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Schakel

Ban from Wada for russian athletes to compete in international sport events

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The russians are banned from competing in international sport events yesterday
Russia doping ban
This is not funny anymore.
1112912504_Wada2.png.96988ae88b692e35bcfb86158760e35a.png
World Anti Doping Agency

The impact of this is hardly comprehensible for russian sport.
On the olympics they were good for 1010 Medals.
Only US of A has more.
Olympic Medal race by country

World championsships

In Dragon and 5.5 russians are quitte big.
Russian Dragon association

Russian 5.5

But they may compete under a different flag...

Russian International Sailing Federation

https://www.sailing.org/about/members/mnas/russia.php
Thousands of sailors that have to sail without their countryflag

These regatta's they are excluded from:

https://www.sailing.org/regattas.php

In  RC44 there are 3 russian teams:

367393887_Tatatuvrusiansailingteam.thumb.jpg.7340e225abc3df92ba8776e4f4280f19.jpg
2030941582_TeamNika.png.f11bc492183fff966029c5078c97c047.png
RC4420160303_ms_2719.jpg.84f49f5c049d149d38c0de91fdb055f4.jpg
And all those bravehearted yachtsmen are expelled because some fellow countrymen are on streoids?
Kosatka.jpg.9c9b0ab7d0acb2e34467c7225bad71cc.jpg


 

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45 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Thousands of sailors that have to sail without their countryflag

Screw countries.

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1 hour ago, schakel488 said:

And all those bravehearted yachtsmen are expelled because some fellow countrymen are on streoids?

They are expelled because those who should have been watchdogs were helping the athletes to use steroids.

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1 hour ago, schakel488 said:

And all those bravehearted yachtsmen are expelled because some fellow countrymen are on streoids?

While true, this somewhat minimizes the state directed cheating that's been going on (and by all WADA reports continues to go on) in Russia for decades. Those bravehearted yachtsmen will no doubt be relieved to sail under a flag not tainted by systemic unsportsmanlike behavior.

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1 hour ago, Simcard said:

While true, this somewhat minimizes the state directed cheating that's been going on (and by all WADA reports continues to go on) in Russia for decades. Those bravehearted yachtsmen will no doubt be relieved to sail under a flag not tainted by systemic unsportsmanlike behavior.

While on the water, these fellow yachtsmen are not even in the position nor opportunity to do anything about doping scandals in the USSR.
1168505941_DmitryLapikov.PNG.1bfa689e5acffdcfcdbc2f997d817ea2.PNG

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3 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

While on the water, these fellow yachtsmen are not even in the position nor opportunity to do anything about doping scandals in the USSR.
1168505941_DmitryLapikov.PNG.1bfa689e5acffdcfcdbc2f997d817ea2.PNG

Can't they just take the steroids after sailing for the day or on rest days like everybody else? :P

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10 minutes ago, mad said:

Can't they just take the steroids after sailing for the day or on rest days like everybody else? :P

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
Google didn't give a single incident.
ISAF should overrule the ban, just to show justice.
What has sailing tyo do with atlethes on steroids? Nothing..
 

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4 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
Google didn't give a single incident.
 

It doesn't matter, its a blanket ban.  That's what happens when the cheating and the cover-up is so endemic.............and just because they weren't named, doesn't mean they're innocent.

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23 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
Google didn't give a single incident.
ISAF should overrule the ban, just to show justice.
What has sailing tyo do with atlethes on steroids? Nothing..
 

But there were a few who chose not to turn up at Olympic trials before out of competition testing became the norm

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33 minutes ago, mad said:

It doesn't matter, its a blanket ban.  That's what happens when the cheating and the cover-up is so endemic.............and just because they weren't named, doesn't mean they're innocent.

Not guilty until proven otherwise.

14 minutes ago, lydia said:

But there were a few who chose not to turn up at Olympic trials before out of competition testing became the norm

Name one..
Isaf should overrule the ban for sailing. The russian will appreciate when we are lenient.
To acknowledge each others country in sport is sportmanship and will at least prevent war a little bit.

