ekas

A Loser’s Guide to Winning in One Designs

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A Loser’s Guide to Winning in One Designs


Race preparation

  • Survey your competitors. Sail those events with the lowest turnout, lest competition, and those regattas where they give the most awards.
  • If sailing as part of a series, maximize participation by turning up those days everyone else stays home when it’s cold, rainy etc.

Boat prep and tuning

  • You don’t have the time or inclination to figure out how to make your boat go fast by spending time on the water. Replicate all settings from the sailmaker(s) in your fleet or that guy who was All-American at Kings Point or something.
  • Keep your new sails in shape by not using them, including at big events where you have even less chance of doing well.

Strategy

  • Pray you get a good start. Follow the leaders around the course doing exactly as they do.
  • Go left, always go left, unless the good boats are going right, in which case you probably should have gone right.

Starting

  • You know you can’t start or hold a lane off the line, so why try. Start near the boat so you when you inevitably have to tack away for clear air you can do so without taking everyone’s transom.
  • Try setting up next to a “sheep” until you realize that you’re always the “sheep” in the wolf/sheep scenario.

Upwind

  • If you find yourself on the wrong side of a shift going upwind, dig in, keep going to that side and pray taking a flyer by yourself will pay. It’s gotta pay this time.
  • Now that you’re at the back of the fleet, go left again on the second upwind. You’re never going to catch up to the fleet if you just follow them to the favored tack/side.

Downwind

  • Fixate on your tactical position with boats immediately around you, aggressively taking them up if necessary, to give the boats ahead a chance to further extend their lead and the one straggler behind a chance to catch up.

Rules and sportsmanship

  • Compensate for your lack of understanding of the basic racing rules of sailing by being aggressive and overly confident, protesting and never following through, and challenging others to do the same.
  • Only talk to sailors of equal or better sailing ability. Acknowledging the presence or existence of inferior sailors on or off the water will reflect poorly on your own abilities.

Supporting your local one design fleet

  • Pay dues only when absolutely required to do so to participate in an event or avoid public shaming.
  • Provide input to fleet decisions, preferably through long email rants on the fleet listserv. If possible, target your input specifically through ad hominem attacks on other fleet members, race committee officials, or others who volunteer their time.
  • If you continue be a loser at one designs, get a PHRF boat and blame poor performance on your rating

 

 

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Sounds like too much work.

Its no wonder that most OD losers take the more time efficient route of buying a PHRF boat and bribing the rating committee.

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You must know my old skipper!

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Forgot: Modify your boat so it doesn't meet class standards and then sue the class saying they were trying to discriminate against you.

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Also make the crew buy the beers, as without your generosity, they would never get the opportunity to sail on a top race yacht.   

 

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3 hours ago, ekas said:

If you find yourself on the wrong side of a shift going upwind, dig in, keep going to that side and pray taking a flyer by yourself will pay. It’s gotta pay this time.

One day. By God, one day it will.

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Under "Strategy" you might add

intentionally run into boats on both port and starboard tack and continue to do so until everyone learns to stay away from you

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Why did I waste all those years reading and re-reading Stuart Walker?  This is it!

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Get your head out of your ass and pay attention..............................and stop listening to the dumb shit stuff on this useless site........

 

HA HA HA

OH, pay a legit coach to help  your sorry ass.

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One design racing is the best way to develop skills, handicap systems are for the wealthy who can't sail, or are overly obsessed with "winning"

Just rememember that all participants are winners(except for those who live in/for protest rooms...

 

PS best way to sail upwind is to do it in only one tack, you lose too much time in tacking.....and it tires out the crew and wrecks the sails

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8 minutes ago, kiwichas said:

One design racing is the best way to develop skills, handicap systems are for the wealthy who can't sail, or are overly obsessed with "winning"

Just rememember that all participants are winners(except for those who live in/for protest rooms...

 

PS best way to sail upwind is to do it in only one tack, you lose too much time in tacking.....and it tires out the crew and wrecks the sails

Sometimes there is no one design racing  remotely close to where you live and boat. Handicap racing is all there is.

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50 minutes ago, jerseyguy said:

Sometimes there is no one design racing  remotely close to where you live and boat. Handicap racing is all there is.

