Kiwing

How many challengers will there be?

How many challengers?  

127 members have voted

  1. 1. How many challengers will race the Prada Cup?

    • 3 - that is no new challengers
    • 4 that is one new challengers
    • 5 that is two new challengers
    • 6 that is three new challengers
    • more than three new challengers


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1 hour ago, dg_sailingfan said:

I disagree. While AC 32 was close (I was in VLC in 2007) it only had 7 Races (5-2). AC 34 had 19 Races and a 9-8 Score.

And if it wasn't for the somewhat questionable comeback, it would've been over in 10.

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5 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

There was no questionable Comeback. If you call OTUSA having a questionable there then I am going to call ETNZ having a questionable device in 2017.

When you can prove they have cheated, or broken any rule, at any time , someone might believe you. Until then, thats just another stupid conspiracy theory. Water under the bridge shall we say...or lead in the kingpost lol

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^^^ see, what did I tell ya! there's one down vote now lol

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11 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

If you believe that the 2000 LVC Challenger Finals can match the 34th AC in San Francisco you're gravely mistaken. No Sailing Event can match that Drama.

Surely that is entirely down to personal taste?  Some people prefer to watch something they can relate to, something utterly different like the Vendee, or something that shows people who are utterly on top of a game they know well and have spent thousands of hours practising. AC34 didn't offer those appeals.

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2 hours ago, Curious said:

Surely that is entirely down to personal taste?  Some people prefer to watch something they can relate to, something utterly different like the Vendee, or something that shows people who are utterly on top of a game they know well and have spent thousands of hours practising. AC34 didn't offer those appeals.

I've been trying to watch broadcasts of AC since the 70s and from a pure spectator viewing point AC34 was far better than anything else, followed by AC33. Sailing in Valencia was sort of viewable but most races were over in 1 minute and then the rest was just waiting for the finish line and the animated graphics was more exciting than the TV pictures actually.

 

So for AC35 to be exuding they need to spend money on good TV production and hope the races are sort of even.

 

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8 hours ago, Forourselves said:

And if it wasn't for the somewhat questionable comeback, it would've been over in 10.

Nothing questionable about the comeback. It reminded me of the Ali fight against, I think, Foreman where he was pinned in the corner, gloves up then unleashed a flurry of punches that took the bout. Oracle USA proved beyond a doubt that it ain’t over until the fat lady stops singing.

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1 hour ago, arneelof said:

I've been trying to watch broadcasts of AC since the 70s and from a pure spectator viewing point AC34 was far better than anything else, followed by AC33. Sailing in Valencia was sort of viewable but most races were over in 1 minute and then the rest was just waiting for the finish line and the animated graphics was more exciting than the TV pictures actually.

 

So for AC35 to be exuding they need to spend money on good TV production and hope the races are sort of even.

 

From the point of view of a non-sailing spectator who just wanted to sit back and watch and like high speed action, you may well be right. But that is just one of many different ways to look at the event.

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54 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

Nothing questionable about the comeback. It reminded me of the Ali fight against, I think, Foreman where he was pinned in the corner, gloves up then unleashed a flurry of punches that took the bout. Oracle USA proved beyond a doubt that it ain’t over until the fat lady stops singing.

Ali clearly had a plan, a strategy to tire Foreman out. Ali had many training sessions just taking hard Body shot after hard body shot. He trained his body to take the best Foreman could give him and endure until it he realised it would get to a point where Foreman would tire enough for him to hit him with his trademark speed combinations. He said in an interview before the fight, that Foreman would tire and he would knock him out. It was his strategy from the start. He hit and ran the whole fight until Foreman couldn't get his hands up and hit him with a combination that decked him. I don't think it was ever Oracles strategy to get to match point and come back. Not a very good comparison

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On 5/5/2019 at 5:59 AM, dg_sailingfan said:

I trend to agree with you on AC 34 and AC 33 :)

I am curious what the TV Production will be in NZL in 2020 & 2021. Thus far aside from TVNZL who will be of course the Host Broadcaster there have been no TV Deals announced at all. If you look back at AC 34 and AC 35  the America's Cup Event Authority had already announced numerous TV Deals.

I'm also advocating not letting these 3 Late Challengers Race. The 3 Super Teams are enough for PRADA CUP. We don't need for example AM, LR or Ineos beating Altus, Dutch or S & S by 5 Minutes plus on the Race Track.

Why would you advocate for not letting challengers race? What a stupid thing to say! The more challengers the better. It makes for a better event. 95, 2000, 2003, 2007, 2013 and 2017 all had challengers who were realistic that their chances of winning were slim at best, but no one ever advocated that they not participate.

