terrafirma 978 #3201 Posted November 19, 2020 Alex getting his lead squeezed now. If he can't sustain a lead not sure how he'll go one on one with Linked Out and Apivia.? Can he come through the softer stuff and get into new pressure and gain some miles again. The trailing boats have the advantage of strategic positioning and weather with Alex in front. My concern for Alex has always been his ability to work harder and trim the boat compared to the other two. Let's see how this plays out over the coming week? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 254 #3202 Posted November 19, 2020 Alex is just doing fine. The other two might have a bit of speed on him, but not much (if any). The distance to Thomas has remained pretty consistent at just over a 100 nm. Routing strategy (and some luck) will be more defining then a slight change in speed. Alex is betting on a route more West, which might be related to his slight lead and we will have to see how that pans out. For now he has lost some miles in relation to the waypoint, but not in terms of distance to the next boat. There might be a few restarts coming up, although it is often a matter of FIFO. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hitchhiker 823 #3203 Posted November 19, 2020 0400 update. Unlike the tracker, these updates are position reports to position reports. DTf is to Kerguelen which is essentially in the route. They could make it a mark of the course. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3204 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 0700 HB 18.3kts 212deg latlon -4.846155, -31.93712 LO 24.3 kts 182deg latlon -3.884428, -30.62311 APIVIA 20.7 kts 190 deg latlon -3.266675,-30.33971 HB-LO haversine separation 97.6nm, if I calculated correctly HB-APIVIA haversine separation 134.7nm 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3205 Posted November 19, 2020 2 hours ago, AnotherSailor said: Alex is betting on a route more West, which might be related to his slight lead and we will have to see how that pans out. That will not pan out well unless there is a ITCZ stumble with those behind...which doesn't appear to be on the horizon. Anyway that's what 'outer my arse' told me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
terrafirma 978 #3206 Posted November 19, 2020 20 minutes ago, noaano said: UTC 0700 HB 18.3kts 212deg latlon -4.846155, -31.93712 LO 24.3 kts 182deg latlon -3.884428, -30.62311 APIVIA 20.7 kts 190 deg latlon -3.266675,-30.33971 HB-LO haversine separation 97.6nm, if I calculated correctly HB-APIVIA haversine separation 134.7nm Cheers that looks better for him..! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sailbydate 2,438 #3207 Posted November 19, 2020 17 hours ago, Herman said: The picture edit did not come through My commercial barge pics were too big, Herman. I've compressed them. I was amazed by the sheer tonnage of the commercial barge traffic running up the Rhine, the Main and the Danube rivers, from Amsterdam. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainbow Spirit 284 #3208 Posted November 19, 2020 The real problem for all of the different groups in the race is that once they hit the ice limits there will be very little room to make any truely tactical moves. All we will see is a follow the leaders, with some lucky ones getting the winds they prefer and others not. It is what it is unfortunately. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Raptorsailor 285 #3209 Posted November 19, 2020 kojiro getting stuck in. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3210 Posted November 19, 2020 4 hours ago, terrafirma said: Can he come through the softer stuff and get into new pressure and gain some miles again. That jump is still a big ask to compensate for him having to travel many more miles around the outside relying only on TWD clocking to get easting in. I would not be surprised if he took the 'delta' he has in the bank and at some point 'cashed in' some to keep further off the coast. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3211 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 0800 Experimented with pythonscript autogenerated position report from sat ais: HB 17.2 kts 210 deg, latlon: -5.05834 -31.99827 age mins: 33 LO 23.1 kts 180 deg, latlon: -4.324043 -30.65525 age mins: 1 AV 23.4 kts 191 deg, latlon: -3.696658 -30.41788 age mins: 5 Seems to more or less agree with the data on the public tracker, though Bossdata is a bit old but oh well. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KingMonkey 57 #3212 Posted November 19, 2020 33 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said: That jump is still a big ask to compensate for him having to travel many more miles around the outside relying only on TWD clocking to get easting in. I would not be surprised if he took the 'delta' he has in the bank and at some point 'cashed in' some to keep further off the coast. Well he will start getting more East during today and will be doing so slightly earlier than those behind him but that is just following the gradual change in wind angle. However, his extra Westing and better wind angle doesn’t seem to have got him south any quicker. The Brazil current runs South between Natal and the Falkland Islands doesn’t it? But again this will be helping them all equally if at all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
