How Embarrassing - Trump is international Laughing Stock

[Lifted Tack 75]

Things that make you shake your and and wonder how this is possible:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/robert-lighthizer-trump-trade-terminology-memo_n_5c724378e4b03cfdaa55f93d

If you voted for this guy, you are as stupid as he is.

[Ishmael 6,160]

15 minutes ago, Lifted Tack said:

Things that make you shake your and and wonder how this is possible:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/robert-lighthizer-trump-trade-terminology-memo_n_5c724378e4b03cfdaa55f93d

If you voted for this guy, you are as stupid as he is.

That is very obvious on this forum.

[Clove Hitch 853]

It really is like dealing with a petulant, stubborn and dumb toddler.  "We'll have the same document but we'll call it a trade agreement." 

[Navig8tor 1,188]

He became an international laughing stock the day he was elected.

Everything he has done since has simply reinforced the notion.

[Sean 2,205]

Not so fast. In real estate, an “mou” is sometimes used as an outline of terms agreed in principle between the parties, to be formalized in a contract. Perhaps that’s not the the case in diplomacy, I don’t know. I give Trump a pass on this one.

https://legaldictionary.net/memorandum-of-understanding/

Excerpt -

A memorandum of understanding (MOU) is an agreement between two parties that is not legally binding, but which outlines the responsibilities of each of the parties to the agreement. An MOU is often the first step toward creating a legally binding contract. In the U.S., an MOU can be considered identical to a letter of intent, which is another kind of non-binding agreement that suggests that a binding agreement will soon follow. To explore this concept, consider the following memorandum of understanding definition.

[mad 3,839]

6 minutes ago, Sean said:

Not so fast. In real estate, an “mou” is sometimes used as an outline of terms agreed in principle between the parties, to be formalized in a contract. Perhaps that’s not the the case in diplomacy, I don’t know. I give Trump a pass on this one.

https://legaldictionary.net/memorandum-of-understanding/

Excerpt -

A memorandum of understanding (MOU) is an agreement between two parties that is not legally binding, but which outlines the responsibilities of each of the parties to the agreement. An MOU is often the first step toward creating a legally binding contract. In the U.S., an MOU can be considered identical to a letter of intent, which is another kind of non-binding agreement that suggests that a binding agreement will soon follow. To explore this concept, consider the following memorandum of understanding definition.

As much as I hate to give Trump a pass, I tend to agree with you, especially from my understanding of the term in the UK. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorandum_of_understanding

 

Sooner or later, even Trump has to strike it lucky and get it right. Saying that, the casinos didn’t work out that well, and he ran the house. 

[SailBlueH2O 544]

Who the fuck cares about the rest of the lesser free world ?...really ?....

[Sean 2,205]

10 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

Who the fuck cares about the rest of the lesser free world ?...really ?....

^^ this is what’s wrong with this country. And not for nuthin, you left out better than half of the US.

[P_Wop 1,896]

23 minutes ago, Sean said:

Not so fast. In real estate, an “mou” is sometimes used as an outline of terms agreed in principle between the parties, to be formalized in a contract. Perhaps that’s not the the case in diplomacy, I don’t know. I give Trump a pass on this one.

https://legaldictionary.net/memorandum-of-understanding/

Excerpt -

A memorandum of understanding (MOU) is an agreement between two parties that is not legally binding, but which outlines the responsibilities of each of the parties to the agreement. An MOU is often the first step toward creating a legally binding contract. In the U.S., an MOU can be considered identical to a letter of intent, which is another kind of non-binding agreement that suggests that a binding agreement will soon follow. To explore this concept, consider the following memorandum of understanding definition.

That's quite right in real estate.  I do them all the time in the tech business with potential customers, LOIs too.  All non-binding.

But in international relations and diplomacy they have a very different meaning.

I would suggest that if you're the head honcho of your country for international relations and diplomacy it might be an idea to find out about that. 

If you could listen, or read, that is.

[SailBlueH2O 544]

15 minutes ago, Sean said:

^^ this is what’s wrong with this country. And not for nuthin, you left out better than half of the US.

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

[mad 3,839]

7 minutes ago, P_Wop said:

That's quite right in real estate.  I do them all the time in the tech business with potential customers, LOIs too.  All non-binding.

But in international relations and diplomacy they have a very different meaning.

