Mid

2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race: The Race Committee has lodged a protest against Wild Oats XI

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1 hour ago, LB 15 said:

 

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Your mistaken dear, that sound is Sparrow giving Lonely Boy a "Chinese Burn".

What's a "Chinese Burn" Your Majesty?

What you do before giving someone a "Titty Twister" dear.

What's a "Titty Twister" ma'am?

William dear, where the fuck did you find this one? She is as sharp as bait.

I found her using my AIS Gran.

Well dear, next time check hers is fucking turned on OK.

Sorry Gran.

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confused as to why LB is bumping a thread which he professes to want dead . :rolleyes:

 

should there be anything from Oats / Richards then a new thread will be forthcoming .

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3 minutes ago, Mid said:

should there be anything from Oats / Richards then a new thread will be forthcoming .

I suggest you go into witness protection first before embarking on that stupidity.

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6 minutes ago, Mid said:

should there be anything from Oats / Richards then a new thread will be forthcoming .

As sure as night follows day...

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On 1/10/2019 at 12:30 PM, frant said:

Actually Melbourne gave somewhere further South worth sailing to. This discussion wouldn’t exist if it wasn’t for Hobart.

Melbourne was settled from Launceston,  well after Hobart.

TUBBY

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40 minutes ago, Mid said:

confused as to why LB is bumping a thread which he professes to want dead . :rolleyes:

Putting aside you are easily confused,  @LB 15 is a double agent and travels under various alias's,  Bill Haydon, Harry Hart and Donald Crowhurst just three.

@smiley or just George revealed this little espionage snippet some time ago. In fact it came to light in a thread he started about racing rules titled “Survival...is an infinite capacity for suspicion.” 

 

032ccc55c08c1db6409b43e9e3b8c89a--gambit--uk-actors.jpg

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Hey Mid- heard back from Richo yet? Did you text him your list of demands or email them? 

He might be away enjoying a holiday after his magnificent 9th line Honours win, while you sit in your dark little flat pounding the keyboard and demanding answers. 

I am sure explaining himself to an anonymous little non-Sailing toad on a forum will be his first priority when he returns. 

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Maybe we should all forget the last 26 pages of crap and look at the 1962 S2H "result".
I quote from Kevin Burke's book "Man of Iron Boat of Steel" about the life and races of Solo.
"The final celebrations were soured when it was revealed that Huey Long had flown to Launceston to inspect photos of Solo which suggested that she did not carry a dinghy on deck as required by the race rules. An objection was lodged with the Royal Yacht Club of Tasmania by a third party (not a competitor). The Sailing Committee dismissed the objection later that night. Vic Meyer was reported......"
Forgetting the semanitics of both issues I say same shit just just 56 years later.
For those too young to remember Huey Long was owner of Ondine and had the Line Honours win and Vic Meyer on Solo had the handicap win

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2 hours ago, No Way said:

Maybe we should all forget the last 26 pages of crap and look at the 1962 S2H "result".
I quote from Kevin Burke's book "Man of Iron Boat of Steel" about the life and races of Solo.
"The final celebrations were soured when it was revealed that Huey Long had flown to Launceston to inspect photos of Solo which suggested that she did not carry a dinghy on deck as required by the race rules. An objection was lodged with the Royal Yacht Club of Tasmania by a third party (not a competitor). The Sailing Committee dismissed the objection later that night. Vic Meyer was reported......"
Forgetting the semanitics of both issues I say same shit just just 56 years later.
For those too young to remember Huey Long was owner of Ondine and had the Line Honours win and Vic Meyer on Solo had the handicap win

I was MC at the book launch of 'Man of Iron Boat of Steel'.

Mid has lodged an objection to WOXI on here, with his wife, with his next door neighbour, with the guy who mows his lawn, with a guy who works in his local IGA, his barber, 4 different Uber drivers and a random guy he met in a lift. Only SA has so far dismissed his protest.

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13 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

and a random guy he met in a lift.

So Mid has met up with Randumb. Is that wise?

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19 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

I was MC at the book launch of 'Man of Iron Boat of Steel'.

Well you could have warned people the Free CD was the fucking Seekers.

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7 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Well you could have warned people the Free CD was the fucking Seekers.

images (13).jpeg

Oi! We played the seeker's 'New world' at my dads funeral. 

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3 hours ago, No Way said:

Maybe we should all forget the last 26 pages of crap and look at the 1962 S2H "result".
I quote from Kevin Burke's book "Man of Iron Boat of Steel" about the life and races of Solo.
"The final celebrations were soured when it was revealed that Huey Long had flown to Launceston to inspect photos of Solo which suggested that she did not carry a dinghy on deck as required by the race rules. An objection was lodged with the Royal Yacht Club of Tasmania by a third party (not a competitor). The Sailing Committee dismissed the objection later that night. Vic Meyer was reported......"
Forgetting the semanitics of both issues I say same shit just just 56 years later.
For those too young to remember Huey Long was owner of Ondine and had the Line Honours win and Vic Meyer on Solo had the handicap win

So your saying the RC of the S2H has form going back 56 years for relying on protesting parties having no "standing". In these cases "3rd" or "conflicted" parties for protests without the RC making their own enquiries to either sustain a valid protest, or if heard, one with any prospects of sucess. That bit is easy to understand.

The hard bit is "why" would the RC do that to favour first over the line?

Ricko and Vic looking nothing alike?

Vic had a weakness for women on boats.  WOX maybe, but WOXI adorned with women, no chance.

As for the cry babies in #2, Huey Long was a merchant mariner then shipping executive, Peter Harburg a real estate guy.

Huey from New York, Peter from Queensland.... Hey is that it? A common postcode between the RC and #1? #2 are always the blacksheep, the interloper, the party crasher? Fuck I never thought of that.

If I have it wrong you might need to put more effort into giving us the "why".