You're only advocating that because you don't want this cup to be successful, as it would blow all of your conspiracy theories out of the water.

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1 hour ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Of course it wasn't. I think Ken Read was spot on when he said during the Commentary that he thinks that the whole Protest, International Jury hearing, etc. threw Oracle of their Game before the 1st Race and it took them half the Regatta to get it back. The IJ also took Oracles Wing Trimmer away. It takes some time to adjust to all of this.

Thats what happens when you cheat.

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Just now, dg_sailingfan said:

They didn't cheat during the AC Match itself. They did in the ACWS and took their Punishment.

You need to accept that they didn't cheat during the Cup Match.

Once a cheat, always a cheat.

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On 5/3/2019 at 1:40 AM, blunderfull said:

Whatever happened to that “Super 12’s Challenge Series” Ehman was promoting?

Think just about everything one had that one clocked as a non-starter from day 1 

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1 hour ago, Forourselves said:

Once a cheat, always a cheat.

Like your doped to the gills All Blacks? Fair enough I guess.

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5 minutes ago, pusslicker said:

Like your doped to the gills All Blacks? Fair enough I guess.

Ah the sound of a loser... always puts a smile on my face. The classic excuse when someone gets their asses whooped lol When you can prove that Bullshit statement, we'll talk, until then, you're just a loser.

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^^^Like I said, you're a fucking idiot that knows nothing about what he's talking about.

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2 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

And you are the same!

Too bad for you, the AC75's will be around for a long time to come while the F50's will be gone in a few years time when Larry loses interest.

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3 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Too bad for you, the AC75's will be around for a long time to come while the F50's will be gone in a few years time when Larry loses interest.

AC75 will only stay around if the kiwis win. Anyone else and they might go for anything 

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7 minutes ago, Chimp too said:

AC75 will only stay around if the kiwis win. Anyone else and they might go for anything 

True. But given how far down the road INEOS is with the concept, and how dominant the Kiwi's were in the AC50, if INEOS did win, its unlikely they'll want to give the Kiwi's an opening by going back to the AC50. LR will never go back to the AC50, Patrizio's ego will never let that happen, and neither will ETNZ. The other teams are unlikely to win anyway, so it doesn't really matter. AM is the unknown, although they are predominantly a Monohull team. Wouldn't be surprised if AM do away with foiling all together and go with a maxi 72 similar to Bella Mente

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Or as in the past, anyone else could develop their own class rather than resurrect an old one.

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1 hour ago, Forourselves said:

True. But given how far down the road INEOS is with the concept, and how dominant the Kiwi's were in the AC50, if INEOS did win, its unlikely they'll want to give the Kiwi's an opening by going back to the AC50. LR will never go back to the AC50, Patrizio's ego will never let that happen, and neither will ETNZ. The other teams are unlikely to win anyway, so it doesn't really matter. AM is the unknown, although they are predominantly a Monohull team. Wouldn't be surprised if AM do away with foiling all together and go with a maxi 72 similar to Bella Mente

Clarkey, if TNZ lose I doubt very much if they would mount another challenge on the other side of the world.  I don't think the NZ public would allow any more government money in to what the Joe public perceives as a a billionaires folly.

 

 

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^ Maybe they should do an IPO.  Or maybe get solar panels and Elon Musk can fund them after he is excused from running that robot car company.  Just kidding.

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3 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

I disagree. The AC 75 are ready for the museum EVEN if the Kiwis win once it's all over just like the AC 72 Cats were. That Boat isn't sustainable.

I can’t argue with that 

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3 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

You're totally wrong here. The F50's & SailGP doesn't need Larry Ellison or Russell Coutts for that matter. SailGP will replace the ESS & GC32 as the primary foiling Series in a few years time. Big commercial Sponsors will hoop onboard. Instead of 6 Teams there will be 10-12 Teams in a couple of years time. All these things will happen.

LE & RC were just there to get it started. Once SailGP has established themselves and get big Sponsors they don't need Larry's Financial Committment.

EESS & GC32 are already established. The fact is, Teams need either billionaire backing, or sponsorship to survive, which means stakeholders.

The ESS and GC32 have established, and managed to maintain healthy sponsorship of both the events and the teams. Its highly doubtful that teams like the French, who are, and always will be, completely outgunned against the likes of Slingsby and his AC team will continue after Ellison loses interest. If Coutts plan of going 100% National teams, that eliminates guys like Outteridge, Jensen, Phil Robertson, it also eliminates teams like Alinghi, Real Team, Team Tilt. They are all brands, brands that will have to go under the "SailGP Team... brand, and its highly unlikely guys like Berterelli will want to give up their brand that they have worked so hard and poured so much of their own money into, and right now, its big names like Outteridge and Jensen that are the draw and are the ones performing for this event. When they go, who's left? Slingsby? Rome Kirby? 