I would suggest that if you're the head honcho of your country for international relations and diplomacy it might be an idea to find out about that. 

If you could listen, or read, that is.

Do you have a link to it’s defintion in the terms of international relations? there must be a US government statute or, set of terms stating these definitions??

[mad 3,839]

8 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoying more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

So the idea of having friendly allies and trading partners is not your idea of a good thing then?? And I take it you don’t travel to the overpriced dumps to often either by the sound of it?  

I’m sure you could educate all of us poor dehumanised  citizens.  

[d'ranger 2,660]

13 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

Bullshit.

I don't fault those who voted for Trump, I do for those who still support him. The con is on and even Helen Keller could see it.  Trump is like the Pied Piper leading the little children over the cliff.

[SailBlueH2O 544]

9 minutes ago, mad said:

So the idea of having friendly allies and trading partners is not your idea of a good thing then?? And I take it you don’t travel to the overpriced dumps to often either by the sound of it?  

I’m sure you could educate all of us poor dehumanised  citizens.  

" friendly allies and trade partners" .....not so friendly

try manufacturing and selling product on equal footing to Europe, Canada,China,Mexico.....it's a long list of protectionist trade practice by those "Allies" ....

"And I take it you don’t travel to the overpriced dumps "...only to humor my wife

[AJ Oliver 1,275]

20 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

Ethnocentrism alert - every assertion above is a demonstrable lie.  

This one is especially unfortunate . .  https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-mobility-america/491240/

How many ferrin countries have you been to Blue? Tell us all about them? 

 

[mad 3,839]

3 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

" friendly allies and trade partners" .....not so friendly

try manufacturing and selling product on equal footing to Europe, Canada,China,Mexico.....it's a long list of protectionist trade practice by those "Allies" ....

Care to post some cites for that? 

Edit to add.

Do you travel.?

[SailBlueH2O 544]

Just now, AJ Oliver said:

Ethnocentrism alert - every assertion above is a demonstrable lie.  

This one is especially unfortunate . .  https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-mobility-america/491240/

How many ferrin countries have you been to Blue? Tell us all about them? 

 

What we have here is a Jonestown Kool Aid...aide

[P_Wop 1,896]

39 minutes ago, mad said:

Do you have a link to it’s defintion in the terms of international relations? there must be a US government statute or, set of terms stating these definitions??

Here you go....

From Wikipedia, abbreviated slightly...

In public international law

In international relations, MoUs fall under the broad category of treaties and should be registered in the United Nations treaty collection. In practice and in spite of the United Nations Office of Legal Affairs' insistence that registration be done to avoid 'secret diplomacy', MoUs are sometimes kept confidential. As a matter of law, the title of MoU does not necessarily mean the document is binding or not binding under international law. To determine whether a particular MoU is meant to be a legally binding document (i.e., a treaty), one needs to examine the parties’ intent as well as the signatories' position (e.g., Minister of Foreign Affairs vs. Minister of Environment). A careful analysis of the wording will also clarify the exact nature of the document. The International Court of Justice has provided some insight into the determination of the legal status of a document in the landmark case of Qatar v. Bahrain, 1 July 1994.

Advantages

One advantage of MoUs over more formal instruments is that, because obligations under international law may be avoided, they can often be put into effect without requiring legislative approval. Hence, MoUs are often used to modify and adapt existing treaties, in which case these MoUs have factual treaty status. The decision concerning ratification, however, is determined by the parties' internal law and depends to a large degree on the subject agreed upon. 

Although MoUs in the multilateral field are seldom seen, the transnational aviation agreements are actually MoUs.

Examples of MoUs include:

• The Memorandum of Understanding Relating to the Treaty between the United States of America and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics on the Limitation of Anti-Ballistic Missile Systems on May 26, 1972 signed by US President Richard Nixon and the Soviet Union updating the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty
• The Memorandum of Understanding on Hijacking of Aircraft and Vessels and Other Offenses between the US and Cuba, meant to criminalize hijacking in both countries (February 3, 1973)
• The agreement between the Cayman Islands and Cuba, under which Cayman immigration officers must give Cuban refugees two choices: disembark and be repatriated back to Cuba, or continue on their way with no help[citation needed]
• The Agreed Framework between the U.S. and North Korea over nuclear weaponry on October 21, 1994
• The Oil for Food program, for which Iraq signed an MoU in 1996
• The agreement between the government of Indonesia and the GAM in the Aceh peace process, 15 August 2005.
• The agreement between the UK and Jordan, Libya and Lebanon regarding potential extradition of suspects (commonly terrorist suspects), who, if they are to be tried, must be tried fairly and in a manner similar to the European Convention on Human Rights; for example, withholding from using evidence obtained through the use of torture (Article 3). Such an understanding has been criticised for its inability to be legally enforced. This has been highlighted in the current deportation process of the suspected terrorist Abu Qatada, who is wanted by Jordan in connection with a terrorist attack. However, at present, the Court of Appeal has rejected the UK Government's appeal based on the Court's concern of Jordan obtaining evidence potentially incriminating Qatada through the use of torture.
• The Memorandums of Understanding on Labour Cooperation between the People's Republic of China, Singapore and New Zealand on 2008, in parallel with their respective free trade agreements
• The Under2 MOU is a 2015 memorandum of understanding which sets climate change mitigation goals for jurisdictions with over 1 billion residents

[AJ Oliver 1,275]

10 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

What we have here is a Jonestown Kool Aid...aide

Got any sources?  No, of course you do not, and that is because you are well aware of you lies.  

I'm just trying to remove any lingering doubt in the minds of others about your lying ways. 

So I already corrected you on social mobility, and here is "freedom" from the Reichist CATO Instit. 

they rank the US as # 23.  https://www.cato.org/human-freedom-index-new

You think that, like the Drumph, your lies show how bold and clever you are.  

Not at all, they show you to be contemptible. 

[SailBlueH2O 544]

1 minute ago, AJ Oliver said:

Got any sources?  No, of course you do not, and that is because you are well aware of you lies.  

I'm just trying to remove any lingering doubt in the minds of others about your lying ways. 

So I already corrected you on social mobility, and here is "freedom" from the Reichist CATO Instit. 

they rank the US as # 23.  https://www.cato.org/human-freedom-index-new

You think that, like the Drumph, your lies show how bold and clever you are.  

Not at all, they show you to be contemptible. 

Well then why does everyone want to come to the USA ?...LOL....CATO globalist elite...One World Order

[Ishmael 6,160]

24 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

" friendly allies and trade partners" .....not so friendly

try manufacturing and selling product on equal footing to Europe, Canada,China,Mexico.....it's a long list of protectionist trade practice by those "Allies" ....

 

Bullshit.

[Olsonist 1,912]

Bluewater, strictly on the hush hush, but didja vote for Shitstain?

[P_Wop 1,896]

28 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

" friendly allies and trade partners" .....not so friendly

try manufacturing and selling product on equal footing to Europe, Canada,China,Mexico.....it's a long list of protectionist trade practice by those "Allies" ....

"And I take it you don’t travel to the overpriced dumps "...only to humor my wife

I've been involved as an executive or adviser on many, many attempts to establish a European company in the US or a US one in Europe.  They are equally difficult and will inevitably fail unless you follow the basic rules. 

It has to look like a local company, smell like a local company, sound like a local company, be established like a local company, have local legal help, and be run by nationals of the local territory.

A4 promo docs in the US just get laughed at and will kill you.  SAP failed twice in the US because of this, once also because they sent over all the promo materials in German.  8½x11 docs in Europe ditto.  American English doesn't wash in Europe.  British English doesn't do it in the US.  Hybrid semi-Engrish is a non-starter.

95% of the companies that fail on importing their technology or whatever across an ocean fail because of this.  You have to know the rules and do it right, in either direction, to have a remote chance of success.  It will cost a lot more of course, but if the opportunity is there, raise more capital.

This is my job, actually.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

1 hour ago, Navig8tor said:

He became an international laughing stock the day he was elected.

Everything he has done since has simply reinforced the notion.

He became an international laughing stock years ago when he was just a New York cheap suit.

The USA became an international laughing stock the day he was elected..

[SloopJonB 8,316]

1 hour ago, SailBlueH2O said:

Who the fuck cares about the rest of the lesser free world ?...really ?....

