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44 minutes ago, TheUltimateSockPuppet said:

Let's put this in context:

Throwing chairs at a woman - no conviction

Handbags at 50 paces - short holiday

Calling someone a muppet - life-time ban

Well done sir!  You have condensed 13 plus pages, plus a couple of other threads into three simple (albeit QLD-specific) laws.  Easy to remember, and you can derive all sorts of outcomes from them.

 

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1 hour ago, twistandtape said:

So you're telling me that you're not allowed to punch on with each other but beating women is okay?

RQ and it's members have been well aware of this situation for several months now and nothing has been done and it has never been addressed. 

Apparently there is being a meeting held at the end of the month regarding Hollis but just like everything else at the fucking club the residents of the Ivory Tower are being protected and exonerated for their behaviour.

It always has been and always will be this way unless these pieces of shit are held accountable for their actions. 

 

There is a lot that still care for our club, and hates its reputation getting worse by the day! And all from the last few years and you can count on one hand the major players! But you cant voice an opinion anymore!

 

But a positive, its a good precedent that's now set! If you get in the shit, just say your an RQ member, your now above the law!!!!

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I too refuse to pay for any of Ruperts Rags! Or Fox!

So somebody please flesh out this story a bit

Or pm me

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1 hour ago, TheUltimateSockPuppet said:

Not sure that the club has actually been involved - the article only references the court case and a plea not to be convicted as it would affect standing - personally I think the article itself has had the same effect as a conviction with respect to bringing a club into disrepute.

Mmmmmm, yeah who knows! ;-)

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11 minutes ago, Turkey Slapper said:

Mmmmmm, yeah who knows! ;-)

You can be quite sure the club was involved

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I owned a yacht for 15+ years. I've raced offshore, regattas, pennants, midweek twilights, the whole 9 yards. I've just sold my yacht, it leaves Hobart tonight for pastures new. Frankly, it has become harder and harder to justify putting the boat on the start line, and there are more and more impediments to doing so. There are more yachts in Hobart than there have ever been, but the fleets sizes continue to dwindle. You reap what you sow, I guess.

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2 minutes ago, lydia said:

You can be quite sure the club was involved

Considering the club have been well aware of the situation for several months now. Ot is appalling they have let it get this far without addressing it and have only now decided to consider it because it has become public. 

The club should publically cut all association with Hollis rather than allowing him to publicslly use their name to avoid conviction. 

I'm surprised people are still members of the club considering the fucking calamity of an organisation they truly are. We need to tell them to go and fuck themselves and resign our memberships. 

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26 minutes ago, cosmicsedso said:

I too refuse to pay for any of Ruperts Rags! Or Fox!

So somebody please flesh out this story a bit

Or pm me

Panic over!

I found it on the mythical front page

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RQYS, just cancel his membership forthwith for bringing the club into disrepute for raising any connection with you in his disgusting (and demeaning) appeal.

What a low life Hollis is, that behaviour is never acceptable.

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2 hours ago, DtM said:

RQYS, just cancel his membership forthwith for bringing the club into disrepute for raising any connection with you in his disgusting (and demeaning) appeal.

What a low life Hollis is, that behaviour is never acceptable.

Looks like RQYS have got it right again.

Protest decision...........correct.

Race Entry declined......correct.

Low life flicked..............correct.

Makes one want to join up.

 

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22 minutes ago, MRS OCTOPUS said:

Looks like RQYS have got it right again.

Protest decision...........correct.

Race Entry declined......correct.

Low life flicked..............correct.

Makes one want to join up.

 

Protest Decision: bullshit

Race Entry Declined: more bullshit 

Low Life Flicked: still waiting 

If you genuinely believe RQ is right and they're acting in the best interests on their members you honestly need to take the board members dicks out of your mouth and reevaluate yourself. 

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Jeeeeeeesus twisty, 

That lure wasn't for you.

Can you spit it back out and well see what else swims by.

:)

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Weyalan said:

I owned a yacht for 15+ years. I've raced offshore, regattas, pennants, midweek twilights, the whole 9 yards. I've just sold my yacht, it leaves Hobart tonight for pastures new. Frankly, it has become harder and harder to justify putting the boat on the start line, and there are more and more impediments to doing so. There are more yachts in Hobart than there have ever been, but the fleets sizes continue to dwindle. You reap what you sow, I guess.

No doubt a big relief and a big gap to fill as well?

One suggestion, the Sabre fleet up at Lindisfarne is going really well.  Great boats, a delight to sail.  I'm not being facetious, btw, I've seen this solution work for a number of people and there's more than one ex-keelboat owner in there.  It's almost everything that's good about sailboat racing in an easier package. And, you can walk into a chandlers to buy something and still have change from a $50 (alright, a $100).

Cheers.

 

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5 minutes ago, MRS OCTOPUS said:

Jeeeeeeesus twisty, 

That lure wasn't for you.

Can you spit it back out and well see what else swims by.

:)

 

 

 

I don't give a fuck who your bait was for. 

I'm a pissed off member voicing my opinion about the shitty culture that is RQ. They care more about themselves and how shiney their knobs are rather than focusing on the sailing. I honestly can't understand why people continue to pay 1k a year in membership to be subjected to this fuckery. 