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43 minutes ago, mad said:

It doesn't matter, its a blanket ban.  That's what happens when the cheating and the cover-up is so endemic.............and just because they weren't named, doesn't mean they're innocent.

Couldn't agree with you more. Endemic is the right word here. The blanket ban is meant to discourage all forms of cheating.

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18 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Not guilty until proven otherwise.

Name one..
Isaf should overrule the ban for sailing. The russian will appreciate when we are lenient.
To acknowledge each others country in sport is sportmanship and will at least prevent war a little bit.

The only people that care are a few Russian sailors and you.............get over it.

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17 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Not guilty until proven otherwise.

Name one..
Isaf should overrule the ban for sailing. The russian will appreciate when we are lenient.
To acknowledge each others country in sport is sportmanship and will at least prevent war a little bit.

That could work if they, the athletes, would try to get someone else than RUSAD to do their testing. With proper laboratories and test without prior knowledge. 

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12 minutes ago, mad said:

The only people that care are a few Russian sailors and you.............get over it.

Untrue; they, the russians, are on Voile the st. Tropez, Dragon Gold race, Medemblik, World championships. RC44 tournaments.
They are going to be missed.
RC4420160303_ms_2719.jpg.f257cb698a40e952bd5dc060ecadc821.jpg
Gazprom is their national oilcompany that sponsors them.
Gazprom

10 minutes ago, Upp3 said:

That could work if they, the athletes, would try to get someone else than RUSAD to do their testing. With proper laboratories and test without prior knowledge. 

That would be an improvement. Stop using the shit in the first place might work as well.

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18 minutes ago, schakel488 said:


Gazprom is their national oilcompany that sponsors them.
Gazprom

 

If Gazprom were out of sailing for good, that would be one small blessing.

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State sponsored cheating!

Chuck the lot of 'em!

My bro represented Auustralia in Kayaking at Lake Casitas (nice place) in 1984, pre drug testing, extremely fit, drug free and weighing about 80 kgs (convert it yourself)

The finalists in the 1984 500K1, mostly Eastern Europeans, averaged 92kgs (CIY)

Post drug testing ie 1984 that number fell quite quickly to 82kgs.

I have another story from inside the village in 1984 which will amaze you if you want to hear it.

Goodnight

 

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Is it just the cheating or would shooting down the passenger jet have unleashed some hounds

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50 minutes ago, madboutcats said:

Is it just the cheating or would shooting down the passenger jet have unleashed some hounds

No the world ignored that, and the invasion of another country. Don't upset the rich psychopath with all the petrol.

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For anyone who's interested, this Netflix documentary was an excellent look into Russian doping. Starts out as an American's experiment, and turns into the expose that helped get to where we are today.  And once again, all roads lead to Putin...

 

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What's this "neutral flag" thing? Don't countries qualify for the olympics? at least in sailing...

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I say let them compete. I'd like to watch a guy run a marathon in 22 minutes. Both legs could blow off for all I care. The olympics are such a waste of world funds, politics and wasted lives. Compete under a neutral flag in International competition? Please, lets not punish the atheletes...... its not like they were the ones taking all the dope...

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44 minutes ago, crankcall said:

I say let them compete. I'd like to watch a guy run a marathon in 22 minutes. Both legs could blow off for all I care. The olympics are such a waste of world funds, politics and wasted lives. Compete under a neutral flag in International competition? Please, lets not punish the atheletes...... its not like they were the ones taking all the dope...

And that's where this is al about. Not able to compete in any sport at all in international games without your flag is severe punished.
How will a swimming outcome for russian competiors without their flag look like?
1574442970_swimmingfinish.PNG.4be42f41d6b4aca8f3a1e208ff9fb67d.PNG
Like a white flag from surrender?
o-white-flag-surrender-facebook-compressor.thumb.jpg.99bd95fb5fb1f6f7c992ab9029a88f13.jpg
 

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So Schakel, in your opinion, how should state-sponsored cheating be stopped when the cheater has defied all previous attempts to persuade them to change their ways?

