Mid

2018 Rolex Sydney Hobart Yacht Race: The Race Committee has lodged a protest against Wild Oats XI

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

What about it?

Lets break it down. Take the tin foil hat off so you can think straight. The RC was made aware of a potential AIS issue from "an interested party" who had a conflict of interest. They did not lodge a protest, therefor the Jury could not rule on information obtained by an interested party with a conflict of interest.

If they cheated, and other teams knew or suspected, surely Bradford or someone else, Cooney, Bekking, Butterworth would've lodged a protest, but they didn't.

There will always be people like you who are jealous of winners and cry "Cheater" to justify his own bitterness toward the winner. Just get over it. The win stands, just like the other 8 wins stand. They are, have been, and always will be a highly respected team, and MR has been, is, and always will be one of the most successful skippers in the history of the Sydney Hobart Race.

  1. The Sailing Instructions say that the AIS must be sending and receiving for the entire race.  "Shall" is used, it's mandatory.
  2. The AIS log shows that it was not transmitting, other vessels report that they could not see WOXI on the AIS.
  3. Richards tries to sidestep by claiming it was not mandatory, so he is either lying or he is ignorant of the rules. You choose, I have.
  4. WOXI gets to silverware after a technicality about who lodged the protest after the proof that they were not compliant is in the public domain.

Why would you be a fan of these people?

Why are you willing to pimp for them in this alternate universe of Weasel-Land?

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think you're missing a fundamental here Forourselves. 

Nobody is bitching about he deserves accolades for his achievements. But if you think they wouldn't know of a failed TX capability you don't live in my version of reality. Hence, he is doing his best to finish that career as a cheat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

 

When an invalid protest is no excuse:

If a protest is lodged, but ruled as invalid (perhaps because there was no hail of ‘protest’), if the jury is satisfied that the protestee knew at the time that he had broken a rule, an experienced jury will interview him and if he doesn’t agree to retire, the jury would consider opening a hearing under Rule 69.

 

https://www.yachtingworld.com/features/cheating-at-yacht-racing-how-honest-a-sailor-are-you-65177

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, NORBowGirl said:

I don’t think so. You’d send the person with the most experience in the protest room. Typically somebody with a lot of dinghy experience or qualified referee ;) That’s not always the skipper. 

This,

People that represent themselves in law courts rarely win, you let professionals do that. :ph34r:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Spoonie said:

I would consider this ruling more nuanced than just an administrative error.   To me it really comes across as a fruit of the poisonous tree type ruling.   

If the RC had of acted on advice from anyone other than a competitor, this forum even, then we may have had a different result. 

Wouldn't surprise me if this a precedent setting case. 

I agree. But I aint going to admit to being wrong. Its apparently unaustralian.......

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, EddyAllTime said:

What actual evidence didr any of you fucktards have that WOXI cheated?

Screenshots of AIS with/without WOXI for the duration of the race?

Front up with the actual evidence or sit down and shut up. 

 

5 hours ago, Just A Skosh said:

 

image.thumb.png.eea010d795927c6a7734ae106117aa9f.png

image.thumb.png.70e4472c4b16ceb3be9a1ceea3d0751f.png

 

5 hours ago, EddyAllTime said:

Look at the sources - WOXI was only ever picked up by the terrestrial stations. Could genuinely be an equipment problem if not picking up satellites...

 

Eddy you really should have kept quiet after seeing the evidence you sought.

But you couldn't help yourself claiming WOXI could have had a AIS transmission power issue whereby only terrestrial stations could pick up WOXI's AIS TX signals in Sydney Harbour and Hobart and not mid race via low level geostationary satellite. I will park the myriad of terrestrial stations mid race like from Sth Head to Woolongong, Flinders Island and the Derwent for the simplicity. Your view also corresponds to Mark Richards statements that their AIS TX was on for the duration of the race and they had no idea they were not sending out a TX signal even though they had a fully functioning RX signal. I will also park the argument if RX was OK, how could say a coax cable antenna/antenna power loss only effect TX?  

If that malfunction statement of Richards and supported by you is true how do you both explain the 3+  hour period between Wednesday morning (reciept of the last terrestrial signal in Sydney Harbour) and then the 6 hour period from finish to WOXI's AIS coming back on line again in sight of those same terrestrial stations?

That is a 9 hour period where WOXI was in line of sight and a bees dick from the exact same terrestrial AIS stations close to Bradleys Head in Sydney Harbour and then parked up in Hobart, yet were there, then disappeared, then reappeared again? Funny about that.

