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Vendee Globe 2020

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34 minutes ago, Rafael said:

Tripon w/his blackPepper have been a tad faster (440Nm) and Boissieres (457Nm)

LeCam appreciates Escoffier much, but he wants to be home alone again :D

Yes Kevin has been eating all his food.! When they pick Kevin up I presume Jean will be delivered the equivalent of what Kevin ate? As long as the water maker keeps up for drinking water.! :D

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2 hours ago, Rafael said:

Uh oh... Not a good night for Burton in his southern lane. Sched shows lost almost 63Nm and last 4hr speed no good... Some kind of problem, hope just tmpBurton.thumb.jpg.39373a52835c08acc153a51438390f62.jpg

No news in his channels or race website yet...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

1 hour ago, Rafael said:

Burton now appears in my screen pointing SSW (bow to the waves)BurtonSSW.thumb.jpg.22a58f4aa59e3e653a8349bd4b3738b6.jpg

It's Official, technical problems, but no details yet.

Ça cavale toujours en tête de course malgré une forte mer de travers limitant la vitesse des bateaux. Louis Burton a perdu beaucoup de terrain dans la nuit, certainement handicapé par des soucis techniques. https://www.vendeeglobe.org/fr/actualites/20807/ca-tape-devant-ca-glisse-derriere

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1 hour ago, prime8 said:

It's a little tough for me to relate to their decision making as well but isn't their goal just to get their names mentioned? Doesn't seem like that necessarily requires success.

 

 

I guess.  What do you think a company like Charal threw into this one?  Hugo Boss?

 

I guess they have folks that scrutinize this but I gotta think the more boats that hit something and have to drop out changes that equation.  

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14 minutes ago, Rainier said:

I guess.  What do you think a company like Charal threw into this one?  Hugo Boss?

I guess they have folks that scrutinize this but I gotta think the more boats that hit something and have to drop out changes that equation.  

The top teams are sponsored in multi year deals that are not just for the Vendee, Alex in the past has done all sorts of PR stunts and tours with the Hugo Boss boats that generate ROI for the sponsor. In a normal no covid vendee year, the boats would do the IMOCA masters series crossing the Atlantic twice, from France to New York and back. Hugo Boss then gets a very large billboard sailing up into NYC.

A common trick in France even at the mini level, is to have the boat on a mortgage owned by an association (company to us English speakers), so its just part of the yearly running costs to pay off which is much smaller than buying the boat out right, and you can sell the boat on to pay off the remainder. Insurance payouts should cover total loss, (although that is getting harder to get) so in reality a failure is not necessarily a huge financial loss, and certainly the sponsors are protected.

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2 hours ago, terrafirma said:

Meanwhile Jean Le Cam posted the fastest 24 hours of the fleet at 430 Miles Approx. I suspect Jean has confidence in his boat and is sending it whereas Charlie for example maybe sailing with a reef etc. 

Interesting to note that Jean le Cam's  own maintenance and refit operation is also caring with "Apicil" which is doing "not too bad" either ;)

King Jean has multiple cards (he was one of the original CDK co-founders)

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3 minutes ago, JonRowe said:

A common trick in France even at the mini level, is to have the boat on a mortgage owned by an association (company to us English speakers), so its just part of the yearly running costs to pay off which is much smaller than buying the boat out right, and you can sell the boat on to pay off the remainder. Insurance payouts should cover total loss, (although that is getting harder to get) so in reality a failure is not necessarily a huge financial loss, and certainly the sponsors are protected.

It’s a smart a proven structure which if you play it right works well for everyone.  If you’re well connected you pre-arrange  the sale of the bot at the end of the project which can make it a relatively “fixed” cost.  The other option if you’re in a country whose tax system allows it can be that the name sponsor buys the boat rights or the whole thing as a marketing expense then double dips by “donating” the boat to a suitable charity on conclusion.

a lot of people try to go into these things not only expecting companies to pay for them to live their dream but also to leave them with an expensive souvenir at the end.

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JLC numbers reassures my impression how silly weight cutting madness is. Cut your toothbrush, do not take spare rudder, talke less food than you may need? And we have a boat carrying probably more than 100 extra kg... and??? 

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https://www.yacht.de/regatta/vendee_globe/vende-globe-interview-mit-boris-herrmann/a126740.html

Long interview with Boris from yesterday... interesting parts translated:

Yesterday he lost his 2 hydro generators, the were ripped out of the mount when he hit 30kts of boat speed, the generators should only be used up to 25. He will repair when its calmer, because it will involve cutting parts with the angle grinder and that is impossible in the current conditions. He is facing short steep waves because of the alghuas current, which make it difficult to stay on pace, he says that he is hitting top speeds of 38 knots, but the average is bad. Now he has slowed down and retraced the foil, because it scares the shit out of him when the boat accelerates uncontrollably and hits the next wave at 38 knots, he has to think about Kevin. It was a difficult decision for him to slow down, bleeding miles is the hardest to see, but at the moment its about finishing for him. His J2 is broken (mentioned before here) and he cannot use it, another reason why he is slow. The main task to make the boat go fast in the current conditions he says, is trimming the autopilot. He needs calm weather to make the repair. OSCAR has warned him and successfully dodged a floating fender so far. He thinks its possible Sam hit a whale.