It would make a mockery of the whole series for Coutts to go round saying "These are National Teams" and then have teams like Alinghi, Team Tilt, Real-Team etc made up professionals.

Coutts track record of maintaining strong relationships with sponsors and backers doesn't bode well either.

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10 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

EESS & GC32 are already established. The fact is, Teams need either billionaire backing, or sponsorship to survive, which means stakeholders.

The ESS and GC32 have established, and managed to maintain healthy sponsorship of both the events and the teams. Its highly doubtful that teams like the French, who are, and always will be, completely outgunned against the likes of Slingsby and his AC team will continue after Ellison loses interest. If Coutts plan of going 100% National teams, that eliminates guys like Outteridge, Jensen, Phil Robertson, it also eliminates teams like Alinghi, Real Team, Team Tilt. They are all brands, brands that will have to go under the "SailGP Team... brand, and its highly unlikely guys like Berterelli will want to give up their brand that they have worked so hard and poured so much of their own money into, and right now, its big names like Outteridge and Jensen that are the draw and are the ones performing for this event. When they go, who's left? Slingsby? Rome Kirby? 

It would make a mockery of the whole series for Coutts to go round saying "These are National Teams" and then have teams like Alinghi, Team Tilt, Real-Team etc made up professionals.

Coutts track record of maintaining strong relationships with sponsors and backers doesn't bode well either.

I would say you're only partly right about the EXSS. It went well for years, but now it looks like it's game over.
OC Sport has left, and information about a new owner is not public (if available at all), although the new direction of the series was to be "announced soon".

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21 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Also, I don't get it what he says that a 100% Nationality Rule would eliminate Team Tilt or Alinghi. There are enough Swiss Sailors now to get a Swiss SailGP Team to the Start Line. He is talking crap and that's what he does best.

Usually I agree with Forourselves, but this time he was not totally up to date.

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One thing about some of those circuits is owners can and do drive sometimes.  Paying for a product like F50 is likely just sponsorship/branding not participatory enjoyment.  Unless Jason Momoa wants to own the US team LOL. 

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1 minute ago, Tornado-Cat said:

Wow... :unsure:

Haha, more than with the other trolls at least :D

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5 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Also, I don't get it what he says that a 100% Nationality Rule would eliminate Team Tilt or Alinghi. There are enough Swiss Sailors now to get a Swiss SailGP Team to the Start Line. He is talking crap and that's what he does best.

What you did not understand, and still don't, is its all in the name. Teams like Alinghi and Team Tilt, they are brands, sailing brands that have marketability and history. Sure those teams can be called Swiss SailGP Team, or Germany SailGP Team or whatever, which means they come under the SailGP umbrella, SailGP makes money off the name and likenesses, not the teams themselves. Alinghi especially is a brand, much like in the AC, Emirates Team New Zealand is a brand. Emirates Team New Zealand is a brand that competes on many different circuits, as does Alinghi.

The Swiss SailGP team can only compete on the Sail GP circuit, because SailGP is a brand in itself, under copyright. US SailGP team can not compete on the ESS and the SailGP circuit and the Americas Cup for example, but Emirates Team New Zealand can compete on the ESS, the AC, the 52 Super Series, etc. Alinghi can not compete on the SailGP circuit under that name because what stops any other team from doing that? If they did, then we have just another regatta with professional teams.  Thats what Coutts means by National Teams, USA SailGP Team, Australia SilGP Team, Japan SailGP Team etc. Get it now? 

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7 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Ineos Team UK skipper Ben Ainslie casts doubt over America's Cup challengers

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12229912

# 1 Ben doesn't believe that the 3 Late Challengers will make Start Line in Auckland

# 2 Only the Stars & Stripes Team USA Challenge paid the 5.8M NZ$ Entry Fees

# 3 Auckland City Coucil has monkied things up. Ben & INEOS would have gone to Auckland this upcoming 2019/2020 UK Winter to train BUT can't now because the base will not be finished until January 2020.

# 4 Ben very upset with Altus & DutchSail and the Protocol Amendments.

I remember an Article from Sail World NZ's Richard Gladwell about "Base Constructions" were he claimed that the Base of AM & INEOS would be available in August. That will not be the case at all.

A lot of things are going terribly wrong in Auckland.

You forgot to mention that none of this is the fault of ETNZ and that anything that goes wrong only benefits the challengers.