The answer is simple. Someone turned the fucker off at Bradleys Head on the morning of the Start. It wasn't turned on again until sitting tied up in Hobart until early yesterday afternoon. The latter may well have coincided with the RC's investigation referred to in RC Facts Found Item 4 which states

."4. As a result of receiving the report, the Race Committee conducted an investigation into AIS tracking records in respect of Wild Oats Xl. The Race Committee obtained evidence from its own investigation that Wild Oats Xl may have breached Sl 11.4 and therefore submitted the protest."

As a consequence of the Protest being deemed invalid, none of this will ever see the light of day. The PC and IJ had no other decision to make. The only question remaining how the RC conducted themselves. The Statement of fact in Item #3 says; 

2. Shortly after finishing, the owner of Black Jack submitted a report to the Race Committee alleging that Wild Oats Xl's AIS "had not transmitted throughout" the Race.
3. Prior to the report, the Race Committee had "no knowledge of an issue" with Wild Oats Xl's AIS.

So for a period of hours between the owner of Black Jack airing his complaint on National Television and the RC being in receipt of his report, they had no knowledge of the controversy that had erupted. Yet it was the submission of that report and RC claiming to having no knowledge of the media storm that then time barred it from consideration, and that led to the RC's Protest to be invalid. Funny about that. 

If anyone thinks this is not a dark day for Australian Yachting you all really need to give yourself an uppercut. 

 

http://www.rolexsydneyhobart.com/media/3438889/ccf29122018.pdf

 

1575233611_WOXI_AIS_20181226_1111AEDT_A.jpg.dea232899ea948a4abf6cd08d48964f3.jpg414540691_WOXI_AIS_20181226_1111AEDT.jpg.a25ea6e4765f23160df98f2aa5882224.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Forourselves said:

"If the RC had of acted on advice from anyone other than a competitor, this forum even" Hahahahahahahaha

I'm deadly serious.  There were comments about the lack of AIS on WOXI from nearly the get go... 

Just takes someone on the RC team to troll social media...  Hive mind and all that... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Spoonie said:

I'm deadly serious.  There were comments about the lack of AIS on WOXI from nearly the get go... 

Just takes someone on the RC team to troll social media...  Hive mind and all that... 

Sure. Maybe they should monitor Facebook as well, Twitter, Instagram, maybe even Tinder...this is exactly why an International Jury shouldn't take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Forourselves said:

Sure. Maybe they should monitor Facebook as well, Twitter, Instagram, maybe even Tinder...this is exactly why an International Jury shouldn't take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums.

You mean like you do for the WOXI team?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Sure. Maybe they should monitor Facebook as well, Twitter, Instagram, maybe even Tinder...this is exactly why an International Jury shouldn't take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums.

Well, you're kinda just showing your own ignorance so I will move on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, random said:

You mean like you do for the WOXI team?

 

I just know when a better team wins. They won because they are/ were the better team. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Cruising Yacht Club of Australia Commodore Paul Billingham explains the protest lodged by the race committee against Wild Oats XI over the yachts Automatic Identification System.

quote : case to answer : unquote .

https://www.weeklytimesnow.com.au/news/national/protest-against-sydney-to-hobart-winner-wild-oats-xi-explained/video/57b40c3ddaeb213b30bfa88a125d976c

no answer has been provided .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Spoonie said:

Well, you're kinda just showing your own ignorance so I will move on. 

Coming from the guy who said the International Jury should take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So what what do you have to backup your claim that the RC withdrew the protest?

Or was that a lie too?

  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Spoonie said:

Again no.   If the RC had deemed an SI breach on their own, all would have been kosher. 

The IJ ruled that the RC only learned of a possible breach via an interested party and as such they should have protested.   

No subsequent learnings from the RC was submissible as a protest by them.

^^^ This and the RC's claims of not knowing until advised by interested party is horseshit, leaving IJ with only one ruling. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Forourselves said:

Coming from the guy who said the International Jury should take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums... 

Umm. No...  Go back and read my post 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213416/S2H-Protest-against-Wild-Oats-XI-is-dismissed

Rolex Sydney Hobart: Protest against Wild Oats XI is dismissed

Sail-World NZ spoke to a Wild Oats XI crew member after the protest who advised that the AIS system was working but was at a much weakened strength as a result of technical issues on board following a media interview before the start of the race, but after a check had been made to ensure the AIS was working and at at full strength.

