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13 minutes ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

Saorsa insisted on calling President Barack Obama "boy" for years. He's a bitter old racist shitstain.

Um... I think you're mixing Saorsa up with Dabnis. Who was eventually banned for it.

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5 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Why on earth is the education of the nation's citizenry a "local issue"? 

 Because the more the Federal Government gets involved in something, the more it gets fucked up. 

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Lighten the fuck up people - A guy posted how he feels about something making it clear he is not going around forcing anyone else to adhere to his feelings nor discriminating or otherwise suppressing those he doesn't agree with.

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25 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Um... I think you're mixing Saorsa up with Dabnis. Who was eventually banned for it.

Simple Jack called him O Boy. 

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38 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Lighten the fuck up people - A guy posted how he feels about something making it clear he is not going around forcing anyone else to adhere to his feelings nor discriminating or otherwise suppressing those he doesn't agree with.

Sure, and that's been my experience of Chesapeake as well. That said, not being homophobic and not being a homophobic activist are two different things. One can be homophobic without forcing others to agree with you or suppressing those that think homosexuality is no more odd than a preference for chubby redheads. Just like someone can be racist and not join tiki torch parades defending the right of the South to commemorate those fighting for the right to keep slaves.

Again, not saying Chessy is homophobic, cos I've not seen him be such. Just being clear that being homophobic doesn't mean you have to be actively trying to suppress their rights or go all Happy Jack crazy on those that support them having said rights.

Edit: Think I've found it. Hadn't been reading the Mother is a bigot thread at all, so missed that conversation. Will continue it there.

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7 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Sure, and that's been my experience of Chesapeake as well. That said, not being homophobic and not being a homophobic activist are two different things. One can be homophobic without forcing others to agree with you or suppressing those that think homosexuality is no more odd than a preference for chubby redheads. Just like someone can be racist and not join tiki torch parades defending the right of the South to commemorate those fighting for the right to keep slaves.

Again, not saying Chessy is homophobic, cos I've not seen him be such. Just being clear that being homophobic doesn't mean you have to be actively trying to suppress their rights or go all Happy Jack crazy on those that support them having said rights.

Edit: Think I've found it. Hadn't been reading the Mother is a bigot thread at all, so missed that conversation. Will continue it there.

  On 1/18/2019 at 9:16 AM, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I think you're ignoring the right of the school to employ individuals that embody their values, and one of those is to not embrace deviant behavior.  Whether people want to admit it or not, choosing to live an LGBTQ lifestyle is a decision, and someone who'd choose that path isn't going to be a good fit in a christian academy.   it's a private institution, and they can do what they want.  Don't like it?  Don't go.    Would you approve your school hiring a flat-earther as a science teacher?  

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Let's face it. It's a simple pure fact that, if our neighbor's kids are educated, and have a firm rasp on economics, geography, history, literature, and at least basic math, they will be better neighbors. If they grow up thinking that the best option is to steal the battery out of your car while you sleep, rip off your tools out of the shed and sell them for drugs, because no one cares if you know Namibia from Nambia, and your president is a TV star because he cheats people out of pay checks....

It's just absurd even having this discussion.....

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48 minutes ago, Left Shift said:
  On 1/18/2019 at 9:16 AM, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I think you're ignoring the right of the school to employ individuals that embody their values, and one of those is to not embrace deviant behavior.  Whether people want to admit it or not, choosing to live an LGBTQ lifestyle is a decision, and someone who'd choose that path isn't going to be a good fit in a christian academy.   it's a private institution, and they can do what they want.  Don't like it?  Don't go.    Would you approve your school hiring a flat-earther as a science teacher?  

Define deviant behavior, please.

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3 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

Define deviant behavior, please.

Official Conservative Christian definition.   Anything not conducive to the only legitimate purpose of sex, making baby Christians.   

Real Conservative Christian rule: Anything the wife won't let me do, so I have to cheat to get some.   

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5 minutes ago, Lark said:

Official Conservative Christian definition.   Anything not conducive to the only legitimate purpose of sex, making baby Christians.   

Real Conservative Christian rule: Anything the wife won't let me do, so I have to cheat to get some.   

I was once asked by a psychologist if I had ever "indulged in deviant sexual behavior". I asked him to define what "deviant sexual behavior" was.

 His answer: "What do you think it means?"

 My answer: "No"

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3 hours ago, Saorsa said:

Fer fucks sake, the playing field is never even and getting the feds involved will fuck it up further.

First try getting the fuckwits to stay in school and get back to me.

Take a look at Newark NJ and Zuckerbird's 100 million that he dumped in that sewer.

Education takes more than money.  Dumping money in is not a solution and that's all the feds can do.

 

2 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Sorry, It wasn't clear before that you were an actual racist.  I thought you were just a tRumpian apologist.  "A Guy" outed himself as a homophobic asshole this week.  Now you and your racism. 

Clearly the tEam tRumptsters are feeling the stress and starting to show their true colors.  It's been a week of coming clean.  

Good for the soul.

 

2 hours ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

Saorsa insisted on calling President Barack Obama "boy" for years. He's a bitter old racist shitstain.

You poor rash-ridden babies.

I guess you don't realize that a lot of honky motherfuckwits drop out of school too.

Unless of course you meet that description.

