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2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race: The Race Committee has lodged a protest against Wild Oats XI

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Just now, hiphip said:

The SI says that a boat has to file a protest within 6 hours of finishing. Does this mean any boat not finished could still protest WOXI?

Have a look at RRS 61 and se how anyone else can protest at this time.

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From the ABC news website:

But a five-member international jury ruled the protest was invalid because it needed to have been lodged by a competitor.

Russell Green, the chairman of the international jury, said the race committee's investigation and protest had arisen from a competitor in the race, and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the racing rules of sailing.

"For the protest to be valid under racing rules of sailing, a competitor with the information about a potential rule breach must lodge a protest," Mr Green said.

"The sport of sailing is a self-policing sport. These guys are out there, out of sight, out of land, we don't have referees.

"If there's a possible breach, then it's up to the competitors to bring a protest."

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3 hours ago, olaf hart said:

She has been non compliant since the day she was launched.

tungsten bulb now illegal, she was grandfathered.

powered winches and keel, so much for human powered sailboats.

the rules were never meant to apply to WOXI, MR knows that and was just being consistent.

 

Do I win the meat tray?

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Overall this is probably the best result. The rule on the RC's protests is there for a reason, and that reason is clear - don't expect the RC to do your work for you. BJ moaning and then having the RC protest had a bad smell to it, and that would not have gone away. But, as always, there are many lessons to be learnt. And some good has come from this.

  • The RC should be clear that if there are additions to the SI's, someone should be checking. The lack of any oversight on the AIS rule, despite the clear evidence of breaches, suggests the RC was asleep. Had they been looking, they would have seen all those boats whose AIS was inoperative, and should have bundled the lot up in a protest. Only going after WOXI after BJ's moaning was never going to sit well. Next year one would hope they will do some checking.
  • Next year, everyone will be pretty damned clear that the AIS stays on. 
  • MR will know that he ducked a bullet. WOXI was not exonerated, and if the protest had come from an RC that had observed the breach independently they would be looking at a very different outcome. Doesn't excuse his churlish arrogance. But that will probably never be cured.

The S2H ducked a bullet as well. 

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2 minutes ago, trt131 said:

Does that mean Black Jack is illegal with her tungsten bulb

No, Alfa and Oats were grandfathered, the only boats.

so, keep building new hulls around those two bulbs ...

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If Matt Allen as President of AS has any balls he should put Harburg/Bradford and Oatley/Richards in a room and read them the riot act. Harburg for not protesting but having a cry on national TV and Oatley for doing what ever they fuckin did to make this shitfight appear in peoples loungerooms.

I betcha he doesn't as that Oatley trough of money that Australia Sailing's snout is in, is way too big to put at risk.  

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Disgusted that at the “highest” level of our sport, that a “shall” rule can (seemingly) be completely ignored without reprocussion.  Does anyone else wonder if WOIx would have made their “winning maneuver” going outside Comanche if they didn’t have the AIS info on the Indian when she parked up?  What a sad statement on an otherwise amazing race, and for most of us,, an amazing Corinthian sport. How do we, as experienced yachtsmen, explain to folks outside our under appreciated/ missunderstood sport that a simple “shall” rule can be ignored.  Very sad and makes a joke of our sport, imho.  SAD!

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20 minutes ago, Philc said:

Have a look at RRS 61 and se how anyone else can protest at this time.

So if a boat finds out at the finished that some boats turned off their ais. Could that boat protest all those boats.  

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The official outcome of the protest against Wild Oats XI

Following a protest against Wild Oats XI by the Race Committee of the Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race, which was held by the International Jury at Royal Yacht Club of Tasmania today, it was found that the protest was invalid and so Wild Oats XI retains her line honours crown.

 

Conclusions:

  1. The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

 

  1. The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

 

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

 

Decision:  Protest Invalid.

