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Cableless code 0 design

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Random thought for a small sport boat sail - Can a cableless Code 0 sail design be retrieved like an asym kite or is it only furled?

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The one we had on a 28 foot sport boat was a cableless one that was launched and retrieved just liked the asym. However, it was a sail modified to fit our boat, not necessarily a perfect fit.

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Sailmaker at our club just built one for his Elliot 6.5 .  No furler needed  just chuck it out like an A sail and bring it back in the same , his is masthead C04F6A11-8E18-4596-BB36-32678490C062.thumb.jpeg.8d6c759edfcadc2d4f2f9f8e0fc8bb3c.jpeg

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If you’re building it from scratch I’d say put a cable in it.  If you go no cable you’ll never get the luff right enough to fly right.  

Having a cable doesn’t mean you have to have a furler.

On our FT10 we went without the furler just to see if we’d miss it.  Sail handling was fine - though a furler would probably be very nice if we used it more often or didn’t have a regular crew.

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14 hours ago, ctdriver said:

If you’re building it from scratch I’d say put a cable in it.  If you go no cable you’ll never get the luff right enough to fly right.  

Having a cable doesn’t mean you have to have a furler.

On our FT10 we went without the furler just to see if we’d miss it.  Sail handling was fine - though a furler would probably be very nice if we used it more often or didn’t have a regular crew.

A cableless zero would make the sail a hell of a lot easier to handle w/o a furler. 

 

Also, your comment on luff tension with cableless zeros is just blatantly incorrect. 

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Show me a pic of a boat bigger than 30' with a no-cable zero and carrying decent tension.  I've never seen that.

Now, if you're exclusively talking about "small sport boats", at some point I'm sure you could build the luff strong enough to carry the tension, but I don't know how small your toy is.

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1 hour ago, ctdriver said:

Show me a pic of a boat bigger than 30' with a no-cable zero and carrying decent tension.  I've never seen that.

Now, if you're exclusively talking about "small sport boats", at some point I'm sure you could build the luff strong enough to carry the tension, but I don't know how small your toy is.

zero_resized_2.thumb.jpg.dbcfcfabd7d9ea10dc811c42b3306377.jpg

From https://www.doylesails.com/news/product-feature-cable-less-code-zero

 

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Nice - so they're sewing/laminating in the equivalent of a cable - nice progress, looks like my sails are more than a year old...

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Yeah, mine too.

These don't rely on tension.  You ease the halyard slightly and the luff projects a bit to windward.

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17 hours ago, ctdriver said:

Nice - so they're sewing/laminating in the equivalent of a cable - nice progress, looks like my sails are more than a year old...

Not so much, the luffs are actually projecting to windward with the new designs. I used Doyle stratis ice masthead code, flying jt, and staysail. They all had an awesome shape/build. Furling can be more difficult on the code and it often needs someone guiding it in the furl. The other two furl flawlessly. I know Doyle has come out with a super lightweight cable that is just to assist the furl, not take much tension geared towards shorthanded sailors that cant have a bad furl.

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We've used a North Code 0 sans cable on our Viper 830 for the last couple of years.  It's launched and retrieved just like any of our other A-sails.  It's not a sail that we have the opportunity to use much but when it's up, it's a race winner.

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15 minutes ago, Mike Hunt said:

We've used a North Code 0 sans cable on our Viper 830 for the last couple of years.  It's launched and retrieved just like any of our other A-sails.  It's not a sail that we have the opportunity to use much but when it's up, it's a race winner.

Great.  Which North office did you contact?  Do you have any pictures of your code 0 sail up?

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Is it really cable-less if there's a furler and the luff is essentially like a cable?

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yes. 

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Cableless just seems like a good decision these days. As for Furler vs. none... kind of depends. How big the zero is, how many crew you sail with, what your prod setup is... how skilled your crew is...

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1 hour ago, silversailor said:

I’m considering a Code O for my 28’ sport boat. Cable vs cableless? Furler vs no furler? Your thoughts. 

You are mistaken if you believe that Andrews 28 is a "sport boat"

Melges 24, that is 4' shorter LOA and that is significantly faster, is a "sport boat".

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1 hour ago, marcus brutus said:

You are mistaken if you believe that Andrews 28 is a "sport boat"

Melges 24, that is 4' shorter LOA and that is significantly faster, is a "sport boat".

How about answering my question...

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1 hour ago, marcus brutus said:

You are mistaken if you believe that Andrews 28 is a "sport boat"

Melges 24, that is 4' shorter LOA and that is significantly faster, is a "sport boat".

This type of boat is now called a sports boat down here , melges and the like are considered as “performance trailer yachts “ 

12A0D97C-F87D-4B94-B3EE-6FCA0CC8A51E.png

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3 hours ago, silversailor said:

I’m considering a Code O for my 28’ sport boat. Cable vs cableless? Furler vs no furler? Your thoughts. 

I reckon furler , I you think about the angles you sail with it , much tighter than a downwind sail so you don t really want to bugger off downwind at the mark so your crew can wrestle it down easier . 

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4 hours ago, silversailor said:
  6 hours ago, marcus brutus said:

You are mistaken if you believe that Andrews 28 is a "sport boat"

Melges 24, that is 4' shorter LOA and that is significantly faster, is a "sport boat".

 

4 hours ago, silversailor said:

How about answering my question...

 

Better turn on your hearing aid if you want to hear the answer.

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On 4/2/2020 at 12:08 PM, silversailor said:

I’m considering a Code O for my 28’ sport boat. Cable vs cableless? Furler vs no furler? Your thoughts. 

I ordered a North Code 0 with Helix luff for my non-sport boat yet plenty fast Columbia. It's going to be on a Facnor FX2500+ furler, which just arrived. If you're doing any shorthanded sailing, go with the furler. the loads, even in light air, are enough to make a normal takedown dicey especially going upwind. Unless you're really good at letterbox drops single-handed, I think it's the way to go. I'm hoping to get a chance to see the new sail up and working in the next week or two.

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43 minutes ago, ryley said:

I ordered a North Code 0 with Helix luff for my non-sport boat yet plenty fast Columbia. It's going to be on a Facnor FX2500+ furler, which just arrived. If you're doing any shorthanded sailing, go with the furler. the loads, even in light air, are enough to make a normal takedown dicey especially going upwind. Unless you're really good at letterbox drops single-handed, I think it's the way to go. I'm hoping to get a chance to see the new sail up and working in the next week or two.

Thanks Ryley. Some questions (you may want to respond via PM):: 1. Size of your Columbia? 2. Why North?  Did you consider Doyle or Quantum? 3.  Did decide to use a  furler because you shorthand?  4. If you sailed with a crew of 4 or more would you use a furler? 5. Why did you chose the Facnor FX2500+? 

Thanks. Let me know how the new sail and furler are working?

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On 4/2/2020 at 5:08 PM, silversailor said:

I’m considering a Code O for my 28’ sport boat. Cable vs cableless? Furler vs no furler? Your thoughts. 

Others have kind of answered but I would definitely look at a cableless sail mounted on a furler, losing the cable saves weight and cost and it lacks tighter in the bag. I’m not sure the revolutionary gains are better at that size range but the cost saving I’m sure would help. Only drawbacks with the cable free sail is that the sails don’t like to stay hoisted and furled as much as a cabled sail, the head can sometimes want to unfurl a little bit but it’s a very small drawback and considering that you have asked the question about not having a furler it shouldn’t be an issue at all

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