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25 minutes ago, SCARECROW said:

It’s a smart a proven structure which if you play it right works well for everyone.  If you’re well connected you pre-arrange  the sale of the bot at the end of the project which can make it a relatively “fixed” cost.  The other option if you’re in a country whose tax system allows it can be that the name sponsor buys the boat rights or the whole thing as a marketing expense then double dips by “donating” the boat to a suitable charity on conclusion.

a lot of people try to go into these things not only expecting companies to pay for them to live their dream but also to leave them with an expensive souvenir at the end.

They are also using a lot of tax cuts schemas, related to "mécénat" (like with associations such as "initiative coeur"), or also for sponsorship, which also can make sponsoring a sailing team better than say, running TV ads or something.

 

Hope it is not a major stuff with Louis !

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2 hours ago, prime8 said:

It's a little tough for me to relate to their decision making as well but isn't their goal just to get their names mentioned? Doesn't seem like that necessarily requires success.

Any company that sponsors sailing with the plan to get their name mentioned, or their brand seen is going to be upset with their returns. 

Some will use it for internal messaging and team building, some will use it for networking (especially the likes of PRB, Newrest, Akena, Foncia, all in the building industry near each other). 

Those spending millions will plan on having their ROI, or ROO, before this race even starts. Those that come in late, are spending less than 7 figures, but are still getting lots of internal messaging. 

The Skippers, aside from their media commitments, will also be calling into sponsors conferences and meetings. Dee was giving speeches and interviews with Aviva back in 2008, and the comms are significantly better and easier now. 

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RE sponsor ROI

It looks to me a lot like professional cycling.

If you  can't afford to support an effort to win  a grand tour, but take the spotlight at key times, the return on the smaller investment pencils out. And in the VG,  the personality of the participant can really multiply the returns.  But if you spend more than anyone else, especially on PR, and don't produce any results, not so good.

From the sponsor's POV, I don't think winning is everything.

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And of course you need to remember that a lot of the sponsors this year won’t get their intended ROI not because of what has occurred during the race but because of France’s lock down in the weeks leading up to the start effectively closing the village.

I’m not sure about the Vendee but it is definitely the case with the Volvo that many of the sponsors did it for the corporate networking and entertainment opportunities the roadshow offered and really didn’t care about Joe public.

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The latest sked is in and it seems Louis is back up to speed doing 15.4 knots at the time. Charlie Dalin has been talking about reducing sail area is important otherwise the boats nosedives. I think the patience game is important less sail area means you are slower but not risking the boat. The sea state is also very difficult not allowing the boats to sail to their optimum performance. But this is what the SO is all about. 

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Are non foilers showing a good pace or am I biased towards them?

JLC and also Omnia are gaining miles on Malizia, and Seguin also looks slightly better then Bestaven now (did he choose to retract the foil at the end?).

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1 minute ago, DVV said:

Are non foilers showing a good pace or am I biased towards them?

JLC and also Omnia are gaining miles on Malizia, and Seguin also looks slightly better then Bestaven now (did he choose to retract the foil at the end?).

In these conditions the non foilers are probably not at risk as the foilers. Less loads on the boat. But as soon as the conditions allow the foilers will be off again. The Yo Yo effect is a normal part of the race.

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4 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

In these conditions the non foilers are probably not at risk as the foilers. Less loads on the boat. But as soon as the conditions allow the foilers will be off again. The Yo Yo effect is a normal part of the race.

Do you expect conditions to improve sensibly from here on? Le Cam, Malizia and the others nothern part of the fleet do not seem to have horrible conditions, and they are actually just at the beginning of a long SO run. Am I missing something?

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2 minutes ago, DVV said:

Do you expect conditions to improve sensibly from here on? Le Cam, Malizia and the others nothern part of the fleet do not seem to have horrible conditions, and they are actually just at the beginning of a long SO run. Am I missing something?

Most likely in less wind ATM and perhaps an easier sea state not sure. Less loads on their boats mean the non foilers can push harder sometimes. As soon as the sea state changes (Very confused ATM) the foilers will pick up their speed. 

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6 minutes ago, DVV said:

Do you expect conditions to improve sensibly from here on? Le Cam, Malizia and the others nothern part of the fleet do not seem to have horrible conditions, and they are actually just at the beginning of a long SO run. Am I missing something?

This is from Charlie Dalin it explains what I am trying to say too. 

