Meat Wad

18 footers 2018/2019

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I keep forgetting that they start their season in 2018, not when the year begins.

13/1/2019 Sunday 11 NSW Championship Race 5

March starts the JJG series
1/3/2019 Friday JJG Worlds Championship Invitational

These guys have a great website and you can find all the video of Races missed and photos

God bless the big screen Tele, Sydney Harbor looks so much better with the 18 Footers than the Hobart start did.

https://www.18footers.com.au/

These boats should be in the Olympics. I understand the Hull and Foils are OD to control costs?. 2 male 2 female crew and set the rigs for OD if needed to make the nannies happy.

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Best racing coverage on the net. I watch it October through to the queen of the harbour race . Sunday ritual. Go the Yandoo!

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It's been a pretty good season so far. Last three races before the Xmas break were really good, with last lap position changes.

The legends event was really fun to watch as well. 

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Back live this Sunday 13th Jan. At this stage looking like a nice 15knt SE for the 1st heat of the NSW Championship 

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J.J.s are on this weekend. Any predictions? Asko is strong, having won the championship, but what about the Kiwis and others?

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On 1/6/2019 at 11:29 PM, bangbang said:

Back live this Sunday 13th Jan. At this stage looking like a nice 15knt SE for the 1st heat of the NSW Championship 

Are you doing the stream bb?

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On 1/5/2019 at 5:17 AM, Meat Wad said:

These boats should be in the Olympics. I understand the Hull and Foils are OD to control costs?. 2 male 2 female crew and set the rigs for OD if needed to make the nannies happy.

That's disappointing.

I grew up sailing in Sydney in the 80s, and must admit to losing touch with the scene for the last 30 years. Back then, the 18s were the pinnacle of everything to do with sailing; skills of course, but especially design development.

The standard joke about 18 foot skiffs was that the entirity of the class rules was: the boat shall be 18 foot long; the race starts at 2:00.

Everything else was open. Do whatever you like to make you fast.

Carry as much sail as you can hold upright (most of the time), and as many crew as you need to control it. They pretty much invented wings and assymetrical kites. I remember being amazed that they were building parts of them out of carbon fibre. Crazy little (actually quite big) shells surrounded by a nest of scaffolding, holding up more rigging than a tall ship. Driven by three gods of men (and Adrienne Cahalan, who all young sailors knew by name although we had no idea what she looked like off her Ella Bache skiff).

Of course there would have been other rules, but it was explicitly an open development class.

I remember old photos of early 18footers, clinker-planked workboat hulls with a crew of 20 holding these ridiculous oversized rigs down. Evolution to the high tech skiffs that were actually shown racing each week on mainstream broadcast TV.

Big money, big sponsorship, big profile.

It's a pity if they have tightened things up to a sterile one-design class.

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2 hours ago, OneGoat said:

That's disappointing.

I grew up sailing in Sydney in the 80s, and must admit to losing touch with the scene for the last 30 years. Back then, the 18s were the pinnacle of everything to do with sailing; skills of course, but especially design development.

The standard joke about 18 foot skiffs was that the entirity of the class rules was: the boat shall be 18 foot long; the race starts at 2:00.

Everything else was open. Do whatever you like to make you fast.

It's a pity if they have tightened things up to a sterile one-design class.

 

Turning a development class into one design killed all media interest in the class resulting in reduced sponsorships averaging around $20K today.

Bradmill was the last of the truly unrestricted 18s to win a JJ. Rob Brown ended the domination of Murray designs his balsa carbon skiff peaked around 30Ft wingspan. The following year wingspan was reduced to 22ft.

 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, Rushman said:

Med_One%20of%20Iain%20Murrays%20Color%207%20Giltinanwinning%20skiffs.jpg

How did they gybe the pole?

 

End for end it.

 

JJ winner Chesty Bond before rule changes restricting hull design along with  reduction in wing width to make boats easier to sail.

