Knut Grotzki

The Great Lakes System

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13 hours ago, Knut Grotzki said:

I've never seen it that way:

Nice way of depicting elevation, depth, distance, and body of water. And yes, it's a long way, from East to West in particular.

Just don't understand how they throw Lake Huron and Michigan into one. Maybe they try to keep the picture width down ?

One might as well look at it from a satellite, the largest group of freshwater lakes on Earth by total area:

 

Great_Lakes_from_space_crop_labeled.jpg.04c8d0b82b082d1e434c87b8ae52e93d.jpg

 

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1 hour ago, Fiji Bitter said:

Just don't understand how they throw Lake Huron and Michigan into one.

Hydrologically, Lake Michigan and Huron are technically one lake. The water level elevation is the same across both joined by the Straits of Mackinac

They were so big that people that lived around them could not perceive them as being one when they were named.

Superior, Huron and MIchigan were one lake 11,000 year ago. (End of last ice age) The ancient lake is named Algonquin.

also...no salt, no sharks... 

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Here are some of more interesting images....Lake effect snow (LES) and the Lake Algonquin 11,000 years ago...

Great_Lakes_Lake_Effect_Snow.jpg

lake_superior_lake_eff_anim-400.gif

800px-Plate_21_-_Glacial_Lake_Algonquin_and_its_Correlatives_(USGS_1915).JPG

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The Lakes are Great....I agree!

31 minutes ago, 12345 said:

Our Lakes are Great!

 

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Does anybody know what the prognosis is for downstream water levels come spring? Specifically interested for L. Ontario. It's usually the US Engineering corps that runs the numbers as they need to maintain levels to the power take-off damns further east and maintain St. Lawrence seaway depths to the joint Canada-US commision specs.  There was a lot of damage under the new protocol a couple springs ago. 

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Surprised that no one has said that the Great Lakes provide the best fresh water sailing in the world! ...  Except for Lake Ontario in August...

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I call them the "Sweetwater Seas" - sounds more romantic . .

And the Corps are the go-to folks for lake water levels . .  

Looks like Erie (where I live) will be near record highs, Ontario average or higher.

https://www.lre.usace.army.mil/Missions/Great-Lakes-Information/Great-Lakes-Water-Levels/Water-Level-Forecast/Monthly-Bulletin-of-Great-Lakes-Water-Levels/

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I would expect higher levels of water come spring....there is a shit-ton of snow in the basin this winter....

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2 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

I call them the "Sweetwater Seas" - sounds more romantic . .

And the Corps are the go-to folks for lake water levels . .  

Looks like Erie (where I live) will be near record highs, Ontario average or higher.

https://www.lre.usace.army.mil/Missions/Great-Lakes-Information/Great-Lakes-Water-Levels/Water-Level-Forecast/Monthly-Bulletin-of-Great-Lakes-Water-Levels/

Great - another spring of walking down the dock in boots.

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51 minutes ago, Tax Man said:

Great - another spring of walking down the dock in boots.

Can't you Canadianses ricos afford floating docks?  

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That was the problem last time , the floating docks floated up into the car parking lots. Water at our dry sail crane base on shore was 22" deep at the crest, 6ft from the concrete retaining wall

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That thread was great!  Made me long for the original SA forum. 

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7 hours ago, Thisbe_8Can9 said:

Surprised that no one has said that the Great Lakes provide the best fresh water sailing in the world! ...  Except for Lake Ontario in August...

thats when you head out into the lake to have a beer and go for a swim to cool off. gawd i miss that

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Ask Larry Ellison what he thinks. I heard that after bringing Sayonara in to do a Mac that he said "never again".

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One "right of passage" for some Great Lakes sailers is moving a boat up or down Niagra Falls a.k.a. The Welland Canal. Imagine that you and your boat are shrunken down to 1:64 scale and you're dropped into the crappiest toilet in the crappiest truck stop along I90 outside Buffalo. That's what it's like in each one of those locks.

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Hey,  how about if one of you artistes cook up a "Sweetwater Seas" logo ?  

I would be all over that . .  

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On 3/5/2019 at 9:12 PM, RATM said:

One "right of passage" for some Great Lakes sailers is moving a boat up or down Niagra Falls a.k.a. The Welland Canal. Imagine that you and your boat are shrunken down to 1:64 scale and you're dropped into the crappiest toilet in the crappiest truck stop along I90 outside Buffalo. That's what it's like in each one of those locks.

I did it in a 38 footer It was like being a rubber ducky in huge bath tub. 50  foot lifts First was f'in scary after you realize you won't die it was a blast. Not very pretty but fun. 

 

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36 minutes ago, HuronBouy said:

I did it in a 38 footer It was like being a rubber ducky in huge bath tub. 50  foot lifts First was f'in scary after you realize you won't die it was a blast. Not very pretty but fun. 

 

I think going up is harder then going down but I've only done one of each. The best advice I would give is to purchase a set of heavy duty work gloves. The other advice would be to bring every bumper you can get your hands on AND spend the money on those hay bails.

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I'm in Lake Erie and we have been told that this summer may see record highs for water levels

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On 3/5/2019 at 9:01 PM, RATM said:

Ask Larry Ellison what he thinks. I heard that after bringing Sayonara in to do a Mac that he said "never again".

Well - the end of Larry sailing Sayonara was actually after the 1998 Sydney Hobart, which was surely a bit bumpy - it had absolutely nothing to do with the Mac Race

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On 3/9/2019 at 2:08 AM, Christian said:

Well - the end of Larry sailing Sayonara was actually after the 1998 Sydney Hobart, which was surely a bit bumpy - it had absolutely nothing to do with the Mac Race

That boat definitely did at least one of the early 2000s Mac races, I remember seeing it. It then sat on the hard in West Michigan for the next ~15 years and I believe it has now been cut up and disposed of.

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On 3/5/2019 at 12:24 PM, Retired BN said:

Not so Shark free in Kingston last August.

2a6ce626c8e16e286236c08b62ab6f43.jpg

Great photo BN - Thanks for posting. We well remember seeing that Shark fleet some years back on a visit to Kingston. Quite, quite friendly too !!

But here is where I will get myself in trouble - as is my wont. Whereas Sandusky has a great Bay in which to sail, and Lake Erie as well, and whereas we have more sailboats docked here; therefore we declare that Sandusky Bay is actually the "Freshwater Sailing Capital of the World". 

Maybe we could have a sail-off to determine who gets to keep the name .  . 

https://www.shoresandislands.com/things-to-do/sandusky-sailing-club?id=513038

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14 minutes ago, AJ Oliver said:

Great photo BN - Thanks for posting. We well remember seeing that Shark fleet some years back on a visit to Kingston. Quite, quite friendly too !!

But here is where I will get myself in trouble - as is my wont. Whereas Sandusky has a great Bay in which to sail, and Lake Erie as well, and whereas we have more sailboats docked here; therefore we declare that Sandusky Bay is actually the "Freshwater Sailing Capital of the World". 

Maybe we could have a sail-off to determine who gets to keep the name .  . 

https://www.shoresandislands.com/things-to-do/sandusky-sailing-club?id=513038

 CORK hosts countless events each summer on an international scale... Sandusky has nothing in comparison to the caliber of events or sailing that takes place. Kingston is the freshwater sailing capital of the world.

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4 hours ago, AJ Oliver said:

Great photo BN - Thanks for posting. We well remember seeing that Shark fleet some years back on a visit to Kingston. Quite, quite friendly too !!

But here is where I will get myself in trouble - as is my wont. Whereas Sandusky has a great Bay in which to sail, and Lake Erie as well, and whereas we have more sailboats docked here; therefore we declare that Sandusky Bay is actually the "Freshwater Sailing Capital of the World". 

Maybe we could have a sail-off to determine who gets to keep the name .  . 

https://www.shoresandislands.com/things-to-do/sandusky-sailing-club?id=513038

Sandusky Bay, and for that matter the entire Lake Erie islands area, is the power boating / jet ski capital of the world. In fact, this area's dumb fuckness is a year-round affair. How many ice fisherman did the Coast Guard pull off the water last weekend?

 

 

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We have the BEST here with these Great Lakes!

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On 3/11/2019 at 8:27 AM, Carrera said:

That boat definitely did at least one of the early 2000s Mac races, I remember seeing it. It then sat on the hard in West Michigan for the next ~15 years and I believe it has now been cut up and disposed of.

Pretty sure it was ‘99. It was a pretty mellow race. The only thing he was grumpy about was that they’d made a bunch of “rating be damned” changes to try to beat Piper’s record and missed. 

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1 hour ago, Monkey said:

Pretty sure it was ‘99. It was a pretty mellow race. The only thing he was grumpy about was that they’d made a bunch of “rating be damned” changes to try to beat Piper’s record and missed. 

My memory is 2000.  After the supremac, hung out at Burnham for a few nights and remember seeing a lot of them.  Normal disclaimer stands.  

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2 minutes ago, Cal20sailor said:

My memory is 2000.  After the supremac, hung out at Burnham for a few nights and remember seeing a lot of them.  Normal disclaimer stands.  

Unless Sayonara did it twice, it wasn’t a super Mac year. She was docked two slips away from us and I chatted with Larry (not knowing who he was) in an elevator at the Chippewa. 

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2000 offered the option to continue to race to CHI.  I spent Wed/Thu nights on the boat and swore I saw Sayonara on the end of the dock with plenty of security.  On odd years, I flew into CHI the night before and wouldn't have the same memory.  

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Just now, Cal20sailor said:

2000 offered the option to continue to race to CHI.  I spent Wed/Thu nights on the boat and swore I saw Sayonara on the end of the dock with plenty of security.  On odd years, I flew into CHI the night before and wouldn't have the same memory.  

Did she try it twice?  I only worked for Cyno in ‘98 and ‘99 as far as I remember, and Cyno got line honors one of those years, Sayonara got it the other. And both stopped at the island. 

A lot of rum has fogged the memories. 

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12 minutes ago, Monkey said:

Did she try it twice?  I only worked for Cyno in ‘98 and ‘99 as far as I remember, and Cyno got line honors one of those years, Sayonara got it the other. And both stopped at the island. 

A lot of rum has fogged the memories. 

Oops, 2001.  Now I'm curious if she did do it twice.  

https://www.boats.com/on-the-water/sayonara-first-to-finish-chicago-to-mackinac-race/

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18 minutes ago, Cal20sailor said:

Nice find!  I can update my rum addled brain. I have to adjust my memory by two years!

edit: I guess I was with them in 2000 and 2001 then. Trying to remember the younger days is a bitch!

edit again:  still wasn’t a super Mac though. If we combine enough of our brains, we’ll figure things out eventually!

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If I remember correctly she stayed up north that year and did Harbor Springs race week too.

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On 3/5/2019 at 7:01 PM, RATM said:

Ask Larry Ellison what he thinks. I heard that after bringing Sayonara in to do a Mac that he said "never again".

It was Ted Turner, 1970 mac on American Eagle...  Joked before the race that the great lakes are a millpond..  Got hit with 60+ on the nose and he retracted the millpond comments thereafter.

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15 hours ago, Monkey said:

Nice find!  I can update my rum addled brain. I have to adjust my memory by two years!

edit: I guess I was with them in 2000 and 2001 then. Trying to remember the younger days is a bitch!

edit again:  still wasn’t a super Mac though. If we combine enough of our brains, we’ll figure things out eventually!

I can say without hesitation that 2000 was what we call a Supermac but this one was from PH to CHI.  If you were on Cyno, you could not forget the run down L Mich.  I heard speeds of low 20s for long stretches on the sleds.  A friend showed me an O-ring that had become very much an oval ring from a sled.  I was on a forty-something and we finished the PH-Mac at about 10am and had a chute up from Grays to the finish.  

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Hey  did a few Mac races and had a blast.  It convinced me to take a cruiser up there from Chesapeake, likely summer 2020, up the Hudson then enter via Erie canal or continue north and enter on the St Lawrence.

Any Lakes cruisers can point me to good Lakes cruising guides?

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1 hour ago, Cal20sailor said:

I can say without hesitation that 2000 was what we call a Supermac but this one was from PH to CHI.  If you were on Cyno, you could not forget the run down L Mich.  I heard speeds of low 20s for long stretches on the sleds.  A friend showed me an O-ring that had become very much an oval ring from a sled.  I was on a forty-something and we finished the PH-Mac at about 10am and had a chute up from Grays to the finish.  

Figured out all the confusion. https://www.chicagoyachtclub.org/files/Mac-Trophy-Winner-List.pdf

I was with Cyno in 97 and 98. Sayonara raced the Mac in 98 as well as the 2000 Supermac. I wasn’t there for that one. 

Edit:  and I think 2000 was the year Cyno decided to test the depth of Spectacle Reef with her keel, so missed out on the sleigh ride. 

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13 minutes ago, Monkey said:

Figured out all the confusion. https://www.chicagoyachtclub.org/files/Mac-Trophy-Winner-List.pdf

I was with Cyno in 97 and 98. Sayonara raced the Mac in 98 as well as the 2000 Supermac. I wasn’t there for that one. 

Edit:  and I think 2000 was the year Cyno decided to test the depth of Spectacle Reef with her keel, so missed out on the sleigh ride. 

We're so close.  Cyno moved some rocks in '99 (http://www.bycmack.com/past-results/1999-macfinal.cfm) and Sayonara only did the Chi-Mac in 2000.  

This was fun and I feel better about my memory of sighting Sayonara in 2000.  

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36 minutes ago, Cal20sailor said:

We're so close.  Cyno moved some rocks in '99 (http://www.bycmack.com/past-results/1999-macfinal.cfm) and Sayonara only did the Chi-Mac in 2000.  

This was fun and I feel better about my memory of sighting Sayonara in 2000.  

We're still not quite there yet!  Cyno DNF'ed in 99 because the rig came down shortly after the start.  https://goo.gl/images/rcxBaX

2000 was the grounding DNF.  It was a rough two years.

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1 minute ago, Monkey said:

We're still not quite there yet!  Cyno DNF'ed in 99 because the rig came down shortly after the start.  https://goo.gl/images/rcxBaX

2000 was the grounding DNF.  It was a rough two years.

You're right.  Done!

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On 3/11/2019 at 9:27 AM, Carrera said:

That boat definitely did at least one of the early 2000s Mac races, I remember seeing it. It then sat on the hard in West Michigan for the next ~15 years and I believe it has now been cut up and disposed of.

Okay - so he did one (or two) flat water lake races - probably not what scared the shit out of him...................

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