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Monkey

Need some suggestions

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The boat owner I sail with is looking to change boats. I’m trying my best to steer him towards at least a semi-fun boat. He wants something cruising friendly, but still wants to do distance racing. 35-40 feet and a budget of about 100 grand. My best idea so far has been a Benny 40.7. Any of you have better ideas?

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what area?

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Just now, VWAP said:

what area?

Lake Michigan. Good question, because shipping is obviously a cost issue. 

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If you can convince him to come up another $30-40K a J/109 is a fantastic boat in that category and there are plenty of them in that area for OD racing.

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41 minutes ago, Hugh Jorgan said:

If you can convince him to come up another $30-40K a J/109 is a fantastic boat in that category and there are plenty of them in that area for OD racing.

plusse oune!!!  Ist wifey on bourde?                                  :)

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8 hours ago, Monkey said:

The boat owner I sail with is looking to change boats. I’m trying my best to steer him towards at least a semi-fun boat. He wants something cruising friendly, but still wants to do distance racing. 35-40 feet and a budget of about 100 grand. My best idea so far has been a Benny 40.7. Any of you have better ideas?

Depends if the 100k is purchase budget or total budget. If it’s total budget and there’s nothing more for new sails, then think about a 36.7. Difference in the purchase price will then allow for some new sails. Very few boats that race are sold with fresh sails, and it wouldn’t be a lot of fun to have a new boat and be limited by someone else’s old sails.

 

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Monkey, you probably already know this, but the First 40.7 (and First 36.7) are both very lightly ballasted and need a lot of crew to hold them down in anything over 8 knots of wind. That means the owner will need a large crew pool from which to draw.

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4 hours ago, Somebody Else said:

Monkey, you probably already know this, but the First 40.7 (and First 36.7) are both very lightly ballasted and need a lot of crew to hold them down in anything over 8 knots of wind. That means the owner will need a large crew pool from which to draw.

I haven’t sailed on a 36.7, but have done a Mac on a 40.7 and was ok with it. I’m not hung up on a beach ball, it was just an idea. His emphasis is very much more cruiser/racer than racer/cruiser. The boat being replaced is a C&C 33. 

To answer a few of the other questions, 100 is the all in budget for year one, then the usual sail budget moving on. As long as the current inventory is functional for the first year, it doesn’t need to be perfect. This will just be for very casual club racing and cruising. 

A 109 would be awesome, but stretches the budget pretty hard. 

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+1 on the 36.7 

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5 minutes ago, Baldur said:

+1 on the 36.7 

I think you guys are on to something. Appreciate the help!

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6 minutes ago, Monkey said:

I think you guys are on to something. Appreciate the help!

Here's a 40.7 in Rochester that fits your description.  I know the boat, and while it's been a few years since I've seen it or sailed against it, it was always very well maintained.  RCR is a very good brokerage.

http://www.rcryachts.com/used/beneteau-first-407-1489428435

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6 minutes ago, Monkey said:

I think you guys are on to something. Appreciate the help!

the 36.7 can be a lot of fun in one design, and I think there's a good fleet on Lake Michigan.  But it's hard to sail them to their phrf rating (sticky in light wind), so may be frustrating in mixed fleets. 

 

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56 minutes ago, PeterHuston said:

Here's a 40.7 in Rochester that fits your description.  I know the boat, and while it's been a few years since I've seen it or sailed against it, it was always very well maintained.  RCR is a very good brokerage.

http://www.rcryachts.com/used/beneteau-first-407-1489428435

I will definitely pass that info on. Thanks!

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I didn't see any for sale in your area but the Ben 42.7 has a Yuge main salon, at least the one I sailed on, there are a couple in our area that do well in phrf.  Being a bit older should fit the budget. 

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I like the J-36. But compared to the 36.7 the cockpit is cramped and the interior is just not in the same category for cruising/entertaining. 

Phrfnw rates them both at 81. And i would agree that it comes down to boat prep and sailing ability on who is going to move thru the water faster than the other. 

Nice price point in the J for sure. 