Start a fleet

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When you have a massive penis like some of us you are a winner even before you leave the dock. 

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31 minutes ago, VWAP said:

Start a fleet

Funny man. Try to get a few folks to agree on anything especially a club where cheap is the order of the day. In my 35 years at my club the J 24 fleet petered out after about 4 years. Merit 25s never got off of the ground. Never had more than 3 T10s.  There are a half dozen 7.9s but maybe 3 race on Wednesday and only one races anywhere on weekends.  So it is PHRF or nothing.

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2 hours ago, jerseyguy said:

Funny man. Try to get a few folks to agree on anything especially a club where cheap is the order of the day. In my 35 years at my club the J 24 fleet petered out after about 4 years. Merit 25s never got off of the ground. Never had more than 3 T10s.  There are a half dozen 7.9s but maybe 3 race on Wednesday and only one races anywhere on weekends.  So it is PHRF or nothing.

Try smaller OD boats

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8 hours ago, VWAP said:

Try smaller OD boats

How small? Unless you're referring to racing dinghies?  J24 and Merits are pretty small.

He's got a half dozen 7.9's. Too bad those owners can't get their act together. I hear @jerseyguy on how difficult it is to get people to agree...or show up.

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11 hours ago, jerseyguy said:

Funny man. Try to get a few folks to agree on anything especially a club where cheap is the order of the day. In my 35 years at my club the J 24 fleet petered out after about 4 years. Merit 25s never got off of the ground. Never had more than 3 T10s.  There are a half dozen 7.9s but maybe 3 race on Wednesday and only one races anywhere on weekends.  So it is PHRF or nothing.

Something interesting has happened at our club on Lake Ontario. We now have a fleet of 13 Sharks racing. Almost all are owned by people who have a bigger boat that they cruise or PHRF with. The Sharks were bought for a few thousand dollars each and it is considered bad form to spend too much money on new sails, etc.

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1 hour ago, random said:

Handicap racing is for owners who need and excuse for not winning.

Have you ever raced a sailboat  besides a RC boat 

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9 hours ago, VWAP said:

Try smaller OD boats

When the average age of boat owners at our club is approaching death you aren't going to get too many 65 and 70 year olds in small boats.

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41 minutes ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Something interesting has happened at our club on Lake Ontario. We now have a fleet of 13 Sharks racing. Almost all are owned by people who have a bigger boat that they cruise or PHRF with. The Sharks were bought for a few thousand dollars each and it is considered bad form to spend too much money on new sails, etc.

Our Star boat fleet has had some staying power but it too is a shadow of what it was a decade or so ago.  

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14 minutes ago, jerseyguy said:

Our Star boat fleet has had some staying power but it too is a shadow of what it was a decade or so ago.  

I guess I wasn't clear about the Shark fleet. It started only about 4 years ago with a couple of Sharks racing PHRF and those guys getting others to buy into racing OD. The beauty of it is that it is cheap, low tech, and fun with as few rules as possible. And our YC has a similar demographic to yours I think.

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1 hour ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

I guess I wasn't clear about the Shark fleet. It started only about 4 years ago with a couple of Sharks racing PHRF and those guys getting others to buy into racing OD. The beauty of it is that it is cheap, low tech, and fun with as few rules as possible. And our YC has a similar demographic to yours I think.

Which club? I know NOLSC has a ton of Sharks.

 

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3 hours ago, random said:

Handicap racing is for owners who need and excuse for not winning.

Such an ignorant statement.  Racing in general, is already on life support so your solution is to make handicap racers (often cruising boats) feel unwelcome by telling them to fuck right off. It's not like someone is forcing you to race handicap.

Enjoy playing in the sandbox, alone.

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42 minutes ago, 'Bacco said:

Which club? I know NOLSC has a ton of Sharks.

 

Whitby. It is entirely an almost new thing. Not as if we were a club with C&C ties. Much more links to Whitby, Northern, Aloha, and PDQ which were built locally - although only one PDQ ever in the club. I thought about buying a Shark to play around with but my wife is not a racer. She does not like it when boats get too close together.. Odd since she is fine crossing an ocean though.

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I race OD but anybody who knows me thinks I'm handicapped in a number of ways.