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11 minutes ago, TCWippy said:

Disgusted that at the “highest” level of our sport, that a “shall” rule can (seemingly) be completely ignored without reprocussion.  Does anyone else wonder if WOIx would have made their “winning maneuver” going outside Comanche if they didn’t have the AIS info on the Indian when she parked up?  What a sad statement on an otherwise amazing race, and for most of us,, an amazing Corinthian sport. How do we, as experienced yachtsmen, explain to folks outside our under appreciated/ missunderstood sport that a simple “shall” rule can be ignored.  Very sad and makes a joke of our sport, imho.  SAD!

There is no evidence that it was "completely ignored"  The equipment was on the boat and worked prior to the start and after the finish.  The suggestion that it was deliberately turned off during the race is something that you read here on SA, not something that has been stated by anyone on the boat.  We don't get to find out the facts of the case because the protest was ruled invalid.  

Sailing will be just fine, don't worry.   Almost everyone will have forgotten about this by tomorrow night, sooner if Trump tweets something stupid in the next hour or two.

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6 minutes ago, TCWippy said:

Disgusted that at the “highest” level of our sport, that a “shall” rule can (seemingly) be completely ignored without reprocussion.  Does anyone else wonder if WOIx would have made their “winning maneuver” going outside Comanche if they didn’t have the AIS info on the Indian when she parked up?  What a sad statement on an otherwise amazing race, and for most of us,, an amazing Corinthian sport. How do we, as experienced yachtsmen, explain to folks outside our under appreciated/ missunderstood sport that a simple “shall” rule can be ignored.  Very sad and makes a joke of our sport, imho.  SAD!

Maybe u could explain there are rules about protests too. All rules should be adhered to. 

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29 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Blah blah, the International Jury have ruled. Game over.

Except no Jury hearing was convened. Game didn't even kick off.

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5 minutes ago, TCWippy said:

Disgusted that at the “highest” level of our sport, that a “shall” rule can (seemingly) be completely ignored without reprocussion.  Does anyone else wonder if WOIx would have made their “winning maneuver” going outside Comanche if they didn’t have the AIS info on the Indian when she parked up?  What a sad statement on an otherwise amazing race, and for most of us,, an amazing Corinthian sport. How do we, as experienced yachtsmen, explain to folks outside our under appreciated/ missunderstood sport that a simple “shall” rule can be ignored.  Very sad and makes a joke of our sport, imho.  SAD!

I think you need to relax a bit

 

The protest was invalid that was by the book. If a competitor had an issue they could have protested like Comanche did last year really simple If Oats said it was on we need to take that at face value.

There will be no public execution tonight I understand that's what you all want yo see

 

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1 minute ago, jack_sparrow said:

Except no Jury hearing was convened. Game didn't even kick off.

The Jury ruled the protest invalid. The first job of a PC is to decide if the protest is valid. If not that is where it ends. So there was a hearing.

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Fuck Mark Richards for cheating and then having the balls not to come clean about it.

Fuck Black Jack for not having the balls to protest themselves.

Now there's no closure.

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6 minutes ago, Philc said:

Conclusions:

  1. The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing

 

Decision:  Protest Invalid.

So no one on the race committee checked AIS for the duration of the race and noticed that WO 11 was not transmitting?

And not one of the 80 competitors has the balls to protest an infringement of the SIs.

Good result, the best justice that money can buy.

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Mark Richards in the interview says that it was a gruelling race, 2 days with no sleep..

If he sticks around in Hobart long enough maybe he could buy the guys of Gun Runnner a few beers, and find out what gruelling really is....

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1 minute ago, EddyAllTime said:

What actual evidence didr any of you fucktards have that WOXI cheated?

Eddy let me guess you can be arse fucked with house brick under the cover of darkness, but you won't complain until a Judge concurs with you?

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6 minutes ago, HILLY said:

Mark Richards in the interview says that it was a gruelling race, 2 days with no sleep..

If he sticks around in Hobart long enough maybe he could buy the guys of Gun Runnner a few beers, and find out what gruelling really is....

how was your sydney to hobart???

willing to bet that the crew on gun runner had sleep during the race, and that they weren't pushing nearly as hard.

a hard race for all, yes

MR didn't say anywhere tat his race was harder than anyone elses

chill out dude

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8 minutes ago, HILLY said:

Mark Richards in the interview says that it was a gruelling race, 2 days with no sleep..