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33 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Ineos Team UK skipper Ben Ainslie casts doubt over America's Cup challengers

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12229912

# 1 Ben doesn't believe that the 3 Late Challengers will make Start Line in Auckland

# 2 Only the Stars & Stripes Team USA Challenge paid the 5.8M NZ$ Entry Fees

# 3 Auckland City Coucil has monkied things up. Ben & INEOS would have gone to Auckland this upcoming 2019/2020 UK Winter to train BUT can't now because the base will not be finished until January 2020.

# 4 Ben very upset with Altus & DutchSail and the Protocol Amendments.

I remember an Article from Sail World NZ's Richard Gladwell about "Base Constructions" were he claimed that the Base of AM & INEOS would be available in August. That will not be the case at all.

A lot of things are going terribly wrong in Auckland.

I remember an Article from Sail World NZ's Richard Gladwell about "Base Constructions" were he claimed that the Base of AM & INEOS would be available in August. That will not be the case at all.

A lot of things are going terribly wrong in Auckland - Bullshit.

"The timeframes with regard to the works with piping and docks have not been delayed and have not changed from the original target," Simmons said. "In fact best endeavours are to deliver these works in advance of the initial handover dates for the teams."

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On 5/5/2019 at 12:23 PM, Rennmaus said:

Haha, more than with the other trolls at least :D

Ha ha, I think reny is talking about....like you are getting in yur old age tc.

Maybe...

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4 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

You're so full of shit:

Here is what Richard Gladwell wrote in an Article on Sail Wold NZ on April 2nd

The first set of three bases for American Magic (New York Yacht Club), Ineos Team UK (RYS Ltd) and Stars & Stripes Team USA will be ready to take bases in August 2019.

Gladwell is wrong here 100%. Ben said that their Base would not be available to move in until January 2020.

I trust Ainslie a lot more than that crappy Simmons Guy or Richard Gladwell for that matter.

Oh FFS. First you call him a sellout, then you wanna go down and protest, then you're gonna boycott, then you want people to throw tomatoes at him and want his team to withdraw, now you "Trust him"? What the actual fuck is wrong with you!? Its you thats full of shit!

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2 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Oh FFS. First you call him a sellout, then you wanna go down and protest, then you're gonna boycott, then you want people to throw tomatoes at him and want his team to withdraw, now you "Trust him"? What the actual fuck is wrong with you!? Its you thats full of shit!

Again, I'd encourage you to simply ignore A4E - it's a fools errand you are on, and you're the last person giving him any oxygen. Put him on iggy like the rest of us and he'll be left to the voices in his head.

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1 hour ago, dg_sailingfan said:

You're hilarious! Where did I say that I didn't like Ainslie? I did say that I don't like their Sponsor INEOS. A Sponsor who does fracking & dumps garbarge chemicals into the Ocean has no place in the America's Cup IMO which happens to be sailed on water. I have no problem with BA or the Sailors/Designers on that Team.

I HAVE A MASSIVE PROBLEM WITH JIM RATCLIFFE & his COMPANY though.

Kevin Shoebridge also talked garbarge as you did by claiming Teams would be in Auckland in the NZL Summer of 2019/2020.

When you've won the Americas Cup you can call him out for talking garbage. Until then, you're talking out your ass.

By the way, here you go:

January 15th: INEOS TEAM UK (Ainslies Team) should not be allowed to race in Auckland and should be prohibited from any further AC Competition
January 17th: Ben Ainslie is least liked Sailor in GB. He's desperate to be liked like Sir Andy Murray is which he won't. He has too much of an ego as well. Combine that all together it won't win you the AC. And yes, I also don't like it when the Cup is too much owned by Billionaires
January 17th: Ben Ainslie is the biggest hypocrite ever. Talking about a sustainability message during Bermuda, then doing a 360 by accepting INEOS money. I'm sure Dalts is thrilled having a Team in Auckland whose Main Sponsor is dumping Chemicals into the water 24/7.
April 8th: Ben Ainslie doesn't have the guts getting it. I think ETNZ should be considering defending it (usually that happens when you win it see 2000, 2007, 2013). I think the mostly likely Final will be ETNZ vs AM

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6 hours ago, rh2600 said:

Again, I'd encourage you to simply ignore A4E - it's a fools errand you are on, and you're the last person giving him any oxygen. Put him on iggy like the rest of us and he'll be left to the voices in his head.

Aren't sclarke and a4e the same guy?

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57 minutes ago, pusslicker said:

Aren't sclarke and a4e the same guy?

giphy.gif.a4371eb2396eb625273eff70da68ce01.gif

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On 5/10/2019 at 8:51 PM, barfy said:

Ha ha, I think reny is talking about.

 

Thanks, we now know that Rennmaus, you and Forourselves are the first members of the kiwi troll squad :D

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2 hours ago, pusslicker said:

Aren't sclarke and a4e the same guy?