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28 minutes ago, Saorsa said:

 

 

You poor rash-ridden babies.

I guess you don't realize that a lot of honky motherfuckwits drop out of school too.

Unless of course you meet that description.

I just want to pinch your plump pink cheek, you cutie.

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3 hours ago, Left Shift said:

Sorry, It wasn't clear before that you were an actual racist.

So pointing out that some NJ school districts fail no matter how much money is thrown at them is enough to be branded a racist?

 

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1 hour ago, bpm57 said:

So pointing out that some NJ school districts fail no matter how much money is thrown at them is enough to be branded a racist?

 

It's all the Heathers have.  Name calling middle school girlies.

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14 hours ago, J28 said:

 Because the more the Federal Government gets involved in something, the more it gets fucked up. 

67902f4fd96f4d02354b5641cb1e55b9665dec3f.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Boy ain't that the truth. The dadgum feddy-rull gubbermint cain't do NOTHIN' right!

-DSK

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Amusing thing passed my Twitter feed this morning. I don't follow any political accounts, but this DailyWire reporter got his ass handed to him by programmers, mathematicians, and AI researchers for trying to dump on AOC for being (as it turns out) 100% correct. Not a single tweet of support for his fuck up. Well done conservatives.

 

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I am starting to blame the fathers of conservative US males instead of their mothers.  Biggest thing to me is something like a gun registry.  The usual statement is that the registry may lead to greater inroads to freedom, but I am now thinking that it is a defensive response to a "wait till your father gets home" fear of punishment.  It really seems to come through in many cultural areas where "we got whupped if we strayed".  What seems like respect for authority (fathers) is actually fear of that same authority.  Fear of the authority of the federal government seems to show up as a diminution or lessening of the abilities of the federal government.  I know that too much "respect for authority" is a way not to get selected at officer candidate school if the selection board is using standard policy.

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1 minute ago, Moderate said:

We still haven't found out if the waitress takes it in the ass

Huh, well your boyfriend says you do.

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32 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Amusing thing passed my Twitter feed this morning. I don't follow any political accounts, but this DailyWire reporter got his ass handed to him by programmers, mathematicians, and AI researchers for trying to dump on AOC for being (as it turns out) 100% correct. Not a single tweet of support for his fuck up. Well done conservatives.

 

Which are written by human beings driven by the profit-motive.  But, sure, blame it on the math.

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30 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Amusing thing passed my Twitter feed this morning. I don't follow any political accounts, but this DailyWire reporter got his ass handed to him by programmers, mathematicians, and AI researchers for trying to dump on AOC for being (as it turns out) 100% correct. Not a single tweet of support for his fuck up. Well done conservatives.

 

The best part is he'd accused Facebook of discriminating against conservatives with their algorithms last year....

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44 minutes ago, Moderate said:

We still haven't found out if the waitress takes it in the ass

I have a hunch that is how you were conceived.

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26 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

The young woman throws strikes.  

50628539_10218456809990379_4664387779705

Dayum.

Now, that is a satire Twitter feed.  But, does a fine job pointing out the absurdity in their "logic".

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55 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

Dayum.

Now, that is a satire Twitter feed.  But, does a fine job pointing out the absurdity in their "logic".

I'm pretty sure that's not a satire feed, just her old account/handle, from during the campaign.  I only vaguely understand how that stuff works, but remember her changing to @AOC after winning... 

Anyways, it's a real tweet, from/by the real AOC.  I googled some keywords... it's here: 

https://twitter.com/aoc/status/1065369433982595073?lang=en

 

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10 hours ago, Laker said:

Biggest thing to me is something like a gun registry.  The usual statement is that the registry may lead to greater inroads to freedom, but I am now thinking that it is a defensive response to a "wait till your father gets home" fear of punishment. 

Not really. It's more a "wait until you die and possession of your legally purchased property by your heirs becomes a felony." There's a thread about this.

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7 hours ago, frenchie said:

I'm pretty sure that's not a satire feed, just her old account/handle, from during the campaign.  I only vaguely understand how that stuff works, but remember her changing to @AOC after winning... 

Anyways, it's a real tweet, from/by the real AOC.  I googled some keywords... it's here: 

https://twitter.com/aoc/status/1065369433982595073?lang=en

 

Funny, when I looked up the feed as identified in Sol's post (@Ocasio2018), I found this - 

Screen Shot 2019-01-25 at 6.36.32 AM.png

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I pulled it from another source, as I am not on Twatter. I might have to start, but I do not have time as it is, so it is not likely. 

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1 hour ago, SailBlueH2O said:

AOC.jpg

I think that comes from this old labor vs capitalist cartoon.    The original is even nautical.   

036C8641-1ACC-46C3-B724-0ABBDE510C28.jpeg

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1 minute ago, Lark said:

I think that comes from this old labor vs capitalist cartoon.    The original is even nautical.   

036C8641-1ACC-46C3-B724-0ABBDE510C28.jpeg

The cool thing about the capitalist model is that it is 100% voluntary.  Don't like what you are doing? Go do something better.  

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16 minutes ago, jzk said:

The cool thing about the capitalist model is that it is 100% voluntary.  Don't like what you are doing? Go do something better.  