The issue regarding Hollis is still yet to be offically address by the club and that is just disgusting. The club has had a long history of covering up the abuse by it's senior members and it is time to call them out on it. It is time to hold people accountable, time for the victims to be heard. 

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9 minutes ago, twistandtape said:

I don't give a fuck who your bait was for. 

I'm a pissed off member voicing my opinion about the shitty culture that is RQ. They care more about themselves and how shiney their knobs are rather than focusing on the sailing. I honestly can't understand why people continue to pay 1k a year in membership to be subjected to this fuckery. 

The issue regarding Hollis is still yet to be offically address by the club and that is just disgusting. The club has had a long history of covering up the abuse by it's senior members and it is time to call them out on it. It is time to hold people accountable, time for the victims to be heard. 

Thank you Twist. For reinforcing my belief in that integrity is still important to some.

Cheers,

SB

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49 minutes ago, twistandtape said:

I don't give a fuck who your bait was for. 

I'm a pissed off member voicing my opinion about the shitty culture that is RQ. They care more about themselves and how shiney their knobs are rather than focusing on the sailing. I honestly can't understand why people continue to pay 1k a year in membership to be subjected to this fuckery. 

The issue regarding Hollis is still yet to be offically address by the club and that is just disgusting. The club has had a long history of covering up the abuse by it's senior members and it is time to call them out on it. It is time to hold people accountable, time for the victims to be heard. 

They own marina berth leases which times past paid good money for but now they can't sell as there is no market for them because of the bullshit so have to keep the membership up or lose the lease

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5 hours ago, twistandtape said:

It's okay. I can hit a person being restrained and only get good behaviour as long as I give Barry some cuddles afterwards.

You forgot to add that if you the person holding down the person being hit you get off free.

And the person getting held down and hit gets probation.

Obviously he used his face to hurt someone hands.

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It sounds like we need to remind RQYS that they are a disgrace at any opportunity we can

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1 hour ago, twistandtape said:

I don't give a fuck who your bait was for. 

I'm a pissed off member voicing my opinion about the shitty culture that is RQ. They care more about themselves and how shiney their knobs are rather than focusing on the sailing. I honestly can't understand why people continue to pay 1k a year in membership to be subjected to this fuckery. 

The issue regarding Hollis is still yet to be offically address by the club and that is just disgusting. The club has had a long history of covering up the abuse by it's senior members and it is time to call them out on it. It is time to hold people accountable, time for the victims to be heard. 

Hear fucking hear.

In the last few years the management has pissed off the berth owners, caused one the best sailing coaches in the country to leave, and ditto one of the best yachting instructors.

Is it too much to ask for our several thousands of dollars per year in membership and other fees that the hierarchy behave like grownups?

And frankly Lydia, if your bloke doesn’t want to get punched then maybe he shouldn’t start fights. 

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3 hours ago, MRS OCTOPUS said:

Looks like RQYS have got it right again.

Protest decision...........correct.

Race Entry declined......correct.

Low life flicked..............correct.

Makes one want to join up.

 

One thing about smug cunts

They usually get their comeuppance.  Sometimes it takes a while

 

You should think about that

 

 

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1 hour ago, greasy al said:

Hear fucking hear.

In the last few years the management has pissed off the berth owners, caused one the best sailing coaches in the country to leave, and ditto one of the best yachting instructors.

Is it too much to ask for our several thousands of dollars per year in membership and other fees that the hierarchy behave like grownups?

And frankly Lydia, if your bloke doesn’t want to get punched then maybe he shouldn’t start fights. 

No my bloke, I was talking about the Etchell sailor bloke.

 

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5 hours ago, Weyalan said:

I owned a yacht for 15+ years. I've raced offshore, regattas, pennants, midweek twilights, the whole 9 yards. I've just sold my yacht, it leaves Hobart tonight for pastures new. Frankly, it has become harder and harder to justify putting the boat on the start line, and there are more and more impediments to doing so. There are more yachts in Hobart than there have ever been, but the fleets sizes continue to dwindle. You reap what you sow, I guess.

I've mentioned before that as far as I'm concerned you racing guys live in a bubble that people like me happily ignore. At least until you think you've stand-on status simply by virtue of racing anyway.

As you say, lots of yachts in & around Hobart. The owners just don't want to have anything to do with your racing club culture.

I was asked today by a bloke about crewing on a casual basis to get some experience. I tried to explain the 'Sailpass' thing to him - his eyes glazed over. Doubt you'll see him down at one of the clubs asking for a crew slot any time soon.

FKT

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Here’s a simple exercise for AS and clubs.... (for AS works best if done over a geographic area rather than just a single club)

1. walk down a marina (AS this means you have to actually need to leave the office)

2. count the number of yachts (AS these are the funny looking ones with stick things pointing to the sky)

3. check out the race results online (AS do this for all clubs in the area)

4. count the number of entries (AS if you scroll to the bottom the generally give you a figure so you won’t need to take your shoes off if there’s more than ten)

5. divide answer at 2 by answer at 4 (use a calculator)

6. Open mouth and look shocked when you realise that way less than 10% of yachts actually race

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2 hours ago, TheUltimateSockPuppet said:

Here’s a simple exercise for AS and clubs.... (for AS works best if done over a geographic area rather than just a single club)

1. walk down a marina (AS this means you have to actually need to leave the office)

2. count the number of yachts (AS these are the funny looking ones with stick things pointing to the sky)

3. check out the race results online (AS do this for all clubs in the area)

4. count the number of entries (AS if you scroll to the bottom the generally give you a figure so you won’t need to take your shoes off if there’s more than ten)

5. divide answer at 2 by answer at 4 (use a calculator)

6. Open mouth and look shocked when you realise that way less than 10% of yachts actually race

Come on - way less than 10% of the yachts on moorings out the front of my house go anywhere for maybe 11 months of the year.