Exactly the kind of moronic attitude we have come to expect from the sort of ignorant trailer trash who provide Trumps core support.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

1 hour ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens  

Exactly the kind of moronic attitude we have come to expect from the sort of ignorant trailer trash who provide Trumps core support.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

18 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

Well then why does everyone want to come to the USA ?...LOL....CATO globalist elite...One World Order

They don't - but you are too fucking ignorant to realize it.

[SailBlueH2O 544]

3 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Exactly the kind of moronic attitude we have come to expect from the sort of ignorant trailer trash who provide Trumps core support.

actually that would be the dems....the manipulating elite at the top of the pyramid and the unwashed masses and over educated quilt trippers in at all levels below

[Ishmael 6,160]

2 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

actually that would be the dems....the manipulating elite at the top of the pyramid and the unwashed masses and over educated quilt trippers in at all levels below

What planet are you really from?

[SailBlueH2O 544]

Just now, Ishmael said:

What planet are you really from?

The world that elected the current POTUS...despite all the unwashed masses voting for more free cheese and illegal voting....

[mad 3,839]

17 minutes ago, P_Wop said:

I've been involved as an executive or adviser on many, many attempts to establish a European company in the US or a US one in Europe.  They are equally difficult and will inevitably fail unless you follow the basic rules. 

It has to look like a local company, smell like a local company, sound like a local company, be established like a local company, have local legal help, and be run by nationals of the local territory.

A4 promo docs in the US just get laughed at and will kill you.  SAP failed twice in the US because of this, once also because they sent over all the promo materials in German.  8½x11 docs in Europe ditto.  American English doesn't wash in Europe.  British English doesn't do it in the US.  Hybrid semi-Engrish is a non-starter.

95% of the companies that fail on importing their technology or whatever across an ocean fail because of this.  You have to know the rules and do it right, in either direction, to have a remote chance of success.  It will cost a lot more of course, but if the opportunity is there, raise more capital.

This is my job, actually.

As will printing on single-sided, non-recycled paper in colour at times. 

[mad 3,839]

3 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

The world that elected the current POTUS...despite all the unwashed masses voting for more free cheese and illegal voting....

The USA is not the world!  You actually need the world to trade with, you moron. 

[SailBlueH2O 544]

1 minute ago, mad said:

The USA is not the world!  You actually need the world to trade with, you moron. 

Are you AOC's mother ?

[Mrleft8 2,259]

"Trump the laughing stock of the world"......

Something new, and different.....

[Bristol-Cruiser 1,065]

1 hour ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

Keep believing this, it seems to give you comfort. "Chique"?

[Bristol-Cruiser 1,065]

37 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

The world that elected the current POTUS...despite all the unwashed masses voting for more free cheese and illegal voting....

The unwashed masses voted for illegal voting? I wasn't aware.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

50 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

What planet are you really from?

Floriduh.

It's in a Galaxy far, far away.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

12 minutes ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

Keep believing this, it seems to give you comfort. "Chique"?

That's a small banana isn't it?

[SloopJonB 8,316]

49 minutes ago, SailBlueH2O said:

The world that elected the current POTUS...despite all the unwashed masses voting for more free cheese and illegal voting....

Here are your sophisticated voters who elected Trump.

The cream of American society - Definitely not a trailer among them.

You're judged by the company you keep.

[Grrr... 1,545]

3 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

Shameless quote. 

_________________________

We're seventh in literacy, twenty-seventh in math, twenty-second in science, forty-ninth in life expectancy, 178th in infant mortality, third in median household income, number four in labor force, and number four in exports. We lead the world in only three categories: number of incarcerated citizens per capita, number of adults who believe angels are real, and defense spending, where we spend more than the next twenty-six countries combined, twenty-five of whom are allies. 

___________________________

I'll be frank.  You're a relic sailblue.  One who is totally hung up on the things he used to hear from "the greatest generation".  You've sucked down the propaganda your whole life and can't take a rational view of what the United States really is. 

[learningJ24 342]

You forgot healthcare costs.

[Olsonist 1,912]

[Bus Driver 4,216]

3 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

The world that elected the current POTUS...despite all the unwashed masses voting for more free cheese and illegal voting....

Well, there is that pesky little brouhaha going on down in North Carolina.

[Bus Driver 4,216]

2 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Here are your sophisticated voters who elected Trump.

The cream of American society - Definitely not a trailer among them.

You're judged by the company you keep.

Don't forget these guys - Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dum -

Anyone else thinking someone in that family knew someone in that family?  Know what I mean?