The race relay vessel also advised two other competitors that their AIS was not working mid-race yet did not advise Wild Oats XI of issues with their AIS, and the crew were unaware of any fault until after the boat arrived in Hobart.

Conclusions:

The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

Decision: Protest Invalid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Coming from the guy who said the International Jury should take advice from Sailing Anarchy Forums... 

So what what do you have to backup your claim that the RC withdrew the protest?

Or was that a lie too?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

If anyone thinks this is not a dark day for Australian Yachting you all really need to give yourself an uppercut.

 

Yes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Spoonie said:

Umm. No...  Go back and read my post 

""If the RC had of acted on advice from anyone other than a competitor, this forum even"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, random said:

So what what do you have to backup your claim that the RC withdrew the protest?

Or was that a lie too?

Conclusions:

The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

Decision: Protest Invalid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

2 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213416/S2H-Protest-against-Wild-Oats-XI-is-dismissed

Rolex Sydney Hobart: Protest against Wild Oats XI is dismissed

Sail-World NZ spoke to a Wild Oats XI crew member after the protest who advised that the AIS system was working but was at a much weakened strength as a result of technical issues on board following a media interview before the start of the race, but after a check had been made to ensure the AIS was working and at at full strength.

The race relay vessel also advised two other competitors that their AIS was not working mid-race yet did not advise Wild Oats XI of issues with their AIS, and the crew were unaware of any fault until after the boat arrived in Hobart.

Conclusions:

The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

Decision: Protest Invalid.

Wow. Reading really is fundamental.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Forourselves said:

Decision: Protest Invalid.

no one is arguing any different .

however an invalid protest DOES NOT address the situation .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Forourselves said:

https://www.sail-world.com/news/213416/S2H-Protest-against-Wild-Oats-XI-is-dismissed

Rolex Sydney Hobart: Protest against Wild Oats XI is dismissed

Sail-World NZ spoke to a Wild Oats XI crew member after the protest who advised that the AIS system was working but was at a much weakened strength as a result of technical issues on board following a media interview before the start of the race, but after a check had been made to ensure the AIS was working and at at full strength.

The race relay vessel also advised two other competitors that their AIS was not working mid-race yet did not advise Wild Oats XI of issues with their AIS, and the crew were unaware of any fault until after the boat arrived in Hobart.

Conclusions:

The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

Decision: Protest Invalid.

Thanks that's that 

Can we put the tinfoil hats down and irrational bias away now time to stop the made up shit and enjoy an amazing race.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sail-World NZ spoke to a Wild Oats XI crew member

2 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Thanks that's that 

:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Forourselves said:

Conclusions:

The Race Committee’s investigation and subsequent protest arose from the report from the owner of Black Jack, a competitor in the Race and therefore a person with a conflict of interest within the meaning of the Racing Rules of Sailing (RRS).

The Race Committee’s investigation was prudent, however in these circumstances, for the protest to be valid under the Racing Rules of Sailing, a competitor with information about a potential rule breach must lodge the protest.

Rules that apply: RRS60.2 (a), Definitions – Conflict of Interest.

Decision: Protest Invalid.

So that does not say that they didn't switch of the AIS.

 

2 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Sail-World NZ spoke to a Wild Oats XI crew member after the protest who

That's pretty cute, one post you cut and paste PC findings, the next you are quoting hearsay?

Make up you mind fan boy.

Nothing there to say that they did not switch off the AIS.  Got anything else?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Can we put the tinfoil hats down and irrational bias away now time to stop the made up shit and enjoy an amazing race.

No, fuck off.

This one has legs.

Edit: Looks like Oatley's have shelled out for a media hose-down campaign.  Like calling in the Wolfman in Pulp Fiction to clean up the mess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, random said:

This one has legs.

according the the Commodore of the CYC , the RC thought so .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, random said:

No, fuck off.

This one has legs.

No the result stands it's over you love this internet drama stuff there's no conspiracy Oats were faster end of story 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Liquid Assett NZ said:

No the result stands it's over you love this internet drama stuff there's no conspiracy Oats were faster end of story 

Why is the social media campaign using NZ badged accounts?  Does that look more legit ... like not Australian?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, random said:

So that does not say that they didn't switch of the AIS.

 

That's pretty cute, one post you cut and paste PC findings, the next you are quoting hearsay?