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3 hours ago, No Way said:

Maybe we should all forget the last 26 pages of crap and look at the 1962 S2H "result".
I quote from Kevin Burke's book "Man of Iron Boat of Steel" about the life and races of Solo.
"The final celebrations were soured when it was revealed that Huey Long had flown to Launceston to inspect photos of Solo which suggested that she did not carry a dinghy on deck as required by the race rules. An objection was lodged with the Royal Yacht Club of Tasmania by a third party (not a competitor). The Sailing Committee dismissed the objection later that night. Vic Meyer was reported......"
Forgetting the semanitics of both issues I say same shit just just 56 years later.
For those too young to remember Huey Long was owner of Ondine and had the Line Honours win and Vic Meyer on Solo had the handicap win

If I'm not mistaken, while Huey was in Launceston one Rupert Murdoch had invitations printed on Ondine blue stationary for a victory party on board, Rupert and his mates turned up with a keg but the boat Captain eased the lines and let Ondine drift away from the dock so they couldn't get onboard.

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12 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Hey Mid- heard back from Richo yet? Did you text him your list of demands or email them? 

He might be away enjoying a holiday after his magnificent 9th line Honours win, 

Mate he will be on Hamilton Is for sure. He hasn't a great history for doing much offshore sailing offshore so I doubt he owns a Passport. Though the explanation could well be he just suffers from airsickness or AA (Aspergers Anonymous) where a sea of microphones are not at race end for him to practise Tourette's laden Skipper post commentary?

Anyway I'm sure Richo's is sitting by the pool up at the Oatley private villa having a delicious breakfast of Avocado In Sauce (smashed & fried) practising his lines for the end of the next S2H about the one just gone by.

Backing up his thoughts on AISGATE will be Time Magazine's article describing the most successfull Top 10 Technological Failures of all time, and republished by Richard Gladwell from sail-world NZ every Monday through to the end of this year.

Richard keeps pointing out Superbowl's Nipplegate only just made it into the Top 10 and over a 100 million people saw that and believed that wardrobe malfunction not contrived.

Top 10 Technological Failures

1. TV Test Pattern Fries Marine Safety Gear

2. Harley Davidson Cologne

3. The DeLorean

4. Brewed Coffee in a Box

5. New Coke

6. Smith & Western Bicycles

7. Smokeless Cigarettes

8. Ben Gay Asprin

9. Astro Pants

10. Janet Jackson's Nip Slip

Anyway hope Ricko enjoys his holiday, aside from those RRS aggrieved souls hoping he makes that time-off permanent. 

Though I do think Richo owes Janet a thank you card.

 

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1 hour ago, Forourselves said:

Great video!

 

Mid played it backwards so it had a good ending.

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16 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

Mid played it backwards so it had a good ending.

How do you watch Channel 7's live coverage of the race backwards? 

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2 hours ago, 10thTonner said:

By the way: what about the other seven or eight wins? Had there been... issues too? 

Only for the losers 

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I'm thinking Mumbles is still in the spare room and monitoring all comms in and out of the building, a bit like LB's child bride.


Will Mark ever make a comment in public again?

Will the child bride free Random and run away?

Will the Anney Oakleys cancel the 75th Hobart race?

Should the CYC replace berths with Ion Murri condo's?

Is Syd running for CYC Commodore?

How long doe the * stay along side this years winner?

Exactly how long does a microwave oven on high take to heat a sausage roll?

TBC

 

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On 1/17/2019 at 4:41 PM, jack_sparrow said:

How do you watch Channel 7's live coverage of the race backwards? 

Same way as we did with the Beatles man........don't you remember? 

Shit I have no idea how we did it? Do you?

 

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Just read Gladwell’s latest apology piece. 

FFS

Funny to see this thread get a indirect mention

Guess will see the evidence maybe!

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6 minutes ago, lydia said:

Just read Gladwell’s latest apology piece. 

FFS

Funny to see this thread get a indirect mention

Guess will see the evidence maybe!

I'd doubt it.
 

"This is a grossly unfair situation to WOXI, her crew, owners and supporters.

Make no mistake the 2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart race should have been a big celebration for the Oatley and Wild Oats family - with a Line Honours win in Wild Oats XI, and second in the Overall standings with a Womens crew sailing Wild Oats X.

Instead they came away having been booted where it hurts, with nary a public apology or explanation from the competitors involved, the Race Committee or the Club.

You guys are better than that."

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I'll hold my position that WOXI deliberately shut off their AIS transmit capabilities to gain an advantage during the race, and their posted  after the race race mea culpas are not believable.  I understand the point of order that no competitor raised the red flag in time so no formal protest issue ensued.

So let's all move on, WOXI is the line honor boat, but with an asterisk after the trophy.

Case closed.

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24 minutes ago, axolotl said:

I'll hold my position that WOXI deliberately shut off their AIS transmit capabilities to gain an advantage during the race, and their posted  after the race race mea culpas are not believable.  I understand the point of order that no competitor raised the red flag in time so no formal protest issue ensued.

So let's all move on, WOXI is the line honor boat, but with an asterisk after the trophy.

Case closed.

With no honor?

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Hopefully WOXI and the other motorsailers will quit the S2H and go race somewhere else.

What, they can’t race anywhere else?

 

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1 minute ago, olaf hart said:

Hopefully WOXI and the other motorsailers will quit the S2H and go race somewhere else.

What, they can’t race anywhere else?

 

Hamilton Is Race week?

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Instead they came away having been booted where it hurts, with nary a public apology or explanation from the competitors involved, the Race Committee or the Club.

Well he is sort of right. So long as you include WOXI in the list of competitors involved.

Right now the only reason anyone remains interested is because of MR's rant in Sail Word, and most importantly his promise to prove their AIS was working. The only public apology or explanation due is currently the one from MR. Nobody else. MR is two weeks overdue on that very public promise. WIthout that explanation, the only apology that is expected is one from him, apologising for the slur on the RC.

The implication of Gladwell's missive is that the "RC and Club" are somehow complicit in deliberately tarnishing WOXI's name. Which is ironic to say the least. Most people will read events as the RC and the CYCA being complicit in an effort to manage things to ensure WOXI kept the win, whilst being seen to do something about BJ's complaining. The perception being that the CYCA treat the Oatley's in a special manner. If true, the previous chair of the IJ not being invited back this race is damning.

Currently, it reads as if Gladwell is drinking from the Oatley cup.  

I suspect that MR has been told in no uncertain terms to STFU.  We will never hear anything else from him on this subject. 

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And heading straight out the door after receiving the trophy doesn't show a lot of respect for the other competitors still to receive their (obviously lesser trophies) either.

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Ha! No one from Black Jack stayed for the Gladstone presentation this year. They got line honours in the 70th anniversary race. 

