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Hey Sailors,

I am 24 years old with about 1000 nm offshore racing miles and 37 hours at the helm offshore. 2 Chicago Mac races, a Harvest Moon, and a couple deliveries. Additionally, I buoy race on a J105 as the bowman about 40 weekends a year in North Texas and have been doing so for the last 6 years or so. 

I recently found a mini transat boat that I am in love with who's price is right however, I have been told by older sailors that I essentially have a death wish by just jumping into owning my own solo handed boat/ jumping into a solo ocean race in a 6.5 meter boat.

Thoughts on this? AND, where can I find more information about double handed ocean racing around Texas? I have realized I need a little more experience. It seems to me that most of the solo and double handed racers are in the great lakes, east and west coasts, or are just non-existent. As it is, I cannot find much of a community around solo and double handed ocean racers in the US.

I watched the Mike Plant documentary, Coyote, and I'm ready to take my ocean sailing to the next level!

Please advise! Thank you all!!

With Gratitude,

Aaron

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Being able to do the things you love is the biggest gift life will bring you.

Naysayers may be well intentioned, but they’re still negative. You’re 24, you’ve loads of time to try things, fuck up things and move on and recover. 

A good friend owns a mini, her eyes sparkle whenever she talks about it.

Do it. We’ve all been cold, wet, tired, partly terrified and thinking we’re not good enough whilst worrying about how to fund it all. And it’s all worth it when the stars align and you’re hooting over big swells with your hair on fire.

Welcome to boat ownership.

SB

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HAHAHA!!! Thanks SB, I appreciate the encouragement! That's basically my mentality. I understand safety and that I do not have the most experience, but I'll never get experience if I don't push on - I have to learn (and fuck up) on my own to grow as a sailor!

I haven't purchased the boat yet, I need to 1 get the pedigree in order and determine it's certifications (ORR, etc.) but 2, need to get funds and storage in order.

What about solo and double handed organizations? I from your profile you're based in Australia, but do you know of any orgs around the US specific to single and double handed ocean racing? What about in Australia? At this point, I just want to talk to more people.

Thanks again SB!

Cheers,

Aaron

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6 minutes ago, noblesails said:

HAHAHA!!! Thanks SB, I appreciate the encouragement! That's basically my mentality. I understand safety and that I do not have the most experience, but I'll never get experience if I don't push on - I have to learn (and fuck up) on my own to grow as a sailor!

I haven't purchased the boat yet, I need to 1 get the pedigree in order and determine it's certifications (ORR, etc.) but 2, need to get funds and storage in order.

What about solo and double handed organizations? I from your profile you're based in Australia, but do you know of any orgs around the US specific to single and double handed ocean racing? What about in Australia? At this point, I just want to talk to more people.

Thanks again SB!

Cheers,

Aaron

SF Bay Singlehanded Sailing Society, SFbaysss.org is, well, the SF Bay area one.

 

Also - grab the book by Foolish (SA Member)

Singlehanded Sailing: Thoughts, Tips, Techniques & Tactics

 

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Go for it...... The hard bit is not so much sailing experience itself, but adapting to do it all singlehanded. Be prepared and know your drills for all situations!

There are lots of organisations around. Eg:

https://www.offshoresolo.com/ 

There is plenty of stuff on line in terms of books, videos etc. Eg:

https://www.quantumsails.com/en/resources-and-expertise/articles/going-solo-getting-started-singlehanded-sailing

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There's a mini sailor in New Orleans, he posts here sometimes.

  I would say give it a go. 

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The minis are a fantastic way to get into short handed sailing. PM me and i'll put you in touch with a number of mini sailors.  I own a Pogo II and love it. Also check out GLSSS and CHESSS for short handed events and like minded individuals.  

Go for it. 

 

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I have raced a Pogo I, it's not much fun up wind but otherwise is a blast.  I helped a friend qualify for the Bermuda I/II which he did, as far as I know that boat is still for sail in Kemah, Tx.  Just little interest or support in these parts - in fact the Harvest Moon has a minimum crew of 4 (3 for multihull) and i have done several of those with 4 and placed well.  I spent years being one of 10 or more and those days are done with.  I don't like myself enough to single hand long distance but really enjoy double handing and have done numerous deliveries.

