toad

Ocasio

Recommended Posts

9 hours ago, frenchie said:

 They don't even seem to realize: the more they attack her, the stronger they make her.

Guess who's got herself a seat on the Financial Services Committee? 

 

Exactly.

One interesting thing I see thanks to her is the effect that Twitter has on the strawman fallacy. No matter how someone tries to argue against what she didn’t say, the record is right there. As long as she doesn’t start tweeting both sides of every issue, that should serve her well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, jzk said:
11 hours ago, frenchie said:

 They don't even seem to realize: the more they attack her, the stronger they make her.

 

Does the same go for Trump?

To pretty large extent, yes it does.

Clearly the Red Hat MagAettes love him for making libby-rull heads explode.

But the cases are different in one key factor: President Trump is dishonest, and does not care about his constituents. Ocasio-Cortex is (apparently, so far) honest, and does.

-DSK

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jzk said:

Does the same go for Trump?

It might.  If he were able to avoid stepping on his dick every chance he gets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jzk said:

“I do think that a system that allows billionaires to exist when there are parts of Alabama where people are still getting ringworm because they don’t have access to public health is wrong,” Ocasio-Cortez said.

We have 2 basic schools of thought.  One is that a billionaire gets to be a billionaire by taking wealth from the poor people in Alabama and others.  The other is that a billionaire gets to be a billionaire by providing society with a huge amount of desired goods and services which benefits a huge number of people such as those poor people in Alabama.  Further, if you made it such that the billionaire couldn't become a billionaire, the poor person in Alabama would be worse off, not better.   Even further, if we really wanted to set up a safety net for truly disadvantaged people that really can't take care of themselves, where do we get the wealth to do it?

News flash, genius: There are in fact NOT "2 basic schools of thought" even giving credit to your view as a "school of thought" which should more accurately be labelled a school of poorly-thought.

The socio-economic system is not a zero sum game. IIRC you've said that yourself, why can't you seem to apply it here?

Did the billionaire start out naked in the woods, with nothing but sticks and rocks? Did -any- part of our socio-economic system play a part in his (or her, why are you such a chauvanist pig) becoming a billionaire?

Over the last decade, the wealth split in this country has grown faster than the rest of the world, and it's pretty dramatic in the rest of the world. Pretending we have a level playing field and the poor deserve to be poor is just greasing the skids.

-DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Clearly the Red Hat MagAettes love him for making libby-rull heads explode.

But that's not to say that they support Shitstain. Supporting Shitstain would be bad. Instead, they support the idea of supporting Shitstain which is completely different from supporting Shitstain, a distinction without distinction.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

News flash, genius: There are in fact NOT "2 basic schools of thought" even giving credit to your view as a "school of thought" which should more accurately be labelled a school of poorly-thought.

The socio-economic system is not a zero sum game. IIRC you've said that yourself, why can't you seem to apply it here?

Did the billionaire start out naked in the woods, with nothing but sticks and rocks? Did -any- part of our socio-economic system play a part in his (or her, why are you such a chauvanist pig) becoming a billionaire?

Over the last decade, the wealth split in this country has grown faster than the rest of the world, and it's pretty dramatic in the rest of the world. Pretending we have a level playing field and the poor deserve to be poor is just greasing the skids.

-DSK

What part of my post is chauvinist?  

What part of our economic system played a part in the billionaire becoming a billionaire?  Isn't that already paid for?  Why do you need more from the billionaire for your system to work?  Is it because your system is financially insolvent?  

You think it is the billionaires that keep the poor poor?  Or is it government?    

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, jzk said:

What part of my post is chauvinist?  

 

The part where you're not even considering the possibility that any random billionaire might be a woman. Multiple times.

 

20 minutes ago, jzk said:

What part of our economic system played a part in the billionaire becoming a billionaire? 

The part where there's money.

 

20 minutes ago, jzk said:

What part of our economic system played a part in the billionaire becoming a billionaire?  Isn't that already paid for?

"Already paid for" does mean a free ride to me. Does it to you?

My car is all paid for. It needs maintenance, and gas stations are kinda stubborn about not giving me free fuel.

 

20 minutes ago, jzk said:

 Why do you need more from the billionaire for your system to work?  Is it because your system is financially insolvent?  