The only asterix would be on BJ’s win which is why they didn’t protest. Had plenty of time to discuss it whilst staring at WOXI’s ass up the river. 

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Hazlewood our for the Gabba test. 

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Cricket is more boring than sailing an optimist. 

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24 minutes ago, SCANAS said:

Cricket is more boring than sailing an optimist. 

Opti’s are only boring because don’t have AIS.

And they read their SI’s.

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After weeks of research, I've found a ruggedised AIS transponder.

There's a bunch on ebay off a ship called Fitzgerald. Apparently they work really well, the blurb mentions being tested in real life conditions to DoD specifications.  

Don't let the sticker fool you, it's just there to stop people opening it (protecting my IP). 

Lead_shielding.thumb.jpg.c6108297a75484cbafc1dd0c97590e09.jpg

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On 1/17/2019 at 4:06 PM, LB 15 said:

Mid played it backwards so it had a good ending.

 

On 1/17/2019 at 4:11 PM, jack_sparrow said:

How do you watch Channel 7's live coverage of the race backwards? 

 

17 hours ago, paps49 said:

Same way as we did with the Beatles man........don't you remember? 

Shit I have no idea how we did it? Do you?

 

I rang up Channel 10 seeing they have televised the S2H in the past and might have a tip. They were very helpful. If you push the green button on your remote twice then hold it down for 5 seconds it does exactly that to Channel 7's live S2H coverage.

Seems in the trade it's called the "Benjamin Button Button".

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1 hour ago, shaggybaxter said:

Opti’s are only boring because don’t have AIS.

And they read their SI’s.

The parents do. 

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'"With the Race Committee remaining tight-lipped, the spotlight remains fixed on the crew and owners of Wild Oats XI - accompanied by jeers and innuendo from the usually nameless chatterati that they have cheated or won a race by breaking the rules."

Richard the same ones who read your stuff so you can pay the bills right? If journalists whose job it is to poke the bear won't, or worse forget their creed of independence and write shit, then guess who are the only ones left to do your poking?

Time you gargled some WOXI Cock Wash mate, your breath is now starting to stink.

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213896/A-big-fortnight-for-Women-Sydney-Hobart-Furore

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Gladwell's writing is dogmatic in it's support of WOXI

"It should be noted that AIS is a system to alert other vessels of other craft in the area. It is a safety feature, not a surveillance tool."

The fallacy he argues of AIS being only safety equipment is clearly a stupidity; just ask any Volvo race navigator. They didn't call the Volvo the "Round the World match race" for nothing, AIS was constantly used tactically and was interfaced with nav software for this purpose.

 It's annoyingly stupid for him to say this.

 

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Very good Jack.

Edit

Lost the quote, re re buttons.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Francis Vaughan said:

Instead they came away having been booted where it hurts, with nary a public apology or explanation from the competitors involved, the Race Committee or the Club.

Well he is sort of right. So long as you include WOXI in the list of competitors involved.

Right now the only reason anyone remains interested is because of MR's rant in Sail Word, and most importantly his promise to prove their AIS was working. The only public apology or explanation due is currently the one from MR. Nobody else. MR is two weeks overdue on that very public promise. WIthout that explanation, the only apology that is expected is one from him, apologising for the slur on the RC.

The implication of Gladwell's missive is that the "RC and Club" are somehow complicit in deliberately tarnishing WOXI's name. Which is ironic to say the least. Most people will read events as the RC and the CYCA being complicit in an effort to manage things to ensure WOXI kept the win, whilst being seen to do something about BJ's complaining. The perception being that the CYCA treat the Oatley's in a special manner. If true, the previous chair of the IJ not being invited back this race is damning.

Currently, it reads as if Gladwell is drinking from the Oatley cup.  

I suspect that MR has been told in no uncertain terms to STFU.  We will never hear anything else from him on this subject. 

Yes Francis the article did little to disperse the foul odour. Mr Gladwell is certainly drinking the cood aid and is less creditable for it.

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5 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

'"With the Race Committee remaining tight-lipped, the spotlight remains fixed on the crew and owners of Wild Oats XI - accompanied by jeers and innuendo from the usually nameless chatterati that they have cheated or won a race by breaking the rules."

Richard the same ones who read your stuff so you can pay the bills right? If journalists whose job it is to poke the bear won't, or worse forget their creed of independence and write shit, then guess who are the only ones left to do your poking?

Time you gargled some WOXI Cock Wash mate, your breath is now starting to stink.

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213896/A-big-fortnight-for-Women-Sydney-Hobart-Furore

It is not the first time Richard Gladwell has been 'somewhat off the mark' or biased in his writing.

His comments show a lack of awareness of how yacht racing offshore has progressed over the years. In the past at night it was the nav-lights that sometimes got switched off and sometimes by quite high profile boats AND I might add in total non-compliance with the IRPCAS regulations (ColRegs).

Now AIS is, in yacht racing terms in Category 2 and above, just as mandatory.

Yes, it is primarily a safety requirement but anyone who actually believes - as Gladwell writes it is "not a surveillance tool" clearly has a total lack of understanding how useful a "surveillance tool" it can be when monitored at night in an offshore yacht race.

When the Volvo Ocean Race boats went 'dark' their AIS was still pinging. They would wait until they broke out of AIS range of the other boats then take their stealth opportunity. No point in doing it before as the AIS was would still give their position, course and speed away to nearby competitors. Any switching off of the AIS would have been severely penalised.

The fact that the RSHYR Race Cpmmittee did NOT investigate as persons with no "conflict of interest"  shows a lack of attention to duty. They may have only received a report from a competitor but if they had taken their role seriously they should have investigated and gathered evidence (one way or the other) rather than proceed with a half hearted invalid protest leaving the PC with no choice under the RRS but to issue the ruling they did. 

Either way, this leaves a stain on the 2018 RSHYR. If WOXI did cheat they should have been penalised. If they didn't cheat they have had no opportunity to clear their name and the only opinion that would have mattered, that is the opinion of the International Jury (who I have total confidence in by the way) but that was not to be so.

Knowing when your fellow competitors tack or gybe away is ALWAYS an advantage and equally denying that knowledge to a fellow  competitor also provides a potential and often real advantage.

Courage Richard, is your reputation less important than being nice to ONE boat in a regatta?