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

Bravo for Trump to cut through the PC Dliplo-babble and put it in plain English. 

Trump once again is smarter than the Nose in the air TDS  morons that falsely believe he is dumb and they are smart.  From the UK Government ... 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/293976/Treaties_and_MoU_Guidance.pdf

 

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

5 hours ago, Clove Hitch said:

It really is like dealing with a petulant, stubborn and dumb toddler.  "We'll have the same document but we'll call it a trade agreement." 

Who just happens to be right. 

[Sol Rosenberg 6,267]

 

[Mrleft8 2,259]

Had a brief listen to an old feller from Ohio today. (Stopped into the local bar for a beer)..... He's about 70 something, and thinks Trump is a fucking genius. Obama was an illegal foreign plant put in place by the Iraqis.... And Hillary probably killed JFK.

Hates absolutely everything about Florida. The govt. sucks because they don't take care of him like they did in Ohio. Hates the V.A. down here because they don't take care of him like they did in Ohio. Hates, the V.F.W. because they messed up his membership, like they never did in Ohio. And his damn truck cost him money for mud flaps.... In Ohio that woulda been free.....

 The Bar owner finally asked him..... "If you hate it so bad, why don't you move back to Ohio?"

 "Cheaper taxes"......

 

[Mrleft8 2,259]

10 minutes ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

Who just happens to be right. 

My god..... You really are an idiot, aren't you?....

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

Trump has made a laughing stock of the Huffy Puffy Post and most of you. 

If the Treaty office of the UK Foreign Affairs Department says an MoU is nonbinding then Trump was right and HPP was dead wrong so yuk it up the joke is you. 

[Mrleft8 2,259]

4 minutes ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

Trump has made a laughing stock of the Huffy Puffy Post and most of you. 

If the Treaty office of the UK Foreign Affairs Department says an MoU is nonbinding then Trump was right and HPP was dead wrong so yuk it up the joke is you. 

Since when does the UK foreign affairs dept. determine what happens in the USA?

You've been an idiot for a long time. You've been on my ignore list for a long time. Why are you now suddenly showing up?

[SloopJonB 8,316]

2 hours ago, Grrr... said:

Shameless quote. 

_________________________

We're seventh in literacy, twenty-seventh in math, twenty-second in science, forty-ninth in life expectancy, 178th in infant mortality, third in median household income, number four in labor force, and number four in exports. We lead the world in only three categories: number of incarcerated citizens per capita, number of adults who believe angels are real, and defense spending, where we spend more than the next twenty-six countries combined, twenty-five of whom are allies. 

___________________________

I'll be frank.  You're a relic sailblue.  One who is totally hung up on the things he used to hear from "the greatest generation".  You've sucked down the propaganda your whole life and can't take a rational view of what the United States really is. 

Correct - his attitudes date back to the 50's & 60's.

Like any good conservative.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

1 hour ago, Bus Driver said:

Don't forget these guys - Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dumber

Anyone else thinking someone in that family knew someone in that family?  Know what I mean?

Well, they are big on things Biblical.

[Bent Sailor 859]

1 hour ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

Bravo for Trump to cut through the PC Dliplo-babble and put it in plain English. 

Trump once again is smarter than the Nose in the air TDS  morons that falsely believe he is dumb and they are smart.  From the UK Government ... 

Right, but Trump is not running the UK government nor was his deal with them. What they think is completely meaningless in regards to US negotiations with China. The US has used "Memorandum of Understanding" documents, in practice, as a treaty in simplified form. The intent is in how the document is worded, not in how it is labelled.

But hey, Jack is saying that the US should do things like the UK... wonder how long that position lasts.

 

[Raz'r 3,353]

6 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

I know your not lying, so I won’t say “you lie”

rather, you’re just an ignorant motherfucker. That feel better?

[Raz'r 3,353]

4 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Here are your sophisticated voters who elected Trump.

The cream of American society - Definitely not a trailer among them.

You're judged by the company you keep.

“Liberals and Islam Suck’s”

it's like a happy jackoff thread title. So much wrong.

[Lark 1,449]

6 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

we enjoy more freedom, have the greatest individual opportunities, are the most generous and successful country in the world and in all of history....certainly don't need to heed the chiding of lesser models of governing....especially the Euro's....living off overpriced dumps masquerading  as chique...I feel sorry for the dehumanized citizens 

Gold star.  Most outlandish troll all day.   You almost had me thinking you believe your own BS.   This is manure as art, sir.   