FKT

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2 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Come on - way less than 10% of the yachts on moorings out the front of my house go anywhere for maybe 11 months of the year.

FKT

Hey FKT stop injecting rationale into this.

The angry mob don't want facts.

PS

Can some one actually explain why the Catherine Mary (stb tacker) should not have been flicked.

As stand-on vessel she was obligated to, well .....how you say...... STAND ON.

This was all discussed in the now deleted thread (deleted cause it didn't go as the OP planned)

 

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Just now, MRS OCTOPUS said:

Hey FKT stop injecting rationale into this.

The angry mob don't want facts.

PS

Can some one actually explain why the Catherine Mary (stb tacker) should not have been flicked.

As stand-on vessel she was obligated to well .....how you say...... STAND ON.

This was all discussed in the now deleted thread (deleted cause it didn't go os the OP planned)

 

I don't give a fuck about sailboat racing so it's all entertainment to me.

Well, one caveat - I fully approve of sailboat racing provided that everyone puts their expensive toys away at the end of the race & finds something else to do in their other free time. It means the anchorages I like using are less populated (I can't honestly bring myself to use the word 'crowded' down here....)

FKT

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5 hours ago, wal' said:

One thing about smug cunts

They usually get their comeuppance.  Sometimes it takes a while

 

You should think about that

 

 

Smug Cunts?

Who the fuck are we talking about now?

How many?

Is the mythical UBER Driver one?

WTF 

Stop talking in riddles.

 

 

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so there has been a court case hence its all in the public domain so what was the fight about?

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And ya wonder why the sport is fucked.....AS have precisely no interest...that's a close approximation to zero interest...in anything that's not Lympix focussed. They occasionally cast a distracted eye over the megabuck fleet...but really, if your club doesn't have a lympix pathways program, their interest and consequent contribution to you and your local club is....fuck all.....beyond using your data...participation numbers ..to justify their latest grab for govt cash....that goes straight back to their own interests...Lympix programs and trough snuffling.

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3 hours ago, MRS OCTOPUS said:

Hey FKT stop injecting rationale into this.

The angry mob don't want facts.

PS

Can some one actually explain why the Catherine Mary (stb tacker) should not have been flicked.

As stand-on vessel she was obligated to, well .....how you say...... STAND ON.

This was all discussed in the now deleted thread (deleted cause it didn't go as the OP planned)

 

Because if the actual witnessed extras were added, the mid week social race existence could be in jepodary! And there lyes why lips are sealed!

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1 hour ago, duncan (the other one) said:

I'll just leave this here:

https://www.queenslandjudgments.com.au/case/id/343587

R v Hollis [2020] QCA 7

 

Oh my fucking god. In summary. Rich cunt assaults woman. Rich cunt gets fined $5000 and has conviction recorded. Rich cunt realises that conviction might get him thrown out of exclusive yacht club. Rich cunt appeals on the basis of, "I'll pay the chicken feed $5K, just don't record the conviction, oh, and by the way, that woman I beat up was a slut."

All because he didn't want to be kicked out of the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron?

Groucho Marx said two things about clubs.

1. I wouldn't join any club that would have me as a member.

2. I've a good mind to join a club and hit you over the head with it.

In summary, no right thinking person should remain a member of that club.

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Now back to our usual program. GRS is talking up the benefits of Sail Pass on his Facebook page. Gremlins with my crap tablet won't let me post it here. Seems like the RYCT employee involved in the recent AS IRC Championships let down is attacking a former director of his own club on the issue.

Professionalism.

That's why I recommend you send your children to state schools.

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45 minutes ago, (p)Irate said:

Now back to our usual program. GRS is talking up the benefits of Sail Pass on his Facebook page. Gremlins with my crap tablet won't let me post it here. Seems like the RYCT employee involved in the recent AS IRC Championships let down is attacking a former director of his own club on the issue.

Professionalism.

That's why I recommend you send your children to state schools.