It was argued since an Olympic Gold Medallist J Mc Kee couldn't sail a 22ft wingspan 18 there must be something wrong with the boat. 3 Rookies on the boat was the problem if Mc Kee had an experienced crew he would have been OK.

44Ft big rig

 

 

Alt_Chesty%20Bond%20carries%20the%20tallest%20mast%20ever%20on%20an%2018ft%20Skiff1.jpg

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The commodore of the YMCASC in Canberra had a 60's vintage timber 18.  It didn't sail a lot but I was lucky enough to get a ride as a teenager in the early 80's.

I was forward hand for the ACT schools regatta.  Adrian Lejins and Nigel Littlewood made up the crew and we had a blast but the courses were very short.  I can't remember if we were allowed to use the kite.

They held an ACT 18's titles one year, 3 of the Sydney 18's made the trip to Canberra, Lysaght Colourbond was one that I remember. Everyone from the club gathered around the huge trailers carrying multiple rigs, boat and aluminium wings.  We were rigging the commodore's vintage 18 away from the crowd, it was a big rig day as the fickle Canberra breeze hadn't arrived. The commodore, a skiff moth sailor and myself took on the big boys from Sydney... Guess who won

 

 

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I could Google it myself, but easier to ask here... Are the Sydney 12-foot skiffs still insane, of have they been crippled as well?

A friend of a friend raced a 12 footer out of Birchgrove, and I got a ride once. I don't know what the rules were, but they were essentially a mini 18; sailed 2-handed, both on trapeze on wings, fixed pole, and I remember the rudder being on a frame about 6foot aft of the open transom. Again, strong indication that it was a "hull is 12 foot, invent whatever rig and attachments you think you can handle" rule.

Never been so scared on a boat. OMFG that thing was overpowered. Truly insane.

Another friend of the same friend (actually a contact through Scouts) sailed an ancient 16' skiff out of Drummoyne. Drummoyne was the club where old skiffs were handed down from competitive skiff clubs, and his was very old by Drummoyne standards. I ended up sheeting for him for a season or so. We never finished a race - not sure we even started any. We just went out every Saturday and capsized a lot. 16s were more regulated; no wings or fixed poles, only two on wire (sailed 3 handed, skipper stayed on strap). Still, our #1 rig had a 32 foot mast on the 16 foot hull, and a 300 square foot spinnaker, so they too were a matter of carrying as much sail as you thought you could handle. Even with the little #3 rig up, the boat was so top-heavy it would capsize sitting on the water with the mast in; we had to actively hold it upright.

I didn't learn much about racing, but I learned how to work a mainsheet, and not be scared of carrying too much sail :D

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So apparently AECC over... Aussies afraid of the kiwi's again? Did AECC get redress? It seems they were quite cautious, looks like ASKO were close, and possible the boat at the committee (SMEG)? But certainly not AECC. 

 

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ASCC and Asko were not OCS... No boats were over even though there was apparently a second sound signal

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Hi Everybody,

Reading OneGoat posts reminds me that about 20/25 years ago I got a video tape from Australia, or through Ovington Boat in UK cannot remember, and this video was the 18 foot Skiff championship, with Ella Bache and other big sponsors I cant remember.

I think the name of the organization was  "Grand Prix Sailing" or something like that.

When I could actually see these boats sailing on this video, it was a true revelation.

And between 2 races there was an interview of Julian Bethwaite,  showing how he put large strips of Carbon UD in a Skiff mould, just like a mega-roving fabric.

Probably many other interesting details, but I have no more video tape player, and don't know if it is possible to put it on a CD and how to do it.

Later I bought High Performance Sailing written by Franck (Julian's father) and the book is still in goood place in my library.