Make up you mind fan boy.

Nothing there to say that they did not switch off the AIS.  Got anything else?

First time ever I've agreed with Random.  This is getting weird. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

""If the RC had of acted on advice from anyone other than a competitor, this forum even"

Yes.  The RC (ie short for the Race Committee) submitted a protest based on information gathered only as a result of a complaint given by what is called an interested party, ie. A competitor with a conflict of interest. 

The protest was deemed invalid for what I'm loosely going to call fruit of the poisonous tree. 

If the RC, in submitting their protest, had of acted on information from any other source: (this forum, my 3 year old daughter, your mouldy underwear) that was not an interested party, then the IJ (that is short for an International Jury) may have made a very different ruling. 

I Hope that clarifies things for you 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, random said:

 

Edit: Looks like Oatley's have shelled out for a media hose-down campaign.  Like calling in the Wolfman in Pulp Fiction to clean up the mess.

 

1 minute ago, random said:

Why is the social media campaign using NZ badged accounts?  Does that look more legit ... like not Australian?

Wow time for you to get away from the computer you're actually being paranoid

Chemtrailz bro 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Oats were faster end of story 

not if they didn't comply with the SI's ...................

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

 

Wow time for you to get away from the computer you're actually being paranoid

Chemtrailz bro 

Just checked, you have been working the same patch as forourselves for about the same time.

He had a second one ripped and you appear with the same weasel shit.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Mid said:

not if they didn't comply with the SI's ...................

Get over it they were first across the line the protest was invalid its done 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Get over it they were first across the line the protest was invalid its done 

means NOTHING unless the SI's were followed .

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Liquid Assett NZ said:
3 minutes ago, random said:

Just checked, you have been working the same patch as forourselves for about the same time.

Bahahahahahaha 

Yeah thought so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do find it quite surprising that people posting here, who one would assume have some experience of offshore sailboat racing, really don't seem to understand how huge is the advantage that one has being able to see your all your competitor's AIS tracks almost in real time when they are all unable to see yours.

Knowing the above, it must be a special kind of experience going up in front of all your competitors and walking off with first prize.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mid said:

nice to see the IJ's still doing their best to rule any and all protests invalid .........................................

nothings changed .

Mid nothing could be further from the truth.They were fucked by the RC's bullshit evidence in Item #3 and left with no other conclusion to make than the one made.

2. Shortly after finishing, the owner of Black Jack submitted a report to the Race Committee alleging that Wild Oats Xl's AIS "had not transmitted throughout" the Race.
3. Prior to the report, the Race Committee had "no knowledge of an issue" with Wild Oats Xl's AIS

If BJ had submitted no report to the RC, leaving the RC with just the media storm and then the IJ with room to move, Team WOXI's jaws would be hanging around the same level now where they were this time last year. Begs the question if the RC insisted on a report from BJ to kill off the RC's own Protest?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, random said:

Yeah thought so.

Sorry but you need to get a grip. I'm just adding some much need balance and realism to this sick conversation. It's a yacht race, the fastest boat won, yes there were Ais issues but that doesn't automatically mean there is a sinister conspiracy at play. I enjoyed the race and think Oats deserves the win 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, jack_sparrow said:

Mid nothing could be further from the truth

Refer you to post # 614 Jack .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Sorry but you need to get a grip I'm just adding some much need balance and realism to this sick conversation it's a yacht race the fastest boat won yes there were Ais issues but that doesn't automatically mean there is a sinister conspiracy at play. I enjoyed the race and think Oats deserves the win 

You mean that you are both here posting weasel shit for WOXI and both starting here in 2012 and focusing on the Artemis thread is a complete 'coinkidink' right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Mid nothing could be further from the truth.They were fucked by the RC's bullshit evidence in Item #3 and left with no other conclusion to make than the one made.

2. Shortly after finishing, the owner of Black Jack submitted a report to the Race Committee alleging that Wild Oats Xl's AIS "had not transmitted throughout" the Race.
3. Prior to the report, the Race Committee had "no knowledge of an issue" with Wild Oats Xl's AIS

If BJ had submitted no report to the RC, leaving the RC with just the media storm and then the IJ with room to move, Team WOXI's jaws would be hanging around the same level now where they were this time last year. Begs the question if the RC insisted on a report from BJ to kill off the RC's own Protest?

This "report" seems non standard.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, random said:

You mean that you are both here posting weasel shit for WOXI and both starting here in 2012 and focusing on the Artemis thread is a complete 'coinkidink' right?