If you like fact checking, check this out.
https://www.sailing.org.au/news/faq-changes-to-rule-46/

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Comments
 
  • Darren Drew
    Darren Drew So why bother making it just a little bit harder to get casual crew at the last minute when others drop out? I’m wondering if the rule makers actually own racing yachts that aren’t at the top level of racing
    5
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  • Ben Taylor
    Ben Taylor Seems a good way to push people away from the sport.
    3
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  • Peter Sherwood
    Peter Sherwood Or I could quit my club and just get a sail pass for those 4 or 5 days a year that I sail.
    3
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  • JeanJacques Manier
    JeanJacques Manier This painting is at Sidney now since 30 years and friends , sailing in Australia us great

    Thank you
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    1
  • Jason Ruckert
    Jason Ruckert I cant afford the lawyers fees anyway so im out!
    1
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  • Alex McMillan
    Alex McMillan Club memberships just went down the drain ill save 600 a year now 
    Hide or report this
    • John Graham
      John Graham It's not supposed to work that way.........
      Hide or report this
    • Alex McMillan
      Alex McMillan John Graham its going too 
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Alex McMillan - an unintended side effect - but I reckon you are right, Why pay $600 a year to do what you can for $100 or less.
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    • Alex McMillan
      Alex McMillan John Graham yep ! Unless you are dinghy or otb every weekend
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Just checked a few clubs. Couldn't get into all of them. I did find I could sign up for a Sailpass at one club for free up to 20 days of a year. That would cover most of a season of club racing. So why pay $600 for something you can get for nothing. Crewing on a dinghy that races less than 20 times a year - very common.
      Hide or report this
    • Jason Ruckert
      Jason Ruckert Hi John, remember me, let's catch up!
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    • Carmen Barney
      Carmen Barney I'm still not convinced that this is a step in the right direction
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  • John Graham
    John Graham Glen Stanaway - Question - is a Sailpass issued for say 10 selected days at one yacht cub valid at other clubs on those selected days? Or is that something that never occured to you? One club I looked at required a photo - can't see that happening from the cockpit just before a race.
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  • Barrie McIndoe
    Barrie McIndoe Hey Glenn, correct me if I am wrong. Aus Sailing have only advised clubs that they need to ensure 46 is complied with if they want to ensure they have their but covered. Aus Sailing have also facilitated a product called Sailpass that gives clubs an option to allow temporary memberships. It is totally up to clubs as to whether they use this option and what conditions they place on it.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Barrie McIndoe 99% correct. Not only "but covered"... also about a greater effort to build clubs' membership.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Barrie McIndoe - The main reason for this will be to inflate the numbers of AS affiliated members. The safety thing is just a smokescreen - UNLESS they plan to make it compulsory for a boat to lodge a crew list before each race including WAGS & twilight races. Remember that ALL boats are required to have liability insurance to be able to race (that is outside of the AS members insurance scheme)
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    • Barrie McIndoe
      Barrie McIndoe John Graham . Due diligence by clubs would suggest that they know who is on the water and with whom
      1
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Barrie McIndoe - NO way. Except for ocean races.
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    • Barrie McIndoe
      Barrie McIndoe John Graham it is and always has been at our little volunteer run club
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Barrie McIndoe - That would be a very unique club then. No club I have ever raced at or officiated at has EVER required a boat to lodge a crew list before each race - except for ocean races. Occasionally at a national champs a crew list might be required to ensure all crew are members of the class association. That will be a class association issue - not a club or AS matter.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Barrie, don't worry about it. We know the PDYC is on point.
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    • Barrie McIndoe
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    • Mark Graveson
      Mark Graveson John Graham our Club sailing Historical 10ft Skiffs on the Brisbane River requires everyone heading onto the water to sign on and off - sailing crew and rescue boat crews. It's not hard.
      1
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    • Barrie McIndoe
      Barrie McIndoe Exactly
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Mark Graveson - and how many historical 10 footers are there? I can tell you that is an exception to the rule. How do you think that would work at say CYCA on a good day for WAGS - maybe 25/30 boats with 10 - 15+ crew. NOT GUNNA HAPPEN.
      Hide or report this
    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John, there's probably no convincing you, no matter what we showed you who who expresses support. Thanks for your views, we get it.
      1
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    • John Graham
      John Graham I'm convinced that this new approach will damage the sport. It's already suffering at grass roots level. Why make it worse - and I'm obviously not on my own.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Good night John.
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    • Barrie McIndoe
      Barrie McIndoe https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j...
      Good night John, good luck in the dark ages
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    • Markus Markarkus
      Markus Markarkus I probably said enough before but It's old white toxic males that damage the sport not this change. Build a bridge
      1
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  • John Graham
    John Graham Have checked about a dozen clubs Sailpass set-up. My first 6 attempts with BRYC the system did not work. (women only category available), Tried other clubs & found a variety of Sailpass set ups from 20 passes per year - free, 10 passes free. 3 - 5 - 1See more
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John, great to see you've found many clubs using it in a variety of ways. Good on'em.
      Hide or report this
  • Aaron Adam Goldwater
    Aaron Adam Goldwater I am over all this negativity.
    1
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  • JeanJacques Manier
    JeanJacques Manier I know Australian man and girl some one are great and wonderful that could or not fare away in dangerous or peaceful places
    JJM
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  • John Graham
    Hide or report this
    Image may contain: sky and outdoor, possible text that says 'AS? No problems'
     
     
  • Gavin Adamson
    Gavin Adamson The nature of the sport is distributed, it always has been and always will be. Clubs perusing membership is a critical part of it. However owners are the central and most important element to the sailing relationship. The aim of owners is to get enoughSee more
    2
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway What penalty has been mentioned? Further, I think its entirely reasonable a club expect owners to direct sailors toward club membership. You'll find the three big Hobart clubs providing flexible opitions to embrace those new members. And Im sure, given your prominent role in this community, those three clubs are looking forward to your support.
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    • Gavin Adamson
      Gavin Adamson Glen Stanaway you’re response is inappropriate. You are trying to guilt/bully me on a public forum into supporting a flawed system. This was already done to me in the past by you.