Everything put together helps to understand why "Aussies & Kiwis are ruling the waves"

Cheers 

Erwan

 

 

 

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22 hours ago, Rushman said:

ASCC and Asko were not OCS... No boats were over even though there was apparently a second sound signal

Yeah, had only watched the start before going off sailing myself. I thought the voice shortly after was confirmation from the CB, but obviously not. It's good no one went back. But at the end of the coverage they confirm no-one over... but then result say ASKO and ASCC were OCS

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1 hour ago, Mozzy Sails said:

Yeah, had only watched the start before going off sailing myself. I thought the voice shortly after was confirmation from the CB, but obviously not. It's good no one went back. But at the end of the coverage they confirm no-one over... but then result say ASKO and ASCC were OCS

The coverage today suggested they might be sorting it out in the room tonight

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Careful review suggests both boats will get reinstated. Hearing this morning.

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I am Clean. Long days on the Camera Cat. As you know the environment onboard is not incredibly conducive to streaming equipment but we are trying our best to bring this class too the masses. 

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Winning group redress... that's er interesting. 

Did they have that race sewn up considering how honda came through the pack? Have honda been demoted to a 2nd or did they keep a 1st as well?

Did they get it under this? 

b. injury or physical damage because of the action of a boat that was breaking a rule of Part 2 or of a vessel not racing that was required to keep clear

How did they determine the vessel not racing was due to keep clear?

Keeps the championship alive though, so that's nice. 

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15 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

Winning group redress... that's er interesting. 

Did they have that race sewn up considering how honda came through the pack? Have honda been demoted to a 2nd or did they keep a 1st as well?

Did they get it under this? 

b. injury or physical damage because of the action of a boat that was breaking a rule of Part 2 or of a vessel not racing that was required to keep clear

How did they determine the vessel not racing was due to keep clear?

Keeps the championship alive though, so that's nice. 

Average points for that race from over the series for Winning Group if I read it correctly.

From what I read, Winning Group was the right of way boat but was staying clear of the private boat until the private boat towing a kayak suddenly turned giving Winning Group no where to go.

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8 hours ago, WCB said:

Average points for that race from over the series for Winning Group if I read it correctly.

From what I read, Winning Group was the right of way boat but was staying clear of the private boat until the private boat towing a kayak suddenly turned giving Winning Group no where to go.

Yeah, see that now. 

In my opinion it's a weird one getting redress for boats not racing. I feel you should get redress for errors the race committee makes which out you at a disadvantage, or if you are fouled by another boat which causes damage.  I also get you might want redress for boats not racing, but who are part of the event, to stop people taking out competitors in other flights or after finishing. 

But at some point, when is it just bad luck? Why get redress for a third party vessel, and not for hitting a submerged object? or snagging a fishing line? or hitting the bottom? or anything else which is just considered luck and part of the game?

I know those are the rules, but it's always sat uncomfortably.

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6 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

Yeah, see that now. 

In my opinion it's a weird one getting redress for boats not racing. I feel you should get redress for errors the race committee makes which out you at a disadvantage, or if you are fouled by another boat which causes damage.  I also get you might want redress for boats not racing, but who are part of the event, to stop people taking out competitors in other flights or after finishing. 

But at some point, when is it just bad luck? Why get redress for a third party vessel, and not for hitting a submerged object? or snagging a fishing line? or hitting the bottom? or anything else which is just considered luck and part of the game?

I know those are the rules, but it's always sat uncomfortably.

I don't disagree. I can only assume that the RC felt that since Winning Group was the victim of a recreational sailor who doesn't know the right of way rules, that it was an unfortunate incident that interfered with their race.  They were an obstacle on the race course that was unexpected.  

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On 3/4/2019 at 5:08 PM, bangbang said:

I am Clean. 

?

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Just now, MR.CLEAN said:

?

Oh, I get it.  "I am, Clean."

 

Thanks for your hard work!

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Honda and ASCC discussing tactics for the weekends races in the busy harbour.

@6:37 sharing what they've learnt from the weeks racing. 

"the key is to not hit any boats",

"but if you do, get redress... But, if you're back in the fleet?"

"oh, then tee one up (to get redress)"

 

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I've enjoyed watching the 18s in the YouTube, very relaxing

My only complaint is that the black sails are very hard tio see with my eyesight... On my screen...

On the other hand, Black sails are cool

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