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Brexit WTF, WTF

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41 minutes ago, dullers said:

Not Yes Minister is it.....

Word is that BJ attacked Barnier and his unwillingness to compromise so the UK can be sovereign, then cracked a bad ww2 joke. When asked if he had a plan of compromise proposal, he had nothing. It was not pleasant. But because of secrecy rules agreed on, it will take years to really find out.

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53 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

Anyway my understanding is that all the EU's No Deal contingency plans are individual sectors and not dependant on the other.

Possible but very unlikely. More likely is that french fishermen are already reinforcing their boats with steel plates and the EU wants to avoid violent issues in the channel... 

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50 minutes ago, LeoV said:

We can now afford to lose you.’

Your leaders obviously don't think so, hence all the need to try and keep us in line with the EU.

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Dutch PM Rutte on Johnson's announcement that he is prepared to travel to Paris, Berlin, other capitals to clinch a deal: 'I would like to invite him to stay in London and work hard. Capitals don't negotiate, Barnier does, has our full support'.

Blunt as ever.... and he was the best friend of the UK in the EU political arena.

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43 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

Your leaders obviously don't think so, hence all the need to try and keep us in line with the EU.

No, they don't. Only if you want to have access to our markets, then of course. But you can of course be fully independent and sovereign, but please don't ask for access to the EU markets. That would be bad for UK as well as EU, but it's your choice. Fishing is regulated by UN rules by the way.. 

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Britain’s customs system is not ready for the end of the post-Brexit transition, a House of Lords committee has said. In a letter to the Cabinet Office minister Michael Gove, the Conservative Lady Verma, who chairs the EU goods sub-committee in the Lords said:
We are not confident that all the necessary technological, physical and welfare arrangements will be in place in time to avoid or mitigate significant disruption following the end of the transition period. Key customs IT systems, some of them going live at the end of this month, are still in development and testing. Similarly, construction of port and inland customs facilities is still ongoing and, in some locations, yet to begin.

In report;
We are astonished that, less than a month before the introduction of significant
changes to customs processes and less than seven months before the introduction of
full customs checks, the Government has not yet allocated the £200 million port
infrastructure fund. There is also a serious concern that the fund is “significantly
oversubscribed”, as Mr Morris told us.


And more; big pdf alert;
https://committees.parliament.uk/publications/3919/documents/39339/default/

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17 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

No, they don't. Only if you want to have access to our markets, then of course. But you can of course be fully independent and sovereign, but please don't ask for access to the EU markets. That would be bad for UK as well as EU, but it's your choice. Fishing is regulated by UN rules by the way.. 

So you are happy for UK to tariff everything coming from the EU to the UK, you can't have it both ways ?

 

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2 hours ago, Waynemarlow said:

Ah but the same applies to all the EU's planes, truck, drivers and EU visitors to the UK.

 

8 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

So you are happy for UK to tariff everything coming from the EU to the UK, you can't have it both ways ?

 

Doesn't seem to bother that much the EU :

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-no-deal-boris-johnson-call-merkel-macron-b1769975.html

Macron and Merkel don't even bother to take his phone calls any more...

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What is coming from the UK? Services? Not anymore. City of London? No. Cars? Forget it, all foreign owned and will move to EU. Cheddar? Nobody eats that stuff here. Other foods? Come on..... we don't eat baked beans.. 

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38 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

What is coming from the UK?

Ah but that is the whole point, any tariff war will mean a bonanza for Rishi courtesy of the EU or perhaps we may well import from elsewhere at a cheaper rate, after all we no longer have to meet the EU protectionist quotas. Those busy ports at Dover may just get a lot less used and Felixstowe continues to expand.

I think you might be under a bit of an illusion if you think say Germany can do without the City of London for its finances in the short term.

A question with all the shenanagins, Ireland with its land bridge via the UK and no real direct shipping services to the continent, must be quaking in its boots. Will the EU step up and bung Ireland a load of cash to pay for all the duties that are going to occur every time an Irish truck lands on Brit soil, only to have to ask for a refund as they go out via Dover, now thats going to be a long and slow process.