Contacted this morning for the 5 o'clock radio session, the race leader Charlie Dalin, spoke at length about his sailing conditions in the Indian Ocean and the need to adapt to the sea state. The waves come to him from the side and he explains that he needs to adapt to a different rhythm being imposed by the South Seas.
There are blue skies and squalls. The state of the sea is the main issue and is what prevents us from accelerating. Every time I tried to put more sail up, I end up with big nose dives. In terms of wind, it ranges from between 30 to over 40 knots at times. I’ve had quite a bit of wind for a while now and it's not going to stop any time soon. But I've picked up my 'strong wind' rhythm. I managed to sleep well last night. For the last few days, I’ve had a little trouble eating, but I'm feeling better now. I'm starting to get used to the life in the Indian Ocean. I had a temporary setback yesterday, but I'm back in great shape. I can tune the boat, I know what wind angle I need to sail at, I've got into my Indian Ocean routine.
 
The worry is the cross sea. The wind alternates between South-West and North-West, so you sail perpendicular to the swell. So as soon as you catch a wave, you end up nose diving and every time you start the surf you just squeeze tight and hold on…
 
I compromise a lot; manoeuvres take time, they come at a price, so it has to be for an advantage. Yesterday, I was got caught out. It had got a bit lighter and I put up more sail and then the wind picked up and I had wipe out. There is still a long way to go.
 
But since we've been sailing in these conditions for almost a week now, I’m getting used to it. The human being has a great capacity to adapt. I realise that today. Two nights ago, there was a moment when I didn't know what to do. The boat was knocking around. I was being shaken on my bucket seat and yet I managed to fall asleep. I can't wait to get back to conditions that gives me a chance to make more use of the boat's performance.
 
The skies have been solid grey... but I've got sunshine for a change and it's nice. As the days are long, I feel like I get enough light. You can feel that you are moving towards the East: the sun is setting earlier and earlier, and it is also rising earlier and earlier. This morning it must have started to get light around 1am GMT and last night arrived around 5:30pm. There is a half hour difference in the day.  The nights are short and it's nice.  
 
It is beautiful, there are birds, rolling breakers and sailing on the Southern swell. The waves just go on and on rolling and breaking one after another. When there is a ray of sunshine, it brings out the blue of the water and the white of the foam. It's a beautiful to see.
 
I rarely go out. I'm either inside or in the cockpit adjusting and checking things and not so often in my wet weather gear. My life revolves around the weather files, 7/8 in the morning, 7/20 in the evening. I adjust my course. This is my routine. As for the rest, for meals, I try and keep stay on solar time. I've got a map of the time zones so that I can set the meals to solar time. I decided not to stay on French time.
 
It's not that cold. 9 degrees in the cockpit. In the boat it's almost 18... I haven't got out of the cold weather gear yet.
 
I am waiting for the wind shift (to the west) tomorrow night. It will allow me to gybe towards a new front approaching and if all goes well, it is a tack that could send us as far as Cape Leeuwin. If the timing is right, if I manage to keep up the pace, before the end of the weekend I'll be on port tack, a direct course towards the next cape.
 
Yes, I'm in the lead, but there are still so many miles to go, so many things can happen... everything in its own time, I'm taking each weather system one after the other....
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3 hours ago, Rainier said:

Love the idea of this race and have followed the last few races but I just can't understand how corporations can throw millions of dollars at what is basically a coin flip of a result every four years.

If you want to improve this race make it mandatory to install the tech to at least post mortem ID what you hit.  Doesn't have to prevent it but at least ID what all these "UFOs" are.

This race will die if it turns into Russian roulette.

This was all talked about a couple of days ago, the VG is very popular here in France, and always has been, most of the big sponsors are french market centered, a lot of them don't even do business outside of France. Read a couple of pages back for the discussions. They don't care want the anglos think, they only care about what the french think.

As a sponsor, and all the marketing part of it is well worked out, you get to be known for supporting a glorious, and gloriously perilous adventure. The position you finish at is important, real sailing fans will be paying attention, but it really is anecdotal, racing hard and giving all you got, alone, against the random odds of the oceans in a gloriously perilous enterprise is what really matters. Making the finish is an achievement in itself, and the ones that arrive 10, 20, 30 days or more after the first ones to cross the line will be celebrated just as much, and there will still be huge crowds lining the channel in the sables d'olonnes to welcome them back.

I believe there is a huge difference between the anglo-saxon psyche (anglo-saxon wannabees around the world included) and the french psyche in that regard.

I'm so surprised that some people don't get why sponsors back these teams, when it just seems so obvious to me (win or lose, everyone talks about all the skippers and their truly amazing adventure in France) that I believe it must be due to some very deeply rooted cultural difference.

As for the sposonrs themselves, I rather see companies sponsor the skippers (because the teams are really skipper lead) than "causes". When companies sponsor, the skippers don't become company salesmen, you don't hear Beyou saying "eat more meat", or Escoffier saying "buy more concrete", or Dalin saying "buy more insurance". The companies bring them out to company or press events to talk about sailing, about the challenges of the vendee globe... values that the company shares, but not to be a company salesman. But when "causes" sponsor, the deal is usually that the skippers become talking heads for the cause, they don't talk about sailing or the challenges of their endeavor anymore, they just repeat the marketing narrative they were briefed to give. It feels like they sold their souls.

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I try to sleep some nights .... catching up still on one completely lost this week.