Sure.    If you can play professional sports.    Hard to get an academic scholarship if you go to a shit community school funded by shit property taxes made possible by the shit wages available.    It’s called a poverty trap.   America is becoming a leader in this cycle, while making sure the winners of the last generation can protect their favored offspring from unfair competition by harder working and sometimes more meritorious masses.    The Republicans have yet to surpass GB, but are trying hard.    Brexit is an example of stupidity in Formerly Great Britain from similarly desperate people.    Google Great Gatsby Curves.    

C296584C-41B9-48D0-A1B7-EB0849AB2AA8.jpeg

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5 hours ago, dogballs Tom said:

That was just my point, a registry does not take away the gun, it registers it.  We are not talking about taking it away.  This is where the concept of defensiveness comes in.  Are you afraid of the acknowledgement of having a gun?  I think I should have used another analogy.  The issue here is the concept of fear, not respect, in the way that the US male deals with authority.

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18 minutes ago, Lark said:

Sure.    If you can play professional sports.    Hard to get an academic scholarship if you go to a shit community school funded by shit property taxes made possible by the shit wages available.    It’s called a poverty trap.   America is becoming a leader in this cycle, while making sure the winners of the last generation can protect their favored offspring from unfair competition by harder working and sometimes more meritorious masses.    The Republicans have yet to surpass GB, but are trying hard.    Brexit is an example of stupidity in Formerly Great Britain from similarly desperate people.    Google Great Gatsby Curves.    

C296584C-41B9-48D0-A1B7-EB0849AB2AA8.jpeg

Breaking out of the poverty trap is done by individuals.  Lots of ways to do it.  Wait tables.  Clean boat bottoms.  Learn boat canvas.  Cut lawns.  Sell shit on ebay.  Learn to paint cars at a body shop.  There are literally thousands of ways for anyone to get ahead in this society.  Your class warfare bullshit isn't actually helping anyone except the political elite.   The idea that free people are too stupid to make it in this world without your help is pretty fucking elitist of you.   

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4 minutes ago, jzk said:

Breaking out of the poverty trap is done by individuals.  Lots of ways to do it.  Wait tables.  Clean boat bottoms.  Learn boat canvas.  Cut lawns.  Sell shit on ebay.  Learn to paint cars at a body shop.  There are literally thousands of ways for anyone to get ahead in this society.  Your class warfare bullshit isn't actually helping anyone except the political elite.   The idea that free people are too stupid to make it in this world without your help is pretty fucking elitist of you.   

Why don't you share with the class some actual examples?  Let's make it in the last decade, m'kay?

and other guys - can we not turn this thread into a gun thread? seriously.

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OC was a bartender and waitress. Now she has a good paying job on the House Financial Services Committee. 

ps: guns.

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Just now, d'ranger said:

Why don't you share with the class some actual examples?  Let's make it in the last decade, m'kay?

and other guys - can we not turn this thread into a gun thread? seriously.

You want me to write a boat bottom cleaning business plan for you?  Ok.  In South Florida, the going rate is $2.50/foot on a monthly plan.  Let's take a typical 40 foot powerboat.  I have never seen a diver take more than like an hour to clean such a boat.  Probably less on the monthly plan.  $100 for an hour plus travel & expenses.   One could disrupt the whole industry by doing $1.50 per foot.  Hire a helper for $20/hour and do entire marinas all in a shot.   You are taking in $60/hour (or better) and paying out $20 in labor.  Now add zinc changes to the mix, and you have yourself a nice little business.  Education is a diver class.  Equipment is a tank and a scraper.  You can even get one of those plug in systems and avoid the whole diver certification thing if you want.  

Take that and apply it to 1,000 possible other businesses.  Anyone can do anything if they have drive.  

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5 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

Why don't you share with the class some actual examples?  Let's make it in the last decade, m'kay?

and other guys - can we not turn this thread into a gun thread? seriously.

Sorry, did not mean for it to be a gun thread.  Wanted it to be a comment on why she is getting all this back talk. 

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6 minutes ago, jzk said:

You want me to write a boat bottom cleaning business plan for you?  Ok.  In South Florida, the going rate is $2.50/foot on a monthly plan.  Let's take a typical 40 foot powerboat.  I have never seen a diver take more than like an hour to clean such a boat.  Probably less on the monthly plan.  $100 for an hour plus travel & expenses.   One could disrupt the whole industry by doing $1.50 per foot.  Hire a helper for $20/hour and do entire marinas all in a shot.   You are taking in $60/hour (or better) and paying out $20 in labor.  Now add zinc changes to the mix, and you have yourself a nice little business.  Education is a diver class.  Equipment is a tank and a scraper.  You can even get one of those plug in systems and avoid the whole diver certification thing if you want.  

Take that and apply it to 1,000 possible other businesses.  Anyone can do anything if they have drive.  

lol, I love you jerkz

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18 minutes ago, jzk said:

You want me to write a boat bottom cleaning business plan for you?  Ok.  In South Florida, the going rate is $2.50/foot on a monthly plan.  Let's take a typical 40 foot powerboat.  I have never seen a diver take more than like an hour to clean such a boat.  Probably less on the monthly plan.  $100 for an hour plus travel & expenses.   One could disrupt the whole industry by doing $1.50 per foot.  Hire a helper for $20/hour and do entire marinas all in a shot.   You are taking in $60/hour (or better) and paying out $20 in labor.  Now add zinc changes to the mix, and you have yourself a nice little business.  Education is a diver class.  Equipment is a tank and a scraper.  You can even get one of those plug in systems and avoid the whole diver certification thing if you want.  