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12 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

Yes it makes sense to increase direct shipping to Ireland

New DFDS service between Dunkerque and Rosslare 6 times a week. Additional Stena service Rosslare Cherbourg, New BF service BF Cherbourg .... 

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North Macedonia has a big catalyst converter factory, UK owned, without that the whole UK car industry is fucked.
So no Irish trucks given an easy route, no UK trucks passing through the EU to Turkey, Ukraine, NM, and more.

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6 minutes ago, LeoV said:

North Macedonia has a big catalyst converter factory, UK owned, without that the whole UK car industry is fucked.
So no Irish trucks given an easy route, no UK trucks passing through the EU to Turkey, Ukraine, NM, and more.

And the tit for tat can go on for ever, all because our political mumpties on both sides of the channel couldn't work out a deal that was equitable to the man on the street in 3 years, all for the sake of a political agenda. How fucked up is that.

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fmtt ... Boris will be coming to Brussels again this weekend, frequent flyer or what ? if this keeps on going we'll have to give him an honorary citizenshit (error intended)

what is also pathetic is that once again Boris asked to shift discussions to him, Macron and Merkel, and for the umpteenth time the reply was "nope, you discuss this with Barnier and the EU comission"... will it ever get through his (and Wayne's) thick skull that the request to discuss it only with France and Germany is an insult to all other countries and therefore the most counterproductive way, if ever such a discussion would happen, and if ever such a discussion would end up in a proposal you can bet that other EU countries would veto it just out of general principle

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7 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

And the tit for tat can go on for ever, all because our political mumpties on both sides of the channel couldn't work out a deal that was equitable to the man on the street in 3 years, all for the sake of a political agenda. How fucked up is that.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-deal-eu-boris-johnson-ursula-b1769899.html?jwsource=cl

Ursula explained in simple english words what it is about. If the UK can't agree to these conditions, cause BJ believes to have some kind of special rights to get free access to the largest market in the world and also has the right to undercut EU companies, well I don't know how this guys can be helped. Maybe we should add something against brain problems in the covid vaccine.... 

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17 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

Maybe we should add something against brain problems in the covid vaccine.... 

Some people wondering what is wrong with UK, BJ, and Wayne. 

Simply, it is a N A T I O N A L I S M. 

You are prepared to endure some shit for that and it also defies logic and reasons. Sovereignty is just a beautiful word to cover up the ugly truth. 

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Agree. 

If I had the chance to talk to Barnier I would tell him that if a member leaves our club cause he don't like the clubrules and don't like to pay, but keeps asking for access to the clubs facilities and a berth we would propably tell him either to go somewhere else or ask minimum twice of what he has paided as a member. I think we already offer far too much... And we would not even start to discuss about the clubrules... 

 

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1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

Ah but that is the whole point, any tariff war will mean a bonanza for Rishi courtesy of the EU or perhaps we may well import from elsewhere at a cheaper rate, after all we no longer have to meet the EU protectionist quotas. Those busy ports at Dover may just get a lot less used and Felixstowe continues to expand.

I think you might be under a bit of an illusion if you think say Germany can do without the City of London for its finances in the short term.

A question with all the shenanagins, Ireland with its land bridge via the UK and no real direct shipping services to the continent, must be quaking in its boots. Will the EU step up and bung Ireland a load of cash to pay for all the duties that are going to occur every time an Irish truck lands on Brit soil, only to have to ask for a refund as they go out via Dover, now thats going to be a long and slow process.

Felixstow is expanding in Zeebrugge. Because they will not be able to handle the additional containers and ships

Last time I checked, Zeebrugge is in Belgium.

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2 hours ago, jgh66 said:

What is coming from the UK? Services? Not anymore. City of London? No. Cars? Forget it, all foreign owned and will move to EU. Cheddar? Nobody eats that stuff here. Other foods? Come on..... we don't eat baked beans.. 

Actually, I do like to have a full english breakfast now and then, so yes to baked beans! Keep the sausages, though. :)

And there is more: short bread, tea, various single malt whiskys, Vox and Laney amps aaaand ... the list ends here, for me, I am afraid.