 

Google the word "maintenance"

Also you might want to consider infrastructure upgrades as technology improves and population expands. They're not free either.

And do you suppose that the fact IOUs from Uncle Sam are the world's most secure monetary instrument indicates a "financially insolvent" system?

-DSK

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

image.thumb.png.f8717279034ada8f00d31c10d856acb6.pngThe part where there's money.

Yeah, that part!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Has anyone commented on the fact that all this Make America Great Again rhetoric is referencing a time when the tax rates were what AOC is presenting?

If not, consider it done. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Has anyone commented on the fact that all this Make America Great Again rhetoric is referencing a time when the tax rates were what AOC is presenting?

If not, consider it done. 

They were even higher, were they not?

I've said for some time that what we want is 1950s social policy, with modern tax policy that properly recognizes the entitlement of our Best Americans.  Thet thar's a ewtopia.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Sol Rosenberg said:

They were even higher, were they not?

I've said for some time that what we want is 1950s social policy, with modern tax policy that properly recognizes the entitlement of our Best Americans.  Thet thar's a ewtopia.  

True - under Eisenhower the top was at 90%, of course we were paying for a war then. Oh wait, couple of wars never got paid for.  Oh well thanks to Reagan and his magic math of making everyone rich income inequality is the new patriotism. Just wait long enough and you too will be rich. But Wait! Don't answer yet! There's More! Soon to come you can also get the MAGA feeling for FREE! Just pay a separate fee.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What i don't like about the 70% plan is that it doesn't remove all the bullshit loopholes, it requires us to waste resources keeping track of millions that don't and won't ever pay taxes, and ride herd on cats who can hire smart cheaters.

My nontaxable, no deductions plan on the first million of income is much leaner, and I strongly suspect would be wildly popular with just folks. 

Make it simple, keep it simple.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, we don't have the AOC plan *and* we have loopholes. Leona Helmsley was right. She only made the mistake of pointing it out.

Congress isn't going to fix loopholes. I remember taking Theory of the Firm way back when. The prof was a bit of a winger but some of his explanations rang true. He said the reason the minimum wage isn't indexed to inflation is that politicians want to be able to give their constituencies something. Indexing it to inflation would fix the problem but that doesn't get politicians elected. Same with ending loopholes. That doesn't get politicians elected.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, d'ranger said:
14 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

They were even higher, were they not?

I've said for some time that what we want is 1950s social policy, with modern tax policy that properly recognizes the entitlement of our Best Americans.  Thet thar's a ewtopia.  

True - under Eisenhower the top was at 90%, of course we were paying for a war then. Oh wait, couple of wars never got paid for.  Oh well thanks to Reagan and his magic math of making everyone rich income inequality is the new patriotism. Just wait long enough and you too will be rich. But Wait! Don't answer yet! There's More! Soon to come you can also get the MAGA feeling for FREE! Just pay a separate fee.

I wonder how many contributors to the "Build Tha Wall" gofundme came from the over-$100k/yr bracket? Seems likely to be a very regressive tax to me.

The "standard view" or Happy Dayz sitcom ideal of 1950s society never had much appeal to me, personally. On one hand, the only electric guitars available were all classics, good. OTOH the amps they had (while still considered classics) were not very loud and their effects outright sucked.

What the MAGAettes appear to want is not the phony-50s but an actual medieval society where they can burn witches, and their rightful overlords fuck their daughters, but they don't have to make any decisions or take any responsibility for themselves.

-DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

The part where you're not even considering the possibility that any random billionaire might be a woman. Multiple times.

 

The part where there's money.

 

"Already paid for" does mean a free ride to me. Does it to you?

My car is all paid for. It needs maintenance, and gas stations are kinda stubborn about not giving me free fuel.

 

Google the word "maintenance"

Also you might want to consider infrastructure upgrades as technology improves and population expands. They're not free either.

And do you suppose that the fact IOUs from Uncle Sam are the world's most secure monetary instrument indicates a "financially insolvent" system?

-DSK

Very specifically what part of my post assumes billionaires can't be women.  Like quote it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, jzk said:

Very specifically what part of my post assumes billionaires can't be women.  Like quote it.

The word "his" or "him" generally does not refer to females. Like women.

-DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

The word "his" or "him" generally does not refer to females. Like women.