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3 hours ago, schakel488 said:

Untrue; they, the russians, are on Voile the st. Tropez, Dragon Gold race, Medemblik, World championships. RC44 tournaments.
They are going to be missed.
RC4420160303_ms_2719.jpg.f257cb698a40e952bd5dc060ecadc821.jpg
Gazprom is their national oilcompany that sponsors them.
Gazprom

3 hours ago, schakel488 said:
3 hours ago, Upp3 said:

That could work if they, the athletes, would try to get someone else than RUSAD to do their testing. With proper laboratories and test without prior knowledge. 

That would be an improvement. Stop using the shit in the first place might work as well.

 

Hit the nail on the head................when they clean up their act and show they can be trusted, they can play again.

In the meantime..............tough shit!

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3 hours ago, schakel488 said:

Untrue; they, the russians, are on Voile the st. Tropez, Dragon Gold race, Medemblik, World championships. RC44 tournaments.
They are going to be missed.
RC4420160303_ms_2719.jpg.f257cb698a40e952bd5dc060ecadc821.jpg

I think you mean their $$$$$$$ will be missed..........................talk about a fucking first world problem!!

Image result for baby cry"

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49 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

So Schakel, in your opinion, how should state-sponsored cheating be stopped when the cheater has defied all previous attempts to persuade them to change their ways?

The russian ban in the olympics is unavoidable in my opinion.
In sailing however they do not have a proven record on doping.
ISAF should overrule the ban for sailing out of leniency toward the russian people.

45 minutes ago, mad said:

Hit the nail on the head................when they clean up their act and show they can be trusted, they can play again.

In the meantime..............tough shit!

That is where you stayed correct.

21 minutes ago, mad said:

I think you mean their $$$$$$$ will be missed..........................talk about a fucking first world problem!!


 When Stars and Stripes Team USA was gone, they where missed in AC.
You talk like you are shouting. (and crying, poor baby)
South Africa, which is not a first world country, competes in TP52.
74326714_Phoenixeleven.thumb.PNG.4e6005504b04cc6e37ff00af489dbdf9.PNG

1712409759_Phoenixtwelve.thumb.PNG.69da83cecf5d737623e10220968409fb.PNG

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9 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

In sailing however they do not have a proven record on doping.
ISAF should overrule the ban for sailing out of leniency toward the russian people.

Yup. Only one test sample found tampered. So basically no doping. No biggie, doesn't make me think that there could be other samples that were tampered better.

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26 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

The russian ban in the olympics is unavoidable in my opinion.
In sailing however they do not have a proven record on doping.
ISAF should overrule the ban for sailing out of leniency toward the russian people.

That is where you stayed correct.


 When Stars and Stripes Team USA was gone, they where missed in AC.
You talk like you are shouting. (and crying, poor baby)
South Africa, which is not a first world country, competes in TP52.
74326714_Phoenixeleven.thumb.PNG.4e6005504b04cc6e37ff00af489dbdf9.PNG

1712409759_Phoenixtwelve.thumb.PNG.69da83cecf5d737623e10220968409fb.PNG

You're the only one crying about this!!

And what have stars and stripes or the SA TP52 team got to do with this??

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The Russians have been notoriously cheating at sport for my entire life - this is long overdue.

Only the East Germans were worse - they virtually turned women into men FFS.

The Russian "amateur" hockey team was comprised of soldiers whose only duty was to play hockey - they have operated on that level for over 50 years to my knowledge.

Fuck'em.

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7 hours ago, schakel488 said:

While on the water, these fellow yachtsmen are not even in the position nor opportunity to do anything about doping scandals in the USSR.
...

Especially as the USSR disbanded in 1991

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4 hours ago, European Bloke said:

No the world ignored that, and the invasion of another country. Don't upset the rich psychopath with all the petrol.

Well really it's the gas supply to Europe that gives more leverage

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7 hours ago, schakel488 said:

While on the water, these fellow yachtsmen are not even in the position nor opportunity to do anything about doping scandals in the USSR.
1168505941_DmitryLapikov.PNG.1bfa689e5acffdcfcdbc2f997d817ea2.PNG

she looks mean , i wouldn't want to piss her off..

fuck the russians...  quit being assholes and say nyet to drugs..

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Ban any individual unless they had out-of-competition testing completed through a recognized authority other than Russia.  The rules require a certified clean history, and you can't get that from a corrupt facility.