Nope. Aren't pusslicker and A4E the same guy? Thats what I as told.

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Folks, you really need to get a better grip of what "troll" means in net speech.
Just look at the latest asinine conversations. Who is upping their post count with permanent repetitions? What does a troll make?
If you feel targeted by my post above, it's in your head, not mine. Have a nice life

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3 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

I stand by it what I said there:

# 1 Sir Ben is definitly trying to be liked like Andy Murray which of course he won't. Now compare what Murray has done for British Sport to Ainslie, Sir Ben comes out second best.

# 2 I do think it's hypocrisy if you spent 3 years talking about sustainability, teaming up with 11th Hour Racing, talking about cleaning the Oceans health and then accepting INEOS Money because you had nowhere to go.

# 3 Sir Ben has a big EGO, he isn't a natural Team Leader like Burling, Ashby, Barker, Spithill, etc. and being egoistic doesn't win you the AC.

Thats why Ainslie is a winner, and you're not.

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Sister sends me pic of Newest Kiwi in family (neice’s hubby from Auckland) taking swim lessons @ 3 months old.   I point out there should be a boat somewhere yes?   Comes back in 30 seconds with Jaxon sitting on his first mini-dinghy.   

Indeed.

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12 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Nope. Aren't pusslicker and A4E the same guy? Thats what I as told.

The old "I know you are, but what am I" rebuttal. Worked well in kindergarten I guess so why not now? I do love when you are off your meds and posting like crazy though. 

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1 hour ago, pusslicker said:

The old "I know you are, but what am I" rebuttal. Worked well in kindergarten I guess so why not now? I do love when you are off your meds and posting like crazy though. 

Well, I'm just saying, a stupid question, gets a stupid answer.

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And I guess they are continuing to build areas for the Malta, S+S and DutchSail bases?

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4 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

LOL,

I'm not a Professional Sailor.

Why is Ainslie a Winner, please explain? He won 4 Olympic Golds, I'll grant you that.

However when it comes to the AC he was mostly in a secondary role that started with the OneWorld Challenge in 2003, then came ETNZ for the 2007 Campaign and then OTUSA for 2013. When he had his own Team for 2017 it was going a long way downstream.

He doesn't have that natural ability to make the Boat go faster like some other ATG's in Team-Sports have like Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Michael Schumacher or Sebastian Vettel for starters.

"Why is Ainslie a Winner, please explain? Only an idiot would feel the need to ask that question.

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The general consensus seems to be heading in the direction of 3 or 4 contenders for the PRADA Cup.  The new voters are voting there

Back in December @JackGriffin and @Basiliscus voted for 3 competing for the Prada Cup Maybe I should have taken more notice!!

So Now it seems like the question is "Will another team make it 4?"  I thought we would know by know BUT .......

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14 minutes ago, Kiwing said:

The general consensus seems to be heading in the direction of 3 or 4 contenders for the PRADA Cup.  The new voters are voting there

Back in December @JackGriffin and @Basiliscus voted for 3 competing for the Prada Cup Maybe I should have taken more notice!!

So Now it seems like the question is "Will another team make it 4?"  I thought we would know by know BUT .......

Don't forget me :) Right or wrong...

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Hey,  @Tornado-Cat could I be blamed for feeling there was a little sour grapes in your vote?

But Yes, you, back in December voted for 3.

Are you still absolutely sure that Stars&Stripes wont make it?

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1 hour ago, Kiwing said:

Hey,  @Tornado-Cat could I be blamed for feeling there was a little sour grapes in your vote?

But Yes, you, back in December voted for 3.

Are you still absolutely sure that Stars&Stripes wont make it?

Obviously I am not sure, it was a guess, but the last changes in the team do not seem positive to me.

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12 hours ago, Rennmaus said:

Folks, you really need to get a better grip of what "troll" means in net speech.
Just look at the latest asinine conversations. Who is upping their post count with permanent repetitions? What does a troll make?
If you feel targeted by my post above, it's in your head, not mine. Have a nice life

Sorry for quoting and putting you in the cross hairs of the silly zone.

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Well I freely admit I thought 5 for Prada Cup.  But I am pretty sure 3 is the likeliest bet unless S+S comes up with a billionaire and restarts boatbuilding this month.

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Well I actually don't care about the Prada Cup.  All I want for Xmas is an incredibly strong challenger, a fair set of races to determine the winner and good TV coverage to watch it (over, over and over again).  I still get a thrill out of watching Jimmy bringing that big tri with that huge wing racing into the box, winning the entry, then getting into irons, then having to pull all strings out to catch Ernesto.  Little did I know the AC72s would make that look slow.  AND sailing would never be the same for me.  Three times the speed of the wind down wind!!  All this stuff is the stuff dreams are made of.