If he sticks around in Hobart long enough maybe he could buy the guys of Gun Runnner a few beers, and find out what gruelling really is....

True dat!

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7 minutes ago, EddyAllTime said:

What actual evidence didr any of you fucktards have that WOXI cheated?

Screenshots of AIS with/without WOXI for the duration of the race?

Front up with the actual evidence or sit down and shut up. 

 

image.thumb.png.eea010d795927c6a7734ae106117aa9f.png

image.thumb.png.70e4472c4b16ceb3be9a1ceea3d0751f.png

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5 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Great comments by Mark Bradford.

Could have said we learned our lesson that having a cry on TV doesn't cut the mustard.

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1 minute ago, Kermit said:

Maybe u could explain there are rules about protests too. All rules should be adhered to. 

I’m well aware of, and respect the rules governing our, to me, beloved sport.  WOIx, imho, violated those rules as evidenced by the lack of transmission data from their boat.  If ours was a true Corinthian sport, they should have withdrawn based on the fact they did not follow the rules, involuntary, or otherwise.  Who of us hasn’t finished a race only to find we were declared OCS and have sworn that we weren’t over and that we complied with the rules?  I’ve never won that argument, but i’m not worth $1.5B either. Pathetic. 

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it would be quite legitimate for one of the smaller boats to protest WO. They have up to 6 hours from their own finish.

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12 minutes ago, TCWippy said:

I’m well aware of, and respect the rules governing our, to me, beloved sport.  WOIx, imho, violated those rules as evidenced by the lack of transmission data from their boat.  If ours was a true Corinthian sport, they should have withdrawn based on the fact they did not follow the rules, involuntary, or otherwise.  Who of us hasn’t finished a race only to find we were declared OCS and have sworn that we weren’t over and that we complied with the rules?  I’ve never won that argument, but i’m not worth $1.5B either. Pathetic. 

So much conjecture and anecdotal emotional ramblings here. You even pulled the rich card which is insulting to Richard Greens PC common sense prevailed.

You can't say "but the rules " but not respect them when it comes to the protest part. You  can't cherry pick 

You really need some perspective here and not lead with emotional conspiracy rich guy bollox

The best sailed fastest boat won on the water where it counts

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3 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

So much conjecture and anecdotal emotional ramblings here you even pulled the rich card which is insulting to Richard Greens PC common sense prevailed

You can't say "but the rules " but not respect them when it comes to the protest part. You  can't cherry pick 

You really need some perspective give and not lead with emotional conspiracy rich guy bollox

Russell Green not Richard, I know you Wellingtonians struggle with the JAFAs

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16 minutes ago, TCWippy said:

I’m well aware of, and respect the rules governing our, to me, beloved sport.  WOIx, imho, violated those rules as evidenced by the lack of transmission data from their boat.  If ours was a true Corinthian sport, they should have withdrawn based on the fact they did not follow the rules, involuntary, or otherwise.  Who of us hasn’t finished a race only to find we were declared OCS and have sworn that we weren’t over and that we complied with the rules?  I’ve never won that argument, but i’m not worth $1.5B either. Pathetic. 

You were asking how to explain it to non sailors. You’re all over the shop with your opinions. The protest was dismissed.

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In software / coding competitions, we often have a prize for Best Abuse of Rules. And then the rules are immediately amended to close the loophole.

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4 minutes ago, trt131 said:

Russell Green not Richard, I know you Wellingtonians struggle with the JAFAs

Fair call right there 

 

And yeah Jafa so who cares

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16 minutes ago, EddyAllTime said:

Look at the sources - WOXI was only ever picked up by the terrestrial stations. Could genuinely be an equipment problem if not picking up and satellites...

 

If it can be picked up by terrestrial stations it can be picked up by satellites. If it was properly transmitting in Sydney the sats would've seen it. 