Yes it is a coincidence you need your meds buddy 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Mid said:

Refer you to post # 614 Jack .

Yeah mate but that is 69 territory. Maybe we should get drunk drunk and lodge one? That would be funny. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, jack_sparrow said:

that is 69 territory.

indeed ...............................

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Liquid Assett NZ said:
4 minutes ago, random said:

You mean that you are both here posting weasel shit for WOXI and both starting here in 2012 and focusing on the Artemis thread is a complete 'coinkidink' right?

Yes it is a coincidence you need your meds buddy 

image.png.1eeafc4e519b983bbba196e1459598ba.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, random said:

I fucking hate shills.

You really have zero clue 

Two people disagree with your fucked logic and it's a conspiracy ?.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Liquid Assett NZ said:

You really have zero clue 

Two people disagree with your fucked logic and it's a conspiracy ?.

 

 

 

The post logs don't lie.

Just like the AIS logs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The AIS records show that WOXI were not transmitting AIS.

The SI's say that it is mandatory to transmit.

WOXI wins the silver.  How does that work?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

..... it's a yacht race the fastest boat won yes there were Ais issues but that doesn't automatically mean there is a sinister conspiracy at play. I enjoyed the race and think Oats deserves the win 

Sorry but a yacht race is a little different from a drag strip race with cars and the "fastest boat" does not necessarily win. Yacht racing involves strategy and knowledge of wind directions and speeds. These can be deduced by observing competitor's AIS track information hence all sail boats transmitting AIS are continually giving this information to their rivals. Any boat in the same race and, for whatever reason, not transmitting his AIS data, can have a huge advantage since the wind information where he is sailing is denied to his rivals.

You may think Oats deserves the win. That is your prerogative.  There may well be no conspiracy.

But would you cheerfully walk up and collect first prize if you discovered after the race that your opponents had been disadvantaged in this way?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, random said:

The AIS records show that WOXI were not transmitting AIS.

The SI's say that it is mandatory to transmit.

WOXI wins the silver.  How does that work?

Ais issue nothing sinister there were heaps of issues Oats sailed better and crossed the line first there was a protest that was not valid really simple stuff all the conspiracy bullshit is you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, staysail said:

But would you cheerfully walk up and collect first prize if you discovered after the race that your opponents had been disadvantaged in this way?

No I would not,  But Richards was more than happy to!

tumblr_lesewbCi2J1qaqaiy.gif

image.png.2c36963db4e53df60fc3f38a52b3c737.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Ais issue nothing sinister there were heaps of issues Oats sailed better and crossed the line first there was a protest that was not valid really simple stuff all the conspiracy bullshit is you

I really hate shills, they are bottom feeders of the worst kind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Oats sailed better

better than who ?

 

competitors who did not have access to the same information ?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, staysail said:

Sorry but a yacht race is a little different from a drag strip race with cars and the "fastest boat" does not necessarily win. Yacht racing involves strategy and knowledge of wind directions and speeds. These can be deduced by observing competitor's AIS track information hence all sail boats transmitting AIS are continually giving this information to their rivals. Any boat in the same race and, for whatever reason, not transmitting his AIS data, can have a huge advantage since the wind information where he is sailing is denied to his rivals.

You may think Oats deserves the win. That is your prerogative.  There may well be no conspiracy.

But would you cheerfully walk up and collect first prize if you discovered after the race that your opponents had been disadvantaged in this way?

Thanks buddy I'm aware of yacht racing and what's involved.

If I thought the Ais was operating and I sailed a race 100% and we were all around each other all the way and we all still had tracker info yes I would accept the prize.

I do think Oats team deserved the win and I don't think there is a crazy conspiracy here. The other competitors didn't protest all this is is just internet dribble

I don't think the Ais was the winning of the race it's being overstated

Just my opinion

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Just my opinion

That's all you can use really, given that the AIS log shows they did not comply with the rules.

I fucking hate shills, I hear there are a few about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Thanks buddy I'm aware of yacht racing and what's involved.

If I thought the Ais was operating and I sailed a race 100% and we were all around each other all the way and we all still had tracker info yes I would accept the prize.

I do think Oats team deserved the win and I don't think there is a crazy conspiracy here. The other competitors didn't protest all this is is just internet dribble

I don't think the Ais was the winning of the race it's being overstated

Just my opinion

You are welcome to your opinion.

