simply saying that you should only be allowed to vote where you have an interest in the outcome. Otherwise you caneling out a legitimate residents vote.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

I'm simply saying that you should only be allowed to vote where you have an interest in the outcome. Otherwise you caneling out a legitimate residents vote.

 

 

Should only landowners be allowed to vote?  

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

I'm simply saying that you should only be allowed to vote where you have an interest in the outcome. Otherwise you caneling out a legitimate residents vote.

 

 

And I'm saying that Mrs Steam and I _ARE_ legitimate residents, and by a reasonable standard so are military personnel, and so is BJ.

If he were a felon, or attempting to vote in more than one location, you'd have a gripe.

-DSK

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Just now, Sol Rosenberg said:

Should only landowners be allowed to vote?  

don't be silly Sol.

 

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Just now, Shortforbob said:

don't be silly Sol.

 

I’m not. That seems to be where you are going with this. 

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16 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Should only landowners be allowed to vote?  

Given the abject stupidity of the masses, There's a small part of me who thinks this wasn't such a bad idea.  But only a small part.

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6 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:

FIFY.  Every US citizen who lives overseas is on the hook for Federal taxes, although at a reduced amount as the first $100K is exempt.

I meant  the taxes all the rest of us pay into the community we vote in. Property(addressed above) sales, garbage, water, fuel, electricity, licences  etc.

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51 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Should only landowners be allowed to vote?  

President Adams thought so.  That progressive rabble rouser Thomas Paine swayed public opinion and the future of the country was changed.    Paine wasn’t very popular with religious and conservatives of his day and wouldn’t be with current Republicans.  Take comfort @B.J. Porter, he was denied the right to vote as well.   His obituary read in part:   “He had lived long, did some good, and much harm".   Two of his six mourners were freed black men.  

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22 minutes ago, warbird said:

I meant  the taxes all the rest of us pay into the community we vote in. Property(addressed above) sales, garbage, water, fuel, electricity, licences  etc.

The addresses of convenience for military disproves the relevancy of your argument.   

If you have mansions in multiple states you can register in several, like Trump’s daughter, and vote in the location of your choice.  https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2017-01-25/tiffany-trump-steve-bannon-steve-mnuchin-registered-to-vote-in-multiple-states%3fcontext=amp

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

I'm simply saying that you should only be allowed to vote where you have an interest in the outcome. Otherwise you caneling out a legitimate residents vote.

 

 

I assume you want to ban homeless people from voting. Where the hell do they live?

How about renters - they don't pay property tax, why the hell should they get to vote on how it gets spent.

Meli, you are not from here and really haven't the slightest clue WTF you are talking about. At various times my job has had me moving around so much I never "lived" anywhere for more than a few weeks. Guess what - I am still a citizen and still made sure I put my vote in. People died for this right and we take it seriously.

Legally the FAA required me to have an address for my pilot's license. Likewise for my passport, driver's license, etc etc. You CAN'T just "not live anywhere" if you want to have a job, bank account, or anything else a normal functional adult has.

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