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On 5/5/2019 at 9:28 AM, pusslicker said:

Like your doped to the gills All Blacks? Fair enough I guess.

A guilty projection from the battle of Nantes, Shirley.

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15 hours ago, barfy said:

Sorry for quoting and putting you in the cross hairs of the silly zone.

Haha, all good. I don't give a f#ck whether anyone thinks s/he is a troll.

Challengers in the Prada Cup? 3 I suppose, but it was nice to cherish the illusion of having the young Americans, the Dutch and last but not least Malta involved. Spes saepe fallit, as we learned in school...

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On 5/12/2019 at 7:44 AM, Rennmaus said:

Folks, you really need to get a better grip of what "troll" means in net speech.
Just look at the latest asinine conversations. Who is upping their post count with permanent repetitions? What does a troll make?
If you feel targeted by my post above, it's in your head, not mine. Have a nice life

You know its getting rough around here when Renny tells you to fuck off.  ;)

WetHog  :ph34r:

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So Ainslie says he wishes S+S well since they did pay the fee but perhaps they had not  initially realized the costs involved.

Huh. Should have read this forum. 

https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2019/05/12/americas-cup-british-see-reduced-field/

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5 hours ago, Rennmaus said:

Haha, all good. I don't give a f#ck whether anyone thinks s/he is a troll.

Challengers in the Prada Cup? 3 I suppose, but it was nice to cherish the illusion of having the young Americans, the Dutch and last but not least Malta involved. Spes saepe fallit, as we learned in school...

Yep, was fun to imagine and maybe contractual agreements in NZ even depend on some of that, but...

I’d put the odds at 9-1 there will only 3 Challengers since even if someone else magically finds an unexpected big benefactor it is too late by now to set up a real AC team operation. People aren’t widgets. 

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We know how much the kiwi troll squad (previously defined in my previous post :D)  has been attacking dg-sailingfan but Ben, who is not his favorite competitor, is saying the same thing.

“We were really frustrated by that because it was holding things up. We couldn’t make decisions because the other teams weren’t agreeing to vote or were voting against and you need a unanimous decision.”

In the end Team New Zealand and Luna Rossa, Challenger of Record, altered the Protocol in order to make rule changes without approval from the late entry teams, allowing project plans to proceed.

Ultimately, Ainslie expects costs to be too prohibitive for the late syndicates to join Luna Rossa, New York-based American Magic, and Team UK in challenging Team New Zealand on home waters.

“We don’t expect those teams to get to the start line. Stars and Stripes, our understanding is it’s really shaky. We’d love to see them all there but the reality is the costs of this Cup are dawning on them just how expensive it is.

https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2019/05/12/americas-cup-british-see-reduced-field/

That said, I hope Ben is going to kick some asses.

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^^^ Really? Have you read his posts? In the NYYC thread his post was "I wish everything bad for AC36" after San Francisco, where a guy died, wishing everything bad for the event is not only stupid and wrong, but also disrespectful. another post was "The Mule is a Crap boat" and you call Kiwi's a "Troll squad". Ya know a few years ago, you were credible...but since ETNZ won, you've lost your way. Just one tin pot conspiracy theory after another, trying to find something bad, even when there's nothing there. And when there's nothing to bag, you just make something up.

Who really cares if its a reduced field? Those challengers are as serious and competitive as it gets, and they are independent of the Defender and CoR and have the funding, the talent, and the desire to win.

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Hey mate, Forouselves, dg-sailing fan was right about pretty much everything, Malta, the number of challengers.

The kiwi squad has been trolling about the F50 not happening, Malta, the number of challengers, the F50 speed, and pretty much everything. I hope they don't pay you too much for this mild fun. :D

 

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48 minutes ago, Tornado-Cat said:

Hey mate, Forouselves, dg-sailing fan was right about pretty much everything, Malta, the number of challengers.

The kiwi squad has been trolling about the F50 not happening, Malta, the number of challengers, the F50 speed, and pretty much everything. I hope they don't pay you too much for this mild fun. :D

 

Its like the weatherman saying, it could be sunny, perhaps with some cloud, but it might rain, and could snow too. May be warm, but could be cold too. Its hard to be wrong when you cover all the bases. 

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1 hour ago, Forourselves said:

^^^ Really? Have you read his posts? In the NYYC thread his post was "I wish everything bad for AC36" after San Francisco, where a guy died, wishing everything bad for the event is not only stupid and wrong, but also disrespectful. another post was "The Mule is a Crap boat" and you call Kiwi's a "Troll squad". Ya know a few years ago, you were credible...but since ETNZ won, you've lost your way. Just one tin pot conspiracy theory after another, trying to find something bad, even when there's nothing there. And when there's nothing to bag, you just make something up.

