Dale Jr.

Comanche sold again?

Recommended Posts

51 minutes ago, bigrpowr said:

but by witty or wharro ?

That rumour born from maybe some team Scally bodies doing some fly in fly out Euro regattas on something chartered/different this year and that colliding with Oz east coast races.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Next Level said:

I don’t know the new owner but it’s being managed by M Booth. 

Odd choice.  Booth has been a cat guy absolutely forever.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Never heard of 'Salty Dingo' before, but this came up in my facebook feed.

Both Comanche and Black Jack (apparently) heading to Europe (wonder if that includes Pommy Island :P).

Screen Shot 2020-01-03 at 07.44.34.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Mr Bo_Tangles said:

Never heard of 'Salty Dingo' before, but this came up in my facebook feed.

Commercial photography/video outfit often sports with an aquatic bent. No special connection.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

Commercial photography/video outfit often sports with an aquatic bent. No special connection.

Knuckles has done half a dozen or so Hobarts....

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Assess Marine has a a photo on Instagram of Comanche being lifted with the title “survey underway.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jason AUS said:

Assess Marine has a a photo on Instagram of Comanche being lifted with the title “survey underway.”

Sven Runow of Assess Marine sails on Comanche so you would think a bit close to home and conflicted for it to be a "purchasers survey."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Sven Runow of Assess Marine sails on Comanche so you would think a bit close to home and conflicted for it to be a "purchasers survey."

He was also pretty instrumental in getting Bumblebee (Jim’s other boat) off the beach in one piece, rather than in several small ones but there’s no reason he can’t be there as simply an “interested party / owner’s rep.” How many really good marine surveyors are there with knowledge of a yacht that big and complex?

 

Sven spent a lot of years in the Oats camp, so he’s got experience across more than just the big Indian. Plus - he’s a genuinely nice guy to boot. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Jason AUS said:

...but there’s no reason he can’t be there as simply an “interested party / owner’s rep.” How many really good marine surveyors are there with knowledge of a yacht that big and complex?

Jason don't get me wrong I agree. In fact a thinking purchaser would, with JC's concurrence, ignore any potential conflict and engage him in a heartbeat for the reasons you say. Then again surveys go beyond transactions like insurance renewal/changes and transport insurance for JC campaigning her in Europe this year etc.

Got to keep the crowd here guessing :-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You would hope that a professional surveyor with a reputation to protect and a legal liability towards their purchasing client would be performing an impartial survey.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, jack_sparrow said:

Jason don't get me wrong I agree. In fact a thinking purchaser would, with JC's concurrence, ignore any potential conflict and engage him in a heartbeat for the reasons you say. Then again surveys go beyond transactions like insurance renewal/changes and transport insurance for JC campaigning her in Europe this year etc.

Got to keep the crowd here guessing :-)

Watch my left hand.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Jason AUS said:

Watch my left hand.....

Gotcha ;-)

19 minutes ago, Spreader Boots said:

6D16BA03-EBD9-47EA-8C50-A5D3B8BD09A3.png

Mate Instagram post is obviously today but that photo was taken 3 years ago when Clark/Hinz owned her and taken by Assess Marine who did the purchaser survey for Cooney then.

Jumping to obvious conclusions..but nothing happening here.

images - 2020-01-04T172727.596.jpeg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Dark Knight said:

You would hope that a professional surveyor with a reputation to protect and a legal liability towards their purchasing client would be performing an impartial survey.

Hoppy my experience with "professional" (repeat professional) surveyors offshore and in a couple of states in Aust going back 40 years is they are anal in that regard. "Word of mouth" referrals play a large part in new business in this business, even in the internet age and likewise can obliterate it in a heartbeat.

Having said that it is quite reasonable for "perception bias" to come into play if someone believes judgements might be influenced, even unconsciously if there is some connection between their advisor and the party on the opposing side. That is quite normal in the business and professional advisory world, mainly because really good people are often in short supply (like this case of Sven Runow) and so accepted with steps taken to remove that "perception".