Something to consider - the Pogo I needs slings to launch as there is no lifting point, don't know about the newer models (you can ramp launch if deep enough to float off trailer). 

I say go for it and hope you light a spark to get more people involved. 

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Go for it.

Make sure you have a plan to fund it. Racing any boat is expensive, even an old mini.

There is a small two handed scene in Oz, but the rules here are not yet ready for ocean going minis.

3R

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Jumping in a mini and doing a transatlantic as a first race would be silly. I suspect that is what the naysayers think you are planning. 

But getting one and learning is a great idea if that is where your heart is. Just remember that spending time sailing is only part of singlehanded Sailing. Knowing your boat and how to fix problems is also critical. 

You will kick yourself later in life if you don’t grab this opportunity.

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3 hours ago, Chimp too said:

Jumping in a mini and doing a transatlantic as a first race would be silly. I suspect that is what the naysayers think you are planning. 

But getting one and learning is a great idea if that is where your heart is. Just remember that spending time sailing is only part of singlehanded Sailing. Knowing your boat and how to fix problems is also critical. 

You will kick yourself later in life if you don’t grab this opportunity.

Chimp pretty much summed up my thoughts when I read your post.

I love to single and doublehand sail my boat.  But, even in a room full of random racing sailors the single/doublehanders are usually considered crazy.  If you need proof, try asking for tips on boat setup/sail trim to make your boat more stable/balance running in 20+ knots of wind with the kite up so that the autopilot can drive easier.

So, don't let the naysayers stop you.  Just make sure that you allow yourself time to learn at a reasonable pace and be ready, because mistakes will happen and your skills will be tested.

Good luck.

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Any major race requires qualifying miles to enter,  can't just jump in and go.  IIRC LeoV is big on Mini's in Europe and has a thread somewhere, probably worth checking out.

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What the hell. Nothing says you have to round the capes or do anything at all except put around in it if you want to. When you don't see a reason to come back at the end of the day you are ready to go. One thing for certain is that SHing will make you a better sailor faster than just about anything else.

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Noblesails, stop listening to any naysayers.  Singlehanded sailing is my life and I couldn't imagine anything else.  So get a boat, any boat, and go out on the water  - now!   One thing first: you absolutely have to read this book. 

Book Cover.jpg

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Do it, do it, do, it. If you don't you will regret it immensely in the future. There will be times when you have failure after failure and want to sink the fucking thing, but then there will be a little sliver of light that will lead you on. You're young and (presumably) unencumbered by mortgages, kids, wife, mistress etc, so now is literally the best time. And while you are at it, bang all the chicks you can, you'll never regret that in the future. 

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If it's what you want definitely go for it.   If the boat has been prepped for ocean races already (electrical systems, sails, emergency rudder...the list goes on) you will save a TON by buying it used.  Seriously get in touch with SF singlehanded society, you will find some mini sailors that can fill you in.  Consider doing the SH Transpac 2020? or 2022.  Its a great race, gets warmer every day and you end up in Kauai.  I did it with about your level of experience and I was 50. You should be able to go twice as fast!!!!!

This could be your boat in a year...........dream big!!!!

IMG_1177.jpeg

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41 minutes ago, Alcatraz5768 said:

Do it, do it, do, it. If you don't you will regret it immensely in the future. There will be times when you have failure after failure and want to sink the fucking thing, but then there will be a little sliver of light that will lead you on. You're young and (presumably) unencumbered by mortgages, kids, wife, mistress etc, so now is literally the best time. And while you are at it, bang all the chicks you can, you'll never regret that in the future. 

Wish someone gave me that advice when I was 18, especially that last bit.

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Go sailing. Have fun. Live.

People who haven't will line up to tell you you can't as if they know. 

Norm

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On 3/28/2019 at 8:43 PM, noblesails said:

Hey Sailors,

I am 24 years old with about 1000 nm offshore racing miles and 37 hours at the helm offshore. 2 Chicago Mac races, a Harvest Moon, and a couple deliveries. Additionally, I buoy race on a J105 as the bowman about 40 weekends a year in North Texas and have been doing so for the last 6 years or so. 