Who really cares if its a reduced field? Those challengers are as serious and competitive as it gets, and they are independent of the Defender and CoR and have the funding, the talent, and the desire to win.

You drippy cunts are the kings of conspiracy. Remember the herbie and all the shitty videos with yellow lines on them? Hell, you've changed your name so many times it was probably you putting that shit up. The point is the Kiwi's here were constantly bitching about the low turnout for 34 and now that it is happening to their cup it is suddenly no big deal. You were the ones that lost your fucking minds when you choked away 34 and came up with all the conspiracies. Now that you are getting a taste you don't like it.

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1 hour ago, Tornado-Cat said:

 

gawd TC we could bore each other for days with the almost impressive amount of things A4E has been wrong about and you know it :-) 

...indeed there was a period of time where he had the midas touch, and everything he said turned out to be the opposite... beginning with his fucking handle! Coupled with his bizarre angry rants and obsessions of hate against random AC players means the sum total of contributions from that quarter are best summed up with this

giphy.gif

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1 hour ago, Forourselves said:

You mean your team of cheats? Thought so. Just because you condone cheating in sport, doesn't mean everyone does.

Its only conspiracy if its not true. Problem is, most of it is! Hence the penalties (financial and points losses) due to rule infringements - your team are repeat offenders when it comes to cheating and rule infringing. Oracle deserved to be shut down. They are a black mark on the history of the event.

well said . .... i'm not really adding anything but .... that is a great post .... 

 

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1 hour ago, pusslicker said:

You drippy cunts are the kings of conspiracy. Remember the herbie and all the shitty videos with yellow lines on them? Hell, you've changed your name so many times it was probably you putting that shit up. The point is the Kiwi's here were constantly bitching about the low turnout for 34 and now that it is happening to their cup it is suddenly no big deal. You were the ones that lost your fucking minds when you choked away 34 and came up with all the conspiracies. Now that you are getting a taste you don't like it.

And you cunts are the ones flip flopping on your views of the number of challengers. First you said it wasn't enough challengers, then when they had enough challengers you said "oh we don't these challengers because they won't be competitive and are going to be beaten by 5 minutes" now you're back to saying "Its not enough challengers.

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8 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Its like the weatherman saying, it could be sunny, perhaps with some cloud, but it might rain, and could snow too. May be warm, but could be cold too. Its hard to be wrong when you cover all the bases. 

My thoughts exactly.  Late/underfunded Challengers fizzling out long before a meaningful race takes place is not new.  Teams like S&S, Dutch and Malta are the rule not the exception.  

WetHog  :ph34r:

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On 5/15/2019 at 2:18 AM, dg_sailingfan said:

Thanks buddy, these Days I am indeed more right wrong than wrong right As far as Malta is concerned as soon as these Maltese Government withdrew funding for their Challenge I kinda knew this wouldn't happen! (per Tom Ehman Cataldi wanted 15M US$ from the Maltese Government but they said they could give him only 5M). The Island of Malta is in a huge Economic Crisis from what I'm hearing via Italian/Maltese Media.

Thanks buddy, these Days I am indeed more right wrong than wrong right

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11 hours ago, rh2600 said:

gawd TC we could bore each other for days with the almost impressive amount of things A4E has been wrong about and you know it :-)

Honestly I don't read all posts, and we don't know the issues yet, but he has been spot on for these points while Foryourselves has been spot....wrong :)

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On 5/15/2019 at 4:12 AM, Tornado-Cat said:

Honestly I don't read all posts, and we don't know the issues yet, but he has been spot on for these points while Foryourselves has been spot....wrong :)

Haha about? You only seem to be able to go on (and on) about one thing...the F50 series.

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7 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

That's why I am saying it would be absolutely mind-boggling to see AM, Ineos train in Auckland 2019/2020 to allow every single NZL Designer to copy it and make their own boat go faster.

You think ETNZ, and other teams, didn't have people watching what was, and is, going on in Pensacola and Portsmouth?  

WetHog  :ph34r:

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3 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Really? Tell me where I am wrong!

# 1 If you believe the Altus Challenge from Malta is going to make it to the 1st ACWS in Cagliari 2020 your HEAD needs to be examined - Period. That same goes for the DutchSail Challenge.

I've always said, and so has Dalton/ Shoebridge, they may not make it to the start line, but officially, they are challengers. Whether they make it to the start line is a different story, and I've always said that. You saying "They're dead is wrong, because they haven't withdrawn. They still feature on Americas Cup.com under Teams, so until they are officially out, they're officially in.

# 2 I called the ESS being DEAD and that was spot on and is now confirmed.
Is it? where is this confirmation you speak of?