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11 minutes ago, JimBowie said:

MAGA baby!  Putin and his Puppet will rule the Universe if we don't clip some wings soon.

Trump shouldn’t be too rude to Putin or he will not get him re-elected. 

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8 minutes ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

she looks mean , i wouldn't want to piss her off..

fuck the russians...  quit being assholes and say nyet to drugs..

Nyet in cyrillic script is het.
Njet.thumb.png.d8b845fb7dbaace46bb4596767bd3883.png
Persiflage:
njet.jpg.d0cbdaad28c69e76b28ddb7fde14ad21.jpg
They are quite famous for alcoholism.
1003640838_alcoholrussia.PNG.87ffe12802b848ea5b5ae77841858618.PNG
Then the steroids doesn't matter anymore either.

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Yawn. The athletes will all be there. They will sing their national anthem over the Olympic music. They will continue to use banned products if they were using them previously.

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1 hour ago, KC375 said:

Especially as the USSR disbanded in 1991

Pointing out facts to Schakel will get you nowhere. 

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The Russians were given every warning and opportunity to change their ways when it came to doping. They choose to keep ignoring WADA, so I have zero sympathy. It's laughable that no positive tests of sailors is held out as evidence that no sailors are doping. The whole problem is that the Russian system is rigged so everyone tests clean regardless. 

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Have you ever noticed that a flag on a ship is essential in identification.
If ISAF doesn't  over rule the Wada ban for sailing, what is, I think is what will happen, it's too humiliating.
And we are busy listening to emotional Greta Thurnberg because it makes so much sense.
Do you see this flag flying at the stern of beautifull russian yachts competing?
o-white-flag-surrender-facebook-compressor.thumb.jpg.733796c87a0697a05feeef4f1443537d.jpg
173111658_Dragondaysailer.thumb.png.aa324439fe2e26bd93d4cb1933ea15e3.png
I expect ISAF over-rules. I hope so.
I am too serious for this.
I noticed before.

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Sport got by without South Africa for a long time. Life will go on without Russians for four years. 

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Oh no, what is the sport of yachting going to do without all the laundered Russian money!  Will Russians shoot down another civilian Dutch flight just to distract from this WADA annon?  Let's all show solidarity and sail with Republic of Krimea flags in our next regattas.  Twat.

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9 hours ago, schakel488 said:

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
Google didn't give a single incident.
ISAF should overrule the ban, just to show justice.
What has sailing tyo do with atlethes on steroids? Nothing..
 

Pavel Sozykin. A Russian 470 sailor who got denied eligibility to sail in Rio because of.........  Doping!

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56 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Have you ever noticed that a flag on a ship is essential in identification.
If ISAF doesn't  over rule the Wada ban for sailing, what is, I think is what will happen, it's too humiliating.
And we are busy listening to emotional Greta Thurnberg because it makes so much sense.
Do you see this flag flying at the stern of beautifull russian yachts competing?
o-white-flag-surrender-facebook-compressor.thumb.jpg.733796c87a0697a05feeef4f1443537d.jpg
173111658_Dragondaysailer.thumb.png.aa324439fe2e26bd93d4cb1933ea15e3.png
I expect ISAF over-rules. I hope so.
I am too serious for this.
I noticed before.

Take a look at all the commercial ships sailing under flags of convenience!!  
Jeez, you’re a tiresome fucking idiot. 

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3 minutes ago, mad said:

Take a look at all the commercial ships sailing under flags of convenience!!  
Jeez, you’re a tiresome fucking idiot. 

You are so diplomatic!
Do you expect the top teams in ISAF will not compete under their own flag?
I expect Isaf to over rule the Iwad ban for sailing out of diplomacy.
Wanna bet? Pretty sure about it...
 

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How does ISAF ignore the ban and still have sailing in the Olympics? If someone wanted me for crew on their TP52,  I don't think I would care if it was a Cayman Islands TP52. 

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What Ban?  The athletes can continue to compete, IF they have not been already caught doping. Those athletes would already be banned.  Everyone else, good to go. 