Bottom line is if WOXI were NOT transmitting an AIS ident they were in non-compliance with the 2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race Sailing Instructions whether they knew it was transmitting or didn't know it was transmitting Of course if they were transmitting then no issue but the amount of rhetoric from various parties regarding the "non- mandatory" nature or that is was "not a surveillance tool" only,  quite naturally adds doubt to the status of the AIS on this boat.

Sad that people won't man up.

SS 

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2 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

It is not the first time Richard Gladwell has been 'somewhat off the mark' or biased in his writing.

His comments show a lack of awareness of how yacht racing offshore has progressed over the years. In the past at night it was the nav-lights that sometimes got switched off and sometimes by quite high profile boats AND I might add in total non-compliance with the IRPCAS regulations (ColRegs).

Now AIS is, in yacht racing terms in Category 2 and above, just as mandatory.

Yes, it is primarily a safety requirement but anyone who actually believes - as Gladwell writes it is "not a surveillance tool" clearly has a total lack of understanding how useful a "surveillance tool" it can be when monitored at night in an offshore yacht race.

When the Volvo Ocean Race boats went 'dark' their AIS was still pinging. They would wait until they broke out of AIS range of the other boats then take their stealth opportunity. No point in doing it before as the AIS was would still give their position, course and speed away to nearby competitors. Any switching off of the AIS would have been severely penalised.

The fact that the RSHYR Race Cpmmittee did NOT investigate as persons with no "conflict of interest"  shows a lack of attention to duty. They may have only received a report from a competitor but if they had taken their role seriously they should have investigated and gathered evidence (one way or the other) rather than proceed with a half hearted invalid protest leaving the PC with no choice under the RRS but to issue the ruling they did. 

Either way, this leaves a stain on the 2018 RSHYR. If WOXI did cheat they should have been penalised. If they didn't cheat they have had no opportunity to clear their name and the only opinion that would have mattered, that is the opinion of the International Jury (who I have total confidence in by the way) but that was not to be so.

Knowing when your fellow competitors tack or gybe away is ALWAYS an advantage and equally denying that knowledge to a fellow  competitor also provides a potential and often real advantage.

Courage Richard, is your reputation less important than being nice to ONE boat in a regatta?

Bottom line is if WOXI were NOT transmitting an AIS ident they were in non-compliance with the 2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race Sailing Instructions whether they knew it was transmitting or didn't know it was transmitting Of course if they were transmitting then no issue but the amount of rhetoric from various parties regarding the "non- mandatory" nature or that is was "not a surveillance tool" only,  quite naturally adds doubt to the status of the AIS on this boat.

Sad that people won't man up.

SS 

Nice virtue signalling again SS. 

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Well said gentleman.

 The SI's required AIS transmission, end of story. No ifs, buts or microwaves.

 

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Lard's lunch, now that's another issue entirely.

 

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12 minutes ago, paps49 said:

Well said gentleman.

 The SI's required AIS transmission, end of story. No ifs, buts or microwaves.

 

Yeah I think BJ knew that lol. 

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9 minutes ago, paps49 said:

Well said gentleman.

 The SI's required AIS transmission, end of story. No ifs, buts or microwaves.

 

Yes Paps,

It's not the breaking of a rule that is irksome, but that they are trying to make it sound like an irrelevant and benign oversight like carrying a v sheet (or not),

They sailed a brilliant race, I just wished they sought to dispel the issue not by fallacious and frankly silly assertions but by being open and treating us with respect.

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So, MR has a story which hasn’t been disproven.

The AIS splitter went down, and could receive but not transmit a significant signal.

They were unaware of this till after the finish, when BJ had a whinge.

A jury convened to sort this out refused to hear a protest.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence, no one has evidence that disputes his claim.

what have I missed here? 

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2 minutes ago, olaf hart said:

So, MR has a story which hasn’t been disproven.

The AIS splitter went down, and could receive but not transmit a significant signal.

They were unaware of this till after the finish, when BJ had a whinge.

A jury convened to sort this out refused to hear a protest.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence, no one has evidence that disputes his claim.

what have I missed here? 

Its a yacht race, not a court of law.  There is no presumption of innocence.

Either you complete the race within all appropriate rules or you don't.  If you don't,  at no fault of your own, you can highlight any non compliance in the after race paperwork.

If you don't complete the race within the rules, how can you be considered to be part of the race?

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1 minute ago, olaf hart said:

So, MR has a story which hasn’t been disproven.

The AIS splitter went down, and could receive but not transmit a significant signal.

They were unaware of this till after the finish, when BJ had a whinge.

A jury convened to sort this out refused to hear a protest.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence, no one has evidence that disputes his claim.

what have I missed here? 

You've missed nothing Olaf.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence ( a legal term) and he enjoys that.

Now we wade through the fallacious arguments surrounding the splitter's apparent failure and the lack of advantage it afforded.

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Presumption of innocence for the one week which I understand he gave himself to prove said innocence (as was reported in the press).

I have seen nothing reported re the anticipated proof and one week is long gone so until I read otherwise I presume he didn't win the race. End of the story for me. Is that fair enough?

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What is presumption of innocence bullshit

even outside sailing there are now all sorts of legislation that reverses the onus

secondly issues of innocence is not how rules of racing work

 

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1 hour ago, Trickypig said:

You've missed nothing Olaf.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence ( a legal term) and he enjoys that.

What? No he’s not. You might want to give him the benefit of the doubt, but that’s a personal moral question for you.

 

edit: beat me to it Lydia.

 

If it went to the IJ there would be no question of “innocence”, just what facts were proven on the evidence, with the first hurdle being whether there was enough evidence on which to find facts sufficient to constitute a contravention.

should we start talking about whether it matters if they knew or didn’t know again? We’ll have to do each topic four or five times if we’re going to make this thread last til Christmas.

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1 hour ago, olaf hart said:

So, MR has a story which hasn’t been disproven.

The AIS splitter went down, and could receive but not transmit a significant signal.

They were unaware of this till after the finish, when BJ had a whinge.

A jury convened to sort this out refused to hear a protest.

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence, no one has evidence that disputes his claim.

what have I missed here? 

 

How do you know the splitter went down ?  Is it just because Richo told you so ?