      I don’t agree with what AS is doing. I don’t agree with the way they ha
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      3
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    • Alice Grubb
      Alice Grubb Gavin Adamson The key point here is that owners are no longer invited to make useful suggestions in relation to sailing - rules, racing formats or encouraging membership/ new sailors.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Gavin Adamson - You are wasting your time mate. AS will take NO notice of anybody that doesn’t support their decisions, and there is nothing you or I can do about it.
      NOBODY in AS was elected by the affiliated members so what we think is irrelevant. W
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Gavin, you commented on the post and I responded. And, I'm sincerely confident they look forward to your support.
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    • Gavin Adamson
      Gavin Adamson Glen Stanaway my two clubs and AS have never sort my engagement on the matter so your confidence is unfounded.
      1
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    • Nick Hutton
      Nick Hutton Gavin Adamson is this the Gavin who was a Director of a major yacht club for several years, a member of the Sailing Committee of the same club for years and a committee member of Yachting Tasmania? Sounds like your engagement has been thoroughly sought! Being involved and getting your own way are not always the same thing.
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    • Steve ThePirate
      Steve ThePirate Nick Hutton is this the Nick Hutton who is actually a current EMPLOYEE of said same yacht club of which Gavin Adamson was an unpaid Board Member and Director and therefore one of your former EMPLOYERS? Arguably as a member of the club he still is one oSee more
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    • Gavin Adamson
      Gavin Adamson Clever clever witty Nick Hutton could not resist could you?

      Thought you got me there with your sharp retort.
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  • Brian Case
    Brian Case Can anyone tell me of a sport where you can compete in/ participate in where you don’t need to first register? Go in a fun run, you need to register, play golf, a tennis game, snow boarding, you gotta register first.
    I don’t think it’s a massive burden
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - So do you want every boat sailing in every race, Twilight, WAGS, etc to lodge a crew list every day? That will go down well. - - - "Insurance will require it, rules will require it i I’m dam sure the Coroner will require it. '
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John, we know your views and I don't think they'll be changing any time soon. You need not add any more comments.
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham obviously I’d prefer not as its something else I need to remember but I see the reasons and logic behind it and just accept it. The argument that it will make it more difficult to get crew certainly doesn’t cut it with me as that just comesSee more
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Glen Stanaway - Is this an attempt to censor me? I am entitled to my view AND to express is. AS does not yet own or control Facebook.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - I know (first hand) very well your clubs view of outsiders visiting the club so I would expect you would support that view. In spite of Glen's portrayal of my view it is NOT that I'm saying people should be allowed to race willy nilly withSee more
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway No its not censorship at all John, youve had quite the free reign to comment as you think fit and comment you have. I just dont see much value in continually repeating the same stuff ad nauseam. We understand that you don't like it.
      2
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Glen Stanaway - in other words you want me to "shut up and go away". You provoke me to more comment. I'm NOT going away so just accept it!
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham what the hell is WAGS?
      1
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - I thought everyone knew that - Wednesday Afternoon Gentlemens Sailing. Usually no spinnakers involved. Not necessarily limited to wednesdays.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Glen Stanaway - Why don't you start a new AS thread - "In the spirit of the Sailpass and the argument that clubs know who is on the water during races, we want to sound out peoples view that every boat lodge a crew list for every race including WAGS & Twilight racing". See what the response is.
      1
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham ffs, you guys spend more time dreaming up acronyms than it takes to register a crew for a race! “Gentlemen’s sailing”? That’s good for the sport??
      So John, let me get this right, you’re happy for Clubs to run races and owners to take out no
      See more
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - what a load of bullshit. Totally misrepresenting what I'm on about. You have NO idea of what I have done in my sailing life - longer than you have been on this earth yet you write such crap as that. FYI I had no idea what WAGS was when I first came across it many years ago. I did not find it necessary to put shit on people who do those races.PM coming.
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham i couldn’t give two hoots about what you’ve done or what you think you’ve done, I’m merely responding to your antics on this topic.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - Typical of what I would expect from a member of an exclusive Royal club. RGYC is renowned for that. Arrogance! and a superiority complex.
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham wow! You seem to be happy dishing out your diatribe but you don’t like to be challenged do you, go to water real quick. Anyway, back to your wags. Your welcome.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - FYI (thats - for your information" for you) I've only ever done one WAGS - at WSC about 20 years ago. You really are an obnoxious, arrogant arsehole. I feel sorry for your fellow members. Having spent some time there I got to know a few great guys - not arrogant arseholes like you.
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case John Graham oh this is funny! I can see the steam coming out of your ears.
      Everyone calls me that mate, surely a guy like you can do better?
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Brian Case - no steam. Just enjoying jerking your chain. You react predictably.
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    • Drew Hulton-Smith
      Drew Hulton-Smith My son can't play Under 12 soccer without the coach lodging a team sheet with Football Australia affiliation numbers for each player before the match, for all the same reasons that are being cited here. There is a little bit of catching up to be done - a simple online portal accessible and usable through a phone to lodge crew lists - but the principle is sound.
      3
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Drew Hulton-Smith - Soccer clubs own or rent the playing fields. NO yacht club owns or rents the sea.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John Graham or the wind... ipso facto everything in sailing should be free and people can take part in an organised sport anonymously. Seriously.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Glen Stanaway - "everything in sailing should be free and people can take part in an organised sport anonymously." ...... where on earth do you get that stupid idea? I certainly have NEVER advocated that. To suggest that is just plain LIES. I thought you were above that - obviously not.
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    • Aaron Adam Goldwater
      Aaron Adam Goldwater John Graham you are a real whinger aren't you? What Drew Hulton-Smith said is spot on, you just can't play soccer because you feel like it, you write a big cheque.
      2
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Aaron Adam Goldwater - idiot! You can play soccer in a park free. You can't play on sombody elses field without their permission. and that probably requires a payment to somebody.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John, you cannot play in organised soccer without registering no matter who owns said park.
      2
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Aaron Adam Goldwater - I sent this to Glen Stanaway. He has read it but chosen to ignore it in favour of making up some bullshit in an attempt to bully me.. . . . . . . In spite of how my views on Sailpass have been misrepresented by you and a couple oSee more
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Glen Stanaway - oh yes you can! Just get two groups of people with like interest. Don't even need a club. Happens frequently.
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    • Aaron Adam Goldwater
      Aaron Adam Goldwater John Graham I have much better things to do than keep arguing with you. If you don't see any value that is fine, but stop wasting everyone else's time.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Aaron Adam Goldwater - then don't read what I write - or waste your time responding to what I write.
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    • Bradley Ginnivan
      Bradley Ginnivan Brian Case mate, one of the Great days in sport, although it's now call" Wednesday afternoon gender sailing "
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    • John Graham
      Hide or report this
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      1
    • Bradley Ginnivan
      Bradley Ginnivan John Graham hey champ, I agree that there should be no free sailing, sailing is like any other sport its a privilege, you pay for what you do in competition/ racing.
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Bradley Ginnivan - I totally agree with that, What I'm saying is being misrepresented. I've always felt the 3 races "free" should not apply in more serious racing BUT shutting the door at Wags & Twilight racing is going to hinder the growth of the sporSee more
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    • Sam Tiedemann
      Sam Tiedemann Far out Glen Stanaway this John graham clown comes out with some crap
      1
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Sam Tiedemann - what kind of fuckwit are you, Just a troll. If you can't contribute something worthwhile then FUCK OFF moron.
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    • Sam Tiedemann
      Sam Tiedemann Settle down cupcake 
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      1
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    • Bradley Ginnivan
      Bradley Ginnivan John Graham 20 is way to much,, I own a boat and the people that come sailing with me are all members, , my father founded a sailing club in Central Victoria some 60 years ago, they encourage people to come sailing, try sailing days etc, racing See more
      1
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    • John Graham
      John Graham Bradley Ginnivan and I agree totally. 20 free races is too much but not MY idea - some clubs ARE offering that. I'm not a member of any of those clubs or responsible for their policy. For about 10 years I was an instructor at BRYC Adult traning classesSee more
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway John, two groups of people playing soccer sans club is not organised sport and Im sure the FFA is happy for them. Once they play in a competition they'll be registered. We even had to supply photos when doing so for our children.
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    • Brian Case
      Brian Case Sam Tiedemann careful Sam as he’ll play the bully card.
      Busted guns will not fire.
      1
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    • Mikael Lundh
      Mikael Lundh Brian Case thank you Brian you have summed it up very well.
      2
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  • Paul Glynn
    Paul Glynn Sent details of the JPK Pacific & North Sails "Introduction to Short Handed Sailing" Tuesday 11 Feb @ 6.30 at the RPAYC - Anyone from AS coming ?
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  • Andrew Dolly Divola
    Andrew Dolly Divola Debate is good
    Insults are not
    5
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    • John Graham
      John Graham I agree but some just cannot help them selves. If the guy throws shit at me - they get it back.
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  • Ian Guanaria
    Ian Guan A question for you lot. Has anyone ever been asked by any club about complying with the 3 race rule ? No one who has sailed with me has ever been asked that I am aware of and I doubt that any clubs ever consider it , they are generally more interested in bar takings after the race 
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    • John Graham
      John Graham I've never seen it enforced. I know of a couple of clubs that required a fee ($10 or $15) for non members on twilight races in the past, but never seen it collected.
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    • Ian Guanaria
      Ian Guanaria John Graham , I have never sailed at a club that charges casual crew to sail. Yes a boat owner pays a casual race fee, quite rightly,
      1
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    • John Graham
      Hide or report this
      Find a SailPass - Australian Sailing
      SAILING.ORG.AU
      Find a SailPass - Australian Sailing
      Find a SailPass - Australian Sailing
       