Southern Ocean. Mea culpa x 2. One for technical innacuracy and Two for forgetting that on sailing Anarchy we prefer to argue the toss about semantics than lives too often.

So, you are Jacques Caraès the Race Director, or Lieutenant X, commanding the warship. Your call. Launch a RIB in difficult conditions putting the crew at risk? Ask Kevin to jump in the not quite southern enough for some ocean? Accidents happen, cranes fail, outboard engines break down. Are you going to accept responsibility for a decision which is NOT NECESSARY?

Sure they will assess conditions and have a go if they allow, but the forecast ahead on the optimum racing route, does not look like helping, does it? To what extent will they ask JLC to deviate from optimum? Tasmania or south island NZ? Still would need significant diversion probably, but should ensure safe transfer? Of course these options make it even tougher for the IJ.

I simply cannot see the justification for putting lives at unnecessary risk.

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https://twitter.com/LouisBurtonOff/status/1335158522221371394

Quote

Hier le skipper de @bureauvallee 2 a eu un problème électronique sur son pilote jusqu’à 1h30 du matin. Un des capteurs d’angle de barre de Louis Burton affichait des messages d’erreur. Le problème a été résolu. Le skipper et le bateau vont bien, ils reprennent leur route. pic.twitter.com/FvftXeJZFi

Quote

Yesterday the skipper of @bureauvallee 2 had an electronic problem on his pilot until 1:30 am. One of Louis Burton's rudder angle sensors was displaying error messages. The problem was resolved. The skipper and the boat are doing well, they are on their way again. pic.twitter.com/FvftXeJZFi

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14 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

This is from Charlie Dalin it explains what I am trying to say too. 

Contacted this morning for the 5 o'clock radio session, the race leader Charlie Dalin, spoke at length about his sailing conditions in the Indian Ocean and the need to adapt to the sea state. The waves come to him from the side and he explains that he needs to adapt to a different rhythm being imposed by the South Seas.
There are blue skies and squalls. The state of the sea is the main issue and is what prevents us from accelerating. Every time I tried to put more sail up, I end up with big nose dives. In terms of wind, it ranges from between 30 to over 40 knots at times. I’ve had quite a bit of wind for a while now and it's not going to stop any time soon. But I've picked up my 'strong wind' rhythm. I managed to sleep well last night. For the last few days, I’ve had a little trouble eating, but I'm feeling better now. I'm starting to get used to the life in the Indian Ocean. I had a temporary setback yesterday, but I'm back in great shape. I can tune the boat, I know what wind angle I need to sail at, I've got into my Indian Ocean routine.
 
The worry is the cross sea. The wind alternates between South-West and North-West, so you sail perpendicular to the swell. So as soon as you catch a wave, you end up nose diving and every time you start the surf you just squeeze tight and hold on…
 
I compromise a lot; manoeuvres take time, they come at a price, so it has to be for an advantage. Yesterday, I was got caught out. It had got a bit lighter and I put up more sail and then the wind picked up and I had wipe out. There is still a long way to go.
 
But since we've been sailing in these conditions for almost a week now, I’m getting used to it. The human being has a great capacity to adapt. I realise that today. Two nights ago, there was a moment when I didn't know what to do. The boat was knocking around. I was being shaken on my bucket seat and yet I managed to fall asleep. I can't wait to get back to conditions that gives me a chance to make more use of the boat's performance.
 
The skies have been solid grey... but I've got sunshine for a change and it's nice. As the days are long, I feel like I get enough light. You can feel that you are moving towards the East: the sun is setting earlier and earlier, and it is also rising earlier and earlier. This morning it must have started to get light around 1am GMT and last night arrived around 5:30pm. There is a half hour difference in the day.  The nights are short and it's nice.  
 
It is beautiful, there are birds, rolling breakers and sailing on the Southern swell. The waves just go on and on rolling and breaking one after another. When there is a ray of sunshine, it brings out the blue of the water and the white of the foam. It's a beautiful to see.
 
I rarely go out. I'm either inside or in the cockpit adjusting and checking things and not so often in my wet weather gear. My life revolves around the weather files, 7/8 in the morning, 7/20 in the evening. I adjust my course. This is my routine. As for the rest, for meals, I try and keep stay on solar time. I've got a map of the time zones so that I can set the meals to solar time. I decided not to stay on French time.
 
It's not that cold. 9 degrees in the cockpit. In the boat it's almost 18... I haven't got out of the cold weather gear yet.
 
I am waiting for the wind shift (to the west) tomorrow night. It will allow me to gybe towards a new front approaching and if all goes well, it is a tack that could send us as far as Cape Leeuwin. If the timing is right, if I manage to keep up the pace, before the end of the weekend I'll be on port tack, a direct course towards the next cape.
 
Yes, I'm in the lead, but there are still so many miles to go, so many things can happen... everything in its own time, I'm taking each weather system one after the other....

Thank you. This is very interesting.

What I was wondering, though, is:  arent these kind of conditions the most frequent in the stretch of Ocean they are going through until the Horn?