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6 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

So many WO haters. Tall Poppy syndrome?

Maybe that there are very few people who like what they do? I guess it is like an election where you gauge the feedback of the masses, it seems you're the only supporter and would not be surprised if you sail/work on the boat or fucking someone who does? Sadly the sport is run like the antiquated Westminster law system, not about fact or reality but a pyrimad of legislation. The reality is that AIS was switched off and that can never be denied (except if you are Ricko). At $10,000 a day I would have thought that Butterworth would have been all over it....... 

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Just now, Kermit said:

You were asking how to explain it to non sailors. You’re all over the shop with your opinions. The protest was dismissed.

Very nitpicky, but it was not dismissed. That would suggest exoneration. 

The protest was ruled invalid. It was ruled invalid by the application of the rules about protesting.

So the protest never progressed to a finding of facts. The findings that did occur were clear: the RC were right to check things, but they were not in a position to protest, that was the job of BJ. That comes back to the self policing aspect. This is a sport, not real life, there are no policemen and no department of public prosecutions. As a competitor, you are duty bound to perform your role in the enforcement of the rules. You don't get to have it done by proxy if you will be advantaged by the result. And the rules are totally clear on this. 

One might argue (and I will) that the RC were asleep at the wheel, and should have been independently checking on the AIS transmissions across the fleet. The rule was there. But they didn't. BJ noticed, but instead of taking up their duty, they went for trial by media. That wasn't a good look, and they should not have been advantaged by doing so, and they were not.

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BJ might be fairly content right now.  Didn’t protest for the win but let the World know that WO elect to not play by the rules.

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14 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

So many WO haters. Tall Poppy syndrome?

Yes you can gauge by how many other yachts didnt have them on and how many have complained about them, seems Oats must be the only boat without the AIS.

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12 minutes ago, Kermit said:

You were asking how to explain it to non sailors. You’re all over the shop with your opinions. The protest was dismissed.

Just to get it right.  The protest was declared invalid. Different to dismissed.

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These rules clearly are from the dark ages..... what happens when a competitor cheats in the Olympic sailing classes and no sailor lodges a protest. Dumbest thing I have ever heard in my life, what is the point of even having a race committee if they have no purpose once the start gun fires.

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22 minutes ago, Guvacine said:

Bullshit outcome. You can cheat if you are well connected. The Sydney Hobart is fu**ed.

I think Sparrow addressed this earlier.  Oatley products own this race with dosh and it's gonna take big balls to stand up which BJ could have done. But their balls are too small.

 

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6 minutes ago, Francis Vaughan said:

Very nitpicky, but it was not dismissed. That would suggest exoneration. 

The protest was ruled invalid. It was ruled invalid by the application of the rules about protesting.

So the protest never progressed to a finding of facts. The findings that did occur were clear: the RC were right to check things, but they were not in a position to protest, that was the job of BJ. That comes back to the self policing aspect. This is a sport, not real life, there are no policemen and no department of public prosecutions. As a competitor, you are duty bound to perform your role in the enforcement of the rules. You don't get to have it done by proxy if you will be advantaged by the result. And the rules are totally clear on this. 

One might argue (and I will) that the RC were asleep at the wheel, and should have been independently checking on the AIS transmissions across the fleet. The rule was there. But they didn't. BJ noticed, but instead of taking up their duty, they went for trial by media. That wasn't a good look, and they should not have been advantaged by doing so, and they were not.

Cant the race committee DSQ someone for a breach of the SIs? I wonder if the jury were more saying to the race committee, get your own house in order and don't make us do your dirty work.

It's pretty embarrassing for the race committee / yacht club that they have been shown to be this incompetent regarding their knowledge of the rules?

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4 minutes ago, Mad Mac said:

Just to get it right.  The protest was declared invalid. Different to dismissed.

I didn’t say exonerated. It was dismissed by being called invalid.

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12 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

Don’t know about S2H, but US races SIs specify that the RRS replace the  COLREGS during hours of daylight.