Take that and apply it to 1,000 possible other businesses.  Anyone can do anything if they have drive.  

America is becoming a failure of the industrialized world in regard to income inequality and opportunity by merit.    You argue the lack of upward mobility in the US has nothing to do with education and tax code.   You claim it reflects a congenital laziness and stupidity of Americans?      The melting pot has removed the temper from the raw ore that once made America great, resulting in soft scrap.   You just made an argument for open immigration so we can reclaim the title of average human beings.    Shame on you for disparaging your countrymen in such a manner.

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1 minute ago, Lark said:

America is becoming a failure of the industrialized world in regard to income inequality and opportunity by merit.    You argue the lack of upward mobility in the US has nothing to do with education and tax code.   You claim it reflects a congenital laziness and stupidity of Americans?      The melting pot has removed the temper from the raw ore that once made America great, resulting in soft scrap.   You just made an argument for open immigration so we can reclaim the title of average human beings.    Shame on you for disparaging your countrymen in such a manner.

I fully support open immigration.  No welfare.  No diseases or criminals.  Long path to citizenship.  Let anyone that wants to come and work for a new life.  Also, it would be nice if we could have the economic freedom that we used to have.

I know a 64 year old gentleman from the Dominican Republic.  Maybe some of you know him too.  He polishes boats at Bahia Mar in Fort Lauderdale by hand.  I saw him last week polish a boat for $500.  He worked three days, 5 hours per day.  He has no shortage of work.  Some people are whiners while other people are doers.  That is the difference.

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5 minutes ago, jzk said:

I fully support open immigration.  No welfare.  No diseases or criminals.  Long path to citizenship.  Let anyone that wants to come and work for a new life.  Also, it would be nice if we could have the economic freedom that we used to have.

I know a 64 year old gentleman from the Dominican Republic.  Maybe some of you know him too.  He polishes boats at Bahia Mar in Fort Lauderdale by hand.  I saw him last week polish a boat for $500.  He worked three days, 5 hours per day.  He has no shortage of work.  Some people are whiners while other people are doers.  That is the difference.

Great example of success.

How many people in the surrounding community would like work at those wages? What would happen to the wages if one morning, a thousand people (let's assume they all somehow acquire the appropriate gear and training) show up to clean boat bottoms?

-DSK

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12 minutes ago, Lark said:

America is becoming a failure of the industrialized world in regard to income inequality and opportunity by merit.   

Why is income inequality a bad thing?  If some one serves society more than someone else, is it wrong that they are compensated for it?

Take Ellen Degenerous.  She pulls down something like $75 million per year.  But, the facts are that she provides a huge number of people with desired entertainment that they seem to be willing to pay for.  Should we prohibit Ellen from this outrageous income inequality?

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10 minutes ago, jzk said:

I fully support open immigration.  No welfare.  No diseases or criminals.  Long path to citizenship.  Let anyone that wants to come and work for a new life.  Also, it would be nice if we could have the economic freedom that we used to have.

I know a 64 year old gentleman from the Dominican Republic.  Maybe some of you know him too.  He polishes boats at Bahia Mar in Fort Lauderdale by hand.  I saw him last week polish a boat for $500.  He worked three days, 5 hours per day.  He has no shortage of work.  Some people are whiners while other people are doers.  That is the difference.

So you are even more liberal then me on immigration,   Congratulations.    Now to the claim that most Americans are too dumb and lazy to grasp at opportunity, but hard working people in Oz, Canada, Kiwi, and especially the great socialist democracies of Europe do better doesn’t trouble you?   Why are Americans so inferior to all those people in your estimation?   

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1 minute ago, Steam Flyer said:

Great example of success.

How many people in the surrounding community would like work at those wages? What would happen to the wages if one morning, a thousand people (let's assume they all somehow acquire the appropriate gear and training) show up to clean boat bottoms?

-DSK

They would quickly find that the bottom cleaning opportunity in that area is saturated, so they might look into something else like diesel oil changes, marine canvas, boat cleaning, and a thousand other opportunities.

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1 minute ago, Lark said:

So you are even more liberal then me on immigration,   Congratulations.    Now to the claim that most Americans are too dumb and lazy to grasp at opportunity, but hard working people in Oz, Canada, Kiwi, and especially the great socialist democracies of Europe doesn’t trouble you?   Why are Americans so inferior to all those people in your estimation?   

Free flow of labor is the only real capitalist position.  Why should some ambitious person that is willing to work hard for their family be stuck in a shithole like Haiti when they could be more valuable for themselves, their family and society somewhere else.

Please explain your "hard working" people question.  What are you asking me?  Are you suggesting that the great socialist democracies of Europe are really socialist?  

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5 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Great example of success.

How many people in the surrounding community would like work at those wages? What would happen to the wages if one morning, a thousand people (let's assume they all somehow acquire the appropriate gear and training) show up to clean boat bottoms?

-DSK

FYI, the Dominican guy told me he cleans boats so he can send his kids to college.  He doesn't want his kids cleaning boats.  He is cleaning boats, so they don't have to.

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3 minutes ago, jzk said:
5 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Great example of success.