[Bristol-Cruiser 1,065]

5 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

Well then why does everyone want to come to the USA ?...LOL....CATO globalist elite...One World Order

It may come as a shock to you but not everyone wants to come to the US of A. Since the coronation of Donald the First the number has dropped precipitously so he is achieving something. 

[Junkyard Dog 12]

7 hours ago, Sean said:

Not so fast. In real estate, an “mou” is sometimes used as an outline of terms agreed in principle between the parties, to be formalized in a contract. Perhaps that’s not the the case in diplomacy, I don’t know. I give Trump a pass on this one.

https://legaldictionary.net/memorandum-of-understanding/

Excerpt -

A memorandum of understanding (MOU) is an agreement between two parties that is not legally binding, but which outlines the responsibilities of each of the parties to the agreement. An MOU is often the first step toward creating a legally binding contract. In the U.S., an MOU can be considered identical to a letter of intent, which is another kind of non-binding agreement that suggests that a binding agreement will soon follow. To explore this concept, consider the following memorandum of understanding definition.

Perhaps in your world. I work for  a State Agency, and a signed MOU is a binding legal document, in other words, a contract. In our case, it is usually between the State and a third party that undertakes to act on behalf of the State in some capacity, be it operating a facility, raising funds or what have you. I could also be an agreement between States for whatever reason.

Many people treat these as non binding to their peril. I suggest you consult an attorney who is well versed in govt. regulations before spouting such nonsense, or at least don't attempt to agree to an MOU with a governmental agency until you do.

 

He steps off his soapbox, and agrees not to post on PA for another 6 months at least. What a cesspool this place has become.

[Olsonist 1,912]

5 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Perhaps in your world. I work for  a State Agency, and a signed MOU is a binding legal document, in other words, a contract. In our case, it is usually between the State and a third party that undertakes to act on behalf of the State in some capacity, be it operating a facility, raising funds or what have you. I could also be an agreement between States for whatever reason.

Many people treat these as non binding to their peril. I suggest you consult an attorney who is well versed in govt. regulations before spouting such nonsense, or at least don't attempt to agree to an MOU with a governmental agency until you do.

 

He steps off his soapbox, and agrees not to post on PA for another 6 months at least. What a cesspool this place has become.

Can you cite your state's MOU? I've never heard of an MOU being binding in the way an NDA is.

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

29 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Perhaps in your world. I work for  a State Agency, and a signed MOU is a binding legal document, in other words, a contract. In our case, it is usually between the State and a third party that undertakes to act on behalf of the State in some capacity, be it operating a facility, raising funds or what have you. I could also be an agreement between States for whatever reason.

Many people treat these as non binding to their peril. I suggest you consult an attorney who is well versed in govt. regulations before spouting such nonsense, or at least don't attempt to agree to an MOU with a governmental agency until you do.

 

He steps off his soapbox, and agrees not to post on PA for another 6 months at least. What a cesspool this place has become.

Dude, I posted the UK diplomatic guide defining MOU  

Here is the Canadian rule book entry for MOUs

8. Non-binding International Instruments

Under international law, a treaty creates international legal obligations for Canada. https://treaty-accord.gc.ca/procedures.aspx?lang=eng

Other international instruments (often referred to, in Canada as "Memorandum of Understanding" (MOU) or "arrangements") can be considered as creating only moral or political commitments.

In order to avoid situations where instruments that,

could reasonably be viewed to be treaties, and therefore covered by the Government's policy, are not mistakenly classified as non-binding instruments and thus not brought to the attention of the House of Commons,

each Department is responsible for ensuring that the proper distinction is made between treaties and non-binding instruments, in consultation with the Treaty Section of the Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade.

For an explanation of the steps leading to the conclusion of a non-legally binding instrument, see Annex C.

You want the US guidelines? Here.  https://www.state.gov/s/l/treaty/guidance/

 

Nothing prevents a Government from considering an MOU Binding on them and language can be added to an MOU that creates a binding contract or treaty but in the general case, most countries call a treaty a treaty and MoU is not a treaty. and in the Canadian and UK case is specifically NON-BINDING.

 

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

Suck it, people, Trump made a monkey out of the Huffy Puffy Post and any of you that argues an MOU was equivalent to a treaty. 

 

Evey wonder where the idiom "Dumb as a Post" came from.

[P_Wop 1,896]

Did you (can you) even read what I posted above?

"One advantage of MoUs over more formal instruments is that, because obligations under international law may be avoided, they can often be put into effect without requiring legislative approval. Hence, MoUs are often used to modify and adapt existing treaties, in which case these MoUs have factual treaty status. "

[Sean 2,205]

44 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Perhaps in your world. I work for  a State Agency, and a signed MOU is a binding legal document, in other words, a contract. In our case, it is usually between the State and a third party that undertakes to act on behalf of the State in some capacity, be it operating a facility, raising funds or what have you. I could also be an agreement between States for whatever reason.

Many people treat these as non binding to their peril. I suggest you consult an attorney who is well versed in govt. regulations before spouting such nonsense, or at least don't attempt to agree to an MOU with a governmental agency until you do.

 

He steps off his soapbox, and agrees not to post on PA for another 6 months at least. What a cesspool this place has become.

 

As I said, or tried to say, I'm only speaking from my experience in the real estate industry (NYC commercial), and the semantic may vary in other contexts. I'm loath to defend Trump, but he is, obviously, the product of the NY real estate industry. These mou's would typically have language referring to a subsequent contract. It's quite helpful to spell out and agree to the salient points in a few pages before hiring high priced lawyers to draft hundred page leases. 

[Bent Sailor 859]

39 minutes ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

Evey wonder where the idiom "Dumb as a Post" came from.

From the teacher explaining to you "ever" is spelt with an "r"? 

[Bent Sailor 859]

53 minutes ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

You want the US guidelines? Here.  https://www.state.gov/s/l/treaty/guidance/

If anyone ever wonders why no-one trusts Jack? It's because he is a liar with a long history of posting screenshots that clip out the parts proving him wrong.

Here's the rest of that paragraph he conveniently clipped out.

Quote

With respect to the title of a non-binding document, negotiators should avoid using the terms “treaty” or “agreement.” While the use of a title such as “Memorandum of Understanding” is common for non-binding documents, we caution that simply calling a document a “Memorandum of Understanding” does not automatically denote for the United States that the document is non-binding under international law. The United States has entered into MOU’s that we consider to be binding international agreements.

And later on in the document, there is this comment negating his use of other countries to prove his point.

Quote

United States practice on non-binding documents may differ from that of other countries. For example, the mere fact that a document is called a “Memorandum of Understanding” does not mean that the document automatically is considered non-binding for the United States

 

[Olsonist 1,912]

It also helps if you put a question mark at the end of a question. Anyone know if Jack was home schooled?

Like this. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------^

[Left Shift 2,753]

Does anyone any longer wonder why one should not assume that a "business man" has any useful skills that relate to running a government?  

This especially applies to a multi-time failure of a "business man".

[Nailing Malarkey Too 7,316]

35 minutes ago, Olsonist said:

It also helps if you put a question mark at the end of a question. Anyone know if Jack was home schooled?

Like this. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------^

It may have the form of a question but it was a rhetorical question not seeking an answer. As such it takes on the context of a statement. 

At least I was schooled.  Writing courses were mandatory electives at MIT. 

ABOUT THE MIT WRITING REQUIREMENT

web.mit.edu/uaa/www/writing/prefrosh/geninfo.html

 MIT initiated the Writing Requirement to ensure that its graduates have the writing skills necessary for personal and professional success. ... The Writing Requirement is governed by the Committee on the Writing Requirement and administered by The Office of the Dean of Students and Undergraduate Education.

[Bent Sailor 859]

24 minutes ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

 At least I was schooled. 

We know. You get schooled here every day. Some in your position would find it embarrassing just how often you are schooled here.

 

Quote

Writing courses were mandatory electives at MIT. 

Which might actually matter if you had graduated from MIT.

[Navig8tor 1,188]

Writing courses were mandatory electives at MIT. 

Were they mandatory or elective?

It would seem that the committee on writing requirements has a low bar or it is poorly administered by the  the Office of Dean of Students.

Bent beat me to it

[SloopJonB 8,316]

59 minutes ago, Bent Sailor said:

1 hour ago, Nailing Malarkey Too said:

Evey wonder where the idiom "Dumb as a Post" came from.