From what I've read over years, Souther Ocean frequently presents crossed waves and difficult seas. I'm just elaborating on JLC opinion on the un-fitness of those kind of boat for this long southern passage.

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Does anyone has a routing for Armel Tripon ? It seems he s going to be caught in light air for a long time.

I wish he could have faced the same conditions as the guys upfront to see how his boat manages the toughest sea

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7 minutes ago, Rafael said:

Quite spectacular short clip footage from Ms. Isabelle Joschke smokin' ! ok.png.76ed3db14a7fda286f780012469a9c60.png

Looks like fun but she'll be colder in the cockpit pretty soon. She looks relaxed and the boat looks good. She is doing a great job.! 

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2 minutes ago, DVV said:

Thank you. This is very interesting.

What I was wondering, though, is:  arent these kind of conditions the most frequent in the stretch of Ocean they are going through until the Horn?

From what I've read over years, Souther Ocean frequently presents crossed waves and difficult seas. I'm just elaborating on JLC opinion on the un-fitness of those kind of boat for this long southern passage.

Un-fitness of those kind of boat? Do you mean the foilers? Why don't we wait until the race is over and make that judgement?

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6 minutes ago, cortosam said:

Does anyone has a routing for Armel Tripon ? It seems he s going to be caught in light air for a long time.

Did this 3 day projection not work? He'll be slow until the next low catches up tomorrow.

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7 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

Looks like fun but she'll be colder in the cockpit pretty soon. She looks relaxed and the boat looks good. She is doing a great job.! 

The Good Hope w/ good Wind & good Sun... Carpe Diem! :D (tomorrow another story)

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25 minutes ago, Rafael said:

Quite spectacular short clip footage from Ms. Isabelle Joschke smokin' ! ok.png.76ed3db14a7fda286f780012469a9c60.png

Awesome.

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14 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

Un-fitness of those kind of boat? Do you mean the foilers? Why don't we wait until the race is over and make that judgement?

Of course, this is just saturday morning speculation, based on what we see. I'm not even the right person to judge, I do not have neither knowledge nor experience.

I remember I had - like anyone I guess - the same doubt last edition, but after Armel and Alex race I was quite conviced by foilers. This time they just seem more fragile.

May is just bad luck, this (VG) thing has some level of risk you cannot avoid. Did not want to look bad. Just too much pub talkig from my side

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3 hours ago, Rafael said:

It's Official, technical problems, but no details yet.

Autopilot. https://twitter.com/LouisBurtonOff/status/1335158522221371394?s=20

Quote

Yesterday the skipper of @bureauvallee 2 had an electronic problem on his pilot until 1:30 a.m. One of Louis Burton's rudder angle sensors was showing error messages. The problem was resolved. The skipper and the boat are doing well, they are on their way again.

 

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7 minutes ago, DVV said:

Of course, this is just saturday morning speculation, based on what we see. I'm not even the right person to judge, I do not have neither knowledge nor experience.

I remember I had - like anyone I guess - the same doubt last edition, but after Armel and Alex race I was quite conviced by foilers. This time they just seem more fragile.

May is just bad luck, this (VG) thing has some level of risk you cannot avoid. Did not want to look bad. Just too much pub talkig from my side

Well yes the Foilers have more to break. This time the foilers are more extreme than the last time. More loads. So it may well be the case that they do not make the course? We are only 30% of the race so a long way to go. 

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Burton is doing very well with last edition's winning boat. Much shorter foils than the new ones. Dalin also picked the less extreme foils of both sets.

Seems to work for both of them

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27 minutes ago, stief said:

Pip gives a tour of some maintenance.

[video]

Pip Hare is a pretty damn cool woman. Casually servicing winches and canting keels in the southern ocean.

Did anyone see this?

 

Am I correct in understanding that JLC took a flying fish to the face which caused the bleeding?

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4 minutes ago, Tylo said:

Pip Hare is a pretty damn cool woman. Casually servicing winches and canting keels in the southern ocean.

Did anyone see this?

 

Am I correct in understanding that JLC took a flying fish to the face which caused the bleeding?

Yes because the Auto Pilot failed so he had to manually steer. Leaving him in the elements I presume. Off course some might think Jean wasn't giving Kevin enough food and so Kevin gave Jean a gentle reminder they should both get the same.! :D

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7 minutes ago, Tylo said:

Am I correct in understanding that JLC took a flying fish to the face which caused the bleeding?

Yes

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Sigh. The faint hope Sam and team can fix the keel is gone, but she'll still continue . FR, but expect she'll have something in EN later.

Quote

his morning as she arrived in Cape Town she confirmed by video at 0900hrs UTC that she is officially retiring from the race. But she says she is determined to return - after making repairs with her team and experts - to complete the race course as 'hors course', unclassified on the solo race which forbids any kind of outside assistance. 

https://www.vendeeglobe.org/en/news/20819/sam-davies-retires-from-the-vendee-globe-but-wants-to-complete-the-route-hors-course

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1 hour ago, SCARECROW said:

 

I’m not sure about the Vendee but it is definitely the case with the Volvo that many of the sponsors did it for the corporate networking and entertainment opportunities the roadshow offered and really didn’t care about Joe public.