staysail 316 #3213 Posted November 19, 2020 3 hours ago, AnotherSailor said: Alex is just doing fine. The other two might have a bit of speed on him, but not much (if any). The distance to Thomas has remained pretty consistent at just over a 100 nm. AT fanboys are sure optimistic! Lead over Linked out cut to 22.3nm but we are sure it is all good news and in the plan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
igim 20 #3214 Posted November 19, 2020 I think Alex is probably searching to get first to the downwind conditions which seem to be happening first to the west. It is pretty clear that in closer reaching conditions both Verdier boats have a slight or not so slight better topspeed, will see how that turns out in VMG conditions in the south 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sfigone 112 #3215 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said: That will not pan out well unless there is a ITCZ stumble with those behind...which doesn't appear to be on the horizon. Anyway that's what 'outer my arse' told me. I kind of a agree. Forecasts I can see in 48 hours have all the leaders in downwind conditions, with the further west option giving a better angle if what you want is to get further south... but earlier in the race HB looked like it could sail deeper than the others anyway plus at around that time or soon after the it will E not S that they want. I've not actually run routes, but AT must be seeing something I'm not that makes cutting the corner no good.... or is it that HB is just not as good in a broad reach and has to sail slightly deeper (but is still slower)? Interesting corner! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3216 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 0830 Testing autoupdate script, now with fresh data for Bossman: HB 20.8 kts 188 deg, latlon: -5.304228 -32.07902 age mins: 6 LO 22.9 kts 183 deg, latlon: -4.476625 -30.66787 age mins: 2 AV 22.7 kts 195 deg, latlon: -3.825175 -30.44247 age mins: 13 The script seems to work just fine, learned some python json -handling as a bonus, win-win HB update cycle seems to be much worse than LO, LO always has fresh 10 min old data availeble, HB sometimes takes 30+ mins to update. Different antenna location, different brand AIS beacon? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3217 Posted November 19, 2020 24 minutes ago, KingMonkey said: The Brazil current runs South between Natal and the Falkland Islands doesn’t it? But again this will be helping them all equally if at all. In close to coast there are counter eddies that run north....hence 1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said: I would not be surprised if he took the 'delta' he has in the bank and at some point 'cashed in' some to keep further off the coast. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3218 Posted November 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, sfigone said: but AT must be seeing something I'm not that makes cutting the corner no good.... or is it that HB is just not as good in a broad reach and has to sail slightly deeper (but is still slower)? Better VMG is taking him west. But only takes small change to forecast particularly TWD and that goes to shit and too late to escape. As in a Xmas ham....the pig is committed. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 1,287 #3219 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Sailbydate said: My commercial barge pics were too big, Herman. I've compressed them. I was amazed by the sheer tonnage of the commercial barge traffic running up the Rhine, the Main and the Danube rivers, from Amsterdam. Yup, we are the gateway to continental Europe via the rivers. Rotterdam is the biggest port in Europe. It was the biggest in the world up to 2004, until Chinese ports grew even bigger with the economic rise of the dragon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 1,287 #3220 Posted November 19, 2020 22 minutes ago, noaano said: UTC 0830 Testing autoupdate script, now with fresh data for Bossman: HB 20.8 kts 188 deg, latlon: -5.304228 -32.07902 age mins: 6 LO 22.9 kts 183 deg, latlon: -4.476625 -30.66787 age mins: 2 AV 22.7 kts 195 deg, latlon: -3.825175 -30.44247 age mins: 13 The script seems to work just fine, learned some python json -handling as a bonus, win-win HB update cycle seems to be much worse than LO, LO always has fresh 10 min old data availeble, HB sometimes takes 30+ mins to update. Different antenna location, different brand AIS beacon? You have been busy! Is there a way to share the output of your hard work online ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
neuronz 27 #3221 Posted November 19, 2020 Not sure if this has been discussed before, but I noticed that Boris Hermann in Seaexplorer often has an unloaded mainsheet dangling around at the back in His videos. Instead there seems to be some sort of bridle setup. Is this a common thing? Did I overlook something? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JonRowe 678 #3222 Posted November 19, 2020 Just now, neuronz said: Not sure if this has been discussed before, but I noticed that Boris Hermann in Seaexplorer often has an unloaded mainsheet dangling around at the back in His videos. Instead there seems to be some sort of bridle setup. Is this a common thing? Did I overlook something? The bridle is the mainsheet, the traveller is the vang. Very common on IMOCAs where the goose neck is basically on the deck. Has been discussed several times in this thread. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