So really, it's the best of both worlds.

Now which way is the protest room?

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The biggest "losers" in sailing are the ones that get hung up on the small things when they still can't do the big things properly.

Too many examples to list out.

 

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1 hour ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Whitby. It is entirely an almost new thing. Not as if we were a club with C&C ties. Much more links to Whitby, Northern, Aloha, and PDQ which were built locally - although only one PDQ ever in the club. I thought about buying a Shark to play around with but my wife is not a racer. She does not like it when boats get too close together.. Odd since she is fine crossing an ocean though.

Gotcha. I grew up racing on Sharks in Youngstown. My old boat came from Whitby,  it was a C&C 29 named SnapShot at the time

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The "wishful flyer" and the "boat end - safety start" hit a little bit close to home. If you are at a party someday, and somebody splashes a Rum and Coke in your face, that will be me. 

 

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5 hours ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

 The Sharks were bought for a few thousand dollars each and it is considered bad form to spend too much money on new sails, etc.

Until someone does......

For example if a former member of Canada's Olympic squad decided to start sailing Sharks for fun, would he be able to resist tweaking it?

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1 hour ago, 'Bacco said:

Gotcha. I grew up racing on Sharks in Youngstown. My old boat came from Whitby,  it was a C&C 29 named SnapShot at the time

George who used to own SnapShot is one of the guys who bought a Shark to go along with his 36.7. To really build the fleet we added a second night of OD racing just for the Sharks. There are at least 3 new to Whitby boats joining next year as well, hoping for 20 on the line Tuesdays.

The boat my partner and I bought is a 68' and still in really good shape. Beauty of the Shark is there is really good OD events attracting 30+ boats every second weekend. We did 4 away events last year and are going to step things up in 2019. Great people in the class as well.

 

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1 hour ago, IPLore said:

Until someone does......

For example if a former member of Canada's Olympic squad decided to start sailing Sharks for fun, would he be able to resist tweaking it?

Bristol-Cruiser is not exactly right on the $$ people are paying for boats in the Whitby fleet. At a Shark regatta someone told me all competitive Sharks cost around 14K. You can buy a $2,000 boat and put $12,000 in or buy a $12,000 boat and add another 2k. Of the top 10 boats in the Whitby fleet this year, all have pretty crispy sails. One of the new boats that came in at $3000 ordered a new spinnaker after their first race out. Still the most fun I have had in years and glad I partnered with a friend and bought one.

 

 

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6 hours ago, VWAP said:

Have you ever raced a sailboat  besides a RC boat 

Yep, raced handicap and OD.

Tell us another porn story, you seem to like them.

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4 hours ago, Ajax said:

Such an ignorant statement.  Racing in general, is already on life support so your solution is to make handicap racers (often cruising boats) feel unwelcome by telling them to fuck right off. It's not like someone is forcing you to race handicap.

Enjoy playing in the sandbox, alone.

I have raced handicap, I have been the handicapper, I have an opinion that it's bullshit.

After a while everyone knows which boat will finish well if it's +20 knots, which boat will win if it's a drifter.

Handicapping is what you have to do when everyone has a different boat, it's a fudge, and then half the fleet complains like whinny little bitches that their H/C is wrong.  I have won a big coastal race on H/C, the trophy is on the wall not far from where I am typing.  It was fun but I have never really valued it beyond being able to say I won.  Just not the same as winning in a OD fleet, that's hard.

Edit: Handicaps are pretty effective over a period of time, that's how they are established, an average if you will.  For any given race they are often way out.

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48 minutes ago, random said:

I have raced handicap, I have been the handicapper, I have an opinion that it's bullshit.

After a while everyone knows which boat will finish well if it's +20 knots, which boat will win if it's a drifter.

Handicapping is what you have to do when everyone has a different boat, it's a fudge, and then half the fleet complains like whinny little bitches that their H/C is wrong.  I have won a big coastal race on H/C, the trophy is on the wall not far from where I am typing.  It was fun but I have never really valued it beyond being able to say I won.  Just not the same as winning in a OD fleet, that's hard.