Buying and selling of boats is no different for those who understand/have experience with that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hintze - new CQS

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/31/2019 at 7:20 AM, jackolantern said:

Heard a rumor it’s going to Europe

Specifically Russia actually.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/4/2020 at 3:23 AM, jack_sparrow said:

Hoppy my experience with "professional" (repeat professional) surveyors offshore and in a couple of states in Aust going back 40 years is they are anal in that regard. "Word of mouth" referrals play a large part in new business in this business, even in the internet age and likewise can obliterate it in a heartbeat.

Having said that it is quite reasonable for "perception bias" to come into play if someone believes judgements might be influenced, even unconsciously if there is some connection between their advisor and the party on the opposing side. That is quite normal in the business and professional advisory world, mainly because really good people are often in short supply (like this case of Sven Runow) and so accepted with steps taken to remove that "perception".

Buying and selling of boats is no different for those who understand/have experience with that.

And sometimes the “perception” can cut both ways. If “your guy” acting for the other party finds bad news it may be easier to accept and digest it than if you feel the “other guy’s guy” is exaggerating bad news to knock the price down.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Flags said:

Specifically Russia actually.

Trump giving up Golf in favour of Ocean Racing?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/5/2020 at 3:47 PM, Al Paca said:

tRump’s a stinkpoter guy. 

Comanche can't function without the engine running. Halfway there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/4/2020 at 6:58 PM, jack_sparrow said:

Gotcha ;-)

Mate Instagram post is obviously today but that photo was taken 3 years ago when Clark/Hinz owned her and taken by Assess Marine who did the purchaser survey for Cooney then.

Jumping to obvious conclusions..but nothing happening here.

images - 2020-01-04T172727.596.jpeg

Survey done prior to Hobart.... Yes i know what i said in December.. but...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, PIL66 - XL2 said:

Survey done prior to Hobart.... Yes i know what i said in December.. but...

Stop ruining un-story efforts :-)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/12/2020 at 8:19 AM, stinky said:

Comanche can't function without the engine running. Halfway there.

Was Camanche initially lunched as 'powered'? I thought they did the transat manually

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Liquid said:

Was Camanche initially lunched as 'powered'? I thought they did the transat manually

Changed to power winches in 2018

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was under the impression Commanche was built with the option to be either, so they could go powered for max performance, but still go manual for records that required it. Then Jim converted it to powered only? But I could be talking out of my arse there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, JonRowe said:

I was under the impression Commanche was built with the option to be either, so they could go powered for max performance, but still go manual for records that required it. Then Jim converted it to powered only? But I could be talking out of my arse there.

You aren't listening. The manual/powered argument is just for adjustment of the sails. Canting keels are fine. The boat had one or two powered pit winches for hoisting, furling/unfurling and dropping sails that could be deactivated for manually powered records only - the only one of which they ever really went for was the Transatlantic Race.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jackolantern said:

You aren't listening. The manual/powered argument is just for adjustment of the sails. Canting keels are fine. The boat had one or two powered pit winches for hoisting, furling/unfurling and dropping sails that could be deactivated for manually powered records only - the only one of which they ever really went for was the Transatlantic Race.

Sorry I thought we were talking about winches, I didn't think anyone doubted that she had a canting keel from birth...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, JonRowe said:

Sorry I thought we were talking about winches, I didn't think anyone doubted that she had a canting keel from birth...

And wasn’t the canting keel manually powered? :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/3/2020 at 10:53 PM, The Dark Knight said:

You would hope that a professional surveyor with a reputation to protect and a legal liability towards their purchasing client would be performing an impartial survey.

I will/would not take on a pre-purchase survey of any yacht that I had actively been crewing on and there have been several.  It’s not a case of being objectively impartial, it’s more the case of perceived conflict of interest.  I need the money, trust me with a kid still in college!  But, it is not worth the risk of being accused of some bias toward the seller.

 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Jason AUS said:

Clutch? Just use a cam cleat!

Mayb a small horn cleat behind the cam as well? Just in case it slipped you know.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Hitchhiker said:

I will/would not take on a pre-purchase survey of any yacht that I had actively been crewing on and there have been several.  It’s not a case of being objectively impartial, it’s more the case of perceived conflict of interest.  I need the money, trust me with a kid still in college!  But, it is not worth the risk of being accused of some bias toward the seller.