VOR was all corporate networking and entertainment. 2 times around ago was just after Mapfre had bought Commerce and a bunch of other US insurance carriers so they were pulling out all the stops for their corp people. Except the drunk dude with the clown wig who got thrown out. Doubt he had a job on Monday.

Volvo had meetings with fleet managers also.

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Haven’t we only seen 2 broken foils?

One caused by collision with a UFO and the other failure under load with the boat still coming second in the race.

Alex is out due to rudder failure after collision 
Sam is probably out due to keel floors after collision.

Kevin is out because his whole boat folded in half.  Was this because of foils?  We’ll never know.

Beyou had to go back and fix deck and rigging issues.

as we get more boats in the race with foils we’ll have more foilers having issues.  It’s not necessarily because they’re foilers though.

 

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Tylo said:

Am I correct in understanding that JLC took a flying fish to the face which caused the bleeding?

Laughed at the way they joke about the dangers of the race. Typical JLC. 

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28 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

Well yes the Foilers have more to break. This time the foilers are more extreme than the last time. More loads. So it may well be the case that they do not make the course? We are only 30% of the race so a long way to go. 

We'll see. That's one of the beauty of this amazing race! So many challenges: among designs, among among skippers, luck, OFNI, weather ecc.

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10 minutes ago, SCARECROW said:

Haven’t we only seen 2 broken foils?

One caused by collision with a UFO and the other failure under load with the boat still coming second in the race.

Alex is out due to rudder failure after collision 
Sam is probably out due to keel floors after collision.

Kevin is out because his whole boat folded in half.  Was this because of foils?  We’ll never know.

Beyou had to go back and fix deck and rigging issues.

as we get more boats in the race with foils we’ll have more foilers having issues.  It’s not necessarily because they’re foilers though.

 

 

 

 

 

True. Can we say we saw two broken foils and two failures which could probably have been influenced by the presence of them (Alex and Kevin)?

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14 minutes ago, LeoV said:

Dalin says confused seas keeps him from powering up. Tried to go fast, nosediving and a wipe out. And he is still not frost biting, 9 degrees outside, 18 inside.
https://www.vendeeglobe.org/en/news/20812/dalin-when-you-are-about-to-surf-down-a-wave-you-clench

PS, call it the Southern Oceans, problem solved.

Getting into the groove and looking ahead.

Quote

I can tune the boat, I know what wind angle I need to sail at, I've got into my Indian Ocean routine.[. . . ]

But since we've been sailing in these conditions for almost a week now, I’m getting used to it. . . . I can't wait to get back to conditions that gives me a chance to make more use of the boat's performance.

[aside] Just wait till the Horn and the maldives, faulklands rounding those islands.

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21 minutes ago, stief said:

Sigh. The faint hope Sam and team can fix the keel is gone, but she'll still continue . FR, but expect she'll have something in EN later.

https://www.vendeeglobe.org/en/news/20819/sam-davies-retires-from-the-vendee-globe-but-wants-to-complete-the-route-hors-course

She has to lift up the boat above the water to inspect the keel, so obviously she needs assistance for that, and has to give up the race but will go on sailing hopefully after the repairs to Les Sables-d'Olonne. Vendée Globe is over but a new aventure begins.

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Even without outside assistance, the moment you step foot on land, its over, its the "non-stop" part of the challenge.

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2 hours ago, mario147 said:

JLC numbers reassures my impression how silly weight cutting madness is. Cut your toothbrush, do not take spare rudder, talke less food than you may need? And we have a boat carrying probably more than 100 extra kg... and??? 

That's just the passenger on board as well.

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10 minutes ago, ant1 said:

Even without outside assistance, the moment you step foot on land high tide mark, it's over, it's the "non-stop" part of the challenge.

 

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15 minutes ago, stief said:

Getting into the groove and looking ahead.

And he is a Southern Newby, for him it is all new.
So far he has done well, preserved when Theta hit, fought hard in South Atlantic where the weather systems were not as expected for fast sailing days.
Now the chaotic Cape Horn passage.
He needs a break with some nice weather to go fast in the right direction.
Wonder how well his VMG to V ratio is over the whole course up to now.
And Ruyant and Burton chasing, then a whole group like Le Cam and Bestaven doing well. Race  ain't over.

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23 minutes ago, DVV said:

True. Can we say we saw two broken foils and two failures which could probably have been influenced by the presence of them (Alex and Kevin)?

Kevin’s is an old boat and Alex’s has a unique layout that removes structure from a highly loaded area.  But he didn’t drop out because of structural failures.  Pretty sure he’d be in 2nd of 3rd right now if he still had 2 rudders.

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1 minute ago, SCARECROW said:

Kevin’s is an old boat and Alex’s has a unique layout that removes structure from a highly loaded area.  But he didn’t drop out because of structural failures.  Pretty sure he’d be in 2nd of 3rd right now if he still had 2 rudders.

Let's not forget Seb was starting to get into his own before killing the foil.