littlechay 698 #3223 Posted November 19, 2020 51 minutes ago, KingMonkey said: Well he will start getting more East during today and will be doing so slightly earlier than those behind him but that is just following the gradual change in wind angle. However, his extra Westing and better wind angle doesn’t seem to have got him south any quicker. The Brazil current runs South between Natal and the Falkland Islands doesn’t it? But again this will be helping them all equally if at all. The Brazil current only reaches about 42 S, the Falkland current tends runs north along the continental shelf as far as Uruguay (ish) the Brazil current is East of the Falkland current and their relative positions having quite and effect on the local weather in the area where they meet. HB seems to be running with the current at the moment - see attached. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ague 34 #3224 Posted November 19, 2020 Meanwhile, Le Cam is still ahead of the first generation foilers 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sailfly 16 #3225 Posted November 19, 2020 https://chevaliertaglang.blogspot.com/2020/11/vendee-globe-challenge-2020-2021-yacht_11.html 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3226 Posted November 19, 2020 32 minutes ago, Herman said: You have been busy! Is there a way to share the output of your hard work online ? I'll think about it. It most definitely is in gray area region type of thing, but I can help reproduce the results I am sure 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigmatically2 590 #3227 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, staysail said: AT fanboys are sure optimistic! Lead over Linked out cut to 22.3nm but we are sure it is all good news and in the plan. I certainly am cheering for AT and I'm certainly nervous about him being to west. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3228 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 0930 HB 17.1 kts 188 deg, latlon: -5.653441 -32.15584 age mins: 0 LO 18.2 kts 189 deg, latlon: -4.882225 -30.69161 age mins: 1 AV 17.5 kts 196 deg, latlon: -2.71595 -29.92487 age mins: 26 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sailbydate 2,438 #3229 Posted November 19, 2020 Lateral separation between HB and LO is now out to about 71nm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3230 Posted November 19, 2020 56 minutes ago, Herman said: You have been busy! Is there a way to share the output of your hard work online ? You can start by: 1. Zoom marinetraffic to area of interest with Google Chrome 2. Filter out everything but "pleasure boat" 3. Open "Developer tools" 4. From "Network" -tab, press "clear" button 5. Right click map and select "Refresh map" 6. From "Network tab", right click and select "save all as HAR with content" 7. You end up with json file with all the boat data 8. Parse this with python I am currently working on how to automate steps 4-6. 1-3 can stay open, 7-8 is easy to automate. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3231 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 1000 HB 16.8 kts 187 deg, latlon: -5.741219 -32.17201 age mins: 3 LO 18.2 kts 189 deg, latlon: -4.992486 -30.70703 age mins: 2 AV 22.3 kts 187 deg, latlon: -4.235455 -30.51851 age mins: 30 (note, rather old update) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chris UK 118 #3232 Posted November 19, 2020 Just looking at Linkedout's foils you can see they're going to be powerful due to the short cord, long flat profile i.e. almost horizontal to the surface......Alex could have had these, essentially he did last time.....but having hit something last time he/they've gone away from them, choosing instead seemingly stronger, fatter cord, rounded foils that get foil out of the water.....its a risk game. If linkedout get around without a collision/issue then great. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
terrafirma 978 #3233 Posted November 19, 2020 I can hear Alex snoring from Australia..! 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigmatically2 590 #3234 Posted November 19, 2020 Quote The weather charts offer some promise for the race leader. The Saint Helena high pressure system which dominates the weather systems in the South Atlantic, is displaced to the east slightly with a low pressure to its west thus creating a corridor of SE’ly airstream which -as things stand – would allow the leaders to chart a more direct, fast course to the south east. From VG. I hope they are right Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chucky 33 #3235 Posted November 19, 2020 41 minutes ago, Chris UK said: Just looking at Linkedout's foils you can see they're going to be powerful due to the short cord, long flat profile i.e. almost horizontal to the surface......Alex could have had these, essentially he did last time.....but having hit something last time he/they've gone away from them, choosing instead seemingly stronger, fatter cord, rounded foils that get foil out of the water.....its a risk game. If linkedout get around without a collision/issue then great. HB foils also look like they are more all round foils and may be better suited to heavy down wind conditions Such as in the Southern ocean. In heavy winds the HB foils could be more stable with any change in heel angle! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
