blastoff

dry seals on foul weather gear for non-volvo ocean race sailing: stupid?

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Hi All -

I currently ave some decent henri lloyd phoenix salopettes in great condition.  Also have a basic henry lloyd dinghy smock (no hood).

Had a kind of crappy no name full foul weather jacket with hood and high collar.  It's ripped and done.  Looking for new foul weather jacket or smock, and better quality without breaking the bank.

Not 100% sure what my sailing will look like now as recently moved.  But, in past has been something like 1 mackinac, and maybe one other distance race a year (then other short course big-boat and dinghy stuff).  Newport-Bermuda probably the longest race potentially on my radar, but who knows.  I do whatever job on the boat, but was main bow guy for past 5 years.  Don't have a new boat yet.  For coastal day stuff, I am fine with what I have now.   But, I need something with a higher collar, decent quality fabric, and hood as a real foul weather jacket.

I found a deal on some high quality stuff that has latex seals for arms and maybe even neck.  It would otherwise be ideal.   Good fabric and quality and good price.   But, I'm not going around the world or crossing the southern ocean here...

Question is:  How stupid/annoying (or good.useful) would having latex dry seals on arms and neck be on a race like a mackinac?? 

Some years I imagine it would be great.  But most years would be stupid.  If it matters, I tend to pack a pair of bibs, and then really light rain jacket, and then full foul weather top + a couple layers.

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Properly trimmed and maintained, there's nothing annoying about dry suit seals on foul weather gear except that you're sealed in and that can lead to excessive moisture in the bag due to perspiration.

It really depends no prevailing conditions, position and the boat. Sailing a fresh water race as navigator on a 40' 5 knot boat could be shorts and t-shirt. Move to an offshore race as bow on a supermaxi and the same conditions could easily call for a full dry suit.

Since you don't say anything about conditions, position or boat there's not much that can really be said.

 

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Thought I mentioned some of this throughout post, but to be clearer.  In past...

Prior boats: 40 foot range.  Something like J111, Ben 40.7, J133 or similar most likely.

Conditions:  Races in past were mainly mackinac for distance stuff.  So, some years that is shorts and a t-shirt for any position on the boat.  Some years wet and windy the whole way.  Not crossing oceans. 

Position:  A mix, but did bow in past on boats.  Assume one of wetter positions on the boat.  

Recently moved, so not 100% certain what exactly future racing will be.

But let's say bow guy on a 40 foot boat in a mackinac.  Would latex dry seals be annoying?

Sounds like not too bad for comfort to wear for awhile, just a little hotter inside due to breathing and maybe a little more of a pain to get on?

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Annoying compared to what?

Compared to getting soaked to the skin at 2AM when you're freezing cold and annoyed with yet-another stupid call from the back of the boat to do a silly change - probably not.

Seriously, you don't really know what or where you're sailing, so it's difficult to choose layers - next-to-skin, mid or outer. Foul weather gear deteriorates on the shelf, latex seals as quickly as neoprene. I'd suggest you hold off on purchases until you know what you need and then buy the best you can afford.

 

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Velcro seals are good enough for most applications I think.

 

If you're not often thinking "wow I really wish I had latex seals right now" you probably don't need them.

 

HW

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7 hours ago, Haligonian Winterr said:

Velcro seals are good enough for most applications I think.

 

If you're not often thinking "wow I really wish I had latex seals right now" you probably don't need them.

 

HW

I agree.  I don't need them.

Just a good deal on a new offshore smock with Gore-Tex in latex seals made me consider...

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I have not used a offshore jacket with seals, but have used a gortex surface sport drysuit. The seals are noticable at first, but after a few mins you don't even think about them. I had no trouble with 6-8 hours of use. The issue is they do not ventilate  at all so the breathable fabric is very important. 

If the offshore smock is a great deal why not pick it up for snotty weather, and get an inexpensive lightweight one for other times. For light use hiking or ski shells are fine and tend to be less expensive than boat stuff. There should be lots of end of the camping/hinking season sales now.

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I had a HPX smock with the latex seals and I found it to be overkill for nearly every occasion. I opted to sell that and get a HL Ocean smock which is very similiar except it has velcro seals on wrists and neck. I find this to be much better for all sorts of conditions.