In some ways the anti-doping crowd has been so double faced.   Having a blind eye when the money or the status was important to that crowd, turning on others like they were refuse from a septic tank when the situation was not an advantage to the powers to be. Its all a big joke. 

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9 minutes ago, Santana20AE said:

What Ban?  The athletes can continue to compete, IF they have not been already caught doping. Those athletes would already be banned.  Everyone else, good to go. 

In some ways the anti-doping crowd has been so double faced.   Having a blind eye when the money or the status was important to that crowd, turning on others like they were refuse from a septic tank when the situation was not an advantage to the powers to be. Its all a big joke. 

how does an athele prove to WADA that they are clean ?

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9 minutes ago, KC375 said:

how does an athele prove to WADA that they are clean ?

By not being previously caught on a blood test, urine test or biological passport.  

No past record, good to go.  Now, I do not know if this “cleanliness” pass applies to those having finished serving a ban from a previous infraction. (Currently the ban time is 4 years from date of testing that reveals an infraction).

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They didn't have the balls to ban the Chinese, maybe becasue the Chinese Women had the balls especially Yuan Yuan (pictured)

In 1992 the number of Chinese swimmers in the top 25 world rankings soared from a plateau of less than 30 to 98, with all but 4 of the 98 swimmers female. Their improvement rate was much better than could have been expected as a result of normal growth and development. China subsequently performed beyond expectations to win 12 gold medals at the 1994 World Aquatics Championships amid widespread suspicions of doping.[3] Chinese swimmers won 12 of 16 gold medals at the 1994 championships and set five world records.[4]

Between 1990 and 1998, 28 Chinese swimmers tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs, almost half the world total of drug offenders in sport

Related image

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Russia as a country has been banned and rightly so. They were insulting the rest of the world. We've seen the documentaries we've seen the evidence. The good news is that Russian athletes can still compete on a personal basis if they pass all the stringent drug tests and the like. So the people what weren't cheating can still compete. It sends a message to the rest of the world and perhaps counties like China may see the light too?

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19 hours ago, Upp3 said:

They are expelled because those who should have been watchdogs were helping the athletes to use steroids.

you mean the gov helped them cover up use and then tried to scam wada

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4 hours ago, Bill E Goat said:

They didn't have the balls to ban the Chinese, maybe becasue the Chinese Women had the balls especially Yuan Yuan (pictured)

In 1992 the number of Chinese swimmers in the top 25 world rankings soared from a plateau of less than 30 to 98, with all but 4 of the 98 swimmers female. Their improvement rate was much better than could have been expected as a result of normal growth and development. China subsequently performed beyond expectations to win 12 gold medals at the 1994 World Aquatics Championships amid widespread suspicions of doping.[3] Chinese swimmers won 12 of 16 gold medals at the 1994 championships and set five world records.[4]

Between 1990 and 1998, 28 Chinese swimmers tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs, almost half the world total of drug offenders in sport

Related image

Maybe they should start doing what NASCAR does - or at least did - when every winners engine was torn down and inspected for legality.

Drug test every medalist right after they win.

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4 hours ago, Sailabout said:

you mean the gov helped them cover up use and then tried to scam wada

Exactly that. Or that the former Russian antidoping boss lies, maybe we should hear what other former bosses say... oh wait, they are dead.

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13 hours ago, schakel488 said:

I expect ISAF over-rules. I hope so.
I am too serious for this.
I noticed before.

So you think the organisation previously known as ISAF wants to step out of line with the position set out by WADA  which has been endorsed by the IOC? https://www.olympic.org/news/statement-from-the-ioc-on-wada-recommendations 

Leaving aside the morality of doing so,  on which I do not agree with you, are you familiar with the source of 90% of World Sailing's funding and how likely do you think it is to bite the hand that substantially feeds it?

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9 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Maybe they should start doing what NASCAR does - or at least did - when every winners engine was torn down and inspected for legality.

Drug test every medalist right after they win.

The only problem there is that it lets the athletes cheat and use PED’s during training to build strength, endurance, etc. Then they go clean when the Olympics roll around, and test clean. That’s pretty much exactly what Russia’s been doing. 