minca3 191 #3236 Posted November 19, 2020 Another informative video from Will Harris: 10 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steinbrenner 19 #3237 Posted November 19, 2020 is it possible HB having some problem onboard? teams and skippers do not always disclose such things if I remember correctly from VG 2016, when he hit something, it was impossible to see the photo of the broken foil and I can't imagine her being so much slower than Linked Out or Apivia even if optimized for southern broad reaching one more thing, if charal crosses the equator in less than HB 2016 time, is it then officially recognized as new IMOCA solo record, though not in the race of course and not for VG history books? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowden 295 #3238 Posted November 19, 2020 JLC thanking Neptune for safe passage south. Seems like there may have been another bottle that he tucked into before making the video ;-) 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
terrafirma 978 #3239 Posted November 19, 2020 Yes I think this could be a big moment in the race? Alex doesn't have the speed to match Apivia and Linked Out. I think he was nearly out to a 200 mile lead over these 2 at one stage and by the next sked Linked Out will be the new leader. I'm sure Alex will be behind entering the Southern Ocean so we'll see where HB stands in the running conditions. When you think he used Theta to get his lead and now he is about to surrender it I think it will be very nervous moments in the Hugo Boss camp. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
minca3 191 #3240 Posted November 19, 2020 12 minutes ago, Chucky said: HB foils also look like they are more all round foils and may be better suited to heavy down wind conditions Such as in the Southern ocean. In heavy winds the HB foils could be more stable with any change in heel angle! I think that is one of the big differences: HB can have a range of lean angles where the RM from the foils remain somewhat constant. Apivia and LinkedOut probably have a distinct sweet spot of lean angle where the foils work best, hence they should have a narrower band of what sail trim and head sails are applicable 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buck Turgidson 77 #3241 Posted November 19, 2020 7 minutes ago, minca3 said: Another informative video from Will Harris: Great video and helps explain why HB is opting for the more conservative west then south route. I expect a lot of false hope for the chasing pair over the next few days followed by a moment of realisation when HB starts flying east. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
serialsailor 112 #3242 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Chris UK said: Just looking at Linkedout's foils you can see they're going to be powerful due to the short cord, long flat profile i.e. almost horizontal to the surface......Alex could have had these, essentially he did last time.....but having hit something last time he/they've gone away from them, choosing instead seemingly stronger, fatter cord, rounded foils that get foil out of the water.....its a risk game. If linkedout get around without a collision/issue then great. Those are LinkedOut's old foils. Here are the new foils. They are a bit more tolerant (more area/chord i think and more curved, the "double curvature bow" like shape is gone) 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BozoC 112 #3243 Posted November 19, 2020 31 minutes ago, minca3 said: I think that is one of the big differences: HB can have a range of lean angles where the RM from the foils remain somewhat constant. Apivia and LinkedOut probably have a distinct sweet spot of lean angle where the foils work best, hence they should have a narrower band of what sail trim and head sails are applicable So, you think.... that somewhat and probably he should ..... what ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPAL 188 #3244 Posted November 19, 2020 3 hours ago, Herman said: Rotterdam is the biggest port in Europe. It was the biggest in the world up to 2004, until Chinese ports grew even bigger with the economic rise of the dragon. Absolutely massive, knew a merchant man who said it was a nightmare getting back to your ship at night! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPAL 188 #3245 Posted November 19, 2020 4 hours ago, KingMonkey said: Brazil current runs South between Natal and the Falkland Islands doesn’t it? Kinda! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3246 Posted November 19, 2020 55 minutes ago, Buck Turgidson said: 1 hour ago, minca3 said: Another informative video from Will Harris: Great video and helps explain why HB is opting for the more conservative west then south route. I expect a lot of false hope for the chasing pair over the next few days followed by a moment of realisation when HB starts flying east. You have misinterpreted that video. He is not describing HB route west route versus the others a south route. They are ALL taking the west route. At the moment it LOOKS as though AT is taking a west 'plus' route for around the the next 1,000+ mile where they will start converging at around half that distance before meeting up. He could come east BEFORE that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