-DSK

Quote?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm with AOC on taxing the rich - as are 75% of Americans 

That makes the KZK ilk the real radicals - not AOC 

And note that KZK's formulation assumes that billionaires have zero obligation to the rest of society . . 

which is a mean and idiotic Randian view which is even rejected by the many of US billionaires themselves . .  

(42% of upper income folks)   https://news.gallup.com/poll/182987/americans-continue-say-wealth-distribution-unfair.aspx

People get it, the US oligarchic Reich has created a country in which half of us cannot afford to live . .  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

The word "his" or "him" generally does not refer to females. Like women.

-DSK

How is that quote coming along?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, AJ Oliver said:

I'm with AOC on taxing the rich - as are 75% of Americans 

That makes the KZK ilk the real radicals - not AOC 

 

You and 75% of Americans are willing to take money from people that have more than you?  How shocking.

Why do you think you need to take money from other people just to "live?"  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, jzk said:

You and 75% of Americans are willing to take money from people that have more than you?  How shocking.

Why do you think you need to take money from other people just to "live?"  

The Reich has no concept of solidarity - the idea that we are all in this thing together. 

Many of us, even me, give a lot more than we get - including through sailing . . 

Our Club has active programs helping the disabled, young, low income, minorities, etc. have access to our great sport. 

Do you do any of that? Somehow I doubt it. 

Humane societies help out those who need it - a kid going to school (K-12) costs us all around $ 150,000

before they ever pay taxes, then there are folks like my relative with autisism (not cheap to treat) 

I'm glad to help pay for all of that - and so should you if you have a shred of humanity. 

Spare us that John Galt bulls--t. 

I think you have a great future in that libertarian paradise, Somalia (with apologies to all the decent people who live there - they deserve better) 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Best Americans are entitled to pay a tax rate of 15%, or even much less.  The Best Americans are entitled to own the Congress.  The Best Americans are entitled to pay their employees something below living wage and have the rest of the rubes in society pick up the tab to keep those poor scum ready to go to work again the next day. They are entitled to it right up to the point where the masses realize that it isn't people to their left or right who have been fucking them, and stop focusing on hating the different people.  At that point, the Best Americans become less entitled and heads begin to roll.  Those proposing a system that avoids that point in time are trying to keep the peace.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

The Best Americans are entitled to pay a tax rate of 15%, or even much less.  The Best Americans are entitled to own the Congress.  The Best Americans are entitled to pay their employees something below living wage and have the rest of the rubes in society pick up the tab to keep those poor scum ready to go to work again the next day. They are entitled to it right up to the point where the masses realize that it isn't people to their left or right who have been fucking them, and stop focusing on hating the different people.  At that point, the Best Americans become less entitled and heads begin to roll.  Those proposing a system that avoids that point in time are trying to keep the peace.  

This is a big fucking lie.  

No one should work for less than they agree to.  And if they can't find a job that pays what they like, they should improve their skills.  One way to do that is to take a job making less that will teach them skills such that they can make more.

Are we talking about people with working legs and arms and half a brain?  97% of them command a wage higher than current minimum wage because they have skills that have value in the marketplace.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, jzk said:

This is a big fucking lie.  

No one should work for less than they agree to.  And if they can't find a job that pays what they like, they should improve their skills.  One way to do that is to take a job making less that will teach them skills such that they can make more.

Are we talking about people with working legs and arms and half a brain?  97% of them command a wage higher than current minimum wage because they have skills that have value in the marketplace.

fuck yeah, it's another geezer dumbass rambling about "skills".

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

fuck yeah, it's another geezer dumbass rambling about "skills".

Because we all know the way to make more than a living wage is to not have skills?

The reason that you don't make a living wage is big bad old white rich guys?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, jzk said:

This is a big fucking lie.  

No one should work for less than they agree to.  And if they can't find a job that pays what they like, they should improve their skills.  One way to do that is to take a job making less that will teach them skills such that they can make more.

Are we talking about people with working legs and arms and half a brain?  97% of them command a wage higher than current minimum wage because they have skills that have value in the marketplace.

Sol was talking about taxes and political ownership and you responded with your usual malarkey about wages.

Ya kind of missed the point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, d'ranger said:

Cut funding for education and acquire better skills.  It never ends.