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On ‎12‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 7:18 AM, Israel Hands said:

For anyone who's interested, this Netflix documentary was an excellent look into Russian doping. Starts out as an American's experiment, and turns into the expose that helped get to where we are today.  And once again, all roads lead to Putin...

 


Anybody that hasn't seen Icarus (or done a similar amount of in-depth research) probably shouldn't be making bold statements about what is going on here. 

That mind blowing documentary highlighted not just official Russian corruption and perversion of the anti-doping system (I mean, killing lab clinicians who return a positive doping result on a national team member, sort of extreme, eh?) but it also exposed the corruption and unwillingness of anti-doping authorities like WADA (and the USOC / IOC) to actually grab the bull by the horns. 

As a cyclist, I saw this play out with Lance Armstrong.  It seems clear to me that because he was so good at keeping the money roll into what is otherwise a niche sport, that the world cycling authorities (UCI) and WADA were content to let him have his way, as long as he didn't do anything that forced them to take real action.   Ultimately Floyd Landis and Tyler Hamilton's crash and burn, and the public testimony and lawsuits involving Armstrong's former teammates and laying out the viciousness of the Motorola / US Postal omerta, forced WADA and the UCI and USA Cycling to take a much tougher line on doping... but as part of the gravy train that is the international sports sanctioning business, they didn't do this until absolutely forced to do so. 

Icarus reveals how difficult it is to get these sanctioning bodies to take any action that might upset the rice bowls.  Bribes, junkets, perks, and pay are all at stake... who really wants to deal with these problems when it's possible to get rich, or richer, by sitting on one of these do-nothing sanctioning bodies?  Until the filmmaker, who was accidentally implicated in this whole criminal scheme, perceived a threat to his own life and reported on it, on film, thus forcing the US Government and WADA to pay attention, none of the international bodies were going to take the necessary action to make it stop.  Once the FBI and US Attorney got in on the act... something was going to happen.  Now the sanctioning and anti-doping agencies are fighting a rear guard action to clean up the mess.  It has been forced upon them. 

For a place where everybody is always railing about the out-of-touch and corrupt international sanctioning bodies, the SA outrage over the Russian national team ban seems completely incongruous.  Most of what we get pissed about merely looks like dipshittery… the way organized Russian sports doping operates is state level organized crime.  Besides, individual athletes can still compete in the Olympics as "neutrals" (as many did in Brazil) providing they can prove they aren't involved in doping and weren't near the center of the Russian scandal.*  

I look forward to the day the Russian team can return to the Olympics and compete fairly, holding their national flag high.  But I am not holding my breath. 

 

 

*It isn't really a Russian scandal, so much as it is a Russian way of doing business these days. Disappearing and murdered clients is getting to be a thing for companies that do business with Russian firms...  Long live the Tsar...

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18 hours ago, schakel488 said:

You are so diplomatic!
Do you expect the top teams in ISAF will not compete under their own flag?
I expect Isaf to over rule the Iwad ban for sailing out of diplomacy.
Wanna bet? Pretty sure about it...
 

I think the FIFA will. they are the only ones asking more information up to this point

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36 minutes ago, Lex Teredo said:

*It isn't really a Russian scandal, so much as it is a Russian way of doing business these days. Disappearing and murdered clients is getting to be a thing for companies that do business with Russian firms...  Long live the Tsar...

These days? I'd say it is business as usual, just like in the 90s.

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For the uninitiated in international sports doping, Google "Operation Puerto" for a crash-course in pro sports cheating. Virtually every sport is riddled with cheaters... track & field, soccer, cycling (gasp)... even tennis for fuck's sake! Think sailors are exempt? I doubt it. Back in the dark ages (see 1980s), I considered trying out for various America's Cup campaigns but was not large enough for the barges being utilized in that era. My first thought? Hmmmm, I could put on a ton of weight with steroids! That thought exited my mind nearly as quickly as it entered, but there it was. The highest level dopers have entered a realm of genetic-level alterations at this point, making it nearly impossible to detect, but that doesn't mean plenty of others aren't using the more pedestrian drugs like "T," HGH and EPO to name a few. Are the good 'ol US of A boys and girls clean? Some are and some probably are not. Are the Russians glowing? Indeed. So what's the end-game? Don't waste too much energy being concerned about international sports doping. Go sail your own damned boat and have fun.

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On 12/10/2019 at 9:44 PM, SloopJonB said:

Maybe they should start doing what NASCAR does - or at least did - when every winners engine was torn down and inspected for legality.

Drug test every medalist right after they win.

They do test very winner in cycling (usually the top three places). Still the folks using PED’s find ways to get by.  

Micro dosing worked pretty good for a long time.  Just hiding or gobbling massive amounts of water helps disguise the biological passport.  

For those who do not know, the biological passport is a measure of hematocrit level in the blood.  Normal Hematcrit levels in humans average between 35.2 and 49.4.  Mine is a piss-poor 40.7 (I know cause I am a cyclist who competes). Anything above 50 is considered to be abnormal and suspicious of blood doping or using EPO which stimulates the body to create more red blood cells.  The Biological Passport determines what an individual’s “normal” hematocrit level is and whenever, there is a major change, up or down, it is a suspicion again of blood doping or using EPO.  Using too much EPO is suspected of causing fatal heart attacks in very young athletes though of late this has in itself become a questionable conclusion.  

Other forms of doping are growth hormones and the use of testosterone.  Girls using Testosterone develop abnormal muscle mass (see the Chinese swimmer pictured above) as well as deep voices and beards.  It also really screws up female reproductive efforts.  Males using excessive testosterone just become muscle massed very angry, at times dangerous individuals  Also diuretics delute the blood and hide certain other drugs which makes them banned substances as well.  Certain asthma meds are banned except in certain cases requiring a therapeutic use exemption.   (Awarded by WADA or USADA). As it helps performance it seems that just about every pro cyclist has exercised induced asthma.  Which really pisses me off because I ACTUALLY have exercised induced asthma.  Fortunately we have found an inhaler that is legal for me to use, that works.  Legal as long as I only use TWO puffs (not three, or four).  

One last story and I’ll leave it alone.  During the Cold War years a young women walked into the restroom and became rather frightened and shocked when she heard several men talking inside this women’s restroom.  They wern’t men, just East German women seriously affected by testosterone.   

Being a cyclist is such an educational pursuit. 

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On 12/10/2019 at 11:55 AM, KC375 said:

Especially as the USSR disbanded in 1991

Someone might also want to point out to Shakebell  that there is no longer an organization called ISAF

 

On 12/10/2019 at 1:29 PM, schakel488 said:

If ISAF doesn't  over rule the Wada ban for sailing, what is, I think is what will happen

 

 

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There is only one sailor in the entire history of the Olympics who won 3 gold medals in 3  different classes,  (winning 4 medals in 4 contiguous Olympics and he didnt even get into Olympic sailing until he was 30.). 

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17 hours ago, Monkey said:

The only problem there is that it lets the athletes cheat and use PED’s during training to build strength, endurance, etc. Then they go clean when the Olympics roll around, and test clean. That’s pretty much exactly what Russia’s been doing. 

Major League Baseball too.  And others I'd imagine. 

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4 hours ago, Santana20AE said:

Certain asthma meds are banned except in certain cases requiring a therapeutic use exemption.   (Awarded by WADA or USADA). As it helps performance it seems that just about every pro cyclist has exercised induced asthma.  Which really pisses me off because I ACTUALLY have exercised induced asthma.  Fortunately we have found an inhaler that is legal for me to use, that works.  Legal as long as I only use TWO puffs (not three, or four). 

That reminded me of this: https://www.rt.com/sport/418239-norwegian-olympic-skiing-asthma-diagnosed/

 

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8 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Elvstrom?

Elstrom started much younger, he was 20 at his first olympics, he won four successive golds, Firefly, then three in Finn. Sailed Tornado with his daughter in two olympics 84 and 88 but no podium, but they were European Champs in 83/84.

Valentin Mankin nearly equalled Elvstrom's four golds in row. Mankin won three golds and a silver. He podiumed in three clases, Finn, Tempest and Star

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On 12/10/2019 at 9:18 AM, schakel488 said:

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
 

There was one sailing positive result covered up, it was identified in the McLaren report. 

You can read the report here: https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/20160718_ip_report_newfinal.pdf

It was the fall out of the Icarus documentary. 

You obviously didn't google very well as it was covered in the news quite a bit, but might have been buried under the other names.

Anyway, the name of the one yachtsman you are looking for is Pavel Sozykin. 

Edit... i now see this was covered above, but here with links for @schakel488

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true, but still very much part of the doping scandal...

and overturned because they couldn't tell whether the positive was in or out of competition... so, hardly full exoneration.  

 

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Russian athlete can compete provided they can prove they are clean this is what the judgement says. So worse case I would hope outside of the Olympic classes and a couple of special events is not having "RUS" on the sails. It has been pointed out to World Sailing by it own committees in the past the reach of the anti dopping code even to offshore races. But it agreed at a WADA level knowing it would not be enforcement at any lower level events. If you take the Dragon example from the front page half the elderly owners probably take some form of medication that would either be prohibited or need an exemption. Don't think there are any simple answers to this one will be interesting to see what the experts say.

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3 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:
On 12/10/2019 at 1:18 AM, schakel488 said:

Name one yachtsmen that was in a doping scandal..
 

There was one sailing positive result covered up, it was identified in the McLaren report. 

You can read the report here: https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/20160718_ip_report_newfinal.pdf

From what I've seen over the years, sailors tend to cheat with their equipment more than with doping.

Cheating has become as normalized as corrupt and lying politics have.

Anyone caught should lose all records and prizes they have ever won and get a lifetime ban - period.

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Over the course of my life I’ve had quite a reversal of opinion about the Olympics and elite sport. As a teen I was lucky enough to get a job at the ’76 games (among other things I got to wear coveralls and carry a broom). I was agog to be around the anointed. I could not have been a bigger fan.

Now I think the Olympic movement should disband. I see the corruption. The East Germans and USSR, the Russians, the Chinese, USPostal, Oregon Project... I see the cost to society and in many cases to the athletes. I don’t see the benefit to any but a very few – the sports politicians – federations etc. I see the ingrained cheating and abuse of power.

In some sports I do see fans enjoying themselves but at what they pay for tickets they could probably support those sports as professional leagues.

I don’t see a broad benefit to society but I see a lot of taxpayer money being spent. Host costs for summer games are in the order of $10 billion plus all the money spent over the previous four years by various countries...I can sure see some better things to spend the money on.

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16 hours ago, EYESAILOR said:

Someone might also want to point out to Shakebell  that there is no longer an organization called ISAF

 

 

 

I guess you just told me, it's has been renamed.
Isaf.PNG.48f36d67ebff8759dcd7c0dc0d1a4b18.PNG

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6 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

There was one sailing positive result covered up, it was identified in the McLaren report. 

You can read the report here: https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/20160718_ip_report_newfinal.pdf

It was the fall out of the Icarus documentary. 

You obviously didn't google very well as it was covered in the news quite a bit, but might have been buried under the other names.

Anyway, the name of the one yachtsman you are looking for is Pavel Sozykin. 

Edit... i now see this was covered above, but here with links for @schakel488

Thanks for that, it is a thoroughly report. As it should be.
This graph is their findings in doping scandals per sport.
Notice the red circled sport at the right of the graph.
708150007_numberofdopinguserscaughtbywada2.png.a3eea99d1fef145c7781d2b24520342d.png

 

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31 minutes ago, schakel488 said:

Thanks for that, it is a thoroughly report. As it should be.
This graph is their findings in doping scandals per sport.
Notice the red circled sport at the right of the graph.
708150007_numberofdopinguserscaughtbywada2.png.a3eea99d1fef145c7781d2b24520342d.png

 

So table tennis is the cleanest sport...

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23 hours ago, Santana20AE said:

 Also diuretics delute the blood and hide certain other drugs which makes them banned substances as well.

The above statement is wrong.  Diuretics DO NOT dilute the blood.  They increase the urine flow and sodium excretion.  Thus there is a masking effect by altering the urinary pH and inhibiting the passive excretion of acidic and basic drugs in urine.  

I apologize for the error

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