Classic british cars and motorcyles are contenders, but not currently. The modern versions don't do much for me.

 

I am really sorry to see this whole Brexit thing turning out much worse than I could have imagined.

Bad idea, badly executed by the worst man possible. It's like watching a life long friend and partner turn into a mumbling vegetable, spending his days on the bottom of his pint, overwhelmed by just about everything to do with reality.

No Schadenfreude involved, at all.

 

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1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

A question with all the shenanagins, Ireland with its land bridge via the UK and no real direct shipping services to the continent, must be quaking in its boots. Will the EU step up and bung Ireland a load of cash to pay for all the duties that are going to occur every time an Irish truck lands on Brit soil, only to have to ask for a refund as they go out via Dover, now thats going to be a long and slow process.

Ireland’s worst day ever as part of the EU will likely be exponentially better than it’s best day ever as part of the UK.

 

We’ll be just grand as always, no matter what shite ye POMs dish up.

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Whyne cannot even read what is posted here, far less find out any useful info for himself. We have several times covered the huge increase in direct Republic of Ireland to EU ferry and shipping services, and more are in the wings once the players see how things go, and everyone recovers a little from the economic damage of Covid-19.

Felixstowe has failing Grayling as a highly paid consultant .... Saturated, turning away ships, chaos .... The smart operators on services to the UK are already using, and looking to expand use of, other ports on the east coast of England and even Scotland to avoid the horlicks of the SE and the total lack of UK gov preparation.

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not mention the difficulty of creating jobs if the UK buys stuff abroad and ignoring the EU. The EU can survive a smaller economical shock and move on. 

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Some ships already just unload in Rotterdam cause they can't wait until Felixstowe is able to unload them, and tell the Brits that they shall pick up their containers in NED. How this is going to work in the new year - who knows... Dutch Hauliers seem to not have much interest to go for days of unpaid holidays in Kent, not sure if British lorries may drive in the EU, what about customs if they just unload in NED... etc. 

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I am hearing that Irish Ferries are desperately trying to find suitable ships to charter for EU Eire services, with P&O Pride of Burgundy being mentioned. The big operators with large fleets on many routes (Stena and DFDS) are potentially on a big win.

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The EU will propably do as much as they can to help Ireland to get stuff from the EU if the Landbridge stops working I would guess.. 

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1 hour ago, cms said:

Whyne cannot even read what is posted here, far less find out any useful info for himself. We have several times covered the huge increase in direct Republic of Ireland to EU ferry and shipping services, and more are in the wings once the players see how things go, and everyone recovers a little from the economic damage of Covid-19.

Understood for the future and as I have stated previously, all for the Irish lorries not damaging our motorways for no return to the locals, but you guys are hammering the 1st Jan and no the services from the continent to the Eire are not yet in place in sufficient numbers to keep Eire produce moving.

47 minutes ago, cms said:

I am hearing that Irish Ferries are desperately trying to find suitable ships to charter for EU Eire services,

 

17 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

The EU will propably do as much as they can to help Ireland to get stuff from the EU if the Landbridge stops working I would guess.. 

How, put on extra flights ?

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1 minute ago, Waynemarlow said:

How, put on extra flights ?

To Ireland, yes no problem, 26 members to help  UK:

 

No-deal Brexit will be ‘wonderful’, Boris Johnson insists, as prospects of an agreement fade

 

France and Germany refuse direct talks - with just two days left for a breakthrough - and PM admits crash-out departure now ‘very likely

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So you honestly think it would be cheaper to put on flights than to simply pay the tax and refund it on the way out, talk about way out there with your thinking.

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35 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

The EU will propably do as much as they can to help Ireland to get stuff from the EU if the Landbridge stops working I would guess.. 

Yes and even Gibraltar will get survival packages...

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2 minutes ago, Knut Grotzki said:

Yes and even Gibraltar will get survival packages...

Guys even on a SA level, you are getting into weird territory if you think all trucking and border crossing is going to stop.

Fantasies or just pure lack of realism of the situation brings out some weird computer rhetoric at times.

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57 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

Guys even on a SA level, you are getting into weird territory if you think all trucking and border crossing is going to stop.