loneshark64 375 #3247 Posted November 19, 2020 4 hours ago, igim said: I think Alex is probably searching to get first to the downwind conditions which seem to be happening first to the west. It is pretty clear that in closer reaching conditions both Verdier boats have a slight or not so slight better topspeed, will see how that turns out in VMG conditions in the south Another Verdier, Arkea, is also flying very fast on this reach after abandoning the “Jeffersons strategy” (moving on up to the east side) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowden 295 #3248 Posted November 19, 2020 8 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said: They are ALL taking the west route. At the moment it LOOKS as though AT is taking a west 'plus' route for around the the next 1,000+ mile where they will start converging at around half that distance before meeting up. This is going to compress the fleet, I think? If they are all going 'great circle' round the back of that high, and it's moving East, then the distance to sail is progressively shorter for each boat (all other things equal). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yl75 1,027 #3249 Posted November 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, loneshark64 said: Another Verdier, Arkea, is also flying very fast on this reach after abandoning the “Jefferson’s strategy” (moving on up to the east side) Arkea is a JuanK 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corryvreckan 189 #3250 Posted November 19, 2020 8 minutes ago, loneshark64 said: Another Verdier, Arkea, is also flying very fast on this reach after abandoning the “Jefferson’s strategy” (moving on up to the east side) Groan... I feel old for getting that reference. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
loneshark64 375 #3251 Posted November 19, 2020 17 minutes ago, yl75 said: Arkea is a JuanK My bad, I got confused with the PRB boat I think and how is that pronounced? “junk” ? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jack_sparrow 7,503 #3252 Posted November 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, Snowden said: This is going to compress the fleet, I think? Around the top 10 certainly but after that delta's might get very ugly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soton_Speed 3 #3253 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Snowden said: JLC thanking Neptune for safe passage south. Seems like there may have been another bottle that he tucked into before making the video ;-) Can we be sure he'll turn left after Cape Horn?... 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3254 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 1300: HB 17.1 kts 199 deg, latlon: -6.635658 -32.321 age mins: 21 LO 16.9 kts 192 deg, latlon: -6.027823 -30.86074 age mins: 4 AV 23.9 kts 192 deg, latlon: -5.29885 -30.69133 age mins: 38 HB-LO separation 90.1 nm. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 1,287 #3255 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, noaano said: You can start by: 1. Zoom marinetraffic to area of interest with Google Chrome 2. Filter out everything but "pleasure boat" 3. Open "Developer tools" 4. From "Network" -tab, press "clear" button 5. Right click map and select "Refresh map" 6. From "Network tab", right click and select "save all as HAR with content" 7. You end up with json file with all the boat data 8. Parse this with python I am currently working on how to automate steps 4-6. 1-3 can stay open, 7-8 is easy to automate. Very interesting, I just tried and can work with this although I'm not good with python yet. Any code snippets you can spare via pm are much appreciated! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3256 Posted November 19, 2020 4 hours ago, Herman said: You have been busy! Is there a way to share the output of your hard work online ? Some python to get started, this is 99% working, but at least this way I cannot be blamed : --- import json def ship_name(sname): sname = sname[0:8] return sname with open('www.marinetraffic.com.har') as f: data = json.load(f) entries = data["log"]["entries"] for entry in entries: cnts = json.dumps(entry["response"]["content"]) # this is because some weird locale stuff on my mac if cnts.find("SHIP_ID") > 0: # I know, I know. This is not the proudest line of code. data2 = json.loads(cnt['text']) ships = json.loads(json.dumps(data2['data']['rows'])) # same locale mixup for ship in ships: print(ship_name(ship['SHIP_ID'])), spd = float(ship['SPEED']) print(str(round(spd/10, 1))), print('kts'), print(ship['COURSE']), print('deg,'), # insert some more data digging here print(ship['ELAPSED']) 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3257 Posted November 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, Herman said: Very interesting, I just tried and can work with this although I'm not good with python yet. Any code snippets you can spare via pm are much appreciated! Here you go! If you manage to invent way to automate 4-6, please share! I was thinking of Tampermonkey script maybe, or some other user side scripting solution, would be more universal and work for other things also. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troll99 446 #3258 Posted November 19, 2020 +8 nm .. yeah!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maritimesailski 0 #3259 Posted November 19, 2020 13 minutes ago, noaano said: Here you go! If you manage to invent way to automate 4-6, please share! I was thinking of Tampermonkey script maybe, or some other user side scripting solution, would be more universal and work for other things also. @noaano have you put this up in github as public repo yet? If not, and you want to, please do, happy to contribute to it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buck Turgidson 77 #3260 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said: You have misinterpreted that video. He is not describing HB route west route versus the others a south route. They are ALL taking the west route. At the moment it LOOKS as though AT is taking a west 'plus' route for around the the next 1,000+ mile where they will start converging at around half that distance before meeting up. He could come east BEFORE that. No, you have misinterpreted my post mate. The take away is that there is little time difference between cutting the corner or going Deep South but there is a big difference in risk. As it happens, having looked at windy a little I think they will all have to stay north of the southern conversion zone and slip down the front as there is no ride for them in the south for a week. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nasil2nd 88 #3261 Posted November 19, 2020 10 minutes ago, maritimesailski said: @noaano have you put this up in github as public repo yet? If not, and you want to, please do, happy to contribute to it Agree 24 minutes ago, noaano said: Here you go! If you manage to invent way to automate 4-6, please share! I was thinking of Tampermonkey script maybe, or some other user side scripting solution, would be more universal and work for other things also. You can try to use selenium wire, like selenium, but allows to capture individual requests from the page. https://pypi.org/project/selenium-wire/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kcolborne 25 #3262 Posted November 19, 2020 I don't really have the time to take a look at all of the routing and forecasting data. I review what is posted here briefly, when I can. But, to me it looks like AT is getting into a position where if the boats coming behind him manage to cut the corner he could lose big. He must have some confidence in his routing, or it is a mistake, or possibly he is slow at the moment for some undisclosed reason. Interesting to watch for sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffy 2,125 #3263 Posted November 19, 2020 Looking at the 12-24 hr survey, Hugo Boss is investing in the future because that wind veer is gonna give him a better continuous pressure and an angle to shoot the gap in one gybe while LinkedOut and Apivia will need to wait longer and before their optimal angles avoid the high pressure. But agree that if the high pressure moves across the south Atlantic a few hours ahead of the forecast then all bets are off. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
r.finn 268 #3264 Posted November 19, 2020 8 minutes ago, kcolborne said: I don't really have the time to take a look at all of the routing and forecasting data. I review what is posted here briefly, when I can. But, to me it looks like AT is getting into a position where if the boats coming behind him manage to cut the corner he could lose big. He must have some confidence in his routing, or it is a mistake, or possibly he is slow at the moment for some undisclosed reason. Interesting to watch for sure. True, but if he can avoid a gybe and they can't, he'll come out well ahead. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 1,287 #3265 Posted November 19, 2020 37 minutes ago, noaano said: Here you go! If you manage to invent way to automate 4-6, please share! I was thinking of Tampermonkey script maybe, or some other user side scripting solution, would be more universal and work for other things also. Thanks very much for sharing and contributing, much appreciated! As I'm new to Python and JSON files, I cannot add much at this moment. Just started playing with it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3266 Posted November 19, 2020 41 minutes ago, maritimesailski said: @noaano have you put this up in github as public repo yet? If not, and you want to, please do, happy to contribute to it As I said, I don't know. It is not certainly 100% clear cut if this is within fair use territory, I mean it kind of obviously goes around some restrictions put there to encourage paying for the subscription - but then again it does not _really_ expose anything that is not already there in the public web interface, except you could argue for maybe one bit of data, speed which is maybe not shown there in the web. But I think it is bit of 50/50 deal, with the proper paid subscription you get _much_ more data, past tracks and predictions and all that, and you do not need to guess which boat is which, so it is there in the gray area. I definitely encourage to support Marinetraffic if you use this, I myself have spent 1 eur each to track three top boats for 24 hrs and I think it is a very decent deal and I plan to support them again in the key stages of the race. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