My 2c.

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18 hours ago, Next Level said:

I had a HPX smock with the latex seals and I found it to be overkill for nearly every occasion. I opted to sell that and get a HL Ocean smock which is very similiar except it has velcro seals on wrists and neck. I find this to be much better for all sorts of conditions.

My 2c.

Thanks.  I suspected this is correct for me. Just needed to hear it I think!  Appreciate the feedback.

 

On somewhat related topic (maybe I need should start new thread?). Any thoughts on Henry Lloyd tp3 fabric?

 

There was an old thread from maybe 10 years ago about different fabrics, but haven't seen much sense.

 

 

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1 hour ago, blastoff said:

Thanks.  I suspected this is correct for me. Just needed to hear it I think!  Appreciate the feedback.

 

On somewhat related topic (maybe I need should start new thread?). Any thoughts on Henry Lloyd tp3 fabric?

 

There was an old thread from maybe 10 years ago about different fabrics, but haven't seen much sense.

 

 

I like HL and have a  HL dry smock too with the latex seals but I think its TP2. I really like it. Very lightweight but it fits well and keeps the water out.

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I like to take both a dinghy smock and jacket when I'm offshore. I find it to be a good compromise for those watches where you can be sweating your ass off one minute and freezing cold the next all while trying to stay dry. A dinghy smock takes up little room in your bag but can be real handy to keep the water out. I quite often wear it underneath my jacket, that way I can ditch the jacket if I'm dancing on the foredeck working up a sweat. Then when the party is over I throw the jacket back over the top so I can hide in shame behind the collar and hood. Preferably a different colour so the owner doesn't recognise it was me that created the monumental clusterfuck on the foredeck. 

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17 hours ago, Oscar Whitbread said:

I like to take both a dinghy smock and jacket when I'm offshore. I find it to be a good compromise for those watches where you can be sweating your ass off one minute and freezing cold the next all while trying to stay dry. A dinghy smock takes up little room in your bag but can be real handy to keep the water out. I quite often wear it underneath my jacket, that way I can ditch the jacket if I'm dancing on the foredeck working up a sweat. Then when the party is over I throw the jacket back over the top so I can hide in shame behind the collar and hood. Preferably a different colour so the owner doesn't recognise it was me that created the monumental clusterfuck on the foredeck. 

Yeah.  I like this too.  I have an OK dinghy smock with velcro seals.  Collar isn't 100% impervious to water, but it's pretty good.  Henri lloyd TP1 thing.  Maybe I read a post of yours here awhile ago that gave me the idea for this combo.  I'll often sleep in the smock if not super hot and then just pop-up and do the work and go back down and not be too wet.  Works well.  Then jacket if need to hunker down on the rail or cold.

I should probably just get something like a GIllOS23 jacket.   ....Just hard to turn down Gore Tex Pro material (w dry seals smock) at the same price.   All else equal an MPX jacket would be perfect, but I'd prefer to save a couple bucks if I can find a deal.

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Yep, I normally sleep in the smock too, works great on boats that are just as wet down below as above. Plus as you said, you are ready to roll if you need to be on deck in a hurry for any reason. I don't find it an issue doubling up waterproof layers and having it affect the "breathability" aspect. At some point you are still going to drown in your own sweat no matter what you are wearing and base layers these days are so good at keeping you warm even if you are soaking wet.

If possible find gear that you can physically try on or ask if you can try other crewmates gear for size. Zip it all up, jump around, stand up, sit down, smash out a few windmills and squats, look like a complete fucktard. Nothing worse than a jacket that is slighly too big or too small, or the hood adjustment sucks or the collar is too tall or too short etc. Find whats comfortable for you and then by all means hit up ebay or whatever to screw the best deal.

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Depends on whether you think you are going in the water.

Speaking of the Mac race, Jon Santarelli would probably still be here if he had been wearing a dry suit.

My understanding is that most of the Volvo racers use latex seals, not just because they are drier, but because if properly trimmed, they can be more comfortable. I have both types and do not feel there is a difference in comfort.

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