How do you know it could not transmit a significant signal ? If it is because Richo told you so then we have two problems :

1. How did Richo know it could not transmit a significant signal ?  The entire crew of WO were in no position to have that information.

2. During the times that other maxis were well within VHF range which were for most of the race, how come none of them saw WO on their AIS screens ?  A one watt transmission would have been sufficient.

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1 hour ago, olaf hart said:

MR is entitled to a presumption of innocence, no one has evidence that disputes his claim.

In addition to what has been said above, the interview in Sail World where he demanded an apology from the Race Committee for daring to protest WOXI, and promised to provide evidence that they did not breach any rules. Despite ample evidence from commercial entities that track AIS data that they were not transmitting.

Given MR has given an assurance that such evidence would be forthcoming, he is no longer entitled to any benefit of the doubt. He took the ball into his court of his own volition. He gets judged under the terms of those actions. Demanding an apology from the RC for daring to do their job simply comes under the category of dick behaviour. It pretty much rates with BJ moaning to the media but declining to protest. 

Given how there is considerable evidence to suggest that the RC actually knew the protest would be bounced, and filed it with no further action to bolster their case - action that may otherwise have taken it out of the conflict rule's range, one is left suspecting that they turned a blind eye to the issue to ensure WOXI got the win and hoped like hell the issue of AIS would be forgotten. MR is probably not going to get another get out of gaol card ever again.

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13 hours ago, axolotl said:

So let's all move on, WOXI is the line honor boat, but with an asterisk after the trophy

 

12 hours ago, SCANAS said:

The only asterix would be on BJ’s win which is why they didn’t protest. Had plenty of time to discuss it whilst staring at WOXI’s ass up the river

Well it seems we are all in luck. This conversation was picked up and recorded from aboard Black Jack when in the Derwent looking at WOXI’s arse. An exchange between the BJ afterguard comprising Owner Peter Harburg (PH), Sailing Master Mark Bradford (MB), Tactician Brad Butterworth (BB) and Navigator Tom Addis. It seems the TX button on the remote VHF handset beside the helm was jammed down and some kid in Hobart recorded it on his IPhone VHF App.

 

LOCATION           28 DECEMBER 2018 - EARLY MORNING ON THE DERWENT RIVER HOBART

 

PH.         Looking wistfully at WOXI’s arse, suddenly screamed; “I’m not fucking taking this up the arse any fuckin more.”

MB.        Looking sheepishly; “Taking what up the arse Boss, it’s their arse we are looking at, all we have is the wide heavy pricks behind us with buckleys?”

PH.         “Fucking “this” Squark..fucking “this” fucking cunt of a fucking “this”. What are you a fucking moron or something.”

TA.         “Boss there is nothing we can do about the breeze in the Derwent closing down overnight, it happens nearly every year”

PH.         “Fuck me Squark and Tommy, have you two escaped from some fucking institution for the fuckin intergalactic brain dead.”

BB.         “Settle down Boss…Guys I think Pete, sorry Boss is referring to the sticker up the front of the boat”

MB/TA. Now getting nearly annoyed as PH; “What the fuck has the Rolex S2H Race bow sticker got to do with it you the Kiwi fucktard who made us go in tight to Tasman Is in the dark and not stay wide with WOXI even though Tom had no idea where they fucking were?

BB.         “No, you know the sticker, the one back from the bow that says ‘F1’.”

PH.         “Well fucking Hallelujah, one of you dumb pricks finally gets it and he probably had to pull it out of his sheep dag ridden Kiwi arse, that or his ‘chilly bin’. That’s right ‘Number Fucking 1’, and all you nutless wonders can do is give me for over a decade is anything but a ‘Number Fucking 1’. Jack (Brabham, not Sparrow) would be rolling in his fuckin grave. I feel like a fucking fraud now naming all my fuckin offshore race flotilla ‘Black Jack’s with that sticker up front. You self-absorbed money grabbing pros with no appreciation of racing sporting history, don’t think beyond my last pay cheque you banked you snivelling bastards.”

MB.        “Look I’m really sorry boss, I should have appreciated your frustration about not getting the top silverware after 11 goes at it.

PH.         “Squark fuckin frustration, you don’t bloody well know the meaning of the fucking word. Frustration is at your fucking recommendation buying that RP 66 footer in 2008, spending a bomb on the fucker then after 5 minutes selling it to that Tassie Turner Gambling dude all because you reckoned a Volvo 70 fuckin footer was the go because one day it would blow 40 bastards out of the east then go mongrel south, the 100's shat themselves so we could beat a 100 footer on a budget. What happens, we go on to repeat the same shit for fucking years.”

MB.        “Yeah but that RP66 was a nice boat, you said so yourself.”

PH.         With steam coming out his ears like a nuclear power plant. “ ’Was’ fuckin ‘was’? Squark no fuckin ‘was’ son, look out the back for a fuckin change or buy a rear vision mirror that F1 Jack never needed instead of making me look at WOXI’s arse year in year fucking out you retard. That fuckin “was a nice boat”you made me sell is taking all the silverware in this fucking race to a fuckin low life fucking river put on by the Rushcutter Bay Mafia headed by Matt Allen/Itchy, the fucking Don of that mob and Australian Sailing. You now have me on this fucking 100 footer and what has fuckin changed? The only thing that has changed son is I was fucking 10 foot fucking tall standing on my wallet 11 fucking years ago before meeting you. Thanks to you I’m now a fucking midget. Fuck me dead.”

TA.         “I think I have the solution Boss.”

MB.        And what fucking great idea would that be Tommy, you got a fuckin Outboard with you to strap on the fucking back?”

TA.         “Fuck off Squark. Boss you know how we went to the Race Briefing and were reminded about the change to the SI’s this year included a mandatory AIS turned on provision?”

PH.         “Fucking race briefing, that was days ago, we are in the fucking Derwent son if you haven’t noticed and you are our navigator? Mate I might have to put up with sitting glued in this arsehole of a river for hours, but I’m not waiting all day for your clueless crap I can do without.”  

TA.         “Well I kept telling you and Squark from the beginning I couldn’t from the Start and still can’t pick up WOXI on AIS”

PH.         “Tommy sorry about that I’m a tad emotional at the moment. Now you say that that I remember it well and Squark said to you – ‘it won’t matter Tommy until they are behind us and we have to put a cover on the pricks’. Well that didn’t fuckin happen did it Tommy, so what is this point of pure genius now written all over your fucking face?”