How many people in the surrounding community would like work at those wages? What would happen to the wages if one morning, a thousand people (let's assume they all somehow acquire the appropriate gear and training) show up to clean boat bottoms?

 

They would quickly find that the bottom cleaning opportunity in that area is saturated, so they might look into something else like diesel oil changes, marine canvas, boat cleaning, and a thousand other opportunities.

You didn't answer the question

What would happen to the wages offered for boat bottom cleaning?

Then, that market became "saturated" with labor on offer, what would happen to the wages of these other "opportunities"?

-DSK

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Just now, Steam Flyer said:

You didn't answer the question

What would happen to the wages offered for boat bottom cleaning?

Then, that market became "saturated" with labor on offer, what would happen to the wages of these other "opportunities"?

-DSK

The wages would go down.  And then people would do something else.  The very best bottom cleaners would be the ones that survive in that business.  And, more people would have their bottoms cleaned because it would be more affordable.  

What is the problem? What is your point?

Regardless, the opportunity I described is available right now in this very day and age to anyone that wants it.  When I say there are thousands of other opportunities, it might even be millions.

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9 minutes ago, jzk said:
12 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

...    ...    ... What would happen to the wages offered for boat bottom cleaning?

Then, that market became "saturated" with labor on offer, what would happen to the wages of these other "opportunities"?

 

The wages would go down.  And then people would do something else.  The very best bottom cleaners would be the ones that survive in that business.  And, more people would have their bottoms cleaned because it would be more affordable.  

What is the problem? What is your point?

Regardless, the opportunity I described is available right now in this very day and age to anyone that wants it.  When I say there are thousands of other opportunities, it might even be millions.

Bingo, wages would go down. Good answer.

The rest is just fluffy wishful thinking. "The very best bottom cleaners" would be the ones who were willing to continue work for the lowering wages in a downward spiral, until enough other bottom cleaners said "I quit" to stabilize wages.

From http://www.ncsl.org/research/labor-and-employment/national-employment-monthly-update.aspx

National Unemployment Rate at 3.9 Percent Through December 2018

Approximately 312,000 jobs were created in December 2018 and the national unemployment rate rose to 3.9 percent, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Employment increased in health care, food services and drinking places, construction, manufacturing and retail trade.

Then the actual numbers from actual reality say that there are somewhere around 6.3 million people unemployed in the US, as of December 2018. So yeah, there better be millions of opportunities. The reports of new jobs generally runs more in the low hundred-thousands, so clearly it's falling short.

-DSK

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Just now, Steam Flyer said:

Bingo, wages would go down. Good answer.

The rest is just fluffy wishful thinking. "The very best bottom cleaners" would be the ones who were willing to continue work for the lowering wages in a downward spiral, until enough other bottom cleaners said "I quit" to stabilize wages.

From http://www.ncsl.org/research/labor-and-employment/national-employment-monthly-update.aspx

National Unemployment Rate at 3.9 Percent Through December 2018

Approximately 312,000 jobs were created in December 2018 and the national unemployment rate rose to 3.9 percent, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Employment increased in health care, food services and drinking places, construction, manufacturing and retail trade.

Then the actual numbers from actual reality say that there are somewhere around 6.3 million people unemployed in the US, as of December 2018. So yeah, there better be millions of opportunities. The reports of new jobs generally runs more in the low hundred-thousands, so clearly it's falling short.

-DSK

Yet any one of them could go into the bottom cleaning business and do very well.  Another could do mobile oil changes.  Both are very easy to learn if you have access to a cell phone and youtube.  

And there are millions.  In a capitalist economy, there are more jobs than people.

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10 minutes ago, jzk said:

Yet any one of them could go into the bottom cleaning business and do very well.  Another could do mobile oil changes.  Both are very easy to learn if you have access to a cell phone and youtube.  

And there are millions.  In a capitalist economy, there are more jobs than people.

Are you saying that the US isn't capitalist?

-DSK

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so what if there are lots of jobs? the question is what do these new jobs pay - not per hour, per week, per month, per year. not bullshit jerkz math, whats the actual return of these jobs - because your bottom cleaner contractor isn't taking home $40/hr on someone elses labor in your example. And thats leaving out just how long it would take the guy who you are paying $20/hr to undercut you.

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1 minute ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

so what? the question is what do these new jobs pay. not bullshit jerkz math, whats the actual return of these jobs - because your bottom cleaner contractor isn't taking home $40/hr on someone elses labor.

Well give it a try.  The bottom cleaner sure seems to be taking home good coin.  Much better than the Dominican boat polisher.  He seems to be taking in about $37/hour.  Neither are starvation wages though.  

Then as these people make money, they spend it too.  More jobs for even more people.  Much better than sitting around on welfare waiting for the government to come and solve their problems for them.

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3 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Are you saying that the US isn't capitalist?

-DSK

It is not capitalist enough.  

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1 hour ago, Laker said:

Sorry, did not mean for it to be a gun thread.  Wanted it to be a comment on why she is getting all this back talk. 

Don't ever mention guns in a thread unless you want Dogballs to hijack it and make a couple of hundred unanswered posts over the next ten years. This one is in danger.

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1 hour ago, jzk said:

FYI, the Dominican guy told me he cleans boats so he can send his kids to college.  He doesn't want his kids cleaning boats.  He is cleaning boats, so they don't have to.