minca3 191 #3267 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, loneshark64 said: My bad, I got confused with the PRB boat I think and how is that pronounced? “junk” ? I don't want to make a prediction whether Arkea will finish the race and at what position, but right now, Simon is really fast 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
minca3 191 #3268 Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Soton_Speed said: Can we be sure he'll turn left after Cape Horn?... Keep going Jean, the fleet will rejoin in the VG2024. The tracker will remain running and we will keep following you. Hope you have enough freeze-dried food 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
huey 2 542 #3269 Posted November 19, 2020 Sebastien has been quick most of the day.... now at 22knts. and got through the doldrums with everyone in the group, the last being Stephane...and he has still got 14knts but if the hole does appear those behind [20-23] might be going to get caught. ......those further back ...NW of Verdes may also have a hole coming from behind but have a good burst of breeze till then. [24-31]. but Fabrice could get caught. Jeremie could be about to get on a good roll to get him south 'of his turn around position ' sometime today. It will be interesting to watch all the groups. But Im only using the weather time advance and could be out, ..... is Corum Geovoile Tracker using Windy. hope it stays on Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kcolborne 25 #3270 Posted November 19, 2020 28 minutes ago, r.finn said: True, but if he can avoid a gybe and they can't, he'll come out well ahead. I see that in the screenshots posted here. Wish I had more time to study the data. But, I don't. That's why I didn't even bother with the virtual race this time, it would just get frustrating without the time to properly put in an effort. I became an AT fan over the last decade due to his media output being plentiful, high quality, and in English. All of that I still think holds true. But, there are many other skippers putting out good content this time. The auto translate on the videos isn't perfect, but helps. Overall, this has been a very fun race to watch so far. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3272 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 1440 HB 21.1 kts 190 deg, latlon: -7.213053 -32.47381 age mins: 8 LO 24.2 kts 196 deg, latlon: -6.558217 -30.97566 age mins: 1 AV 18.7 kts 191 deg, latlon: -5.91304 -30.81509 age mins: 18 It seems Thomas has really found a good spot with wind and nice speed! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
huey 2 542 #3273 Posted November 19, 2020 Are these the next thing in locks apparently new thinking and robust not sure about weight https://www.facebook.com/riggingprojects/videos/675910599785544 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
minca3 191 #3275 Posted November 19, 2020 4 minutes ago, huey 2 said: Are these the next thing in locks apparently new thinking and robust not sure about weight https://www.facebook.com/riggingprojects/videos/675910599785544 looks nice. but would they work with rotating masts? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3276 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 1515 HB 23.3 kts 193 deg, latlon: -7.28601 -32.49083 age mins: 28 LO 23.3 kts 194 deg, latlon: -6.733851 -31.0192 age mins: 4 Now it seems they both found the same wind and sail settings. Speed and course are remarkably close Hmm, once I come back from my evening run I think I might try to implement a sort of latlon prediction. Quick idea is to add age amount of mins on current course and speed ofset to reported position, would make comparing relative positions very much more accurate. Something like this: HB 23.3 kts 193 deg, latlon: -7.28601 -32.49083 age mins: 28 error dist: 10.9 LO 23.3 kts 194 deg, latlon: -6.733851 -31.0192 age mins: 4 error dist: 1.6 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigmatically2 590 #3277 Posted November 19, 2020 I like that latest from AT. Wish he could say something about his routeing as well, but I know that isn't going to happen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rtfq 12 #3278 Posted November 19, 2020 8 hours ago, Sailbydate said: My commercial barge pics were too big, Herman. I've compressed them. I was amazed by the sheer tonnage of the commercial barge traffic running up the Rhine, the Main and the Danube rivers, from Amsterdam. I found that the most impressive thing was the ease they had navigating. Coming from the UK it was shocking how _everyone_ in Holland just swung boats round like it was in their blood. After a couple of days we didn't look when people were coming past. In England 50% of boat owners can't park; it's worrying