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A guy in the Chesapeake

The US Flag is "racist symbolism" now?

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That's f-ing stupid.  Our nation is imperfect and we have our tragic mistakes, but we cannot cleanse our history in such a way, nor can we overlook the fact that a later version of that flag flew over the army that "liberated" the slaves.  

I support that guy's stand against institutional racism and disparate treatment of black kids from street to morgue.  I recognize that bullshit artists will try to distort his message to say he hates our troops.  All he does with this is give the bullshitters better footing from which to sling bullshit. He might as well say that other people shouldn't stand for the anthem either.  If people want to buy some fine, patriotic Betsy Ross Flag shoes from Nike, made in Bangladesh, let them. 

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Those there are some seriously butt ugly kicks. Whatever reason Nike needed to get them off the shelves works for me. I know sneakerhedz and I'm going to torture them with this. Who designed these hideous things? I'm calling a false flag operation. It couldn't have been done by anyone with any sense of American street style.

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2 minutes ago, Fakenews said:

Why not just a normal US flag that hasn’t been co-opted by racists?

They're talking about the Betsy Ross flag, not the Gadsden Flag, are they not?  

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8 minutes ago, Rat's ass said:

Nike keeps getting their cultural marxist asses handed to them on a plate. They should be ashamed for being such pussies.

On the other hand, the price of these shoes will likely skyrocket if any were sold or made available before the "recall" $-)) 

As a Nike shareholder I can tell you that Nile is doing quite well in their partnership with Kapernick .  Their ass is just fine

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1 minute ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

They're talking about the Betsy Ross flag, not the Gadsden Flag, are they not?  

I think so.  I have no issue with it  but I’ve read where some alt right groups have gloomed on to it

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so a private company cancels a product?  You're outraged about THAT?!?

fucking snowflakes.

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7 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

so a private company cancels a product?  You're outraged about THAT?!?

fucking snowflakes.

Everytime Kaep does something for Nike, some old guys boycott and Nike's sales and stock goes up.  That's pretty outrageous.  BREAK 'EM UP, MONOPOLY, PUBLIC SQUARE!!!!!

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Imagine that a company actually looks at their customers, and makes sure to provide products that they will buy. Imagine!

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20 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Imagine that it's about Nike - and not about people trying to co-opt history to advance their own agenda... Betsy Ross's flag is racist?  Gimme a fuggin' break. 

I think what he is saying is true, inasmuch as our founding fathers owned slaves.  It was our original sin.  It is part of our history, and we cannot get past it by pretending it isn't. Where he goes off track is by ignoring the rest of the history of our flag, specifically the part about the army that ended our original sin and what flag it flew. We were a racist country at the start, we were a racist country during the civil war, and we're a racist country now. There is no period of time where our flag hasn't flown over racism, so his point is rather diluted to the point of saying that we shouldn't put flags on shoes. That's a position with which I might have some sympathy, but not for the same reasons. 

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Just now, Sol Rosenberg said:

I think what he is saying is true, inasmuch as our founding fathers owned slaves.  It was our original sin.  It is part of our history, and we cannot get past it by pretending it isn't. Where he goes off track is by ignoring the rest of the history of our flag, specifically the part about the army that ended our original sin and what flag it flew. We were a racist country at the start, we were a racist country during the civil war, and we're a racist country now. There is no period of time where our flag hasn't flown over racism, so his point is rather diluted to the point of saying that we shouldn't put flags on shoes. That's a position with which I might have some sympathy, but not for the same reasons. 

Thanks Sol - that's kinda my point - we can't move past the things in our history that we want to change by trying to erase any reference to or mention of that past, and there's not an inherent racism in the appreciation of parts of that past. 

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13 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Thanks Sol - that's kinda my point - we can't move past the things in our history that we want to change by trying to erase any reference to or mention of that past, and there's not an inherent racism in the appreciation of parts of that past. 

Someone is erasing something? Really? Where?

It's a product that was never sold! 

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23 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Colin seems to think it's a good idea - IIRC, you do too.  

I don’t care either way. I don’t have a pair of Nikes in my closet cause, guess what? I’m not in their target demographic and don’t  wear their designs. I’d look damn foolish if I did. But your faux outrage is noticed. Why do you continue to try to split America?

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38 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

I don’t care either way. I don’t have a pair of Nikes in my closet cause, guess what? I’m not in their target demographic and don’t  wear their designs. I’d look damn foolish if I did. But your faux outrage is noticed. Why do you continue to try to split America?

If this was about Nike the company, or Nike the shoes, ya might have a point.  It's not, and you're a bit myopic in your perspective, but, hey, that's just you being focused on your chosen adversaries instead of the point.  No worries - you have fun bein' you.   And I'm splitting America. Yeah, OK. 

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If it is true that racist white supremacist shitbags really have coopted the Betsy Ross flag, I see this differently. Those little fuckfaces have already fucked up one great flag for everyone. 

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2 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

If this was about Nike the company, or Nike the shoes, ya might have a point.  It's not, and you're a bit myopic in your perspective, but, hey, that's just you being focused on your chosen adversaries instead of the point.  No worries - you have fun bein' you.   And I'm splitting America. Yeah, OK. 

This is directly about Nike the Company making decisions that benefit their bottom line and stock price.  Apparently, these numbers do not depend at all on the FoxNews zombies and Breitbart readers who boycott them.  I wonder why they'd even let the information out...it couldn't be a stunt for the benefit of the young people who buy their shit, could it?

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2 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

This is directly about Nike the Company making decisions that benefit their bottom line and stock price.  Apparently, these numbers do not depend at all on the FoxNews zombies and Breitbart readers who boycott them.  I wonder why they'd even let the information out...it couldn't be a stunt for the benefit of the young people who buy their shit, could it?

Could be - and if it works for them, good for them.  My point isn't about Nike or what they do or don't do, but, you already knew that. 

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5 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Could be - and if it works for them, good for them.  My point isn't about Nike or what they do or don't do, but, you already knew that. 

Your point, and correct me please if I am wrong, was that this is "about people trying to co-opt history to advance their own agenda."

That's not really a point though.  It's a vague talking point that I read a form of daily in multiple Breitbart articles.

I would like to know more about your point though.  Who is co-opting history and how, and what is his or her agenda?  

 

 

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2 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Your point, and correct me please if I am wrong, was that this is "about people trying to co-opt history to advance their own agenda."

That's not really a point though.  It's a vague talking point that I read a form of daily in multiple Breitbart articles.

 I would like to know more about your point though.  Who is co-opting history and how, and what is his or her agenda?  

Anyone who tries to eradicate every instance of a historical symbol because it existed during a time when something that they don't like was going on.  In this case?  Suggesting that Betsy Ross's flag is racist because it was flying as the symbol of our country when slavery was permitted.   I feel that the agenda for folks who adopt that approach isn't to correct wrongs, but, rather to feel like they accomplished something by causing something historic to be relegated to a negative connotation. 

As I said above, you can't move past the things in our history that we want to change by trying to erase any reference to or mention of that past. 

Tell me how you see it.  

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2 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Everytime Kaep does something for Nike, some old guys boycott and Nike's sales and stock goes up.  That's pretty outrageous.  BREAK 'EM UP, MONOPOLY, PUBLIC SQUARE!!!!!

But nobody's racist.

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18 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Anyone who tries to eradicate every instance of a historical symbol because it existed during a time when something that they don't like was going on.  In this case?  Suggesting that Betsy Ross's flag is racist because it was flying as the symbol of our country when slavery was permitted.   I feel that the agenda for folks who adopt that approach isn't to correct wrongs, but, rather to feel like they accomplished something by causing something historic to be relegated to a negative connotation. 

As I said above, you can't move past the things in our history that we want to change by trying to erase any reference to or mention of that past. 

Tell me how you see it.  

When you say things like "trying to eradicate every instance of a historical symbol because it existed when something they didn't like was going on", you avoid answering questions or committing to a real discussion, because that's not what the link you posted discusses.

I would like to talk about this with you, but I can't until I understand what you are criticizing.  Are you saying that Nike is trying to eradicate history?  Or is it Kaep?  What history do you think they are trying to eradicate?

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, MR.CLEAN said:

When you say things like "trying to eradicate every instance of a historical symbol because it existed when something they didn't like was going on", you avoid answering questions or committing to a real discussion, because that's not what the link you posted discusses.

 I would like to talk about this with you, but I can't until I understand what you are criticizing.  Are you saying that Nike is trying to eradicate history?  Or is it Kaep?  What history do you think they are trying to eradicate?

I think that Kaepernic is manufacturing an issue.  I don't think that the Betsy Ross flag is racist, and I disagree with his premise that displaying any symbol that represented our country when we permitted slavery is racist.    We can't move forward by eradicating history or historical symbolism, we move forward when we understand and accept that we did things wrong, we have improved, and that while there's any discrimination based upon anything beyond a person's own actions, that we have more to do.   

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48 minutes ago, kent_island_sailor said:

I see it as Nike stirring up shit to get free publicity and make more $$$$$.   u

 

crazy, ain't it? Sure seems to work!

 

And A_Guy, it exactly IS about Nike making a business decision, your mumble, mumble trash sentence aside. And they took a hit on inventory. I expect they will see a nice bump in sales this holiday weekend.

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10 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I think that Kaepernic is manufacturing an issue.  I don't think that the Betsy Ross flag is racist, and I disagree with his premise that displaying any symbol that represented our country when we permitted slavery is racist.    We can't move forward by eradicating history or historical symbolism, we move forward when we understand and accept that we did things wrong, we have improved, and that while there's any discrimination based upon anything beyond a person's own actions, that we have more to do.   

Okay, thanks for clarifying. 

I think that Kaepernick has zero motivation to "manufacture an issue" when one already exists.  You may not be tuned in to the controversy over our whitewashed history and the attempt by many to try to bring some reality to the typical US citizen's knowledge of it, so you can be forgiven for thinking it is some kind of 'new issue' rather than an existing one.

 Kaep has been very consistent in protesting against the brutal, genocidal, misogynist, and racist history of our country and attempting to educate the public about it. 

We definitely can't move forward if we fail to acknowledge that our textbooks were full of shit, or that 'old glory' represents all that is good and holy in the US. Kaep told Nike that their marketing move did exactly that, glorifying a flag that flew over the murdered, the raped, the stolen, and the owned, and Nike said 'thanks Kaep, good idea; this is why we hired you.'

Activism + corporate responsibility = a positive result.  To me, the whole thing is an example of how things oughtta work, and how to prevent some of the fashion fuckups of the past few years.

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20 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I think that Kaepernic is manufacturing an issue.  I don't think that the Betsy Ross flag is racist, and I disagree with his premise that displaying any symbol that represented our country when we permitted slavery is racist.    We can't move forward by eradicating history or historical symbolism, we move forward when we understand and accept that we did things wrong, we have improved, and that while there's any discrimination based upon anything beyond a person's own actions, that we have more to do.   

Now there's a strong statement of no intent. Well done. Golf clap.

 

And Kaep, whether you like it or not, seems to have made Nike a boatload of cash based on his read of Nike's core market. I would guess he's closer to that market than either of us. I'd defer to him on what will sell. Or in this case, might keep people out of the stores, or sour them on the brand.

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1 minute ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Okay, thanks for clarifying. 

I think that Kaepernick has zero motivation to "manufacture an issue" when one already exists.  You may not be tuned in to the controversy over our whitewashed history and the attempt by many to try to bring some reality to the typical US citizen's knowledge of it, so you can be forgiven for thinking it is some kind of 'new issue' rather than an existing one.

 Kaep has been very consistent in protesting against the brutal, genocidal, misogynist, and racist history of our country and attempting to educate the public about it. 

We definitely can't move forward if we fail to acknowledge that our textbooks were full of shit, or that 'old glory' represents all that is good and holy in the US. Kaep told Nike that their marketing move did exactly that, glorifying a flag that flew over the murdered, the raped, the stolen, and the owned, and Nike said 'thanks Kaep, good idea; this is why we hired you.'

Activism + corporate responsibility = a positive result.  To me, the whole thing is an example of how things oughtta work, and how to prevent some of the fashion fuckups of the past few years.

Shoot, Nike might see Kaep as the Canary. "Hey man, tell us when we're gonna fuck up, ok?"

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1 hour ago, MR.CLEAN said:

This is directly about Nike the Company making decisions that benefit their bottom line and stock price.  Apparently, these numbers do not depend at all on the FoxNews zombies and Breitbart readers who boycott them.  I wonder why they'd even let the information out...it couldn't be a stunt for the benefit of the young people who buy their shit, could it?

That's bullshit. They went to the trouble and expense to design, develop and produce the product because the market research said it would sell. they pulled it because one crybaby had a problem with it...  

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10 minutes ago, Movable Ballast said:

I like to jerk off to pics of ivanka trump while wearing my MAGA hat

Pardon?

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24 minutes ago, Movable Ballast said:

That's bullshit. They went to the trouble and expense to design, develop and produce the product because the market research said it would sell. they pulled it because one crybaby had a problem with it...  

One crybaby who made them how many millions?

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1 hour ago, Movable Ballast said:

That's bullshit. They went to the trouble and expense to design, develop and produce the product because the market research said it would sell. they pulled it because one crybaby had a problem with it...  

Do you know how many times big consumer branded companies go through that process and said great idea bombs?  Everyday you bozo.

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1 hour ago, Fakenews said:
2 hours ago, Movable Ballast said:

That's bullshit. They went to the trouble and expense to design, develop and produce the product because the market research said it would sell. they pulled it because one crybaby had a problem with it...  

Do you know how many times big consumer branded companies go through that process and said great idea bombs?  Everyday you bozo.

 

Makes me wonder if the Edsel is a racist symbol.......

 

3 hours ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I think that Kaepernic is manufacturing an issue.  I don't think that the Betsy Ross flag is racist, and I disagree with his premise that displaying any symbol that represented our country when we permitted slavery is racist.    We can't move forward by eradicating history or historical symbolism, we move forward when we understand and accept that we did things wrong, we have improved, and that while there's any discrimination based upon anything beyond a person's own actions, that we have more to do.   

 

And some people will be pissed off about it. So, you're a rightie, it's your culture to get mad about stuff that doesn't really affect you. But how does it feel to let Nike and Colin Kaepernick pull your string? Is that just as enjoyable as the endorphin rush from a good Rush rant?

-DSK

 

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I don't care much for flags.

They are symbols, the represent so much. When the flag becomes more important than what it represents, we've lost something.

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Isn’t It disrespectful to wear the flag?  When I think of flag wearers trashy drunk white women (Sarah plain)  in ill advised flag bikinis always comes to mind 

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4 minutes ago, Shootist Jeff said:

You are deliberately and obtusely missing the point, dipschit.  This is not about Nike and what shoes they market or don't.  Its the mindset behind asswipes like kaperfuck that are the problem here.  I don't have a problem with his 'cause".  But I have a problem with people like him trying to erase any image that might be offensive to some segment of the US population and trying to bury our past.  I think its actually counter-productive to the cause he's fighting for.  Partly for the reasons Sol has written about, but also partly (mainly) because it just frankly stifles any possible discussion on the subject of race.  Its more about finger pointing and gotcha than it is about healing and moving past a history that we cannot undo.  In fact, I would say that as a result of this, kaperfuck missed an incredible teachable moment to highlight that flag was partly about our racist past but also about the good things that America stands for and the hope it can bring.  But nope, lets just bury it and find one more way to call all whites racist.  WFD Colin!  There are lots of current and more relevant racist topics to campaign against, and he picked the one that doesn't matter.  

Sadly, irony is the target audience for this Nike shoe likely had a fraction of a fraction of its demographic that even knew what that flag was.  

Kaepernick and Nike aren't trying to bury anything.

If you want to put a particular flag on the back window of your pick up truck, you still can.

Of course, you could use this moment as a teaching moment and do some reading of that particular flag's origin and it's questionable attribution.

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1 hour ago, Shootist Jeff said:

HEY..... Wait a minute sol, I thought our job was to STFU, sit down and listen???  I was unaware that old white guys like you and me were allowed to have an opinion on these matters.  I'm experiencing some cognitive dissonance.  Help me out here.....

I listened to his proposal. As long as the Betsy Ross flag hasn’t been coopted by racist morons like the Gadsden flag has, his ideas are stupid and overreaching. But he makes Nike a lot of money and quite likely just made them more. So they listen to them. 

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The 4th of July is an inherently nostalgic holiday.  Birth of a country!  Nike's oversight is that racists, patriots, and the economically disadvantaged are all playing to that same theme right now.  They're all looking back for a time when things were 'better' - whatever that means to each group.  That doesn't mean those groups agree with one another at all - but its too complicated in sound bite America to separate them.  There are also crossover members - patriotic racists who don't have a job - who can be very vocal.

Minority groups aren't real interested in any nostalgic roots past the civil rights amendment right now - no matter how it's bundled.  Maybe later.  Not today. 

It is profitable to pit the groups against each other though.  Maybe it was Nike's plan?  I tend to doubt it.  I think they just misread the wind.

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Arizona Governor Threatens Nike's Corporate First Amendment Rights

Quote

...the First Amendment generally forbids the government from retaliating against government contractors based on the contractors' protected First Amendment activity (which would include either deciding to release a shoe with a particular flag design, or deciding not to release it);

 

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2 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:

You are deliberately and obtusely missing the point, dipschit.  This is not about Nike and what shoes they market or don't.  Its the mindset behind asswipes like kaperfuck that are the problem here.  I don't have a problem with his 'cause".  But I have a problem with people like him trying to erase any image that might be offensive to some segment of the US population and trying to bury our past.  I think its actually counter-productive to the cause he's fighting for.  Partly for the reasons Sol has written about, but also partly (mainly) because it just frankly stifles any possible discussion on the subject of race.  Its more about finger pointing and gotcha than it is about healing and moving past a history that we cannot undo.  In fact, I would say that as a result of this, kaperfuck missed an incredible teachable moment to highlight that flag was partly about our racist past but also about the good things that America stands for and the hope it can bring.  But nope, lets just bury it and find one more way to call all whites racist.  WFD Colin!  There are lots of current and more relevant racist topics to campaign against, and he picked the one that doesn't matter.  

Sadly, irony is the target audience for this Nike shoe likely had a fraction of a fraction of its demographic that even knew what that flag was.  

I thought you were past race and there's nothing to discuss? Other than to do your usual coded bigotry bullshit like  " a fraction of its demographic that even knew what that flag was."

Anyways it's damn funny that y'all didn't learn the first time around with Kaepernick and Nike. So I'll shout it for you. YOU ARENT THE FUCKING MARKET MORON! OLD DUDES RANTING ESPECIALLY WITH CRYPTOBIGOTRY LIKE YOURS JEFFREAUX IS WHAT NIKE WANTS!

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15 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

Okay, thanks for clarifying. 

I think that Kaepernick has zero motivation to "manufacture an issue" when one already exists.  You may not be tuned in to the controversy over our whitewashed history and the attempt by many to try to bring some reality to the typical US citizen's knowledge of it, so you can be forgiven for thinking it is some kind of 'new issue' rather than an existing one.

 Kaep has been very consistent in protesting against the brutal, genocidal, misogynist, and racist history of our country and attempting to educate the public about it. 

We definitely can't move forward if we fail to acknowledge that our textbooks were full of shit, or that 'old glory' represents all that is good and holy in the US. Kaep told Nike that their marketing move did exactly that, glorifying a flag that flew over the murdered, the raped, the stolen, and the owned, and Nike said 'thanks Kaep, good idea; this is why we hired you.'

Activism + corporate responsibility = a positive result.  To me, the whole thing is an example of how things oughtta work, and how to prevent some of the fashion fuckups of the past few years.

I appreciate that perspective, Clean - and I have no issue w/Kaepernick's advocacy.  Where I think you and I disagree is in thinking that it's necessary to denigrate every historic symbol that existed during any time that our nation did something that was offensive to one group or another.  I think that perspective creates division, as it negates recognition of the good things that were happening at the time.  I'd bet a dollar to donuts Kaep has no problem keeping pictures of slaveowners in his wallet. 

 

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16 hours ago, Raz'r said:

crazy, ain't it? Sure seems to work!

 

And A_Guy, it exactly IS about Nike making a business decision, your mumble, mumble trash sentence aside. And they took a hit on inventory. I expect they will see a nice bump in sales this holiday weekend.

No, Flash - you don't get to tell ME what I'm thinking or saying.   I don't give 2 shits about Nike - I am aggravated over the attempt to suggest that everything that happened, and every symbol from every period in our history when we did things that we've moved beyond is hateful and racist, and with that the suggestion that anyone appreciating our history and symbolism is an intentional racist for doing so.   That's not how we address the real issues that confront us today and work together to move past them.   I know that you get a tingle every time someone bashes the US or our past, but, you ought to remember that that history is what has enabled you to enjoy what you do as a citizen of this country, and perhaps temper your criticism with a bit of appreciation for that. 

 

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20 hours ago, Fakenews said:

Why not just a normal US flag that hasn’t been co-opted by racists?

 Because this is a marketing strategy that relies on creating controversy.

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9 minutes ago, Dog said:

 Because this is a marketing strategy that relies on creating controversy.

Your partisan selective vision is hilarious. Now don't you have some immigrant detention porn to jerk off too?

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4 hours ago, Shootist Jeff said:

You are deliberately and obtusely missing the point, dipschit.  This is not about Nike and what shoes they market or don't.  Its the mindset behind asswipes like kaperfuck that are the problem here.  I don't have a problem with his 'cause".  But I have a problem with people like him trying to erase any image that might be offensive to some segment of the US population and trying to bury our past.  I think its actually counter-productive to the cause he's fighting for.  Partly for the reasons Sol has written about, but also partly (mainly) because it just frankly stifles any possible discussion on the subject of race.  Its more about finger pointing and gotcha than it is about healing and moving past a history that we cannot undo.  In fact, I would say that as a result of this, kaperfuck missed an incredible teachable moment to highlight that flag was partly about our racist past but also about the good things that America stands for and the hope it can bring.  But nope, lets just bury it and find one more way to call all whites racist.  WFD Colin!  There are lots of current and more relevant racist topics to campaign against, and he picked the one that doesn't matter.  

Sadly, irony is the target audience for this Nike shoe likely had a fraction of a fraction of its demographic that even knew what that flag was.  

Actually, this IS about Nike making a product decision. Whoopdefuckingdo.

your faux outrage is noted. And not surprising given your continual loss-of-white-privilege  butthurt.

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1 hour ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I appreciate that perspective, Clean - and I have no issue w/Kaepernick's advocacy.  Where I think you and I disagree is in thinking that it's necessary to denigrate every historic symbol that existed during any time that our nation did something that was offensive to one group or another.  I think that perspective creates division, as it negates recognition of the good things that were happening at the time.  I'd bet a dollar to donuts Kaep has no problem keeping pictures of slaveowners in his wallet. 

 

Oh my! Denigration! 

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1 hour ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

 

 

No, Flash - you don't get to tell ME what I'm thinking or saying.   I don't give 2 shits about Nike - I am aggravated over the attempt to suggest that everything that happened, and every symbol from every period in our history when we did things that we've moved beyond is hateful and racist, and with that the suggestion that anyone appreciating our history and symbolism is an intentional racist for doing so.   That's not how we address the real issues that confront us today and work together to move past them.   I know that you get a tingle every time someone bashes the US or our past, but, you ought to remember that that history is what has enabled you to enjoy what you do as a citizen of this country, and perhaps temper your criticism with a bit of appreciation for that. 

 

An ugly flag shoe is a REAL issue? YCMTSU

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1 hour ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

 

 

No, Flash - you don't get to tell ME what I'm thinking or saying.   I don't give 2 shits about Nike - I am aggravated over the attempt to suggest that everything that happened, and every symbol from every period in our history when we did things that we've moved beyond is hateful and racist, and with that the suggestion that anyone appreciating our history and symbolism is an intentional racist for doing so.   That's not how we address the real issues that confront us today and work together to move past them.   I know that you get a tingle every time someone bashes the US or our past, but, you ought to remember that that history is what has enabled you to enjoy what you do as a citizen of this country, and perhaps temper your criticism with a bit of appreciation for that. 

 

It’s a fucking shoe, not the Declaration of Independence.

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1 minute ago, Raz'r said:

It’s a fucking shoe, not the Declaration of Independence.

The issue isn't the shoe or Nike - as much as you keep trying to wrongly suggest that it is.  Deflect, conflate and twist -- why don't you try actually addressing a point once in a while?  I've seen you do it before, so I know you can. 

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Just now, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

The issue isn't the shoe or Nike - as much as you keep trying to wrongly suggest that it is.  Deflect, conflate and twist -- why don't you try actually addressing a point once in a while?  I've seen you do it before, so I know you can. 

Damn, I admit it. You’re right. It’s about outrage. And how to whip up the base. How did I miss that?

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If a company like Nike can be so politically correct but still wants to sell in China where people are repressed even more what does that say? Next will be Nike outfitting the North Korean soccer team.

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11 minutes ago, Rum Runner said:

If a company like Nike can be so politically correct but still wants to sell in China where people are repressed even more what does that say? Next will be Nike outfitting the North Korean soccer team.

This had nothing to do with political correctness.  It had to do with one of their most profitable marketing tools (Kaep) not approving of a shoe.  It's called capitalism.  Suddenly all the Rightwing fuckwits hate it when businesses make business decisions.

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1 hour ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

So are white supremacists really using the Betsy Ross flag as their own, now?  

Only thing I saw was some guys in the Midwest carrying both the confederate and the original at some protest. So I’d say “nope”

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1 hour ago, Swimsailor said:

This had nothing to do with political correctness.  It had to do with one of their most profitable marketing tools (Kaep) not approving of a shoe.  It's called capitalism.  Suddenly all the Rightwing fuckwits hate it when businesses make business decisions.

The shoes are now selling at $2500 a pair.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nike-betsy-ross-flag-sneakers-selling-for-more-than-2000-on-stockx/

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29 minutes ago, Rat's ass said:

That settles it! The Betsy Ross flag is racist. Dept of veteran affairs is racist. America is racist. Ivanka is a NAZI. 

Well, the Ross flag isn't racist (we have all pretty much agreed, so not sure what you're crying about still).  Dept of Vet Affairs isn't racists.  But much of America is racist.  And while Ivanka isn't a Nazi, she is an over-privileged, under qualified, out of place twit that has no legitimate business being in the WH other than to serve as some sick form of arm candy for daddy.

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12 minutes ago, Swimsailor said:

Well, the Ross flag isn't racist (we have all pretty much agreed, so not sure what you're crying about still).  Dept of Vet Affairs isn't racists.  But much of America is racist.  And while Ivanka isn't a Nazi, she is an over-privileged, under qualified, out of place twit that has no legitimate business being in the WH other than to serve as some sick form of arm candy for daddy.

So if we agree that the Betsy Ross flag isn't racist - then doesn't it stand to reason that Kaepernick's issue is a bit of a stretch in this case?  

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1 minute ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

So if we agree that the Betsy Ross flag isn't racist - then doesn't it stand to reason that Kaepernick's issue is a bit of a stretch in this case?  

Um, no. Kaep is a product consultant, he gave a recommendation. Why do you hate capitalism so much?

This reminds me of the bathroom nontroversy.  Hmm, I like that word. 

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4 minutes ago, Raz'r said:

Um, no. Kaep is a product consultant, he gave a recommendation. Why do you hate capitalism so much?

This reminds me of the bathroom nontroversy.  Hmm, I like that word. 

I'm certain that it does - you love to cry foul about nonsense, and pretend that nonsense you like isn't. 

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4 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I'm certain that it does - you love to cry foul about nonsense, and pretend that nonsense you like isn't. 

At least you now agree that it's nonsense.

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9 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

So if we agree that the Betsy Ross flag isn't racist - then doesn't it stand to reason that Kaepernick's issue is a bit of a stretch in this case?  

the last thing that nike wanted to see was these shoes worn by every dickhead nazi wannabe in a tiki torch march.  after kaepernick posted his misconstrued thoughts on the flag, it was almost guaranteed they would.  nike really had no choice but to pull them.  unfortunately, the flag will probably now grow in usage by the assholes.  and I agree, this won't be nike's fault

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5 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Kaepernick raising this as a racist issue in the 1st place?  I've been saying that all along. 

Kaepernick didn't raise an issue. 

Your nontroversy is noted.

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2 minutes ago, hermetic said:

the last thing that nike wanted to see was these shoes worn by every dickhead nazi wannabe in a tiki torch march.  after kaepernick posted his misconstrued thoughts on the flag, it was almost guaranteed they would.  nike really had no choice but to pull them.  unfortunately, the flag will probably now grow in usage by the assholes.  and I agree, this won't be nike's fault

I hadn't considered that the attention would result in the future cultural appropriation of the symbol, thanks for that thought.   

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Just now, Raz'r said:

Kaepernick didn't raise an issue. 

Your nontroversy is noted.

Of course - from the NYT: 
"The abrupt cancellation came after Colin Kaepernick, the former National Football League quarterback and social justice activist, privately criticized the design to Nike, according to a person with knowledge of the interaction." 

I found your Christmas present: 
https://www.amazon.com/Playskool-Classic-Spinning-Activity-Toddlers/dp/B00YTWEMUO/ref=asc_df_B00YTWEMUO/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309813568978&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8758995429716153159&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9007576&hvtargid=pla-524385734788&th=1

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2 minutes ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Of course - from the NYT: 
"The abrupt cancellation came after Colin Kaepernick, the former National Football League quarterback and social justice activist, privately criticized the design to Nike, according to a person with knowledge of the interaction." 

 

 

What does this mean:

"privately criticized the design to Nike"

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This thing was nothing but an advertising ploy form the start in getting ready to boost back to school and fall sports sales..

 

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Well, Ted Cruz is never buying Nike again. That alone should boost some sales.

Thanks Ted!

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4 hours ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

Where I think you and I disagree is in thinking that it's necessary to denigrate every historic symbol that existed during any time that our nation did something that was offensive to one group or another. 

 

You're straw manning.  So far, Kaep asked Nike to recall one run of jingoistic shoes with one historic symbol.  Kaep started a movement to sit during the national anthem.  That's two historic symbols in ten years.  That is all. 

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5 minutes ago, MR.CLEAN said:

You're straw manning.  So far, Kaep asked Nike to recall one run of jingoistic shoes with one historic symbol.  Kaep started a movement to sit during the national anthem.  That's two historic symbols in ten years.  That is all. 

And in the most recent case, it was a leak that caused the nontroversy to happen, at all. 

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1 hour ago, Troglodytarum said:

D50E641D-0863-4161-8404-19C67C1D5677-100

I have a feeling that you Nutjobs don't realize that GW died in 1799. Don't do maths, huh. Must be the snowflake butthurtz.

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The upholsterer sewed that flag in 1777 but math is one of them liberal arts.

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8 minutes ago, d'ranger said:

I have a feeling that you Nutjobs don't realize that GW died in 1799. Don't do maths, huh. Must be the snowflake butthurtz.

Lets hope he multiplies as well as he counts....  

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The Reich actually expects us to stand up and smartly salute the Torture State that disgraces everything decent this country ever represented. 

Not gonna happen. 

End the torture and we can talk about it. 

(Note that your man GW opposes torture) 

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1 hour ago, Movable Ballast said:

interesting... account has been hacked.

It was my post, not yours.

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59 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:
1 hour ago, d'ranger said:

I have a feeling that you Nutjobs don't realize that GW died in 1799. Don't do maths, huh. Must be the snowflake butthurtz.

Lets hope he multiplies as well as he counts....  

Picky, picky...... he was within 15%

-DSK

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9 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Picky, picky...... he was within 15%

-DSK

Likely an acceptable margarine of error. 

edit: i know it's a pathetic pun but thought Trogs needed buttering up.  This message brought to you by al Gebra. 

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11 hours ago, A guy in the Chesapeake said:

I appreciate that perspective, Clean - and I have no issue w/Kaepernick's advocacy.  Where I think you and I disagree is in thinking that it's necessary to denigrate every historic symbol that existed during any time that our nation did something that was offensive to one group or another.  I think that perspective creates division, as it negates recognition of the good things that were happening at the time.  I'd bet a dollar to donuts Kaep has no problem keeping pictures of slaveowners in his wallet. 

 

Ii a it necessary to denigrate every symbol?

No, but it is necessary to point out why some events  that inanimate objects like flag's symbolise were/are offensive.

Then it's up to the individual entity, whether it's a person or some other entity to make a decision on what they do about that offense.

Whether it's withdrawing a product or not giving a fuck is entirely up to the entity.

 

 

As for Kaepernick having pictures of slave owners in his wallet, really?

Is that really the best you can do?

 

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2 hours ago, Troglodytarum said:

article-4448-2.jpg

Who produces these memes?

Does anyone ever ask or do the faithful just suck them up stupidly and share them as if they came from the fairies?

Cost money to pump out the quantity and quality of production that the are.

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