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I have to admit to falling into the 36.7 camp on this one.. owned and raced one for a while, and disagree with them being "tender" boats. my biggest complaint was that helm was a bit numb. I like driving my J35 a lot more, but the 36.7 was a lot of boat then for the money and at the prices they're asking now even better. I just really didn't need all the cruisy shit inside.

and for me it seemed kinda dumb to have that much money tied up in amenities I rarely used.

they are nice boats, and really fun to drive downwind in big breeze.. that big fat ass keeps it from gettin all rolly and it feels very stable.

in comping it to a 40.7 it's almost hard to tell the difference until you start buying sails.

the 40.7 is an order of magnitude more expensive for a full suit.

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If you are going to distance race on the Great Lakes why not look at a J/120? There are a few around for sale around 99-120k. Winter is a good time to haggle, and if he is committed to spending 100 whats another 10k?

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On 11/23/2018 at 1:52 PM, Monkey said:

The boat owner I sail with is looking to change boats. I’m trying my best to steer him towards at least a semi-fun boat. He wants something cruising friendly, but still wants to do distance racing. 35-40 feet and a budget of about 100 grand. My best idea so far has been a Benny 40.7. Any of you have better ideas?

just out of curiosity, what is the current boat?

oh never mind, just saw C&C 33... must be a lot like a Viking 33

 

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9 minutes ago, 'Bacco said:

If you are going to distance race on the Great Lakes why not look at a J/120? There are a few around for sale around 99-120k. Winter is a good time to haggle, and if he is committed to spending 100 whats another 10k?

Going from a C&C 33 to a J/120 would be a big jump unless the owner and crew have been on bigger asymmetrical boats. A J/109 or J/105 is a smaller jump 

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19 minutes ago, RATM said:

Going from a C&C 33 to a J/120 would be a big jump unless the owner and crew have been on bigger asymmetrical boats. A J/109 or J/105 is a smaller jump 

True, but who wants to distance race or cruise a 105?

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19 minutes ago, 'Bacco said:

True, but who wants to distance race or cruise a 105?

I wouldn't be thrilled with cruising a 109 either.. and I've raced on them a lot. I like them for racing. and a better distance racer than the 36.7.( the bunks suck for sleeping underway. And hard to rig pipe berths in em.)

we're I interested in cruising, I'd have no bones about taking off for a month or 3 on a 36.7.

plenty of storage for food and gear, the fridge on mine would make ice cubes. held enough water to take a shower every now and then with hot water. hands down a better cruising boat than any of the Jsprits. Perhaps not as well built.. but if you're not going thousands of miles offshore wtf?

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1 hour ago, 'Bacco said:

If you are going to distance race on the Great Lakes why not look at a J/120? There are a few around for sale around 99-120k. Winter is a good time to haggle, and if he is committed to spending 100 whats another 10k?

That was the first boat I suggested to him. A quick search that day didn’t show anything in his price range. Minimal effort’s been made so far though, since he was leaving on vacation the next morning. 

Edit:  I also mentioned a J/110. 

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I don't think anyone has chimed in with the Farr 395 as an alternative.  Will probably save you 2-3 crew needed to get the boat to leave the dock.  Most of the Carroll Marine issues have been fixed on the boats by now.

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Just now, Looper said:

I don't think anyone has chimed in with the Farr 395 as an alternative.  Will probably save you 2-3 crew needed to get the boat to leave the dock.  Most of the Carroll Marine issues have been fixed on the boats by now.

I had thought of those, but prices were far higher than his budget. 

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A friend of mine is looking with similar requirements, though leaning a bit more towards the racy side. Short list are J/120's and Aerodyne 38's. The 120's tend to have better sail inventory. List price isn't always the best guide as I'm willing to bet many boats get sold at >20%  below list price.

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Wife and I DH our 40.7 all the time in 15-20 kts. and we're OLD. We use a #3 on a furler and flatten the shit out of the main but you would have to do that with every one of the choices offered so far. The 40.7 sails may be an order of magnitude more expensive but the boat is an order of magnitude more boat for cruising so pick your poison. The biggest complaint I  have is the traveler across the cockpit makes tacking a challenge when SHed. An autopilot comes in very handy at that time. Otherwise  I'd look at moving the traveler to the cockpit sole. 

Bottom line: we love ours. 

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I had a thought this morning that your owner friend should look into a C & C 41. I really like the looks of them, very nicely set up for cruising and not a bad boat for club racing either. There are enough of them on the market in the upper Midwest and E Coast at prices that clearly leave room for delivery and some mods to make them a little more friendly for SH sailing. 

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