Well, that is the story of every immigrant.  Probably the story of your grandfather.  

Your bottom cleaning scenario is, by the way, proof that you have let your ideology get out in front of our rational thought process.  Your half-baked "business plan" assumes that:

1.  The market place is not saturated already and that there are unhappy customers waiting to save a shekel or two on an unproven competitor.  I have my guy and I have 3 other dive services that call me and ask if I want to give them a try.  

2.  There are only one or two cleaning services working in the area and they have colluded on setting high prices rather than competing with each other.  Those other dive services all charge within $5 bucks of each other.  I wonder why. :rolleyes:

3.  The start-up diver-wannabe has the several thousand dollars needed to acquire all the necessary gear.

4.  That those "incidental" costs like transportation, taxes, FICA, insurance, etc. need to be accounted for.  And they add up fast.

5.  That the diver-wannabe has rent, food, health care maybe child care or car loans, etc. covered while the business ramps up

6.  That the diver-wannabe has a 2nd gig that will cover the down-time winter months.   I double the time between dives on my boat in the winter.

 

Its easy to claim that those bootstraps are just there for the pulling up, but the truth is, it ain't easy.  

 

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4 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

Well, that is the story of every immigrant.  Probably the story of your grandfather.  

Your bottom cleaning scenario is, by the way, proof that you have let your ideology get out in front of our rational thought process.  Your half-baked "business plan" assumes that:

1.  The market place is not saturated already and that there are unhappy customers waiting to save a shekel or two on an unproven competitor.  I have my guy and I have 3 other dive services that call me and ask if I want to give them a try.  

2.  There are only one or two cleaning services working in the area and they have colluded on setting high prices rather than competing with each other.  Those other dive services all charge within $5 bucks of each other.  I wonder why. :rolleyes:

3.  The start-up diver-wannabe has the several thousand dollars needed to acquire all the necessary gear.

4.  That those "incidental" costs like transportation, taxes, FICA, insurance, etc. need to be accounted for.  And they add up fast.

5.  That the diver-wannabe has rent, food, health care maybe child care or car loans, etc. covered while the business ramps up

6.  That the diver-wannabe has a 2nd gig that will cover the down-time winter months.   I double the time between dives on my boat in the winter.

 

Its easy to claim that those bootstraps are just there for the pulling up, but the truth is, it ain't easy.  

 

The diver example was in Florida.  Every business requires a ramp up period, so maybe wait tables or something in the evenings.  Maybe even polishing boats by hand.   If you think there is collusion in the bottom cleaning business, even better for the start up that wants to disrupt.  A diver does not need "several thousand dollars" for equipment.  But even if that were true, it is possible.

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1 hour ago, jzk said:

Yet any one of them could go into the bottom cleaning business and do very well.  Another could do mobile oil changes.  Both are very easy to learn if you have access to a cell phone and youtube.  

And there are millions.  In a capitalist economy, there are more jobs than people.

Then capital will make sure there are not.  It is inherent that capital predominates where it can.  The maximization of capital requires the suppression of labour because there are only two things you can sell in this world, capital or labour.

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Just now, Laker said:

Then capital will make sure there are not.  It is inherent that capital predominates where it can.  The maximization of capital requires the suppression of labour because there are only two things you can sell in this world, capital or labour.

How so?  How will capital prevent a bottom cleaner from growing the business?  By your philosophy, there are no businesses that can start from scratch.   The idea that capital requires the suppression of labor is nonsense.  

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5 minutes ago, Laker said:
1 hour ago, jzk said:

Yet any one of them could go into the bottom cleaning business and do very well.  Another could do mobile oil changes.  Both are very easy to learn if you have access to a cell phone and youtube.  

And there are millions.  In a capitalist economy, there are more jobs than people.

Then capital will make sure there are not.  It is inherent that capital predominates where it can.  The maximization of capital requires the suppression of labour because there are only two things you can sell in this world, capital or labour.

True, but remember JZK's position is that Amurrikuh ain't capitalist enough.

But to say "there are more jobs than people" in a country where there are over 6 million currently looking for jobs and not finding them, while the creation of two hundred thousand (which is a lot, but isn't 1/6th of 1/4 enough for the millions) is exactly the kind of stupidity that we rightly bash JZK for.

That, and not knowing about the capital/labor split. Kind of like a person claiming to be an investment advisor not knowing equity/debt.

-DSK

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2 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

True, but remember JZK's position is that Amurrikuh ain't capitalist enough.

But to say "there are more jobs than people" in a country where there are over 6 million currently looking for jobs and not finding them, while the creation of two hundred thousand (which is a lot, but isn't 1/6th of 1/4 enough for the millions) is exactly the kind of stupidity that we rightly bash JZK for.

That, and not knowing about the capital/labor split. Kind of like a person claiming to be an investment advisor not knowing equity/debt.

-DSK

You say "true" to the statement that capital will make sure that there is not.  How does capital prevent the diver from growing "her" business?

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7 minutes ago, jzk said:

How so?  How will capital prevent a bottom cleaner from growing the business?  By your philosophy, there are no businesses that can start from scratch.   The idea that capital requires the suppression of labor is nonsense.  