From the teacher explaining to you "ever" is spelt with an "r"? 

From the teacher explaining to the class using a Hopeless Jack post as an example.

[SloopJonB 8,316]

57 minutes ago, Olsonist said:

It also helps if you put a question mark at the end of a question. Anyone know if Jack was home schooled?

Like this. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------^

If he was his parents owe him a refund.

[Happy 1,395]

That's another bad thing about Trump: he has given confidence and conviction to a myriad of dullards and fuckwits, causing them to proudly strut their obnoxious ignorance.

"I'm just as stoopid as the President! U--S---A!!! U--S---A!!!"

[Remodel 488]

6 hours ago, Bent Sailor said:

If anyone ever wonders why no-one trusts Jack? It's because he is a liar with a long history of posting screenshots that clip out the parts proving him wrong.

Here's the rest of that paragraph he conveniently clipped out.

And later on in the document, there is this comment negating his use of other countries to prove his point.

 

Typical Lying Jack.

[Pedagogical Tom 1,514]

14 hours ago, SailBlueH2O said:

" friendly allies and trade partners" .....not so friendly

try manufacturing and selling product on equal footing to Europe, Canada,China,Mexico.....it's a long list of protectionist trade practice by those "Allies" ....

Just because other governments are hostile to their taxpayers and consumers is no good reason for our government to be hostile toward our taxpayers and consumers. Trump's idea that we can tax our way to prosperity is just as silly today as when it was a lefty idea.

[P_Wop 1,896]

52 minutes ago, Contumacious Tom said:

Just because other governments are hostile to their taxpayers and consumers is no good reason for our government to be hostile toward our taxpayers and consumers. Trump's idea that we can tax our way to prosperity is just as silly today as when it was a lefty idea.

“I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.”

Winston S. Churchill

[Sol Rosenberg 6,267]

8 hours ago, Bent Sailor said:

If anyone ever wonders why no-one trusts Jack? It's because he is a liar with a long history of posting screenshots that clip out the parts proving him wrong.

Here's the rest of that paragraph he conveniently clipped out.

And later on in the document, there is this comment negating his use of other countries to prove his point.

 

If he ever switches to telling the truth, this place won’t be nearly as much fun. 

[learningJ24 342]

1 hour ago, P_Wop said:

“I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.”

Winston S. Churchill

Just as stupid as Hoover's "pull yourself up by your bootstraps"

We DO, however, have real world evidence that high progressive tax rates and high government spending is stimulative. 

[Grrr... 1,545]

21 hours ago, Ishmael said:

What planet are you really from?

Fortunately, or unfortunately, Sailblue is pretty easy to slide into his 'slot' in life.  He's old and he's pretty much a stereotypical republican.

The "old man yells at cloud' meme is probably served better here than  anywhere else.

[Left Shift 2,753]

 

8 hours ago, P_Wop said:

“I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.”

Winston S. Churchill

Never take tax advice from someone who was born in a dump like this:

Blenheim Palace is a monumental country house in Blenheim, Oxfordshire, England. It is the principal residence of the Dukes of Marlborough, and the only non-royal, non-episcopal country house in England to hold the title of palace. 

 

 

[Mrleft8 2,259]

43 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

 

Never take tax advice from someone who was born in a dump like this:

Blenheim Palace is a monumental country house in Blenheim, Oxfordshire, England. It is the principal residence of the Dukes of Marlborough, and the only non-royal, non-episcopal country house in England to hold the title of palace. 

 

 

We used to picnic there on nice days.... The palace guards even showed us the "back gate" so we could get onto the palace grounds w/o paying the admission fee. It really is a very nice estate, with spectacular landscaping.... The interior furnishings, and the artwork are..... To put it politely..... A bit gauche....

[Left Shift 2,753]

1 minute ago, Mrleft8 said:

We used to picnic there on nice days.... The palace guards even showed up the "back gate" so we could get onto the palace grounds w/o paying the admission fee. It really is a very nice estate, with spectacular landscaping.... The interior furnishings, and the artwork are..... To put it politely..... A bit gauche....

But not tRumpian.  

[Mrleft8 2,259]

2 minutes ago, Left Shift said:

But not tRumpian.  

Not quite that bad.... No...