Well, how much should education cost? Anybody can google "skills for higher wages" and pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.

Just the way JZK has learned so much about economics from googling topics I suggest, like marginal rates and arbitrage and shinplasters.

We'd all be so-o much better off if we just depended on ourselves. I could build a much better car, for example, by digging up ore and smelting metal and learning how to forge an engine block and sewing animal pelts into finely crafted seats..... what luxury!..... instead of depending on the current socio-economic system to provide me a car in exchange for a pile of funny-colored paper. Fuck all that interdependency bullshit.

And THAT is why I shouldn't have to pay taxes to support all you other lazy dumbasses! It's obvious that poor people deserve to fuckin' starve!

-DSK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Cut funding for education and acquire better skills.  It never ends.
 

Correct me if I am wrong here, but isn't school funding done at a local or state level?

Yes we have an education problem. Not sure there is a direct correlation to school funding. In any regard, we fail at preparing our next generation to be competitive in the workplace. No arguing that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, BillDBastard said:

Correct me if I am wrong here, but isn't school funding done at a local or state level?

Yes we have an education problem. Not sure there is a direct correlation to school funding. In any regard, we fail at preparing our next generation to be competitive in the workplace. No arguing that.

Yep, you're wrong. Federal contribution to elementary and secondary education is about 8 percent.

https://www2.ed.gov/about/overview/fed/role.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wasn't just referring to fed money - the push has been for years to cut funds at all levels. Teachers buying supplies out their own pockets? Then there is the Robin Hood debacle - where rich districts give money to poor districts. Good idea, right? Well, the big problem in Houston is the poor schools are in deep trouble to the point the state wants to take over the district. Never mind much needed monies are taken from the district. 

Big government is not the problem despite Saint Ronnie, it's bad government. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, BillDBastard said:

we fail at preparing our next generation to be competitive in the workplace. No arguing that.

what skills should they be learning bill? what are the skills workers don't have?

now keep in mind the "skills gap" is mostly bullshit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

I'm with AOC on taxing the rich - as are 75% of Americans 

That makes the KZK ilk the real radicals - not AOC 

And note that KZK's formulation assumes that billionaires have zero obligation to the rest of society . . 

which is a mean and idiotic Randian view which is even rejected by the many of US billionaires themselves . .  

(42% of upper income folks)   https://news.gallup.com/poll/182987/americans-continue-say-wealth-distribution-unfair.aspx

People get it, the US oligarchic Reich has created a country in which half of us cannot afford to live . .  

Why stop at 75% of income?  That won’t change the status quo - billionaires will still be billionaires.  Millionaires will still be millionaires.

If you really want change, let’s just get on with it and start seizing wealth.  How are we going to do that?  And how much wealth should folks be allowed to keep?  Lots more questions, but let’s start with those two.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, J28 said:

Why stop at 75% of income?  That won’t change the status quo - billionaires will still be billionaires.  Millionaires will still be millionaires.

If you really want change, let’s just get on with it and start seizing wealth.  How are we going to do that?  And how much wealth should folks be allowed to keep?  Lots more questions, but let’s start with those two.

Apparently it somewhere south of a billion.

"It’s immoral how America’s economic system allows billionaires to exist,” ...Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, J28 said:

Why stop at 75% of income?  That won’t change the status quo - billionaires will still be billionaires.  Millionaires will still be millionaires.

If you really want change, let’s just get on with it and start seizing wealth.  How are we going to do that?  And how much wealth should folks be allowed to keep?  Lots more questions, but let’s start with those two.

Obviously not a believer in marginal utility.  What is being bought after 10 million a year? Power, pure and simple.  This is power being transferred to the billionaire by the people.  To whose advantage?  Definitely not the people.  BTW, I am sure you know that on a basis of amount paid out vs amount returned via various programs, that the billionaires are paying for things anyway.  I can't remember the exact number this year, but it is in the hundred thousand a year range before the amount you pay in taxes is greater than the cost of programs returned to you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Dog said:

Apparently it somewhere south of a billion.

"It’s immoral how America’s economic system allows billionaires to exist,” ...Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

I guess Oprah isn't on her Happy Holidays list?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, jzk said:

Because we all know the way to make more than a living wage is to not have skills?

The reason that you don't make a living wage is big bad old white rich guys?