Edit: Handicaps are pretty effective over a period of time, that's how they are established, an average if you will.  For any given race they are often way out.

this is what happens if you race PHRF, not "handicap." Ask Mass Bay if they could predict the winners with that regularity this year. It's true that the well-sailed boats still rose to the top for the most part, but the racing, on the whole, was a lot more equitable under ORR-ez than it has been under PHRF for the past 10 years or so.

to be fair, you're not wrong about people whining about ratings (done my fair share as well), and it's true that winning in an OD fleet is hard (just ask Jud Smith), but there have been a few races we've won in handicap racing that I'm pretty proud of because of how my boat and my team have performed.

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7 hours ago, random said:

Yep, raced handicap and OD.

Tell us another porn story, you seem to like them.

Sure you have, whatever you say,  keep telling yourself that oh yea it's the internet. 

 

What? oh hay Limp Buoy 15 is  calling you back to PA he  needs another  aussie opinion on american politics.

 

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I think I met someone on the water on Sunday who took the advice.... making improper calls and putting boats into the doldrums, when there was no need...

 

That Handicap fleet race (51 boats from 40ft to 14Ft) was won by a Star...

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16 hours ago, random said:

I have raced handicap, I have been the handicapper, I have an opinion that it's bullshit.

After a while everyone knows which boat will finish well if it's +20 knots, which boat will win if it's a drifter.

Handicapping is what you have to do when everyone has a different boat, it's a fudge, and then half the fleet complains like whinny little bitches that their H/C is wrong.  I have won a big coastal race on H/C, the trophy is on the wall not far from where I am typing.  It was fun but I have never really valued it beyond being able to say I won.  Just not the same as winning in a OD fleet, that's hard.

Edit: Handicaps are pretty effective over a period of time, that's how they are established, an average if you will.  For any given race they are often way out.

You're not totally wrong in all of that, but when faced with the choice of handicap or nothing, handicap might be the better choice.

Also, consider the level of competition. A bunch of cruiser/racers might be willing to accept a less than perfect fudge in order to go out and have a good time with a casual race. Not everyone is 100% full-aggro, barging, protest rooms and the whole bit.

Beware blanket statements and all that...

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On 10/24/2018 at 3:41 PM, jerseyguy said:

When the average age of boat owners at our club is approaching death you aren't going to get too many 65 and 70 year olds in small boats.

King Harald of Norway was 76 when he started racing the almost 26' 1980 vintage Swedish Albin Express. And all of a sudden, the class became popular ..

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6 hours ago, Ajax said:

You're not totally wrong in all of that, but when faced with the choice of handicap or nothing, handicap might be the better choice.

Also, consider the level of competition. A bunch of cruiser/racers might be willing to accept a less than perfect fudge in order to go out and have a good time with a casual race. Not everyone is 100% full-aggro, barging, protest rooms and the whole bit.

Beware blanket statements and all that...

That's what I said, h/c is used when you have to.

I don't have to beware blanket statements at all.  I am willing and able to make them based on experience of being involved and in organising them.

One occasion we were preparing for a major event, I was the handicapper and I published the list with h/c's a few days before the race.  One skipper approached me and requested an adjustment and provided reasons for it.  While discussing that with the race committee at a meeting before the race, I calculated the adjusted time difference, between the existing h/c and the requested one.  One of the officials who had been involved in the sport for years said "ahhhhh, so that't how it works!!!"   Faaarck meeeee.

Even the Sydney to Hobart is effected by this imperfect science.  You will hear the commentators discussing the fleet against the weather forecast and making predictions on a winner.   If it's 25 to 30 on the nose they discount any of the smaller boats and look at longer narrower jobs.  If it's on the beam or behind they will do the opposite, and of course they are right. 

What really shits me about this type of sailing is that (over here at least) they are very often passage races or big courses around navigation marks.  The owners often have no idea about RRS and they operate under COLREGS.  This isn't yacht racing but they think it is.  It can be scary shit.  Once on port, lining up to duck behind a starboard boat much larger than mine, at the last minute he altered course directly towards me, we almost collided head-on.  Later he said that he tried to cross behind me because the thought I was not giving way!  Think about that, he didn't crash tack but altered course towards me.  He had no fucking experience in actual racing and no real understanding of the RRS but had been h/c passage racing his cruiser for years. 

I rest my case.