I remember competing in a race once when something similar happened. The highest profile boat "won" but in similar circumstances where clearly, most of the other competitors realised the boat which came first had not been fairly sailed. No one protested. Protests in our kind of racing were rare. The owner walked up and collected the first prize and the room was almost silent. The skipper of the boat which came second walked up for the runner up prize and was met with tumultuous applause.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Wait, so if you cheat (allegedly)and win, you deserve to be hated, but if you cheat (allegedly) and lose, thats okay?

No.   If you cheat and lose, we chalk it up to Karma kicking your ass cause you had it coming...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, Ease the sheet. said:

This "report" seems non standard.....

Facts Item#3 was written by Hans Christian Anderson that left IJ with no decision other than the one they made. Smellier than a old boot.

http://www.rolexsydneyhobart.com/media/3438889/ccf29122018.pdf

35 minutes ago, VOA said:

Go on, I dare ya. 

I’ll hold your beer. 

I'm thinking about it.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, staysail said:

You are welcome to your opinion.

I remember competing in a race once when something similar happened. The highest profile boat "won" but in similar circumstances where clearly, most of the other competitors realised the boat which came first had not been fairly sailed. No one protested. Protests in our kind of racing were rare. The owner walked up and collected the first prize and the room was almost silent. The skipper of the boat which came second walked up for the runner up prize and was met with tumultuous applause.

Respect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, staysail said:

You are welcome to your opinion.

I remember competing in a race once when something similar happened. The highest profile boat "won" but in similar circumstances where clearly, most of the other competitors realised the boat which came first had not been fairly sailed. No one protested. Protests in our kind of racing were rare. The owner walked up and collected the first prize and the room was almost silent. The skipper of the boat which came second walked up for the runner up prize and was met with tumultuous applause.

I get that. I don't think this race has a nasty sinister underbelly to it at all. Four boats battled hard all the way some phenomenal sailing. I'm just trying to add some balance to this crazy biased thread. Oats are a great team and sailed exremely well we should not publically slate them over a technicality. Sometimes getting all wound up over the internet is just ridiculous

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

Cool so you're happy to say that

Bekking

Bannatyne

Nicholson

Witt

 

Are all Cheats who have no honour ? It's just a load of garbage 

If you want to discuss something these have done, create a separate thread. Right now, the topic is woxi, the current edition of the race. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

I don't think this race has a nasty sinister underbelly to it at all.

If you honestly believe that you have a terrible illness involving mind effecting drugs, are a junkie,  not very bright or maybe all three.

The RC for this race has plumbed a new low driven by self interest with zero regard for Australian sailing, the views of the international sailing community and ironicaly a decision that will come back to haunt them down the track.

That is a fact.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Mid said:

The RC obtained evidence from it's own investigation that WOXI may have breached SI11.4

http://www.rolexsydneyhobart.com/media/3438889/ccf29122018.pdf

and thanks to the IJ , we'll never know  , so this is the mess they have left our sport in .

 

Mid another reminder..get on the right page. This shit storm has nothing to do with the IJ. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Liquid Assett NZ said:

I get that.

I don't think you do.

In a previous post you have stated that you would happily accept first prize in these circumstances. You justify this to yourself by saying "if I thought ....etc. etc." and by saying the others around you "had tracker info" (even though you must know that tracker data is vastly inferior to AIS data?) but you do not dispute that AIS data would have given you an unfair advantage over the other competitors. No one can ever know if that advantage was race-winning or insignificant, but it was there.

This thread and all the controversy would not exist had Woxi retired. Woxi would still have crossed the line first which I agree is no mean achievement, and the reputations of the skipper and the owner would have been enhanced.

How much do they really need the first prize?

How much do you need a prize? Is it worth having people justifiably question your sportsmanship?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have just seen some Press Releases distributed earlier today post ruling by the WOXI camp to assist the media, both sailing and mainstream write stuff. It is like one is reading Hitlers PR after conquering Poland.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

I have just seen some Press Releases distributed earlier today post ruling by the WOXI camp to assist the media, both sailing and mainstream write stuff. It is like one is reading Hitlers PR after conquering Poland.

Damage control.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

I have just seen some Press Releases distributed earlier today post ruling by the WOXI camp to assist the media, both sailing and mainstream write stuff. It is like one is reading Hitlers PR after conquering Poland.

Yep. By not retiring, their image is forever tainted.