Yes, that is true.  It has to do with power, not skills.  The return on capital is usually controlled by old white rich guys.  There is a heck of a lot more return on capital than labour.  High tax rates turn "power" capital away from the capitalist.  This "power" capital is (rogue, dead, casino) money as true capital can be written off taxes anyway.  So that brings about the high tax rates. You can have all the unique skills in the world and you will still be placed well below capital due to the return on capital vs the return on labour.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Dog said:

Apparently it somewhere south of a billion.

"It’s immoral how America’s economic system allows billionaires to exist,” ...Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

this girl is a simpleton with a megaphone....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Dog said:

Apparently it somewhere south of a billion.

"It’s immoral how America’s economic system allows billionaires to exist,” ...Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

Dog, why do you lie?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Olsonist said:

Sol was talking about taxes and political ownership and you responded with your usual malarkey about wages.

Ya kind of missed the point.

Did you read this part of his post?

"The Best Americans are entitled to pay their employees something below living wage and have the rest of the rubes in society pick up the tab to keep those poor scum ready to go to work again the next day"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

Well, how much should education cost? Anybody can google "skills for higher wages" and pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.

Just the way JZK has learned so much about economics from googling topics I suggest, like marginal rates and arbitrage and shinplasters.

We'd all be so-o much better off if we just depended on ourselves. I could build a much better car, for example, by digging up ore and smelting metal and learning how to forge an engine block and sewing animal pelts into finely crafted seats..... what luxury!..... instead of depending on the current socio-economic system to provide me a car in exchange for a pile of funny-colored paper. Fuck all that interdependency bullshit.

And THAT is why I shouldn't have to pay taxes to support all you other lazy dumbasses! It's obvious that poor people deserve to fuckin' starve!

-DSK

Did you find that quote where I was being a chauvinist?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Laker said:

Yes, that is true.  It has to do with power, not skills.  The return on capital is usually controlled by old white rich guys.  There is a heck of a lot more return on capital than labour.  High tax rates turn "power" capital away from the capitalist.  This "power" capital is (rogue, dead, casino) money as true capital can be written off taxes anyway.  So that brings about the high tax rates. You can have all the unique skills in the world and you will still be placed well below capital due to the return on capital vs the return on labour.

That is a bunch of complete nonsense.  You think that people can't make it in this world without being subject to your elite rule and "help?"  There are all sorts of ways to make it.  This husband wife team at the marina seem to be pulling in around $50/hour each cleaning boat bottoms.  What white power is preventing them from making a decent living?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

this girl is a simpleton with a megaphone....

Ummmm, no, she is the future of the democrat party.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

this girl is a simpleton with a megaphone....

Not by a long shot.  She is a very smart and PR savvy.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, BillDBastard said:

Ummmm, no, she is the future of the democrat party.

Not sure about that but she is a driving force. On Colbert when asked how many fucks she gave about upsetting the Democratic party she said zero.   Her goal is to do what Trump pretended to do.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out - she will run up against all the old money and power plays.  I like her and hope she shakes things up good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, jzk said:

Not by a long shot.  She is a very smart and PR savvy.   

Short term....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, d'ranger said:

Not sure about that but she is a driving force. On Colbert when asked how many fucks she gave about upsetting the Democratic party she said zero.   Her goal is to do what Trump pretended to do.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out - she will run up against all the old money and power plays.  I like her and hope she shakes things up good.

She sure is shaking up the old right wing. These bitter old fucks are scared.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

Well, how much should education cost? Anybody can google "skills for higher wages" and pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.

Just the way JZK has learned so much about economics from googling topics I suggest, like marginal rates and arbitrage and shinplasters.

We'd all be so-o much better off if we just depended on ourselves. I could build a much better car, for example, by digging up ore and smelting metal and learning how to forge an engine block and sewing animal pelts into finely crafted seats..... what luxury!..... instead of depending on the current socio-economic system to provide me a car in exchange for a pile of funny-colored paper. Fuck all that interdependency bullshit.

And THAT is why I shouldn't have to pay taxes to support all you other lazy dumbasses! It's obvious that poor people deserve to fuckin' starve!

-DSK

You called me a chauvinist pig for this post.  Can you show me where the chauvinism is?