Because there will be others entering the business if it has any legs.  Then those in the business will realize the efficiencies of joining together in some form.  All will do better.  Then one of the businesses will fully buy out another due to, say retirement.  They will also be buying the others goodwill, which will make it more difficult for others to enter the business.  Eventually the business gets reduced to one or two suppliers.  To this statement,. I was used to dealing with commercial divers in the Gulf at $300 a day in 1980s dollars.  They are now going for $15 an hour.  The number of major players is also way down.

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Just now, Laker said:

Because there will be others entering the business if it has any legs.  Then those in the business will realize the efficiencies of joining together in some form.  All will do better.  Then one of the businesses will fully buy out another due to, say retirement.  They will also be buying the others goodwill, which will make it more difficult for others to enter the business.  Eventually the business gets reduced to one or two suppliers.  To this statement,. I was used to dealing with commercial divers in the Gulf at $300 a day in 1980s dollars.  They are now going for $15 an hour.  The number of major players is also way down.

The dominican guy has been washing/polishing boats at Bahia Mar and other marinas in the area for 25 years.  No one is pushing him out.  Every year, more and more boats arrive that need such cleaning and other maintenance.  

Are there one or two restaurant brands in the US?  Does McDonalds and Burger King keep anyone from starting up?

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7 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

Funny, when I looked up the feed as identified in Sol's post (@Ocasio2018), I found this - 

Screen Shot 2019-01-25 at 6.36.32 AM.png

Link?  Pretty sure that's a zero, not a letter O, in the first position of "Ocasio".

Also, no blue checkmark.

 

Anyways, the tweet's genuinely hers.   I linked it, ya?

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Dive gear for sale. Several thousand dollars worth of the real thing. No shipping available. You too can ruin your shoulders in under 5 years and retire on disability. Send for my online book on Making It in America. Tips, tales, tell-alls ... ten bucks. Book free with gear purchase.

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2 minutes ago, frenchie said:

Link?  Pretty sure that's a zero, not a letter O, in the first position of "Ocasio".

Also, no blue checkmark.

Letter O.  Zero 0  Zeros are thinner.

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2 hours ago, jzk said:

Well give it a try.  The bottom cleaner sure seems to be taking home good coin.  Much better than the Dominican boat polisher.  He seems to be taking in about $37/hour.  Neither are starvation wages though.  

my point dipshit was your figures indicate you have no fucking clue what they are earning. gross != net.

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2 minutes ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

my point dipshit was your figures indicate you have no fucking clue what they are earning. gross != net.

Nah, I mentioned expenses.  Come up with something better.

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39 minutes ago, jzk said:

Letter O.  Zero 0  Zeros are thinner.

Yes, exactly. 

To clarify:  I'm referring to the character right after "@", in the screenshot BD posted in post #1740.  It's visibly thinner than the character right after the "@" in Sol's post, #1736.

 

Google confirms, by the way.  Type in "@0casio2018" (using zero), you get:

https://twitter.com/0casio2018?lang=en

the same profile BD posted in #1740.

"@Ocasio2018", using the letter O, takes you to "that account doesn't exist", or tweets that are nowadays under her actual account, @AOC.

 

Like, for example, the one Sol posted (and I already linked, upthread, already):

 

Fucking hell, guys, how far off into the weeds are we gonna take this minor, unimportant, side-issue?  It was a real tweet, by her.  That is all. 

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1 minute ago, Mismoyled Jiblet. said:

it reminds me of a bullshit youtube scammer convincing people they can make money buying Amazon's castoffs.

Maybe you can.  But if that youtube scammer knew how, the last thing he or she would be doing is making youtube videos on how.

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1 hour ago, jzk said:

The dominican guy has been washing/polishing boats at Bahia Mar and other marinas in the area for 25 years.  No one is pushing him out.  Every year, more and more boats arrive that need such cleaning and other maintenance.  

Are there one or two restaurant brands in the US?  Does McDonalds and Burger King keep anyone from starting up?

Not so good a this "thinking things through" business are you.

1.  Interesting that "no one is pushing him out."  Must mean that everybody else around is a no-good lazy welfare sponge who can't see the glorious business opportunity awaiting them.  Or it could mean that he's pretty much saturated the market.  

So the marina must be partially empty for those "more and more" boats to arrive?  If so, and it's filling fast, why isn't your Dominican (fully documented I'm sure) being challenged by upstarts?

Extra credit:  Divide the population of the US by the slips in the marina and you might get a sense of the proper restaurant/dive business ratio.

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9 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

Not so good a this "thinking things through" business are you.

1.  Interesting that "no one is pushing him out."  Must mean that everybody else around is a no-good lazy welfare sponge who can't see the glorious business opportunity awaiting them.  Or it could mean that he's pretty much saturated the market.  

So the marina must be partially empty for those "more and more" boats to arrive?  If so, and it's filling fast, why isn't your Dominican (fully documented I'm sure) being challenged by upstarts?

Extra credit:  Divide the population of the US by the slips in the marina and you might get a sense of the proper restaurant/dive business ratio.

Why did you use a 1 if there is no 2?  You think this 64 year old guy from the Dominican Republic who compound/waxes boats by hand has saturated the market?  

New marinas are being built in Florida all the time.  Were you aware of that?

Your post is of no value to this conversation.  Not even close.

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17 hours ago, Laker said:
23 hours ago, dogballs Tom said:

That was just my point, a registry does not take away the gun, it registers it.  We are not talking about taking it away.  This is where the concept of defensiveness comes in.  Are you afraid of the acknowledgement of having a gun?

I am talking about taking it away. When possession of something is a felony, it's normal to talk about taking it away.

There's a whole thread about my assault weapon, and the desire of legislators in my state to ban and confiscate it.

I'm not afraid of acknowledging that I own it, but like the majority of gun owners in places where bans closed registries are passed, I would never sign up to have my property confiscated.

"We" are not talking about the fact that making possession a felony is talking about taking it away only because you are not willing to talk about it. That doesn't mean the facts escape gun owners, which is why such a small percentage signed up for the confiscation program in Billy's thread.

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Ocasio thread here, Tom. You can prove you're not the one obsessed with firearms and leave the subject alone or continue proving that you'll obsess about them in any/all threads given an excuse. 

I wouldn't bet on you proving reasonable but there is a first time for everything. Hope I'm wrong. 

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On 1/24/2019 at 6:02 PM, Laker said:

Biggest thing to me is something like a gun registry.

 

9 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Ocasio thread here, Laker. You can prove firearms aren't the biggest thing to you.

Fixerated.

It's always my fault when someone else mentions guns. And always extremely BAD if I take it to a gun thread. Or respond in the thread where it was mentioned. Or generally mention the fact that we ARE talking about taking guns away. That's the main issue of controversy in the gun debate these days and a registry is the vehicle.

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Didn't say it was your fault for bringing it up. Said it was an Ocasio thread and you could prove you weren't the fixated one by getting back in topic. Looks like you cannot overcome your obsession no matter what subject the thread is about. 

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12 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Didn't say it was your fault for bringing it up. Said it was an Ocasio thread and you could prove you weren't the fixated one by getting back in topic. Looks like you cannot overcome your obsession no matter what subject the thread is about. 

Looks like someone is obsessed with another's posting habits.

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Just now, jzk said:

Looks like someone is obsessed with another's posting habits.

Bent has control issues.  But, he doesn't have control.

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5 minutes ago, Saorsa said:
6 minutes ago, jzk said:

Looks like someone is obsessed with another's posting habits.

Bent has control issues.  But, he doesn't have control

Define irony. :lol:

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8 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Define irony. :lol:

Seriously?

I don't give orders to other posters as you seem to do frequently.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Saorsa said:

Seriously?

I don't give orders to other posters as you seem to do frequently.

I didn't give orders either. Merely made an observation on what future posts could indicate. 

And you're still talking about me and how I post, so yeah "seriously". :lol:

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34 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

I didn't give orders either. Merely made an observation on what future posts could indicate. 

And you're still talking about me and how I post, so yeah "seriously". :lol:

(Just between us, have you noticed how often dogballs quotes himself?)

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14 hours ago, dogballs Tom said:

I am talking about taking it away. When possession of something is a felony, it's normal to talk about taking it away.

There's a whole thread about my assault weapon, and the desire of legislators in my state to ban and confiscate it.

I'm not afraid of acknowledging that I own it, but like the majority of gun owners in places where bans closed registries are passed, I would never sign up to have my property confiscated.

"We" are not talking about the fact that making possession a felony is talking about taking it away only because you are not willing to talk about it. That doesn't mean the facts escape gun owners, which is why such a small percentage signed up for the confiscation program in Billy's thread.

Wouldn't the best place to start be just to confiscate all guns and then let people buy them based on agreeing to certain, constitutionally defined needs?  A 1776 restart.

For instance, one acceptable reason would be a willingness to join a well-regulated militia and abide by the discipline established by Congress.  

Wanting to shoot varmints might not pass constitutional muster.

Now that would be a breath of fresh air.  Wouldn't it!

 

I think I'll send this idea to AOC.

 

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8 minutes ago, Blue Crab said:

(Just between us, have you noticed how often dogballs quotes himself?)

Yes, and how he responds to himself too. Which he does a lot when folks like @Left Shift don't give him an excuse to indulge in his favoured subjects.

Around the rest of the Internet, Godwin's Law holds sway. Here in PA, Tom Ray's Law (any excuse to discuss guns will be found and taken by Tom) gets in first. 

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34 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

Here in PA, Tom Ray's Law (any excuse to discuss guns will be found and taken by Tom) gets in first.

Or-someone else makes the topic guns, and Tom gets chastised for daring to respond to the person who brought up the topic.

The echo chamber cries when topics get moved and  responded to in the appropriate thread, and they whine just as loudly when things are responded to in the original thread. If the echo chamber just wants a circle jerk with no contrary opinions, there are websites that specialize in that.

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24 minutes ago, bpm57 said:

Or-someone else makes the topic guns, and Tom gets chastised for daring to respond to the person who brought up the topic.

The echo chamber cries when topics get moved and  responded to in the appropriate thread, and they whine just as loudly when things are responded to in the original thread. If the echo chamber just wants a circle jerk with no contrary opinions, there are websites that specialize in that.

Only one person guaranteed to jump in on a gun topic. Not even jocal is as consistent as Tom in that regard and no-one debates he's obsessed. 

Got nothing to do with echo chamber; but you beat that drum as hard as you like. For anyone but Tom, it would be a good deflection. 

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