 

 

 

SR is a professional.... There are no mates at this level... I see no reason why he shouldn't do the survey... In fact I see him being more thorough than ever and the fact he has an intimate knowledge of the boat means he can be.....  He would never hide things that weren't right and Jim would not want him to. If there was a problem Jim would just fix it according to the report.

my 2 cents

BTW... I don't believe the deal is signed off yet so...............................................................................
 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Jason AUS said:

Clutch? Just use a cam cleat!

Just a butt cleat required surely. Self tacking that way, crew gets up during the tack and the keel goes over :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, PIL66 - XL2 said:

SR is a professional.... There are no mates at this level... I see no reason why he shouldn't do the survey... In fact I see him being more thorough than ever and the fact he has an intimate knowledge of the boat means he can be.....  He would never hide things that weren't right and Jim would not want him to. If there was a problem Jim would just fix it according to the report.

my 2 cents

BTW... I don't believe the deal is signed off yet so...............................................................................
 

 

How can we believe anything you post now after deliberately bullshitting pre Hobart race.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, trt131 said:

How can we believe anything you post now after deliberately bullshitting pre Hobart race.

Umm, that's a bit harsh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, trt131 said:

How can we believe anything you post now after deliberately bullshitting pre Hobart race.

I technically didn't lie... I delivered the company statement. Jim has had interest from several  parties wanting the boat since the day he bought it... It was officially not for sale prior to Hobart
But I get your point

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, PIL66 - XL2 said:

I technically didn't lie... I delivered the company statement. Jim has had interest from several  parties wanting the boat since the day he bought it... It was officially not for sale prior to Hobart
But I get your point

 

PIL, the best thing would have been to say nothing no matter how much prompting there was.  It would have kept your standing in the SA community, now its all shot to shit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sad to see Comanche go but Ricco will be having a party at his joint no doubt.! (Not that he would ever admit it). Surprised to hear Black Jack may be gone as well? All the mods for a new owner or a last ditch desperate attempt at winning the Hobart? Mark Bradford's predictions on the mods may have been wrong? 

This leaves Wild Oats as the clear favourite from hear on in. We were spoiled and perhaps I was naive to think it might continue? LOL 

Not liking the future anywhere as much now......:unsure:

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, trt131 said:

PIL, the best thing would have been to say nothing no matter how much prompting there was.  It would have kept your standing in the SA community, now its all shot to shit.

To quote LB.... I love this place

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, PIL66 - XL2 said:

To quote LB.... I love this place

Don’t tell LB but many of us miss the idiot. His socks ain’t the same as the original. 
 

And Phil your cred is just fine. If somebody can’t understand it says more about them.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My understanding on BJ is that she is leaving Australian water but not changing owners.

I was lead to believe this was for tax purposes (eg. she'll be registered in Monaco?) but she will return to Australia after a certain time.

I am no expert on Australian tax law and it's only something I was told by someone connected with the boat/owner so take it how you will!! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, mezaire said:

My understanding on BJ is that she is leaving Australian water but not changing owners.

I was lead to believe this was for tax purposes (eg. she'll be registered in Monaco?) but she will return to Australia after a certain time.

I am no expert on Australian tax law and it's only something I was told by someone connected with the boat/owner so take it how you will!! 

BJ 100 is on the Australian Shipping Registry and given the time she has been here already, I can't imagine it is for purchase tax reasons. The GST must have been paid and duty not applicable, But like you, I don't know the tax laws.

Maybe it is leaving simply because Harburg has racing ambitions that go beyond Aus. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, The Dark Knight said:

BJ 100 is on the Australian Shipping Registry and given the time she has been here already, I can't imagine it is for purchase tax reasons. The GST must have been paid and duty not applicable, But like you, I don't know the tax laws.

Maybe it is leaving simply because Harburg has racing ambitions that go beyond Aus. 

Isn’t BJ going to the EU to race for the next couple of seasons? Hence the registration in Monaco?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Next Level said:

Isn’t BJ going to the EU to race for the next couple of seasons? Hence the registration in Monaco?