“I do think that a system that allows billionaires to exist when there are parts of Alabama where people are still getting ringworm because they don’t have access to public health is wrong,” Ocasio-Cortez said.

We have 2 basic schools of thought.  One is that a billionaire gets to be a billionaire by taking wealth from the poor people in Alabama and others.  The other is that a billionaire gets to be a billionaire by providing society with a huge amount of desired goods and services which benefits a huge number of people such as those poor people in Alabama.  Further, if you made it such that the billionaire couldn't become a billionaire, the poor person in Alabama would be worse off, not better.   Even further, if we really wanted to set up a safety net for truly disadvantaged people that really can't take care of themselves, where do we get the wealth to do it?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's her interview.  She kinda meanders.. she says they're immoral but not really because it's the system but yea, they're immoral but not Bill Gates...

BTW: it's obviously edited at some level but it was the most complete I could find in short order.

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, d'ranger said:

Big government is not the problem ….., it's bad government. 

Absolutely 100% correct. Give that man a beer.

Problem is big government is bad government. The larger, the less responsive and more unruly.

As for school funding. I am not convinced it is a function of how much money a school district has as per se, more a matter of how it is being spent. That is and has always been the issue. That is not to say some districts in impoverished areas are underfunded mind you. They certainly exist.

Quick story. In our little town we have some magnet schools. They were designed to give the higher IQ, higher potential pupils a learning atmosphere unencumbered by the need to teach to the average students or under-average students. So in our little town they were working pretty well. One day the local school board got it into their collective heads that this was patently unfair. Not from an academic perspective but from a social perspective. That families with a mix of average kids and above average kids were being split up in their schooling. The solution was to allow all family members from households with an above average learner to attend the magnet schools. So much for them being geared to the above average  learners. What a freakin waste of time, effort and money.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Olsonist said:

Sol was talking about taxes and political ownership and you responded with your usual malarkey about wages.

Ya kind of missed the point.

Let's say that a billionaire pays 15% income tax.  That is a whole metric fuckton more than you pay, so shouldn't you be giving them an award or something?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Not sure about that but she is a driving force. On Colbert when asked how many fucks she gave about upsetting the Democratic party she said zero.   Her goal is to do what Trump pretended to do.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out - she will run up against all the old money and power plays.  I like her and hope she shakes things up good.

Well what she is up against is what some have labeled "The Swamp". That entrenched power structure, exists on both side of the aisle, that has a way of grinding people like A O-C down. Either they conform and toe the line or they are irrelevant. Give her 6 months to decide which way the wind is blowing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ringworm......LOL....she is ignorant...she has no idea what ringworm is, other than is sounds ominous....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, BillDBastard said:

Well what she is up against is what some have labeled "The Swamp". That entrenched power structure, exists on both side of the aisle, that has a way of grinding people like A O-C down. Either they conform and toe the line or they are irrelevant. Give her 6 months to decide which way the wind is blowing.

The good news? Record number of women and minorities elected. The best way to drain the swamp is to put them out to pasture. Change is coming on many levels (well to be fair it started under Trump) and will make for interesting times.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, BillDBastard said:

Problem is big government is bad government. The larger, the less responsive and more unruly.

That's factually incorrect Bill. 

1*ST8FyiZL3QS8PKT4hOyUfQ.png

quickiy apparent that small government isn't good for prosperity or freedom. Do you know what is?'

Good government

1*X4er8hnuKNp_C8-LI3aaZg.png

Now - you going to put those skills to work and learn today?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, SailBlueH2O said:

ringworm......LOL....she is ignorant...she has no idea what ringworm is, other than is sounds ominous....

 

That actually was pretty silly.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, cmilliken said:

Here's her interview.  She kinda meanders.. she says they're immoral but not really because it's the system but yea, they're immoral but not Bill Gates...

BTW: it's obviously edited at some level but it was the most complete I could find in short order.

 

 

Posting a Daily Caller video? Of course it's been edited in a way to please the biases of rightwing whackjobs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, cmilliken said:

 

That actually was pretty silly.

 

LOL...both of my sons wrestled all 4 years in HS...6 years of Lamisil... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, cmilliken said:

 

That actually was pretty silly.

 

But very sincere.

Global warming is WW II.

The world will end in 12 years.

Te term 'useful idiot' comes to mind but that's kind of old school.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Saorsa said:

But very sincere.