    • Ian White
      Ian White Obviously need to club to add "Skippers and Crew are required to be financial members of the XXXXX in the
      appropriate category" to Notice of race of all club yacht races
      Hide or report this
    • Ian Guanaria
      Ian Guanaria Ian White , I am not being negative, just realistic, how many clubs would bother to check, particularly in Sydney where so many boats come from various marina’s & moorings to start a race .
      Hide or report this
    • Ian White
      Ian White Ian Guanaria That's in our club's NI, and they have been requested crew list. The mix club NIs are different. Sadly if it is more enforced, and you race at two clubs, you will have to be a member of both, or drop one
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    • Ian Guanaria
      Ian Guanaria Ian White , I stand to be corrected but at my club we only have to submit crew lists for Cat 1&2 races, years ago it used to be cat 4 as well but that fell by the wayside.
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Ian Guanaria, I joined one club I sail at. The other club tapped me on the shoulder and asked me to join.
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    • Ian Guanaria
      Ian Guanaria Glen Stanaway , ah but Glen you are a new resident in Tasmania, I would get worried if you get tapped on the shoulder 
      4
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  • Gavin Adamson
    SAVINGSAILING.COM
    The Book
    The Book
     
  • Kendall Richardson
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  • Reynald Neron
    Reynald Neron It is not "fact checking", it is AS trying to convince people that their idea is a good one, when most people can see it is not. The fact that AS needs to issue such a statement clearly demonstrate that you have seen most people are against that change of rule. The other issue is that AS issues rule changes without asking the people involved in the sport.
    1
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway Reynald, the fact we issued this is because people were contacting us with questions, or making incorrect assertions on social media.
      Hide or report this
    • Reynald Neron
      Reynald Neron Glen Stanaway, the fact that people have questions, make "incorrect" (according to AS) assertions, and more generally, criticise the change of the rule should really open the eyes of AS about it. On the other hand, that last document really tells every sailors out there: AS is right, you are wrong and we don't really care what you think...
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    • JeanJacques Manier
      JeanJacques Manier Reynald Neron

      Oh many don’t care what I think and who I am, in Yachting I prescrive race and this long time and far, so design for also,
      See more
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    • Reynald Neron
      Reynald Ner JeanJacques Manier Personne ne comprends ce que vous voulez dire non plus.. 
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    • JeanJacques Manier
      JeanJacques Manier Reynald Neron not prescrive practice also many since child,
      Hide or report this
      Image may contain: ocean, sky, cloud, outdoor, water and nature
       
       
    • Glenn Yates
      Glenn Yates Glen Stanaway - Glen, I am from a country sailing club and the first my Club knew about this new process was when I mentioned it on Sunday after reading your post! One of the major issues as I see it, is that country clubs have a huge disconnect with ASee more
      1
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  • Michael Forsyth
    Michael Forsyth Maybe its driven by the insurance companies as an excuse not to pay out based on crew experience?
    Hide or report this
  • Reynald Neron
    Reynald Neron "The more someone needs to convince me, the more I know they are wrong". (Confucius)
    1
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    • Glen Stanaway
      Glen Stanaway “The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” (Robertson Davies)
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  • Steve ThePirate
    Steve ThePirate Hey Glen Stanaway. There is a lot of discussion about this issue on the Australian Sailing thread on Sailing Anarchy. Is there going to be any response to that from you or AS?

    My main concern is the potential misuse of SailPass. I am a member of two A
    See more
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14 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

I've mentioned before that as far as I'm concerned you racing guys live in a bubble that people like me happily ignore. At least until you think you've stand-on status simply by virtue of racing anyway.

As you say, lots of yachts in & around Hobart. The owners just don't want to have anything to do with your racing club culture.

I was asked today by a bloke about crewing on a casual basis to get some experience. I tried to explain the 'Sailpass' thing to him - his eyes glazed over. Doubt you'll see him down at one of the clubs asking for a crew slot any time soon.

FKT

Some of "us racing guys" also cruise. Some of us racing guys cruise more than we race. It is permissable to do both, you know. I, for one, have never assumed stand-on status by virtue of racing, but if I am not racing, I am happy to adjust my course so as to not interfere with racers, my rights under colregs notwithstanding. You seem to have a rather jaundiced view on those who race, perhaps as a result of personal experience? 
 

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The problem for AUS SAILING with this regulation as I see it, is we live in Australia. We have a great culture here, which includes character traits such as, we don't dob on our mates, we are a little bit subversive, we don't like over regulation.

This initiative will  possibly exist in name for some time, but it's highly unlikely to be successful. It's almost unenforceable, without protest by other competitors, and I suspect that anyone protesting will be treated as a pariah. 

If it does gain traction, I would imagine that it will only drive a further split in the sailing community. "Clubs" like Woody Point which currently host the largest twilight fleet on Pittwater will become more attractive to those looking for a casual race.

AUS SAILING isn't the RYA much as they might like to be, and they don't have the regulatory clout the overarching responsibility for all things maritime of RYA.

Culture eats strategy for breakfast! - Peter Drucker

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I wonder if we've all got this wrong, and all the additional revenue collected from this initiative will go towards having a physical copy of the Blue Book printed again?

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I believe the facebook rants over Sail Pass have mostly got it wrong when they say its an imposition on Clubs.  According to RRS this is not a club issue, its a 'Person in charge' issue, club dont have to check, clubs dont have to stop people from sailing if they dont comply.  Boats have to protest and then the protestor have to prove their case in the room, not the protestee having to prove that the crew had Sail Passes.  Club adminstrators do not have to do anything.

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1 hour ago, Weyalan said:

Some of "us racing guys" also cruise. Some of us racing guys cruise more than we race. It is permissable to do both, you know. I, for one, have never assumed stand-on status by virtue of racing, but if I am not racing, I am happy to adjust my course so as to not interfere with racers, my rights under colregs notwithstanding. You seem to have a rather jaundiced view on those who race, perhaps as a result of personal experience? 
 

No by & large I find racing boring. Also I grew up in Sydney where the self-entitlement factor of the racing brigade was huge.

The current exception to the boring bit is this SailPass fiasco. It's pure gold in the entertainment stakes.

Feel free to carry on - this is Sailing Anarchy after all.

FWIW I'll generally change course so as to pass behind if I think it'll help regardless of status. Not like I'm in a hurry. It's only when dealing with those people who *demand* that I change course that I don't, if I've got stand-on status. Hasn't happened in Tasmania yet.

FKT

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If the FB rants represent AS views then it just shows how out of touch AS are.

Yes, I know they did have support but I can't help but think they called in mates for that support.

Or at least that's how I read it.

Any rules that restrict casual crewing are bad for the sport.

 

 

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So let me get this straight

I own a racing keelboat - Check
I am a senior member of a yacht club and I pay yearly membership fees - Check
I joined the yacht club because it has a marina - Check
I berth my boat in the yacht club marina - Check
I pay monthly rental fees to berth my boat in the marina - Check
I pay monthly marina maintenance fees because I berth my boat in the marina - Check
I pay monthly electricity fees because my boat is connected to mains power to trickle charge my boats batteries - Check
I pay yearly boat registration fees - Check
I pay boat insurance with minimum $10 million liability - Check

I now have to register every person on my boat when I race - Check
The reason is because if something happens on board my boat when racing the Club will act as first contact and responder - I don't know, how is this to be enacted?

Every person on my boat when I race has to pay to BE ABOARD when I race my boat - Check
How much is my cut? - Nothing
What do I get for all this? - ????????????
Why am I racing my boat? - ????????????

Time to buy a cruising boat, and too hell with racing - Check

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1 hour ago, cosmicsedso said:

Any rules that restrict casual crewing are bad for the sport.

 

 

^^^This!

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So serious question GRS, if you get injured in say a bar room fight at the end of say a ocean race, does the Sailing Australia policy answer the claim or only cover on water events.

It seems to me that if the bar room fight falls into RRS 69 territory the rest must follow!

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2 hours ago, Flags said:

The problem for AUS SAILING with this regulation as I see it, is we live in Australia. We have a great culture here, which includes character traits such as, we don't dob on our mates, we are a little bit subversive, we don't like over regulation.

we like to believe that, but we're one of the laziest around when it comes to actually standing up against over regulation and government over-reach.

 

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On 2/8/2020 at 10:50 PM, KC375 said:

I've read the RRS a few times.

I'm comfortable that the skipper should be responsible. I'm not arguing that AS or the Club has "a duty of care"...AS is arguing that. I think to some extent australian law probably does impose some "duty of care" on the club...even if it is just to maintain their docks so they are not dangerous etc.

I'm skeptical that a "duty of care" then requires collecting information on all people who that you have a duty to and failing to collect that information is "contrary to that duty of care"...

but I'm not a lawyer so maybe AS are right (I doubt it)

I haven't checked in here for a week so this question may already have been answered, however...

The club, or more to the point, the Flag Officers and Race Committee, do have a duty of care to the competitors, such as not starting a race when there is a gale warning current, some clubs even go so far as not starting a race when there's a strong wind warning. At our club, Princess Royal Sailing Club, up until the recent changes we had a requirement for skippers (keelboat and dinghy) to sign-on and list all crew members names. It is then up to the Sailing Director to check whether the crew are members and keep a track of those that aren't and once they've raced 3 times the crew member is required to become a member. A boat can technically be disqualified if they breach this rule, however I don't think it's ever happened. 

And therein lies the problem for the Club.  If something happens and a crew member gets injured, or god forbid drowns or dies, then the Club has a liability and the Directors can have a personal liability if negligent in their duties. When I was on the Board I was very conscious of this.

I haven't raced this season so not sure what the procedures are now re admin of Sailpass.

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1 hour ago, Don said:

So let me get this straight

I own a racing keelboat - Check
I am a senior member of a yacht club and I pay yearly membership fees - Check
I joined the yacht club because it has a marina - Check
I berth my boat in the yacht club marina - Check
I pay monthly rental fees to berth my boat in the marina - Check
I pay monthly marina maintenance fees because I berth my boat in the marina - Check
I pay monthly electricity fees because my boat is connected to mains power to trickle charge my boats batteries - Check
I pay yearly boat registration fees - Check
I pay boat insurance with minimum $10 million liability - Check

I now have to register every person on my boat when I race - Check
The reason is because if something happens on board my boat when racing the Club will act as first contact and responder - I don't know, how is this to be enacted?

Every person on my boat when I race has to pay to BE ABOARD when I race my boat - Check
How much is my cut? - Nothing
What do I get for all this? - ????????????
Why am I racing my boat? - ????????????

Time to buy a cruising boat, and too hell with racing - Check

what I said.

If clubs are not for profit and staff are payed by the club and volunteers are working for a beer and a snag and the club boats and other facilities are covered by club general revenue what are the funds being used for? 

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11 minutes ago, cosmicsedso said:

.................... the administrators ............

At best, this is a loose description of these people.

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