Fantasies or just pure lack of realism of the situation brings out some weird computer rhetoric at times.

Hmm, in the middle of the 90s I had to travel regulary to Poland, sometimes twice a week. There was far less traffic compared to EU/GB, custom systems were in place for quite some time and no ferry or eurotunnel. Basic time for lorries to cross the border was 48h. When I look at your current situation, a border crossing will propably soon take min. 5 days.... 

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7 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

When I look at your current situation, a border crossing will propably soon take min. 5 days.... 

 

1 hour ago, Waynemarlow said:

Fantasies or just pure lack of realism of the situation brings out some weird computer rhetoric at times.

What more can one say.

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6 hours ago, jgh66 said:

What is coming from the UK? Services? Not anymore. City of London? No. Cars? Forget it, all foreign owned and will move to EU. Cheddar? Nobody eats that stuff here. Other foods? Come on..... we don't eat baked beans.. 

Actually, Cheddar could be an issue for the UK as much is imported from Europe. My personal favourite is made in the Republic of Ireland, but one of the biggest producers is down the road in Fougères.

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2 days, real possibility, papers not in order etc. But 5 days, only if the UK trade stuff gets so cheap and can be stuck for 5 days... but then we have containers.
And as Wayne says, a lot of industry dependable of JIT EU stuff will just move...next investment round for them will not be UK.

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Cheese people are now looking for the two feet they shot off.....and a lot of English people to start eating more cheese.

On 12/5/2020 at 9:01 PM, jack_sparrow said:

Robert Pouget runs the Oxford Cheese company which produces and sells cheeses and chutneys.

This is him before the referendum.

17 June 2016 - 'I don't think Brexit would mean tariffs'

This is him after the referendum 

1 July 2016 - 'The pound dropping is a net advantage'

I wish the BBC would ask him what he thinks of his Brexit now? 

 

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24 minutes ago, Waynemarlow said:

 

What more can one say.

Well, I would say the UK government has been highly negligent.

There was no chance of an agreement because BJ drove the nationalist / sovereign bus hoping the EU would bend over. No sane group would say sure - here's a refund for your dues, thanks for being a member all those years, but look we will give you the clubhouse key anyway - use it anyway you want.

A pragmatic leader would have insisted on mitigation from day 1 - assume a no deal and prep for it - at least it would have sent a clear signal to the EU. But nooooooooooooooo. Don't make any hard decisions. Don't work out the impact and mitigation methods a few years ago. We're better negotiators than those &^%$# continentals. It'll all work out - we will force them to accept our special claims.

None of the Brit complaints about the EU that brought on brexit have been resolved.....

Fishing Quotas: UN Controlled & Treaties. Nationalistic on all sides. No one will want to move from status quo (except the brits of course)
Red Tape: Still there, but of course when you leave the club you cant benefit from the boiler plate anymore - you have to make your own red tape to make it work, more expense, plus still have to conform to EU red tape if you want to sell a product there.
Level Playing Field: was there, still is, wont go away,  if you want to sell your products into that field either you have the same input methodologies & costs or you incur a tariff
Trade Imbalance: 18B surplus in services (mainly financial, which is the easiest industry to pickup and move to another country), - 97B shortfall in goods. That sucks. The brits are not overly competitive at cost efficient manufacturing (and now the manufacturers have to deal with additional costs that make them less competitive in Europe even without tariffs), dont have the landmass to be highly more efficient than EU producers, even with EU qouta bloat causing inefficiencies.
GFA: An unbreakable treaty (unless the brits want to really piss off the US, who are guarantors.) 
The list goes on, and on and on.
 

So basically Brexiteers, BJ and the elk simply said, FU all. We're not going to pay the exorbitant annual fees, we like our own laws, we dont want you to have any control over us, treaties are only worth the paper they are written on, oh and by the way, we demand you give us special treatment because, like, we are your neighbours and used to be friends.

Fairy tale. Always was, Always will be. It's a divorce where the red lines are so far apart the only outcome will be acrimonius. Anyone who thinks divorces are equitable & logically argued, with participants on both sides being empathetic, charitable need a spell at the divorce ER.