Global warming is WW II.

The world will end in 12 years.

Te term 'useful idiot comes to mind but that's kind of old school.

PA is chock a block with UI's

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

The good news? Record number of women and minorities elected. The best way to drain the swamp is to put them out to pasture. Change is coming on many levels (well to be fair it started under Trump) and will make for interesting times.

Swamps are a perfectly useful, in fact necessary, part of the ecology.  We drain them at our risk - e.g. Florida and the Okeechobee.  However, there are some critters that proliferate in a swamp that are indeed dangerous.  Crocodiles, Claim Jumpers, Poachers, Boa Constrictors, Land Developers and such.  Most of those species are not actually native swamp dwellers.  

One of the great advantages of a swamp is its diversity.  One side of the divided house of congress critters is getting much better at showing that trait that the other.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, jzk said:

That is a bunch of complete nonsense.  You think that people can't make it in this world without being subject to your elite rule and "help?"  There are all sorts of ways to make it.  This husband wife team at the marina seem to be pulling in around $50/hour each cleaning boat bottoms.  What white power is preventing them from making a decent living?  

You are stuck in the bourgeoisie.  We are talking real money here.  Above what it takes you to pay for your shelter, food and fast women, what will more than 10 million a year buy you? Power and power only.  It is this power that keeps people in a position that, for instance, keeps farmworkers from workmen's compensation.  Again, a failure of the free market system.  You are obviously a lost cause, but others can see that there are indeed failures of the free market and those are exacerbated by large differences in the power of those entering the contract that is central to a free market.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Saorsa said:

Te term 'useful idiot' comes to mind but that's kind of old school.

It's funny how you, Bluey, and the rest of the Trumpalos don't see it best describes ..... you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Laker said:

You are stuck in the bourgeoisie.  We are talking real money here.  Above what it takes you to pay for your shelter, food and fast women, what will more than 10 million a year buy you? Power and power only.  It is this power that keeps people in a position that, for instance, keeps farmworkers from workmen's compensation.  Again, a failure of the free market system.  You are obviously a lost cause, but others can see that there are indeed failures of the free market and those are exacerbated by large differences in the power of those entering the contract that is central to a free market.

Sounds like you are complaining about government.  And you want to make it bigger?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, jzk said:

Sounds like you are complaining about government.  And you want to make it bigger?

Why does it sound like government is the only answer.  You are pulling a red herring here.  We are talking about money buying power and that power being used to create a free market failure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Laker said:

You are stuck in the bourgeoisie.  We are talking real money here.  Above what it takes you to pay for your shelter, food and fast women, what will more than 10 million a year buy you? Power and power only.  It is this power that keeps people in a position that, for instance, keeps farmworkers from workmen's compensation.  Again, a failure of the free market system.  You are obviously a lost cause, but others can see that there are indeed failures of the free market and those are exacerbated by large differences in the power of those entering the contract that is central to a free market.

How'd that revolution work out for the masses in Russia ...after all they've had a 100 year to work out the bugs..... SMH...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Laker said:

Why does it sound like government is the only answer.  You are pulling a red herring here.  We are talking about money buying power and that power being used to create a free market failure.

No we weren't.  We were talking about how to make more than a living wage.  Cleaning boat bottoms seems to be one way.  There are a million others that free people can figure out without government telling them what to do.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The other part about excessive money? It doesn't do anything to stimulate the economy, it is offshored and otherwise put into safe places where it just makes more money. A big part of a graduated tax system is to encourage reinvesting money to create jobs.  Trickle down does it's best to see that does not happen. The sheep happily agree to this since they believe that one day they will join the elite group.  Bill Clinton in his book "Back To Work" wrote extensively about how to change it. Of course myself and a handful of others ever bothered to read it.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

They learned to read and write.

LOL....that's your best shot ?...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, SailBlueH2O said:

LOL....that's your best shot ?...

 

Well, before it was a feudal society where the few owned the many. That is the perfect recipe for revolution - Communism flourished in these environment as it was the only choice. In a number of countries such as China, Vietnam and Cuba the west propped up dictators until the dam broke. If you don't believe me try reading some history.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cmilliken said:

I guess Oprah isn't on her Happy Holidays list?

Any reason she should be?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Saorsa said:

But very sincere.