# 3 I called out Richard Gladwell for the stunt he pulled by claiming Teams like AM, Ineos would be able to move into their new Bases in Auckland by August. That is not the case at all per Sir Ben Ainslie.

But, I see you only decided to quote half of the article, while ignoring the other half, which denies Ainslies claims.

# 4 Clownish Kevin Shoebridge (you mean winner Kevin Shoebridge) claimed some Teams would be training during the NZ Summer of 2019/2020 on the AC Race Courses. I called him out on that one because it would be stupid doing so regardless if their Bases are finished or not to show the Defender all their little secrets.

Would it? Thats up to the teams. They certainly thought it would help last time round when all but ETNZ trained in Bermuda. Everyone loved that idea back then, but now its stupid. 

One of the Main Reasons ETNZ lost AC 34 wasn't about cheating, etc..., it was because they showed all their new innovations like Foiling, Upwind Foiling, Roll Tacking too early to the other Competitors particularly Defender OTUSA. This allowed them to go to school what ETNZ was doing and carbon-copy it.

This is the rare occasion where we agree. Though it was never going to be a secret for long.

That's why I am saying it would be absolutely mind-boggling to see AM, Ineos train in Auckland 2019/2020 to allow every single NZL Designer to copy it and make their own boat go faster.

Maybe they won't feel the need to copy it. I would say it would be the other way around. They know ETNZ will be launching and training mid year this year, as well as launching a test boat sometime this year, so perhaps being in NZ where they can keep an eye on what the Kiwi's are doing may be advantageous.

 

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4 hours ago, Tornado-Cat said:

Honestly I don't read all posts, and we don't know the issues yet, but he has been spot on for these points while Foryourselves has been spot....wrong :)

You know what they say about broken c(l)ocks...

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21 hours ago, Forourselves said:

And you cunts are the ones flip flopping on your views of the number of challengers. First you said it wasn't enough challengers, then when they had enough challengers you said "oh we don't these challengers because they won't be competitive and are going to be beaten by 5 minutes" now you're back to saying "Its not enough challengers.

When have I said that three won't be enough challengers? I said I enjoyed the '95 Citizen's Cup more than any other defender series and it had 3 defenders. 

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I freely admit I was suckered thinking 5. Sure looks like my would be fave the all-American S+S is not making it.  Hard to get excited about half-American Magic.  Dunno who I will be cheering for.

Unfair maybe but I keep thinking about politics.

 

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^^^ maybe you should do what the 3 challengers have done and become dead silent too.

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2 hours ago, Forourselves said:

^^^ maybe you should do what the 3 challengers have done and become dead silent too.

If only you would listen to your own advice.

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16 minutes ago, pusslicker said:

If only you would listen to your own advice.

If only you'd quit moaning about anything and everything AC36.

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They probably are building too many challeger bases, bwahaha

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6 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Maybe you should stop defending every single ETNZ Action they're doing during the AC36 Cycle.

Large_ACF464.jpgteam_nz_celebrate_their_louis_vuitton_viAC1.jpg238fb668-5acc-11e7-ba61-9189acf465bb-780AC75_A.jpg

Americas-Cup-2018-2-RNZYS-1024x683-1024x

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10 hours ago, Forourselves said:

 

 

These are truly great, emotional photos. Thanks for posting them.

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I'm pissed off at myself. 

For months in the other thread (Teams?) I was consistent with my predictions on the low end of the spectrum. For all the exact reasons we are seeing come to life now: cost, talent, technology, timing. Yet then this blasted poll comes and I put my name down for four teams contesting the Prada Cup. Stick with your guns, a-hole!

Yes, something incredible may happen and S&S, Malta, or Holland may make it to the line. But it sure doesn't look that way. Even their websites are dead. Malta and Holland have no mention about the challenge at all on their sites; S&S has a post from two months ago as their 'Latest News' item. 

Meanwhile, props to @Tornado-Cat and the five other pessimists who actually voted "3 - that is no new challengers" when the poll first came out. 

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25 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

There are Rumors surfacing that ETNZ wants to amend the Protocol allowing 2 of the 3 Entries not to race in Cagliari next year and give them more time until the 2nd Event in June.

Even if these teams got the money they would not be competitive, however that would be another blow to the challengers who respected the protocol and are now delayed by the foil arm. However I said from the beginning that the MC would vote in favour of the defender, up to now..... they did.

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19 minutes ago, dg_sailingfan said:

Like this or not I think ETNZ is really desperate to get the 5M NZ$ Purchase Design Pay by the 3 Late Teams and that's the sole reason why they want to keep these Teams alive.

5 million? Where did that number come from?

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