PIL66

WTB Wind / Speed / Depth Intruments / GPS

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Sorry if it's been done to death...(i did search)

I'm wanting to buy Wind / Speed / Depth instruments for a 38ft race multi

I like the sound of wireless (and not having to pull the rig out to fit)

I'm looking at best bang for buck (even second hand)

Consider I may need a repeater for one of the hulls .....

For the Plotter ... do  i just get an Ipad ...?   

I'm in Sydney so who to buy from and who to fit it all...?

All advice is appreciated

Pil

 

 

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The boss doesn't have a few containers full of stuff you could have? 

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Also interested in this. Rotating mast.

 

What about auto-pilot - connected to the GPS? 

 

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11 hours ago, SCANAS said:

The boss doesn't have a few containers full of stuff you could have? 

Yes he does but it's all BIG boat displays and to be honest, it's all a bit to hard.... I'm looking for fairly basic ground floor stuff...

I have a guy offering me the clipper wireless range from nasa (3-5 years old) but I read it has many faults so I might steer away from it

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Go Raymarine wireless. You can interface with the axiom / axiom pro plotter and bring up all your data on the plotter screen as well as your dedicated wind screens. I believe ou can also use an iPad to control it all and as a repeater as well.

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18 hours ago, F15 AUS said:

Go Raymarine wireless. You can interface with the axiom / axiom pro plotter and bring up all your data on the plotter screen as well as your dedicated wind screens. I believe ou can also use an iPad to control it all and as a repeater as well.

Thanks... I worry about touch screens due to how wet the boat and my hands are. I hear they don't like to work well with wet hands.  

The wireless Raymarine / Tactic gear looks good

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4 hours ago, PIL66 said:

Thanks... I worry about touch screens due to how wet the boat and my hands are. I hear they don't like to work well with wet hands. 

Correct worry - I use a touchy tablet & it is a pain when fingers are wet ... find towel, scub like crazy, still only half contacts ... yada yada

But it and its apps are very convenient when works right

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7 hours ago, PIL66 said:

Thanks... I worry about touch screens due to how wet the boat and my hands are. I hear they don't like to work well with wet hands.  

The wireless Raymarine / Tactic gear looks good

The axiom touch screens work when wet (the rep threw one in the sink and it worked under water)

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7 hours ago, PIL66 said:

Thanks... I worry about touch screens due to how wet the boat and my hands are. I hear they don't like to work well with wet hands.  

The wireless Raymarine / Tactic gear looks good

I like the Raymarine wireless.. it all works great.. except for my mast rotation transmitter.

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Seeing this is sort of on topic, what is the feed back on B&G chartplotters? Specifically https://www.bandg.com/bg/type/chartplotter/vulcan-7r-no-xd/

Looks like a good deal as I see them for $399 at Defender https://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?path=-1|344|2028688|2028741&id=3214513

Thinking of upgrading from my Raymarine A50

 

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I've decided after chatting to many... I'll wait till the boat show in 3 weeks and make a decision... The Ray wireless is in the lead but B & G have a new wireless so we will see

I do like that Plotter Inneedof... thanks

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On Indian Chief i had a plotter mounted in each hull hatch facing the stern. worked great, bit of an outlay but longterm delight. an iPad is great so long as it doesn't get wet.

chief8881.jpeg

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I spent $400 on a tablet and loaded Navionics on it. Put it in a waterproof pouch  and the touch screen worked through the pouch.

I even put several layers of coloured cellophane over the tablet, inside the pouch,  to further cut light output for night vision and the touch screen still worked through all that.

Works OK for navigation and speed because of the GPS function but  a fully integrated system with wind speed etc would be nice.

 

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45 minutes ago, SeaGul said:

Any good solutions for wind/rotating mast?

On the advice from Peter at Osprey Technical and with help from Matt @ B&G I installed a Honeywell sensor (SPS-A100) onto Freshly Squeezed. It wires directly into an analog input port in the H5000 cpu.

It appears to be the same sensor used by lcj - http://www.lcjcapteurs.com/product/capteur-dangle-mat-rotatif-2/

At under 200 euro it was by far the cheapest solution I could find and with no linkage or moving parts it seems pretty elegant. Very early days ( only launched recently ) but so far so good.

 

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Yes something like that would work - but some montage challenges. 

 

Does it work to only use GPS data for wind? The boat moves almost in the direction of the bow - just minor drift - specially when moving fast. 

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I faced a similar decision recently for a 27ft racing cat (36ft rotating mast) that had existing minimal Raymarine / Tacktick wireless instruments (depth, speed log, Racemaster compass), but nothing else.

Starting with rotating mast considerations, since those limit options very fast (though not relevant to PIL66). In order of price, the options are:

(1) No mast rotation compensation -- use a standard wind transducer and focus on apparent wind speed (does not require correction), and angle relative to mast (instead of relative to boat).  Multis are apparent wind boats so this works very well upwind (pretty easy to deduce true wind, and easy to set reefing rules like reef to 2nd reef at 32kts AWS), and also works well for angles downwind (though hard to tell true wind speed when off the wind).  Did this on Top Gun for years, happy with it.  But none of the fancy layline or other modern plotter calcs work since you don't have true wind (though if really needed to get true wind say at night, you can always center your mast).

(2) Raymarine Tacktick wireless -- going to try this on our 27ft cat.  Rotation sensor alone costs US$710. It's not clear what else you need -- you need a compass and wind transducer obviously, but Raymarine help forum suggested you might be able to use non-wireless and perhaps even non-Raymarine compass + wind transducer, so long as you pipe that data into the wireless network (via the Raymarine Microtalk wireless gateway).  You also need at least 1 Raymarine wireless multi-function display to calibrate the wireless network (multi-funciton display is key -- wind display with the wind arrow does not handle calibration...).   I'm not sure where is the "brains" that does the rotation calculations --  in the rotation sensor, or in the digital display?

I'm going to give it a shot soon with a hybrid setup, but I don't know if it will work: Raymarine wireless mast rotation sensor (new, still need to buy), Racemaster compass (existing, should also serve as digital display for calibration), B&G 608 wired wind transducer (more affordable than wireless, and no bad connection risks) via NMEA 2000, Raymarine Microtalk wireless gateway (to let B&G and Raymarine talk to each other).  If all new, expect to spend US$2000-2200+ just for this, but at least you get a compass and display.

(3) LCJ capteurs LCJ-C-RM ultrasonic wired transducer ($1500) plus separate mast rotation sensor like the Honeywell gurok mentioned. US$1700 total.  No display or compass included, interfaces with other instruments via NMEA 2000.  Some question-marks on how well an ultrasonic wired transducer performs -- my guess is ok, so this was tempting.

(4) B&G Hercules (H5000, or old H3000) processor with one of the Honeywell rotation sensors (or a B&G rudder angle feedback sensor that can also be used to measure mast angle), plus a B&G wired wind transducer.  Opens up advanced calibration, but very quickly well above US$3000 and you are locked into a Hercules system....


My favorite solution above all of the above was actually a Nexus server plus mast rotation compass, generally similar to Raymarine approach, but with much better calibration options.  However after Garmin bought Nexus, they appear to have deprecated the mast rotation compass and it is now impossible to find...  The Nexus gear doesn't have great lifespan, so even if I found a mast rotation compass today, I'd be very reluctant to go down this path without knowing that I could ever find a replacement compass if needed.

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One more non-trivial consideration if you plan to lift a hull regularly: for true wind calculation, you need good boat speed calcs (regardless of rotating or fixed mast).  Most instrument systems and chartplotters use the boat's log as speed source, which is fine for a monohulls, but much less good for a multihull...

This is specifically a beef I have against Raymarine -- neither the wireless instrument range nor their Axxiom plotters allow the user to modify the speed source to GPS speed.  Garmin, B&G do not have this problem.  That's why I'm aiming for a hybrid solution where Raymarine wireless system with mast rotation sensor provides the corrected AWA (using B&G wind transducer input AWA relative to mast, and AWS), but then send that back to a B&G Vulcan plotter that calculates TWS/TWA with GPS speed as a source.

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10 hours ago, galacticair said:

My favorite solution above all of the above was actually a Nexus server plus mast rotation compass, generally similar to Raymarine approach, but with much better calibration options.  However after Garmin bought Nexus, they appear to have deprecated the mast rotation compass and it is now impossible to find...  The Nexus gear doesn't have great lifespan, so even if I found a mast rotation compass today, I'd be very reluctant to go down this path without knowing that I could ever find a replacement compass if needed.

To my surprise West Marine is still listing the "Nexus MRC Box (mast rotation compensation)" on their site.  So maybe Nexus is still an option -- I'm going to ask Garmin customer service to understand if those are still being manufactured... (none of the other usual marine electronics sites lists it as available)

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iPad with Navionics is fantastic as a trip planner and for creating waypoints and stuff - but the hardware is just not 'marine proof' for a wet boat or exposed area.

I used one on the cruising cat for nearly 12 months, in a waterproof pouch, and it was pretty good - until it wasn't.  Navigating south on that 'lovely' stretch of the Gold Coast between Jacobs Well to Boatworks turnoff, 35 degree sunny afternoon - iPad decides it is too hot out there and shuts down!  Had to put it inside out of the sun, where it was obviously useless, and had to rely on the fantastic channel markers in that area to complete the journey...

Got to Boatworks and spent 2 boat dollars on a Raymarine E7D and have loved it over the past 5 years.  Syncs with the iPad, works despite the weather, knobs plus touchscreen for when things get drenched, and put the Sonar sender in the other hull so I now have depth source in both hulls - never thought this would be of any use, other than for fishing, but have had a few narrow channels now where it has been very useful.

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