Stock up on food and drugs of choice. You're going to need it. You have absolutely no clue how easily finetuned JIT systems breakdown and spiral out of control exponentially. A no deal exit without mitigation at this late stage is like smashing an uncooked egg with a 10 tonne wrecking ball.

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, dfw_sailor said:

Well, I would say the UK government has been highly negligent.

Isn't there anything stronger than highly negligent??

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Just now, jack_sparrow said:

Isn't there anything stronger than highly negligent??

Pig headed, Stupid, Ammoral, Deceptive, Abusive, Two-faced, Selfish, Arrogant, Delusional, Misinformed, Irrational, Scheming. I'd get the thesaurus out, but it would be cheaper to pay a monkey to randomly type. Eventually the monkey would get all the words.

The words above describe my ex-wife during our divorce. I succeeded in getting court ordered counselling but she just did the minimum. Turned up to each session and refused to say a single word. But she met the minimum legal requirement. I was also financially generous to a fault (to the annoyance of my lawyer, who said it was pointless, it wouldn't be thanked, and only used to ask for more and more and future years. I was naïve back then - that was 20 years ago.)

I think the words apply equally well to Brexiteers and their elk.

I fully support the EU if they just tell the Brits to fuck off. It's too late for niceties.

 

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17 minutes ago, LeoV said:

2 days, real possibility, papers not in order etc. But 5 days, only if the UK trade stuff gets so cheap and can be stuck for 5 days... but then we have containers.
And as Wayne says, a lot of industry dependable of JIT EU stuff will just move...next investment round for them will not be UK.

When did you see a high traffic border with full custom controls and checks, 50000 custom agents missing,  IT Systems in beta stage plus crossing some water? Might be less cause many EU hauliers will refuse to drive to the UK... 

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So BJ get his deal now; reckless with the amount of preparation on UK side.
No Deal, costly, stupid and naive.
In both cases, UK made itself an outcast in the EU. So much damage done to the relationship since 08.

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1 minute ago, jgh66 said:

When did you see a high traffic border with full custom controls and checks, 50000 custom agents missing,  IT Systems in beta stage plus crossing some water? Might be less cause many EU hauliers will refuse to drive to the UK... 

yep, you can not find EU drivers to wait for 2 days in a line, nope, not even East Europeans. As here is work in other places.
And the lng waitinglist now, 6 hours or more, is for stockpiling. I bet the first weeks will see lower traffic, but still huge waiting times. And maybe even ferries leaving the UK almost empty :)

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Heard the brits are preparing 8 warships to fight against french fishermen from 1.1.21. Good base to get a deal.... 

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And then I said, ‘tell him that no meeting is better than a bad meeting’.”
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4 minutes ago, jgh66 said:

Heard the brits are preparing 8 warships to fight against french fishermen from 1.1.21. Good base to get a deal.... 

Have you got a link for that?

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There are simple and durable solutions to all of the remaining problems but unfortunately the Tories have painted themselves into a corner from which there appears to be no escape and from where easy answers are unacceptable. As I understand it the deal is 98 - 99% agreed but BJ cannot accept the remaining issues without losing the support of many of his MPs. He has already shafted the DUP.

The upshot will probably be ruinous for the UK and not much better for Ireland. I just cant see any good outcomes from the current position

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arrumph

Norway says it could block EU, British fishing vessels from Jan 1

OSLO (Reuters) - Norway may stop British and EU vessels fishing in its waters from Jan. 1, its fisheries minister said on Friday, as talks on the management of common North Sea stocks have been held up by London’s protracted Brexit standoff with Brussels.

Norway, which is not part of the EU but is part of the European single market, had previously negotiated annually with the bloc about the management of common fish stocks, access to each other’s waters and exchange of fish quotas.

That has had to change following Britain’s withdrawal from the EU. Britain completes its departure from the EU’s orbit on Dec. 31.
In September, Norway and Britain agreed a so-called “framework” agreement on which to base their future relations on fisheries.