I recently found a mini transat boat that I am in love with who's price is right however, I have been told by older sailors that I essentially have a death wish by just jumping into owning my own solo handed boat/ jumping into a solo ocean race in a 6.5 meter boat.

Thoughts on this? AND, where can I find more information about double handed ocean racing around Texas? I have realized I need a little more experience. It seems to me that most of the solo and double handed racers are in the great lakes, east and west coasts, or are just non-existent. As it is, I cannot find much of a community around solo and double handed ocean racers in the US.

I watched the Mike Plant documentary, Coyote, and I'm ready to take my ocean sailing to the next level!

Please advise! Thank you all!!

With Gratitude,

Aaron

Pity you are not in the UK where I race with SORC (Solo Offshore Racing Club):  https://www.offshoresolo.com/

We run an active series of solo Inshore and Offshore races and training events, from weekend day events to offshore events such as solo out to the Fastnet Rock and back, and we join in with the French solo events on the other side of the Channel. Our boats range from displacement cruisers through to purpose designed short-handed flyers, and we have had Mini sailors join us. The Mini's manage just fine and are a hoot. Good luck and make your dream reality.

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22 hours ago, Foolish said:

Noblesails, stop listening to any naysayers.  Singlehanded sailing is my life and I couldn't imagine anything else.  So get a boat, any boat, and go out on the water  - now!   One thing first: you absolutely have to read this book. 

Book Cover.jpg

Second this.  I have bought 3 of these books (not including the pdf) as I keep loaning them out and they don't seem to come back.  Great reference, thanks for writing it.  I bought a cheap, beat up cruiser/racer (remember those?) based on a 3/4 ton IOR racer at 60 after not sailing for 25 years.  Not ideal by today's standards but little tweaks help out.  Solo docking in a crowded marina is my major worry now!

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I have bought 3 of these books (not including the pdf) as I keep loaning them out and they don't seem to come back. 

Wow. Thanks very much. I'm glad that you like it. If you ever get up to Victoria I'll buy you a beer. 

I've got a new novel out if you are looking for something else to read. See below.

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On 3/29/2019 at 4:15 AM, kcolborne said:

............... If you need proof, try asking for tips on boat setup/sail trim to make your boat more stable/balance running in 20+ knots of wind with the kite up so that the autopilot can drive easier.................

This truly is a perfect test question!  As I have asked this exact question and received very dramatic and. unhelpful responses....   fortunately I didn't say that I needed to know so I could sleep longer........

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One thing first: you absolutely have to read this book. 

"Have to"?   I say get a boat and get out and practice, 1000s of people have done it and so can you.

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Oh allow Foolish a little bit of advertising.   Many seem to have benefited from his book.

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Thanks DtM.  I appreciate the thought.

Quote

............... If you need proof, try asking for tips on boat setup/sail trim to make your boat more stable/balance running in 20+ knots of wind with the kite up so that the autopilot can drive easier.................

This is actually described in some detail on page 122 of my book.  Here is a direct quote:

"It is often thought that in high winds, it is safer to hide much of the spinnaker behind the main sail by moving the pole forward. This is a mistake that can lead to serous broaches. We must always go back to the initial concept that sail trim is vital. If the spinnaker pole is well forward, the sail trim assumes that the boat is on a reach rather than a run, and the spinnaker will pull the boat up into a broach.  An autopilot or wind vane cannot overcome this pressure."

So what you want to do is pull the pole back until it is perpendicular to the wind, or just a bit forward.  Then you want to ease the sheet until the spinnaker is just on the edge of a curl.  Now comes the tricky part. With a crew, any time the spinnaker starts to curl over, the trimmer will pull the sheet and stop the sail from collapsing. And the helmsman can adjust his steering for the feel of the situation.  But this is exactly the opposite of what you do when using an autopilot, sailing on apparent wind.  If you pull the sheet, then the boat will just continue to round up into a full broach, because the autopilot cannot override the much more powerful spinnaker.  So, what you want to do is to allow the spinnaker to continue to curl over, even until it collapses if necessary. And allow the autopilot to steer the boat back down until the spinnaker catches again.  It takes nerve to do this counter intuitive action, but it is absolutely necessary.  It is quite funny the first few times you go through this.  Watching your sail flap in front while the boat steers down. But once you've seen this happen, you'll understand. 