MB/TA. “Boss we could lodge a Protest”

PH.         “Lodge a fucking Protest, Tommy and Squark have those fuckin ants in your heads eaten what is left of youre useless miniscule fucking brains.”

MB.        “But…”

PH.         “For fucks sake Squark don’t you remember last year. Richo carried on a like a fucking pork chop before and after the International Jury hearing where they got whacked into 2nd. Even with a couple of fuckin helicopters filming, an on-board camera and Stan’s video recreation all showing if Jimmy hadn’t put his right hand down, Richo and the Big Fella would still be pulling carbon sprit splinters out of there arses. Then the prick has put poor old Coons and Comanche through the agony of his and the Oatley sulky silence ever since. Fuck they didn’t even invite the IJ Chairman back after that fuckup to the Rushcutters Bay Mafia script after 8 years of exemplary service.”

MB.        “But..”

PH.         “No fucking buts Squark, I’m maybe from Queensland but I’m not fucking brain dead. The Sydney mafia and WOXI fanboys will fuck us whether we Protest with or without a win. Look what they did to Coon, one of their own last year. I’m not going through with that sort of shit.

BB.         “Boss it doesn’t have to be like that, we could make the Race Committee Protest and just sit back. We probably won’t even be asked to attend the IJ hearing and if we do, it will be with all the other 100’s so we can hide behind them. ”

PH.         “Butters you are a fucking Kiwi and don’t know shit from clay. That Rushcutters Bay Mafia will fucking eat their own young before they Protest WOXI.”

BB.         “Boss what happens after the finish every year when tie up?”

PH.         “God give me fucking strength, what is it with you useless lot with this Q&A shit, I didn’t get rich answering fucking 50 questions.”

BB.         “TV cameras Boss, TV cameras. All we do is have a good old cry about no WOXI AIS. They will all then rush over to Richo shoving microphones in his face  saying – what’s with the AIS Mark - and pounds to peanuts he will come up with some his normal Tourette’s stuff like – ‘the Australian Institute of Sport are in Canberra not Hobart, or what’s an AIS?’ - next question.”

PH.         “ Oh dear, so what fucking happens next then Butters, spaceships invade planet earth and take Richo away?”

BB.         “Simple Boss, the Race Committee will get wind of all this bizarre happening and in a flash, they will first look up WOXI’s AIS TX trail on the Interweb and see they came here overland using wheels via Bondi Junction and Launceston, so then will be forced into action. They then interview all us 100’s, nip down and have a quick look at WOXI’s AIS and then lodge a Protest to be determined by the Protest Committee/International Jury. The IJ hearing will probably be done a dusted before we finish our sixth round of Rum and Chokes at the Custom’s House this afternoon.”

PH.         “Is it that simple, surely there is something that can go wrong? Boys I remind you again I’m not here owning this 100’ piece of carbon shit and sending your kids to school by being less than inquisitive. ”

MB.        “Boss the only thing that could derail it is if the Race Committee just lodge a protest solely based on what they have heard via us, therefore  being ‘conflicted’ with no investigation of their own, which would then deem their Protest invalid and so WOXI don’t even have to front up, other than with a couple of stooges.”

PH.         “Fuck if that happened it would make us look like complete cockwarblers for having a cry and not protesting. Every Channel 7 viewer apart from being surprised anyone other than WOXI is in this race, will fucking crucify us. Fuck even my own Courier Mail will say I’m just sucking on sow grapes and suggest I clean out my huge cellar and only drink the Oatley Vineyards Wild Oats label from now on.”

BB.         “Boss forget the popular mainstream media. In my international experience with stuff like this, respected sailing journalists will be all over this. Potential cheating in our self-policed sport is top of the hit parade at the moment.”

PH.         “If that was to happen fuck Independent sailing journalists like Richard Gladwell a rule stickler and never seen drinking to date from the WOXI Cup, they will murder us on a technicality for not protesting. If there is silence or the likes of him gets thirsty they will just try and make it all go away.”

MB.        “Yes Boss that could happen.”

PH.         “Squawk I’m getting the feeling you are getting cold feet here. But in your defence you are now on the Norths teat payroll after selling your loft and my guess is after this race Norths will claim podium finishes including WOXI with a new wardrobe that support a small country and other than for some slow shitters divisions who can only afford Hoods and Doyles wardrobes have cleaned up. Kenny will be doing cartwheels.

MB.        “Not so Boss I’m not ‘conflicted’ here.”

PH.         “So Squawk you using that term ‘conflicted’ again with your warning of the RC making solely a protest based solely upon our ‘conflicted’ position and blowing up their own protest sort of leads me to maybe think you might be potentially also ‘conflicted’. You and Richo talented as you both are in the same boat being basically one race ponies in the same pond that have dust collect on your passports. So I hope I don’t offend but I’m going to have to defer to Butters, the  international sailing guru here with Americas Cups, Admiral's Cup, the Fastnet, the Whitbread and even the old Clippers/Kenwood Cup where everyone got pissed; for the last say to help me decide. Tommy all you have to do is give me a wink, or pretend your shoelaces are undone.”   

BB.         “Boss there is a fuckin snowflakes chance in hell of the RC blowing up their own protest, the eyes of the world are on this race, not even the Rushcutters Bay Mafia could possibly think they could get away with that cover-up shit. If they do independent sailing journalists will be all over it and god forbid if they don’t, it is up to the jeers and innuendo from the nameless chatterati on Sailing Anarchy to remind them it is their job to poke any bear who is playing bully in the cage.”

PH.         “Thanks Butters for that. I have now made my decision subject to the unanimous agreement of you, my valued afterguard. I say we ‘go the Big Cry’, yes or no?”

MB/TA/BB.         “Yay we are the three Musketeers.”

PH.         “Well I’ll be fucked, you useless pricks have suddenly at long last earned your money. Butters I actually said to Squark why in the fuck are we taking you to Hobart this year and funding your house additions in Auckland, well son you proved me wrong. There I was thinking the only decent thing to come out of NZ was your Prime Minister with that mouth that looks like a runaway cheese grater.”

BOOOM               In the distance followed by sounds of backslapping.

TA.         “What in the fuck was that”

PH.         Well Tommy it didn’t come from the fuckin Hobart Duck Shooting Club did it. That was the gunshot for fucking WOXI and the tenth time in thirteen outings, so Richo will be holding both hands up with all fingers outstretched, forgetting to tuck in one thumb.”

MB.        Yeah there is some pent up Oatley frustration there now making it two out of four just to make it here.

BOOOM               Black Jack crosses the line.

TA.         Scrambles below saying; “I’ve got something else that will help us for when we tie up”

PH.         “What in fuck is that Tommy, you got some spare fenders tucked up your arse?”

TA.         “No, there is some leftover onions in the galley, we should start rubbing them like crazy in our eyes without us looking crazy”

MB.        “Tommy can you microwave them first so they are nice and soft?”

TA.         “Squawk I would but I just had a premonition microwaves on a boat will fry all on-board instruments including even the AIS splitter.”

PH.         “Now I know why I pay you fucking dipshits the big money, well done lads, mine will be the first and only shouts at Shippies and the Customs House and whether the IJ deems us first or second, I don’t give a rats arse. World Sailing is the winner here.”

 

CLICK     IPhone turns off.

 

Small Boy.           Gazing across the Derwent watching Black Jack crawl by. “Mum I just recorded something on that IPhone with the VHF App that Uncle Jack gave me for Xmas. It is really weird.”

Mother.               “Oh my god he didn’t put porn on it did he?”

Small Boy.           “No, it seems to be coming from those guys out there in the race with the F1 thing. What do you think I should do with it?”

Mother.               “Dear just send it to your crazy Uncle Jack, I’m sure he will find a place for it.”

Small Boy.           “ I already have already sent it to Uncle Jack and he said; ‘I should get off my arse and go and find where the Race Committee meet, hide in a cupboard there with my IPhone with a full battery on record and I wont be home for dinner.”

Mother.               “Darling you know what my crazy brother is like”

Small Boy.           “But Mum Uncle Jack said if I did that I would be called World Sailings Watergate or discovered who shot the third bullet from the Grassy Knoll”

Mother.               “OK darling, here is some money for the bus fare and a sandwich to tie you over.”

                            

 

To be continued.

Black Jack.jpg

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2 hours ago, lydia said:

What is presumption of innocence bullshit

even outside sailing there are now all sorts of legislation that reverses the onus

secondly issues of innocence is not how rules of racing work

 

So if I am protested under racing rules, the onus is on me to prove my innocence?

I thought the protester had to prove me guilty.

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15 hours ago, LB 15 said:

Hazlewood our for the Gabba test. 

The views on this thread while extraordinarly strong for a race result over three weeks ago have now spiked. 

LB you come from a strong marketing and PR background and know full if you are served up a shit sandwich in the commercial world you only have one of three options to choose from.

1. Mea Culpa; or

2. Say nothing and hope it goes away; or

3. Come out all guns blazing and 'kill off' all disident noise using a strong believeable counter message to deprive them of oxygen. 

For WOXI they have gone hybrid with a bit of #2 and with a bit of #3, but only having wet powder. That will not end well and too late to retract from with or without the Richard Gladwells slurping WOXI soup.

BTW this reply not about you, your cricket post reminded me of the above and so as an aside I hate to say it but your predilection for train crash memes and cricket are not cutting the mustard for killing this thread mate.

PS. By way of comparison even going full tilt #3 and taking 'kill' literally doesn't quite work out well in the long run for some in the communication world.

images (18).jpeg

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In the interests of debunking intentionally misleading "fake news", here is an edited version of Richard Gladwell, Sail-World.com/nz 19 Jan 14:46 NZDT   -

 Strikeout for the original, italics for insertions.

Anyone else care to make suggestions to further improve the quality of the article?

Rolex Sydney Hobart furore

On the water, the 2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart line honours competition developed into a Battle Royal between the five supermaxis, which dropped to four after the withdrawal of Scallywag with a broken bowsprit.

The remaining four lead-swapped all the way to the finish in Hobart. Eventually, the old champion Wild Oats XI - who seems to be unbeatable over the last stretches of the course from Tasman Island - got away again and won line honours for the ninth time. was not seen on AIS for virtually the entire race according to a close competitor, crossed the line first.

The A controversy naturally started after some remarks to the media by the skipper and owner of the second placed Black Jack claiming stating that Wild Oats XI had her AIS (automatic identification system) turned off, and thus she was able to give the fleet the slip on the final night. (Fully functioning AIS having been mandatory for this race.)

Although Black Jack did not proceed with a protest, the Rolex Sydney Hobart Race Committee, for reasons best known to itself,  not made public decided to act and protested WOXI some 12 hours after the finish. The Race Committee's complaint protest was dismissed after being ruled by the Int Jury to be invalid in a preliminary stage of the Hearing. The jury therefore did not consider or rule on the details of the protest. That failure meant that the details of the claim were not revealed in a full Hearing.

WOXI skipper Mark Richards hotly rebuked the Race Committee's and Black Jack's claims. We feature an interview with him in this edition. Shortly after the race with events fresh in everyone's minds, he stated that he would prove the claims and statements he made concerning WOXI's AIS issues within a week. Quoting him from (, by Richard Gladwell, Sail-World.com/nz 31 Dec 2018 17:10 NZDT)  "We can very clearly prove that we had our AIS on for the entire race. We can prove, and will confirm in a week's time, that we were compromised by live-streaming from the helicopter."

 Well Mark, the weeks long gone; so where is the proof?

As we I write the matter is still unresolved. An explanation needs to be made as to how Wild Oats XI's AIS transmission was not seen by others and if it could have been affected/fried by microwave transmission equipment operated by the Channel 7 camera crew. The "proof" which was offered has to my knowledge, yet to materialise. Without that explanation who will have media people on board before the start of the 2019 edition of the annual offshore classic?

It should be noted that whilst AIS is primarily a system to alert other vessels of other craft in the area. It is of course a safety feature, not but it is also incidentally a very powerful racing surveillance tool which reveals to each skipper in a race, the position, course and speed of every competing boat within a few miles rang, and with great precision and on a near-real- time basis on a continuous 24 hour per day basis. A boat receiving AIS but not transmitting has all this data for all his nearby competitors at his fingertips but his competitors are denied sight of his position, course and speed on their AIS receivers.

Outside the protest room, the comments alleging cheating by WOXI cut very deep, and are continuing almost three weeks after the finish of the race.

With the Race Committee remaining tight-lipped, the spotlight remains fixed on the crew and owners of Wild Oats XI - accompanied by jeers and innuendo from the usually nameless chatterati that they have cheated or won a race by breaking the rules.

This is a grossly unfair  the  situation to for WOXI, and her crew, owners and supporters will have to live with it.

Make no mistake the 2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart race should might have been a big celebration for the Oatley and Wild Oats family - with a Line Honours win in Wild Oats XI. and second in the Overall standings with a Womens crew sailing Wild Oats X.

Instead they came away having accepted the trophy and continue to be been booted where it hurts in the clear and unforgiving light of public opinion, with nary a public apology or explanation from to the competitors involved, the Race Committee or the Club.

You guys are better than that.

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8 hours ago, staysail said:

 

 

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7 hours ago, savoir said:

 

 

7F3BC392-3AF0-4930-B9F9-D2D8E68A4A93.jpeg

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7 hours ago, resist said:

 

 

13377E8B-60E0-46F0-9CF6-770B74DC073E.jpeg

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2 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

 

 

1A924D39-84F4-4057-8125-A596403584D8.jpeg

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8 hours ago, lydia said:

What is presumption of innocence bullshit

even outside sailing there are now all sorts of legislation that reverses the onus

secondly issues of innocence is not how rules of racing work

 

Can you explain this for us?

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17 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

'"With the Race Committee remaining tight-lipped, the spotlight remains fixed on the crew and owners of Wild Oats XI - accompanied by jeers and innuendo from the usually nameless chatterati that they have cheated or won a race by breaking the rules."

Richard the same ones who read your stuff so you can pay the bills right? If journalists whose job it is to poke the bear won't, or worse forget their creed of independence and write shit, then guess who are the only ones left to do your poking?

Time you gargled some WOXI Cock Wash mate, your breath is now starting to stink.

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213896/A-big-fortnight-for-Women-Sydney-Hobart-Furore

 

11 hours ago, shanghaisailor said:

It is not the first time Richard Gladwell has been 'somewhat off the mark' or biased in his writing.His comments show a lack of awareness of how yacht racing offshore has progressed over the years.....

Shang I have been reading Richard Gladwells writings for years. If it came down to a RRS interpretation I have never once questioned his interpretation. He both being a journalist and WS Jury member etc CV extending back decades gave me comfort his opinion was solid. Sure being a Kiwi some of his AC maybe regarded as a bit biased, but so what.

Then his WOXI interview came up 3 days after race end.

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213456/Wild-Oats-XIs-skipper-answers-critics-on-S2H-row

I was quite prepared to accept that with his underlying theme being of Black Jack fucking up by not protesting. I was happy to accept that even though he didn't interrogate the aspect of the Race Committee making a protest that poor blind Freddy could see would be deemed invalid. I probably countered that with Mark Richards promising he would come clean within a week of interview, three weeks ago (and so far hasn't). I was also happy to accept that it wasn't so much an interview but a WOXI PR fluff piece to an interviewer sympathic to strict interpretation of the RRS.

Then things starting going off the rails. Like another supposed sailing journalist had this sycophantic WOXI drivel posted on the FP.

https://sailinganarchy.com/2019/01/04/jaccuse/

I countered Blue Robinson's WOXI cockwarbler shit with this.

https://sailinganarchy.com/2019/01/06/if-it-quacks-like-a-duck/

That then leaves us with this from Richard Gladwell yesterday. It is in fact circular and joins with Blue Robinson's dribble above.

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213896/A-big-fortnight-for-Women-Sydney-Hobart-Furore

I'm probably harsh saying Richard should go gargle some WOXI Cock Wash. What however is inescapable by this last WOXI piece of his, is he has now committed a journalists worst sin and traded independence for access just like Blue.

If he or his sailing journalist colleagues don't get off their fat arses and start poking a few bears, things will go unchanged in the sailing world.

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1 hour ago, Trickypig said:

Can you explain this for us?

Easiest to explain is taxation legislation where for instance PAYG debts are raised and the tax payer must disprove the debt

same goes for Part IVC determinations

 

in sailing the rrrs first work on the principle if you breach than you you take the penalty yourself and even in the protest room you do not have any presumption but rather one part seeks to make a case against you which they may or may not do

there is no prosecuting authority

 

there a lots of inquiries and examinations nowday where there is no right not to answer questions as well  so talking about a right to silence is crap as well

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40 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

If he or his sailing journalist colleagues don't get off their fat arses and start poking a few bears, things will go unchanged in the sailing world.

You see jack ‘journalists’ need to write stories that more than about 5 people on a sailing forum give a flying fuck about. Even if one did decide to put their head over the parapet- and they could find an editor to run with such old news- all they would do is find themselves very lonely during HIRW. Even then nothing in the Sailing world would change. Sure a few heads would explode on here, but you guys Sailing your keyboards could hardly be described as being in the ‘Sailing world’. This is just the ‘chattering class world.’

Again congratulations to Mark and the team on their magnificent 9th win.

37C160FC-06A3-4710-9DB5-2D531B799C3C.jpeg

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16 minutes ago, lydia said:

Easiest to explain is taxation legislation where for instance PAYG debts are raised and the tax payer must disprove the debt

same goes for Part IVC determinations

 

in sailing the rrrs first work on the principle if you breach than you you take the penalty yourself and even in the protest room you do not have any presumption but rather one part seeks to make a case against you which they may or may not do

there is no prosecuting authority

 

there a lots of inquiries and examinations nowday where there is no right not to answer questions as well  so talking about a right to silence is crap as well

Same at our yacht club. They say you have caused someone to be offended and then you have to prove that that person is a sackless, cocksmoking snowflake who should take up golf. I have about 10 cases on the go presently. 

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2 minutes ago, LB 15 said:

You see jack ‘journalists’ need to write stories that more than about 5 people on a sailing forum give a flying fuck about...

Mate you are stepping off a cliff into the unknown world. My tip.. play safe and stick with the memes.

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1 minute ago, jack_sparrow said:

Mate you are stepping off a cliff into the unknown world. My tip.. play safe and stick with the memes.

What, are you 5 haters going to post nasty things about me?  Oh no! I better get myself a safe space. 

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