Agreed. Can’t luff at night. But the rule-path that requires lights at night seems the same?

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1 minute ago, dachopper said:

These rules clearly are from the dark ages..... what happens when a competitor cheats in the Olympic sailing classes and no sailor lodges a protest. Dumbest thing I have ever heard in my life, what is the point of even having a race committee if they have no purpose once the start gun fires.

RC can protest on its own but not after another competitor tells them about an incident but won't protest themselves very clear 

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It will be interesting to see in the long drawn out review how many other yachts had issues with AIS, my money is on none..... 

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30 minutes ago, Guvacine said:

Bullshit outcome. You can cheat if you are well connected. The Sydney Hobart is fu**ed.

other way of looking at it is that if you cross the line first you win...

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2 minutes ago, thetruth said:

It will be interesting to see in the long drawn out review how many other yachts had issues with AIS, my money is on none..... 

infotrack did

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4 minutes ago, frant said:

I think the IJ has handed MR a poisoned chalice. You can take the win but your reputation will be forever tarnished. For many great sportsmen their reputation is far more valuable than an event victory.

I wonder if his contract includes performance incentives?  The whole episode stinks and brings discredit to both Oats and the race itself, which I (never done it) believe is the the premiere ocean race in the world trailed closely by the Fastnet.  

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I've never understood the aversion to taking a competitor 'to the room' and just 'leaving it out on the water', what utter bullshit, the rules are an important part of our sport and often the room provides a great learning experience...so my question is, if BJ had had protested, what specific evidence would a PC require/accept from them to judge that a breach of the Si's did occur?

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7 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

RC can protest on its own but not after another competitor tells them about an incident but won't protest themselves very clear 

Did BJ talk to the race committee.... sounded like they spoke to the media not committee...

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1 minute ago, dachopper said:

Did BJ talk to the race committee.... sounded like they spoke to the media not committee...

Yes they did speak to media that how the RC found out.

The verdict is very clear and is just following the rules BJ should have protested or shut up imo

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23 minutes ago, thetruth said:

Maybe that there are very few people who like what they do? I guess it is like an election where you gauge the feedback of the masses, it seems you're the only supporter and would not be surprised if you sail/work on the boat or fucking someone who does? Sadly the sport is run like the antiquated Westminster law system, not about fact or reality but a pyrimad of legislation. The reality is that AIS was switched off and that can never be denied (except if you are Ricko). At $10,000 a day I would have thought that Butterworth would have been all over it....... 

The Wild Oats team and boat deserve all the accolades they have achieved. The boat is special, and the team know how to get the best out of her. She has stood the test of time, she has longevity. New designs have come and gone and she has beat them all. From Investec Loyal, to Ragamuffin, to Perpetual Loyal to Comanche. She is the greatest Supermaxi of her time. You might not like Mark Richards but there is no denying he is the most successful skipper in the history of the race.

If you hate Wild Oats, you should hate Infotrack just as much. You were all talking rules like they were the best thing since sliced bread before the hearing, and now you don't agree and think they are a disgrace. If you want rules to be followed, you should be praising the jury for following them, not just cherry picking the ones you like.

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The finding was that Blackjack put it in their report to the RC. That's how they knew about it. Also, a rather dubious looking Fact 3 ...

Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race 2018
Hearing # 1
Decision of International Jury
Date of Hearing: 29 December 2018 at 1300
Date of Incident: 26 December 2018 — 28 December 2018
Protestor: Race Committee Represented by David Jordan
Protestee: Wild Oats Xl Represented by Glenn Bourke and Stephen Quigley
Witness(es): Nil.
Translator(s): Not Applicable.
Validity: Invalid
Facts Found: Facts on Validity
1. Black Jack and Wild Oats Xl both competed in the Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race 2018 (the Race).
2. Shortly after finishing, the owner of Black Jack submitted a report to the Race Committee alleging that Wild Oats Xl's AIS "had not transmitted throughout" the Race.
3. Prior to the report, the Race Committee had "no knowledge of an issue" with Wild Oats Xl's AIS.
4. As a result of receiving the report, the Race Committee conducted an investigation into AIS tracking records in respect of Wild Oats Xl. The Race Committee obtained evidence from its own investigation that Wild Oats Xl may have breached Sl 11.4 and therefore submitted the protest.
Diagram: Not Applicable.
Conclusions: Conclusion on Validity
1. The Race Committee's investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the RRS.
2. The Race Committee's investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.
Rules that Apply: RRS60.2(a), Definitions - Conflict of Interest
Decision: Protest Invalid