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3 minutes ago, SCARECROW said:

Kevin’s is an old boat and Alex’s has a unique layout that removes structure from a highly loaded area.  But he didn’t drop out because of structural failures.  Pretty sure he’d be in 2nd of 3rd right now if he still had 2 rudders.

Agree

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25 minutes ago, LeoV said:

And he is a Southern Newby, for him it is all new.
So far he has done well, preserved when Theta hit, fought hard in South Atlantic where the weather systems were not as expected for fast sailing days.
Now the chaotic Cape Horn passage.
He needs a break with some nice weather to go fast in the right direction.
Wonder how well his VMG to V ratio is over the whole course up to now.
And Ruyant and Burton chasing, then a whole group like Le Cam and Bestaven doing well. Race  ain't over.

He and the foilers really need that nice weather window to live up to their hype. The Atlantic and dear St Helen surprised  even Marcus Hutchinson. He said he has never seen conditions like this before., "statistics are out the window."

Agree--not over. Lots still to watch for. Hoping we don't get a glass-out around Point Nemo B)

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15 minutes ago, Virgulino Ferreira said:

 

Clarisse is just so freakishly cool. She is kicking ass, and having the time of her life!

I really dislike her to be honest, i hate her "minauderies" , she thinks she's sexy and it is basically her storytelling so far, when she's just average for a french woman.

Typical of people graduated from french business schools, she graduated from HEC.

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wonder if we'll see a foil/dagger board combo design for the next go around?  Seems like the foilers are running into the same stuff you see moth sailors experience in heavy air and waves/chop.  They fly along at 20+ then the foil looses flow and big nose dive!  It's traumatic enough on a 60 lb, OD dingy.  Can't imagine the loads and stress put on a 60 ft- however many thousand pound vessel experiencing the same thing.  Bet the designers had a difficult time estimating and designing for those kinds of loads/stresses as well.

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1 minute ago, RobbieB said:

wonder if we'll see a foil/dagger board combo design for the next go around?  Seems like the foilers are running into the same stuff you see moth sailors experience in heavy air and waves/chop.  They fly along at 20+ then the foil looses flow and big nose dive!  It's traumatic enough on a 60 lb, OD dingy.  Can't imagine the loads and stress put on a 60 ft- however many thousand pound vessel experiencing the same thing.  Bet the designers had a difficult time estimating and designing for those kinds of loads/stresses as well.

They are limited in the number of moving appendages, so that's impossible.

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17 minutes ago, cortosam said:

I really dislike her to be honest, i hate her "minauderies" , she thinks she's sexy and it is basically her storytelling so far, when she's just average for a french woman.

Typical of people graduated from french business schools, she graduated from HEC.

You really like being a prick, don't you.

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3 minutes ago, Bebmoumoute said:

They are limited in the number of moving appendages, so that's impossible.

Got'cha.  They could have called it the "frankenfolier".

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2 minutes ago, Bebmoumoute said:

They are limited in the number of moving appendages, so that's impossible.

Could use a canting T-Foil instead of the Dali foils maybe.

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31 minutes ago, cortosam said:

I really dislike her to be honest, i hate her "minauderies" , she thinks she's sexy and it is basically her storytelling so far, when she's just average for a french woman.

Typical of people graduated from french business schools, she graduated from HEC.

Nobody likes you or your shitty posts.

Post tits or GTFO noob.

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1 minute ago, cortosam said:

I really dislike her to be honest, i hate her "minauderies" , she thinks she's sexy and it is basically her storytelling so far, when she's just average for a french woman.

Typical of people graduated from french business schools, she graduated from HEC.

Fair enough, to each his own. I really dislike Alex Thomson, for example.

I became a fan of Clarisse right after the very first videos that she posted on youtube, at the start of her mini transat project. I saw a very smart and talented woman, and a gifted communicator, running a stand out campaign, with little money but very professional, very business like. It was later that she started doing really well at the races, and by the time she started the mini transat me and my wife were hooked, we followed that mini transat like never before, rooting for her.

As for "playing the sexy card", I don't see she doing that. Maybe because I'm from Brazil, or maybe because every single one of the women out there racing boats is sexy as hell to me.

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I know a few women like Clarisse here in Zurich (same mannerisms). Generally I'd agree with cortosam, not my type for sure. However, in her case she's proved in the Classe Mini that she's a hell of a sailor and she's doing great so far in this race so she's ok by me. 

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Lots of sailing incels angry that a girl has a boat well beyond their budget.

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18 minutes ago, terrafirma said:

Anyone know if there is an English version of the analysis of why PRB may have snapped in two? 

https://www.voileetmoteur.com

Sorry too lazy to tranlsate now, but nothing new:

  • boat was lighter than the rest of the fleet, has been heavily modified structure-wise
  • Possibility of the foils pushing down in a surf
  • unknowns about the slamming forces and foil forces (specially in torsion)
  • unknowns about how caron structure ages and fatigue

 

Lots of speculation.