Global warming is WW II.

The world will end in 12 years.

Te term 'useful idiot' comes to mind but that's kind of old school.

As I said 15 pages back, I really don't mind her or her gaffs or hyperbole.  I wish her well and hope she represents her constituents honorably.  I hope she gets some good advisors.  Her biggest political threats aren't going to come from republicans but from other democrats.

 

8 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Any reason she should be?

It was a joke :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, cmilliken said:

It was a joke :)  

I'm aware. I'm questioning the foundation of why you think it's funny. What makes it funny about Oprah?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Bent Sailor said:

I'm aware. I'm questioning the foundation of why you think it's funny. What makes it funny about Oprah?

She thinks billionaires are immoral.. Oprah is a billionaire democrat.. juxtaposition?  That kinda thing?  Thats why I went with the 'Happy Holiday's card" instead of the 'Christmas list" which would be more traditional in such a joke.  War on Christmas?  

Buehler?  

Ok.. I better not give up the day job :)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Well, before it was a feudal society where the few owned the many. That is the perfect recipe for revolution - Communism flourished in these environment as it was the only choice. In a number of countries such as China, Vietnam and Cuba the west propped up dictators until the dam broke. If you don't believe me try reading some history.

I am in communication with 2 or 3 Vietnamese and their spirit exceeds the bounds of the strict governemnt....they say the country is deeply divided and severe penalties  for coloring outside the lines... China is interesting ...Cuba is a poor example

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, cmilliken said:

She thinks billionaires are immoral.. Oprah is a billionaire democrat.. juxtaposition?  That kinda thing?

Sure, but there are other billionaire Democrats too. Bill Gates, for example, is already mentioned in this thread (alongside her sorta, kinda supporting him). Be honest, it wasn't just because Oprah is Democrat. ;) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Sure, but there are other billionaire Democrats too. Bill Gates, for example, is already mentioned in this thread (alongside her sorta, kinda supporting him). Be honest, it wasn't just because Oprah is Democrat. ;) 

She was a politically active democrat billionaire?

Gates isn't really much of a democrat from what i know although he is a philanthropist.  Tom Steyer is running on his own so he's got his own campaign to run.  Same with Bloomberg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

I am in communication with 2 or 3 Vietnamese and their spirit exceeds the bounds of the strict governemnt....they say the country is deeply divided and severe penalties  for coloring outside the lines... China is interesting ...Cuba is a poor example

All became communist because of the repressive and corrupt dictatorships that existed. Nowhere have I said anything positive about communism - it's a flawed system that has failed everywhere for good reason. The point is what happens when people get desperate enough to choose anything. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, toad said:

We all know that she _talks_ about it, I'm looking for the part where she puts forth a bill to enact it.

6 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

I'm with AOC on taxing the rich - as are 75% of Americans 

Which poll was that?

4 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

think you have a great future in that libertarian paradise, Somalia

Since everything is wrong with the US, how are your plans for moving to your tax paradise of Denmark? A top rate of ~55%, and a 25% VAT - sounds like your kind of paradise.

19 hours ago, frenchie said:

Guess who's got herself a seat on the Financial Services Committee?  

Guess we now know what it took for her to vote for Pelosi as speaker.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

It's funny how you, Bluey, and the rest of the Trumpalos don't see it best describes ..... you.

Thinking I'm a Trumpalos marks you as a very poor reader, MJ. I just don't drink all the lefty koolaid on command like so many.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Blue Crab said:

Thinking I'm a Trumpalos marks you as a very poor reader, MJ. I just don't drink all the lefty koolaid on command like so many.

 

Relax. He's talking about SailBlue. We know you're a centrist like all the rest of us.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cmilliken said:

She thinks billionaires are immoral.. Oprah is a billionaire democrat.. juxtaposition?  That kinda thing?  Thats why I went with the 'Happy Holiday's card" instead of the 'Christmas list" which would be more traditional in such a joke.  War on Christmas?  

Buehler?  

Ok.. I better not give up the day job :)

Read what she actually said and not the Doggie Stylied version.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Blue Crab said:

Thinking I'm a Trumpalos marks you as a very poor reader, MJ. I just don't drink all the lefty koolaid on command like so many.

 

sailBlueH2O, not you :)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites