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Trimaran "wings"

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Looking at the design on some Newick (and others) tris, the wings (akas?) are solid.  Others are obviously beams with nets in between, and a range between the two extremes.  What are the advantages (storage?) or disadvantage (windage?) of the two designs?  The netting looks easier to deal with as the solid wings, especially the Newick designs, seem to have a lot of camber to them  although to my eye, Newick's designs just look "right" (yeah, have read the ugly Newick discussion), light and speedy.  Not really interested in the big ole heavy type platform.

In a related question:  Are the solid wing designs more prone to capsize in extreme conditions?  What do single handed sailors do on voyages through squally conditions when they have to nap?  Reduce sail to something capsize proof (resistant)?  I am talking the non professional, cruising type person on a smaller, simple (30 to 40') tri crossing oceans.

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I suspect the wings on early Newicks were more due to structural limitations of the materials of the day. You couldn't make a wood beam stiff or strong enough without it getting too 'chunky'. The wings are big curvy beam and probably pretty aerodynamic compared to 2 beams and some netting.

And of course Dick loved curves and they look very cool. Probably one of the bigger reasons!

For squalls I don't know. These days I would sleep in/close to the cockpit and have a wind speed alarm on an anemometer. And probably reef the main a bit. A jib or reacher on a furler is very fast to roll up or blow the sheets if it is really ugly.

Not much different from me in our cruising cat being inside the saloon on night watch (with no anemometer), listening for the wind rising, feeling the colder air out of the squall - or watching the GPS climb really rapidly! I was a few steps from the cockpit.

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Biggest disadvantage of the solid designs is weight.  The heavier a multihull, the slower it will be.  The akas (beams) tend to be carbon fiber in most modern designs because of stiffness per weight.  

Related to "smaller, simpler (30-40') tri crossing oceans"--I know it has been done, but most in that size range are not intended for ocean crossings.  

Safe cruising single handed in a squall or during naps?  AIS so the container ships don't smack you.  Drogue to hold down speeds; major reefing or all sails down and lie to.  There used to be a video on YouTube showing a trimaran lie'ing to with bare pole and everything below but I sure can't find it again.  Was interesting--mebe you can find it.

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21 minutes ago, Zonker said:

For squalls I don't know. These days I would sleep in/close to the cockpit and have a wind speed alarm on an anemometer. And probably reef the main a bit. A jib or reacher on a furler is very fast to roll up or blow the sheets if it is really ugly.

Not much different from me in our cruising cat being inside the saloon on night watch (with no anemometer), listening for the wind rising, feeling the colder air out of the squall - or watching the GPS climb really rapidly! I was a few steps from the cockpit.

Zonker, you've just nailed the reality of ocean crossing on a multihull--especially in squally tropical conditions but also in general.  There is a heightened degree of alertness required of watch keepers on board multihulls.  ALWAYS in the back of one's mind, there is the awareness that inattention can have a sudden, un-settling, 'upturning' potential consequence.  This same kind of awareness is called generally prudent seamanship on board a monohull but the repercussions are seldom as severe if watchfulness slackens occasionally.

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    I have sailed and raced on both flavors of Newicks, the wing aka and the two beam versions. It is really surprising how much volume the wing aka has and you get a pair of nice comfy double berths right in the middle of the boat where motion is minimised. It is sort of like the inside of a wooden igloo and if finished off nicely it makes for a nice comfy cave.

    The two beam versions have a sidelight and better visibility and light when down below but sometimes you miss the refuge that the wing offers. The wing probably does have less windage and a better stability curve but can be more likely to capsize in extreme winds like a hurricane. A good friend of mine got blown over in a Newick wing design in St Croix in Hurricane Hugo while well up into one of the best Hurricane Holes in the Caribbean, Salt RIver. He had the boat well secured in one of the narrow mangrove creeks with minimal fetch for wave action to build up. However, it doesn't take much of a fetch for 100+ knots winds to kick up a pretty good chop. Funny thing is that the chop seems to only get about 3-4 foot high before the tops just get blasted into spray by the wind. Still it is enough to get a well moored boat to pitching and then a big gust gets under your wings and the boat goes airborne and the next thing you know your transom digs in and you flip over backwards. Terry had just that happen to his boat and he was hunkered down inside freaking out!  The mast had just speared itself into the soft muddy bottom in the shallows and the boat was sort of bow up still catching a lot of wind and the main cabin started to flood. Terry crawled up in what passes for a V berth on a trimaran, really just a single very tapered bunk, to escape the rising water. He had a flashlight and watched as the storm surge slowly flooded the main cabin. He was coming to the conclusion that soon he would have to try and make his way aft and out the companionway as his little bubble of refuge was shrinking. But before he had made that scary commitment to action a next tornado like whirlwind gust somehow got enough of a grip on the tri and flipped it ass over teakettle once again! This snapped the mast off still stuck into the mud and with all the halyards led to the front of the cockpit through deck turning blocks and stoppers and winched on the aft edge of the cabintop, that ripped off much of the wing ama deck/roof! So now he was still in the fwd berth and right side up but looking past the main bulkhead at the main salon completely open to the raging winds and waves. At least he could see out the foredeck hatch into the sky instead of the mud and knew he had an means for escape if it once again came to that. Just when he thought it couldn't get any worse, he heard a big crash against the boat and saw through the hatch a big dark shape fly right overhead and disappear to leeward into the storm. He thought it was a plane crashing but couldn't be sure of anything at that point. 

    A few minutes later he heard a knocking on the hatch overhead and he turned his flashlight on and looked up at the hatch and saw what he thought was a demon scratching to come and claim his soul for the devil. The he saw that there were two blood and mud soaked desperate faces pressed right up again the hatch and realised that it was the crew of a big 60 cat from St Thomas that had sailed over a couple of days earlier to seek refuge there. It had been the big cat that had flipped right over his boat and the two crew were huddled in a tiny podlike deckhouse on the big open beam ex racing cat that was now a popular daysailing cat at the big resorts. Terry pointed his flashlight aft into what had been his cabin to show them the way to get to relative safety because he didn't want to take a chance opening the overhead deck hatch to the forepeak. The 2 guys came crawling in and squeezed into the already cramped space with Terry and they told how they were riding things out as well as could be expected in the minimal deck pod confident that the limited amount of hard decking on the mostly trampoline and net are between the hulls of the cat would be their salvation. Then with no warning that cat flipped and hit the water and flipped again and somewhere along the way the deck pod just disintegrated and they landed in the mangroves and mud. Terry had been anxiously flipping on his flashlight periodically to see if the waters were still rising and they had barely seen his light and crawled over in hopes of finding some shelter. Terry's forepeak wasn't much but they all three survived that night of hell bruised and scratched up with a hell of a story to tell.

    About 60 miles to the NW and a couple of hours later, I had my own trimaran hurricane experience from Hugo and I will try and find an old post in which I told my tale of terror.

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I've posted this here before but another Newick tri was in Salt River that night and wrote a book about itf. His working title was 'The Night the Boats Flew'. He gave me a copy of his manuscript to read and review for him so I remember it by that name but I have to go find the published name.

 

Heart of the Storm - The night the boats flew

 

http://www.dreameagles.info/HOS/

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5 hours ago, Rasputin22 said:

    I have sailed and raced on both flavors of Newicks, the wing aka and the two beam versions. It is really surprising how much volume the wing aka has and you get a pair of nice comfy double berths right in the middle of the boat where motion is minimised. It is sort of like the inside of a wooden igloo and if finished off nicely it makes for a nice comfy cave.

    The two beam versions have a sidelight and better visibility and light when down below but sometimes you miss the refuge that the wing offers. The wing probably does have less windage and a better stability curve but can be more likely to capsize in extreme winds like a hurricane. A good friend of mine got blown over in a Newick wing design in St Croix in Hurricane Hugo while well up into one of the best Hurricane Holes in the Caribbean, Salt RIver. He had the boat well secured in one of the narrow mangrove creeks with minimal fetch for wave action to build up. However, it doesn't take much of a fetch for 100+ knots winds to kick up a pretty good chop. Funny thing is that the chop seems to only get about 3-4 foot high before the tops just get blasted into spray by the wind. Still it is enough to get a well moored boat to pitching and then a big gust gets under your wings and the boat goes airborne and the next thing you know your transom digs in and you flip over backwards. Terry had just that happen to his boat and he was hunkered down inside freaking out!  The mast had just speared itself into the soft muddy bottom in the shallows and the boat was sort of bow up still catching a lot of wind and the main cabin started to flood. Terry crawled up in what passes for a V berth on a trimaran, really just a single very tapered bunk, to escape the rising water. He had a flashlight and watched as the storm surge slowly flooded the main cabin. He was coming to the conclusion that soon he would have to try and make his way aft and out the companionway as his little bubble of refuge was shrinking. But before he had made that scary commitment to action a next tornado like whirlwind gust somehow got enough of a grip on the tri and flipped it ass over teakettle once again! This snapped the mast off still stuck into the mud and with all the halyards led to the front of the cockpit through deck turning blocks and stoppers and winched on the aft edge of the cabintop, that ripped off much of the wing ama deck/roof! So now he was still in the fwd berth and right side up but looking past the main bulkhead at the main salon completely open to the raging winds and waves. At least he could see out the foredeck hatch into the sky instead of the mud and knew he had an means for escape if it once again came to that. Just when he thought it couldn't get any worse, he heard a big crash against the boat and saw through the hatch a big dark shape fly right overhead and disappear to leeward into the storm. He thought it was a plane crashing but couldn't be sure of anything at that point. 

    A few minutes later he heard a knocking on the hatch overhead and he turned his flashlight on and looked up at the hatch and saw what he thought was a demon scratching to come and claim his soul for the devil. The he saw that there were two blood and mud soaked desperate faces pressed right up again the hatch and realised that it was the crew of a big 60 cat from St Thomas that had sailed over a couple of days earlier to seek refuge there. It had been the big cat that had flipped right over his boat and the two crew were huddled in a tiny podlike deckhouse on the big open beam ex racing cat that was now a popular daysailing cat at the big resorts. Terry pointed his flashlight aft into what had been his cabin to show them the way to get to relative safety because he didn't want to take a chance opening the overhead deck hatch to the forepeak. The 2 guys came crawling in and squeezed into the already cramped space with Terry and they told how they were riding things out as well as could be expected in the minimal deck pod confident that the limited amount of hard decking on the mostly trampoline and net are between the hulls of the cat would be their salvation. Then with no warning that cat flipped and hit the water and flipped again and somewhere along the way the deck pod just disintegrated and they landed in the mangroves and mud. Terry had been anxiously flipping on his flashlight periodically to see if the waters were still rising and they had barely seen his light and crawled over in hopes of finding some shelter. Terry's forepeak wasn't much but they all three survived that night of hell bruised and scratched up with a hell of a story to tell.

    About 60 miles to the NW and a couple of hours later, I had my own trimaran hurricane experience from Hugo and I will try and find an old post in which I told my tale of terror.

Looking forward to hearing your experience!

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Jack Petith, Heart of the storm, the night the boats flew, is a great read available as an e book. Thats one serious cyclone/hurricane i am glad to have missed!

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Rasputin22, that was....ummm….scary!  Good to read the people made it through OK.  Thanks for the information and answering stupid questions from someone who has only been on a couple of tris, briefly  Both had the tramps between beam.  The boat I was asking about is a Newick Echo II, professionally built of glass and foam.  It does have the solid wings.

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18 hours ago, Rasputin22 said:

    I have sailed and raced on both flavors of Newicks, the wing aka and the two beam versions. It is really surprising how much volume the wing aka has and you get a pair of nice comfy double berths right in the middle of the boat where motion is minimised. It is sort of like the inside of a wooden igloo and if finished off nicely it makes for a nice comfy cave.

    The two beam versions have a sidelight and better visibility and light when down below but sometimes you miss the refuge that the wing offers. The wing probably does have less windage and a better stability curve but can be more likely to capsize in extreme winds like a hurricane. A good friend of mine got blown over in a Newick wing design in St Croix in Hurricane Hugo while well up into one of the best Hurricane Holes in the Caribbean, Salt RIver. He had the boat well secured in one of the narrow mangrove creeks with minimal fetch for wave action to build up. However, it doesn't take much of a fetch for 100+ knots winds to kick up a pretty good chop. Funny thing is that the chop seems to only get about 3-4 foot high before the tops just get blasted into spray by the wind. Still it is enough to get a well moored boat to pitching and then a big gust gets under your wings and the boat goes airborne and the next thing you know your transom digs in and you flip over backwards. Terry had just that happen to his boat and he was hunkered down inside freaking out!  The mast had just speared itself into the soft muddy bottom in the shallows and the boat was sort of bow up still catching a lot of wind and the main cabin started to flood. Terry crawled up in what passes for a V berth on a trimaran, really just a single very tapered bunk, to escape the rising water. He had a flashlight and watched as the storm surge slowly flooded the main cabin. He was coming to the conclusion that soon he would have to try and make his way aft and out the companionway as his little bubble of refuge was shrinking. But before he had made that scary commitment to action a next tornado like whirlwind gust somehow got enough of a grip on the tri and flipped it ass over teakettle once again! This snapped the mast off still stuck into the mud and with all the halyards led to the front of the cockpit through deck turning blocks and stoppers and winched on the aft edge of the cabintop, that ripped off much of the wing ama deck/roof! So now he was still in the fwd berth and right side up but looking past the main bulkhead at the main salon completely open to the raging winds and waves. At least he could see out the foredeck hatch into the sky instead of the mud and knew he had an means for escape if it once again came to that. Just when he thought it couldn't get any worse, he heard a big crash against the boat and saw through the hatch a big dark shape fly right overhead and disappear to leeward into the storm. He thought it was a plane crashing but couldn't be sure of anything at that point. 

    A few minutes later he heard a knocking on the hatch overhead and he turned his flashlight on and looked up at the hatch and saw what he thought was a demon scratching to come and claim his soul for the devil. The he saw that there were two blood and mud soaked desperate faces pressed right up again the hatch and realised that it was the crew of a big 60 cat from St Thomas that had sailed over a couple of days earlier to seek refuge there. It had been the big cat that had flipped right over his boat and the two crew were huddled in a tiny podlike deckhouse on the big open beam ex racing cat that was now a popular daysailing cat at the big resorts. Terry pointed his flashlight aft into what had been his cabin to show them the way to get to relative safety because he didn't want to take a chance opening the overhead deck hatch to the forepeak. The 2 guys came crawling in and squeezed into the already cramped space with Terry and they told how they were riding things out as well as could be expected in the minimal deck pod confident that the limited amount of hard decking on the mostly trampoline and net are between the hulls of the cat would be their salvation. Then with no warning that cat flipped and hit the water and flipped again and somewhere along the way the deck pod just disintegrated and they landed in the mangroves and mud. Terry had been anxiously flipping on his flashlight periodically to see if the waters were still rising and they had barely seen his light and crawled over in hopes of finding some shelter. Terry's forepeak wasn't much but they all three survived that night of hell bruised and scratched up with a hell of a story to tell.

    About 60 miles to the NW and a couple of hours later, I had my own trimaran hurricane experience from Hugo and I will try and find an old post in which I told my tale of terror.

I used to surf with Terry and for the longest time I wondered if you Rasp were him. He never told me that story though, it’s incredible.

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The wing beams have pluses and minuses, as noted, they do provide a lot of space without a sponson or topside flare, also good racking stiffness and spread out attachment. Access and inspection can be a challenge so for wood it might be spooky over time.

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Ahhh Hurricane Hugo, I still have my "I survived" shirt with that cool 80s neon green and pink swirl.  I was not on a boat, I was with my family in Charleston and remember a tree coming through our garage port.  Dad was in the navy and had to take the ships out to sea and left all the women and children to fend for themselves.  Dad still tells stories of running around welding lathes and other big equipment to the steel decks as they broke loose during the storm.   

Back to the tris.  If it was a foldable tri would it be better to fold the floats on a mooring or always better to just get it out of the water?  

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The trimaran Bucks Fizz was a solid wing deck Newick, it was lost in the '79 Fastnet Race, all 4 crew members died. So 4 of the 19 crew lost in that race were from one trimaran (I think it was the only multihull competing). The skipper Richard Pendred had RORC permission to sail in the race though the RORC position in reporting the race casualties was less than clear. Whether any smallish trimaran would have survived the right way up is unknown. Luckily we (Lock Crowther Buccaneer 40) had a major engine problem in the Baltic and failed to make the start line; if we had made it I might not be writing this. Survival in an inverted trimaran of that design vintage was far from a given.

I don't consider any solid wing deck, low float buoyancy, trimaran safe offshore.

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