 

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2 hours ago, jhellan said:

King Harald of Norway was 76 when he started racing the almost 26' 1980 vintage Swedish Albin Express. And all of a sudden, the class became popular ..

Sorry. Fresh out of kings, queens, princes, princesses. Cannot even find a royal consort.

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Who the hell uses a list-serv these days?
 

You go onto SA and bitch, hell, this place started with a rant about PHRF....

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1 hour ago, random said:

That's what I said, h/c is used when you have to.

I don't have to beware blanket statements at all.  I am willing and able to make them based on experience of being involved and in organising them.

One occasion we were preparing for a major event, I was the handicapper and I published the list with h/c's a few days before the race.  One skipper approached me and requested an adjustment and provided reasons for it.  While discussing that with the race committee at a meeting before the race, I calculated the adjusted time difference, between the existing h/c and the requested one.  One of the officials who had been involved in the sport for years said "ahhhhh, so that't how it works!!!"   Faaarck meeeee.

Even the Sydney to Hobart is effected by this imperfect science.  You will hear the commentators discussing the fleet against the weather forecast and making predictions on a winner.   If it's 25 to 30 on the nose they discount any of the smaller boats and look at longer narrower jobs.  If it's on the beam or behind they will do the opposite, and of course they are right. 

What really shits me about this type of sailing is that (over here at least) they are very often passage races or big courses around navigation marks.  The owners often have no idea about RRS and they operate under COLREGS.  This isn't yacht racing but they think it is.  It can be scary shit.  Once on port, lining up to duck behind a starboard boat much larger than mine, at the last minute he altered course directly towards me, we almost collided head-on.  Later he said that he tried to cross behind me because the thought I was not giving way!  Think about that, he didn't crash tack but altered course towards me.  He had no fucking experience in actual racing and no real understanding of the RRS but had been h/c passage racing his cruiser for years. 

I rest my case.

 

They use handicraps in RC sailing?

 

 

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On 10/24/2018 at 9:57 AM, Bristol-Cruiser said:

I guess I wasn't clear about the Shark fleet. It started only about 4 years ago with a couple of Sharks racing PHRF and those guys getting others to buy into racing OD. The beauty of it is that it is cheap, low tech, and fun with as few rules as possible. And our YC has a similar demographic to yours I think.

Picture of the Whitby shark fleet from this summer. Amazing that the majority of these boats are 50 years old.

37722796_10155780248341947_4801379579837022208_o.jpg

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On 10/24/2018 at 1:00 PM, jerseyguy said:

Sometimes there is no one design racing  remotely close to where you live and boat. Handicap racing is all there is.

Absolutely; within a mixed fleet you'll identify the boats close to you in performance and try to improve(thrash) each time, and still have a ton of fun.

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We've had the odd 100 year old racing, most of the more elderly owners, are supported by their family or friends to race. When they pass on, the boats are normally taken on by the next generation, we've often got 2 , 3, or sometimes 4 generations sailing.. The boats can be older, one of the more common classes was first built in 1908 (though you can get them glassfibre hulled now).

We can have an 80 year old in a 25ft keel boat in the same race as a 8 year old in an Oppi or Gull (although they will start in different groups at 5 minute intervals)...

This is my last (winter) season in one design racing,  mostly because my back won't allow me to race in that class much longer..

So from next year it will be handicap racing, in a boat where I can sit with a supported back. It does have the advantage of 4 one hour races round the cans each Sunday instead of 3... Although the race (2 to 3 hours ) down river to the pub, having a civilised lunch (and a pint or two) then racing back, will still have the same amount of racing and attraction..

 

If you wish to race, you race in what's available..

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So there we go again with the American division of right and wrong affecting logic and reason.

I did not advocate dispensing with h/c racing.  I advocate not comparing them in terms of achievement.  I'll race h/c if that's all there is, but right now I have a choice.

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2 hours ago, random said:

So there we go again with the American division of right and wrong affecting logic and reason.

I did not advocate dispensing with h/c racing.  I advocate not comparing them in terms of achievement.  I'll race h/c if that's all there is, but right now I have a choice.

Do  your RC boats race handicap?

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I've no Idea what a boats religion is, I don't ask it...

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