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1 hour ago, stief said:

He and the foilers really need that nice weather window to live up to their hype. The Atlantic and dear St Helen surprised  even Marcus Hutchinson. He said he has never seen conditions like this before., "statistics are out the window."

Agree--not over. Lots still to watch for. Hoping we don't get a glass-out around Point Nemo B)

Designers design on parameters including expected weather. The old adagio - be in the first group South still holds.
Glass out or even worse Easterly winds ...

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1 hour ago, LeoV said:


So far he has done well,

He learns quickly. He follows Peyron's advice by treating the boat like a bamboo stick. 

Apparently, Alex thinks it is an oak. :lol::rolleyes:

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13 minutes ago, steinbrenner said:

Do we see pinky crocs on Sam's feet while chatting with alex?

Alex's present to her. The marketing continues on land. 

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16 minutes ago, steinbrenner said:

Do we see pinky crocs on Sam's feet while chatting with alex?

They all wear them (Gabart at the 2013 Fasnet start).

DSC_4847.jpg

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4 minutes ago, stief said:

She said that according to the Bateaux interview:

Quote

Par contre, il y a trois jours quand ça m'est arrivé, j'ai pensé que j'allais mourir, mais une fois que j'ai géré la crise, j'ai pensé que j'allais arrêter la voile. Je me suis dit : « c'est débile, c'est n'importe quoi, j'arrête la voile, je ne fais plus ça ».

When the accident happenned 3 days ago, I thought I would die, but once I dealt with the crisis, I thought I would stop sailing. I thought "this is stupid, this is nonsense, I stop sailing, I won't ever do this again".

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While the keelbox is largely intact the rest of the boat is no longer firmly attached to it. If things go wrong that leaves a huge hole in the boat. Would the rest hold together for a moment or fail similar to PRB?
Certainly a moment to think about survival. 

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"Pour ce qui est des bonifications dont vont bénéficier ceux qui se sont déroutés – cela ne concerne malheureusement plus Sébastien Simon qui vient d’abandonner -, je pense que Jean pourra obtenir 12 à 15 heures de crédit, et il va sans doute avoir une bonification supplémentaire pour la dépose de Kevin dans les prochains jours. Ce sauvetage ne lui a pas fait changer de système météo immédiatement ; par contre à moyen terme, ce retard pourrait le faire tomber dans un schéma météo différent. La bonification ne pourra de toute façon pas être parfaite."

Yoann Richomme gives us some insights on the time bonus that will be granted to Jean Le Cam, between 12 and 15 hours according to him. Problem is , he will be in a different meteo system later on in the indian and according to the routing, will probably lose 500 miles on 

https://www.tipandshaft.com/vendee-globe/yoann-richomme/jean-louis-isa-et-les-autres/

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21 minutes ago, Bebmoumoute said:

She said that according to the Bateaux interview:

When the accident happenned 3 days ago, I thought I would die, but once I dealt with the crisis, I thought I would stop sailing. I thought "this is stupid, this is nonsense, I stop sailing, I won't ever do this again".

I know. That's why I pointed out she didn't mention it in the VG-EN article.

In any case, glad we'll be able to follow her like we did Enda. Guess I need to get a Facebook account, too.

Quote

If the boat is repairable, I am determined to leave the race again. It's my philosophy and that of the team. The Vendée Globe is a huge adventure. I always had a lot of respect for those who ended up out of the race. Isabelle Autisier, but also Enda (editor's note O'Coineen), I think he was the last person to do that, long after Nick Moloney following a bowling accident, who ended up out of the race a year later. I have a lot of respect for that, I think it's part of the adventure. If I can be one of those adventurers, I will be, even if it is not easy because I am a competitor with a great boat. I am also an adventurer, passionate about the sea and the oceans, and I want to save children with Initiatives-Cœur.

 

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"Pour ce qui est des bonifications dont vont bénéficier ceux qui se sont déroutés – cela ne concerne malheureusement plus Sébastien Simon qui vient d’abandonner -, je pense que Jean pourra obtenir 12 à 15 heures de crédit, et il va sans doute avoir une bonification supplémentaire pour la dépose de Kevin dans les prochains jours. Ce sauvetage ne lui a pas fait changer de système météo immédiatement ; par contre à moyen terme, ce retard pourrait le faire tomber dans un schéma météo différent. La bonification ne pourra de toute façon pas être parfaite."

Yoann Richomme gives us some insights on the time bonus that will be granted to Jean Le Cam, between 12 and 15 hours according to him. Problem is , he will be in a different meteo system later on in the indian and according to the routing, will probably lose 500 miles on Charlie Dalin.

https://www.tipandshaft.com/vendee-globe/yoann-richomme/jean-louis-isa-et-les-autres/

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49 minutes ago, troll99 said:

Alex's present to her.

That's what I thought too

 

49 minutes ago, troll99 said:

The marketing continues on land. 

But he's wearing brown flipflops?! Maybe Boss though(:

46 minutes ago, Bebmoumoute said:

They all wear them (Gabart at the 2013 Fasnet start).

DSC_4847.jpg

Accent on pink-->Boss

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