Likewise, if you are singlehanding and you are steering, if the spinnaker starts to collapse, do not pull in the sheet. Rather, just steer the boat downwind until the sail catches again. 

One other thing, with the spinnaker up in a blow, the boat might have lots of lee helm.  To counteract this, try sheeting in on the main sail, rather than having it against the spreaders.  You should be able to get the boat balanced with a bit of weather helm as you expect, or at least with a neutral helm.

Now you can go and enjoy your dinner below while the boat continues to sail.  And remember the rule that the big boats use:  When things go to shit, the first thing you do is make a cup of tea, and drink it, and if you're French you smoke a cigarette,  and then go solve your problem.  I'll always remember the first time I followed this advice during a broach. I already had a cup of tea in the cockpit so I didn't have to make it.  But I did take a few sips all while the boat was over on its ear with water halfway up my leg.   

Have fun.

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Thanks Foolish, good read!. On the topic of counter rational thought, I've been working on boat mannerisms when you put your helm hard over, and surprisingly it's also counter intuitive. 

As you mention, my boat is one of those where sail can easily overpower the rudders, even the main. So turning off the wind ain't gonna happen without the main traveller and maybe sheet being eased. When I want to turn fast, I find it instinctive to turn the helm too hard and wait for the trimmer to ease to you, and as a by-product of this you drag the rudders, and the boat seems to fight the turn. If I ease the amount of helm I'm feeding it the boat seems to turn quicker.

??

I went researching ,and because I'm a bit thick, I had to draw it out a few times to get my head around it. It worked out as I gave it a fistful of weather helm to bear away, the rudders point to the surface, and you drive the stern upwards and outward. This pushes the nose down and inward, the boat heels to leeward and kinda trips over itself, and wants to turn the opposite way, back to windward.

The counter intuitive part is easing the amount helm input to actually realise a more rapid turn. I felt like a bit of a dick when I worked it out, thinking of all those times I jammed the helm against the stops while  bawling for the main to be eased :)

Presentation1.thumb.jpg.0fc7bb08d90ad204a6ec4d759cef79e2.jpg

The same thing applies when you're autohelm is driving. This follows the adage you mention, that the boat will settle at its optimum sweet spot for the angle to the wind, if you're sailplan is trimmed for direction  y , the autopilot doesn't have much hope of driving it in direction z

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Just do it. Make sure you do have enough funds but it's amazing what you can get by with when you have too.

I have wanted a mini ever since I was 15, being in Australia made that a bit harder than Europe. It is one of the only things I wish I could have done. 

I got to sail a bit on mini 797 Skippy and it was awesome. they are big bang for your buck.

Maybe some time in the future (am 32 now so still a bit of time). 

It seems that most yacht clubs are getting on board with shorthanded sailing, weather it be a dedicated division or just letting shorthanded boat race with fully crewed boats. Or if your not after results follow the races unofficially (just try not to step on too many toes as it can be a hinderance to clubs accepting shorthanded boats in the future)

We had a cracked race to Keppel last year competing against all the fully crewed boats as we where the only shorthanded boat entered (we won PHS overall)

The other big issue with mini's in Australia is all offshores have in minimum waterline (usually around 7-7.5m) which the mini's done meet. Also there is the motor regulations which outlaw outboards on the transom. A flying tiger got up to cat 2 with it's outboard in a well however all fuel systems need massive upgrade.

Having sailed everything from one design dinghys to 100ft maxi's and TP's, The most fun I've had of late has been doing 2 handed offshores in a 40fter. The boat does have water ballast but the deck layout is pretty lousy.

Shaggy, we need to get you out racing shorthaned, your boat is perfect! Are you doing gladestone this year?

 

 

 

 

Edited by James Chilman
Missed a bit
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Short handed sailing is growing massively in the United States. I think that Oakcliff is now running a specific short handed summer long course using their Class40 and perhaps a Figaro II - I could be wrong!

I'd agree with the other posters though, if you've got the budget then go out and do it - you'll be surprised what you can do for the money. Break stuff and then fix it! If not then connect up with other Mini owners - a cool project to follow is the new Warrior Sailing Program's Mini Campaign. Beyond that connect up with people like the Atlantic Cup, the Bermuda 1-2, the First Light Project and ask if you can assist in anyway. You'd be amazed at how many people need help with deliveries... 

PM me if you need more info on anything. 

 

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1 hour ago, mad4it said:

Short handed sailing is growing massively in the United States.

 

Is it?  

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59 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Is it?  

I attended a talk by Johnstone who stated that shorthanded adventure sailing and racing was the target for their new boat. Would J boats make that kind of investment if it wasn't?

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37 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Is it?  

Comparatively yes, i'd suggest so... 

At the top end of the sport we'll be seeing at least two Class40s bought into the United States for the 2020 season. From what i've been told that number could be as high as 5, I however personally doubt that. Beyond that the mini class appears to be gaining traction again and the introduction of the Figaro 3 has excited people. I understand that a number of Figaro2s have already been purchased in order to create an east coast circuit. 

Take into account the US also had three entries into the Route du Rhum - when was the last time that happened? The romance of it and the writing of people like Hennessy really did capture peoples imaginations. 

Outside of that you only have to look at races such as the Bermuda 1-2 which this year continues the upward trend, the Chicago - Mac, the Three Bridges Race and many others. Another indicator is the way boat design is moving forward - we're seeing more boats like the j/121 using water ballast, furled headsails and so on. When I speak to friends in rigging shops they tell me that the Karver furling gear is the kit that's flying out and when I ask why they say its because XY&Z is fed up of paying additional crew, can't race because they can't find crew or just wants to spend some time on the water, alone or with one other. 

The San Francisco Shorthanded Sailing Club continues to grow, as does the Chesapeake Shorthanded Sailing Society. The sport is going shorthanded - World Failing continues to invest, OC Sport has restructured in order to focus on short handed offshore sailing, a new round the world Class40 race will soon be announced and designers and builders are increasingly look to pursue that market. 

So yes, i'd suggest the US is seeing large growth in the shorthanded sector compared to other areas of our collective sport. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Ajax said:

I attended a talk by Johnstone who stated that shorthanded adventure sailing and racing was the target for their new boat. Would J boats make that kind of investment if it wasn't?

that's called circular reasoning.  I'm not disputing the characterization, I'm just looking if there is any evidence of 'massively growing'.   

I've been a bit off the scene lately, but as of maybe 6 months ago there was no data showing anything but 'very gently increasing' for the US shorthanded scene.  If I'm wrong, I'm happily wrong, but I'd like to know what's real.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, mad4it said:

Comparatively yes, i'd suggest so... 



At the top end of the sport we'll be seeing at least two Class40s bought into the United States for the 2020 season.

We have had two to four Class 40s racing in the US for the better part of a decade, with more whenever the Atlantic Cup is around.  You'll note that the Atlantic Cup has been shrinking though.

 

8 minutes ago, mad4it said:

 

From what i've been told that number could be as high as 5, I however personally doubt that. Beyond that the mini class appears to be gaining traction again and the introduction of the Figaro 3 has excited people. I understand that a number of Figaro2s have already been purchased in order to create an east coast circuit. [/quote]

"Could be as high as" always means "Will not be" to me.  That's what I've learned in this business.  Similarly, "Appears to be gaining traction' and 'has excited people' isn't even good sales speak; it sounds like pure bull.

8 minutes ago, mad4it said:

 

Take into account the US also had three entries into the Route du Rhum - when was the last time that happened?

Not sure, but many years of American Vendee and BWR entries doesn't seem to have translated into much interest here.  Why would 3 RdR entries do so?

8 minutes ago, mad4it said:

Outside of that you only have to look at races such as the Bermuda 1-2 which this year continues the upward trend, the Chicago - Mac, the Three Bridges Race and many others. Another indicator is the way boat design is moving forward - we're seeing more boats like the j/121 using water ballast, furled headsails and so on. When I speak to friends in rigging shops they tell me that the Karver furling gear is the kit that's flying out and when I ask why they say its because XY&Z is fed up of paying additional crew, can't race because they can't find crew or just wants to spend some time on the water, alone or with one other. 

The San Francisco Shorthanded Sailing Club continues to grow, as does the Chesapeake Shorthanded Sailing Society. The sport is going shorthanded - World Failing continues to invest, OC Sport has restructured in order to focus on short handed offshore sailing, a new round the world Class40 race will soon be announced and designers and builders are increasingly look to pursue that market. [/quote]

Not a single piece of data in this two paragraphs of bullshit.  Pure sales puffery.

8 minutes ago, mad4it said:

So yes, i'd suggest the US is seeing large growth in the shorthanded sector compared to other areas of our collective sport. 

[/quote]

Except you wrote that "Shorthanded sailing is growing massively in the USA."   Now you are backtracking.

My question remains:

Is it?

By what percent?

 

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A friend has just bought a Mini, some would consider it ill advised...she has minimal offshore racing experience, hasn't single handed, yet has grabbed life by the balls and gone and done the hard part, buying the boat. She has a good job to pay for work on the boat when she doesn't have time to do it herself and a good cadre of friends in the racing industry to help with time on the hard, on the boat and more importantly the water. 

Should you buy a Mini...why not, should you dare to dream and go after something a little different...sure, hope you have fun with the boat and no doubt you will grow in experience and garner a wealth of knowledge along the way, even if you don't make the Mini Transat start. 

Send it!

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To race in the Mini Transat you have to qualify...there are several races that lead up to it but I think most are across the pond. Campaigning with the goal to get a slot in the Mini Transat is definately doable with Sponsors. The class I believe has a series of offshore events that lead up to the transat and completing some of them are qualifiers...

Below is the class info....and some blurb about qualifying I found. (I looked into this sometime ago...) 

https://www.classemini.com/

1- 1000 miles singlehanded, on the boat you want to sail with. One stop of 72 hr. max. In Europe there is an Atlantic and a Mediterranean course out of which you can choose. If you are far away from this (3 days sailing or so), propose your own qualification course to the Classe Mini. You have to let the Class Mini know by a form that you are leaving (available on their website). You have to let a logbook signed by start and finish (and stop). Some requirements for the log are; Celestial navigation (twice at least), weather reports, 8 times a day all normal log observations, sails and sail changes, damages etc. You are asked to carry your Epirb and liferaft.. 

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3 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

We have had two to four Class 40s racing in the US for the better part of a decade, with more whenever the Atlantic Cup is around.  You'll note that the Atlantic Cup has been shrinking though.

I think you'll find there is a lot more than this. I believe there to be approx 20 in the United States, admittedly some are short handed cruisers. Of those that compete regularly you've got Privateer, Oakcliff, Toothface, Amhas, Dragon, First Light to name a few. You'll also have to note that as a matter of fact the Atlantic Cup has not been shrinking. I think the last edition has 11 boats. It should also be noted that the Class40 cycle affects the participation of European class40s (like mine) a huge amount. I think you'll be surprised when the entry list for 2020 is announced. The English Transat and Transat Quebec - Saint Malo will make the fleet interesting. It should also be noted that since the event was first run in 2011 the American fleet actually racing has doubled. Is it breakneck speed? Certainly not but it's progress. 

 

9 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

"Could be as high as" always means "Will not be" to me.  That's what I've learned in this business.  Similarly, "Appears to be gaining traction' and 'has excited people' isn't even good sales speak; it sounds like pure bull.

Which is why I backed it up with "however, I personally doubt that". Also appears to be gaining and has excited people is a genuine feeling of mine. Of course everything is seen in different lights by different people. I tend to be on the more positive side of life. 

 

11 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Not sure, but many years of American Vendee and BWR entries doesn't seem to have translated into much interest here.  Why would 3 RdR entries do so?

Quote

 The Vendee is for the majority of people unattainable. Rich did a great job in the Vendee, no one can take that away from him. Equally Ryan did a great job in the BWR but again the amount of cash it takes to be involved in those races are huge. I truly believe that Mike, Donald and John did more in the Route du Rhum than Rich or Brian did in terms of motivating people to get out there and do it! Three ordinary guys just living out their dreams. I'm sure our opinions will differ on this but we're both entitled to ours. 

17 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Not a single piece of data in this two paragraphs of bullshit.  Pure sales puffery.

Yep, I won't deny the lack of data but to me its the clear establishment of trends. Those in the industry are being asked to adapt boats so that shorthanded sailors can indeed go sailing. Those that are running races are changing their businesses in order to focus or refocus on shorthanded offshore races. And to your point about sales puffery - i've not going to gain from this, it's what i'm seeing and heaven forbid someone share that on a forum. You of all people should be aware of that. 

 

20 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Except you wrote that "Shorthanded sailing is growing massively in the USA."   Now you are backtracking.

My question remains:

Is it?

By what percent?

I'm not - I truly believe it and my answer to is it? remains the same. Yes. By a percentage? 1348% in other words f*** knows... 

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35 minutes ago, TANGO QUEBEC said:

A friend has just bought a Mini, some would consider it ill advised...she has minimal offshore racing experience, hasn't single handed, yet has grabbed life by the balls and gone and done the hard part, buying the boat. She has a good job to pay for work on the boat when she doesn't have time to do it herself and a good cadre of friends in the racing industry to help with time on the hard, on the boat and more importantly the water. 

Should you buy a Mini...why not, should you dare to dream and go after something a little different...sure, hope you have fun with the boat and no doubt you will grow in experience and garner a wealth of knowledge along the way, even if you don't make the Mini Transat start. 

Send it!

Minis are awesome, and people who sail them are beasts. 

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29 minutes ago, mad4it said:

I think you'll find there is a lot more than this.

 

I'm not - I truly believe it and my answer to is it? remains the same. Yes. By a percentage? 1348% in other words f*** knows... 

 

Your response is an admission that you have literally zero actual evidence of your claim for shorthanded sailing's growth in the USA.  I'm guessing you're not from around here? I also have zero information that tends to agree with your initial 'massive growth' post.  Cool.  I do in fact appreciate your obvious passion, though you sound like you're selling something.

And yes, I'm cynical and borderline pessimistic, but only because I remember 10 years ago when I too believed that 'US shorthanded sailing is growing massively.'  There is nothing new under the sun, and you should check your assumptions before stating what is just straight untrue or you will have to backtrack like you did above.

 

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Your response is an admission that you have literally zero actual evidence of your claim for shorthanded sailing's growth in the USA.  I'm guessing you're not from around here? I also have zero information that tends to agree with your initial 'massive growth' post.  Cool.  I do in fact appreciate your obvious passion, though you sound like you're selling something.

And yes, I'm cynical and borderline pessimistic, but only because I remember 10 years ago when I too believed that 'US shorthanded sailing is growing massively.'  There is nothing new under the sun, and you should check your assumptions before stating what is just straight untrue or you will have to backtrack like you did above

Actual evidence - no but a firm belief yes. You're right - i'm not, i'm European through and through but I have taken a keen interest in the short handed US scene and hope to be at the Atlantic Cup in 2020. 

Well perhaps we can agree to disagree on whether growth is being seen but in either case I think we can both agree that @noblesails should get into the Mini world! 

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4 minutes ago, mad4it said:

Actual evidence - no but a firm belief yes. You're right - i'm not, i'm European through and through but I have taken a keen interest in the short handed US scene and hope to be at the Atlantic Cup in 2020. 

 Well perhaps we can agree to disagree on whether growth is being seen but in either case I think we can both agree that @noblesails should get into the Mini world! 

Of course he should.  Everyone should try sailing a Mini.  Best thing about it is you know almost instantly if it's right for you (because for 99% of humanity, it's too hardcore!).

As to your 'beliefs', I believe that people who make up factual statements with no evidence are something of a plague right now in the world. I'm not saying you are a bad person, but I get pretty offended when I see unqualified statements of fact like you made above without even an attempt at evidence.  You may not see it as lying, but it is.

Belief that something is true is not a reason to say it is true.

 

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29 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Minis are awesome, and people who sail them are beasts. 

we're just regular folks, maybe slightly off but regular folks

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Most crews who've sailed with you would agree that you're a beast.  Compared to regular sailors anyway

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not hard to look at yachtscoring in US over last 5 years and see that dh anyway is up a good bit. Massively? In comparison to sailing in general

can make a case but who cares. Obviously a bunch of new boats being designed for it and Jenny and jpk at least have sold a bunch again in last 5 - 10 years.

 

The kid bought the boat right? 

 

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On 3/30/2019 at 2:57 PM, Third Reef said:

Wish someone gave me that advice when I was 18, especially that last bit.

you aint never lie

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We've got four minis in the 1-2 this year. Hoping for a couple more. Come join us. 

I really hope the kid bought the boat... 

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On 3/28/2019 at 1:43 PM, noblesails said:

Hey Sailors,

I am 24 years old with about 1000 nm offshore racing miles and 37 hours at the helm offshore. 2 Chicago Mac races, a Harvest Moon, and a couple deliveries. Additionally, I buoy race on a J105 as the bowman about 40 weekends a year in North Texas and have been doing so for the last 6 years or so. 

I recently found a mini transat boat that I am in love with who's price is right however, I have been told by older sailors that I essentially have a death wish by just jumping into owning my own solo handed boat/ jumping into a solo ocean race in a 6.5 meter boat.

Thoughts on this? AND, where can I find more information about double handed ocean racing around Texas? I have realized I need a little more experience. It seems to me that most of the solo and double handed racers are in the great lakes, east and west coasts, or are just non-existent. As it is, I cannot find much of a community around solo and double handed ocean racers in the US.

I watched the Mike Plant documentary, Coyote, and I'm ready to take my ocean sailing to the next level!

Please advise! Thank you all!!

With Gratitude,

Aaron

Hi Aaron,

Here in California, the shorthanded ocean racing scene is fairly active but also pretty casual and "corinthian". PSSA in Southern California is a motley collection of boats sailed by men & women who are mostly getting out there for the experience rather than the competition. Yes, we still take our own finish times and report them to the race officer. There is a lot of mentoring and safety education that goes on behind the scenes. The boats range from J24's to Catalina 30's to the J Boat brochure, Sun Fast 3200's, X-Yachts and even my Open 50. PSSA had a few mini's - 3 or more for a while - but we aren't seeing them here much these days. There is a Class 40 with an owner from the East Coast. There is a fair amount of upwind work in the races so the mini's have a hard time on corrected, but in the right conditions they light up, of course. We also have a couple participants that live in Arizona. The conditions in the races of So Cal are typically light at the start, but build as we get offshore and there have been a few races over the last decade held in gale conditions. There is now a shorthanded Hawaii race out of So Cal.

The SSS up in the Bay Area obviously holds most of it's races in the Bay where they contend with currents, sporty conditions and light conditions. It's a large, active group and there are a few mini's up there. They hold the SHTP every two years, a great experience if you can commit the time and effort. Others can comment better than I about the racing scene up there.

I'm not aware of a shorthanded group up in Texas. There is the GLSS on the Great Lakes which appears active, and there is a group in the Chesapeake that got going a few years ago. There are clubs that hold a shorthanded race or two during the year as part of their crewed schedule. Here are some links for the groups around the U.S. if you don't have them:

https://www.chbaysss.org/

https://www.solosailors.org/

http://sfbaysss.org/main/

http://www.pssala.com/

Finally, the big Cat 1 shorthanded races around are the Bermuda 1-2, Singlehanded Transpac, Guadalupe Island Race, and the Atlantic Cup. Folks often get a twinkle in their mind's eye to do a big race and embark on a multi-year effort to pull it off.

The specific boat matter less than just getting out there and experiencing and learning. Singlehanders tend not to learn very fast as they are out there on their own, so a group is really helpful to learn from. Early ventures out are often an exercise of what not to do and how you could have been better prepared through the school of hard knocks.

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All you need to experience the massive growth of solo sailing is to go sailing, alone.

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