Protest Decision I — Race Committee v WOXI Page 1 of 2
Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race 2018
International Jury: Russell Green, Peter Scheuerl, Jamie Sutherland, David Tillett, Rosemary Collins
Chairman's Signature: 
Date and Time
Decision Advised: 29 December 2018 at 1400
Protest Decision 1 — Race Committee v WOXI Page 2 of 2

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5 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Yes they did speak to media that how the RC found out.

Wrong.

"2. Shortly after finishing, the owner of Black Jack submitted a report to the Race Committee alleging that Wild Oats Xl's AIS "had not transmitted throughout" the Race."

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3 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

The Wild Oats team and boat deserve all the accolades they have achieved. The boat is special, and the team know how to get the best out of her. She has stood the test of time, she has longevity. New designs have come and gone and she has beat them all. From Investec Loyal, to Ragamuffin, to Perpetual Loyal to Comanche. She is the greatest Supermaxi of her time. You might not like Mark Richards but there is no denying he is the most successful skipper in the history of the race.

If you hate Wild Oats, you should hate Infotrack just as much. You were all talking rules like they were the best thing since sliced bread before the hearing, and now you don't agree and think they are a disgrace. If you want rules to be followed, you should be praising the jury for following them, not just cherry picking the ones you like.

Investec Loyal, Perpetual Loyal and Infotrack are the same yacht.

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1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said:

In theory yes. Or it may mean competitors sort it between themselves for potential infringements and if no agreement someone has to lodge a protest. It is dumb thinking by simply having a cry on TV the RC or prosecutor is going to be the policeman in a self policed sport. If Harburg didn't know that he knows it now.

I see the lack of effort here on the behalf of the RC as creating a lack of faith in RC's.

It's not going to end up being a positive for the sport......

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5 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

If you hate Wild Oats

I don't hate Wild Oats.

I do hate cheating
...and arrogant cunts that think the rules don't apply to them
...and craven owners that hire them
...and spineless event organizers that let them get away with it
...and the effect it all has on the sport I've loved my entire life. 

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5 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Yes they did speak to media that how the RC found out.

The verdict is very clear and is just following the rules BJ should have protested or shut up imo

God I hate sycophant suck ups. Maybe its a Kiwi thing Liquid, from your inter-village contests? How can anyone cheer for a team of obvious cheaters? Note OBVIOUS. WOXI and Oats will now be remembered forever as the team that cheats (built on this and last year's performance).

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2 minutes ago, nimbus said:

Wrong

Picking straws. RC heard of it first via the media unless living under a rock. The detail came to their attention via BJ's report to the RC.

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5 minutes ago, Flags said:

Cant the race committee DSQ someone for a breach of the SIs?

No. That is the point of having a jury. The RC can't (well nearly can't) DSQ anyone by themselves.

Quote

63.1 Requirement for a Hearing

A boat or competitor shall not be penalized without a protest hearing, except as provided in rules 30.2, 30.3, 30.4, 64.3(d), 69, 78.2, A5 and P2.

 

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Is it worth mentioning that WOXI was represented by Glenn Bourke and Stephen Quigley in the room? Is it unusual for the skipper not to be there?

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6 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

The Wild Oats team and boat deserve all the accolades they have achieved. The boat is special, and the team know how to get the best out of her. She has stood the test of time, she has longevity. New designs have come and gone and she has beat them all. From Investec Loyal, to Ragamuffin, to Perpetual Loyal to Comanche. She is the greatest Supermaxi of her time. You might not like Mark Richards but there is no denying he is the most successful skipper in the history of the race.