But on one specific issue - the management of North Sea fish that swim between waters belonging to the EU, Norway and Britain - Oslo wants a trilateral deal in place. And these negotiations have not yet started.

https://www.reuters.com/article/britain-eu-norway-fisheries

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6 minutes ago, Lynch said:

There are simple and durable solutions to all of the remaining problems but unfortunately the Tories have painted themselves into a corner from which there appears to be no escape and from where easy answers are unacceptable. As I understand it the deal is 98 - 99% agreed but BJ cannot accept the remaining issues without losing the support of many of his MPs. He has already shafted the DUP.

The upshot will probably be ruinous for the UK and not much better for Ireland. I just cant see any good outcomes from the current position

I'm not trying to be argumentative - id genuinely like to know what the simple and durable solutions are for Level Playing Field & the GFA. I've only listed 2, to keep it simple.

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IF negotiations end Sunday, then of the 1,652 days between June 24th 2016 & December 31st 2020 this Tory government will have given businesses 9 days pre Xmas to prepare for Brexit changes. While UK gov itself is not ready by any means. Brilliant minds.
Nothing has changed since June in the EU stance, not withstanding UK newspaper stories. 9 days of real transitioning period.

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1 hour ago, jgh66 said:

Heard the brits are preparing 8 warships to fight against french fishermen from 1.1.21. Good base to get a deal.... 

Last time they did that the Iceland Coastguard beat them up.....and that was when they had a Navy.

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I had missed this, the dark side of Brexiteers :

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/brexit-campaign-worker-jailed-emails-23099281

Funny that there was very little about this. Bearing in mind the Jo Cox tragedy, I would have expected this kind of stuff to reach the front pages.

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Every day it seems to get more crazy. Alone the idea to prepare 8 warships, sorry. What do they expect? What shall the EU do? Command all Frontex plus EU navies into the channel for a training session on how to protect EU coasts? Sit down and laugh? Wait for the US to send some carriers?  

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The threatening to use lethal force on unarmed civilians stage of the negotiations is very normal in trade talks.... not. And Tory MP's tweeting about starting a war over fish... idiots.

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1 hour ago, crashdog said:

How to win friends and influence people.

England has a long history with Gunboat diplomacy

980x551-copy-of-mc140067017.jpg

Remote fully automated mount

A single mounting carrying an Oerlikon 30mm gun, it was designed as a ship-protection system to defend Royal Navy frigates from various short-range missiles, rockets, grenades and explosives. 

The gun is controlled from a remote operator console elsewhere on the ship.

Short-range anti-aircraft gun

A simple hand operated mounting carrying a single Oerlikon KAA200 automatic cannon. It can fire 1000 rounds a minute and has a range of 2000m.

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As far as I understand UK several fishers sold or leased some or all of their fishing rights to EU fishers.
Any idea how that gets handled? Or is it one more thing still in the air?

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4 hours ago, KC375 said:

England has a long history with Gunboat diplomacy

Yes Suez worked out a treat. 

That signaled the end of Britain as a global military force. 

Brexit is going to signal the end of Britain as an economic and political force.. 

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Think about all this stuff Brits took for granted and now worthless.

EHIC card, pet passports, ability to work/retire, no roaming charges, no green card, no international driving licence, no visas. 

They won't complain of course as they are getting 'sovereingty cards' in return that will allow them to? .....mmmmmm.........maybe Wayne can help out here??

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2 hours ago, Chasm said:

As far as I understand UK several fishers sold or leased some or all of their fishing rights to EU fishers.
Any idea how that gets handled? Or is it one more thing still in the air?

Yes a lot....big problem and UK canvassing solutions like prohibiting them flying the Union Jack to avoid paying just compensation. That an international treaty problem in itself.

What's another international treaty to break if you have already set fire to one. 

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5 hours ago, LeoV said:

The threatening to use lethal force on unarmed civilians stage of the negotiations is very normal in trade talks.... not. And Tory MP's tweeting about starting a war over fish... idiots.

Attacking civilians with military force for the right to catch types of fish that most Britons don’t eat, and that the UK will no longer be able to export to France.

That's many rungs below idiots even though they are being whipped to tweet.

The MP for Shrewsbury

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Bet you don't know why Thatcher had this picture taken.

- The UK has not been able to feed itself since the early 19th century.

- The 1970s was a decade of serious anxiety about food supplies. Caused by a mixture of bad harvests, food proceser/bakers strike, population growth, inflation & the collapse of the pound and Commonwealth trade agreements etc. Commonwealth selling to closer and more lucrative markets elsewhere.

-  Supermarkets introduced informal rationing. The government considered rationing all basic foodstuffs.

- The above played a significant role in the decision to join the EEC,

In late 1974, with EEC referendum pending, Margaret Thatcher had to open her cupboards to journalists to prove that she wasn't hoarding food.

Johnson keeps saying he's "full of beans". Anyone checked out his kitchen cupboards, in the kitchen with the burnt out microwave??

Thatcher wrote at the time "every second meal we eat we import". That is the same ratio today. 

Wayne is looking forward to enjoying his diet of pebbles and muddy rainwater.

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47 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Bet you don't know why Thatcher had this picture taken.

- The UK has not been able to feed itself since the early 19th century.

Now that China is fucking us over, we have excess foodstuffs to sell.

Problem there is - what has the UK got to pay us?

FKT

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8 hours ago, LeoV said:

OSLO (Reuters) - Norway may stop British and EU vessels fishing in its waters from Jan. 1, its fisheries minister said on Friday,.....

In September, Norway and Britain agreed a so-called “framework” agreement on which to base their future relations on fisheries.....

https://www.reuters.com/article/britain-eu-norway-fisheries

Which at the time George Eustice dishonestly promoted as a comprehensive fishing rights deal with Norway over their respective EEZ's.

The clock has caught the truth twisters out.

funny-gif-Monty-Python-clock-hands.gif.350a7c68232a936bcc06970bea564c15.gif

 

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4 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:
53 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Bet you don't know why Thatcher had this picture taken.

- The UK has not been able to feed itself since the early 19th century.

Now that China is fucking us over, we have excess foodstuffs to sell.

Problem there is - what has the UK got to pay us?

FKT

And Australia has a FTA with China, whilst 'anti dumping' claim gives China rights to hike tarrifs, it will take WTO eons to rectify that bullshit claim.

While little comfort to those in the 7 sectors impacted they represent only 4% of Aust AUD$150 bn exports to China and 2% of all exports. 

As for UK Aust Trade filling that surplus not a lot of opportunity.

Already beef, wine and sheepmeat together make up 83 per cent of Australia's total agricultural exports to UK.

Already one in five imported bottles of wine consumed in the UK is from Australia under a virtually tarrif free deal that predated the SM. 

Coming the other way as a quid pro quo top 3 imports from UK are motor vehicles, machinary and electrical goods. 

I suspect Brits will want to get on the piss to block out their Brexit pain. Therefore some more wine might already be earmarked, but payment € ex store and cleared before loading.  :lol:

 

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2 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

And Australia has a FTA with China, whilst 'anti dumping' claim gives China rights to hike tarrifs, it will take WTO eons to rectify that bullshit claim.

While little comfort to those in the 7 sectors impacted they represent only 4% of Aust AUD$150 bn exports to China and 2% of all exports.

Rock lobster is cheaper than it has been in years and I'm eating freshly picked new season cherries.

China can punish us some more if they like.

FKT

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27 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Rock lobster is cheaper than it has been in years and I'm eating freshly picked new season cherries.

Spare a thought for people in the UK who read the Daily Mail yesterday. 

An article trying to persuade people that instead of eating pizza (the dough is made with wheat that doesn’t grow in the UK) they can eat a plate of toast and chips. 

I'm expecting a follow up claiming one of exiting with No Deals benefits is helping battle obesity.

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1 hour ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Now that China is fucking us over, we have excess foodstuffs to sell.

Problem there is - what has the UK got to pay us?

FKT

You may want to have a talk to Oxford University and AstroZeneca on that score, they may just have something Australia would like to buy.

 

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Brexit logic; Tony Connelly RTE, good source over the years.

The Level Playing Field: Brexit for Slow Learners.

End of article;
This is the climate ahead of Sunday’s deadline. 
Member states are adamant that Britain simply cannot have zero tariff and zero quota access to the single market without abiding by some rules of the game.

London is digging in on the view that retaliatory tariffs, if the UK refuses to stay in step with EU standards, make a mockery of the entire raison d’être of Brexit.

Brussels sees the treaty as lasting generations, and loosening more and more strings for the UK would erode the fairness of the relationship.

Why EU wants LPF future proof;

One EU source recalls: "Member states took one look [at the original non-regression clause] and said, that’s good but not good enough. We want this relationship to last over time. In these areas - environment, social, labour, climate, taxation standards - we’re intending to be quite ambitious in the future and this relationship is for the long run. 

"We don’t want to be in a position where we now agree to a joint floor on standards which then gets superseded and becomes obsolete very quickly."

To the UK, the fact that the floor was based on EU standards, there was already the danger of European Court of Justice (ECJ) involvement. The ECJ is the only arbiter of EU law, and ending its writ was a red line for London.

https://www.rte.ie/news/brexit/2020/1212/1183991-tony-connelly-brexit/

Talks about the whole process, some nuggets on how both sides worked in the negotiation rooms, from both sides.
Sometime creative, sometimes dogmatic, but not coming closer on the main topics.
And looks like Financial services were thrown completely under the bus in March, only BJ forgot to warn this sector.

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1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said:

Spare a thought for people in the UK who read the Daily Mail yesterday. 

An article trying to persuade people that instead of eating pizza (the dough is made with wheat that doesn’t grow in the UK) they can eat a plate of toast and chips. 

I'm expecting a follow up claiming one of exiting with No Deals benefits is helping battle obesity.

After the cold war there were a few interesting comparisons, looking at changes in food recommendations and cooking magazine content over the years in the GDR. Specifically what got recommended or discouraged in which year.
Quite obvious what was going on when you look also the actual production numbers. (Easy to access, now that the GDR is gone.)

Time to expand those articles in a bit. :lol:

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3 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

Bet you don't know why Thatcher had this picture taken.

- The UK has not been able to feed itself since the early 19th century.

So they came in the EU with a food shortage and financial exhausted.
Found a safe place and fattened up and became wealthy, specially in financial services.
Now leaving the place and calling them 3rd Reich, dictators and all kind of crap.

Nice people...so graceful and of soft power.

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1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said:

Spare a thought for people in the UK who read the Daily Mail yesterday. 

An article trying to persuade people that instead of eating pizza (the dough is made with wheat that doesn’t grow in the UK) they can eat a plate of toast and chips.

Let them eat cod.

Oh, wait - they fucked that fishery just like they did all the other ones.

I don't really care what the UK does. They were quite happy to throw us & NZ under the bus when they joined the Common Market. If they want something now it's going to cost them.

Meanwhile it's summer, I've been out for a nice sail, probably going out again in a couple days, the fish are biting, new season fruit coming on stream, life is good. Brexit is an entertaining sideshow. Let the shitfight continue...

FKT

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2 hours ago, LeoV said:

So they came in the EU with a food shortage and financially exhausted.
Now leaving the place ................

...... in pretty much the same way. 

 

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6 minutes ago, Laser1 said:

...... in pretty much the same way. 

 

Yes, and it took 30 years, a world war, and loss of the empire to get where they were in the 70's, but this time a financial crisis followed by 10 years of mismanagement has managed to destroy 40 years of prosperity in the last 10 years.

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12 hours ago, jgh66 said:

Every day it seems to get more crazy. Alone the idea to prepare 8 warships, sorry. What do they expect? What shall the EU do? Command all Frontex plus EU navies into the channel for a training session on how to protect EU coasts? Sit down and laugh? Wait for the US to send some carriers?  

You may be closer to the truth than you think :

Chris Parry, a former rear admiral and ex-chair of the Marine Management Organisation, said ministers should act assertively. “I would seek to make an example and take a [EU fishing] boat or two into Harwich or Hastings. Once you had impounded them, the others would not be so keen to transgress without insurance.”

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