It is Aus registered

https://www.amsa.gov.au/vessels-operators/ship-registration/list-registered-ships/black-jack-100

Club registration means nothing. Given the shit going on at RQYS, I would not be surprised if that was the reason for the club change, as he was probably already a member at Monaco.

Harburg can keep BJ within the EU for 18 months no problem. When he takes it to the UK for the next Fastnet in 18 months time, the 18 month EU time will be reset. Although if it will be based in Europe for a while, it would be logical to take it to the Caribbean.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's either so they don't have to pay import taxes when entering Europe for their grand tour, or they're just soo ashamed of the continued fuckery going on at RQ that they've decided to register the boat with a club on the other side of the world to avoid being associated. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

It's either so they don't have to pay import taxes when entering Europe 

A mentioned, they can be there 18 month tax free

37 minutes ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

 they're just soo ashamed of the continued fuckery going on at RQ that they've decided to register the boat with a club on the other side of the world to avoid being associated. 

a strong possibility...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

It's either so they don't have to pay import taxes when entering Europe for their grand tour, or they're just soo ashamed of the continued fuckery going on at RQ that they've decided to register the boat with a club on the other side of the world to avoid being associated. 

Registered as Australian Ship with homeport of Brisbane so EU VAT liable unless it doesn't stay there long enough. Depending on country many now abandoned tax free fixed terms  and measured as exceeding a percentage of the trips exiting that countries waters over a calendar year period. Private (quarantine any sponsor income) so no income subject to VAT and moving in and out should make it all easy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2020 at 10:56 AM, trt131 said:

PIL, the best thing would have been to say nothing no matter how much prompting there was.  It would have kept your standing in the SA community, now its all shot to shit.

Information is worth what it costs you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

Registered as Australian Ship with homeport of Brisbane so EU VAT liable unless it doesn't stay there long enough. Depending on country many now abandoned tax free fixed terms  and measured as exceeding a percentage of the trips exiting that countries waters over a calendar year period. Private (quarantine any sponsor income) so no income subject to VAT and moving in and out should make it all easy.

Haven't we all heard of Georgetown? My understanding is they can't be in Australia for more than 6 months at a time otherwise the TAX man comes knocking? Something along these lines anyway and can you blame them? The Australian Government is one of the many "PIRATES" of the high seas.... In all my OS trips on boats the PORTS are littered with OZZIE boats that can't return home. It's cheaper to employ 2 x Deckees's in a remote port than bring your boat home? It doesn't make sense in BJ's case but what would I know? I suspect all big boat owners have done the math on this one, each to their own. CHOOSE YOUR FLAG WISELY

https://nomadcapitalist.com/2017/07/17/ultimate-guide-yacht-registration/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, terrafirma said:

 ...In  all my OS trips on boats the PORTS are littered with OZZIE boats that can't return home. It's cheaper to  employ 2 x Deckees's in a remote port than bring your boat home? It doesn't make sense in BJ's case but what would I know?..

Nearly all countries tax foriegn flagged vessels if they don't keep going, Aust is no different. You only get taxed once. Leave and return as many times as you like.

I think Comanche is still registered in Georgetown and has exited Aust once since acquired.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

She possibly had the European VAT paid when she was Esmit Europa, so she should return there, I think within 2 years, to keep the VAT Paid status current? It'd make it easier to eventually sell to an EU owner if she's VAT paid. Dunno.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Next Level said:

Isn’t BJ going to the EU to race for the next couple of seasons? Hence the registration in Monaco?

Registration in Monaco has nothing to do with VAT being paid, or not paid.  BJ gets 18 months tax free in EU and must then pay up or leave but leaving isn't so bad.  They only have to go to Turkey or Morocco and they can restart the 18 month period.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, savoir said:

Registration in Monaco has nothing to do with VAT being paid, or not paid.  BJ gets 18 months tax free in EU and must then pay up or leave but leaving isn't so bad.  They only have to go to Turkey or Morocco and they can restart the 18 month period.

Or if the UK ever manage to brexit just do the fastnet race.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stan Honey getting a Russian Visa soon? Will be interesting to see who ends up sailing the boat?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now