If you hate Wild Oats, you should hate Infotrack just as much. You were all talking rules like they were the best thing since sliced bread before the hearing, and now you don't agree and think they are a disgrace. If you want rules to be followed, you should be praising the jury for following them, not just cherry picking the ones you like.

I don't hate anyone and I personally know 50% of the crew and know that they would never cheat. My point is just read the thread, people are pissed off at the comments Ricko made on international media and then changing his story. For ourselves is a bit of a give away by the way. I would have chosen something a little more subtle...... 

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8 minutes ago, Philc said:

Investec Loyal, Perpetual Loyal and Infotrack are the same yacht.

No they're not. Investec Loyal was the old Maximus which later became the Ragamuffin 100. Perpetual Loyal is the ex-Speedboat as is Infotrack which is why I didn't add them to the list.

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2 minutes ago, nimbus said:

Is it worth mentioning that WOXI was represented by Glenn Bourke and Stephen Quigley in the room? Is it unusual for the skipper not to be there?

No normally the best rules people on the yacht.

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2 minutes ago, nimbus said:

Is it worth mentioning that WOXI was represented by Glenn Bourke and Stephen Quigley in the room? Is it unusual for the skipper not to be there?

No.

Probably quite smart actually.

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That was a seriously piss poor effort by the RC. Once the owner of BJ contacted them it became easy to see that he was an interested person thereby making any following race committee protest invalid. They should have told him so at the time.

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5 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Picking straws. RC heard of it first via the media unless living under a rock. The detail came to their attention via BJ's report to the RC.

That raises an interesting issue.  Would the RC look into the matter based on the media report and without a formal report from BJ?

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Well, thanks to some of the more even handed posters here I'm starting get over this whole sorry thing (still tastes bad, poisoned chalice indeed).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

However, I'm keeping the asterisk.

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1 minute ago, Forourselves said:

No they're not. Investec Loyal was the old Maximus which later became the Ragamuffin 100. Perpetual Loyal is the ex-Speedboat as is Infotrack which is why I didn't add them to the list.

I stand corrected.

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1 minute ago, savoir said:

That was a seriously piss poor effort by the RC. Once the owner of BJ contacted them it became easy to see that he was an interested person thereby making any following race committee protest invalid. They should have told him so at the time.

This! But did they just want it to go away?

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7 minutes ago, Guvacine said:

God I hate sycophant suck ups. Maybe its a Kiwi thing Liquid, from your inter-village contests? How can anyone cheer for a team of obvious cheaters? Note OBVIOUS. WOXI and Oats will now be remembered forever as the team that cheats (built on this and last year's performance).

I believe they get a tough wrap and the boat and crew are exceptional. I think they made an error of judgement last year and paid for but I'm not going to slate the years of success because of some emotive internet ramblings. They are an exceptional sailing team 

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1 minute ago, frant said:

Nitpicking  but you are wrong Jack, the individual members of the race committee no doubt aware of situation via media and own observations long before, however, only a report addressed to the RC would bring this to the RC attention unless an individual member raised this issue to the full committee first.

FFS, the RC knew what was going on during the race.  They followed it in real time just like you and I did. The RC chose not to act. 

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"4. As a result of receiving the report, the Race Committee conducted an investigation into AIS tracking records in respect of Wild Oats Xl. The Race Committee obtained evidence from its own investigation that Wild Oats Xl may have breached Sl 11.4 and therefore submitted the protest."

1. The RC if on the ball would have obtained the attached record available to Jo Public.

2. The should have interogatted WOXI's AIS. This might be supported by WOXI's AIS at 2.00pm local time yesterday suddenly springing to life after being dead since Wednesday morning.

The RC had no option but but to lodge a protest. They probably knew it would be declared invalid. WOXI with the personal it has its disposal probably knew likewise.

Harburg was doomed the moment he opened his mouth instead of reaching for the red hanky on Wednesday.

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