when people come within 20ft of your boat :/ I love the cars parked on the barges too, do people live on them? PS sorry for thread drift Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3279 Posted November 19, 2020 v.0.1 corrected latlon, did not check if it gives "correct" answer: UTC 1515 HB 23.3 kts 193 deg, latlon: -7.28601 -32.49083 age mins: 28 error dist: 10.9 corrected latlon: -7.46227 -32.53187 LO 23.3 kts 194 deg, latlon: -6.733851 -31.0192 age mins: 4 error dist: 1.6 corrected latlon: -6.75893 -31.0255 Now corrected latlon should be much more accurate presentation of where the boats are right now, assuming they continued straigh. Quote Formula I used - same is often used for celectial nav: R = 6378.1 # radius of the Earth brng = math.radians(float(ship['COURSE'])) #bearing converted to radians. d = errdist * 1.852 lat1 = math.radians(float(ship['LAT'])) lon1 = math.radians(float(ship['LON'])) lat2 = math.asin( math.sin(lat1)*math.cos(d/R) + math.cos(lat1)*math.sin(d/R)*math.cos(brng)) lon2 = lon1 + math.atan2(math.sin(brng)*math.sin(d/R)*math.cos(lat1), math.cos(d/R)-math.sin(lat1)*math.sin(lat2)) lat2 = math.degrees(lat2) lon2 = math.degrees(lon2) 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Your Mom 993 #3280 Posted November 19, 2020 19 minutes ago, enigmatically2 said: I like that latest from AT. Wish he could say something about his routeing as well, but I know that isn't going to happen Yup. Good message, and a nice job personalizing it. I get a laugh out of the clean white Boss polo every time I see it, too 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 1,287 #3281 Posted November 19, 2020 21 minutes ago, Rtfq said: I love the cars parked on the barges too, do people live on them? Yes they do. Skipper plus the wife/kids, and/or a deckhand too. Skipper and family live in the cabin at the back of the boat, the deckhand has a cabin in the front of the boat. Almost all bigger cargo ships have small cars on top of their cabins. For shopping, going out, or to drive home for the weekend. They use their own cranes to on/offload the cars. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3282 Posted November 19, 2020 UTC 1600 HB 21.9 kts 198 deg, latlon: -7.748685 -32.58165 age mins: 8 corrected latlon: -7.79489 -32.5968 LO 19.7 kts 197 deg, latlon: -7.023358 -31.11055 age mins: 4 corrected latlon: -7.04425 -31.11699 Separation calculated from time-corrected positions 99.0 nm 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AnotherSailor 254 #3283 Posted November 19, 2020 8 hours ago, staysail said: AT fanboys are sure optimistic! Lead over Linked out cut to 22.3nm but we are sure it is all good news and in the plan. Not an AT fanboy. I am just pointing out that at this point very little can be said about the differences in speed since they are never in the same conditions. That might change soon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troll99 446 #3284 Posted November 19, 2020 19 minutes ago, noaano said: UTC 1600 HB 21.9 kts 198 deg, latlon: -7.748685 -32.58165 age mins: 8 corrected latlon: -7.79489 -32.5968 LO 19.7 kts 197 deg, latlon: -7.023358 -31.11055 age mins: 4 corrected latlon: -7.04425 -31.11699 Separation calculated from time-corrected positions 99.0 nm is the data based on the official tracker? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3285 Posted November 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, troll99 said: is the data based on the official tracker? No. It is based on satellite AIS, and almost realtime - you'll see that field age in mins, that is how many minutes ago it was sent from the boat. It updates every few mins to every 15 mins or so, depending on luck, moon and stars. LinkedOut it seems is updating much more frequently than BossMan, for some reason or another. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troll99 446 #3286 Posted November 19, 2020 1 minute ago, noaano said: No. It is based on satellite AIS, and almost realtime - you'll see that field age in mins, that is how many minutes ago it was sent. It updates every few mins to every 15 mins or so, depending on luck. awesome. how did you find it? A kind of marinetraffic.com? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3287 Posted November 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, troll99 said: awesome. how did you find it? A kind of marinetraffic.com? It indeed comes from MT and Vesselfinder, they get it from third party provider like Orbcomm, Exactearth or Spire. There are at least half a dozen providers. I wish Spacex equipped some of their Starlink birds with AIS receivers. They would give very good and frequent coverage and flying so low very good signal reception. While we have a wish list open, maybe Spacex could also add small atomic clock and pseudorandom signal transmitter for independent positioning service as well 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troll99 446 #3288 Posted November 19, 2020 i can see the three purple icons. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaano 135 #3289 Posted November 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, troll99 said: i can see the three purple icons. Try: Filter out everything but "pleasure boat" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites